KingEbukasBlog:


@ bolded --- Your opinion ?



Give me a reason to

You don't see a problem with your statement ?

plaetton:


My dear friend, be careful with absolute statements.
The correct thing to say would be that a self-existent universe is yet to be fully understood and scientifically articulated in a way ordinary folks can grasp it.
But meanwhile, the general idea, the proof of concept is out there in the scientific community.

https://www.nairaland.com/2140751/newsflash-forget-bigbang-forget-creationism

creation is a process . WTH did you call creation "magic"

Weah96:


An initial progenitor doesn't have to be remote. It could have been a powerful palm tree, for all I know. Maybe it was a much smaller universe. But to say that the universe has always existed is wrong. There is no precedence for it unless you're coming with solid evidence.

I didn't say that. All I am saying there is equally no basis to say it has an origin.
Unless you limit the definition of universe to what existed from the big bang.

KingEbukasBlog:
[code][/code]

You guys feel the bible is a book of fairytales ... so why continue the argument with him if he insists the story of Noah is an eg of a myth . Simple ... I dont care if you see it as one , that's my example .

Do you honestly believe the story of Noah?

ifeness:


Do you honestly believe the story of Noah?

1.Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't?

KingEbukasBlog:


1.Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't?

s
The Titanic was many many times bigger, but had less cargo capacity than Noahs ark.
How do you explain that?

KingEbukasBlog:


1.Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't?

Are you serious?

plaetton:
s
The Titanic was many many times bigger, but had less cargo capacity than Noahs ark.
How do you explain that?

Hmmm ... Im surprised you asked this . There is proof that the ark could contain very large number of animals -weight , size included . You can sort yourself out online as regards to any disbelief like I did . Mind you , I know the earth's age incase you thinking about dinosaurs and the others being on the ark . .

kolajamesjnr:

Are you serious?

Off course

KingEbukasBlog:


Hmmm ... Im surprised you asked this . There is proof that the ark could contain very large number of animals -weight , size included . You can sort yourself out online as regards to any disbelief like I did . Mind you , I know the earth's age incase you thinking about dinosaurs and the others being on the ark . .

Proof?
Where is the proof?

And, you know the Earth's age?

Do you mind sharing that information with us,. Pls?

plaetton:


Proof?
Where is the proof?

Asking for proof is a show of unbelief , I had that too .Like I said earlier :"You can sort yourself out online as regards to any disbelief like I did"

And, you know the Earth's age? Do you mind sharing that information with us,. Pls?

4.54 billion years?

plaetton:


Proof?
Where is the proof?

And, you know the Earth's age?

Do you mind sharing that information with us,. Pls?

There is zero evidence of a worldwide flood. Let's put aside the fact that a great flood would have been physically impossible and that there are no geological records indicating one ever happened, at least while humans existed, and just use our logic on this one.

Here's what the Dallas zoo needs every single day.

* A ton of hay
* 35 pounds of fish
* 50 pounds of meat
* 100 stalks of celery
* five pounds of red onions
* 100 pounds of carrots
* 25 pounds of spinach
* 15 pounds of kale
* 10 pounds of mixed vegetables
* 150 pounds of sweet potatoes
* 10 heads of cabbage
* 48 heads of romaine
* 30 ears of corn
* four loaves of wheat bread
* 24 eggs
* a pound of yogurt
* 40 pounds of bananas
* eight pounds of blueberries
* 170 oranges
* 500 apples
* 36 cantaloupes
* four papayas
* 250 rodents (the variety pack)
* 6000 mealworms
* 600 wax worms
* 7500 crickets

Remember, it rained for 40 days/nights, and then they had to wait around for the water to drain away (again, where did it go?) for some more weeks. This list of food is what the Dallas Zoo needs every day. Multiply this by 50 or 60 days... Say that Noah only needed half a ton of hay a day. That's 30 tons of hay for the whole cruise. Exactly where did they keep this? How did they gather it all in advance of the rain? If you gathered 100 pounds of hay every day, it would take you 20 days per ton. So you'd have to do nothing but gather hay for 600 days to get 30 tons together.

Now I'm using logic again here, so I'm sure I've lost you by now, but if it rained for 40 days, enough to cover the highest mountain peaks in the world, please tell me exactly where did all that water go? It would have taken years for it to evaporate or be absorbed into the soil, so where did it disappear to?

And how did the animals get there? How exactly did the wombats and kangaroos get to the middle east from Australia? Did the swim? Did the Polar bears swim tens of thousands of miles to get there?
just asking common sense questions. You don't even need science to disprove the Noah's Ark myth, just a brain.

SNCOQ3:

What I am not sure of is if you have reached the zenith of human stupidity and arrogance or if you are almost there; What I am sure of is that you are no programmer.


Indeed, you are no programmer.
You seem to have been fooled by the numerous math-like syntax in programming sample codes seen online to assert the word "ONLY".

Apart from the field of numerical analysis, cryptography, financial wares, physics engine(for simulating the laws of physics in softwares like video games), maths is rarely used by most programmers: examples are the use of regular expression (for word processing), database design, server-side and most web apps programming.

Forget "Natural laws of mathematics", its nothing but "word salad":

There are Natural laws - mostly used in philosophy of rights and justice therefore not applicable in this case.

Laws of Mathematics - effects logical consistency in calculations.

Physical laws also known as scientific laws - "a theoretical principle deduced from particular facts, applicable to a defined group or class of phenomena, and expressible by the statement that a particular phenomenon always occurs if certain conditions be present." - wikipedia.
The highlighted in red is the relationship between maths and science.

What you are confusing for your so-called "Natural laws of mathematics" is what real programmers call ALGORITHM - an indispensable tool for solving both mathematical and non-mathematical problems. Algorithm is to maths what maths is to physics.

For all your "laws of maths" worship, It may interest you to know that real programmers in the field of 3D CG/Physics Engine must rely on tricks, hacks and other creative utilization of man-made maths laws in 3D matrix and quaternions to fake a 3D world on a 2D surface(computer screen).

Ultimately, every programming code is decomposed by a compiler to machine code(10110100...) and computed(calculations, bit shifting, looping, storage) by CPU; but that should not warrant such drivel like "computer programs can ONLY be written using the Natural laws of mathematics."


I like the way you make a case for God.

Is like "nature" is a pseudonym for God.
"mathematical laws" for the Logos.
"default state in nature" — the Logos was with God(John1:1)
"nature's programming code and reprogramming" — Through him(Logos) all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.(John1:3)

"from time to time it contains errors, errors of its past passed down the generations." — The fall of man currupted nature:
For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God.For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.. (Rom 8:20-22)

The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled: for the LORD hath spoken this word.The earth mourneth and fadeth away, the world languisheth and fadeth away, the haughty people of the earth do languish.The earth also is defiled under the inhabitants thereof; because they have transgressed the laws, changed the ordinance, broken the everlasting covenant. (Isaiah 24:3-5).


Actually you don't.

You really think you understand what genetic code in programming term is?
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just think about it for a moment: One gram of DNA can store 700 terabytes of data. That’s 14,000 50-gigabyte Blu-ray discs… in a droplet of DNA that would fit on the tip of your pinky. To store the same kind of data on hard drives — the densest storage medium in use today — you’d need 233 3TB drives, weighing a total of 151 kilos. Extremetech.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The above is for storage alone.

Lets not get into parallel computation, 4bit -as opposed to our primitive 2bit(1,0) computation, data structure equivalent to a DNA with 4bit, algorithms for data sequencing.

Think about the supercomputer power it takes to simulate and decode a single strand of DNA— It can put the fear of God in a sane mind.
But then, you may not appreciate it- after all, you are no programmer.... right?

UyiIredia may not be a programmer in a conventional sense, but anyone with an intuitive understanding of the nature of code and an elementary knowledge of computer science is capable of comprehending genetic coding.

Thank you.
I honestly dont know whether to laugh or cry at the shallowness of Plaettons mind.

kolajamesjnr:

There is zero evidence of a worldwide flood. Let's put aside the fact that a great flood would have been physically impossible and that there are no geological records indicating one ever happened, at least while humans existed, and just use our logic on this one.

Here's what the Dallas zoo needs every single day.

* A ton of hay
* 35 pounds of fish
* 50 pounds of meat
* 100 stalks of celery
* five pounds of red onions
* 100 pounds of carrots
* 25 pounds of spinach
* 15 pounds of kale
* 10 pounds of mixed vegetables
* 150 pounds of sweet potatoes
* 10 heads of cabbage
* 48 heads of romaine
* 30 ears of corn
* four loaves of wheat bread
* 24 eggs
* a pound of yogurt
* 40 pounds of bananas
* eight pounds of blueberries
* 170 oranges
* 500 apples
* 36 cantaloupes
* four papayas
* 250 rodents (the variety pack)
* 6000 mealworms
* 600 wax worms
* 7500 crickets

Remember, it rained for 40 days/nights, and then they had to wait around for the water to drain away (again, where did it go?) for some more weeks. This list of food is what the Dallas Zoo needs every day. Multiply this by 50 or 60 days... Say that Noah only needed half a ton of hay a day. That's 30 tons of hay for the whole cruise. Exactly where did they keep this? How did they gather it all in advance of the rain? If you gathered 100 pounds of hay every day, it would take you 20 days per ton. So you'd have to do nothing but gather hay for 600 days to get 30 tons together.

Now I'm using logic again here, so I'm sure I've lost you by now, but if it rained for 40 days, enough to cover the highest mountain peaks in the world, please tell me exactly where did all that water go? It would have taken years for it to evaporate or be absorbed into the soil, so where did it disappear to?

And how did the animals get there? How exactly did the wombats and kangaroos get to the middle east from Australia? Did the swim? Did the Polar bears swim tens of thousands of miles to get there?
just asking common sense questions. You don't even need science to disprove the Noah's Ark myth, just a brain.

Learn to give credit to who is due for your "research"

https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130502162634AAfzzuw

Now go back online and search for proof of Noah's story ... Thanks

KingEbukasBlog:


1.Can you give me a reason why I shouldn't?

Yes or no, do you believe lions, elephants, antelopes, lizards, flies got into the Noah's boat? Please answer!

ifeness:


Yes or no, do you believe lions, elephants, antelopes, lizards, flies got into the Noah's boat? Please answer!

Yes !

Understand what God being a [size=30pt]supernatural[/size] being means !

KingEbukasBlog:


Yes !

Understand what God being a [size=30pt]supernatural[/size] being means !

You believe Hippotamous,crocodiles got in there too? Now I know who I'm talking to

KingEbukasBlog:


Yes !

Understand what God being a [size=30pt]supernatural[/size] being means !

You believe Hippopotamus,crocodiles got in there too? Now I know who I'm talking to

who missed me

I hope I'm not too late for the party.

UyiIredia:
I made the same arguments on another site and couldn't convince atheists there. Maybe I'll have better luck here . . . OR NOT !

1) The existence of the universe demands an explanation.

So?

The order of the physical universe which ensures it adheres to laws which can be inferred suggests an intelligence behind the universe.

Precisely because it is lawless an unordered universe can take any form and it could pretty much look like ours. There is nothing to stop it from doing so. So for all we know our universe is unordered, in the most fundamental sense.

2) The genetic code in living organisms precludes the possibility they arose naturally. Natural processes CAN'T give rise to codes which don't follow natural laws. As humans, we know that codes are always made by conscious effort so the presence of codes in living things is grounds to infer that God exists.

Do the genetic codes follow any laws? You left that out.

3) Consciousness in man is not explainable by materialistic means. Emergence can't explain consciousness since typically it deals with new physical properties that arise due to complex interactions. But the consciousness isn't physical and so can't be explained by purely material means moreso since physical things lack consciousness. This is good grounds to believe that a God that effects consciousness exists.

Do you have proof that it is impossible for there to be a materialistic theory of consciousness?

DeepSight:


Thank you.
I honestly dont know whether to laugh or cry at the shallowness of Plaettons mind.

Huh?

Even thou, O mighty one!

Does this Mean you agree and support what this fellow babbled above, or you are just lending sentient al moral support to your accolytes?

I have warned you.
You are not teaching your disciples well, Oh wordy master.

As a master of the craft yourself, master of the Creating word ( ), you should know that it takes a lot more than hautiness and youthful exuberance to create an alternate reality with mere wordsalads.
It requires a certain degree of cunning and creativity. Something that is evidently lacking amongst your minions.
Not so, sire?

Your accolytes do not represent you well, sire.

KingEbukasBlog:


Yes !

Understand what God being a [size=30pt]supernatural[/size] being means !

Lol
I can't stop laughing.

When the going gets tough, the tough goes SUPERNATURAL.

Do you also believe Santa Clause uses SUPERNATURAL to deliver gifts to every kid on christmas Eve?
It could only be SUPERNATURAL.

Lol.

plaetton:


It requires a certain degree of cunning and creativity.

Game over.
Nailed and dusted. All your contentions destroyed.

Wonder if you will get it though.

kolajamesjnr:
if it rained for 40 days, enough to cover the highest mountain peaks in the world, please tell me exactly where did all that water go? It would have taken years for it to evaporate or be absorbed into the soil, so where did it disappear to?.

I don't know if the great flood happened and I will not vouch for it, but sticking with logic and answering your question above, Icebergs and the North and South Poles, not to speak of clouds and evaporation, (and a great many other geological factors i can easily think about) can easily account for that which you have inquired about.

Very very easily.

I would be I interested to know if you are aware that sea shells have been found on some of the highest mountains in the world.

In addition I would like to draw your attention to the preponderance of flood myths in so many cultures of the world, and I do not know if you are one of those who dismiss ubiquitous myths lightly.

I would also question if you believe that these stories are literal or spiritual.

DeepSight:


Game over.
Nailed and dusted. All your contentions destroyed.

Wonder if you will get it though.

No sir.
You don't get it sir.
I was merely referring to your techniques, sire,.. the techniques of the Master Chef of world - renowned WordSalads.

One of us makes a pretty good living whipping up and tossing WordSalads all over our judicial landscapes,... And it Ain't me.

Gotcha!

Kay17:


At least you find a code to be some form of order and arrangement, that is what makes it special, isn't it? Now since there will be a regress, it means NOT all forms of order or arrangement is formed by intelligence.

Again read what you wrote. "Consciousness has a cause and its preceding cause is conscious." That does not make sense. because what you said was an existing consciousness is the cause of consciousness.

What makes codes special is the fact that they represent something else, not their order. Why doesn't it make sense of a conscious God to have caused conscious beings ?

ifeness:


First Question; If you are not arguing for the Christian God,what one are you arguing for? Kindly elaborate.

No elaborations. I'm arguing for God as generally understood: the Creator of all reality.

ifeness:

You as a conscious being who is aware of everything going on around you. Do you think if your body shuts down you will stop being aware/conscious? No you wouldn't. You will continue to be aware and always be. Whether humanoid,formless or shapeless. That is a phenomenon that cannot be created nor destroyed. I think if you believe in a God,then it is you.

So you believe that consciousness can survive death. I don't know any atheist that holds that belief. Are you an atheist ?

ifeness:

Science is right about the illusion aspect of the universe. The way we used to perceive things are becoming different periodically. We are most likely projections of information,holograms from a distant reality. We have moved from a one dimensional world to two and now already in three.

I don't listen to quantum physics mumbo-jumbo. The universe is no illusion. It's real and exists whether or not we know it when we're unconscious.

ifeness:

As far as evidence has led us,there is no God responsible for the universe. Kindly wait till we find one,then you can continue your worship.

Your arguments here have failed to show that this is true.

plaetton:

Lol
I can't stop laughing.

When the going gets tough, the tough goes SUPERNATURAL.

Do you also believe Santa Clause uses SUPERNATURAL to deliver gifts to every kid on christmas Eve?
It could only be SUPERNATURAL.

Lol.

Suarez is not human ! Gooooaaaaalllll

Sorry I thought we are giving irrelevant analogies

Name one kid who has claimed to see Santa Clause

kolajamesjnr:



And how did the animals get there? How exactly did the wombats and kangaroos get to the middle east from Australia? Did the swim? Did the Polar bears swim tens of thousands of miles to get there?
just asking common sense questions. You don't even need science to disprove the Noah's Ark myth, just a brain.

The same applies to evolution. How did life evolve from natural processes ? How did sex evolve ? How did the brain evolve ? How can random mutations make new organs ? How can natural selection discern and preserve new species ? Where are transitional forms ? Lots more questions could be asked of the theory and what you'll get is poor replies and/or ignorance, if you're unlucky, insults.

DeepSight:


I don't know if the great flood happened and I will not vouch for it, but sticking with logic and answering your question above, Icebergs and the North and South Poles, not to speak of clouds and evaporation, (and a great many other geological factors i can easily think about) can easily account for that which you have inquired about.

Very very easily.

I would be I interested to know if you are aware that sea shells have been found on some of the highest mountains in the world.

In addition I would like to draw your attention to the preponderance of flood myths in so many cultures of the world, and I do not know if you are one of those who dismiss ubiquitous myths lightly.

I would also question if you believe that these stories are literal or spiritual.

It could even be an allegory and its more fun to know that the ark could really hold all the animals that were supposed to be preserved from flood

undercat:
I hope I'm not too late for the party.

No, you aren't.

undercat:
So?

So, what accounts for the universe existence. Itself ? Or God ?

undercat:
Precisely because it is lawless an unordered universe can take any form and it could pretty much look like ours. There is nothing to stop it from doing so. So for all we know our universe is unordered, in the most fundamental sense.

Actually a lawless universe cannot possibly look like ours. It's taking any form means it won't adhere to a given configuration or set of laws as our universe does.

undercat:
Do the genetic codes follow any laws? You left that out.

Actually, codes are laws themselves. They are rules which determine how a given physical system can represent another. For example the word 'water' representing a given thing.

undercat:
Do you have proof that it is impossible for there to be a materialistic theory of consciousness?

How can that be possible when consciousness is immaterial ?

KingEbukasBlog:




Name one kid who has claimed to see Santa Clause

Laughing out Lord.
This is even more hilarious.

But,.. But using UyiIredia s logic, Santa Clause is generally known to exist.