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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! (12423 Views)
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Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 8:12pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
vooks:Alright. |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 8:13pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
Scholar8200:Do you sin? |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 8:16pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.' Revelation 22:11,12 When we were not yet reconciled to God our lives were characterised by wicked works (Colossians 1:21) but after we are reconciled to God by faith in Christ, there is a transformation and that also shows by a life zealous of good works Titus 2:11-14. Besides, let us remember this: 6 No one who abides in Him [who lives and remains [e]in communion with and in obedience to Him—deliberately, knowingly, and [f]habitually] commits (practices) sin. No one who [habitually] sins has either seen or known Him [recognized, perceived, or understood Him, or has had an experiential acquaintance with Him]. 7 [g]Boys (lads), [size=14pt]let no one deceive and lead you astray. He who practices righteousness [who is upright, conforming to the divine will in purpose, thought, and action, living a consistently conscientious life] is righteous, even as He is righteous [/size]. 8 [But] he who commits sin [who practices evildoing] is of the devil [takes his character from the evil one], for the devil has sinned (violated the divine law) from the beginning. The reason the Son of God was made manifest (visible) was to undo (destroy, loosen, and dissolve) the works the devil [has done]. 9 No one born (begotten) of God [deliberately, knowingly, and [h]habitually] practices sin, for God’s nature abides in him... and he cannot practice sinning because he is born (begotten) of God. 1John 3:6-9 (AMP) It transcends forgiveness to being made a partaker of His Nature. There is a walking in The Spirit , abiding in Him that brings forth the fruit of righteousness and holiness.(not struggling, just abide in Him , in vital union) If we dont abide, we will be fruitless and in spite of much professions will be cast off: 5 I am the Vine; you are the branches. Whoever lives in Me and I in him bears much (abundant) fruit. However, apart from Me [cut off from vital union with Me] you can do nothing. 6 If a person does not dwell in Me, he is thrown out like a [broken-off] branch, and withers; such branches are gathered up and thrown into the fire, and they are burned. John 15:5,6 How do I know if I am not abiding? When my faith has no Fruit! |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 8:24pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
Another verse that confounds and stupefies the self-righteous Legalist; 1 Corinthians 3:13-15 (KJV) Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 1. All work will be revealed by fire 2. Some works will abide earning the worker a reward 3. Some other will be totally obliterated by the fire earning the worker NOTHING 4. Despite the worker in #3 losing everything, he shall be saved |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 8:25pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
[size=1pt] Scholar8200:[/size] Scholar8200, Do you sin? |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 8:27pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
Now thanks be to God for His unspeakable Gift! |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 8:28pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
Scholar8200:Scholar8200, Do you sin? |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 8:31pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
vooks:The Lord be magnified! After many wrong accusations and calling me a pharisee, need I answer? NO! Why? Wisdom tells me your conclusion is already cast in bold relief and any answer will be used for purposes contrary to the purpose of the Thread! (Though you multiply this question a thousand times, sir, forget an answer; in any case you can go ahead with whatever you like to say!) A thread on Grace was with expectation that words posted (by those who have met grace) should at least be with grace but it has been the other way round! 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 8:38pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
Scholar8200: You have a thread telling others to stop sinning yet you can't answer this? Once again, Scholar8200, Do you sin? 1 Like |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promisechuks: 8:49pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
vooks:100 likes! I wouldn't have reply this post, if not for ".....SHALL BE SAVED" |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 9:00pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
promisechuks, Ever wondered why Pharisees and Legalists are super scared of this simple question, 'do you sin?'? The reason is simple; They spend a better part of their waking life condemning others for not embracing legalism as themselves but they have never thought out the implication of their beliefs. Possible answers to the question 1. The radicalized 2. The rational double-minded Legalist will tell you they are hairbreadth away from sinlessness...with a few prayers, carefulness, crucifying the flesh they should be there. This is hopefully by their deathbed some 80 years from now. 3. The confused Legalist will tell you that they sin occasionally. OCCASIONALLY here means, 'way too less than those filthy wicked sinners out there heading to hell. Those are CONTINUING in sin but the Legalist is just an occasional sinner. In fact they are not sinners as such, just that they sin occasionally 4. The semi-baked Legalist will tell you that they do sin, but they sin unconsciously, NEVER deliberately, and as such, their sins are way more forgive able that the vile sinners out there who sin deliberately. He is closely related to #3 When you look at #2-#4, there is sin in the Legalist's life. The Legalist embarks on an impossible task of diminishing this sin, rounding it off to the nearest nothing. To help them along, they MAGNIFY the the sins of others. Another thing is that while the Legalist threatens everyone with eternal damnation, they are not any better assured of their eternity; Christ may sneak on them just after they sin and before they repent! Some to cope with this frightening possibility of missing heaven theorize that somewhat before Jesus lands, He will quickly and spontaneously quicken all believers of all sins, give them some time to repent, hold them sinless for a few more moments, and then before those moments lapse, He will quickly fish them before they are again tainted with sin! Others theorize that these 'minor and infrequent' sins won't determine their eternity; it is the 'major sins' that matter. The problem is the distinction between 'minor and infrequent' sins and 'major and frequent' sins is arbitrary. The The rational Legalist ought to tell you whether he is saved now that he is yet to attain sinlessness or he will be saved once he attains it The confused Legalist ought to define occasional what frequency of a sin makes it occasional and habitual? Once in a week, month, year? The semi-baked Legalist is a pathetic liar. Pray tell me what one sin he did unconsciously that is without knowing it? As such, you can see why the question of sin in the Legalists is a scary one. They will avoid it at all cost because it condemns them! Cc Muafrika2,Scholar8200 1 Like |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promisechuks: 9:13pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
vooks:Leave the guy! One of the trait of the pharisees is that IT IS HARD TO CONVICT THEM THAT THEY CAN NEVER BE SINLESS BY FLESH. You remember what happened between Jesus, the adulterer and the pharisee? If not that Jesus convicted them by the POWER OF THE HOLYGHOST, they would have denied that they have no sin in them and they will go further in killing the woman. I was wondering the other day, if for instance, the adulterer was caught the second time on the act of adultery and brought to Jesus, would Jesus allow the pharisees that caught her again to stone her because of committing it again? Absolutely, NO! Why? Jesus knew FULLY WELL, that he will be going to the cross to die for the woman. So even at that Jesus will still defend her. Jesus said that the son of man has not come to CONDENM the world, but that the world might BE SAVED from wrath through him. https://www.nairaland.com/2621170/threatening-children-hell/3 When I read this post in the link above, I almost wept. Just read this post and see for yourself how deadly this gospel of condemnation that is so covered to look real has done to the writer. The writer said that he was taught in church that good people will go to heaven and bad people will ROT in hell. So heretic! Who in this world can be justified by right living, even after accepting christ? Thank God, I am saved! And because of that, I MUST spread this gospel that saved me, NO MATTER THE COST. Even if it costs my life, it is far better for me than to fold hands and see this heretic gospel of right living make people loose their faith in christ and his perfect finished work. 1 Like |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promisechuks: 10:03pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
vooks:Leave the guy! He WILL NEVER answer you! It only takes the holy spirit to convict you that THERE IS NOTHiNG GOOD IN YOUR FLESH, even when you don't commit sin. And it is that conviction of your sinful flesh that makes you believe in christ to be saved. |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by vooks: 10:26pm On Mar 24, 2016 |
promisechuks:Very true |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 7:11am On Mar 25, 2016 |
15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer or a thief or any sort of criminal, or as a mischief-maker (a meddler) in the affairs of others [infringing on their rights]. 16 But if [one is ill-treated and suffers] as a Christian [which he is contemptuously called], let him not be ashamed, but give glory to God that he is [deemed worthy to suffer] in this name. 17 For the time [has arrived] for judgment to begin with the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will [be] the end of those who do not respect or believe or obey the good news (the Gospel) of God? 18 And if the righteous are barely saved, what will become of the godless and wicked? 1 Peter 4:15-18 |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 7:58am On Mar 25, 2016 |
1:5Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time. 1 Peter 1:5 kept not against our will, the time comes when He asks,''will ye also go away''. We are not only saved but also kept by the Power of God through faith meaning we have the role to play in being steadfast in the faith and we will be kept from sin as sure as God withheld Abimelech from sinning against Him! |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promise101: 8:43am On Mar 25, 2016 |
Scholar8200:My friend, stop all this your legalism! We have NO role to play our salvation. If we still have any role to play for our salvation(eternal life), then is CHRIST DEATH IN VAIN. You quote 1peter 1:5 but still couldn't see ".....KEPT BY THE POWER OF GOD(not right living) THROUGH FAITH(not right living) UNTO SALVATION(eternal life)...." Only to have faith for us to receive the gift of eternal life for the sake of christ's salvation finished work. Prioritising SINLESSNESS(right living) for the salvation way, is of no needed and inconsequential. |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promise101: 10:56am On Mar 25, 2016 |
Scholar8200:1peter 4:15-18 15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters. 16 Yet if any man suffer AS A CHRISTIAN(persecution) let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf. 17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that BELIEVE(obey) not the gospel of God(Jesus- grace)? 18 And if the righteous barely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the wicked appear? Peter was saying that if the judgement of God begins with US, what will be the fate of THEM, who obey(believe) NOT the gospel of Jesus. The "US" in the context, is not talking about(people who pretend to be sinless because they live rightly, absolutely NO!), the "US" there are people who BELIEVE(faith) in the Gospel of Jesus. The people he was referring as "THEM", are not among the people he was referring as "US" but are the people who BELIEVE NOT the gospel. And their unbelief is a disobedience to the gospel. The judgement of God on sinners will be towards SIN. Why? Because they believed not on the gospel that justifies them. But the Judgement of God over believers is entirely different from that of sinners. The judgement of God over believers is not for imperfections, because our sins and imperfections, HAVE BEEN JUDGED ON JESUS AT THE CROSS, and JESUS ENTIRELY AND WILLFULLY TOOK THE PENALTY OF GOD'S JUDGEMENT OVER OUR SINS UPON HIMSELF. So God CANNOT JUDGE US of the SINS CHRIST WAS JUDGE AND CONDEMNED TO DEATH FOR, for the sake of christ's blood that was shed and himself being a God of Justice. If God should PASS JUDGEMENT ON A SIN TWICE, is that not INJUSTICE? If God should judge us for the sins, he judged christ for, then it simply means that christ's death is in vain and of NO effect. And it simply shows that christ was NOT SACRIFIED FOR OUR SINS but MURDERED FOR NOTHING. But GOD FORBID, that it had happened. Then what is the Judgement of God over believers? Corinthians 3:13-15 (KJV) 13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. 14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. 15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire . Our works of faith is what is judged, FOR A REWARD- crown of life and NOT FOR ETERNAL LIFE. Because eternal life is a gift for anyone who BELIEVES iN JESUS. And when our works is burned (of no value, bad or rotten), we shall suffer loss, BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED. Why will he suffer loss? Because his works are of no value, he laboured not abundantly, not for PURPOSE OF MAKING HEAVEN(eternal life) but for making use of the grace of God on him in touching lives and achieving things that he is supposed to achieve. How will he suffer loss? He shall NOT suffer loss of eternal life, because his eternal life is a gift that is not of works but of FAITH. No one is given eternal life because of right living and at the same time no one shall suffer loss of eternal life because of imperfection. Then what shall he suffer loss? Remember, what the verse 14 says;" If any man's work ABIDE which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a REWARD." So any man whose work ABIDES, shall receive a REWARD. Eternal life? No, it is a gift for all believers! Crown of life? Yes, it is a reward for LABOURER OF FAITH(not people who pretend to be sinless, because of right living). So any man whose work ABIDES NOT, SHALL SUFFER LOSS OF HIS REWARD- the crown of life. And because, he is given the free gift of eternal life on the basis of faith, HE SHALL BE SAVED, verse 15 says;"If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: BUT HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire ." HE SHALL BE SAVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now see verse 18; "And if the righteous(believers) BARELY(with no works) be saved, where shall the UNGODLY and the wicked appear?" Even at that, peter knew that we were BARELY saved(out of nothing and with no works). Then he asked; "WHERE SHALL THE UNGODLY AND THE WICKED APPEAR?" One is not wicked before God, because one lives imperfectly, but because he has NOT BELIEVED in the gospel that FORGIVES and JUSTIFIES his imperfection, and thereby making his imperfections to be IMPUTED ON HIM OUT OF HIS UNBELIEF. So bad! We are NO MORE ungodly and wicked before God, because we WERE FORGIVEN and JUSTIFIED, not for the sake of our right living but for CHRIST'S SAKE. Therefore we owe NO DEBT of our imperfections. Rom 4:5; "But to him that WORKETH NOT(strive not to live according to the law), but BELIEVETH(have faith alone) on him that JUSTIFIETH THE UNGODLY, HIS FAITH(not right living/law keeping) IS COUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS." Jesus is the one that JUSTIFIES THE UNGODLY! |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 12:01pm On Mar 25, 2016 |
4:7For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness. 4:8[b]He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, who hath also given unto us his holy Spirit.[/b] 1 Thess 4:7,8 |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 12:04pm On Mar 25, 2016 |
promise101:Define legalism and show ONE post of mine that agrees there to |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by promise101: 12:21pm On Mar 25, 2016 |
Scholar8200:I will! But I somewhere, when I am back! I will define it. |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by oyeludef(m): 8:56pm On Mar 25, 2016 |
@promisechucks, where did i mention that u can b saved by keeping d law?if ur body is saved, why will u die(was adam initial body prone to death?) nd resurrect wen He comes if u truely r born again?why does d bible tells us to live by d spirit? Examining ursef does it suggest pasivity or activity?If Jesus has finished his mission on earth,why is there gonna b a second coming? I see how deliberate efforts r made by u to put words into my mouth. If we are once saved forever saved, how come ppl like demas became apostate? D road u guys r threading is a very slippery one I still await ur exposition of d letter to d seven churches. 1 Like |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 9:38pm On Mar 25, 2016 |
promise101:No problem. Dont forget to quote any post of mine that is an apt sample of that definition |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Scholar8200(m): 4:12pm On Aug 16, 2017 |
Muafrika2:Thank God, ma'am, for your life. 1 Like |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by Kobojunkie: 5:51am On Jun 02, 2021 |
vooks:Jesus Christ called these you describe as hypocrites ,not legalists. Stop giving the word "legalism" a bad name. ![]() |
Re: GRACE TRANSCENDS FORGIVENESS! by emmyileri(m): 6:14pm On Nov 09, 2021 |
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