Martinez19:
It's impossible to trace the first person who started this God shit. There are no detailed records of that time. Evidences point to the fact that the claims of the bible are not true. The same goes with world religions. Use common sense nah.

So it's impossible ba? You say there are NO DETAILED RECORDS yet you also claim evidence points TO THE FACT? How then did you arrive at your conclusion without proof?



I want to see the little details you have available

butterflyl1on:


So it's impossible ba? How then did you arrive at your conclusion without proof?

logic, critical thinking, reasoning, common sense and investigation of biblical events and claim of the bible.

dalaman:


Religious explanations are not accu rate, true and objective. They are mostly mythical explanations.

And neither is science explanation accurate too. both have made an attempt that is debatable logically and scientifically..... I will still give credit to religion because it serve as a benchmark for the scientists. most of the science discovery was and will still be as a result of religion progress..............

Martinez19:
logic, critical thinking, reasoning, common sense and investigation of biblical events and claim of the bible.

You cannot use the same thing you claim was fabricated as proof to itself. You have to seek proof from outside it and this is where history comes in.

Show me what your investigation uncovered. Surely your investigation should have ended at the source of the God idea in order to make it conclusive.

How far did you go before arriving at a conclusion which you already said on this thread was INCONCLUSIVE?

can you have conclusive inconclusiveness?

butterflyl1on:


Can you show me proof of your claim by pointing to the very first man who "fabricated the religious gods idea"?

I want to you to trace him via history and end at where he first emerged with this idea.

You can see your sheer dishonesty and lie lie spin. He said:

"What we know is that all religious gods and teachings are man made"

And you are asking him to tell you the first man that started the religious Gods idea. He can't do that because history is limited and the first God humans started worshipping has long been forgotten. But what he can show clearly is that the religions he sees around him are the creation of men.

Your own God and religion came into existence about two thousand years ago when some people decided to write stories about sone dead Jewish man and elevate him to God status long after he died. History has show us how the theology and traditions were created by men through different councils, the boil you call the word of God was even voted upon by men, 2500 years ago there was nothing like Jesus God anywhere.

Islam began 1600 years ago by a man called Mohammed and his cronies.

Mormon religion began some decades ago by a man called James Smith.

Buddhism began sometime between the 6th and 4th centuries BCE after the teahings of a guy known as Buddah in India.

Scientology religion was developed in 1954 by American author L. Ron Hubbard

The Ifa religion according to Yoruba history says that it was founded by Orunmila in Ile Ife when he initiated himself and then he initiated his students, Akoda and Aseda.

He can show you how the various known religions were founded by different human beings and their various teachings. If you disagree with the fact then show us how these religions were founded by any other thing but human beings.

there's a similar thread here https://www.nairaland.com/3902309/why-atheists-bother

was a good one

butterflyl1on:


My nightmare when I no dey sleep

Mr 1 billion monikers who loves necrophilia have you surfaced with another one of your many monikers as reciprokal and analice already exposed you had?

You keep confirming their stories about you all by yourself.

From oloruntobi4382 now it's UncleTee3Odds

E ku ishe moniker o.

How you go take sleep when you dey find pussy like say your life depend on it

vaxx:
And neither is science explanation accurate too. both have made an attempt that is debatable logically and scientifically..... I will still give credit to religion because it serve as a benchmark for the scientists. most of the science discovery was and will still be as a result of religion progress..............

Hich scientific discovery was made as a result of religious progress? What is religious progress?

butterflyl1on:


So it's impossible ba? You say there are NO DETAILED RECORDS yet you also claim evidence points TO THE FACT? How then did you arrive at your conclusion without proof?



I want to see the little details you have available

Evidence point to the fact that your religion is man made. End of story

dalaman:


You can see your sheer dishonesty and lie lie spin. He said:

"What we know is that all religious gods and teachings are man made"

And you are asking him to tell you the first man that started the religious Gods idea. He can't do that because history is limited and the first God humans started worshipping has long been forgotten. But what he can show clearly is that the religions he sees around him are the creation of men.

Your own God and religion came into existence about two thousand years ago when some people decided to write stories about sone dead Jewish man and elevate him to God status long after he died. History has show us how the theology and traditions were created by men through different councils, the boil you call the word of God was even voted upon by men, 2500 years ago there was nothing like Jesus God anywhere.

Islam began 1600 years ago by a man called Mohammed and his cronies.

Mormon religion began some decades ago by a man called James Smith.

Buddhism began sometime between the 6th and 4th centuries BCE after the teahings of a guy known as Buddah in India.

Scientology religion was developed in 1954 by American author L. Ron Hubbard

The Ifa religion according to Yoruba history says that it was founded by Orunmila in Ile Ife when he initiated himself and then he initiated his students, Akoda and Aseda.

He can show you how the various known religions were founded by different human beings and their various teachings. If you disagree with the fact then show us how these religions were founded by any other thing but human beings.

When he said "What we know is that all religious gods and teachings are man made" did he exclude himself?

So now suddenly history is limited yet you conclusively claim that God was a human construct.

By the way my question to him never specified the religious God of any religion. I simply asked him for the VERY FIRST SOURCE regardless of which religion it fell under.

People were worshipping "gods" before religion emerged were they not?

So he only needs to show me the source of the very first one.

Read to understand before making a hasty albeit silly retort.

butterflyl1on:


You cannot use the same thing you claim was fabricated as proof to itself. You have to seek proof from outside it and this is where history comes in.

Show me what your investigation uncovered. Surely your investigation should have ended at the source of the God idea in order to make it conclusive.

How far did you go before arriving at a conclusion which you already said on this thread was INCONCLUSIVE?

can you have conclusive inconclusiveness?

I said all religious gods are fake and made up. There might be a creator God, no one knows. God, if he exist, need not be involved in religion or seek worship.

dalaman:


Evidence point to the fact that your religion is man made. End of story

Oga dalaman get it straight. I never at any point said anything about MY RELIGION. you are the one trying to shift me to that.

This is not about my religion. The moment the OP said RELIGIOUS GODS he made a sweeping statement and I could no longer focus on mine.

So I asked for the very first source of the God idea regardless of whatever religious inclination or a lack of. Afterall there would have been no religious followership if God or the god idea was not first originated right?

So taking religion out of the way, where and when and whom started it.

Read before you type.

Martinez19:
I said all religious gods are fake and made up. There might be a creator God, no one knows. God, if he exist, need not be involved in religion or seek worship.

Then how did you arrive at your conclusive inconclusiveness?

You make a lot of assumptions yet claim to have a conclusion?

In the other hand you also claim inconclusiveness?

How?

butterflyl1on:


When he said "What we know is that all religious gods and teachings are man made" did he exclude himself?

So now suddenly history is limited yet you conclusively claim that God was a human construct.

By the way my question to him never specified the religious God of any religion. I simply asked him for the VERY FIRST SOURCE regardless of which religion it fell under.

People were worshipping "gods" before religion emerged were they not?

So he only needs to show me the source of the very first one.

Read to understand before making a hasty albeit silly retort.

Will you keep quiet Mr spinner. There is no single God. There are various God ideas all created and worshipped by different men at different point in history. Some conceived of many Gods (polytheism ) others conceived the idea of a single God (monotheism) While to to the God is conceived of as nature itself(Pantheism). Trying to spin it as make it look as if God is just a single entity or idea remains a lie. There are various God concepts and ideas and various religions created after the various God ideas.

Islam is a very diffrent from Hinduism but both of them are religions that have God at the center of their beliefs even though such Gods are totally different.
I repeat if you disagree to the fact that the religions I mentioned are man made the then show how they began without human input.

butterflyl1on:


Oga dalaman get it straight. I never at any point said anything about MY RELIGION. you are the one trying to shift me to that.

This is not about my religion. The moment the OP said RELIGIOUS GODS he made a sweeping statement and I could no longer focus on mine.

So I asked for the very first source of the God idea regardless of whatever religious inclination or a lack of. Afterall there would have been no religious followership if God or the god idea was not first originated right?

So taking religion out of the way, where and when and whom started it.

Read before you type.

And I've told you that the very first source of God or Gods can not be known because history is limited but I have you a list of religions that are practiced today and their human origin. If you disagree then show us their origin that isn't human.

We can begin with your religion.

dalaman:


Will you keep quiet Mr spinner. There is no single God. There are various God ideas all created and worshipped by different men at different point in history. Some conceived of many Gods (polytheism ) others conceived the idea of a single God (monotheism) While to to the God is conceived of as nature itself(Pantheism). Trying to spin it as make it look as if God is just a single entity or idea remains a lie. There are various God concepts and ideas and various religions created after the various God ideas.

Islam is a very diffrent from Hinduism but both of them are religions that have God at the center of their beliefs even though such Gods are totally different.
I repeat if you disagree to the fact that the religions I mentioned are man made the then show how they began without human input.

SMH why are you this dense?

Read my lips. The OP said RELIGIOUS GODS which made it a sweeping statement. How then did I attempt saying that God was a singular religious entity? You well so?

I asked for the very first God idea regardless of whatever religious affiliation. However there would be no religious affiliation if this alleged God idea did not FIRST EMERGE.

so the idea obviously came first before the religion. So he cannot attach the idea to the religion since the idea came first.

So he needs to show me the source. Simple as ABC.

The day you were born did you suddenly become a man overnight?

If an idea is first formed, it takes time to be accepted, and also time to gain followership which you might term as a religious followership

So I want to see and know the source prior to the followership.

This is as simple as I can put it for you and if you still want to act dense na you sabi.

butterflyl1on:


Then how did you arrive at your conclusive inconclusiveness?

there is no conclusive inconclusiveness to begin with. I know all religious gods are fake and man made and that's based on rationality. Must God, if he exists, belong to any religion? What if God, if he exists, is not part of any religion and does not interract with planet and never has? I simply have ruled out the possibility of religious gods but I am open to any idea of God apart from the religious gods.

dalaman:


And I've told you that the very first source of God or Gods can not be known because history is limited but I have you a list of religions that are practiced today and their human origin. If you disagree then show us their origin that isn't human.

We can begin with your religion.

Just as I earlier said, you are desperate to shift me to my religion.

The OP already made it impossible for me to shift from his generality so thanks for the offer but I'll pass

butterflyl1on:


Then how did you arrive at your conclusive inconclusiveness?

You make a lot of assumptions yet claim to have a conclusion?

In the other hand you also claim inconclusiveness?

How?

I have not concluded on the existence of a creator God. Please use sense nah.

butterflyl1on:


Just as I earlier said, you are desperate to shift me to my religion.

The OP already made it impossible for me to shift from his generality so thanks for the offer but I'll pass

dalaman is on track. The origins of all world religions is one of the proofs that they are man made. The claims of the holy books are bunks also.

Martinez19:
there is no conclusive inconclusiveness to begin with. I know all religious gods are fake and man made and that's based on rationality. Must God, if he exists, belong to any religion? What if God, if he exists, is not part of any religion and does not interract with planet and never has? I simply have ruled out the possibility of religious gods but I am open to any idea of God apart from the religious gods.

You know? Based on rationality you say? No longer based on evidence? No longer based on investigations? No longer based on the undetailed history you earlier said?

You are open to the ANY IDEA (CONCEPT) of God apart from the religious Gods

Yet your OP says you hate the concept (idea) of God but here you are saying you are still open to A CONCEPT of God as long as its not the religious kind.

And then with all this confusion you are typing you deny conclusive inconclusiveness?

You reject concept one minute and then you are open to concept the very next second.

OK oo kontinnu

Martinez19:
I have not concluded on the existence of a creator God. Please use sense nah.

But you have concluded on CONCEPTS but acceptable to you and same CONCEPTS you accept also being unacceptable to you.

butterflyl1on:


You know na? Based on rationality you say? No longer based on evidence? No longer based on investigations? No longer based on the undetailed history you earlier said?

You are open to the ANY IDEA (CONCEPT) of God apart from the religious Gods

Yet your OP says you hate the concept (idea) of God but here you are saying you are still open to A CONCEPT of God as long as its not the religious kind.

And then with all this confusion you are typing you deny conclusive inconclusiveness?

You reject concept one minute and then you are open to concept the very next second.

OK oo kontinnu

what I hate is the concept of God as put by all world religions.

Martinez19:
what I hate is the concept of God as put by all world religions.

But you still accept the Concept (idea) of God devoid of religion

You reject man made concepts and still accept man made concepts

butterflyl1on:


But you have concluded on CONCEPTS but acceptable to you and same CONCEPTS you accept also being unacceptable to you.

Read my post and our conversations again. I said that what I mean by the concept of God is the construction and characteristics of God as PUT BY WORLD RELIGIONS.

butterflyl1on:


SMH why are you this dense?

Read my lips. The OP said RELIGIOUS GODS which made it a sweeping statement. How then did I attempt saying that God was a singular religious entity? You well so?

I asked for the very first God idea regardless of whatever religious affiliation. However there would be no religious affiliation if this alleged God idea did not FIRST EMERGE.

so the idea obviously came first before the religion. So he cannot attach the idea to the religion since the idea came first.

So he needs to show me the source. Simple as ABC.

The day you were born did you suddenly become a man overnight?

If an idea is first formed, it takes time to be accepted, and also time to gain followership which you might term as a religious followership

So I want to see and know the source prior to the followership.

This is as simple as I can put it for you and if you still want to act dense na you sabi.

You aren't making any sense at all. You are just spewing thrash without any sense in it.

Firstly God isn't a thing. It is a concept, a perception and an idea that is why there is NO single God. There are many different Gods throughout out human history. When he says religious Gods he means religious God because there are many different religions with different God concepts. Your ridiculous spin only exposes your dishonesty.

Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Ifa, scientology, Buddhism and Mormon religion for examples are all religions that were created by men so what exactly are you on about?

What has the first man that invented religion got to do with the fact that scientology and Islam are man made religions for example?

Martinez19:
Read my post and our conversations again. I said that what I mean by the concept of God is the construction and characteristics of God as PUT BY WORLD RELIGIONS.

But it's still a concept aka an idea.

So is it the concept or idea put forward by aliens you would accept? Do you talk to aliens?

Any concept here on earth is raised by humans whom you communicate with so who then would originate your acceptable concept if not the same humans?

You reject concept with one side of your mouth and with the other side you are open to accepting concept.

Kontinue

butterflyl1on:


But you still accept the Concept (idea) of God devoid of religion

You reject man made concepts and still accept man made concepts

My op was mainly directed to christians and when I said God, I was referring to the christian god and other religious gods. I explained that to you when you asked me what I meant by the concept of God. Read and comprehend well abeg.

butterflyl1on:


But it's still a concept aka an idea.

So is it the concept or idea put forward by aliens you would accept? Do you talk to aliens?

Any concept here on earth is raised by humans whom you communicate with so who then would originate your acceptable concept if not the same humans?

You reject concept with one side of your mouth and with the other side you are open to accepting concept.

Kontinue

.

dalaman:


You aren't making any sense at all. You are just spewing thrash without any sense in it.

Firstly God isn't a thing. It is a concept, a perception and an idea that is why there is NO single God. There are many different Gods throughout out human history. When he says religious Gods he means religious God because there are many different religions with different God concepts. Your ridiculous spin only exposes your dishonesty.

Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Ifa, scientology, Buddhism and Mormon religion for examples are all religions that were created by men so what exactly are you on about?

What has the first man that invented religion got to do with the fact that scientology and Islam are man made religions for example?

You are saying nothing new.

Simply point me to the origin of this God concept which was prior to its acceptance that caused religions to evolve from it in their own way and with their various concepts.

No long grammar Abeg. Simply point me there.

Martinez19:
My op was mainly directed to christians and when I said God, I was referring to the christian god and other religious gods. I explained that to you when you asked me what I meant by the concept of God. Read and comprehend well abeg.

You said ALL RELIGIOUS GODS so why now trying to shift me to the Christian God?

Ogbeni before wisdom was, I AM!

butterflyl1on:


You said ALL RELIGIOUS GODS so why now trying to shift me to the Christian God?

Ogbeni before wisdom was, I AM!

christian and other religious gods = all religious gods. Before foolishness was, you were.