OkaiCorne:


I have not o. But please show me where exactly the Bible instructed Christians to pay their tithes to apart from Levites.

Kindly show us. Thank you.

Gen 14:19-20, Leviticus 27:30-34,Malachi 3:8-12,Gen 14:20,numbers 18:20-32,Nehemiah 12:44,Amos 4:4,Matthew 23:23,Luke 11:42,Hebrews 7:5-9,.
All these verses talks about tithing non of them refuted tithing even in the new testament. Now show me were exactly in the Bible did it say we shouldn't pay tithe? Support your assertion with the precise verse of the Bible not paraphrase or beating around the bush.

petra1:


What was the structure under Levitical order ? Paul says same applies to the church .

Kindly refer me to the scriptures...

then show where tithe was paid to the early church. I want to see the scriptures where tithes were collected by the early church (in black and white).

Thank you.

asuustrike2009:

Gen 14:19-20, Leviticus 27:30-34,Malachi 3:8-12,Gen 14:20,numbers 18:20-32,Nehemiah 12:44,Amos 4:4,Matthew 23:23,Luke 11:42,Hebrews 7:5-9,.
All these verses talks about tithing non of them refuted tithing even in the new testament. Now show me were exactly in the Bible did it say we shouldn't pay tithe? Support your assertion with the precise verse of the Bible not paraphrase or beating around the bush.

Who is the eligible recipient of tithes according to the Scriptures? Since you still insist on tithe payment and collection.

The Bible clearly spelt out in black and white that it is the right of the Levites to collect tithes.

Please show me where this was clearly spelt out for Rabbis, Prophets, Scribes, Apostles and Pastors to also collect. Thank you.


Also feel free to share research materials on where tithes were collected by the early church. I have shared a youtube video...there's another link below;

https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/4329/was-tithing-10-required-or-encouraged-by-the-early-church

betterABIAstate:
stop quoting this your Mathew 23:23 version, Jesus is not a tither

I am gonna have to cut you short there. Jesus participated in the rites of those days, tithing was one which he did. Mark 12:41-44 gives a clear account where the Christ sat opposite where the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the "TEMPLE TREASURY". Jesus in vs 43 commended the widows' midget offering more than others. Which sends a strong evidence that he was part of rendering of offerings in the Temple.
However, Jesus never actually placed serious emphasis on tithing, little wonder he in Matthew 23;23 literally threw a jab at the pharisees for placing much attention on paying tithe at the expense of MORE WEIGHTIER MATTERS which is mercy, love and the ministry of the Holy ghost that he spoke of on his ascension.
Now, the offering of valuables (monies, foods) is commended as an entitlement by Apostle Paul who in 1 Cor 9:11 asked if it were too much to reap material blessings having blessed the Corinthian brethren spiritually.
I could rightly assume that this thread was born out of the controversy surrounding tithing, wherewith I succumb to the fact that several abuses has been made on tithing by several persons.
But we should never underscore the importance of investing your valuables into the propagating of the Gospel of Christ.
To which I conclude by saying having the ministry of the holy ghost is key to living in these times, identify a spirit-filled Biblical assembly and I am sure there may be times where you will contribute something substantial (way more than the 10 percent) to the servant of God who has imparted you and the growth of the gospel.
No force is placed on you to pay any tithe; sowing into the kingdom is not a money-multiplying scheme- there are blessings that money cannot buy. The responsibility therefore lies on you to identify kingdom investment that causes heaven to rejoice and key into them!

ajog1:

I am gonna have to cut you short there. Jesus participated in the rites of those days, tithing was one which he did. Mark 12:41-44 gives a clear account where the Christ sat opposite where the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the "TEMPLE TREASURY". Jesus in vs 43 commended the widows' midget offering more than others. Which sends a strong evidence that he was part of rendering of offerings in the Temple.
However, Jesus never actually placed serious emphasis on tithing, little wonder he in Matthew 23;23 literally threw a jab at the pharisees for placing much attention on paying tithe at the expense of MORE WEIGHTIER MATTERS which is mercy, love and the ministry of the Holy ghost that he spoke of on his ascension.
Now, the offering of valuables (monies, foods) is commended as an entitlement by Apostle Paul in 1 Cor 9:11 asked if it were too much to reap material blessings having being blessed spiritually.
I could rightly assume that this thread was born out of the controversy surrounding tithing, wherewith I succumb to the fact that several abuses has been made on tithing by several persons.
But we should make never underscore the importance of investing your valuables into the propagating of the Gospel of Christ.
To which I conclude by saying having the ministry of the holy ghost is key to living in these times, identify a spirit-filled Biblical assemble and I am sure there may be times where you just may contribute something substantial (way more than the 10 percent) to the servant of God who has imparted you, the growth of the gospel and kingdom of God.
No force is placed on you to pay any tithe; sowing into the kingdom is not a money-multiplying scheme- there are blessings that money cannot buy. The responsibility therefore likes on you to identify kingdom investment that causes heaven to rejoice and key into them!

Thank you! there are more weightier matters to focus on instead of tithes.

However, my other grievance is what gives Pastors the right to ask for what is entitled to the Levites alone?

petra1:


What was the structure under Levitical order ? Paul says same applies to the church .

Same structure applies...the Church does not do animal sacrifice because it is structured under the Levitical Order, but they can still collect tithes abi?

If this is not cherry picking of the Mosiac Laws...then tell me what else this is...

OkaiCorne:


Who is the eligible recipient of tithes according to the Scriptures? Since you still insist on tithe payment and collection.

The Bible clearly spelt out in black and white that it is the right of the Levites to collect tithes.

Please show me where this was clearly spelt out for Rabbis, Prophets, Scribes, Apostles and Pastors to also collect. Thank you.


Also feel free to share research materials on where tithes were collected by the early church. I have shared a youtube video...there's another link below;

https://christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/4329/was-tithing-10-required-or-encouraged-by-the-early-church

You still beating around the bush. Tell me were exactly in the Bible does it go against tithing then I will give you analysis of who to collect tithe. I don't need that material, brainstorm it here with the Bible

asuustrike2009:

You still beating around the bush. Tell me were exactly in the Bible does it go against tithing then I will give you analysis of who to collect tithe. I don't need that material, brainstorm it here with the Bible

Are you reading my posts at all? Nowhere in the Bible stops payment of tithe, however there are weightier matters to give more priority to e.g. giving to the widows and orphans...donating to the Church to help spread the Kingdom of God on earth e.t.c. And not this tithing charade of today.

Now please show me where the Bible directs Christians to pay tithes to the Rabbis, Prophets, Scribes, Apostles and Pastors instead of the Levites that were clearly stated as the Legal and Scriptural recipients.

If there is no scripture you can refer me to...then what gives the Pastors any legal or scriptural right to collect tithes?

You don't want to go to the link where they have made solid reference to the Scriptures...yet you want greedy Pastors to keep on collecting tithes.

Show me a Levite Priest so I can pay my tithe!

OkaiCorne:


Are you reading my posts at all? Nowhere in the Bible stops payment of tithe.

Now please show me where the Bible directs Christians to pay tithes to the Rabbis, Prophets, Scribes, Apostles and Pastors instead of the Levites that were clearly stated as the Legal and Scriptural recipients.

Show me a Levite Priest so I can pay my tithe!

The Bible didn't say you must pay tithe to your pastor, rabbis or prophets. It state bring it to God's store house which is the church not your pastor. Mal 3:10 was clear on that

ajog1:

I am gonna have to cut you short there. Jesus participated in the rites of those days, tithing was one which he did. Mark 12:41-44 gives a clear account where the Christ sat opposite where the offerings were put and watched the crowd putting their money into the "TEMPLE TREASURY". Jesus in vs 43 commended the widows' midget offering more than others. Which sends a strong evidence that he was part of rendering of offerings in the Temple.
However, Jesus never actually placed serious emphasis on tithing, little wonder he in Matthew 23;23 literally threw a jab at the pharisees for placing much attention on paying tithe at the expense of MORE WEIGHTIER MATTERS which is mercy, love and the ministry of the Holy ghost that he spoke of on his ascension.
Now, the offering of valuables (monies, foods) is commended as an entitlement by Apostle Paul who in 1 Cor 9:11 asked if it were too much to reap material blessings having blessed the Corinthian brethren spiritually.
I could rightly assume that this thread was born out of the controversy surrounding tithing, wherewith I succumb to the fact that several abuses has been made on tithing by several persons.
But we should never underscore the importance of investing your valuables into the propagating of the Gospel of Christ.
To which I conclude by saying having the ministry of the holy ghost is key to living in these times, identify a spirit-filled Biblical assembly and I am sure there may be times where you will contribute something substantial (way more than the 10 percent) to the servant of God who has imparted you and the growth of the gospel.
No force is placed on you to pay any tithe; sowing into the kingdom is not a money-multiplying scheme- there are blessings that money cannot buy. The responsibility therefore lies on you to identify kingdom investment that causes heaven to rejoice and key into them!

stop quoting Bible in half, read Mathew 23 from 1, that chapter was meant to criticize the pharisees, it m wasn't talking about tithe. Oh you lots claim to know the bible but know nothing

asuustrike2009:

The Bible didn't say you must pay tithe to your pastor, rabbis or prophets. It state bring it to God's store house which is the church not your pastor. Mal 3:10 was clear on that

Very good...

Was there a Church when Malachi prophesied this?

OkaiCorne:


Thank you! there are more weightier matters to focus on instead of tithes.

However, my other grievance is what gives Pastors the right to ask for what is entitled to the Levites alone?

I would like to start by saying that the use of "pastors" in your last statement portrays the notion that "all spiritual authorities" are guilty which I would like to correct.
I would digress by saying that as a believer, re-aligning ourselves to the core spiritual walk of faith, to which the scripture says let he who thinks he stand take "HEED", less he falls.
The same scripture Luke 22:42 documents where Jesus, who's the finisher of our faith almost derailed from his course when he said ".. Let this cup pass over me", to which he quickly realigned by saying "not my will, but yours be done".
Paul further buttressed the same message in 1 cor 10:12-13 and how he also needed to check himself lest he fails to the same sin he has been preaching against (I can't place my hands on the exact scripture at the moment).
As I said earlier on, we who have been genuinely imparted by the ministry of a genuine spiritual authority owe it as a responsibility to sow material blessings- that's the truth.
The brethren of those days gave their all "IN LOVE" which is lacking this era of denominational-based church.
Most folks quote the ".. for God loves a cheerful giver" part of the scripture neglecting the preceding part that says "each one must give as he has decideth in his heart"
Committing your valuable to the work of "God's Kingdom through Yeshua" in the order of the apostle of those days which is what tithing is about is something a believer would naturally do.

ajog1:

I would like to start by saying that the use of "pastors" in your last statement portrays the notion that "all spiritual authorities" are guilty which I would like to correct.
I would digress by saying that as a believer, re-aligning ourselves to the core spiritual walk of faith, to which the scripture says let he who thinks he stand take "HEED", less he falls.
The same scripture Luke 22:42 documents where Jesus, who's the finisher of our faith almost derailed from his course when he said ".. Let this cup pass over me", to which he quickly realigned by saying "not my will, but yours be done".
Paul further buttressed the same message in 1 cor 10:12-13 and how he also needed to check himself lest he fails to the same sin he has been preaching against (I can't place my hands on the exact scripture at the moment).
As I said earlier on, we who have been genuinely imparted by the ministry of a genuine spiritual authority owe it as a responsibility to sow material blessings- that's the truth.
The brethren of those days gave their all "IN LOVE" which is lacking this era of denominational-based church.
Most folks quote the ".. for God loves a cheerful giver" part of the scripture neglecting the preceding part that says "each one must give as he has decideth in his heart"
Committing your valuable to the work of "God's Kingdom through Yeshua" in the order of the apostle of those days which is what tithing is about is something a believer would naturally do.

Thank you very much, giving out of Love as instructed by the Spirit of the Most High is what should be the basis...
and not all these tithing scam going on.

OkaiCorne:


Very good...

Was there a Church when Malachi prophesied this?

There was a temple

asuustrike2009:

There was a temple

But no Church right?

betterABIAstate:
stop quoting Bible in half, read Mathew 23 from 1, that chapter was meant to criticize the pharisees, it m wasn't talking about tithe. Oh you lots claim to know the bible but know nothing

How quick you are to respond with ill-mannered response without really reading through. If the clear account in Mark 12:41-44 where Christ attested to how more valuable a widows offering was, as compared to others does not convince you that CHRIST ENGAGED IN THE PRACTICE OF RENDERING OFFERINGS INTO THE TEMPLE TREASURY, then forget it-you are entitled to your beliefs. Nothing in the kingdom of God is ever force. Yes a lot of abuses have been made on the issue of "offering money" which tithing is about.
Don't try to find a reason to commit your resources to a genuine assembly or not, if you aren't interested, then don't but don't mislead others!
What is most important is committing yourself to a Genuine assembly because there's a lot of falsehood out there. forget that term "tithe". Jesus and Paul placed little emphasis on it because genuine kingdom brethren commit a whole lot more to the propagation of the gospel and the kingdom.

ajog1:
How quick you are to respond with ill-mannered response without really reading through. If the clear account in Mark 12:41-44 where Christ attested to how more valuable a widows offering was, as compared to others does not convince you that CHRIST ENGAGED IN THE PRACTICE OF RENDERING OFFERINGS INTO THE TEMPLE TREASURY, then forget it-you are entitled to your beliefs. Nothing in the kingdom of God is ever force. Yes a lot of abuses have been made on the issue of "offering money" which tithing is about.
Don't try to find a reason to commit your resources to a genuine assembly or not, if you aren't interested, then don't but don't mislead others!
What is most important is committing yourself to a Genuine assembly because there's a lot of falsehood out there. forget that term "tithe". Jesus and Paul placed little emphasis on it because genuine kingdom brethren commit a whole lot more to the propagation of the gospel and the kingdom.

God bless you for the bolded part of your quote. This is what I've been hammering on since.

.

OkaiCorne:


But no Church right?

Church yes because both church and temple are house of prayers

asuustrike2009:

Church yes because both church and temple are house of prayers

Is it Malachi or you that is calling the storehouse the Church...we need to be clear here.

Even the mosque is a house of prayers but not to digress, is this your opinion or you are clearly stating that Malachi is referring to the Church as the Temple?

OkaiCorne:


Is it Malachi or you that is calling the storehouse the Church...we need to be clear here.

Even the mosque is a house of prayers but not to digress, is this your opinion or you are clearly stating that Malachi is referring to the Church as the Temple?

The temple as it was called then is the modern day church of our time. What do they do there is to pray which is the aim of the gathering. Leave the mosque out of it as it's not the substance discussed

By Femi Aribisala

When Daddy Freeze identified tithing as a modern-day scam in a fascinating interview, I was also asked to weigh in on the same issue by Sahara Reporters. But I declined because I did not think it was necessary to add anything to what he said. However, I have changed my mind seeing that some church heavyweights have come out swinging at him in the bid to undermine his message and safeguard their illicit financial bottom line.

They have tried to muddy the waters by deriding Daddy Freeze’s assertion that in biblical times, it was scriptural to eat your tithe in the house of God and wash it down with a glass of beer. They also hastened to intimidate Christians by insisting if they don’t tithe, they would be cursed.
That is a lot of hogwash. The very attempt to invoke curses in a simple debate about tithing indicates a bankruptcy of reason. Threatening Christians in order to force them to give is witchcraft; it is not the way of Christ. The New Testament position says: “Let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.” (II Corinthians 9:7). Giving in order to avoid curses is giving “of necessity;” not cheerful giving.

Curses and blessings
Let no believer be intimidated by vain curses: “Curses will not harm someone who is innocent.” (Proverbs 26:2). Tithe or no tithe, believers are blessed: “with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ.” (Ephesians 1:3). Therefore, God would never curse us. As God said to Balaam concerning Israel, “You must not put a curse on those people, because they are blessed.” (Numbers 22:12).

Pastors and General Overseers should desist from manipulating Christians with threats of curses. God says to Abraham: “I will curse whoever curses you.” (Genesis 12:3). Therefore, if your General Overseer curses you, the curse will only fall on his head. If these curses were not vain, I would be a dead man already. But I dare anyone to curse a prophet of God for doing his work.
Moreover, tell the eminent General Overseer, there is nothing special about a church building. The church is not the house of God. If it ever was, it no longer is. “The Most High does not dwell in temples made with hands.” (Acts 7:48). It is morally wrong, in any case, to prescribe one conduct for the church and another outside the church. Believers don’t worship God in churches. Jesus says we worship God “in Spirit and truth.” (John 4:23).

Fleecing the flock
The only people authorised to receive tithes were the Levites. (Hebrews 7:5). Therefore, Daddy Freeze is right: no Nigerian prophet, so-called pastor or highfalutin General Overseer is qualified to receive tithes from members of his or her congregation.

Even Jesus could not have received the tithe because he was not from the tribe of Levi but from Judah. Today, Jewish rabbis who still follow the Mosaic Code no longer receive tithes because Levi is one of the lost tribes of Israel. All Jewish genealogical records were lost with the destruction of the temple in AD 70. How then can Nigerian pastors who are not even Jewish, how much more Levites, receive tithes?

In any case, God did not accept money as tithe. The tithe was tied to the land, which was God’s gift to Israel. Therefore, it was a tenth of the seed and fruit of the land and of the animals which ate of the land. (Leviticus 27:30-32). That is why God says: “Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be FOOD in my house.” (Malachi 3:10). He does not say “that there may be MONEY in my house.”

If you bring money, you must convert it to foodstuff. Your tithe is then eaten in the presence of the Lord, and given to the Levites, strangers, widows and the fatherless. (Deute-ronomy 14:24-26). However, pastors today only accept money as tithe, showing they are nothing but money-grubbers who fleece the flock.
Servants who worked on the land did not tithe because the land did not belong to them. Since only agricultural resources were the tithes, only farmers and people with livestock gave tithes. So if you're neither, tell your 419 BOL ZAC:
pastor tithing is scripturally inapplicable to you.

Law and grace
John says: “The law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.” (John 1:17). Tithing belongs to the Law of Moses. But Christians are not under the law but under grace. (Romans 6:14). The law was not given to Nigerians, it was given to Jews. (Psalms 147:19-20; Malachi 4:4). Therefore, the Law on tithes is inapplicable to Nigerians.
Tithing was primarily applicable to Jews in Israel. When Jewish po-pulations grew in Babylon, Ammon, Moab and Syria, these lands also became tithe-able lands. However, tithes were unacceptable from strictly Gentile lands. So it makes no sense to tithe in Nigeria.
Levites were not given any land in Israel. God says: “Instead, I give to the Levites as their inheritance the tithes that the Israelites present as an offering to the Lord.” (Numbers 18:24). But today’s pastors own lands and houses. Therefore, they do not live as Levites and should stop pretending to be Levi-tes.
You cannot cherry-pick what to obey in the law: “The person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws.” (James 2:10).
Therefore, if Nigerian pastors insist on tithing, they must also insist on all other stringent requirements of the law; including the stoning to death of adulterers, disobedient children, homosexuals and Sabbath violators. They should also restore blood-sacrifices for good measure.
The fact that they don’t attests eloquently to their duplicity.

Osumare2013:
By Femi Aribisala

When Daddy Freeze identified tithing as a modern-day scam in a fascinating interview, I was also asked to weigh in on the same issue by Sahara Reporters. But I declined because I did not think it was necessary to add anything to what he said. However, I have changed my mind seeing that some church heavyweights have come out swinging at him in the bid to undermine his message and safeguard their illicit financial bottom line.

They have tried to muddy the waters by deriding Daddy Freeze’s assertion that in biblical times, it was scriptural to eat your tithe in the house of God and wash it down with a glass of beer. They also hastened to intimidate Christians by insisting if they don’t tithe, they would be cursed.
That is a lot of hogwash. The very attempt to invoke curses in a simple debate about tithing indicates a bankruptcy of reason. Threatening Christians in order to force them to give is witchcraft; it is not the way of Christ. The New Testament position says: “Let each one give as he purposes in his heart, not grudgingly or of necessity; for God loves a cheerful giver.” (II Corinthians 9:7). Giving in order to avoid curses is giving “of necessity;” not cheerful giving.

Curses and blessings
Let no believer be intimidated by vain curses: “Curses will not harm someone who is innocent.” (Proverbs 26:2). Tithe or no tithe, believers are blessed: “with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places in Christ.” (Ephesians 1:3). Therefore, God would never curse us. As God said to Balaam concerning Israel, “You must not put a curse on those people, because they are blessed.” (Numbers 22:12).

Pastors and General Overseers should desist from manipulating Christians with threats of curses. God says to Abraham: “I will curse whoever curses you.” (Genesis 12:3). Therefore, if your General Overseer curses you, the curse will only fall on his head. If these curses were not vain, I would be a dead man already. But I dare anyone to curse a prophet of God for doing his work.
Moreover, tell the eminent General Overseer, there is nothing special about a church building. The church is not the house of God. If it ever was, it no longer is. “The Most High does not dwell in temples made with hands.” (Acts 7:48). It is morally wrong, in any case, to prescribe one conduct for the church and another outside the church. Believers don’t worship God in churches. Jesus says we worship God “in Spirit and truth.” (John 4:23).

Fleecing the flock
The only people authorised to receive tithes were the Levites. (Hebrews 7:5). Therefore, Daddy Freeze is right: no Nigerian prophet, so-called pastor or highfalutin General Overseer is qualified to receive tithes from members of his or her congregation.

Even Jesus could not have received the tithe because he was not from the tribe of Levi but from Judah. Today, Jewish rabbis who still follow the Mosaic Code no longer receive tithes because Levi is one of the lost tribes of Israel. All Jewish genealogical records were lost with the destruction of the temple in AD 70. How then can Nigerian pastors who are not even Jewish, how much more Levites, receive tithes?

In any case, God did not accept money as tithe. The tithe was tied to the land, which was God’s gift to Israel. Therefore, it was a tenth of the seed and fruit of the land and of the animals which ate of the land. (Leviticus 27:30-32). That is why God says: “Bring all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be FOOD in my house.” (Malachi 3:10). He does not say “that there may be MONEY in my house.”

If you bring money, you must convert it to foodstuff. Your tithe is then eaten in the presence of the Lord, and given to the Levites, strangers, widows and the fatherless. (Deute-ronomy 14:24-26). However, pastors today only accept money as tithe, showing they are nothing but money-grubbers who fleece the flock.
Servants who worked on the land did not tithe because the land did not belong to them. Since only agricultural resources were the tithes, only farmers and people with livestock gave tithes. So if you're neither, tell your 419 BOL ZAC:
pastor tithing is scripturally inapplicable to you.

Law and grace
John says: “The law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.” (John 1:17). Tithing belongs to the Law of Moses. But Christians are not under the law but under grace. (Romans 6:14). The law was not given to Nigerians, it was given to Jews. (Psalms 147:19-20; Malachi 4:4). Therefore, the Law on tithes is inapplicable to Nigerians.
Tithing was primarily applicable to Jews in Israel. When Jewish po-pulations grew in Babylon, Ammon, Moab and Syria, these lands also became tithe-able lands. However, tithes were unacceptable from strictly Gentile lands. So it makes no sense to tithe in Nigeria.
Levites were not given any land in Israel. God says: “Instead, I give to the Levites as their inheritance the tithes that the Israelites present as an offering to the Lord.” (Numbers 18:24). But today’s pastors own lands and houses. Therefore, they do not live as Levites and should stop pretending to be Levi-tes.
You cannot cherry-pick what to obey in the law: “The person who keeps all of the laws except one is as guilty as a person who has broken all of God’s laws.” (James 2:10).
Therefore, if Nigerian pastors insist on tithing, they must also insist on all other stringent requirements of the law; including the stoning to death of adulterers, disobedient children, homosexuals and Sabbath violators. They should also restore blood-sacrifices for good measure.
The fact that they don’t attests eloquently to their duplicity.

Exactly my point on the bolded. All these tithing fan boys that are cherry picking the laws of Moses

Imagine...one of them was saying Devil is using me sef

asuustrike2009:

The temple as it was called then is the modern day church of our time. What do they do there is to pray which is the aim of the gathering. Leave the mosque out of it as it's not the substance discussed

My question still stands, was Malachi referring to the Church as the Storehouse or is this your opinion?

Osumare2013:
By Femi Aribisala

When Daddy Freeze identified tithing as a modern-day scam in a fascinating interview, I was also asked to weigh in on the same issue by Sahara Reporters. But I declined because I did not think it was necessary to add anything to what he said. However, I have changed my mind seeing that some church heavyweights have come out swinging at him in the bid to undermine his message and safeguard their illicit financial bottom line.
.
.
.

Therefore, if Nigerian pastors insist on tithing, they must also insist on all other stringent requirements of the law; including the stoning to death of adulterers, disobedient children, homosexuals and Sabbath violators. They should also restore blood-sacrifices for good measure.
The fact that they don’t attests eloquently to their duplicity.

well first of all i must agree with him.
1. that pastors are so wrong to threaten the members with curses of tithing
2. Tithe does not apply to new testament christian

but his doctrinal bases are so wrong.
1. what makes levites levites (a position that qualifies receiving tithe) is not geneology but the choice of God. Heb 5:1-10 concerning melchizedek and jesus established this. the bible also confirms that we are made unto God kings and priest Rev 1:6, so the fact that we are not levite is a wrong basis. the levitical order is not of geneology but of the choice of God

2. there is every special thing about chuch building. the believers of old met in a house not an open air. but of course in a house of one of them but can the same be today when you have thousands of members, was there not an headquater in jerusalem where the jerusalem meeting was done and thousands of people converge. it is true that God indwells us but we indwells houses.

3. Tithe to us in the new testament is a form of giving to (a) support our ministers in their ministries. the macedonia and phillipians are financial supporters of paul on earth 2 Cor 8:1-5, phil 4:14-20, luke 8:3 also prove that Jesus has financial supporters. (b) to minister to other believers as done in 2 cor 8-9, 11 (c) those that preach the gospel should live of the gospel 1 cor 9:1-15. although paul didnt take anything from the corinthians because he did not want anybody to use that as an excuse to deform the gospel as these people are doing but it is evident that paul used this principle with the philipians and the ephesian churches.

So we do not tithe according to the old testament nor do we do it as a fulfilment or continuation of the old testament but on the previously explained basis. so when a person begins to abuse pastors on titheing, it is an evidence that
1. he does not attend church services enough to understand this
2. escapes sunday school
3. using the errors of some pastors to demolish the truth.

pastors are fair in institutionalizing tithing.
1. in tithing you give according to your income an d ability in contrast to the way macedonians gave, 1 cor 8:2, paul explained it to be that he robbed other churches to minister to the corintians 2 cor 11:8, but the pastors has coined a biblical term and ideology to ease the members in giving. a tenth of your income and a freewil offering, and special donations are also taken at stragetic times but of course not regularly.

2. 1 cor 16:2 shows how paul proposed an organize way to collect offerings for the corinthians. of couse offerings then was not everytime. but we must understand that the numerical strenght and needs of the church can not be compared to the church then for us to stick ignorantly to that. growth neccessitate the need for new model of financial flow into the ministries,

3. Acts 2: 44 shows another example of continous sacrificial giving of the early church, so if the guy that intend us to forsake tithe is sincere enough
1. how much of his personal belongings has gone to meet the needs of the church.
2. if he can sell his phone, laptop, lands etc everytime there is a need in the church then why on earth do we need tithe!!!

but you will agree that it will be a great act of sacrifice that might be too much for people to give in such a manner hence the tithe formula.

so tell our brother that the term tithe is a biblical term to represent a giving formula for the furtherance of the gospel

About the poor
although Jesus has compassion for the poor and he laid emphasis on providing for the poor. but.
1. the church formerly started in Acts 2 and from there we receive no evidence of charity work only that we are advised to care for the poor. and looking at Gal 6:10 proves that our first concern is those of the household of faith before we engage in community development. so the church is not a cds group for charity, the responsibility to the poor is from the mindset of us been a family that is why paul used the household of faith, so it isnt first our business if roads are not constructed so that we begin to use church money to build roads

so in explaining or defending tithing we must not suscribe to the use of verses that recognize tithing in the scriptures as they are invalid, as the term tithe was borrowed to
1.well structured a consistent fiancial flow
2. build a giving habit in the members
3. make giving less burdensome for the members compared to the early church way of giving.

so the guy has a true conclusion but
1. a wrong premise
2. a wrong spirit
3. a wrong intention
4. a wrong drive.

Osumare2013:

well first of all i must agree with him.
1. that pastors are so wrong to threaten the members with curses of tithing
2. Tithe does not apply to new testament christian

but his doctrinal bases are so wrong.
1. what makes levites levites (a position that qualifies receiving tithe) is not geneology but the choice of God. Heb 5:1-10 concerning melchizedek and jesus established this. the bible also confirms that we are made unto God kings and priest Rev 1:6, so the fact that we are not levite is a wrong basis. the levitical order is not of geneology but of the choice of God

2. there is every special thing about chuch building. the believers of old met in a house not an open air. but of course in a house of one of them but can the same be today when you have thousands of members, was there not an headquater in jerusalem where the jerusalem meeting was done and thousands of people converge. it is true that God indwells us but we indwells houses.

3. Tithe to us in the new testament is a form of giving to (a) support our ministers in their ministries. the macedonia and phillipians are financial supporters of paul on earth 2 Cor 8:1-5, phil 4:14-20, luke 8:3 also prove that Jesus has financial supporters. (b) to minister to other believers as done in 2 cor 8-9, 11 (c) those that preach the gospel should live of the gospel 1 cor 9:1-15. although paul didnt take anything from the corinthians because he did not want anybody to use that as an excuse to deform the gospel as these people are doing but it is evident that paul used this principle with the philipians and the ephesian churches.

So we do not tithe according to the old testament nor do we do it as a fulfilment or continuation of the old testament but on the previously explained basis. so when a person begins to abuse pastors on titheing, it is an evidence that
1. he does not attend church services enough to understand this
2. escapes sunday school
3. using the errors of some pastors to demolish the truth.

pastors are fair in institutionalizing tithing.
1. in tithing you give according to your income an d ability in contrast to the way macedonians gave, 1 cor 8:2, paul explained it to be that he robbed other churches to minister to the corintians 2 cor 11:8, but the pastors has coined a biblical term and ideology to ease the members in giving. a tenth of your income and a freewil offering, and special donations are also taken at stragetic times but of course not regularly.

2. 1 cor 16:2 shows how paul proposed an organize way to collect offerings for the corinthians. of couse offerings then was not everytime. but we must understand that the numerical strenght and needs of the church can not be compared to the church then for us to stick ignorantly to that. growth neccessitate the need for new model of financial flow into the ministries,

3. Acts 2: 44 shows another example of continous sacrificial giving of the early church, so if the guy that intend us to forsake tithe is sincere enough
1. how much of his personal belongings has gone to meet the needs of the church.
2. if he can sell his phone, laptop, lands etc everytime there is a need in the church then why on earth do we need tithe!!!

but you will agree that it will be a great act of sacrifice that might be too much for people to give in such a manner hence the tithe formula.

so tell our brother that the term tithe is a biblical term to represent a giving formula for the furtherance of the gospel

About the poor
although Jesus has compassion for the poor and he laid emphasis on providing for the poor. but.
1. the church formerly started in Acts 2 and from there we receive no evidence of charity work only that we are advised to care for the poor. and looking at Gal 6:10 proves that our first concern is those of the household of faith before we engage in community development. so the church is not a cds group for charity, the responsibility to the poor is from the mindset of us been a family that is why paul used the household of faith, so it isnt first our business if roads are not constructed so that we begin to use church money to build roads

so in explaining or defending tithing we must not suscribe to the use of verses that recognize tithing in the scriptures as they are invalid, as the term tithe was borrowed to
1.well structured a consistent fiancial flow
2. build a giving habit in the members
3. make giving less burdensome for the members compared to the early church way of giving.

so the guy has a true conclusion but
1. a wrong premise
2. a wrong spirit
3. a wrong intention
4. a wrong drive.

The Pastors now have the right to collect tithes? Are they now the replacement for Levites? Is there any scripture that clearly spells out Pastors are replacement for Levites

OkaiCorne:


Same structure applies...the Church does not do animal sacrifice because it is structured under the Levitical Order, but they can still collect tithes abi?

If this is not cherry picking of the Mosiac Laws...then tell me what else this is...

You don’t give tithe , but you give offering and give to the poor . No be cherry picking ?

Christian tithe is not because the law say so. Tithes and offering are eternal principles

OkaiCorne:


Kindly refer me to the scriptures...

then show where tithe was paid to the early church. I want to see the scriptures where tithes were collected by the early church (in black and white).

Thank you.

Shey you have bible , search it ..

petra1:


Shey you have bible , search it ..

Just say there is no reference...instead of this hide and seek game you want to start

OkaiCorne:


The Pastors now have the right to collect tithes? Are they now the replacement for Levites? Is there any scripture that clearly spells out Pastors are replacement for Levites

the fact is this
1. pastors are not the ones that collect tithe although they may benefit from the tithe as stated above. the tithe are used for the furthering of God's purpose, the same way paul would have been immobile, the same way pastors would have been incapacitated without fiance, however, the tithe belongs to the church, there are however chuch management that see to the administration of finance. it is not however your business to see how it is being spent, since you are not there neither do you know the mandate given to them by God.

2. Tithe as practice these days as said earlier on has nothing to do with old testament. so your comment about

"The Pastors now have the right to collect tithes? Are they now the replacement for Levites?"

is wrong since i have established noconnection, you need not connect them together, i only said that the term was borrowed. tithe is a tenth of the produce. that is majorly what was borrowed and nothing more. and i have explained it to be a form of giving so if giving to your pastors is wrong then your argument against tithe is relevant but if it is not as supported by the bible in "Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." (1 Cor 9:14) then your argument is irrelevant.

3. whether it is a right or not
1Co 9:13 For it is written in the law of Moses, Thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?
1Co 9:10 Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.
1Co 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?
1Co 9:12 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ.
1Co 9:13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
1Co 9:14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

having earlier explained that the only similarity between tithe as explained in the old testament and today is the definition and that it is a form of giving, the above verse confirms that the church has the right to receive tithe.

your question is also actually wrong, you have claimed that it is the pastors that received the tithe but when you say that you seperate the pastor from the church which is an error, the pastor is only an important part of the church and not diffrent. so it is the chuch that receives the tithe, of course the pastors might benefit majorly or solely on it base on the fianancial structure of different church.

Osumare2013:

the fact is this
1. pastors are not the ones that collect tithe although they may benefit from the tithe as stated above. the tithe are used for the furthering of God's purpose, the same way paul would have been immobile, the same way pastors would have been incapacitated without fiance, however, the tithe belongs to the church, there are however chuch management that see to the administration of finance. it is not however your business to see how it is being spent, since you are not there neither do you know the mandate given to them by God.

2. Tithe as practice these days as said earlier on has nothing to do with old testament. so your comment about

"The Pastors now have the right to collect tithes? Are they now the replacement for Levites?"

is wrong since i have established noconnection, you need not connect them together, i only said that the term was borrowed. tithe is a tenth of the produce. that is majorly what was borrowed and nothing more. and i have explained it to be a form of giving so if giving to your pastors is wrong then your argument against tithe is relevant but if it is not as supported by the bible in "Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel." (1 Cor 9:14) then your argument is irrelevant.

3. whether it is a right or not
1Co 9:13 For it is written in the law of Moses, Thou shalt not muzzle the mouth of the ox that treadeth out the corn. Doth God take care for oxen?
1Co 9:10 Or saith he it altogether for our sakes? For our sakes, no doubt, this is written: that he that ploweth should plow in hope; and that he that thresheth in hope should be partaker of his hope.
1Co 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?
1Co 9:12 If others be partakers of this power over you, are not we rather? Nevertheless we have not used this power; but suffer all things, lest we should hinder the gospel of Christ.
1Co 9:13 Do ye not know that they which minister about holy things live of the things of the temple? and they which wait at the altar are partakers with the altar?
1Co 9:14 Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

having earlier explained that the only similarity between tithe as explained in the old testament and today is the definition and that it is a form of giving, the above verse confirms that the church has the right to receive tithe.

your question is also actually wrong, you have claimed that it is the pastors that received the tithe but when you say that you seperate the pastor from the church which is an error, the pastor is only an important part of the church and not diffrent. so it is the chuch that receives the tithe, of course the pastors might benefit majorly or solely on it base on the fianancial structure of different church.

Oga, I will give to the Church as God lays it on my heart, but not through tithes.

It is scriptural to support the ministry with goodwill offerings and welfare donations...but not through this tithing sham that is ongoing.

Imagine fraudulent pastors threatening their congregants with the fear of a devourer Jesus has conquered. Smh

OkaiCorne:


Oga, I will give to the Church as God lays it on my heart, but not through tithes.

It is scriptural to support the ministry with goodwill offerings and welfare donations...but not through this tithing sham that is ongoing.

Imagine fraudulent pastors threatening their congregants with the fear of a devourer Jesus has conquered. Smh

well doneto you brother, but first of all.

i have default the activities of fradulent pastors. as you called them fraudulent pastors that threatens the members with devouras but do you know that not all pastors that collect tithe does this?

i have been to a church of recent that confirms the inapplication of malachi 3:10, saying there is no devourer anywhere because of non-payment of tithe and that the tithe is needed to finance the church, hence those who are present with theirs may come forward.

so as earlier said when attacking an error you do not bring the black and white together in judgement. the fact is that some pastors collect tithe as an ordinance of the old testament which is wrong, while some collect it as a form of giving, the same goes with firstfruit and the likes, the later makes it willingly for me and not under compulsion.

therefore, in addressing the issue of tithe you must seperate these two and attack the right party.

there is no problem if you are not giving to God through tithe, the fact is whether it is through tithe or not, the fact is your finance is going into the church. tithe will however allow you to be consistent, accountful and deliberate in giving to your ministry.

now the word giving as God lays it on your mind depends largely on
1. if you know how to hear from God or when God is speaking to you.
2. your willingness
3. your ability not to condemn a voice to give when God says you should.

tithe which makes you consistent will actually train you in giving.

another question is do you pay offering to your church regularly?

if yes, then the problem you have with tithe is irrelevant because if your church has given it another name but the same 10% or even 20% like personal comitment freewill offering. i believe if indeed you are interested in your church growth, you will give it. so it is more of you deceiving your self when you say you are not going to give tithe when you could have given it if it is another name.

if no, then what do you think will happen if evey church members made the same decision you made, the church might have to run out of resources and you will then be blaming the management for poor management.

so friend, tithe or no tithe it is reasonable not compulsory to regularly finance the church through what God has giving you, and i believe, if you are not willing to give and sell your belongings as the early church did, then why not give a stable income to finance your church for church effective planning which can majorly happen through tithe or any percentage you wishes to do it. as earlier said it will also help you to cultivate a giving life. so that your giving life is not need base but just a natural expression of your life