Stats: 3,192,302 members, 7,947,445 topics. Date: Thursday, 12 September 2024 at 07:58 PM |
Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Religion / Jesus Supported Tithing (6978 Views)
Daddy Freeze Replies Pastor Adeboye’s Response To His Teachings On Tithing / Church Members Walk Out On Pastor Adefarasin Over Tithing / Have You Ever Been Blessed Through Tithing And Giving In Church? (2) (3) (4)
(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply) (Go Down)
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 2:43pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
lonikit:den u don't even know wat Christianity is.. The word was Christian was a nickname for disciples of Jesus Christ. The Bible has record of paul disputing wit jews in the synagogue. Wat was he doing in the synagogue? Jesus drove out ppl selling nd buying in the Temple nd called it his father's house, i must av overrated ur knowledge since u didn't even know dat d only word of God available as at the time of paul was the Torah.. His letters nd letters of other disciples were collated by Christian fathers long after their death. Just help ur self and study about how the canon of the new testament was collated their many more books if u must know but didn't meet the requirements of the Christian fathers to be added with the torah which is tye old testament nd is still complete nd unaltered.. If the early Christians and the apostles revered the torah, who are you to say it has been done away with? |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 4:02pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by plainbibletruth: 4:10pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
salvation101: I've said it over and over again: It's not about winning arguments. It's about knowing and ACCEPTING God's view on any issue. It's amazing how you want to jump from one issue to another aimlessly. It's equally interesting how you ACCUSE others of what they have not done. We're on TITHING and suddenly you want to go to which Bible the early church read. What have the two got in common? No one is discrediting the Old Testament yet you're claiming that we're doing so. That's a false accusation. See what Apostle Paul said: "I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ." Galatians 1:11-12. He then went on to say: "For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it." Galatians 1:13. Did you see that Jesus Christ taught him? Did you see that he said he had PREVIOUS WAY OF LIFE in Judaism? What do all these amount to? I believe you're brilliant enough to figure it out. So, when we say the Christian is under a new system WHICH WAS A MYSTERY to those who lived under the old systems why is it difficult for many of you to see? Paul again: "and to make plain to everyone the administration of this mystery, which for ages past was kept hidden in God, who created all things." Ephesians 3:9 "I have become its servant by the commission God gave me to present to you the word of God in its fullness— the mystery that has been kept hidden for ages and generations, but is now disclosed to the Lord’s people." Colossians 1: 25-26. It was the Apostles that revealed church-age doctrines. Yes, there are lots of things we can learn from the old BUT the old does not constitute the NORM for the New Covenant. That is why, when it comes to TITHING this understanding guides the Christian who cares to see. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 4:17pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
plainbibletruth: I asked you which bible the early Christians in new testament era read because you are making it seem like they read matt, mark luke John in their days...u say they never tithed based on wat ur see in wat we call today as new testament but as a matter of fact they only had the Torah and were obedient to it because Jesus never taught them to rebel against the scriptures... To have a peek into the life of the early Christians u should answer what scriptures dey followed as at then became they never had Matt - Revelation |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by plainbibletruth: 5:19pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
salvation101: Don't let me think that COMPREHENSION is a problem for you. Your answer lies in working out what i wrote in my post which is: What do all these amount to? I believe you're brilliant enough to figure it out. So, go back to the post and you will be able to see it. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 5:48pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
plainbibletruth:needless jabs. I sited Matt 23:23 where Jesus supported the pharisees payment of tithes u guys were quick to say it was meant for only the pharisee nd i should point more scriptures in d new testament (dat hadn't even existed during the early church) where it was recorded dat he early disciples paid tithe.. I den told you it was impossible that they wouldn't av paid tithe because their only scripture as at dat time dey used in the early church was the same torah these pharisees read and practice albeit according to the teachings of their master |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by ichuka(m): 6:23pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
Goshen360:Abeg help me ask her. Funny thing is she's now focus on GIVING more than PAYING. Presumed she knows the difference. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Goshen360(m): 11:37pm On Nov 22, 2017 |
salvation101: I don't tithe but a giver, im more blessed than those who tithe and plus, I still give money to friends and family members who say they tithe. What do you say about that? |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 12:10am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: Firstly you are a sheeple. The fact that what you have believed in and followed for years could be wrong puts a lot of other things you blindly believe in into question. A lot of effort has been used to highlight Jesus support for tithing by hinging the doctrine on Jesus statement in Matthew 23:23. Firstly it is important to note that he classed tithes as a less important matter under the law in that very statement. He also stated they were weightier or heavier matters in the law that needed attention. It is important to note that Jesus supported many other things under the law. In Luke 17:12-14 when dealing with the lepers who he healed, he sent them to the priest to confirm they were healed as stated in Leviticus chapter 14 & 15. Jesus also respected the Passover (Matthew 26:17) • Matthew 23:23 (KJV) 23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier MATTERS OF THE LAW, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. • Matthew 26:17 (KJV) 17 Now the first day of the feast of unleavened bread the disciples came to Jesus, saying unto him, Where wilt thou that WE PREPARE FOR THEE TO EAT THE PASSOVER? |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 4:45am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Goshen360:john Rockefeller the first American billionaire never played with his tithe.. Wat i would say to you is exactly what Rev Ken Hagin said..if u don't believe in tithing do not tithe cos without faith you won't receive any blessings for it |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 4:51am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Maximus82:I am glad to be called a sheeple and not a goatie.. Jesus called his followers sheep and the unbelievers goats... Now u said Jesus classified tithes as less important wch has been wat av been saying. Justice and mercy are the more important but because something is less important or not as important than the others doesn't mean you should stop. Now u telling me that Jesus practicing Jewish laws only buttress wat av been saying to all these folks who said the old testament speaks to only the jews |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Precitosh16(f): 6:52am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by lonikit: 7:18am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: dont deceive ursef my sis, tithing doesn't make u rich or poor. contentment is the motto. Jesus told the rich to see his property and give to the poor and follow him, he pronounced salvation upon zaccheaus immediately, he said " half of my goods I giv to the poor..." as a matter of fact, bill gate spend larger percent of his fortune on charity. Qatar is presently the richest country and they are Muslims. those who control our economy are mostly pagans and Muslims. Jesus never supported tithing my sis. dont argue to win but to learn |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by lonikit: 7:28am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101:if u say the disciples used Torah in the early chrch then, I'm glad to inform u that u dont knw wht u are saying or maybe u don't knw wht was Torah. u only ague to win not to learn. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by lonikit: 7:32am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101:u have not answered all. I wish u can then, I explain some part u are missing. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by lonikit: 7:36am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: yes. Jesus practically went against Jewish tradition and that was why he was crucified. tell me if Im missing it. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 8:08am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: Unfortunately sheeple does not mean a follower of Christ doctrines but a follower of the doctrines of men. Christ was a Jew and not a gentile. He also came to fulfill the law which has been done away with. Tithing was for the Jews, the same way circumcision was for the Jews only (please note circumcision is now of no use spiritually). The point is they were other aspects of the law in which Jesus fulfiled. If the modern preacher states that tithes is not a necessity, then why the continuous link to blessings from the Tithe? Christ bore the curse of the law the Bible declares. Have you ever asked yourself the simple question, why did Jesus come? The teaching of the day links almost all blessings apart from salvation to financial seed, which leaves the question on why did Jesus come? The bible says a sign of the curse on Adam was that the ground would bring forth thorns and Thistles (Gen 3:17&18). Adams labour was meant to be rigorous and tedious because of his sin. According to three Canonical versions of the crucifixion, a crown of thorns was placed on Jesus head symbolising that he took upon himself the curse of Adam. (Matt 27:29 Mark 15:17, John 19, 2 &5). If Christ bore the curse, then how can the tithe supersede the work of the cross? Which is greater, the finished work of the cross or the tithe. • Genesis 3:17-18 (KJV) 17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; 18 Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; • Mark 15:17 (KJV) 17 And they clothed him with purple, and platted a crown of thorns, and put it about his head, Be blessed, wake up to the freedom of no condemnation in Christ and take your Christian walk to another level. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 8:18am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: Many other things came before the law and were also mentioned in the law or polished in the law. These other practices are all done away with and are classed as part of the law even though they also came before the law. The same way Christians religiously circumcise their sons even though it is of no use under the New Testament, is the same way people religiously tithe. A. CLEAN AND UNCLEAN beast (Before the law GEN 7:2 & GEN 8:20 in the law LEV 11) • Genesis 7:2 (KJV) 2 Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female. • Genesis 8:20 (KJV) 20 And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar. • Leviticus 11:2 (KJV) 2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth. B. CIRCUMCISION: (Before the law GEN 21:1-4, in the law LEV 12:3) • Genesis 21:4 (KJV) 4 And Abraham circumcised his son Isaac being eight days old, as God had commanded him. • Leviticus 12:2 (KJV) 2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean. • Leviticus 12:3 (KJV) 3 And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised. C. BURNT OFFERINGS/ NOT TO BE CONFUSED WITH SIN OR TRESSPASS OFFERINGS: (Before the law GEN 8:20, In the law EX 20:24 & LEV 1:10-11) • Genesis 8:20 (KJV) 20 And Noah builded an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar. • Exodus 20:24 (KJV) 24 An altar of earth thou shalt make unto me, and shalt sacrifice thereon thy burnt offerings, and thy peace offerings, thy sheep, and thine oxen: in all places where I record my name I will come unto thee, and I will bless thee. • Exodus 18:12 (KJV) 12 And Jethro, Moses' father in law, took a burnt offering and sacrifices for God: and Aaron came, and all the elders of Israel, to eat bread with Moses' father in law before God. Over to your other points you raised of notable people who tithe, I can mention quite a few who I actually know. Your top shots accross the world do not tithe and they are but a handful of tithers when it comes to the super rich. You cannot make a doctrine out of such invalid stats. It's like saying we should be born again because a Hollywood star is. Truth is they are about 3000 Hollywood stars who aren't saved. When it comes to prospering there is one simple God given principle. Your view conveys the message that tithing and other forms of extreme giving guarantee huge returns. The only person guaranteed a return in the prosperity doctrine is the preacher. The Bible clearly says that a man diligent in what he does, he ends up before great men (PROV 22:29). God blesses the works of our hands and that which he has called us to. Our diligence opens doors. The richest people on earth are not your tithers etc but those who are masters in their fields. I don't want to sound rude, but the people you see on TV, I hang out with them. The mega preachers you rant on about, I speak to them almost weekly, but sadly it's a scam when it comes to finances. I'm talking of your mega preachers you all watch on satellite or cable TV, depending on what you call it down there. That's why I'm sad with sheeple. They are times I'm in a place and I hear sheeple defending people they don't know etc and their only view on the person they are defending is from a media source i.e TV etc. Let's face it, these are media ministries and the media are more than capable of pushing views they want seen out. Apart from Reinhard Bonnke, most of the rest are there for money and nothing else. How do I know, I work with them but sadly your programmed minds won't even let you receive that. Have you ever asked yourself who Jacob tithes to? Think on that one. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by petra1(m): 10:05am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Maximus82: . CLEAN AND UNCLEAN beast (Before the law GEN 7:2 & GEN 8:20 in the law LEV 11) firstly what you should think about is the significance of the things and ordinance you mentions. There are types and shadow of christ in the bible . we must know the difference between what christ has fulfilled and what is applicable . Burn offerings ,circumsicion are fulfilled in christ .The kingdom of God runs on spiritual principles . some kingdom principles are revealed or polished in the law as you stated. we still do them ,not because the law says so but because they are principles . Principles transcend dispensations. to your other points you raised of notable people who tithe, I can mention quite a few who I actually know. Your top shots accross the world do not tithe and they are but a handful of tithers when it comes to the super rich. You cannot make a doctrine out of such invalid stats. It's like saying we should be born again because a Hollywood star is. Truth is they are about 3000 Hollywood stars who aren't saved. When it comes to prospering there is one simple God given principle. Far from it . we are not in competition with the world. YOUR success in life is fulfilling destiny either with the peasant or kings view conveys the message that tithing and other forms of extreme giving guarantee huge returns. The only person guaranteed a return in the prosperity doctrine is the preacher the giver receives , thats scripture The Bible clearly says that a man diligent in what he does, he ends up before great men (PROV 22:29). God blesses the works of our hands and that which he has called us to. Our diligence opens doors. The richest people on earth are not your tithers etc but those who are masters in their fields. Sure ,some truth there I don't want to sound rude, but the people you see on TV, I hang out with them. The mega preachers you rant on about, I speak to them almost weekly, but sadly it's a scam when it comes to finances. I'm talking of your mega preachers you all watch on satellite or cable TV, depending on what you call it down there. That's why I'm sad with sheeple. They are times I'm in a place and I hear sheeple defending people they don't know etc and their only view on the person they are defending is from a media source i.e TV etc. Let's face it, these are media ministries and the media are more than capable of pushing views they want seen out. Apart from Reinhard Bonnke, most of the rest are there for money and nothing else. How do I know, I work with them but sadly your programmed minds won't even let you receive that. Thats you opinion. So Kumuyi and the rest are stealing. you're not only rude and wrong. you're sinning. because its God who sees everyman motive and intention. he's the righteous judge . There could be fale ministers but its not you or you measure of judgement that will determine that. jesus was see as false by some . you see from the color of your glass. the fact that someone may be false does not nullify principle. even if a pastor steal money . does that make giving to god invalid?. Dealing with a mans error id different from dealing with a principle. if past administration misuse our taxes , does that make taxation wrong ? you ever asked yourself who Jacob tithes to? Think on that one. its not who he paid to that counts but that tithing still runs in his generation. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:08am On Nov 23, 2017 |
lonikit:i wished to be proved wrong. Wat scripture was used by the early church even according to the new testament |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:11am On Nov 23, 2017 |
lonikit:you got it wrong. Jesus was crucified out of Jealousy and because he claimed he was the coming messiah wch dey see as blasphemy |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by PaChukwudi44(m): 10:11am On Nov 23, 2017 |
spare us all this big grammar and show us where the apostles received tithes from anyone |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by petra1(m): 10:12am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: its the torah of course. paul even quote the law to them gentiles sometimes. the content of the law has godly principle . its only wrong to seek righteousness through the law . it came as gift . thats all . every condemnation of the law has to do with seeking justification by it |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by PaChukwudi44(m): 10:13am On Nov 23, 2017 |
petra1: As long as the early church never tithed we are not also required to practise tithing |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:13am On Nov 23, 2017 |
petra1: Sorry to burst your bubble but Kumuyi is really small on the global scale. On the international scene, pastor Ayo, bishop oyedepo and pastor Chris are on top. As I said, I'm fully in house. Pastor Kumuyi cannot enter a room where the main figureheads in Pentecostals Christianity reigns. He is a good guy but he is low on the pecking order of international Pentecostalism if I can use this term. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by PaChukwudi44(m): 10:18am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Maximus82: sorry to digress but what really is the rationale for all this rankings? 1 Like |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:19am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Maximus82:fortunately i consider being called a sheeple a complement. Now you mentioned that Christ fulfilled the law which i also agree with but bringing all dat happened before the law as part of the law i disagree.. Has Jesus finally completed his mission on earth? If so, why does death still have power over the flesh? Why do women still go tru pain of labor? Why did paul look forward to the time our mortality will put on immortality? Are we in that time already? |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by petra1(m): 10:20am On Nov 23, 2017 |
Maximus82: that is a carnal assessment. you don't rate ministers . its only god who has the scale based on callings. well thats your view and opinion anyway and you're entitled to it. but if you have to deal with facts and statistics you cant call Kumuyi small. he has one of the largest followership in the world . |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:21am On Nov 23, 2017 |
[quote author=petra1 post=62637626] firstly what you should think about is the significance of the things and ordinance you mentions. There are types and shadow of christ in the bible . we must know the difference between what christ has fulfilled and what is applicable . Burn offerings ,circumsicion are fulfilled in christ .The kingdom of God runs on spiritual principles . some kingdom principles are revealed or polished in the law as you stated. we still do them ,not because the law says so but because they are principles . Principles transcend dispensations. Far from it . we are not in competition with the world. YOUR success in life is fulfilling destiny either with the peasant or kings the giver receives , thats scripture some truth there Thats you opinion. So Kumuyi and the rest are stealing. you're not only rude and wrong. you're sinning. because its God who sees everyman motive and intention. he's the righteous judge . There could be fale ministers but its not you or you measure of judgement that will determine that. jesus was see as false by some . you see from the color of your glass. the fact that someone may be false does not nullify principle. even if a pastor steal money . does that make giving to god invalid?. Dealing with a mans error id different from dealing with a principle. if past administration misuse our taxes , does that make taxation wrong ? its not who he paid to that counts but that tithing still runs in his generation. You also didn't answer the points. I sit with your so called mentors daily and before God and man they all see the sheeple like yourself as fools. Sad but true. How does the tithe correlate with the finish work of the cross? My points were answers to the person before me( not sure if it's you). You are not obligated to pay tithes in the new testament.. you don't understand what happened at the cross and that's why for a person like yourself, without admitting it, you link blessings in your life to the tithe. The very thing Martin Luther fought to shatter has been applied to other areas of tour life. You are still religiously bound, the same way your parents were bound and curcumcised you on the 8th day. Go home, take your trousers off and ask yourself, why was I circumcised? Same applies to your tithes. A person controlled by a religious spirit doesn't know he's under one. You can't even pray to God to show you if the so called men of God are real or not, you couldn't. You operate in fear and haven't known the glorious liberty in Christ. As a man or maybe woman, ask yourself, would I circumcise my make child? I bet you would and do it religiously but are in denial. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by petra1(m): 10:22am On Nov 23, 2017 |
PaChukwudi44: as long AS THERE IS a high priest we are required to tithe |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by PaChukwudi44(m): 10:22am On Nov 23, 2017 |
salvation101: Bros Jesus has fulfilled the law shikena.The law of moses is has been dead for over 2000 years now. |
Re: Jesus Supported Tithing by Nobody: 10:23am On Nov 23, 2017 |
petra1: 95% of global Christians haven't heard of him. It's only in Nigeria we hear of some of these names. I know, I used to be there back in the days. |
(1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (Reply)
Why you don't need a spiritual father or mother!!! / Is Satan Really Such A Bad Person? / The Difference Between Christmas Eve & Watch Night?
(Go Up)
Sections: politics (1) business autos (1) jobs (1) career education (1) romance computers phones travel sports fashion health religion celebs tv-movies music-radio literature webmasters programming techmarket Links: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5) (6) (7) (8) (9) (10) Nairaland - Copyright © 2005 - 2024 Oluwaseun Osewa. All rights reserved. See How To Advertise. 139 |