“Whoever comes to me I will never cast away” (John 6:37). Jesus promised he would never cast away those who come to him, yet some people fear he might. Because Jesus is fickle and he changes his mind a lot.

Of course, that’s not true, yet some worry that it might be true, because of what he said here:

If anyone does not abide in me, he is thrown away as a branch and dries up; and they gather them, and cast them into the fire and they are burned. (John 15:6)

How do these words make you feel? Read them again, then see which of the following responses best describes your reaction:

1. “I’m in trouble. I don’t know if I’m abiding, so I’m in danger of being cast into the fire.” This is the response of the uncertain or lukewarm mind. It’s the response of someone who has not fully understood the good news of grace.

2. “These words aren’t for me because I’m a good Christian. I’m not perfect, but I’m at least better than 50% of the people reading this.” This is the response of the self-righteous. Again, it’s the response of someone who has not understood the good news of grace.

3. “I’ve got nothing to fear because God loves and he will never leave me. Since I am one with the Lord, it is impossible for him to cast me away.” This is the response of those who have been set free by the gospel and are growing in the grace and knowledge of Jesus.

If your response was an insecure (1) or a self-righteous (2), don’t worry; you’ve come to the right place.

To the self-righteous and those of you who think you are good enough for God, I have some liberating news: you are wretched, poor, blind, and naked. God’s law says so. Okay, so that wasn’t good news, but this is: Jesus gives grace to the wretched and he clothes the naked. Put off your filthy rags and put on the spotless garments of his righteousness. No one is good enough for God, but God is more than good enough for us. His best is better than your worst. His grace is greater than your self-righteousness. Believe it.

And now some good news for the insecure and anxious. In the parable of the vine and the branches (John 15:1-, Jesus talks about two kinds of people:

1) Those who abide in him
2) Those who don’t abide in him and are cast away

Question 1: Who abides in Jesus?

The believer. “Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God” (1 John 4:15).

A believer, by definition, abides in the Lord. They are not merely branches, but “branches in me” (John 15:6). Because a believer is in union with the Lord, they bear his fruit, and if they don’t, God nurtures them and lifts them up. He doesn’t cut them off.

Question 2: Who doesn’t abide and is cast away?

The unbeliever. Reject the life that Christ offers, and you will have no life in you. You will be a dead stick rather than a living branch.

This is what happened to the religious Jews who rejected Jesus. They “were broken off for their unbelief” (Rom. 11:20). Who broke them off? Not God, but themselves. “They stumbled… they sought to establish their own righteousness … they killed the prophets” (Rom. 9:32, 10:3, 11:3).

Some think that God cuts off unfruitful branches because God allegedly cut off the Jews, but “God did not reject his people” (Rom. 11:2); the Jews rejected God. And by Jews I mean the Jews as a nation rejected Jesus, while many individual Jews accepted him.

Question 3: What’s the takeaway?

Abide in the love of God.

Just as the Father has loved me, I have also loved you; abide in my love. (John 15:9)

We don’t abide to get into the love of God; we get to abide because he loves us. Notice the order in the verse above. There is a proclamation (unconditional love from God to you through Jesus) followed by an invitation (abide in that love; agree that Jesus is the Son of the God who loves us).

When you know how much God loves you, you’ll stop striving to earn his love. You will not fear that he may cut you off and cast you away. (He promised he wouldn’t.) You will be at home in his love.

Your heavenly Father loves you. There is nothing you can do to make him love you more, and nothing you can do to make him love you less.

“Abide in the vine” is both a statement of your union with Christ and an exhortation to live from the pleasant security of that union.


https://escapetoreality.org/2018/08/02/why-god-will-never-cast-you-away/

Thank you Lord Jesus

Morning

Lord Jesus

Thank you Lord

He will never leave me. Neither will he forsake me..

Many people have used that verse to say one can lose his salvation. But they are wrong.

If you can. lose your salvation, then Jesus is not a good saviour. Proponents of such notion are actually saying Jesus is like a. earthly bank where your money is not safe when you save it with them. ATM fraudster can still steal it or the bank can fold up thereby making you lose all your money. No, Jesus is not like that. Nothing he saves ever gets lost, otherwise why would I want such a person to save me when I know I could slip away again.

Nothing you ever do can make you lose your salvation. Nothing can pluck you out of God's hands.

John 10:27-

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one.

alBHAGDADI:

Many people have used that verse to say one can lose his salvation. But they are wrong.

If you can. lose your salvation, then Jesus is not a good saviour. Proponents of such notion are actually saying Jesus is like a. earthly bank where your money is not safe when you save it with them. ATM fraudster can still steal it or the bank can fold up thereby making you lose all your money. No, Jesus is not like that. Nothing he saves ever gets lost, otherwise why would I want such a person to save me when I know I could slip away again.

Nothing you ever do can make you lose your salvation. Nothing can pluck you out of God's hands.

John 10:27-

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one.

Exactly my bro.... Most believers are unaware of what really happened at the Cross. Nothing can void the salvation of a believer. All glory to God the Father and our Saviour the Lord Jesus Christ!!

Perfectbeing:
He will never leave me. Neither will he forsake me..

Amen...all glory to our Lord Jesus!!

alBHAGDADI:

Many people have used that verse to say one can lose his salvation. But they are wrong.

If you can. lose your salvation, then Jesus is not a good saviour. Proponents of such notion are actually saying Jesus is like a. earthly bank where your money is not safe when you save it with them. ATM fraudster can still steal it or the bank can fold up thereby making you lose all your money. No, Jesus is not like that. Nothing he saves ever gets lost, otherwise why would I want such a person to save me when I know I could slip away again.

Nothing you ever do can make you lose your salvation. Nothing can pluck you out of God's hands.

John 10:27-

27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:

28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

30 I and my Father are one.

John 15:1-12 disagree with your assertion sir.
Revelation 3:11 disagree sir
Revelation 2:25 also disagree sir
Hebrew 3:6, Hebrew 4:14, Hebrew 3:14, revelation 3:3 etc my brother stop deceiving yourself if you read all this passages carefully you'll know its a lie from pit hell that salvation can not be lost. If it can not be lost Jesus himself will not tell us to hold fast.
Remain blessed in his presence

rhektor:


John 15:1-12 disagree with your assertion sir.
Revelation 3:11 disagree sir
Revelation 2:25 also disagree sir
Hebrew 3:6, Hebrew 4:14, Hebrew 3:14, revelation 3:3 etc my brother stop deceiving yourself if you read all this passages carefully you'll know its a lie from pit hell that salvation can not be lost. If it can not be lost Jesus himself will not tell us to hold fast.
Remain blessed in his presence

John 15:1-12 is talking about bearing fruit, not salvation.

Revelations 3:11 is talking about crown which is a reward. It in no way speaks of losing salvation.

All the other verses you quoted don't speak of losing salvation. They only advice we hold on to our believe. Holding on to our believe makes us a better person.

Once you are saved which is as a result of believe in jesus, you have eternal life. You saying one can lose that eternal/everlasting life is the same as saying the life wasn't eternal after all. Don't you know what eternal life means?

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

If you say you can lose your salvation/eternal life, then it means you have called Jesus a liar for saying the below.

John 10:28-29
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Can you pluck yourself out of God's hands? If you can, doesn't that mean that God's hand is weak?

God forbid.

alBHAGDADI:


John 15:1-12 is talking about bearing fruit, not salvation.

Revelations 3:11 is talking about crown which is a reward. It in no way speaks of losing salvation.

All the other verses you quoted don't speak of losing salvation. They only advice we hold on to our believe. Holding on to our believe makes us a better person.

Once you are saved which is as a result of believe in jesus, you have eternal life. You saying one can lose that eternal/everlasting life is the same as saying the life wasn't eternal after all. Don't you know what eternal life means?

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

If you say you can lose your salvation/eternal life, then it means you have called Jesus a liar for saying the below.

John 10:28-29
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Can you pluck yourself out of God's hands? If you can, doesn't that mean that God's hand is weak?

God forbid.

If they don't bear fruit the Lord said they will be cut off what does cut off mean to you?
2.your actions will determine if you will remain in his hand or not stop confusing others with your illusion of once saved forever saved
Why should we hold fast if all we need is faith without work? Read James 2:22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?

Your work is your role to play nothing unclean will enter heaven you just have to STRIVE to ENTER. Your striving (struggle) is your work.
Romans 12:1&2
I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that you present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable to God, which is your reasonable service. And do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
Making sure that you present your body as a living sacrifice is your work. Not conforming to this world you think is easy as said? Bro think again

alBHAGDADI:


John 15:1-12 is talking about bearing fruit, not salvation.

Revelations 3:11 is talking about crown which is a reward. It in no way speaks of losing salvation.

All the other verses you quoted don't speak of losing salvation. They only advice we hold on to our believe. Holding on to our believe makes us a better person.

Once you are saved which is as a result of believe in jesus, you have eternal life. You saying one can lose that eternal/everlasting life is the same as saying the life wasn't eternal after all. Don't you know what eternal life means?

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

If you say you can lose your salvation/eternal life, then it means you have called Jesus a liar for saying the below.

John 10:28-29
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Can you pluck yourself out of God's hands? If you can, doesn't that mean that God's hand is weak?

God forbid.

You said all other verses does not talk about loosing salvation but admonish us to hold on to our belief. I put it to you to tell me why we need to hold on to what we believe if we can't lose it

rhektor:


You said all other verses does not talk about loosing salvation but admonish us to hold on to our belief. I put it to you to tell me why we need to hold on to what we believe if we can't lose it

Holding on to your believe makes you a better person. It makes you want to be like Jesus who was a good man. The more you hold on to your believe in Jesus, the more you want to study about him. This will all make you live according to his ways.

alBHAGDADI:


Holding on to your believe makes you a better person. It makes you want to be like Jesus who was a good man. The more you hold on to your believe in Jesus, the more you want to study about him. This will all make you live according to his ways.

What then happen if you stop holding on
Jesus said whoever lay hand on the plough and look back is not fit for the kingdom

rhektor:


What then happen if you stop holding on
Jesus said whoever lay hand on the plough and look back is not fit for the kingdom

Nothing happens other than you still make heaven. When you stop holding on, you stop doing works of salvation. That still doesn't disqualify you from heave. because your believe in Christ has justified you already. You are no different from the one who believes in Jesus but does no work. He will still make heaven because Jesus has justified him already and made him righteous.

Romans 4:5
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Holding the plough and looking back is not the same as holding the plough and not working at all. Looking back means you didn't believe in holding the plough. Not working at all means you believe in holding the plough but you don't want to work to bear fruit. In this case you are still saved.

Peace Brethren

I have followed the scriptural references of two people educating myself(a rare privilege) I must say, about grace and not working the path of Christ.

Frankly, our conceptions is alright depending on the clause behind it.

1. If I believe Gods grace is sufficient regardless of the state of my guilt though I admit that I want to be a better person, then your grace is still GRACE UNTO you. However, it is also necessary to indicate penalties where sin is committed to make us dread it. In as much as I know God is merciful, i, you or anyone will not want Father to be vexed with us for continuing in the very thing He warns against.

2. Love I know covers multitude of our sins and if we have love to share in grace we should hate what God hates. To be honest, I am sure, God does not want anyone to perish- even Brother Lucifer. This is the power of LOVE. Disclaimer: Please do not take this as an excuse to follow your bad brothers lifestyle, only thing you owe him is LOVE irrespective of who and what he is, this will make you a true follower of Christ.

It is a task to unite the world in love, holiness and righteousness, let the mind of Christ be in us. Truth is no matter how pious you are, it is filthy rag in Gods sight however it should be your prize if maintained in humility and offering to lift your brothers falling. Do not boast because of it, see it as an opportunity to lift the worst sinner whom we were before GRACE found us.

We rise by lifting others!!

I don't want to be righteous, I want to be the friend of the Creator- "I am, That I am", whatever the criteria for that, I wish He see me fit, Halleluyah, Hossana, Amen to Our Father who art in Heaven...

I love you Leader Olumba Olumba Obu

alBHAGDADI:


Nothing happens other than you still make heaven. When you stop holding on, you stop doing works of salvation. That still doesn't disqualify you from heave. because your believe in Christ has justified you already. You are no different from the one who believes in Jesus but does no work. He will still make heaven because Jesus has justified him already and made him righteous.

Romans 4:5
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Holding the plough and looking back is not the same as holding the plough and not working at all. Looking back means you didn't believe in holding the plough. Not working at all means you believe in holding the plough but you don't want to work to bear fruit. In this case you are still saved.

Bro don't twist it sir, holding the plough and looking back means to stop doing what you have started doing...........Jesus said such people are not fit for the kingdom

Branches that refuse to abide will become sticks and will be burn with fire John chapter 15
Read carefully Mr alBHAGDADI

Cc Felixomor, anas09

Lord Jesus the altogether lovely One.

rhektor:
Branches that refuse to abide will become sticks and will be burn with fire John chapter 15
Read carefully Mr alBHAGDADI

Cc Felixomor, anas09

John 15:1-12

John 15
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.
7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you.
8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.
10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.
11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.
12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

The passage is not talking about salvation but about bearing fruits in Jesus Christ. If you abide in him, you will bear fruit. If you don't abide in him, you won't bear fruit. Verse 2 makes us to understand that God can decide to put and end to your life for not bearing fruit as a believer. Verse 6 shows that when God ends your life as a result of not bearing fruit as a branch, you wither away. After you've withered away and died, men carryi out the final burial which is symbolized by burning. Please don't tell me you mistook verse 6 to mean one is thrown into hell fire. That's not what it means because it says men burn such a branch. Men don't cast man into or burn man in hell fire.

This is why we all need to bear fruit so that God won't see us as not showing the world that we are saved.

rhektor:


Bro don't twist it sir, holding the plough and looking back means to stop doing what you have started doing...........Jesus said such people are not fit for the kingdom

It is still all about bearing fruit.

rhektor:
Branches that refuse to abide will become sticks and will be burn with fire John chapter 15
Read carefully Mr alBHAGDADI

Cc Felixomor, anas09

Bro rhektor and alBHAGDADI.

Let's consider something for a while. Let's look at this;

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
Revelation:21:23

This verse says the Lord Jesus is the light lighting heaven. (The light emanates from Him 'glory'). And we know that everything which appears on earth has their source in Heaven. Our Sun receives it's power and life from the Sun in Heaven.
Now, If the Sun emanates from Christ our Lord, Lets just say Christ is the Sun.
Can the Sun turn itself away from anyone on earth? No. Where ever we go, the Sun goes with us, but can we turn ourselves away from the Sun? Yes. How?

If you decide to live like the eskimos who live in the North Pole, you'd receive no Sun, or at most minimal sun. because you've decided to shun the warmth of the Sun. But does thst mean the sun has left you? No.

It is the same with our dealings with the Lord.

The Lord does not, cannot, and will never turn himself away from Man as long as that man is alive. His life, air, rain, sunlight still gets to him. The divine grand design still works for him.
If he plant crops, they still yield fruits, if he wants kids, he can still have them. he sleeps, rest, eats and drinks in enjoyment. He enjoys sex whether with a woman or with a fellow man. Everything the followers of Christ gets as long as it's not supernatural, he gets.

BUT, what if he decides to turn away Willingly from Christ, will he be forced to stay? NO.


WE CAN LOOSE OUR SALVATION if we decide to turn away. But it is not Christ who gives us away. He'll be available, reaching us with the warmth of His Love until we die, then, it becomes too late.

The Lord says Love not the World or the things of the World. But what if a believer is caught up in this love, which is the Love to satiate Self, and gets distracted? Can this person hold Christ and hold the world at the same time? No.

Finally, i think the folks propagating this 'Once saved is always saved' gospel, are those who believe in Justification by Faith Alone. It's a Farce.

We have a RESPONSIBILITY and a part to play to keep the enemy from stealing our salvation like the Seed which fell by the way side and was eating by births. Luke 8:5

Christ calls for Continuity, if we walk away, we walk away.

The Gospel of Justification by faith alone is a farce. Faith without Works is no faith.

Anas09:

Bro rhe.ktor and alB..HAGDADI.

Let's consider something for a while. Let's look at this;

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
Revelation:21:23

This verse says the Lord Jesus is the light lighting heaven. (The light emanates from Him 'glory'). And we know that everything which appears on earth has their source in Heaven. Our Sun receives it's power and life from the Sun in Heaven.
Now, If the Sun emanates from Christ our Lord, Lets just say Christ is the Sun.
Can the Sun turn itself away from anyone on earth? No. Where ever we go, the Sun goes with us, but can we turn ourselves away from the Sun? Yes. How?

If you decide to live like the eskimos who live in the North Pole, you'd receive no Sun, or at most minimal sun. because you've decided to shun the warmth of the Sun. But does thst mean the sun has left you? No.

It is the same with our dealings with the Lord.

The Lord does not, cannot, and will never turn himself away from Man as long as that man is alive. His life, air, rain, sunlight still gets to him. The divine grand design still works for him.
If he plant crops, they still yield fruits, if he wants kids, he can still have them. he sleeps, rest, eats and drinks in enjoyment. He enjoys sex whether with a woman or with a fellow man. Everything the followers of Christ gets as long as it's not supernatural, he gets.

BUT, what if he decides to turn away Willingly from Christ, will he be forced to stay? NO.


WE CAN LOOSE OUR SALVATION if we decide to turn away. But it is not Christ who gives us away. He'll be available, reaching us with the warmth of His Love until we die, then, it becomes too late.

The Lord says Love not the World or the things of the World. But what if a believer is caught up in this love, which is the Love to satiate Self, and gets distracted? Can this person hold Christ and hold the world at the same time? No.

Finally, i think the folks propagating this 'Once saved is always saved' gospel, are those who believe in Justification by Faith Alone. It's a Farce.

We have a RESPONSIBILITY and a part to play to keep the enemy from stealing our salvation like the Seed which fell by the way side and was eating by births. Luke 8:5

I didn't read your post, but I'll respond to the bold part.

First and foremost, we can't lose our salvation because we are not the one that saved ourselves. Jesus Christ saved us and is in charge of the task of keeping us safe. Saying we will lose our salvation is the same as saying Jesus that saved us cannot keep us. Why would anyone even want to be saved by such an uncertain savior? Jesus is a perfect savior.

John 10:28-29
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Can you pluck yourself out of God's hands? If you can, doesn't that mean that God's hand is weak?

alBHAGDADI:

I didn't read your post, but I'll respond to the bold part.

First and foremost, we can't lose our salvation because we are not the one that saved ourselves. Jesus Christ saved us and is in charge of the task of keeping us safe. Saying we will lose our salvation is the same as saying Jesus that saved us cannot keep us. Why would anyone even want to be saved by such an uncertain savior? Jesus is a perfect savior.

John 10:28-29
28 And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand
29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.

Can you pluck yourself out of God's hands? If you can, doesn't that mean that God's hand is weak?

Lol. You didn't read my post how then will you get the point i tried to make? No wahala sha. I didn't yours toom

Anas09:
Christ calls for Continuity, if we walk away, we walk away.

The Gospel of Justification by faith alone is a farce. Faith without Works is no faith.

I'm always amazed at how you guys easily kick the Bible away and hold on to man-made doctrines. Here you are saying salvation by faith alone is a farce, whereas that's what the Bible says in the verse seen below.

Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Also, you say faith without works is no faith. You are wrong because that's not what the Bible says. As seen in the Bible, faith without works is dead.

James 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Yes, faith without works is dead. This still doesn't mean faith isn't in existence in such a person. It's the same thing as pointing at a dead dog and saying the dog doesn't have life. Yes, the dog is lifeless, but the body is still a dog. A man who has faith but doesn't do works is still a believer who will make heaven. His believe in Jesus alone justifies him and makes him righteous even without doing works.

Romans 4:5
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

Anas09:

Bro rhektor and alBHAGDADI.

Let's consider something for a while. Let's look at this;

And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
Revelation:21:23

This verse says the Lord Jesus is the light lighting heaven. (The light emanates from Him 'glory'). And we know that everything which appears on earth has their source in Heaven. Our Sun receives it's power and life from the Sun in Heaven.
Now, If the Sun emanates from Christ our Lord, Lets just say Christ is the Sun.
Can the Sun turn itself away from anyone on earth? No. Where ever we go, the Sun goes with us, but can we turn ourselves away from the Sun? Yes. How?

If you decide to live like the eskimos who live in the North Pole, you'd receive no Sun, or at most minimal sun. because you've decided to shun the warmth of the Sun. But does thst mean the sun has left you? No.

It is the same with our dealings with the Lord.

The Lord does not, cannot, and will never turn himself away from Man as long as that man is alive. His life, air, rain, sunlight still gets to him. The divine grand design still works for him.
If he plant crops, they still yield fruits, if he wants kids, he can still have them. he sleeps, rest, eats and drinks in enjoyment. He enjoys sex whether with a woman or with a fellow man. Everything the followers of Christ gets as long as it's not supernatural, he gets.

BUT, what if he decides to turn away Willingly from Christ, will he be forced to stay? NO.


WE CAN LOOSE OUR SALVATION if we decide to turn away. But it is not Christ who gives us away. He'll be available, reaching us with the warmth of His Love until we die, then, it becomes too late.

The Lord says Love not the World or the things of the World. But what if a believer is caught up in this love, which is the Love to satiate Self, and gets distracted? Can this person hold Christ and hold the world at the same time? No.

Finally, i think the folks propagating this 'Once saved is always saved' gospel, are those who believe in Justification by Faith Alone. It's a Farce.

We have a RESPONSIBILITY and a part to play to keep the enemy from stealing our salvation like the Seed which fell by the way side and was eating by births. Luke 8:5

Thank you very much sister for your response.
Let me add this fee points to it ma. I have not even seen a reason put the once saved forever saved as something reasonable. If God through Hosea tell us that "Ephraim has joined himself to idol let him alone" Hosea 4:17 does this mean that God cannot save Ephraim? No god can save Ephraim but Ephraim has to be available. In Isaiah he said not that I can not save but your sin is separating us. Even when God said through Isaiah that seek the Lord when you can find him call him when he is near, God is not traveling but we are the one wondering away from him. God wouldn't force anything on us else there's no need for Jesus to die on the cross

rhektor:



Thank you very much sister for your response.
Let me add this fee points to it ma. I have not even seen a reason put the once saved forever saved as something reasonable. If God through Hosea tell us that "Ephraim has joined himself to idol let him alone" Hosea 4:17 does this mean that God cannot save Ephraim? No god can save Ephraim but Ephraim has to be available. In Isaiah he said not that I can not save but your sin is separating us. Even when God said through Isaiah that seek the Lord when you can find him call him when he is near, God is not traveling but we are the one wondering away from him. God wouldn't force anything on us else there's no need for Jesus to die on the cross

Truth is that, people beliefs has a way of blocking any light of understanding that is contrary to what they believe even tho it's laid out on plain side.

rhektor:



Thank you very much sister for your response.
Let me add this fee points to it ma. I have not even seen a reason put the once saved forever saved as something reasonable. If God through Hosea tell us that "Ephraim has joined himself to idol let him alone" Hosea 4:17 does this mean that God cannot save Ephraim? No god can save Ephraim but Ephraim has to be available. In Isaiah he said not that I can not save but your sin is separating us. Even when God said through Isaiah that seek the Lord when you can find him call him when he is near, God is not traveling but we are the one wondering away from him. God wouldn't force anything on us else there's no need for Jesus to die on the cross

Your points are funny and they show how confused you are. All what you wrote above are talking about someone that has not been saved. Whereas the discussion is mainly about someone who has been saved, whether he can lose that salvation.

If someone has not been saved, then you can say his rejection of Jesus is what is keeping God from saving him. But if that person has been saved and he wanders off into sin, this doesn't mean he has lost his salvation. He can't lose his salvation because he didn't save himself. The one who saved him will ensure he returns to the fold. That's the essence of the parable of the lost coin and lost sheep which Jesus gave. He gave those parables to show that he will go look for any of his sheep that wanders off and return him to the fold.

Mathew 18:12-13
12 How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray?
13 And if so be that he find it, verily I say unto you, he rejoiceth more of that sheep, than of the ninety and nine which went not astray.

Luke15:8-9
8 Either what woman having ten pieces of silver, if she lose one piece, doth not light a candle, and sweep the house, and seek diligently till she find it?
9 And when she hath found it, she calleth her friends and her neighbours together, saying, Rejoice with me; for I have found the piece which I had lost.

That's still the same as the parable of the prodigal son who later realized his error and returned to his father's house. The parable shows that a Christian who wanders off can return on his own after realizing his mistake. If he doesn't, Jesus will go look for him like the good shepherd that he is.

You can't lose your salvation, because the one who saved you is greater than you.

alBHAGDADI:


I'm always amazed at how you guys easily kick the Bible away and hold on to man-made doctrines. Here you are saying salvation by faith alone is a farce, whereas that's what the Bible says in the verse seen below.

Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Also, you say faith without works is no faith. You are wrong because that's not what the Bible says. As seen in the Bible, faith without works is dead.

James 2:26
For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

Yes, faith without works is dead. This still doesn't mean faith isn't in existence in such a person. It's the same thing as pointing at a dead dog and saying the dog doesn't have life. Yes, the dog is lifeless, but the body is still a dog. A man who has faith but doesn't do works is still a believer who will make heaven. His believe in Jesus alone justifies him and makes him righteous even without doing works.

Romans 4:5
But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.

No one is kicking off the Bible. The issue with you is that, you are not allowing scriptures to interpret Scriptures for clarity.

Pls let's take Eph 2 : 8-9 within Context and you'd understand what Apst Paul is saying and what prompted it.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians:2:8

Here, Apst Paul is speaking in response to what has ensued previously. Which was that the non-Jewish Christians were made to feel inferior before their Jewish brethren becos they were not circumcised as the law of Moses stipulated. Paul was trying to re-assure the Gentile Christians that the Circumsission was of the heart, not the cutting of the flesh.

Christ wants us purged and clean inside not necessarily outside, so shd not be allowed to be bamboozled into believing that they had to perform some ritual before the Lord will accept them.

But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.

For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Galatians:2:11-12

At this Point, Christianity has spread and non-Jews who didn't have the Law of Moses had become part of the fold, but Pharisaic Jews (who believed that without circumcision you are not good enough to be accepted by God)had become Christians too, were boasting to the other brethren about their perfection and Holiness by keeping to the Law of Moses which basically was the cutting off of their Foreskin. we See this in what ensued between Paul and Peter in Antioch.

When the Pharisaic Jews (The circumcised) were not there, he mingled and accepted the other Christians, but when they came he separated from them, indirectly admitting that circumcision is the only way one can be accepted by God. This prompted Eph 2: 8-9 you quoted.

This in Essence means that, the Cause of your acceptance is what you must do first and foremost. But Apst Paul disproved that by telling them in Romans 3 & 4 that what Justifies a man is the Faith that that man has and puts in Christ, not by what he did.

Now compare. Rom 2: 8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

And;

Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans:3:20-3)23

All here means, all without exception and all without distinction.

He then went further to tell them that if there was a man who shd have boasted as a resulted of his fleshy activity, Abraham wld've been that man, but even him could not boast because when God met him he was steep in idol worship and uncircumcised, yet he was justified. Now, what occasioned that Justification? He believed that God was Sincere when He told him to leave everything and follow Him and will be made a Father of Many Nations.

He trusted God to keep to His words. That was the Initial Faith that saves.

But, Work comes in as Abraham, after believing takes a step futher and moved out of Mesopotamia to Canaan. From Civilization to the desert. From well constructed buildings to living in Tents.

Works came in when God told him, circumcise yourself and every male in your house and he did. Works came in as he was told, kill your son, your only son whom thou lovest, and he did. If he had refused, he wouldn't have been forced.

Justification is not automatic, if it were, everyone will be saved. Then, we wont be in a relationship with the Lord. For, He would've forced us to be with Him against our volition. But, the Lord wants a Love, Free Willing partnership. The act of reciprocity comes in. I say, you do. 'Two cannot walk together except they agreed'.


Abraham was a Sinner like everyone of us, but like everyone of us received the initial gift of salvation which was presented to him by way of instructions. "Leave Your Father's House and go to the place i will show you...".

The same process still ensues today. The message of salvation is still presented to us free of charge, but it follows with instructions which we need to Obey and act on, without which, there won't be any Justification. The Lord believe for Abraham, He did not enter into Abraham's legs and make him move to Canaan. He didn't make Abraham obey Him. Abraham did all by his volition, that is Faith and works.

Accept Jesus as your Lord and personal saviour, and take a step further by standing up openly and identifying with Him. You say a sinners prayer. You go and get baptised. You make effort to work/walk in the Word as you consciously pick it to read for yourself.


The gift of salvation is free to induct you into the Kingdom, but if you only believe in your heart but take no step towards transformation and renewing of your mind, you'd be like the Seed that fell by the way side. Your'd loose your salvation.

Anas09:

No one is kicking off the Bible. The issue with you is that, you are not allowing scriptures to interpret Scriptures for clarity.

Pls let's take Eph 2 : 8-9 within Context and you'd understand what Apst Paul is saying and what prompted it.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Ephesians:2:8

Here, Apst Paul is speaking in response to what has ensued previously. Which was that the non-Jewish Christians were made to feel inferior before their Jewish brethren becos they were not circumcised as the law of Moses stipulated. Paul was trying to re-assure the Gentile Christians that the Circumsission was of the heart, not the cutting of the flesh.

Christ wants us purged and clean inside not necessarily outside, so shd not be allowed to be bamboozled into believing that they had to perform some ritual before the Lord will accept them.

But when Peter was come to Antioch, I withstood him to the face, because he was to be blamed.

For before that certain came from James, he did eat with the Gentiles: but when they were come, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing them which were of the circumcision.
Galatians:2:11-12

At this Point, Christianity has spread and non-Jews who didn't have the Law of Moses had become part of the fold, but Pharisaic Jews (who believed that without circumcision you are not good enough to be accepted by God)had become Christians too, were boasting to the other brethren about their perfection and Holiness by keeping to the Law of Moses which basically was the cutting off of their Foreskin. we See this in what ensued between Paul and Peter in Antioch.

When the Pharisaic Jews (The circumcised) were not there, he mingled and accepted the other Christians, but when they came he separated from them, indirectly admitting that circumcision is the only way one can be accepted by God. This prompted Eph 2: 8-9 you quoted.

This in Essence means that, the Cause of your acceptance is what you must do first and foremost. But Apst Paul disproved that by telling them in Romans 3 & 4 that what Justifies a man is the Faith that that man has and puts in Christ, not by what he did.

Now compare. Rom 2: 8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.

And;

Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets

Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;
Romans:3:20-3)23

All here means, all without exception and all without distinction.

He then went further to tell them that if there was a man who shd have boasted as a resulted of his fleshy activity, Abraham wld've been that man, but even him could not boast because when God met him he was steep in idol worship and uncircumcised, yet he was justified. Now, what occasioned that Justification? He believed that God was Sincere when He told him to leave everything and follow Him and will be made a Father of Many Nations.

He trusted God to keep to His words. That was the Initial Faith that saves.

But, Work comes in as Abraham, after believing takes a step futher and moved out of Mesopotamia to Canaan. From Civilization to the desert. From well constructed buildings to living in Tents.

Works came in when God told him, circumcise yourself and every male in your house and he did. Works came in as he was told, kill your son, your only son whom thou lovest, and he did. If he had refused, he wouldn't have been forced.

Justification is not automatic, if it were, everyone will be saved. Then, we wont be in a relationship with the Lord. For, He would've forced us to be with Him against our volition. But, the Lord wants a Love, Free Willing partnership. The act of reciprocity comes in. I say, you do. 'Two cannot walk together except they agreed'.


Abraham was a Sinner like everyone of us, but like everyone of us received the initial gift of salvation which was presented to him by way of instructions. "Leave Your Father's House and go to the place i will show you...".

The same process still ensues today. The message of salvation is still presented to us free of charge, but it follows with instructions which we need to Obey and act on, without which, there won't be any Justification. The Lord believe for Abraham, He did not enter into Abraham's legs and make him move to Canaan. He didn't make Abraham obey Him. Abraham did all by his volition, that is Faith and works.

Accept Jesus as your Lord and personal saviour, and take a step further by standing up openly and identifying with Him. You say a sinners prayer. You go and get baptised. You make effort to work/walk in the Word as you consciously pick it to read for yourself.


The gift of salvation is free to induct you into the Kingdom, but if you only believe in your heart but take no step towards transformation and renewing of your mind, you'd be like the Seed that fell by the way side. Your'd loose your salvation.

You just wrote a pile load of junk (except the Bible verses). It also shows that you lack knowledge of the Bible.

The passage in Ephesians 2:8-9 isn't talking about circumcisions. How dare you say that is the context of the passage when nothing in the entire chapter talked about circumcisions? When talking about context of a verse, it is about what the previous or succeeding verses say to give clear meaning to the particular verse. You are totally wrong or dubious to have said the context of that verse is about circumcision when the entire chapter doesn't say anything like that. I guess you just wanted to get rid of the verse that shows clearly that salvation is not of works but by faith.

The funny part is that the other Bible verse and explanation you gave are actually you shooting yourself in the foot. Over and over again you kept speaking of how Paul kicked against the law which includes circumcision, yet you want us to believe that keeping the law is necessary for salvation. That's very funny.