MrMontella:

dude...ur emotions are not in check..
I'd recommend u cling to a religion..it could help ease the randomness of your emotions..

MrMontella:

lol..
Time may not have started with our universe incase you dont know...if our universe is
the product of the blackhole of another universe..
The mistake u make is equating a singularity to nothing..
A singularity is not nothing

Efewestern:


Can you elaborate please ?..

or should i say Organized ?, maybe Perfect doesn't fit the picture.. The more i study about how our solar system operate the more i have faith in God.

lets take for example the human structure, Our Eyes.. Do you know that its current position is the best place to be, Any little shift might cause a defection, Not to talk of our body structure, You believe all these originates from nothing, C'mon bro.. You might be mad with religion, Even me am mad with Religion, But don't Be mad with God.. He Exists with or without u .

Good evening

Owliver:
so how did the black hole begin? what started the other universe?

MrMontella:

the other universe...not urs oga...thats their concern lol...

Owliver:
let me guess. you are unable to comprehend that? expected.

why don't you pick on my post one after the other let me clarify for you. we are all learning. because you cleaning know how the human emotions work.

Owliver:
where did you see me say we should worship the first cause? pls show me.

if you have never met your father does that erase the fact that you must have a father dead or alive? pls be real.

if you argue God in a religious perspective you won't believe trust me I have been there. search God(the first cause) outside religion and you'll understand.

you atheist are just not agreeing to the religious definition which me2 don't agree giving all the contradictions. I totally understand that. but saying there's nothing(great cause) does not erase the nothing(great cause), if something can come out of nothing then that nothing must be something intelligent enough to be supreme. religious people call it God.

Owliver:
so what is the first cause?

MrMontella:

all humans or rather all organisms are selfish is wrong dude...

MrMontella:

all humans or rather all organisms are selfish is wrong dude...

Owliver:
you want me to have an alliance and begin to argue that my alliance is right? and others are wrong huh. that will be stupid.

it's means your not getting me. everyone's saying same thing in a different way. kinda busy. bye man

kilo4sure:

I think you are the one misunderstanding me here, l never said we should name our ignorance God like Newton or Ptolemy did, but rather the discoveries we make in science and even the one made by Laplace help us understand God and his works, l mean God's works may not be magical at all like Ptolemy expected it to be but may all follow the due and logical process in his infinite wisdom, hence the supernatural may be the natural that yet defies logic or simply too complex to fathom for now.
So our many discoveries exalt God rather than rule out God from the picture. The quest for knowledge via science and the understanding of how everything works may eventually teach us the purpose behind life itself and help us understand the mind of God.

Ranchhoddas:
The worst kind of fear I think is the fourth one. That fear of eternal roasting. Keeps people in line.

KingEbukasBlog:


Life sentences , Prisons , firing squad , jungle justice - all these keep people in line . What's a common name for them ?

hopefuLandlord:
DISCLAIMER: This post is about the fears I (Hopefullandlord) faced, I'm not saying such fears are what's keeping people theists but if you're a theist and the shoe fits, please wear it

This is not a thread about HOW I became atheist; NO, its about the fears I had during my journey

Atheism is something I actually became for a long before finally embracing it, this was long before I even knew what the word "atheism" means, so if there had never been an atheist before me, I would have been the first one

Part of the reasons it took so long for me was FEAR, not having anyone around me to guide me on that path made me stick with theism for a long time

Lets examine those fears that kept me theist

1 fear of failing in life due to lack of belief in god

stories were told in churches, at house fellowship, at home, at school, at almost everywhere imaginable about people failing in businesses, academics, sports, marriage, health and other walks of life, and they kept failing until they met Jesus; after meeting Jesus, successes in their businesses, health, marriage, academics followed automatically; these stories usually sounds very spellbinding and are usually followed with the popular bible verse

Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

Mount Zion films also cemented this kind of fear, their films show all you need is Jesus

Hey bro, you don't have any hand? No legs? You can still become a Ronaldo Delima if you believe

Hey bro, you don't have a job? You can have a brand new car, a mansion and huge pile of hard bills in the next one minute if you believe

I know I exaggerated in the two examples above but consider stories of a someone driving from Ore to Lagos on empty tank; someone reparking a Car that had no engine (that story was all over Facebook)

our mathematics teacher who is one such born again was actually the most hungry looking out of all our teachers told us a story about a boy who didn't joke with his spiritual life, this boy according to him kept praying, fasting and attending fellowships; this actually took a toll on him when examination came as he was too busy facing spiritual life rather than reading; when results of the examination was out, he had the best result; naturally, we (the students or should I say audience) didn't believe this story at that point but our math teacher wasn't done, he said that boy passed because an angel appeared to him in the examination hall with answers, stood in front of him and told him to write those answers, no one could see the angel except this prayerful boy; we all believed the story ( secondary school brain)

To someone that's used to hearing stories like these almost every month since birth, the message is very clear Jesus provides everything Ask anything with faith and you have it

Such a fear was the easiest to overcome out of all my fears (it wasn't "easy" though)

How I Overcame that fear

I overcame that fear by keen observation, looking at the fact that the man or woman that prays the most is usually one of the poorest around

"Born again" students fail while a doubter like me succeed with flying colours; I then started to wonder where that "examination Hall angel" was when those prayerful students were failing

Seeing believers fail academically and me succeed actually made me realise that no matter the level of prayer you pray, you need to read, no angel would appear to you AND if you don't pray at all but read very well, you would definitely pass with flying colours

This fear was conquered early on in my life which enabled me embrace atheism faster, do you know why?

This is where it gets interesting

As you grow older, such fears transform from something you have much more control over; eg academics which involves studying, seriousness and reading; basically everything is in your hands, hence easy to debunk the "examination hall angel" logic since all power belongs to YOU and YOU alone TO things that you have much lesser control over; e.g Businesses which depends on a lot of luck; once you become an adult with those fears, it would be very hard to shake off, it becomes a part of you, you start thinking you can NEVER succeed in anything without Jesus

2nd fear is fear of witches, wizards, principalities, powers, spiritual attacks from extended families e.t.c

This was very hard for me to shake, growing up in Nigeria and hearing all sorts of stories about jazz being used on people kept me theist for many years too

Stories of people being freed from nightmares and impending death by mentioning the name of Jesus, stories in "fire in the word" by MFM (I read this bulletin every week, it was 10 naira back then)

Many tales of witchcraft attacks, tales about people using the name of Jesus to overcome those "attacks"

There was even a story of ritual killers transporting a woman to the kill location, this woman then kept shouting the name of Jesus in the bus being used to transport her, this name started causing commotion among the kidnappers and they told her to shut up, she however kept shouting the name until one of the kidnappers had to shut her mouth with a duct tape, she then used her hand to write "Jesus" on the floor of the bus, commotion resumed among the kidnappers and they had to stop the bus to let her leave

Stories of people that are born again being rejected by our local gods from being used as sacrifice while an unbeliever was accepted and sacrificed to the gods instead

Stories of extended families using jazz to bring family members back from abroad

Stories of love potions

Stories of relatives using spiritual means to keep their family members from succeeding in life

Stories of destinies being padlocked and thrown in the wilderness

Stories of grandmothers preventing their grandchildren from succeeding through spiritual means

Every Sunday, you're told these stories or their spinoffs

These stories were being reiterated by Christian movies and even secular movies are not left out

How I overcame that fear

The "grandmother" one made me start to question everything, my grandmother would prevent me from succeeding? Pure hogwash


Little by little, I started questioning each one

Witchcraft; that was the second one, there was this girl that people call a witch in school, she was feared by all and tales abound, like co students falling sick after having issues with her, even a particular girl died because of that; one day, I had a disagreement with her, she slapped me and I beat the holy crhap out of her, I beat her knowing I'm dying anyways, all through the rest of that school day, I was looked upon with pity by fellow students, most of them believing they'll never see me again, well I guess you know if I survived or not, right?

Your businesses and work fail because of anything but spiritual; I'm yet to see a business that keeps proper books fail without knowing the reason for the failure; t worst they fail due to bad luck

As I grew up, that fear got smaller and smaller; I looked at the huge level of curses being directed at bosses in Nigeria, its a surprise such bosses didn't fall down and die; how could Babangida kill so many people and none of them think it worthy to use "spiritual means" to eliminate him? Those Indians that are known to exploit us, they are stil going strong

Why can't that "spiritual means" be used to kill Boko Haram? Why is anybody even living since we should've all killed ourselves through those means since there would be someone somewhere who "deserves" those means

That was tough to overcome but I did anyways

3 Fear of what my family members might think

Hopefullandlord, What would your mother say? How would she feel? Your father? Have you thought about that? These words kept ringing in my brain

This was not really a "fear" thing but just a case of being in limbo out of respect, my parents take spiritual matters very seriously

This I overcame but I won't go into details because its more of a personal thing, what rocks my boat may sink yours

4 Fear of Yahweh himself, Hell fire and all

This fear was the hardest, hell fire, I'm burning for eternity

No one to save me, me and the devil who would torture me forever

Movies, books, Christian magazines, bible, everything points to hell one way or another

Here's the thing A visceral fear of something doesn't disappear automatically when you reason that the thing in question doesn't exist. You can still be scared of ghosts late at night just because it's late at night, even though you can clearly reason during a sunny afternoon that spirits are nonsense. Reason unfortunately doesn't override emotion just like that. It took time, fear of hell still remained for a long long time;

early morning preachers use hell fire as theme; you hear of hell almost everywhere
it kept cemented in my head and it was the HARDEST fear to overcome

But I overcame by realising all Muslims are hellbound; no matter how good they lived their lives, I started thinking about the good Muslims around, I then determined that hell is the place for me, let me point out that I don't believe in hell but indoctrination can be an almost impossible thing to overcome

So I started joking Elvis Presley, Fela and most of the popular people are going to hell, I won't be the only one there to be burning forever

Once I overcame this fear, I realised the absurdity of hell fire, it doesn't make ANY sense

Nothing I can do in this life warrants eternal torture

Even if I kill everyone in the world, I still don't think it warrants eternal torture let alone going to hell because of a lack of belief

Here's the thing; fear of Hell is an accident of your birth and not an indication of reality. Your parents/people around you taught you to fear Hell because they fear Hell. If you had been born to Hindus you would have been raised to believe in reincarnation. If you had been born a Viking you would have been taught that the only way to get into Heaven was to cross a rainbow bridge after dying gloriously in battle.

And BTW

Which hell?

Christian hell?

Muslim hell?

Hades?

Little by little, all these fears disappeared and I started taking full responsibility for my life, there's no witch that would prevent my success and I am succeeding


There you have it; all the fears that gave Christianity "life support" in my life for a long time


Thanks for the read

Ranchhoddas:
Proportional Justice.

247NewsUpdateNG:




First and foremost, I want to congratulate on your supposed overcome of the greatest cankerworm in life, FEAR.

Next, let's tackle your (gone) fears singularly.

Fear of failure: Failure never comes from being an unbeliever neither does success come as soon as you become a 'born-again'? Even the Holy Book of Christianity (The Bible) says that there's a season for everything.... A season to sow and that to reap.
What you were actually suffering from was atelophobia or inferiority complex, which made you look for a base on which to anchor your yearning for success. After all, if you read the Bible, you'll discover that ancient kings, who were idol worshippers or idols themselves (self-proclaimed gods), were actually successful and prosperous. Take the Egyptian Pharaohs for instance.
Also, don't forget that even the Devil tempted Jesus with bounteous riches.

Fear of the spiritual realm: You were supposedly once a christian because of the fear of the unknown and being under the umbrella of christianity was the shelter in which you felt you would be safe from it. Well, if you went through the Bible conspicuously, you would have discovered that witchcraft and other black art are being controlled by (and from) the spiritual realm, which even the foundation of atheism (science) believe in even though it is defined by numerous terms such as the unconscious, subconscious, black hole, e.t.c. The fact that you beat up an alleged witch and survived doesn't put an end to the existence of the spiritual realm. If you think otherwise, you can give it a trial by desecrating a shrine.


Fear of what family members think: It is wrong to live your life for others. Even Jesus at a point asked to be left alone. Mohammed, Buddha, Guru Maharaj and others got theirs power or visitation through meditations ALONE. So if you decide to live for others think, you'll never live. Being a Christian or religious individual should never be because of others. That's what it killing the world today. Take the instance of the biblical priest, Eli and his sons.


Fear of hell: That is one thing that virtually all religions have in common. The day atheists or scientists can explain what happens immediately a human takes his/her breath, then we can deliberate on hell.



FYI, christianity never had a life support in your life. Rather, you used it as a hiding place for your fears.

Also, christianity is best experienced as a way of life rather than as a religion. Same is applicable to other religions.

247NewsUpdateNG:




First and foremost, I want to congratulate on your supposed overcome of the greatest cankerworm in life, FEAR.

KingEbukasBlog:


I had deterrent in my mind .

They discourage criminal activities .

Hell discourages immorality . So why the society plays their part with "proportional justice" , God does His with Hell .

A Christian does not need to fear Hell , the same way a law abiding citizen does not need be afraid of those .

Ranchhoddas:
'Criminal' activities are still on the rise even with this 'deterrent'; among believers and unbelievers alike.

Ranchhoddas:
The worst kind of fear I think is the fourth one. That fear of eternal roasting. Keeps people in line.

KingEbukasBlog:

Then you are wrong

Ranchhoddas:
How so?

KingEbukasBlog:


"Proportional justice" is meant for offenders and Hell is meant for the errant man . According to you , "proportional justice" has failed to keep man in check because criminal activities are on the rise , if you believe this is so , then its also wrong to say that Hell keeps people in check .

Both serve the same purpose - deter people from deviating from the accepted standard .

You get ?

Ranchhoddas:
This is because we do not know for sure that there is a hell. Believe me nobody would sin again if they were 100% sure of hell. Who wan take that kind risk? Even the hell advocates commit sin on a daily basis. They don't know; they just accept it by faith.

KingEbukasBlog:


That's not the reason . Its simply grace .

There is 100 percent certainty of going to jail for 14 years for sexual relationships with the same sex in Nigeria yet homosexuals still engage in such act knowing fully well what awaits them if they're caught .

Every Christian knows Hell awaits a sinner but people hope on God's mercy and grace for another opportunity to ask for forgiveness . Haven't you heard someone say he'll give his life to Christ later on in life , let him enjoy small

hopefuLandlord:


You can't compare the two though

Homosexuals for instance would be very careful not to get caught

They can "reduce" their chances of being caught to a near zero by taking certain precautions; they know that if they have enough privacy, no one can possibly catch them

But in the case of people who believe in hell fire, especially Christians, you believe you can't possibly hide it from Yahweh and you can die while in the act, yet still go ahead and commit sin anyways

KingEbukasBlog:


That's not the reason . Its simply grace .

There is 100 percent certainty of going to jail for 14 years for sexual relationships with the same sex in Nigeria yet homosexuals still engage in such act knowing fully well what awaits them if they're caught .

Every Christian knows Hell awaits a sinner but people hope on God's mercy and grace for another opportunity to ask for forgiveness . Haven't you heard someone say he'll give his life to Christ later on in life , let him enjoy small

Ranchhoddas:
Those gay people carry out their activities secretly, they can do whatever they like as long as they don't get caught. God on the other hand has 'cameras' everywhere, He even knows you'd sin before commiting the sin yet people go ahead to sin.

hopefuLandlord:


Exactly what I'm tryna say

A gay couple for instance can retire into their home, put on the AC, lock all doors, windows and anything that people can see them through, once all these things are done, they have close to zero chance of being caught

Compared to............

Owliver:
LMAO. but you scientist and atheist say the universe came out of nothing na. so that makes sense? you call it nothing because you don't really know what it is. religious people call it God.

so like I said. this is the only situation where nothing would mean something. an intelligent great nothing. God

Okay. What is nothing it is simply the absence of something. It is not a real thing rather a condition of lack of something caused by it's lack of content. So would I call this God hell no.

And I did not say the universe poped out of nothing. I only gave instances where matter popped out of nothing in the quantum world. The universe might always has existed. Who knows

KingEbukasBlog:


The thing is the law has been set proscribing homosexuality in Nigeria and the punishment deemed condign is 14 years in prison . Every homosexual knows this as the punishment for their act . They have assignations as a way evading punishment - that's the risk they are willing to take .

The Christian who commits sin with the awareness of Hell is willing to take that risk because of God's mercy and grace .

So its all about taking risk .

The point is , both of them - The errant Christian and Nigerian homosexual - know their punishments but they are willing to take the risk .