freshest4live:

Lol, it's one of the most useless comments l've ever read, so if parts of Brazil China or even Malaysia are compared to Europe, it therefore follows that the aforementioned countries must copy the European culture as well, simply because they compare their cities to those in Europe,

the way some of them think is just too funny, the other day, SHAYTUN posted that Nigeria has the 7th largest gas reserve in the world after iran and co. and the next thing is that TAYSERMAHIRI asked shaytun to compare Abuja and Lagos with the other 6 countries top cities.
how does that correlates for goodness sake?

brogxy:
henry4real19 i dey call u for hear

brogxy i dey here

genieluv:


Holly this is because most west africans speak Niger-congo languages, n the fulanis have a west-african origin from Senegal.

kikikiki...you funny....i like you....jellyfish...

obaaderemi:
They knew by early 1941 that Japan was going to attack Pearl Harbour but they allowed it to go on so they could use that as an excuse to unleash their madness on Japan which was a rising power in the East and subdue it forever.I think in looking for a model(do we actually need one?),Africa should look towards Japan and not America and Europe.Japan rose so fast after 1945 to rival Europe and America economically.Look at our main exports to the west:commodities whose prices are regulated(cocoa,coffee,crude oil,gold,etc)while they sell us stuffs whose prices are not regulated by any cartel,e.g. electronics,trains,cars,etc)they even control how we see the world and our continent(media power.)

May be we do but Japan is a bad example as it has always enjoyed some form of second class privilege together with the allied powers. China is the best example. Isolated, condemned to the third world but managed to beat odds and used an opposing system - communism, to rise, until it could not be ignored anymore.

For that to be, we have to forge our own systems, which should also discriminate against others to our advantage. That's how the world works. You gain power and construct a system that directs the wealth of the land to you and your people first. Thats what Europe did,
(don't forget the US is just a colony whose British settlers declared its "independence." That was probably the grand plan for all European colonies - settle in the colonies, "cut yourselves off" to look like an independent country and make the natives irrelevant.

Europe still recognises the boundaries of exclusive exploitation they established over Africa (we now call them countries) at the Berlin conference. That's why African countries can't even trade amongst each other.

TayserMahiri:


Very right, if you understand the most likely human migrations you would see how that came to be. Haplogroup E has a Southeast Asian distribution. In particular, it is found among speakers of Austronesian languages, and it is rare even in Southeast Asia among members of other language families. It has been detected in populations of Taiwan, the Philippines, Indonesia, Malaysia (including Sabah of Borneo, but not the Orang Asli of peninsular Malaysia), coastal Papua New Guinea, and especially in the Chamorros People of the Mariana Islands.

That captures it I believe.

Seems everybody started out black. But something strange happened to people outside the continent. The Denisovan and neanderthal effect, and whatever else people did to end up diverse.

As a side note, I suspect that such admixture was the cause of the changes in DNA. And there is possibility of willful introduction of modifying agents into people's bodies by ancient scientists, maybe biological and nuclear weapons. The presence of haplogroup "A" testifies to that fact. That It could have survived without interference.

Lionessza:



I hear you. Lol, I will make you my personal escort then.

Just document everything and everyone you meet and post them here, in case we need to come rescue you,

Bifwoli:


Funny how you want parts of Lagos compared to Europe but yet when other Africans in other countries dress more western then they're labelled "slaves to western culture and dressing".That they "lack originality and pride in their own stuff."

If you guys are gonna school other Africans about pride in african inspired Aso oke and Agbada clothing then might as well make Lagos look and compare to Lagos or Jos or even Abeokuta .Stop comparing it to Europe or London.

It's called double standards. When they don't want to accept the progress of other countries, they say either the white man did it or they (the other country) are copying Europeans yet they're the first to pride themselves for being like Europeans in aspects that they do well in.

NairobiWalker:


It's called double standards. When they don't want to accept the progress of other countries, they say either the white man did it or they (the other country) are copying Europeans yet they're the first to pride themselves for being like Europeans in aspects that they do well in.

If you want we can compare Lagos to Tokyo and China, it doesn't have to be Europe. I believe you are smart enough to see your arguement is absurd, there is no correlation.
In Nigeria for instance, some people in jos or Kano may compare some parts of their beloved cities to Abuja as well as to Lagos even on Nairaland here, does it mean the indigenes of Jos should also abandon their cultures in Plateau state for that of the indigenes of Abuja and Lagos?

Muafrika2:



Just document everything and everyone you meet and post them here, in case we need to come rescue you,

Lol, I will do that.

LionnessZa and Jayceon where are you? Two of your hommiez have won their hits already

Muafrika2:

May be we do but Japan is a bad example as it has always enjoyed some form of second class privilege together with the allied powers. China is the best example. Isolated, condemned to the third world but managed to beat odds and used an opposing system - communism, to rise, until it could not be ignored anymore.

For that to be, we have to forge our own systems, which should also discriminate against others to our advantage. That's how the world works. You gain power and construct a system that directs the wealth of the land to you and your people first. Thats what Europe did,
(don't forget the US is just a colony whose British settlers declared its "independence." That was probably the grand plan for all European colonies - settle in the colonies, "cut yourselves off" to look like an independent country and make the natives irrelevant.

Europe still recognises the boundaries of exclusive exploitation they established over Africa (we now call them countries) at the Berlin conference. That's why African countries can't even trade amongst each other.

Yep, would be good to also mention that Japan got a great deal of financial assistance from the West after the 2 world war ass kicking. China received none of that kinda special treatment.

Muafrika2:

That captures it I believe.

Seems everybody started out black. But something strange happened to people outside the continent. The Denisovan and neanderthal effect, and whatever else people did to end up diverse.

As a side note, I suspect that such admixture was the cause of the changes in DNA. And there is possibility of willful introduction of modifying agents into people's bodies by ancient scientists, maybe biological and nuclear weapons. The presence of haplogroup "A" testifies to that fact. That It could have survived without interference.

Thats it. The admixture with those species is a culprit. What sort of willful introduction could you think of?

Chkil0, your Algerian hommie also won his hit

TayserMahiri:
LionnessZa and Jayceon where are you? Two of your hommiez have won their hits already

Oh ! Great . Who are those? I haven't been following.

Lack of funds (or mismanagement) is why Naija could not send its young athletes to Kenya. .. I thought they also failed to attend due to terror fears like their fellow American counterparts


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xfm6WAyjw5g

Lionessza:




Oh ! Great . Who are those? I haven't been following.

There's this guy called Tshenolo Lemao. Forgot the other one

TayserMahiri:


There's this guy called Tshenolo Lemao. Forgot the other one

Ok great .will check them out. We have started collecting and there's no stopping us

Lionessza:



Ok great .will check them out. We have started collecting and there's no stopping us

Hopefully you dont ashame us on home soil Be nice guests

TayserMahiri:


Hopefully you dont ashame us on home soil Be nice guests

Lol, we will try to be considerate

TayserMahiri:


Is the highlighted an appeal to authority? I hope not. I cannot dispute that ancient Chinese were black (or thereabout). But I dont even know how we got there. Can we stick to one issue and exhaust it? You will take me in circles till I lose focus. We were talking about Melanesians, you went ahead and gathered so much unrelated info. Why are you making scientific matters appear like religious ones where you bombard $ confuse the people with so much conflicting information until they give up and hence agree? Thats how unreliable claims get their backing. Dont tell me I am not informed wen you already told me you are an amateur. Why dont you educate me on this one specific Melanesian issue without dismissing me as uninformed and without veering off? This is not religion

My dude, I told you relax,kidogo! Muafrika2,has already shown the genetic relationship between Melanasians and Africans but let me expound.

Table 1: Shared Y-Chromosome Ocenia and Africa
Haplogroup Oceania Africa Author K-M9 X X Cordaux,2003 M-M4 X X
“
E-M2 Northwestern Micronesia, New Guinea X Merriwether, n.d. E-35 New Guinea, Near Oceania X Cordaux,2003 E-M78 New Guinea X Cordaux,2003

The mtDNA M clade is the best genetic marker of the connection between Africans and Melanesians. The M1 haplogroup is a member of the M macrohaplogroup. M1 is a sister haplogroup to Haplogroup D, one of the major Asian subgroups in Macrohaplogroup M

Remember I mentioned China earlier?

There were two Shang Dynasties, one Melanoid or Dravidian speaking (Qiang-Shang) and the other Proto-Polynesian (Yin-Shang). The first Shang Dynasty was founded by Proto-Melanesians or Melanoids who predominately spoke Tamil.

Table 2: Definining control region mutations for African,Dravidian and Oceanian Haplotypes
Haplogroups HVS1 (add 16000) M 129 241 311 M1 129 189 249 311 M27a 223 048 077T 172 311 320 189 136 M28a 223 148 468 362 086 129 320 M29a 223 189 311
M29‟Q
129 241 Q1 223 148 265 343 D4 223 189 129 311 249

The M, N, and R macrohaplogroups are found throughout East and South and Southeast Asia[b], the Andaman Islands and Africa[/b]

In fact the transitions 16129, 16189, 16249 and 16311 are known to be recurrent in various branches of Haplogroup M, especially M1 and D4. Gonder
et al.,
(2006) for example, noted that[b] the mtDNAs of Tanzanians belonging to haplogroup M1

cluster with peoples from Oceania
[/b]

All this haplogroup classification is difficult for laymen-there are other ways of proving definite relationship. Look at all those common place names.

Page (1988) has found numerous Pacific toponyms that are of West African origin. Toponyms found in the Pacific, especially on Fiji indicate that many Melanesians came from Africa. These place names can be divided into place names that are made up of African ethnic names (AEN) as roots for Fijian place names (FPN), and Fijian place names that are identical to place names in West Africa (Page, 1988). The fact that most Niger-Congo speakers did not enter West Africa until after 2000BC, make it clear that for these terms to appear in the Pacific, the people planting these toponyms in the Pacific did not reach the region until somewhere between 3.5-4kya. These toponyms include a multitude of hills, streams and villages composed of a simple AEN root plus a Fijian placenames e.g.,koro, wai-ni-, vatu and na-, as illustrated in Figure 2. Page (1988) found 270 AEN's forming part of Fijian place names (FPN). The interesting fact about the AEN and FPN cognates is that they are found in West Africa and not East Africa (Page, 1988).The fact that the AENs that are FPN's are prefixed to a multitude of hills, streams and villages" indicate that these place names are very old because the names for hills and streams are rarely changed.

In Figure 4, we can see that there is a close relationship between the Austronesian /Polynesian, Manding and Tamil culture terms: The cognition of these languages is not surprising given the affinity between[b] the Dravidian languages in spoken Southeast Asia and the Pacific, and the fact that the Manding founded the Xia dynasty.[/b]

Also shared cognates between Africans,Tamils and Melanasians.

Dr. Balakrishnan found almost 500 Nigerian placenames, and 46 tribal names in Koraput, India; and 110 ethnonyms of Koyas in Nigeria. [/b]This led Dr. Balakrishnan (2005) to declare that :"However, the overwhelming evidence available from the toponymic corpuses of Koraput and Nigeria, and ethnonyms, surnames and personal names of[b] Koyas seem more adequate to propose an African origin to the Koyas, the Dravidian speakers"

The Melanesian or Dravido-African skeletal remains dating back to the Lapita culture, shared DNA and y-Chromosomes, and cognate Melanesian and West African place names suggest a recent migration of Melanesians from Africa and East Asia into the Pacific.


REFERENCES

Balakrishnan R (2005).
African roots of the Dravidian-speaking Tribes: A case in Onomastics,
International Journal of Dravidian Linguistics

34
(1) 153-202.
Bellwood P (1979).

Man's Conquest of the Pacific
(Oxford, New York).
Bellwood P (1991).
The Austronesian Dispersal and the Origin of Languages.
Scientific American
88-93.
Benedict PK (1990).
Japanese/Austro-Tai, Ann Arbor:Karoma, 1990.
Bulbeck D (2008).
Australian Aboriginal craniometrics as construed through FORDISC, 2005. Available: http://arts.anu.edu.au/bullda/oz_craniometrics.html [Accessed on 4/2/2008].
Chang KC (1964).
Prehistoric and early historic culture horizons and traditions in South China.
Current Anthropology

5
359-375.
Chang KC (1977).

The Archaeology of Ancient China
(Yale University Press: New Haven, 1977).
Chang KC (1980).

Shang Civilization
(Yale University Press: New Haven).
Chang KC (1987).

Archaeology of Ancient China
(Yale University Press.)
Cordaux
et al.,
(2003).
Mitochodrial DNA analysis reveals diverse tribal histories of tribal populations from India.
European Journal of Human Genetics
11
(2) 253-264.
Craib JL (1983).
Micronesian Prehistory An Archaeological Overview.
Science

219
919-927.
Fredlaender JS, Friedlaender FR, Hodgson JA, Stoltz M, Koki G, Horvat G, Zhadanov S, Schurr TG and Merriwether DA (2007).
Melanesian mtDNA complexity,
PLoS ONE

2
(2) 248.
Fucharoen G, Fucharoen S, Horai S (2001).
Mitochondrial DNA

polymorphism in Thailand.
Journal of Human Genetics

46
115-125.
Gonder MK, Mortensen HM, Reed FA, de Sousa A, Tishkoff SA (2006).
Whole mtDNA Genome Sequence Analysis of Ancient African Lineages.
Molecular Biology and Evolution
24
(3) 757-768.
Kayser M, Oscar Lao, Kathrin Saar, Silke Brauer, Xingyu Wang, Peter Nürnberg, Ronald J Trent, Mark Stoneking (2008).
Genome-wide Analysis Indicates More Asian than Melanesian Ancestry of Polynesians.
The American Journal of Human Genetics

82
(1) 194-198.
Kirch PV (1980).
Polynesian Prehistory:Cultural adaptation in Island Ecosystems.
American Scientist

68
(January/February) 39-48.
Laubenfels DJ (1968).
Australoids, Negroids and Negroes: A suggested explanation for their distinct distributions.
Annals of the Association of American Geographers

58
(1) 42-50.
Ling Shun-Sheng (1970).

A Study of the Raft, Outrigger, Double and Deck Canoes of ancient China, the Pacific and the Indian Ocean
(Taipei:Nankang).
Merriwether
et al.,
(1994).
Origins and dispersal in the mtDNA region V 9bp deletion and insertion in Nigeria and the Ivory Coast.
The American Journal of Human Genetics
.
Merriwether
et al.,
(No Date).
Mitochondrial DNA in the South Pacific. In:
Genomic Diversity.
Edited by Papilia SS, Deka R & Chakraborty R 159.
Page WJ (1988).
The Lakota Hypothesis:on the Origin of Melanesian People of the Fijian Islands.
West African Journal of Archaeology

18
31-72.
Pietrusewky M (1989).
A Lapita-associated skeleton from Natunuku Fiji.
Records of the Australian Museum
41
297-325.
Pietrusewsky (2005).
The Physical anthropology of the Pacific, East Asia: A multivariate craniometric analysis. In
The peopling of East Asia Putting together Archaeology, Linguistics and Genetics.
Edited by Sagart L, Blench R, Sanchez-Mazos A (RutledgeCurzon) 201-229.
Pugach I, Delfin F, Gunnarsdottir E, Kayser M, Stoneking M (2014).
Genome-wide data substantiate Holocene gene flow from India to Australia.
Proceedings of the Nation

http://www.academia.edu/10306654/AFRICAN_AND_DRAVIDIAN_ORIGINS_OF_THE_MELANESIANS

TayserMahiri:


Thats it. The admixture with those species is a culprit. What sort of willful introduction could you think of?

GMO kind

TayserMahiri:


Yep, would be good to also mention that Japan got a great deal of financial assistance from the West after the 2 world war ass kicking. China received none of that kinda special treatment.

China was a pariah until she became rich

TayserMahiri:
LionnessZa and Jayceon where are you? Two of your hommiez have won their hits already

You just letting us get off easy

Muafrika2:

China was a pariah until she became rich

I believe China started getting rich after it stopped being a pariah in the 60s after Nixon and Kissinger visited and successfully encouraged China to pull itself out of the sphere of the Soviet Union and embrace a market economy.China began to open up to the rest of the world since then and when it joined WTO,it just soared higher and higher.Maybe it's just me but Japan's economic miracle appears more impressive,especially with those world beating corporations and products(Toyota,Sony,Sharp,Mitsubishi,Canon,etc).But then,I agree with you; China's modern economic rise looks more independent than Japan's and would be a better model for Africa.But without unity of purpose,Africa is fvcked.

obaaderemi:
I believe China started getting rich after it stopped being a pariah in the 60s after Nixon and Kissinger visited and successfully encouraged China to pull itself out of the sphere of the Soviet Union and embrace a market economy.China began to open up to the rest of the world since then and when it joined WTO,it just soared higher and higher.Maybe it's just me but Japan's economic miracle appears more impressive,especially with those world beating corporations and products(Toyota,Sony,Sharp,Mitsubishi,Canon,etc).But then,I agree with you; China's modern economic rise looks more independent than Japan's and would be a better model for Africa.But without unity of purpose,Africa is fvcked.

Japan has tried too from the 1945 incident and the wars all over Asia. But I find themyself a mischievous people whose mischief worked out for them in the end

Hmm So There Is Internet In Kenya? Interesting

YhurKarma:
Hmm So There Is Internet In Kenya? Interesting

Careful B4 Dem Change Am For Yhu OO

kikuyu1:


My dude, I told you relax,kidogo! Muafrika2,has already shown the genetic relationship between Melanasians and Africans but let me expound.

Table 1: Shared Y-Chromosome Ocenia and Africa
Haplogroup Oceania Africa Author K-M9 X X Cordaux,2003 M-M4 X X
“
E-M2 Northwestern Micronesia, New Guinea X Merriwether, n.d. E-35 New Guinea, Near Oceania X Cordaux,2003 E-M78 New Guinea X Cordaux,2003

The mtDNA M clade is the best genetic marker of the connection between Africans and Melanesians. The M1 haplogroup is a member of the M macrohaplogroup. M1 is a sister haplogroup to Haplogroup D, one of the major Asian subgroups in Macrohaplogroup M

Remember I mentioned China earlier?

There were two Shang Dynasties, one Melanoid or Dravidian speaking (Qiang-Shang) and the other Proto-Polynesian (Yin-Shang). The first Shang Dynasty was founded by Proto-Melanesians or Melanoids who predominately spoke Tamil.

Table 2: Definining control region mutations for African,Dravidian and Oceanian Haplotypes
Haplogroups HVS1 (add 16000) M 129 241 311 M1 129 189 249 311 M27a 223 048 077T 172 311 320 189 136 M28a 223 148 468 362 086 129 320 M29a 223 189 311
M29‟Q
129 241 Q1 223 148 265 343 D4 223 189 129 311 249

The M, N, and R macrohaplogroups are found throughout East and South and Southeast Asia[b], the Andaman Islands and Africa[/b]

In fact the transitions 16129, 16189, 16249 and 16311 are known to be recurrent in various branches of Haplogroup M, especially M1 and D4. Gonder
et al.,
(2006) for example, noted that[b] the mtDNAs of Tanzanians belonging to haplogroup M1

cluster with peoples from Oceania
[/b]

All this haplogroup classification is difficult for laymen-there are other ways of proving definite relationship. Look at all those common place names.





Also shared cognates between Africans,Tamils and Melanasians.



The Melanesian or Dravido-African skeletal remains dating back to the Lapita culture, shared DNA and y-Chromosomes, and cognate Melanesian and West African place names suggest a recent migration of Melanesians from Africa and East Asia into the Pacific.


REFERENCES

Balakrishnan R (2005).
African roots of the Dravidian-speaking Tribes: A case in Onomastics,
International Journal of Dravidian Linguistics

34
(1) 153-202.
Bellwood P (1979).

Man's Conquest of the Pacific
(Oxford, New York).
Bellwood P (1991).
The Austronesian Dispersal and the Origin of Languages.
Scientific American
88-93.
Benedict PK (1990).
Japanese/Austro-Tai, Ann Arbor:Karoma, 1990.
Bulbeck D (2008).
Australian Aboriginal craniometrics as construed through FORDISC, 2005. Available: http://arts.anu.edu.au/bullda/oz_craniometrics.html [Accessed on 4/2/2008].
Chang KC (1964).
Prehistoric and early historic culture horizons and traditions in South China.
Current Anthropology

5
359-375.
Chang KC (1977).

The Archaeology of Ancient China
(Yale University Press: New Haven, 1977).
Chang KC (1980).

Shang Civilization
(Yale University Press: New Haven).
Chang KC (1987).

Archaeology of Ancient China
(Yale University Press.)
Cordaux
et al.,
(2003).
Mitochodrial DNA analysis reveals diverse tribal histories of tribal populations from India.
European Journal of Human Genetics
11
(2) 253-264.
Craib JL (1983).
Micronesian Prehistory An Archaeological Overview.
Science

219
919-927.
Fredlaender JS, Friedlaender FR, Hodgson JA, Stoltz M, Koki G, Horvat G, Zhadanov S, Schurr TG and Merriwether DA (2007).
Melanesian mtDNA complexity,
PLoS ONE

2
(2) 248.
Fucharoen G, Fucharoen S, Horai S (2001).
Mitochondrial DNA

polymorphism in Thailand.
Journal of Human Genetics

46
115-125.
Gonder MK, Mortensen HM, Reed FA, de Sousa A, Tishkoff SA (2006).
Whole mtDNA Genome Sequence Analysis of Ancient African Lineages.
Molecular Biology and Evolution
24
(3) 757-768.
Kayser M, Oscar Lao, Kathrin Saar, Silke Brauer, Xingyu Wang, Peter Nürnberg, Ronald J Trent, Mark Stoneking (2008).
Genome-wide Analysis Indicates More Asian than Melanesian Ancestry of Polynesians.
The American Journal of Human Genetics

82
(1) 194-198.
Kirch PV (1980).
Polynesian Prehistory:Cultural adaptation in Island Ecosystems.
American Scientist

68
(January/February) 39-48.
Laubenfels DJ (1968).
Australoids, Negroids and Negroes: A suggested explanation for their distinct distributions.
Annals of the Association of American Geographers

58
(1) 42-50.
Ling Shun-Sheng (1970).

A Study of the Raft, Outrigger, Double and Deck Canoes of ancient China, the Pacific and the Indian Ocean
(Taipei:Nankang).
Merriwether
et al.,
(1994).
Origins and dispersal in the mtDNA region V 9bp deletion and insertion in Nigeria and the Ivory Coast.
The American Journal of Human Genetics
.
Merriwether
et al.,
(No Date).
Mitochondrial DNA in the South Pacific. In:
Genomic Diversity.
Edited by Papilia SS, Deka R & Chakraborty R 159.
Page WJ (1988).
The Lakota Hypothesis:on the Origin of Melanesian People of the Fijian Islands.
West African Journal of Archaeology

18
31-72.
Pietrusewky M (1989).
A Lapita-associated skeleton from Natunuku Fiji.
Records of the Australian Museum
41
297-325.
Pietrusewsky (2005).
The Physical anthropology of the Pacific, East Asia: A multivariate craniometric analysis. In
The peopling of East Asia Putting together Archaeology, Linguistics and Genetics.
Edited by Sagart L, Blench R, Sanchez-Mazos A (RutledgeCurzon) 201-229.
Pugach I, Delfin F, Gunnarsdottir E, Kayser M, Stoneking M (2014).
Genome-wide data substantiate Holocene gene flow from India to Australia.
Proceedings of the Nation

http://www.academia.edu/10306654/AFRICAN_AND_DRAVIDIAN_ORIGINS_OF_THE_MELANESIANS

I would appreciate if you said exactly around what time you think the Melanesians left Africa. Your initial point made it sound like they arrived in Melanesia pretty recently straight from Africa, like American slaves. Well, the genetic evidence doesnt support that notion (at least for the vast majority of Melanesians). You need to understand that some of the perceived resemblances between black Africans and Melanesians are only skin deep. For instance, the genes that express 'black' traits are different in subsaharan Africans than in Melanesians and other dark-skinned populations. With the naked eye you can as well say Native Americans are Mongols. The only thing that can eliminate bias, and the tendency of people to ascribe their preconceived racial/ethnic notions is genetic analysis. As I made clear in my initial response to you, Melanesians have a very distinct genetic footprint from Africans, even more than Europeans. This is due to the fact that they were the very first modern humans to leave Africa and travel all the way to Melanesia, where they remained isolated for a good several thousand years. That is how their genome became rather different from ours and that of others. Mind you, all humans are as much as 99.9 % genetically related, which means the variations you see between all the human ethnicities arise from only a 0.1 % genetic difference.

@ TayserMahiri Must Yhu Qoute Everything Jeez

Kenya

Edopesin:
@ TayserMahiri Must Yhu Qoute Everything Jeez

Im too lazy to edit people's posts