4kings:

Don't you get the point.
If this is solely the case of just watching the pre-released movie, then i'm ok with cancelling out predestination.
I even addressed this with your time traveler example.

It is indeed like watching a pre-released movie.
God isn't subject to time, hence He can move to and fro within events past , present or future.

But the issue here is that, this movie was initiated by God, therefore all events in this movie were initiated by God(Predestination!!!).
If i am omnipotent and i have a series of events in mind(or a movie), we can say this is foreknowledge, if i then bring this movie into reality then i created this series of events. So simple as A,B,C.
This is different from your airplane inventors example, which is just an example of human cognition taking place.So i didn't misrepresent any point, i addressed your points appropriately.

A few weeks ago, the BBNigeria reality TV series was initiated and concluded. Are you insinuating that the Producers, Directors and the Sponsors had already decided from inception that Efe will win the grand prize?

I think what I mean is like this. God gave the general rules, He initiates the program but it is a COMPETITION a SELECTION!

Why are you mixing the point up, intuition also causes KNOWLEDGE, the only difference here, is that it is not gotten from conscious reasoning. So this does not in anyway affect the issue at hand.

My point is to show that there are other means of information and knowledge without need for cognition, deduction or experience. Such is the rhelm of God who can know things yet to be without having to predestinate it.

Then i cease to exist.

Wrong answer!

If you were not subject to time and space, then
1. You can be everywhere and anywhere at the same time
2. You can know everything Past, Present and Future

You really don't get it.
If indeed it's Omniscience then this tests and results were all foreknown.
This does not change the issue.
I also addressed this in the "baby playing with toys" example.

That's why all our actions are based on ILLUSION if indeed we are in this situation.

The above is just your perception.

Judgement based on foreknowledge alone is unfair

This is your problem, you are of the idea that your God is Just.
You know the implication of this issue on that idea, therefore you've unconsciously subjected yourself to selective perception bias.
Well who knows i might be wrong and deluded, but hopefully we would find out soon, addressing this logically.

I would never see you as deluded even if we see things from different point of view.

Talking about perception.

1. Logically, order can never come out of chaos without an external influence.
2. Logically, order cannot spontaneously exist out of nothing

The Order in the fine details of the universe stands seriously against your judgement.

Atoms are Ordered.
From atoms, everything you see as reality including your brain matter were made.

How did atoms came to be ordered?

The answer can only lead you to God!

We can reorient our perception if we ask the right questions

shadeyinka:


It is indeed like watching a pre-released movie.
God isn't subject to time, hence He can move to and fro within events past , present or future.



A few weeks ago, the BBNigeria reality TV series was initiated and concluded. Are you insinuating that the Producers, Directors and the Sponsors had already decided from inception that Efe will win the grand prize?

I addressed this already.
The producers don't know the outcome of their production, therefore it's not foreknowledge.

I think what I mean is like this. God gave the general rules, He initiates the program but it is a COMPETITION a SELECTION!

Does not change Foreknowledge, Predestination and Illusion.

My point is to show that there are other means of information and knowledge without need for cognition, deduction or experience. Such is the rhelm of God who can know things yet to be without having to predestinate it.


Wrong answer!

If you were not subject to time and space, then
1. You can be everywhere and anywhere at the same time
2. You can know everything Past, Present and Future

If i am not subject to time and space, then i am outside of time and space, therefore 1 and 2 can't occur.
Think on this.

The above is just your perception.

Judgement based on foreknowledge alone is unfair

I knew this was your problem.

I would never see you as deluded even if we see things from different point of view.

Thanks.
You're not like KingEbukasBlog

Talking about perception.

1. Logically, order can never come out of chaos without an external influence.
2. Logically, order cannot spontaneously exist out of nothing

The Order in the fine details of the universe stands seriously against your judgement.

Atoms are Ordered.
From atoms, everything you see as reality including your brain matter were made.

How did atoms came to be ordered?

The answer can only lead you to God!

We can reorient our perception if we ask the right questions

I don't think you know 4kings.
I'm not an atheist ooo.

4kings:

I addressed this already.
The producers don't know the outcome of their production, therefore it's not foreknowledge.

Does not change Foreknowledge, Predestination and Illusion.

I am not insinuating that the Producers of BBNiger has any form of foreknowledge. I am stating the obvious:

The fact that you produced a Reality TV does not imply pre-choosing who the winner will be. Your claim is that since God produced the Theater of Man, He must certainly have doctored each persons act. No

Foreknowledge isn't Predestination
Predestination isn't Foreknowledge

Both are exclusive with respect to my God.

If you still have a problem with that, no problem its your choice and I can't change that.

If i am not subject to time and space, then i am outside of time and space, therefore 1 and 2 can't occur.
Think on this.

I knew this was your problem.

Thanks.
You're not like KingEbukasBlog

1 and 2 can't occur iff
a. I don't exist
b. I am Physical

BUT
"I AM" suggests that I exist and since I am not subject to time and space, I am not Physical.

therefore my point holds.

I don't think you know 4kings.
I'm not an atheist ooo.

You speak and argue as one.
So, what are you?

shadeyinka:


I am not insinuating that the Producers of BBNiger has any form of foreknowledge. I am stating the obvious:

The fact that you produced a Reality TV does not imply pre-choosing who the winner will be. Your claim is that since God produced the Theater of Man, He must certainly have doctored each persons act. No

Foreknowledge isn't Predestination
Predestination isn't Foreknowledge

Both are exclusive with respect to my God.

If you still have a problem with that, no problem its your choice and I can't change that.

You are deliberately misquoting him.

He didn't claim that since God produced the Theater of Man, He must certainly have doctored each persons act.

He said that if God has a foreknowledge of every man's act even before CREATING the theater of man then he must have predestined it.

Yes Foreknowledge isn't Predestination and Predestination isn't Foreknowledge

But both cannot be exclusive with God as the creator who already knows every out come even before creating.

shadeyinka:


I am not insinuating that the Producers of BBNiger has any form of foreknowledge. I am stating the obvious:

The fact that you produced a Reality TV does not imply pre-choosing who the winner will be. Your claim is that since God produced the Theater of Man, He must certainly have doctored each persons act. No

Foreknowledge isn't Predestination
Predestination isn't Foreknowledge

Both are exclusive with respect to my God.

If you still have a problem with that, no problem its your choice and I can't change that.

I've always told you that you were misrepresenting my points.
frank317 has replied this appropriately.

1 and 2 can't occur iff
a. I don't exist
b. I am Physical

BUT
"I AM" suggests that I exist and since I am not subject to time and space, I am not Physical.

therefore my point holds.

Was there a time before the creation of the universe where your God resides?
If so, do you think there would be any existence without "TIME"?
Existence can't be without time.

I see you've brought the immateriality concept of God, to talk about space.
The fact that something is immaterial does not mean it's without a location(That is if it exists).

Light for example is mass-less and not classified as matter in physics, but it's existence is subject to space, not so?

Is the residence of God without Location.

Existence and space/time are mutually exclusive

Recheck your definition of time and space to understand what i'm saying.

When people say God is outside of space and time, i don't think they mean it literally, but they think he transcends it(time/space of this universe).

You speak and argue as one.
So, what are you?

I'm a freethinking deist.

4kings:

I've always told you that you were misrepresenting my points.
frank317 has replied this appropriately.

Was there a time before the creation of the universe where your God resides?
If so, do you think there would be any existence without "TIME"?
Existence can't be without time.

I see you've brought the immateriality concept of God, to talk about space.
The fact that something is immaterial does not mean it's without a location(That is if it exists).

Light for example is mass-less and not classified as matter in physics, but it's existence is subject to space, not so?

Is the residence of God without Location.

Existence and space/time are mutually exclusive

Recheck your definition of time and space to understand what i'm saying.

When people say God is outside of space and time, i don't think they mean it literally, but they think he transcends it(time/space of this universe).

I'm a freethinking deist.

Physical Existence and space/time are mutually exclusive

Spiritual Existence can occur outside space and time.

I am sure we shall disagree on this but a good example is what happens in your Dreams (very similar to how things are in the spirit)

Where:

Time isn't linear and sometimes irrelevant
Position isn't absolute

You can think ofbitbin terms of Parallel Universe.

Within a dream, a person could get admission to a school, graduate and start his NYSC all within a dream. In such dream, the events could even occur in parallel and the events seem logical.

Of course, in the Physical, the dream itself could be a 2 minutes REM dream...an impossibility in real life.

You may not believe in the existence of spirit and how they operate (and you don't need to) but that is a close enough explanation of why God can exist without location. Everywhere and Somewhere at the same time!

Like I said, we don't have to agree of the possibility. It is sufficient to just understand how those who believe in God Jehovah think.



First time I'm hearing about a Freethinking Deist.
I know of Freethinkers
I know of Deists
But the combination must be complex. So you see why I mistook you for an Atheist. Even then, you still sound very Atheistic.

frank317:


You are deliberately misquoting him.

He didn't claim that since God produced the Theater of Man, He must certainly have doctored each persons act.

He said that if God has a foreknowledge of every man's act even before CREATING the theater of man then he must have predestined it.

Yes Foreknowledge isn't Predestination and Predestination isn't Foreknowledge

But both cannot be exclusive with God as the creator who already knows every out come even before creating.

I am not misquoting him.

He is saying that since God has foreknowledge of everything, then he must have predestined everything.

I used to word exclusive to mean this:

That is God can have Foreknowledge without having to Predestinate.
However, the converse: Predestination must go with Foreknowledge.

I agree, the word exclusive is ambiguous.

shadeyinka:


I am not misquoting him.

He is saying that since God has foreknowledge of everything, then he must have predestined everything.

I used to word exclusive to mean this:

That is God can have Foreknowledge without having to Predestinate.
However, the converse: Predestination must go with Foreknowledge.

I agree, the word exclusive is ambiguous.

U deliberately ignore the 'as a Creator' part and still say u are not misquoting him.

If before creating me, God knows that i, will grow up to become and atheist. He knows that i will go ahead and reject all biblical theories of him and he knows that i will go to hell, then he goes ahead to create me, isn't that Predestination? Isn't he creating me to become what he knows? Is he expecting me to do otherwise with my free will?
Having a knowledge of me before creating me and calling it free will is fraudulent.

If he was creating me without having in mind what i will become, perhaps all he had was assumption that i might be an atheist or Christian, then u can say the choice is mine. But with God knowing before even creating me, that means i am create to become what he knows.

frank317:


U deliberately ignore the 'as a Creator' part and still say u are not misquoting him.

If before creating me, God knows that i, will grow up to become and atheist. He knows that i will go ahead and reject all biblical theories of him and he knows that i will go to hell, then he goes ahead to create me, isn't that Predestination? Isn't he creating me to become what he knows? Is he expecting me to do otherwise with my free will?
Having a knowledge of me before creating me and calling it free will is fraudulent.

If he was creating me without having in mind what i will become, perhaps all he had was assumption that i might be an atheist or Christian, then u can say the choice is mine. But with God knowing before even creating me, that means i am create to become what he knows.

But He knows that one of your grand children will be a wonderful Evangelist that will turn hundreds of thousands to Him. And you call that fraudulent?

If you were God and the above scenario is true, would you as God still create this atheist?

Moreover, God didn't make you an Atheist, you did!

shadeyinka:


But He knows that one of your grand children will be a wonderful Evangelist that will turn hundreds of thousands to Him. And you call that fraudulent?

If you were God and the above scenario is true, would you as God still create this atheist?

It's either u have difficulty in understanding a point or u are deliberately being dubious

What i call fraudulent is not God knowing people will turn to evangelist. Why are u changing my statement just to make suit Ur believe. I am being objective here.

Listen again...

Knowing my children will turn evangelists and creating them is like creating them to become what u know they will become. It's like creating them to be evangelists because u knew them even before creating them.

Already u don't expect someone u know will become evangelist to become an armed robbery becasue u created him with a prior knowledge of him.

Calling the fact that he became an evangelist, something u created him to become, freewill is fraudulent. It's fraudulent because u created him to be that way, how can it be freewill? It was already predestined because ur creating of him was guided by an already existing knowledge of him.

frank317:


It's either u have difficulty in understanding a point or u are deliberately being dubious

What i call fraudulent is not God knowing people will turn to evangelist. Why are u changing my statement just to make suit Ur believe. I am being objective here.

Listen again...

Knowing my children will turn evangelists and creating them is like creating them to become what u know they will become. It's like creating them to be evangelists because u knew them even before creating them.

Already u don't expect someone u know will become evangelist to become an armed robbery becasue u created him with a prior knowledge of him.

Calling the fact that he became an evangelist, something u created him to become, freewill is fraudulent. It's fraudulent because u created him to be that way, how can it be freewill? It was already predestined because ur creating of him was guided by an already existing knowledge of him.

Your problem is that you have ruled out the possibility of God knowing (Foreknowledge) without coercing (Predestination).
But that's exactly the point.

God does not need to predestin to foreknow any one.

You seem not to understand the power of choice.

A person can choose to be celibate or not
He can choose to terminate his life or go on living
He can choose to live a life of peace or violence
He can choose to be to be an Atheist or not

God respects your choice in life, but every choice has its consequence.

What you don't want to believe is that God can give humans the power of choice and still have a foreknowledge of what your ultimate choices would be.

Since you don't even believe in the existence of God it can't make sense to you. I understand.

It really doesn't have to make sense to you. It is sufficient that you know what a Christian believes about Jehovah God.

shadeyinka:


Your problem is that you have ruled out the possibility of God knowing (Foreknowledge) without coercing (Predestination).
But that's exactly the point.

God does not need to predestin to foreknow any one.

You seem not to understand the power of choice.

A person can choose to be celibate or not
He can choose to terminate his life or go on living
He can choose to live a life of peace or violence
He can choose to be to be an Atheist or not

God respects your choice in life, but every choice has its consequence.

What you don't want to believe is that God can give humans the power of choice and still have a foreknowledge of what your ultimate choices would be.

Since you don't even believe in the existence of God it can't make sense to you. I understand.

It really doesn't have to make sense to you. It is sufficient that you know what a Christian believes about Jehovah God.

From the way u are replying me, i am sure it does not make sense to u either. U just believe all these by faith and that's what u should say rather than trying to explain the impossible.

U are human, i am human, neither of us is God(if he exists)

So try again and RESPOND to my posts.

Let me try again...

I understand choice, i understand u saying foreknowledge and Predestination are exclusive...

WHAT I DONT UNDERSTAND IS GOD KNOWING EVERYTHING ABOUT ME, I MEAN, MY THOUGHTS, DESIRES, UPBRINGING, LIKES, DISLIKES, CHOICE, ASPIRATIONS, DESTINATION, MY FINAL END POINT, even before creating me and and after creating me i become everything he already know i will become AND STILL HE STILL CALLS IT MY FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

frank317:


From the way u are replying me, i am sure it does not make sense to u either. U just believe all these by faith and that's what u should say rather than trying to explain the impossible.

U are human, i am human, neither of us is God(if he exists)

So try again and RESPOND to my posts.

Let me try again...

I understand choice, i understand u saying foreknowledge and Predestination are exclusive...

WHAT I DONT UNDERSTAND IS GOD KNOWING EVERYTHING ABOUT ME, I MEAN, MY THOUGHTS, DESIRES, UPBRINGING, LIKES, DISLIKES, CHOICE, ASPIRATIONS, DESTINATION, MY FINAL END POINT, even before creating me and and after creating me i become everything he already know i will become AND STILL HE STILL CALLS IT MY FREEDOM OF CHOICE.

Point of correction: Your coming to the world wasn't by creation but by procreation through the choices your parents made.

If they chose to abort you, you will not be here.

If your Mum married someone else other than your Dad, you will not be here. Intact, you are here simply because one spermatozoa out of 6 million fused with a particular ovum which happened to the one ovulation pushedbout at that beautiful time.

Now that you are here, you make your own choices.

But the creator of time can reverse, pause or forward time to know what kind of choices YOU will ultimately make. Its your choice, but He has the privilege of "bending time".

Anyone who can understand the concept of time-travel in science fictions will understand this.

shadeyinka:


Point of correction: Your coming to the world wasn't by creation but by procreation through the choices your parents made.

If they chose to abort you, you will not be here.

If your Mum married someone else other than your Dad, you will not be here. Intact, you are here simply because one spermatozoa out of 6 million fused with a particular ovum which happened to the one ovulation pushedbout at that beautiful time.

Now that you are here, you make your own choices.

But the creator of time can reverse, pause or forward time to know what kind of choices YOU will ultimately make. Its your choice, but He has the privilege of "bending time".

Anyone who can understand the concept of time-travel in science fictions will understand this.

lol... God is no longer my creator? now we are getting somewhere

Now that you have accepted that God is not my creator... of course I will make my own choice. It has got nothin to do with any creator. Since you have already acknowledge the fact that God seeing my tomorrow has no significant effect in my life. Can we the conclude that his foreknowledge is COMPLETELY useless to us? Its meaningless and pointless to both God and us.

God's foreknowledge is like one having a skill that is usless to him.

frank317:


lol... God is no longer my creator? now we are getting somewhere

Now that you have accepted that God is not my creator... of course I will make my own choice. It has got nothin to do with any creator. Since you have already acknowledge the fact that God seeing my tomorrow has no significant effect in my life. Can we the conclude that his foreknowledge is COMPLETELY useless to us? Its meaningless and pointless to both God and us.

God's foreknowledge is like one having a skill that is usless to him.

You can think whatever you will, the truth is unmovable.

shadeyinka:


You can think whatever you will, the truth is unmovable.

I am the one who should be telling you this. Stop confusing people with meaningless, unreasonable, beliefs. If u had brought out ur time to think deep u would know that u have just been unreasonable.

What u are doing it trying to explain to me that God is a married bachelor. And u think because u have ascribed the title God to an idea in ur head, u can tell me that he is a married bachelor. You can tell me he sees the future, knows me before i was born,and created me to become what he knows, yet the choice is mine to become what God knows i will become.

And the saddest thing is u call this jargon the truth. may your God really help u. Amen.

frank317:


I am the one who should be telling you this. Stop confusing people with meaningless, unreasonable, beliefs. If u had brought out ur time to think deep u would know that u have just been unreasonable.

What u are doing it trying to explain to me that God is a married bachelor. And u think because u have ascribed the title God to an idea in ur head, u can tell me that he is a married bachelor. You can tell me he sees the future, knows me before i was born,and created me to become what he knows, yet the choice is mine to become what God knows i will become.

And the saddest thing is u call this jargon the truth. may your God really help u. Amen.

You have nothing to gain by your preachings.
You don't have any hope after this life, yet you spend your precious time convincing people to become like you.

Ignorance they say is bliss.

If you claim you know, leave us the ignorant ones at least to enjoy our lives and our hopes.

Do you know that a criminal never appreciates suffering ALONE. They always prefare to endure their punishment with others (even if they have to lure or trick others) into it.

Same with a person on his way to Hell...they need company. Some preach tirelessly to make sure that many are like them just like Lucifer their Father and Boss.

If you don't have anything to contribute, drop the thread.

shadeyinka:


You have nothing to gain by your preachings.
You don't have any hope after this life, yet you spend your precious time convincing people to become like you.

Ignorance they say is bliss.

If you claim you know, leave us the ignorant ones at least to enjoy our lives and our hopes.

Do you know that a criminal never appreciates suffering ALONE. They always prefare to endure their punishment with others (even if they have to lure or trick others) into it.

Same with a person on his way to Hell...they need company. Some preach tirelessly to make sure that many are like them just like Lucifer their Father and Boss.

If you don't have anything to contribute, drop the thread.

U have hope because​ u believe in some meaningless jargon about an idea u made up in ur head... I don't jealous u.

U are now asking me to leave u, when u guys won't let us be. This is exactly how u guys disturb 'unbelievers' in every nook and cranny of the country, paying little attention to people's privacy. Now Ur shitty belief is being challenged and questioned u are begging to be left alone. Isn't it no longer ur God given duty to preach to the world? U want to preach but u don't want to be questioned.
What are u afraid of. Are u no longer in contact with the creator of the world?

A simple question, how is it possible that God saw my future and knows the outcome of my action even before creating me, yet this is not Predestination, u are running round and round.

Answer or keep quiet about ur fake Christianity.

If

frank317:


U have hope because​ u believe in some meaningless jargon about an idea u made up in ur head... I don't jealous u.

U are now asking me to leave u, when u guys won't let us be. This is exactly how u guys disturb 'unbelievers' in every nook and cranny of the country, paying little attention to people's privacy. Now Ur shitty belief is being challenged and questioned u are begging to be left alone. Isn't it no longer ur God given duty to preach to the world? U want to preach but u don't want to be questioned.
What are u afraid of. Are u no longer in contact with the creator of the world?

A simple question, how is it possible that God saw my future and knows the outcome of my action even before creating me, yet this is not Predestination, u are running round and round.

Answer or keep quiet about ur fake Christianity.

What else can one expect of an errand boy! SMH

shadeyinka:
If

What else can one expect of an errand boy! SMH

Lol...
Oga, you were giving off reasonable intelligence​ until u got cornered.
U haven't really given a deep thought to this foreknowledge/Predestination thing have u?

Explain to me why u think God, created me with a foreknowledge of all my actions. I mean every single one of them. I didn't even know myself but the creator has every knowledge of me before making me and giving me choice to do what he already knows i will do. I wouldn't do otherwise with the choicooo. Just what the creator knows. Please explain why you think this is different from Predestination.

The creator is even a good actor... He acts surprised,angry, at what he already knows. He sends u to talk to me to change despite knowing i will never change. He blames me for going to hell despite knowing i was doomed for hell even before creating me.

Explain this to me... Ask God to give u the wisdom to open my eyes.

frank317:

Lol...
Oga, you were giving off reasonable intelligence​ until u got cornered.
U haven't really given a deep thought to this foreknowledge/Predestination thing have u?

Explain to me why u think God, created me with a foreknowledge of all my actions. I mean every single one of them. I didn't even know myself but the creator has every knowledge of me before making me and giving me choice to do what he already knows i will do. I wouldn't do otherwise with the choicooo. Just what the creator knows. Please explain why you think this is different from Predestination.

The creator is even a good actor... He acts surprised,angry, at what he already knows. He sends u to talk to me to change despite knowing i will never change. He blames me for going to hell despite knowing i was doomed for hell even before creating me.

Explain this to me... Ask God to give u the wisdom to open my eyes.

I used to serve your master till I got my Freedom and Independence from him. I know his tactics, you are just an errand boy...good luck.

shadeyinka:


I used to serve your master till I got my Freedom and Independence from him. I know his tactics, you are just an errand boy...good luck.

My master must be greater than your master... is that why u are so afraid of him.

Oga, leave imaginary things, trust me, it will help u stop sounding like this. All the best bro...

frank317:


My master must be greater than your master... is that why u are so afraid of him.

Oga, leave imaginary things, trust me, it will help u stop sounding like this. All the best bro...

I don't blame you for your choice of 'Master'. We always submit to the one we think is stronger.

But since Light is the destroyer of darkness, I am glad I belong finally to the Light. Stay I'm your darkness if you will, its your choice

shadeyinka:


I don't blame you for your choice of 'Master'. We always submit to the one we think is stronger.

But since Light is the destroyer of darkness, I am glad I belong finally to the Light. Stay I'm your darkness if you will, its your choice

Sorry to burst Ur bubbles.... I am my own master. If that's too big for you and your God... I can't help u.

U are allowing false imagination to control u... That's quite sad.

frank317:

Sorry to burst Ur bubbles.... I am my own master. If that's too big for you and your God... I can't help u.

U are allowing false imagination to control u... That's quite sad.

You are!!? LOL
Your great is your blindfolds


Two fish were swimming when they saw a piece of meat dangling before them. The younger fish darted toward it with an open mouth. The older fish cried out, “Stop! You can’t see it, but there is a hook inside that meat. It is connected by an invisible line to a pole outside the water. There is a man holding the pole. If you eat the meat, the hook will catch in your jaw and the man will pull you out of the water. He will cut you open with a knife, roast you on a fire and eat you. Then he will throw your remains to his cat.”

The young fish stopped. The two of them swam away. But when the young fish was alone, he thought to himself, “Let me investigate for myself how accurate these claims are.”

He went back to the meat, swam around it, above and below it. He swam as far as he could in widening circles around the meat. After a long search, he said to himself, “I’ve looked far and wide, and I haven’t found any sign of a man, a pole, a knife, a fire or a cat. In fact, I’ve found no trace of anything outside this water we live in. These must just be stories.”

He went back to the meat and ate it. The hook caught in his jaw, he felt himself being yanked out of the water. He saw a pole, a man and a knife, but at that point his knowledge was useless.

LESSON: So is the TRUTH of the Endtime. Some of it is beyond our comprehension. Many people can neither see Hell fire nor Satan who is enticing them with sin and worldliness. Beware! There is DEATH in the POT.
May God let us heed to the truth in John 3:3-7, 1 John 3:8-10 while it is useful to us. Amen

May mercy & grace meet you in Jesus Name I pray.

shadeyinka:


You are too quick to judge.

Last 2 weeks ago, a phone was stolen from the alter in the church. It brought the question,:

Are there "Christian thieves" in the Church?
How many are Real Christians in the church?

If you think my perception is to harsh, what is yours?
99% rapturable?

Has it ever occurred to you that that phone getting stolen is probably god's plan?

shadeyinka:


You are!!? LOL
Your great is your blindfolds


Two fish were swimming when they saw a piece of meat dangling before them. The younger fish darted toward it with an open mouth. The older fish cried out, “Stop! You can’t see it, but there is a hook inside that meat. It is connected by an invisible line to a pole outside the water. There is a man holding the pole. If you eat the meat, the hook will catch in your jaw and the man will pull you out of the water. He will cut you open with a knife, roast you on a fire and eat you. Then he will throw your remains to his cat.”

The young fish stopped. The two of them swam away. But when the young fish was alone, he thought to himself, “Let me investigate for myself how accurate these claims are.”

He went back to the meat, swam around it, above and below it. He swam as far as he could in widening circles around the meat. After a long search, he said to himself, “I’ve looked far and wide, and I haven’t found any sign of a man, a pole, a knife, a fire or a cat. In fact, I’ve found no trace of anything outside this water we live in. These must just be stories.”

He went back to the meat and ate it. The hook caught in his jaw, he felt himself being yanked out of the water. He saw a pole, a man and a knife, but at that point his knowledge was useless.

LESSON: So is the TRUTH of the Endtime. Some of it is beyond our comprehension. Many people can neither see Hell fire nor Satan who is enticing them with sin and worldliness. Beware! There is DEATH in the POT.
May God let us heed to the truth in John 3:3-7, 1 John 3:8-10 while it is useful to us. Amen

May mercy & grace meet you in Jesus Name I pray.

Nice story but u made it sound like the hook that killed the fish was invisible... What is it God really hiding? He is the creator what stops him from being clear?

Funny u think urself as the senior brother in the story.... Yet you run round and round and can't reply my questions.

And what makes u so sure u are not the little fish in that story... I think u are.

frank317:


Nice story but u made it sound like the hook that killed the fish was invisible... What is it God really hiding? He is the creator what stops him from being clear?

Funny u think urself as the senior brother in the story.... Yet you run round and round and can't reply my questions.

And what makes u so sure u are not the little fish in that story... I think u are.

Wait, do fish eat meat?

hahn:


Has it ever occurred to you that that phone getting stolen is probably god's plan?

Very funny.
..but brilliant conclusion!

frank317:


Nice story but u made it sound like the hook that killed the fish was invisible... What is it God really hiding? He is the creator what stops him from being clear?

Funny u think urself as the senior brother in the story.... Yet you run round and round and can't reply my questions.

And what makes u so sure u are not the little fish in that story... I think u are.

Can't you appreciate a short story?

Its just a story...

hahn:


Wait, do fish eat meat?

They eat Pounded yam with bitter leaf soup.
The meat is just an appetizer.... Like our salad!

shadeyinka:

Can't you appreciate a short story?

Its just a story...

I appreciated it by starting my response with 'nice story's

Then i went ahead to analyze it based on my perception of ur motive behind the story