brocab:

Interesting-is this what Mohammed saw-the trinity of God Mary and Jesus, this was something I didn't know? But through study I found this below.
Muhammad was not a very well informed theologian when he wrote the Koran. Yes, we know, Muslims will tell us that Muhammad didn't write the Qur'an. After all that way they can blame Allah for the errors and their prophet remains sinless and blameless!
Mohammed mistakenly thought that Mary was the third member of the Christian trinity, and here is what the Koran says:
1.“And when Allah saith: O Jesus, son of Mary! Didst thou say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah? he saith: Be glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then Thou knewest it. Thou knowest what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Thy Mind. Lo! Thou, only Thou, art the Knower of Things Hidden? (Koran 5:116)
2."O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of God aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of God, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from Him: so believe in God and His apostles. Say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for God is one God: Glory be to Him: (far exalted is He) above having a son. To Him belong all things in the heavens and on earth. And enough is God as a Disposer of affairs." (Koran 4:171)
3."They do blaspheme who say: God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them." (Koran 5:73)
So basically Islam and Catholicism are the same-Muhammad and Catholicism believe in three distinct gods, the Father (Allah), Son (Isa) and Mary-the Catholic's believe the godhead is also-the Father, the Son and Mary. What does the bible say?

9inches:


So what is the Catholic teaching on "graven images"?

Dnaz:


I only proved that Joshua and Israelites venerated an image. Which is the Ark of the Covenant.
And u don't know what idolatry is
U seek to Justify Ignorance

Exodus 25:34-
And the cherubim shall stretch out their wings above, covering the mercy seat with their wings, and they shall face one another; the faces of the cherubim shall be toward the mercy seat. You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you. And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.

shadeyinka:


Sorry for the late replies: over zealous Bots band me for no just reason.

Joshua did not venerate any image that is a violation of Gods command. However, from the ark, the Presence of God is made manifest to the children of Israel


In other words, the Spirit of God meet with the children of Israel from the ark of the covenant
So, my question:
Is the Spirit of Mary in your Graven Images?

Dnaz:

Lol. Joshua prostrated face down before the ark till evening. That is veneration. However Just like Catholics , he did not worship it
I can see u finally agree that God can meet us through images. U r finally making progress
Mary is the ark Of the new Covenant. In her was Conceived the Word of God who is God himself. Just like the old ark was overshadowed by the presence of God. So Mary was overshadowed by the Holy spirit as the Angel Gabriel rightly said

And the angel said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; therefore the child to be born will be called holy, the Son of God.
Luke 1:35

shadeyinka:

Stop twisting the word of God to suit your traditions. I highlighted the bible verse for you, didn't I?

And Mary the bearer of the "Word" was free from the sin of Adam: no wonder she is your queen of heaven,...

And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony,


And I asked my question:
Is the Spirit of Mary in your Graven Images?

Dnaz:

U didn't write the scripture, u didn't even partake in the Canon
So u don't get to tell me I m twisting the Scriptures. U have no pedigree
If the Spirit of God can reside in a graven image made with human hand, how then can he not cause that the Spirit of the Ever blessed Virgin The God bearer to reside in an image
She is not our Queen of heaven. She is the Queen of heaven regardless of what u believe

shadeyinka:

She is your queen of heaven.
Are you afraid of interpreting the plain word of God in English language?

You just want to justify idolatory for the love of it. Are you saying Gods spirit is in the concrete/pop images of Maryvyou make?

That's why you won't dare answer my question.

The Mary I know from the Scripture is not the one you worship. The Mary I know is one of the Believers in Christ. Just like James and Jude.

Was Mary conceived immaculately too? She is a carrier of the sin of Adam. And for the MarybI know, Christ also died.

Dnaz:

Revelations 12.

1 And a great portent appeared in heaven, a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a crown of twelve stars;
Revelation 12:1

2 she was with child and she cried out in her pangs of birth, in anguish for delivery.
Revelation 12:2


5 she brought forth a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne,
Revelation 12:5


So This Is Evidence of Marys Queen ship. Whether u believe it or not, it doesn't Change the Truth
I ve answered ur Questions fair and Square. U r just too mesmerized to admit it

The Mary we Honour is the Mother of Christ Whom the Holy Spirit prophecies that all Generations shall call her blessed.

for He has regarded the low estate of his handmaiden. For behold, henceforth all generations will call me blessed;
Luke 1:48
And that's how it has been from that age to this one and it ll continue to be. We know the devil is still angry with her for her role In our salvation as the Bible says17 Then the dragon was angry with the woman, and went off to make war on the rest of her offspring, on those who keep the commandments of God and bear testimony to Jesus. And He stood on the sand of the sea.
Revelation 12:17



So we are her offspring and the Devil ll only try hr won't prevail. Please don't be a soldier of the Devil. Be a Child of Mary bear the testimony of Jesus

Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars.

Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth. And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great, fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. His tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth.

And the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to give birth, to devour her Child as soon to give birth.

And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great, fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. His tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to give birth, to devour her Child as soon as it was born.

She bore a male Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne. Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and sixty days.

shadeyinka:






And you think this was Mary?

Then you have a lot of explanation to do of the whole text to convince us.

We know that Mary lived with John the Beloved till she died, so please educate us. We are willing to learn!

What is the interpretation of stars cast down to the earth? And when?

So, where did Mary run to Heaven or the Wilderness?

Why don't you interpret the rest of the Book of Revelation literarily!?

You just pick on a verse to give it an interpretation to suit your idolatory!? I shake my head

Dnaz:


she brought forth a male child, one who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron, but her child was caught up to God and to his throne,
Revelation 12:5
Woman Mary
Child Jesus. Every Unbiased mind ll agree

shadeyinka:


Catholics will deny what you say because in truth there is a slight difference between what they write and what they do.

"We don't worship Mary!" BUT they bow to her idol

quote author=9inches post=65946274]
Pure heresy! If you recognize Scripture for what it is, you’ll see it wasn’t intended to be an instructional tool for converts. In fact, not one book of the Bible was written for non-believers. The Old Testament books were written for Jews, the New Testament books for people who already were Christians.

Most of the epistles were written to local churches that were experiencing moral and/or doctrinal problems. Paul and most of the other New Testament writers sent letters to these local churches (e.g., 1 and 2 Corinthians and Galatians) in order to rectify these problems. There was no attempt on the part of the writers to impart a vast body of basic doctrinal instruction to non-believers nor even to simply summarize everything for the believers who received the letters. This is what protestants fail to realize!

YES, Paul's words are the same as what he wrote down. But NO, he did not write all his words down. Now read again what he said to Timothy (2 Thess 2:15) "So then, brothers and sisters, stand firm and hold fast to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by letter."

Remember, in 2 Tim. 3:14–15, Paul tells Timothy to continue in what he has learned for two reasons: first, because he knows from whom he has learned it (Paul himself) and second, because he has been educated in the scriptures. The first of these is a direct appeal to apostolic tradition, the oral teaching which the apostle Paul had given Timothy.

This is where Protestants like you take 2 Timothy 3:16-17 out of context to arrive at the theory of sola scriptura! But when the passage is read in context, it becomes clear that it is teaching the importance of apostolic tradition!

The Bible denies that it is sufficient as the complete rule of faith. Paul says that much Christian teaching is to be found in the tradition which is handed down by word of mouth (2 Tim. 2:2). He instructs us to "stand firm and hold to the traditions which you were taught by us, either by word of mouth or by letter" (2 Thess. 2:15).

This oral teaching was accepted by Christians, just as they accepted the written teaching that came to them later. Jesus told his disciples: "He who hears you hears me, and he who rejects you rejects me" ](Luke 10:16). The Church, in the persons of the apostles, was given the authority to teach by Christ; the Church would be his representative. He commissioned them, saying, "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations" (Matt. 28:19).

And how was this to be done? By preaching, by oral instruction: "So faith comes from what is heard, and what is heard comes by the preaching of Christ" (Rom. 10:17). The Church would always be the living teacher. It is a mistake to limit "Christ’s word" to the written word only or to suggest that all his teachings were reduced to writing. The Bible nowhere supports either notion.

Further, it is clear that the oral teaching of Christ would last until the end of time -"’But the word of the Lord abides for ever.’ That word is the good news which was preached to you" (1 Pet. 1:25). Note that the word has been "preached", that is, communicated orally. This would endure. It would not be supplanted by a written record like the Bible (supplemented, yes, but not supplanted), and would continue to have its own authority.

This is made clear when the apostle Paul tells Timothy (2 Tim. 2:2), "And the things you have heard me say in the presence of many witnesses entrust to reliable people who will also be qualified to teach others". Here we see the first few links in the chain of apostolic tradition that has been passed down intact from the apostles to our own day. Paul instructed Timothy to pass on the oral teachings (traditions) that he had received from the apostle. He was to give these to men who would be able to teach others, thus perpetuating the chain. Paul gave this instruction not long before his death (2 Tim. 4:6-8 ) as a reminder to Timothy of how he should conduct his ministry.

Go ahead, refute my argument IF YOU CAN.

Pay attention, it's not about what Timothy or Christians at that time knew. It's about what Paul was emphatically saying. So again, Scripture as mentioned In 2 Tim 3:15 (that is, in that context) most specifically referring to the Old Testament.

You're right! Paul never received human tradition like sola scriptura (introduced in 1517 by Martin Luther). Now pay attention and keep in mind what the Catholic Church means by tradition. The term does not refer to legends or mythological accounts. It does not encompass transitory customs or practices which may change, as circumstances warrant, such as styles of priestly dress, particular forms of devotion to saints, or even liturgical rules in Catholic Church. So the Tradition Paul talks about in the scripture is what we aptly call Sacred or Apostolic tradition. It consists of the teachings that the apostles passed on orally through their preaching. These teachings largely, or perhaps entirely overlap with those contained in Scripture (I already used the word 'Supplemented' above), but the mode of their transmission is different.

They have been handed down and entrusted to the Church. It is necessary that Christians believe in and follow this tradition as well as the Bible (Luke 10:16). The truth of the faith has been given primarily to the leaders of the Church (Eph. 3:5), who, with Christ, form the foundation of the Church (Eph. 2:20). The Church has been guided by the Holy Spirit, who protects this teaching from corruption (John 14:25-26, 16:13).


You did address it WRONGLY. 3:16 does not explain 3:15. To contextualize 3:15, you need John 5:39; and to contextualize John 5:39, you need John 12:16; John 19:28; John 20:9; Luke 24:27, Luke 44, 1 Peter 1:10. That's how you know what any author or speaker is talking about any instance. You don't just lump verses together just because they use the same term and/or they are close to each other. If you learned biblical exegesis and hermeneutics, you would know this.[

brocab:
1. https://www.catholic.com/ This is the first page I opened up and this is what it said: Is Sex Okay As Long As Nobody Gets Hurt?
With this very same site-I asked a simple question "Are Catholic's born again "saved" and I read Augustine wrote,"It is this one Spirit who makes it possible for an infant to be regenerated-when that infant is brought to baptism; and it is through this one Spirit that the infant so presented is reborn. Augustine believes it is not written, ‘Unless a man be born again by the will of his parents’ or ‘by the faith of those presenting him or ministering to him,’ but, ‘Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit’ [John 3:5].
How do infants know he/she is baptised, and what sort of faith do you expect an infant to have? And if the parent's don't follow Christ-then what sort of baptism did the infant receive? "And what does the Catholic church expect out of it?
Jesus made a point to be baptised as a man-men make decisions, infants can't make he/she decisions.

shadeyinka:

I see both your Popes and Reverend Fathers and Reverend Mothers bow before " graven images of Mary" and also kiss it!

You don't worship it, you only bow before it in adoration!

It is called IDOLATRY!

9inches:


Answers:
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/infant-baptism

http://www.ewtn.com/v/experts/showmessage.asp?number=313917&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

9inches:


Answers:
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/infant-baptism

http://www.ewtn.com/v/experts/showmessage.asp?number=313917&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

solite3:
Really? How about the Greeks who read the scriptures? How about timothy who was instructed in the scriptures? How about the enunch whom Philip instruct from the old testament? This your comment is one of the dumbest I have ever come across.

solite3:
really there is a vast body of non believers and there doctrine for them. that is the roman catholic church.
The letter of apostle Paul is scripture and the scripture is inspired by God meaning it has God's own authority.
2 timothy tells timothy that the scripture is the basis for doctrine any other doctrine is false and invalid.

solite3:
All their teaching were written down. If all their teaching was not written then their letter would be unsuitable for doctrine but it is not so for if timothy was to instruct others with the letter then it must of necessity contain the complete teaching of the apostles or else it would be useless for doctrine.


2 Timothy 3:10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,

3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

3:17 That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.

oral teaching that was written down. The apostles already told you that their tradition and letter is one and the same.

the message of Paul to timothy remains indented, All scripture is God inspired and can make a man of God perfect.

you mean God's inspired word is insufficient and incomplete rule of faith and yet timothy was made wise unto salvation, Jesus overcome Satan with it. Jesus preached and teach with that you call sufficient,


Matthew 22:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Acts 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,

Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Acts 18:24 And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.

Acts 18:28 For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publickly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.

The oral teaching was about Christ, and about Christ is from the scripture.

Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

John 2:22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

John 5:39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

Without scripture no one can believe in Christ.

He taught in one synagogue for “three months” (Acts 19:, and in one location “daily” for two years (Acts 19:10). This was all oral teaching

there is no context that suggest that. During timothy days some of the new testament books were already written and recognised as scriptures.

shadeyinka:

You can't take just one part that is suitable for your argument. You have to take the whole text as a whole.

Revelation is symbolic:
1. Did Mary experience a prolong birth pang in the delivery of Jesus?
2. A great sign appeared in heaven: not on earth as Mary was here on earth. Do you think this is speaking of Mary?
3. Another sign took place in heaven where the dragons tail swept down to earth a third of the stars. Pls kindly link this up with Mary.
4. Can you reconcile "the wilderness" where Mary fled to with history?
5. If Mary is in the wilderness, is she not supposed to be called the queen of the dessert rather than the queen of heaven?
6. What is the relationship of the Sun, Moon and Star to Mary?

shadeyinka:

You can't take just one part that is suitable for your argument. You have to take the whole text as a whole.

Revelation is symbolic:
1. Did Mary experience a prolong birth pang in the delivery of Jesus?
2. A great sign appeared in heaven: not on earth as Mary was here on earth. Do you think this is speaking of Mary?
3. Another sign took place in heaven where the dragons tail swept down to earth a third of the stars. Pls kindly link this up with Mary.
4. Can you reconcile "the wilderness" where Mary fled to with history?
5. If Mary is in the wilderness, is she not supposed to be called the queen of the dessert rather than the queen of heaven?
6. What is the relationship of the Sun, Moon and Star to Mary?

shadeyinka:

You can't take just one part that is suitable for your argument. You have to take the whole text as a whole.

Revelation is symbolic:
1. Did Mary experience a prolong birth pang in the delivery of Jesus?
2. A great sign appeared in heaven: not on earth as Mary was here on earth. Do you think this is speaking of Mary?
3. Another sign took place in heaven where the dragons tail swept down to earth a third of the stars. Pls kindly link this up with Mary.
4. Can you reconcile "the wilderness" where Mary fled to with history?
5. If Mary is in the wilderness, is she not supposed to be called the queen of the dessert rather than the queen of heaven?
6. What is the relationship of the Sun, Moon and Star to Mary?

brocab:
1. https://www.catholic.com/ And the first page I opened up said this? Is Sex Okay As Long As Nobody Gets Hurt?
Does this mean it is alright for the Catholic's to have sex without marriage?
I looked into number 1 site again, and I wrote-Are Catholic's born again, saved? And I found that Augustine say's he knows it is not written in the bible, he said: parents can make their own decisions to have anybody, infants to be baptised, by doing this under the banner of the Catholic Church, they are born again Christians, they are taught by their works, they are saved.
It shows their teachings isn't about the bible, it's about works in the Catholic Church.
The Victor of Christ-Pope Francis had said: Quote-By Catholic Online (NEWS CONSORTIUM) 5/30/2013 (4 years ago) Catholic Online (https://www.catholic.org)
Pope Francis says atheists can do good and go to heaven too!
Pope Francis said: Jesus died and was raised for them as well. His redemptive embrace was for all, not just a chosen few. The choice to accept its reach is our own. The Holy Father was not teaching anything new.
In fact, the Pope continual's this hope that all who do not yet know God are not only capable of doing good - but will progress toward that knowledge of God by doing good - is ancient.
Well Pope Francis is teaching something new.
If sin could enter into Heaven, then holiness isn't needed, and Christ never died, and the race we started will never end. Jesus said: Many are called, but few are chosen. Obviously Jesus is not the only way into heaven, and the scriptures below don't exist, according to the Catholic's..
{2 Timothy 1:9} Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
{John 6:44} Jesus said "No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me, draw him: and I will raise him up on the last day.

brocab:
they are taught by their works, they are saved

9inches:


Answers:
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/infant-baptism

http://www.ewtn.com/v/experts/showmessage.asp?number=313917&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

Dnaz:

Did Mary Experience Prolonged birth? Pardon me did the passage did not in nyway suggest the Woman experienced prolonged birth. She was only in birth pains
2. I don't know what u r trying to get to with this? Christ was also given birth to on earth and not in heaven. So this one is hogwash
3. Third of the Stars in heaven could mean anything, it could mean a third of the hosts of Angels, it doesn't matter
4. Yes history suggests Mary and Joseph fled with Baby Jesus to Egypt, A wilderness to escape Herod
The Sun, moon and Crown of stars all signify her queenship
And John wrote the Book of Revelations in Patmos as a Very old age. So Mary was no longer on earth by this time

2 Peter 3:16
As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Revelation 17:1-6
And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great LovePeddler that sitteth upon many waters:

With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, [/b]full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a[b] golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

9inches:


Stick to one topic at a time. How old are you?

Show me where you read this.

shadeyinka:

I am amazed at you!
Peter said it


I have warned you.
If you feel you should go on justifying Idolatory, its now your business.

I won't respond to any other post after this. I pray the Holy Spirit by His mercy open your eye to note that idolatory shall not be condoned by God in the name of Mary..





I can't help but to wonder in great admiration.

Sincerely, I pray for you. I wish you will try to understand Rev17:

brocab:
Thanks bro-stick around, you will be well and truly needed here-your studying with the Catholic's, should fill in their emptiness.
Yes we all have had dealings with the Catholic's, well enough to know they hide behind the Word of God, but never ever seem to practice it, I have seen it myself, the Catholic Church is full of idolaters, bowing down, dipping their bodies or nodding their heads while entering into a Catholic Church, the Church follows their shepherd, they actually believe these statues are the true images of the heavenly realm.
The Catholic's claim to know Him, but their hearts are far from Him.
I was given two sites by 9 inches, claiming everything I need to know about Catholic's go to these two sites.
1. https://www.catholic.com/
2. http://www.ewtn.com/search.asp
Well I did, 1. https://www.catholic.com/ And the first page I opened up said this? Is Sex Okay As Long As Nobody Gets Hurt?
I looked into number 1 site again, and I wrote-Are Catholic's born again, saved? And I found that Augustine say's he knows it is not written in the bible, he said: parents can make their own decisions to have anybody, infants to be baptised, by doing this under the banner of the Catholic Church, they are born again Christians, they are taught by their works, they are saved.
It shows their teachings isn't about the bible, it's about works in the Catholic Church.
The Victor of Christ-Pope Francis had said: Quote-By Catholic Online (NEWS CONSORTIUM) 5/30/2013 (4 years ago) Catholic Online (https://www.catholic.org)
Pope Francis says atheists can do good and go to heaven too!
Pope Francis said: Jesus died and was raised for them as well. His redemptive embrace was for all, not just a chosen few. The choice to accept its reach is our own. The Holy Father was not teaching anything new.
In fact, the Pope continual's this hope that all who do not yet know God are not only capable of doing good - but will progress toward that knowledge of God by doing good - is ancient.
Well Pope Francis is teaching something new, it isn't scriptural, If sin could enter into Heaven, then holiness isn't needed, and Christ never died, and the race we started will never end. Jesus said: Many are called, but few are chosen. Obviously Jesus is not the only way into heaven, and the scriptures below don't exist..
{2 Timothy 1:9} Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began.
{John 6:44} Jesus said "No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me, draw him: and I will raise him up on the last day.

Revelation 17:1-6
And there came one of the seven angels which had the seven vials, and talked with me, saying unto me, Come hither; I will shew unto thee the judgment of the great LovePeddler that sitteth upon many waters:

With whom the kings of the earth have committed fornication, and the inhabitants of the earth have been made drunk with the wine of her fornication.

So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, [/b]full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.

And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a[b] golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

9inches:


The question was, what's the teaching behind it?

See what I did in the pic below. You can do it too; it's easy.

Answers
Here: https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/graven-images
and here: http://www.ewtn.com/v/experts/showmessage.asp?number=311119&Pg=&Pgnu=&recnu=

Exodus 25:34-
And the cherubim shall stretch out their wings above, covering the mercy seat with their wings, and they shall face one another; the faces of the cherubim shall be toward the mercy seat. You shall put the mercy seat on top of the ark, and in the ark you shall put the Testimony that I will give you. And there I will meet with you, and I will speak with you from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubim which are on the ark of the Testimony, about everything which I will give you in commandment to the children of Israel.

Dnaz:

Hahahaha Revelations 17 . lol ur misinterpretation of that chapter is Epic Using it against the Catholic Church is now stale.
That verse in Peter was actually referring to u guys and he made it Clearer

10 and especially those who indulge in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority. Bold and wilful, they are not afraid to revile the glorious ones,
2 Peter 2:10

11 whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a reviling judgment upon them before the Lord.
2 Peter 2:11
It is Evident u guyz are the ones Who despise the Authority of the Church. The pillar and bulwark of truth
And u revile the Glorious ones(Mary and the Saints)

Jude 1:9
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

shadeyinka:

Even though I shouldn't reply you BUT All the Apostles were still alive at this point, Mary was still alive.

The Glorious ones are Angels and other Spiritual Beings which even the Arch Angel Micheal would not revile Satan



I didn't comment on Rev17:1-6
I thought you will say as usual that the woman is Mary. Of course you won't...for in truth it isn't Mary but who is SHE?

I leave that you to answer!

A harlot was once chaste!

I still marvel at you!

Bye!

Dnaz:

Lol @other Spiritual beings? Who are other spiritual beings? The Apostles were alive but they were other glorious ones before them. Angels are still amongst the Saints. That's why we have St Michael and St Gabriel but of course u may still revile them
No Connection between the Harlot and Mary so what's the point bringing her into Rev 17
Also there is no Connection between The Harlot and the Catholic Church except the one u guyz made up in your heads
U marvel at me? Thank you but u have to revise ur understanding of Scriptures. It is highly messed up
The Harlot mentioned is The Pagan Roman Empire and it is fallen for centuries

brocab:
The site you have given me-https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print-edition/infant-baptism! Say's there is no doubt that the early Church practiced infant baptism.
Though passages in the New Testament contain principles supporting infant baptism. (e.g., Acts 2:38, 1 Peter 3:21), the first overt statements that the children of believing households were baptized comes from the early Church—where infant baptism was uniformly upheld and regarded as apostolic.
In fact, the only reported controversy on the subject was a third-century debate whether or not to delay baptism until the eighth day after birth, like its Old Testament equivalent, circumcision. (see quotation from Cyprian, below; compare {Lev. 12:2–3, Col 2:11–12}
{Acts 2:37-39} When the people heard this, they were cut to the heart and asked Peter and the other apostles, “Brothers, what shall we do?” Peter replied, “Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. This promise belongs to you and to your children and to all who are far off, to all whom the Lord our God will call to Himself.
Look how dangerous this actually sounds, the parents actually made an infant's decision?
(John 1:12) But to all who have received him--those who believe in his name--he has given the right to become God's children.
Do infant at the age of 8 day's old-or between a certain age even know Christ, do they actually understand the scriptures well enough to make their long life decision, and plus when do parents allow infants to make decisions for themselves?
Peter was talking to those who understood, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. "For the promise [of the Holy Spirit] is for you and your children and for all who are far away [including the Gentiles], as many as the Lord our God calls to Himself.”
This promise is given for everybody, whom God calls, not the other way around, sadly He knows not everyone are suited for His kingdom, He said many are called, but few are chosen.
{John 15} Jesus said: “You have not chosen me, I have chosen you.”
Do the Catholic's even understand the scriptures? This sounds like once born again always born again, the infant say's to himself, because my parents made my choice 8 day's after I was born, If I was to live the life I choose-break the law, steal kill and destroy, and I am still sinning then because of the decision my parents made, by their choice they gave me the keys to heaven.