Did Jesus declare Himself to be God by saying 'I AM'?

OLAADEGBU:
Did Jesus declare Himself to be God by saying 'I AM'?

Yes!!!

One funny observation about the major theme of Christianity is that it's self defeating.

Why should an 'all powerful' god have to sacrifice 'himself' to 'himself' before men could be forgiven.

That's magnanimous

Certainly yes, Jesus did declared Himself God, and indeed He is!

Here is the unmistakably prove of it: "God said to Moses, "I AM WHO I AM. This is what you are to say to the Israelites: 'I AM has sent me to you.'" (Exodus 3:14). Also, this is another solid prove that Jesus Christ is the God of the Old Testament.

OLAADEGBU:
Did Jesus declare Himself to be God by saying 'I AM'?

Rather what did the anonymous writer of John mean by claiming Jesus said I am and at the same time claiming that the Jews tried to stone him so as to make it seem as if he was referring to himself as god.

Rilwayne001:


Rather what did the anonymous writer of John mean by claiming Jesus said I am and at the same time claiming that the Jews tried to stone him so as to make it seem as if he was referring to himself as god.

Agony of Muslim brother who his book said Isa is the spirit and the word of Allah yet still thinking that it's the Author of the book of John that assigned Divinity to Jesus Christ with 'I Am'.

The  Bible  began  to  appear  to  me  as  a  very  human  book.  Just  as  human  scribes  had  copied, and  changed,  the  texts  of  scripture,  so  too  had  human  authors  originally  written  the  texts  of  scripture.  This  was  a  human  book  from  be ginning  to  end.  It  was  written  by  different  human  authors  at  different times  and  in  different  places  to  address  different  needs.  Many  of  these authors  no  doubt  felt  they  were  inspired  by  God  to  say  what  they  did, but  they  had  their  own  perspectives,  their  own  beliefs,  their  own views,  their  own  needs,  their  own  desires,  their  own  understandings, their  own  theologies;  and  these  perspectives.

Emusan:


Agony of Muslim brother who his book said Isa is the spirit and the word of Allah yet still thinking that it's the Author of the book of John that assigned Divinity to Jesus Christ with 'I Am'.

Lol, when was John written and who wrote it? Have you ever asked yourself these questions?

Rilwayne001:
Lol, when was John written and who wrote it? Have you ever asked yourself these questions?

It should have been, why does Qur'an called Isa Allah's Spirit and Word?

because I could still remember how Muslims have been going up and down to proof the prophecy of the coming of Muhammad from the same book of John.

Emusan:


It should have been, why does Qur'an called Isa Allah's Spirit and Word?

Does that make him Allah?

because I could still remember how Muslims have been going up and down to proof the prophecy of the coming of Muhammad from the same book of John.

Well well, i used to hold that view before, but not any longer. Could you now please answer my question?

Rilwayne001:
Does that make him Allah?

Yes it is since both The Spirit and Word of Allah are uncreated and only God is uncreated.

Well well, i used to hold that view before, but not any longer. Could you now please answer my question?

So you mean you were once in delusion of Muhammad in the Bible before but now you're free!

You know what start spreading the Gospel of Truth to your fellow Muslims that there was no single prophecy of Muhammad in the Holy Bible. You can begin here by open a thread to release your fellow Muslims who still hold to that delusion.

What you called question isn't a question because what I can infer from your post is a denial of truth with the word "Anonymous writer".

Scholar8200:


Yes!!!

Glory to God in the highest!

Emusan:


It should have been, why does Qur'an called Isa Allah's Spirit and Word?

because I could still remember how Muslims have been going up and down to proof the prophecy of the coming of Muhammad from the same book of John.

Pls stop reaponding to the muslim, he is making this beautiful thread about Islam, and its not.

Meanwhile, am still waiting.

God in old testament said "I AM that I AM" to Moses while Jesus only said "I AM". How does that mean Jesus was referring to himself as God? There is misinterpretation somewhere.

Jesus said "Before Abraham I AM"
I AM what exactly? I am an angel, slave, spirit, wind? etc

Let's use old testament style: "Before Abraham I AM that I AM"
This make more sense because God has concluded He's I AM that I AM.

The writer of John must have use old testament to suit Jesus being God, unfortunately John writer didn't get it right because God said "I AM that I AM" = twice.

Emusan:


Yes it is since both The Spirit and Word of Allah are uncreated and only God is uncreated.

Well well, we've argued this before, and i don't think I'll be doing this again.

So you mean you were once in delusion of Muhammad in the Bible before but now you're free!

It may not be a delusion, it may actually be the true. But I, as a person do not believe the Bible as the word of God. And so i have decided that it is of no use, using it to validate my beliefs no matter how similar they are.

You know what start spreading the Gospel of Truth to your fellow Muslims that there was no single prophecy of Muhammad in the Holy Bible. You can begin here by open a thread to release your fellow Muslims who still hold to that delusion.

The day you start telling us how your own particular beliefs is what leads to god and all other thousands of Christian sects are scam.

What you called question isn't a question because what I can infer from your post is a denial of truth with the word "Anonymous writer".

It is. You don't discard a question that you perceive to be a denial of truth rather you try to bring the denial of truth to the face of the questionnaire. Are you really saying the writer of the book of John is known? How about other books of the NT? When were they written and by who?

tintingz:
God in old testament said "I AM that I AM" to Moses while Jesus only said "I AM". How does that mean Jesus was referring to himself as God? There is misinterpretation somewhere.

Jesus said "Before Abraham I AM"
I AM what exactly? I am an angel, slave, spirit, wind? etc

Let's use old testament style: "Before Abraham I AM that I AM"
This make more sense because God has concluded He's I AM that I AM.

The writer of John must have use old testament to suit Jesus being God, unfortunately John writer didn't get it right because God said "I AM that I AM" = twice.

And God said unto Moses, I Am That I Am: Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I Am hath sent me unto you.

Exodus 3:14

Scholar8200:

And God said unto Moses, I Am That I Am: Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I Am hath sent me unto you.

Exodus 3:14

It's obvious the former is still referring to the latter in same context. Something like "God has sent me unto you"

he LORD said to Moses, “I am the LORD; tell Pharaoh king of Egypt all that I say to you.”(Exodus 6:29)

It has been concluded.

As for John: " Before Abraham I am" to clear it " before Abraham God"? That didn't flow.

Even Jehovah witness(your fellow christians) don't support it, they know it was misinterpreted by some Christians.

There are many verses Jesus denied being God.

The writter of John as really done good job to portray Jesus as God.

tintingz:
It's obvious the former is still referring to the latter in same context. Something like "God has sent me unto you"

That God being Named, "I Am''.

he LORD said to Moses, “I am the LORD; tell Pharaoh king of Egypt all that I say to you.”(Exodus 6:29)

It has been concluded.

As for John: " Before Abraham I am" to clear it " before Abraham God"? That didn't flow.

The Name both describes a Personality and His Duration. The usage in John considering the mention of Abraham, vis a vis the reaction of His listeners in that chapter shows that the latter Attribute being an exclusive preserve of Deity was intended.

See:
57 The people said, “You aren’t even fifty years old. How can you say you have seen Abraham?[j]”

58 Jesus answered, “I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I am![k]” 59 At that point they picked up stones to throw at him. But Jesus was hidden from them and left the Temple.

Footnotes:
k
8:58 Or before Abraham was even born, I have always been alive; Greek reads before Abraham was, I am. See Exod 3:14.

Scholar8200:
That God being Named, "I Am''.

The Name both describes a Personality and His Duration. The usage in John considering the mention of Abraham, vis a vis the reaction of His listeners in that chapter shows that the latter Attribute being an exclusive of preserve of Deity was intended.

See:
57 The people said, “You aren’t even fifty years old. How can you say you have seen Abraham?[j]”

58 Jesus answered, “I tell you the truth, before Abraham was even born, I am![k]” 59 At that point they picked up stones to throw at him. But Jesus was hidden from them and left the Temple.

Footnotes:
k
8:58 Or before Abraham was even born, I have always been alive; Greek reads before Abraham was, I am. See Exod 3:14.

Why did Jehova witness said those verse where misinterpreted? They have their backups.

tintingz:
Why did Jehova witness said those verse where misinterpreted? They have their backups.

Well, they were not misinterpreted.

tintingz:
Why did Jehova witness said those verse where misinterpreted? They have their backups.

If you have their back up notes towards that effect please share it here if not don't ascribe any thing to jw let jw make their case

For an in-depth analysis of John 8:58
http://biblehub.com/interlinear/john/8-58.htm

For an in-depth analysis of I AM
http://biblehub.com/strongs/greek/1510.htm

So what was misinterpreted?

JOHN 8:58 BEFORE Abraham was, I AM
JOHN 8:58

IS JESUS SAYING HE HIMSELF IS ALMIGHTY GOD THE
GREAT I AM THAT I AM ?


Does John 8:58 prove the the doctrine of the trinity, which states that Jesus the Son of God is CO ETERNAL with Almighty God? Or does John 8:58 prove the doctrine of the deity of Jesus as himself being ALMIGHTY God the great I AM THAT I AM, which we read about in Exodus 3:14, which says,

“And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shall you say unto the children of Israel, I AM has sent me unto you.”

In John 8:58 Jesus says, Verily verily, BEFORE Abraham was, I AM. So the question has been asked, “Is Jesus saying he IS THE I AM, as in, Is Jesus saying that he is THE ALMIGHTY God, when Jesus says the words “I AM”?”

Then another question is asked, “Does Jesus saying the words “I AM” mean that Jesus pre existed for all eternity like Almighty God? In other words, was Jesus as the SON of Almighty God ALWAYS in existence WITH Almighty God the Father in that Jesus the Son of God had NO BEGINNING?

Let us begin this study in God word by reading this verse in the CONTEXT of where it is found. First we will deal with the question of whether or not Jesus is saying that he is the great I AM, the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God. Then further on in this study is God's word we will address the question of whether or not Jesus is co eternal with Almighty God the great I AM.

John 8:12-59.
“Then spoke Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that follows me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

13. The Pharisees therefore said unto him, You bear record of yourself; your record is not true.

14. Jesus answered and said unto them, Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true: for I know whence I came, and whither I go; but you cannot tell whence I come, and whither I go.

15. You judge after the flesh; I judge no man.

16. And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am NOT ALONE, but I AND the Father that SENT me.

17. It is also written in your law, that the testimony of TWO men is true.
(Jesus plainly states that there are TWO that bear witness all the way through this entire passage of scripture, which teaches us that Jesus is NOT saying that he himself is ALMIGHTY God the great I AM, who alone is the FATHER. In other words, IF Jesus was truly saying that he himself IS the I AM, then Jesus would be saying that he is the FATHER himself.)

18. I am ONE that bear witness of myself, and the Father that SENT me bears witness of me.
(in other words, Almighty God the Father is ONE witness and Jesus the SON of God is witness number TWO, which teaches us that Jesus and the Father are NOT ONE and the SAME being, but rather they are TWO separate individual persons or beings that AGREE or have the same WITNESS)

19. Then said they unto him, Where is your Father? Jesus answered, You neither know me, nor my Father: if you had known me, you should have known my Father also. (here again we see Jesus speaking of TWO separate persons)


42. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, you would love me: for I proceeded FORTH and came FROM God; neither came I OF MYSELF, but HE SENT me.
(so again we see that Jesus is NOT identifying himself as BEING the one who sent himself. Jesus is clearly teaching us that he was sent BY the great I AM who is Almighty God.)

50. And I seek not mine OWN glory: there is one that seeks and judges.
(here we see that Jesus does not honor himself, but rather Jesus honors his Father. So again we see two separate persons, the great I AM THAT I AM and his SON Jesus.)

54. Jesus answered, If I honor MYSELF, my honor is nothing: it is MY Father that honors me
(again please notice again that Jesus is speaking of his Father, the great I AM THAT I AM as being a SEPARATE person from himself); of whom you say, that he is your God:

56. Your father Abraham rejoiced to see MY DAY: and he saw it, and was glad.
(HOW did Abraham see the DAY of the Messiah, when the Messiah had NOT YET COME? I will comment on this question in a moment.)

57. Then said the Jews unto him, You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?

58. Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, (or Truly truly) I say unto you, BEFORE Abraham was, I am.

59. Then took they up stones to cast at him:
(not because Jesus was saying that he was ALMIGHTY God the Father, who alone is the great I AM THAT I AM, but rather because they did NOT believe that Jesus was the Messiah. You see the context of the previous chapters teach us that the Jew wanted to kill Jesus for breaking the Sabbath day by healing the sick on the Sabbath. The truth of the matter is that these Jewish leaders did not want to loose any of their followers to become a follower of Jesus so they picked up stones to stone him for whatever reason they could find),
but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.”
http://www.amatteroftruth.com/john-5-58-before-abraham-was-i-am

The write-ups is very long I had to skip some verses, reading the bolded commentaries will give the interpretation in context of the verses.

At the beginning of the chapter (John) we can see Jesus distinct himself being God and said he was sent from God.

cc
Scholar8200
rhektor

tintingz:
JOHN 8:58 BEFORE Abraham was, I AM
JOHN 8:58

Does John 8:58 prove the the doctrine of the trinity, which states that Jesus the Son of God is CO ETERNAL with Almighty God?

Precisely!

Or does John 8:58 prove the doctrine of the deity of Jesus as himself being ALMIGHTY God the great I AM THAT I AM, which we read about in Exodus 3:14, which says,

No, this contradicts other passages in both OT and NT.

“And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shall you say unto the children of Israel, I AM has sent me unto you.”

In John 8:58 Jesus says, Verily verily, BEFORE Abraham was, I AM. So the question has been asked, “Is Jesus saying he IS THE I AM, as in, Is Jesus saying that he is THE ALMIGHTY God, when Jesus says the words “I AM”?”

Consider these:

Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. John 5:18

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
John 10:33
Jesus did not deny these accusations because both were True!

Then another question is asked, “Does Jesus saying the words “I AM” mean that Jesus pre existed for all eternity like Almighty God? In other words, was Jesus as the SON of Almighty God ALWAYS in existence WITH Almighty God the Father in that Jesus the Son of God had NO BEGINNING?

Absolutely! To take a contrary position is to contradict other passages.

Let us begin this study in God word by reading this verse in the CONTEXT of where it is found. First we will deal with the question of whether or not Jesus is saying that he is the great I AM, the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God. Then further on in this study is God's word we will address the question of whether or not Jesus is co eternal with Almighty God the great I AM.

John 8:12-59.
“Then spoke Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that follows me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

13. The Pharisees therefore said unto him, You bear record of yourself; your record is not true.

14. Jesus answered and said unto them, Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true: for I know whence I came, and whither I go; but you cannot tell whence I come, and whither I go.

15. You judge after the flesh; I judge no man.

16. And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am NOT ALONE, but I AND the Father that SENT me.

17. It is also written in your law, that the testimony of TWO men is true. (Jesus plainly states that there are TWO that bear witness all the way through this entire passage of scripture, which teaches us that Jesus is NOT saying that he himself is ALMIGHTY God the great I AM, who alone is the FATHER. In other words, IF Jesus was truly saying that he himself IS the I AM, then Jesus would be saying that he is the FATHER himself.)

18. I am ONE that bear witness of myself, and the Father that SENT me bears witness of me. (in other words, Almighty God the Father is ONE witness and Jesus the SON of God is witness number TWO, which teaches us that Jesus and the Father are NOT ONE and the SAME being, but rather they are TWO separate individual persons or beings that AGREE or have the same WITNESS)

19. Then said they unto him, Where is your Father? Jesus answered, You neither know me, nor my Father: if you had known me, you should have known my Father also. (here again we see Jesus speaking of TWO separate persons)


42. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, you would love me: for I proceeded FORTH and came FROM God; neither came I OF MYSELF, but HE SENT me.
(so again we see that Jesus is NOT identifying himself as BEING the one who sent himself. Jesus is clearly teaching us that he was sent BY the great I AM who is Almighty God.)

50. And I seek not mine OWN glory: there is one that seeks and judges.
(here we see that Jesus does not honor himself, but rather Jesus honors his Father. So again we see two separate persons, the great I AM THAT I AM and his SON Jesus.)

54. Jesus answered, If I honor MYSELF, my honor is nothing: it is MY Father that honors me
(again please notice again that Jesus is speaking of his Father, the great I AM THAT I AM as being a SEPARATE person from himself); of whom you say, that he is your God:

Of course HE was sent by the Father. But remember Philipians 2:3-7

56. Your father Abraham rejoiced to see MY DAY: and he saw it, and was glad.
(HOW did Abraham see the DAY of the Messiah, when the Messiah had NOT YET COME? I will comment on this question in a moment.)

57. Then said the Jews unto him, You are not yet fifty years old, and have you seen Abraham?

58. Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, (or Truly truly) I say unto you, BEFORE Abraham was, I am.

59. Then took they up stones to cast at him:
(not because Jesus was saying that he was ALMIGHTY God the Father, who alone is the great I AM THAT I AM, but rather because they did NOT believe that Jesus was the Messiah. You see the context of the previous chapters teach us that the Jew wanted to kill Jesus for breaking the Sabbath day by healing the sick on the Sabbath. The truth of the matter is that these Jewish leaders did not want to loose any of their followers to become a follower of Jesus so they picked up stones to stone him for whatever reason they could find),
but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.”
http://www.amatteroftruth.com/john-5-58-before-abraham-was-i-am

This highlighted contradicts John 5:18 and 10:33 that shows why they wanted to stone Him, not Messiah-ship! In fact, nothing was said by Jesus about Him being accepted as the Messiah there!

Scholar8200:
Precisely!


No, this contradicts other passages in both OT and NT.

No, it doesn't contradict, Jesus has made himself clear many times to the Pharisees he was sent from God.

Consider these:

Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. John 5:18

The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
John 10:33
Jesus did not deny these accusations because both were True!

Why dont you quote those verses finish?

The Jews misunderstood (change) Jesus words "for a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy and because that thou being a man makest thyaelf God" this were the jews word, if we read John 10:31-36 we will see Jesus corrected them again.

John 10:31-36King James Version (KJV)

31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.

32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?

33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?

35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?

At @ bolded, Jesus answered them "because I said I am the son of God"? That was Jesus words correcting the Jews.

Absolutely! To take a contrary position is to contradict other passages.


Of course HE was sent by the Father. But remember Philipians 2:3-7

This highlighted contradicts John 5:18 and 10:33 that shows why they wanted to stone Him, not Messiah-ship! In fact, nothing was said by Jesus about Him being accepted as the Messiah there!

The above verse has answered this.

The Jews false allegation = You makest thyself God?

Jesus answered correcting the Jews = Because I said I am the son of God?

Brigham:


One funny observation about the major theme of Christianity is self defeating.

Why should an all power god have sacrifice himself to himself before men could be forgiven.

That's magnanimous

You need to understand the nature and attributes of God to begin with.

Rilwayne001:


Rather what did the anonymous writer of John mean by claiming Jesus said I am and at the same time claiming that the Jews tried to stone him so as to make it seem as if he was referring to himself as god.

What do you mean by 'the anonymous writer of John'? Apostle John was the bonafide writer of the gospel of John?

OLAADEGBU:


You need to understand the nature and attributes of God to begin with.

What are they?

You can help with that!

OLAADEGBU:
Did Jesus declare Himself to be God by saying 'I AM'?

Dear OLAADEGBU, you seem to have lots of questions regarding somethings in Scripture.
.
It's alright to ask questions, but the truth is that, concerning spiritual issues, man can only give you vague answers -most times you end up even more confused.
God called the believer to DISCOVER Him personally.
. 
I used to read a lot of Christian books until God gave me a Word. He said, “If everything you know about Me you heard from people, you do not know Me yet. You only know ABOUT Me; you do not KNOW Me"
.
Sir, you don't know someone by asking others, but by having a personal relationship with the said  person. 
I actually spent about 3years seeking Him after that Word He gave me. The things I've discovered in my personal quest are far more than all I learnt via books.
.
Paul became greater than other Apostles because of his passion to KNOW the Lord. 
Let me not take your time. See these Scriptures: Gal.1:11-20; Phil.3:4-14; 1John 2:20,26-27; Job 42:5,6.
Remember, they that KNOW (not know about) their God shall be strong... -Dan.11:32.
God bless you!

Thomas said my Lord and my God. Jesus did not correct him. He is God.haleluyah.

Google is your best friend

[url=5manutd..co.id/2016/10/rashford-and-lingard-prepare-for.html?m=1]Lingard and Rashford Prepare For Chelsea with a secret handshake[/url]