patches689:


Multiple missiles attacking one target is like 1980's tech bro

The Russians have a ASM from the 1980's that has basic "swarm" technology - the missiles link up in flight, assess the enemy fleet composition, caculate priority targets and can even alter flight patterns as a diversion (some could go high to draw fire away from the rest).

I think its Granit, not sure though

since in the other thread everybody is busy in naval warfare let me do the same here

P-700 / 3K45 Granit / SS-N-19 Shipwreck AShM

It is a 7 tonne launch weight 300 nautical mile range Mach 2.5 turbojet missile and was deployed on the Kirov class ships and Oscar class SSGNs etc.

1.The Granit was the first missile of its kind to be equipped with artificial intelligence.it had a wolf pack homing design. up to 20 missiles could be launched and they worked together as a team.

2.At launch they would have a radar picture of the target via satellites (i.e. Legenda) or from other airborne platforms.

3.They know where the target is roughly and they know where they are launched from so all 8-12 missiles will fly at medium height to maximise range. When they approach the radar horizon of the target all but one will drop down to remain unseen by the target and the one missile remaining high will scan the target and then drop down to fly with the other missiles.

4.After the missile itself identifies its target, they would line up like a wolf pack and start "hunting" the target. so ultimately the missiles themselves decided which of them will attack the target, and how. The missiles in a "wolf pack" would distribute a number of targets among themselves, rank targets in order of importance, and choose their attack tactics.

5.In order to rule out errors in choosing manoeuvres and attack methods, the missile's on-board computer contained electronic data on all known enemy warship classes. There are some purely tactical details, such as vessel type. This enables the missiles to decide what they are facing - a convoy, an aircraft-carrying group, a landing group - and attack the major targets within a group.

6.so basically the lead missile will process the scan, pick out the targets and assign the other missiles to each target depending on the information in the radar return ,so a small ship might get one missile while a large target might get 3-4 missiles targeting it including any nuclear armed missiles in the group.

7.If the lead missile is shot down then one of the other missiles will climb and get a radar image of the target and perform the command role of allocating individual missiles to targets. When they cross the radar horizon another scan will take place and the updated data will be data linked to the other missiles which will maintain radar silent till impact.

8.The Granit's on-board computer also stores data on countering the opponent's radio-electronic warfare resources , and tactical manoeuvres for avoiding air defence fire.

9.After destroying the chief selected target, the remaining missiles will immediately redistribute combat tasks among themselves and start destroying other vessels. theoretically no ship in the world is capable of escaping an attack by a Granit pack. The Granit's speed and continual manoeuvring over the sea makes it practically impossible to intercept by air defence or aviation.

10.Plus it has a cool trick in its sleeve. If the missile detects that it is being targeted by anti air missiles etc. then it will create and project an electronic image of itself away from it, aka a CLONE to deceive the attacking enemy missile into attacking this CLONE instead and splash itself harmlessly into the sea. this feature is built into the BRAHMOS also.

11.also Granit's nuclear warhead was 2x lighter then conventional one, so they put a titanium shield in front of it ,not only to balance the missile but to add protection, if a tactical nuke exploded 10km away from the target ship it would destroy the other Granit missiles and the target ship might survive. so only those Granit missiles with nuclear warhead had protection not the conventional ones.

12.each missile radiated a specific frequency , and was designated number from 1-20 on its operating frequency , they would pulse this frequency from time to time to establish rank among themselves, so number 1 will form inertial data pop up first around 70-100km from the target and send radar data to other missiles, in case its destroyed then number 2,3,4,....etc. would take over , also depending on radar return 3-4 missiles will be prioritized to the target having the highest radar signature and also various other data would be factored in for the target prioritization , then remaining others would be assigned 1-2 apiece per target depending on number of targets left.


pic 1 granit missile being loaded

pic 2 granit missile onboard Oscar class SSGN

pic 3 American carrier battle group which the granite was designed to destroy


additional info

generally and simplistically there are 4 stages involved in a missile attack by a AShM

1. the first phase depends on first detecting the target ship. one has to locate and identify where the enemy ships are. this is the surveillance phase. radar is one type of sensor which is used for surveillance. the surveillance radars may in some cases be land based but can also be mounted on satellites, aircrafts UAVs etc.

2. the 2nd stage is the deployment of attacking launch platforms and selection of specific targets for missiles. this is called the targeting phase. the radars employed in targeting are usually aboard the ships or aircraft that launch the Anti-Ship Missiles ( ie if the target is within the onboard radar/sensor range, otherwise off board targeting information is utilized ).

3. in the third phase, i.e. the mid course guidance phase occurs after the missile launch. the mid course portion of the guidance phase may or may not use radar sensors. some anti- ship missiles use inertial guidance until they approach the target, then turn on their radar and acquire the target.

4. the fourth phase is the terminal guidance phase, in which the missile radar/IR seeker is actively tracking the target ship, and attempts to home on the radar echo/heat signature.

thus for a anti ship missile to successfully hit its intended target it is necessary for each of the stages to be successfully negotiated.

here I have just pointed the bare facts when in real life it is much much more complicated. technically what I have described above is the KILL CHAIN from the enemies perspective, in real life scenario there are so many things in this KILL CHAIN which could go wrong which will lead to failure of the launch of the AShM or lead to failure in the AShM to achieve the intended kill.

lionel4power:

Even Ground Based Interceptors are just a few dozen in number, and multiple salvos of multiple missiles will be fired at a real target in an operational engagements


http://amp.timeinc.net/thedrive/the-war-zone/11794/navys-new-sm-3-block-iia-ballistic-missile-interceptor-fails-in-live-test?source=dam

"The use of multiple shots, timed ever-more-closely together, appears destined to rehearse saturating a defensive system by presenting it with an overwhelmingly complex radar picture," Joshua Pollack, editor of the U.S.-based Nonproliferation Review, said of Monday's launch.

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN16F0CT


GO AND RESEARCH ABOUT:
1) Lanchester's Square Law
2) salvo combat model

it would give you a clue how missiles defense Is plotted and executed

nemesis4u:


just saying IMO north korean ICBMs r vulnerable , which no media is pointing to becz they want to build a war hysteria by portraying NK systems to be potent.

eg. did u see their tests , their ICBMs r liquid fuelled , which needs to fuelled prior to launch and then moved to launch location and then the missile off sited (separated from TEL) for launch.

too much time being spent here , thereby very vulnerable to prompt strikes

newafricaken254:
north korea could initially fire its solid fueled tactical ballistic on any land bases where this attack force will be launched from,also north korea likely has tunneled through mountains in north korea. creating bunkers where this missiles can be fueled

nemesis4u:


u must under this that any conflict does not happen in a blink of a eye

there is a escalation ladder , tell tale signs r always there to alert opposing forces

eg. movement of specific personnel's attached to strategic forces , activation of specific comms related to WMDs , disappearance/appearance of key government officials , EMCON initiation , movement of conventional troops and equipments for rear guard or main force offensive/defensive posturing etc etc

NK is under persistent real time surveillance from US SK Japan NATO and to some extent by china and Russia (surprisingly by ind... to some smaller extent)

it will be in the best interest of china and Russia to keep NK from going suicidal , preserving NK for the sole purpose of keeping US occupied for as long as possible will serve their interests rather than see NK destroyed .

yes missiles can be fuelled inside tunnels built into mountains ,but multiple TELs coming out and dispersing will alert opponents counterforce assets

IMO technology exists to determine if missiles being transported by TELs r fuelled or not and dont quote me on this becz i dont know for sure

and initial firing of tactical missiles will lead to full brunt of response being brought to ensure unacceptable damage to all military assets.

all this media misinformation going on is truly hogwash

NK can never put US at risk , all NK is doing is playing a game of roulette by inserting the element of uncertainty (psyops)

NK going against US military on their own initiation defeats their main purpose of unification with SK ( think about it )

NK can fancy their chance against SK military but not with risk of involvement of other nations

NK main purpose right now is survival, deterrence and bargaining tactics via missiles/nuke but all within the threshold of the red line (ie dont start something which u wont live to see)

newafricaken254:
if there is technology that can precisilly pin-point movement of TEL,why hasn't the US provided the saudi with intel to locate houthi TEL being used to launch tactical ballistic missiles toward saudi !?America may have a constellation of spy satellites ,but still major incidents occur which are critical to their security without them realising

nemesis4u:




1. there is no freebies in international relation , there is always a catch . if stakes r not too high then ' no out of the way help '

2. nobody bares all his cards , he deals them as he deems fit and when he deems them to deal them, most of the times he will never deal them (see it in the perspective of intel/technology transfer and international cooperation etc etc )

3. a good businessman never interferes in a demand and supply situation (if US supplies them the intel to pinpoint houthi TEL then who is going to buy and use their munitions/weapons in thousands for random/useless strikes )

4.spy/ELINT/EO etc satellite assets r always role and target oriented , so it will be wrong to assume US has assets to cover the whole world, only their priority targets gets the necessary attention/equipment's/assets

5.in intelligence failures r known but success r not so no way to analyze the success or failure rate credibly

6.failures r mainly at human level , there is no escape from that , can only minimize the human failures.

eg. mumbai 2008 terror attack could have been prevented had the concerned personnel red flagged the real time SIGNIT input captured from karachi instead he failed to prioritize the intel and relegated it to be processed later on.

andrewza:
North Korea all so have not launched any missile with a pay load so there real range is not actually known.

newafricaken254:
also your police were running around with lee enfield rifles against terrorist armed with AK's

newafricaken254:
multiple launch of patriot missiles and still the warhead hit the ground !?

ViceAdmirlAgain:


What happened to the RG-32's meant for Namibia?

patches689:


...and it was used by.... Saudis.

Frumentum:


They've been delivered, I think. Someone in another forum posted pics of 2 outside Swakopmund. They'll be in the 2017 report.

Frumentum:
Cousins, looks like your feedback on the REVA FAV has been incorporated.

PIC1: the old FAV;
PIC2: the new.

Odunayaw:
Higher silhouette. But it looks pretty

Frumentum:


And slightly elongated - ICP claims it can now carry 5 dismounts; has a bigger tank giving a 850km range; and can now mount a 20mm as opposed to the .50cal in the original tested by the Namibians.

Odunayaw:
Impressive

Frumentum:

But is it air-droppable? For a SF rapid deployment vehicle, I'll still take the modular Hornet any day .

Odunayaw:
What is its gross weight

Frumentum:

No idea, but weight isn't the only consideration in air-droppability. ICP only mentions it can be slung by Oryx/MI-17/Super Puma and seeing the founders are retired Recces, if it were air-droppable they'd have touted the fact.

jteku:
Which of the NPF uniform fit the most and should be adobted.

jteku:
Which of the NPF uniform fit the most and should be adobted.

jteku:
Which of the NPF uniform fit the most and should be adobted.

nemesis4u:

yes granit later brahmos (stimulation's have shown that around 75-80 brahmos can wipe out a US CBG if all factors favors the brahmos )


i wrote about it once in the technical thread, it was a revolutionary path breaking technology at that time

Frumentum:


This!
Doesn't matter what system they use, Saudis will be Saudis.

jteku:
Which of the NPF uniform fit the most and should be adobted.