frosbel2:



JESUS LIED


Matthew 16:28

I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming in his kingdom.

Mark 9:1

And he said to them, "I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God come with power.

Luke 9:27

I tell you the truth, some who are standing here will not taste death before they see the kingdom of God

The kingdom of God is righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost..

Jesus said... The kingdom of God is IN YOU.

The Prophecy came to pass at the day of Pentecost... at the release of the Spirit of God on men...


That's is the beginning of the kingdom of God, the beginning is the presence of the HOLY SPIRIT IN MEN....

It came with Fire like a tongue... They were alive and saw the kingdom of God.

The Everlasting Father would not have lied....

Men would rather misinterpret his words... I would rather agree to the fact that his words were misinterpreted than agree that The alpha and Omega lied.

You just called The Mighty God a liar..

I hope you are prepared for the consequences.

Originakalokalo:


The holiness of God is terrible....


It is the nature of God that doesn't tolerate nonsense...

Most times, his nature of mercy prevails...

But his holiness is dreadful...

If you, as a sinner, attacks the Holiness of God,

You are insulting his purity with your filth.


..and Death comes faster.....


He owns that breath in your nostril...


It is by his mercies than you still breathe .

Why is it that to you all atheists are rogues,liars,fornicators et Al?

Michellekabod1:

Why is it that to you all atheists are rogues,liars,fornicators et Al?

All sinners have those attributes

Atheism is the worst sin...

Atheists are worst sinners.

No sinner will stand before God.

Therefore, all atheists, regardless of their number, ARE GOING TO HELL.

Originakalokalo:


All sinners have those attributes

Atheism is the worst sin...

Atheists are worst sinners.

No sinner will stand before God.

Therefore, all atheists, regardless of their number, ARE GOING TO HELL.

You're braindead. Don't even argue. It's true.
[img]https://media1./images/7655f291aa6d72ea6465ff38dade679c/tenor.gif[/img]

XxSabrinaxX:

You're braindead. Don't even argue. It's true.
[img]https://media1./images/7655f291aa6d72ea6465ff38dade679c/tenor.gif[/img]

I won't argue... At least, there is a metre showing the activities of my brain already.


Permit me to laugh.

;

Originakalokalo:



I won't argue... At least, there is a metre showing the activities of my brain already.


Permit me to laugh.

[img]https://media1./images/151d940d16a2cccfc943b38211020dd9/tenor.gif[/img]
Excuse me, did you say "activities of your brain"? ROFLMAO
Bitch please, your skull is an empty wasteland. If i look into your eyes, i'll see straight to the back of your head.
Get a life with your dumbass

frosbel2:
All over YouTube , in blogs ( including African blogs ) , in citadels of learning , in churches and families , there is a noticeable movement , a sort of religious tremor that has shifted peoples minds from faith and fear to reason and courage. Let’s call it the modern age of reason and logic.

People are becoming more inquisitive about their faith and are appalled by the crookery and deceitfullness of church leaders. The cruelty of Christians to their own and to others has not gone unnoticed and many of us can now see the wood from the trees.

Christianity has not cured evil or saved man , in fact it has often times contributed to man’s pain. Many pray to Jesus and he does not answer , many hold onto the promises of Jesus but he does not fulfil them. Many call to Jesus but it appears he cannot hear them.

Jesus has been unable to save the marrriages of his followers ( same rate of divorce as the ‘unbeliever’ ) . Jesus has not returned hundred fold of lands ,cars , houses , brothers and sisters to all those who forsook all for him.

Many of Jesus followers are in mental institutions hearing voices but he does not heal them. Many of his followers beat themselves because of guilt and sin but Jesus does not deliver. How can he deliver when his adherents commit the most sins ?

Are your surprised why people are leaving Christianity ? Why did you leave Christianity ? Do you see yourself remaining a Christian in 2019?

All you wrote are mere assumptions hence they are false.

frosbel2:
All over YouTube , in blogs ( including African blogs ) , in citadels of learning , in churches and families , there is a noticeable movement , a sort of religious tremor that has shifted peoples minds from faith and fear to reason and courage. Let’s call it the modern age of reason and logic.

People are becoming more inquisitive about their faith and are appalled by the crookery and deceitfullness of church leaders. The cruelty of Christians to their own and to others has not gone unnoticed and many of us can now see the wood from the trees.

Christianity has not cured evil or saved man , in fact it has often times contributed to man’s pain. Many pray to Jesus and he does not answer , many hold onto the promises of Jesus but he does not fulfil them. Many call to Jesus but it appears he cannot hear them.

Jesus has been unable to save the marrriages of his followers ( same rate of divorce as the ‘unbeliever’ ) . Jesus has not returned hundred fold of lands ,cars , houses , brothers and sisters to all those who forsook all for him.

Many of Jesus followers are in mental institutions hearing voices but he does not heal them. Many of his followers beat themselves because of guilt and sin but Jesus does not deliver. How can he deliver when his adherents commit the most sins ?

Are your surprised why people are leaving Christianity ? Why did you leave Christianity ? Do you see yourself remaining a Christian in 2019?

The Christains are not worshipping the true Yahawashi Hamasciach whom they called Jesus Christ.
Christainity is witchcraft n Idolatory.
Proverbs 28: 9 He that turneth away his ear from hearing the law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

PROVERBS 1: 22 How long, ye simple ones, will ye love simplicity? and the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?

23 Turn you at my reproof: behold, I will pour out my spirit unto you, I will make known my words unto you.

24 Because I have called, and ye refused; I have stretched out my hand, and no man regarded;

25 But ye have set at nought all my counsel, and would none of my reproof:

26 I also will laugh at your calamity; I will mock when your fear cometh;

27 When your fear cometh as desolation, and your destruction cometh as a whirlwind; when distress and anguish cometh upon you.

28 Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me:

29 For that they hated knowledge, and did not choose the fear of the LORD:

30 They would none of my counsel: they despised all my reproof.

31 Therefore shall they eat of the fruit of their own way, and be filled with their own devices.

32 For the turning away of the simple shall slay them, and the prosperity of fools shall destroy them.

33 But whoso hearkeneth unto me shall dwell safely, and shall be quiet from fear of evil.

Originakalokalo:


All sinners have those attributes

Atheism is the worst sin...

Atheists are worst sinners.

No sinner will stand before God.

Therefore, all atheists, regardless of their number, ARE GOING TO HELL.

Christians nko that do those things, heaven or hell?

XxSabrinaxX:
;
[img]https://media1./images/151d940d16a2cccfc943b38211020dd9/tenor.gif[/img]
Excuse me, did you say "activities of your brain"? ROFLMAO
Bitch please, your skull is an empty wasteland. If i look into your eyes, i'll see straight to the back of your head.
Get a life with your dumbass

you know what ? it baffle me that atheists, claiming to be educated will still believed every things happened by chance. Genesis 1:1 say, in the beginning God created the heaven and earth.

the atheists will interprets it this way " in the beginning it JUST HAPPENED"
smh

Michellekabod1:

Christians nko that do those things, heaven or hell?

Christians don't do those things

Michellekabod1:

Christians nko that do those things, heaven or hell?

Anyone who does this things will go to hell on a jet.... Fast and furious.

When people observed the life of the apostles and it looked like that of Jesus... They called the apostles CHRISTIANS...

More like CHRIST LIKE, OR LIKE CHRIST.

Anyone who does those things should not be called a Christian.

The word "Christian has been abused....

Originakalokalo:



Anyone who does this things will go to hell on a jet.... Fast and furious.

When people observed the life of the apostles and it looked like that of Jesus... They called the apostles CHRISTIANS...

More like CHRIST LIKE, OR LIKE CHRIST.

Anyone who does those things should not be called a Christian.

The word "Christian has been abused....

I have not MET ONE HOLY Christian - EVER !!!

Its a scam

malvisguy212:
you know what ? it baffle me that atheists, claiming to be educated will still believed every things happened by chance. Genesis 1:1 say, in the beginning God created the heaven and earth.

the atheists will interprets it this way " in the beginning it JUST HAPPENED"
smh

Point of correction. Atheists only problem is with the lack of evidence of the claims of religious people. Thus, we "reject' religion. We don't offer alternatives for the source of the universe. We look at the more logical options because they are more likely to be true. It seems you have an issue with cosmologists and not atheists. So leave me alone

frosbel2:


I have not MET ONE HOLY Christian - EVER !!!

Its a scam

You need to change your location and where you go.

XxSabrinaxX:

Point of correction. Atheists only problem is with the lack of evidence of the claims of religious people. Thus, we "reject' religion. We don't offer alternatives for the source of the universe. We look at the more logical options because they are more likely to be true. It seems you have an issue with cosmologists and not atheists. So leave me alone

wow , atheists are 100 % sure God does not exist, even if their belief lack evidence ? am sorry, your post is the real definition of " cowardice of atheism" thank you.

malvisguy212:
wow , atheists are 100 % sure God does not exist, even if their belief lack evidence ? am sorry, your post is the real definition of " cowardice of atheism" thank you.

[img]https://media1./images/a8c6d589afe31bd35928ef60aa6755df/tenor.gif[/img]
How does lack of belief in something bestow you the burden of providing evidence? Lol. Atheists have nothing to prove. Absence of evidence is evidence of absence. What kind of dumbass logic are you working on?
If I claimed to have a flying dog in my house. Its up to me to prove my claim; and not up to you to prove that the dog doesn't exist.
Like I said, leave me alone. I'm in one of those moods today. Don't let your ignorance open your arse in this thread. I can see you have no clue how these kind of arguments work.
P.S Stop generalizing. Not all atheists are 100% sure of God's non-existence. Sure there are some. But there are also those who just find theism less illogical and full of sh!t claims that have no evidence to back them up

XxSabrinaxX:

[img]https://media1./images/a8c6d589afe31bd35928ef60aa6755df/tenor.gif[/img]
How does lack of belief in something bestow you the burden of providing evidence? Lol. Atheists have nothing to prove. Absence of evidence is evidence of absence. What kind of dumbass logic are you working on?
If I claimed to have a flying dog in my house. Its up to me to prove my claim; and not up to you to prove that the dog doesn't exist.
Like I said, leave me alone. I'm in one of those moods today. Don't let your ignorance open your arse in this thread. I can see you have no clue how these kind of arguments work.

Don't mind such hypocrites.
They call you stupid for rejecting their proposition but expect you to call them smart for rejecting yours.

XxSabrinaxX:

[img]https://media1./images/a8c6d589afe31bd35928ef60aa6755df/tenor.gif[/img]
How does lack of belief in something bestow you the burden of providing evidence? Lol. Atheists have nothing to prove. Absence of evidence is evidence of absence. What kind of dumbass logic are you working on?
If I claimed to have a flying dog in my house. Its up to me to prove my claim; and not up to you to prove that the dog doesn't exist.
Like I said, leave me alone. I'm in one of those moods today. Don't let your ignorance open your arse in this thread. I can see you have no clue how these kind of arguments work.
P.S Stop generalizing. Not all atheists are 100% sure of God's non-existence. Sure there are some. But there are also those who just find theism less illogical and full of sh!t claims that have no evidence to back them up

you did not grew as an atheist, you are once a believer, so what makes you stop believing ? if at a point in your life you stop believing, it mean you have evidence .you can't just stop believing without evidence, isn't it?

why will I prove to you that God exist ? you are the one that left ( sons of perdition ) . I am still here.

do you believed, 100% certainty that God dose not exist?

HellVictorinho:

Don't mind such hypocrites.
They call you stupid for rejecting their proposition but expect you to call them smart for rejecting yours.

Our desperate need is not for clever arguments but for a powerful encounter with the living God (1 Corinthians 4:20). And we need not more dramatic signs from heaven, but to act on what we already know. The door to spiritual understanding is not human explanation, but supernatural revelation. It swings not on mind games but on a willingness to surrender our stubborn will to One who knows better than us (John 7:17; 2 Corinthians 3:14-16; 4:3-4; 1 Corinthians 2:4-16; Luke 10:21).

Draw near to God and he will draw near to you, promises the Bible . Until we respond to the light we already have, God is unlikely to squander further enlightenment upon us. With insincere excuses we might even fool ourselves, but not the One who knows everything. We don't decide how much evidence we need: God does. Neither do we have the final say as to when God will lose patience with us.

malvisguy212:
you did not grew as an atheist, you are once a believer, so what makes you stop believing ? if at a point in your life you stop believing, it mean you have evidence .you can't just stop believing without evidence, isn't it?

[img]https://media./images/e3544b8117d3ecbb0cb8751f1ce0ff71/tenor.gif[/img]
SMDH
It isn't "evidence" that makes you stop believing. It's "lack of evidence" that makes you stop believing. Learn to read and understand. I'm serious.

malvisguy212:
why will I prove to you that God exist ? you are the one that left ( sons of perdition ) . I am still here.

Because the burden of proof is on you. You believe in the existence of an all powerful being that set the universe into motion. You don't stop there though; you also believe that the said being came down to earth as a man and sacrificed himself for man's sins to be forgiven. You believe in extra dimensions like a Heaven and a Hell. You believe there was a great flood that covered the earth at some point. You believe there was a mass exodus of Hebrew slaves from Egypt. You believe in paranormal activities and supernatural beings like angels and demons. What evidence do you have to back up these beliefs?

malvisguy212:
do you believed, 100% certainty that God dose not exist?

I don't believe that "Yahweh" exists. The truth is, even if a god exists, there is no way to determine who the true god is and which religion is correct in their beliefs.

malvisguy212:
Our desperate need is not for clever arguments but for a powerful encounter with the living God (1 Corinthians 4:20). And we need not more dramatic signs from heaven, but to act on what we already know. The door to spiritual understanding is not human explanation, but supernatural revelation. It swings not on mind games but on a willingness to surrender our stubborn will to One who knows better than us (John 7:17; 2 Corinthians 3:14-16; 4:3-4; 1 Corinthians 2:4-16; Luke 10:21).

Draw near to God and he will draw near to you, promises the Bible . Until we respond to the light we already have, God is unlikely to squander further enlightenment upon us. With insincere excuses we might even fool ourselves, but not the One who knows everything. We don't decide how much evidence we need: God does. Neither do we have the final say as to when God will lose patience with us.

What else?

Originakalokalo:

At everyone, this thread is a very cheap ploy to convince you out of your faith in Jesus...
"Many are living oooo" "Intelligent ones are living oooo" "smart ones are living now oooo"....
If posts like this make you loose your faith in Jesus,
You don't have that faith in the first place.

These people are out.... They are only looking for supporters.

This quote Made me remember Tales of Hardmirror, reading a few paragraphs, I got that perception that he was lying. He was later busted few days later in a thread that seun decided to maliciously change the topic and close the thread when no one is quarrelling on it, only demanding proof of his tales.

But the tales had already change few with little to no faith.

XxSabrinaxX:

Atheists have nothing to prove. Absence of evidence is evidence of absence. What kind of dumbass logic are you working on?

Pls dont use that line of thought again, you cannot prove to me the existence of your Great - Great - Grandpa.

Proving the Existence of God is simple but you refused to accept that God Create the Universe which is the #1 proof.

Am sure your next next action is to enter a loop of who created God? But then...
If you believed as science told you that energy cannot be created, The universe is self-existing

Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

GoodMuyis:


Pls dont use that line of thought again, you cannot prove to me the existence of your Great - Great - Grandpa.

Am sorry... this is a dumbass question. No offense.
First of all, this doesn't apply just to the existence of God, but to the existence of anything at all. You could use the same argument to someone who "denies" the existence of ghosts or dragons or unicorns too.

Now, to answer your question, there's a phrase made popular by Carl Sagan: "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence"
We have a very good idea about how humans reproduce and also the rough number of years since humans have existed. We know that human being give birth to children; and as of now we don't know any other way new human beings come to earth. So to say that I have a great great grandfather is the natural conclusion we reach. To say the I do not have a great great grandfather is the "extraordinary" claim here, and that would require extraordinary evidence than the claim that I have a great great grandfather.
Consider this example: Suppose a young girl, 4-5 years old tells you that she lives with her parents. You'd believe her because that's how girls of her age generally live. In fact, you'd disbelieve her and want more evidence if she claims the opposite, that she lives alone. Now let's say she says she has a pet dog. You'd see no reason to disbelieve her, you know it's not rare for people to have dogs. But your degree of certainty is less than that of the previous case; there's a very good chance that she doesn't have a dog too. Now, take this further and let's say she says she has a pet tiger. Now you're more skeptical, and would almost never take her word for it. But you may probably believe her if she shows you some pics of her with the tiger which seems real. Now consider an extreme case in which she says she has a pet dragon. Would you be able to believe her even if she shows you pics of her standing next to a dragon? You're gonna go ahead and say they're fake, no matter how convincing they look and even if some people testify in her favor.
So we don't demand equal standards of proof for every claim. I regard the claim that a god exists as extraordinary, there's been absolutely no proof of its existence and neither have we known other cases in which a supernatural being created a universe. The claim that my great grandfather existed, however, is a very ordinary claim and the logic that "I can't be born if he never existed" is quite enough for me to be convinced of his existence.

GoodMuyis:
Proving the Existence of God is simple but you refused to accept that God Create the Universe which is the #1 proof. Am sure your next next action is to enter a loop of who created God? But then...
If you believed as science told you that energy cannot be created, The universe is self-existing

Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

Ok, let's see...
The creation of the universe was most likely a random event. It's a possibility. I don't think someone/something designed the universe. I agree that we see order and design in the universe which might have led people to think that there is a creator. But if you consider everything to be random and all the ordered things to be a part of this randomness, I think it makes more sense.The universe seems to be built on mathematical principles. But, I think it is only a small part of the universe where order exists such that we can observe these patterns. Mathematics is the study of patterns. And we are very good at identifying patterns.
If you think God created the universe, then yes, you should wonder who created God and this would be a never ending cycle. So, why not look at it from a different perspective. Let's think that the universe came from nothingness. No need to think of a creator. I mean if you think God created himself and then created the universe, why not remove God from the picture and think that the universe came from nothing all by itself using the same logic as “ God created himself or God was always present”. Also, if you look at the structure of the universe from the smallest scale, it is made up of particles and their anti particles. For example, electron and positron. Experimentally, it has been found that when electron and positron combine, they cancel out each other and release energy. So, if you look at this process in the reverse manner, Nothing + Energy = Positron + Electron. Hence ,I think the universe was created from nothing and there is no need for God in this process.
Another possibility is this, which I posted to another thread:

It starts with entropy, that is, the apparently iron-clad rule that says that the universe goes from order to disorder in a thermodynamic sort of way; from hotter to colder, from dense to less dense. Until the idea of Big Bang arrived on the scene, it seems that nobody was really thinking about entropy very clearly, because if they had, the old idea of an eternally extant cosmos would have pointed them directly towards a starting point of some sort.
That’s because if the universe were infinitely large and old, then an infinity ago it would have reached maximum entropy and there would have been nothing ordered in the universe; in fact, with infinity to deal with, there never would have been. No stars, no galaxies, no planets, no life, no ordered anything of any kind.
But with Big Bang, we had to consider it. Here’s a line of thought: if the universe is less ordered today, then it was more ordered yesterday, and more the day before that, and even more the day before that. So if you follow that inevitable line of logic, the further back in time you look, the more ordered the universe gets, until you reach the moments right after the Big Bang and realize that the universe had to arrive in the highest state of order, of thermodynamic equilibrium that it would ever be in. Which is to say that it had to be almost the same temperature, the same density everywhere at the beginning, and then gradually, as it expanded and cooled, we would find greater temperature and density variations until we get to the present day.
So then the question to be asked is the one that you asked - where did all the order come from? The first part of the answer is that almost perfect order arrived with the universe, possibly as a result of what they call the Inflationary Epoch when the universe expanded exponentially rapidly, spreading the heat and density evenly throughout a suddenly cosmos-sized cosmos.
So now we have almost perfect order, so the question is, how do we get from there to here? Simply put, we went from order to chaos, and from chaos to order. Scientist call it “clumping” - the universe, as it cooled, clumped into more chaos universally, but more order locally. That tiny variation in temperature and density allowed the universe to separate the cool spots from the hot spots. The cool spots got cooler, and matter clumped there more easily. Gravity kicked in and clumped the matter into gas clouds, and hence clumped into stars and galaxies. Stars produced most of the naturally occurring elements in star life and death, planets clumped out of the iron produced in stars and were clumped into solar systems by gravity around other stars.
Somehow, the elements clumped into life, and then into complex life. We don’t know how, though we have ideas, though without much evidence yet.
What caused all of this clumping to happen? The 4+1 fundamental forces of nature - gravity, strong and weak forces, electromagnetism, plus quantum mechanics - propelled everything into clumps and ultimately into ordered clumps. It was a 13.8B year process of clumping as entropy in the the universe combined with the laws of nature took almost zero entropy to a much higher level of entropy universally, but complex order locally. Order produced chaos, and is still doing so, but chaos produced clumps, with physics organized into ordered structure.
The final question then is, how finely tuned do the laws of physics have to be in order for this to have happened? The odds are 10 to the 10 to the 30th against an ordered universe, and 10 to the 10 to the 123rd against a universe with life. There is no way that the universe produced order, structure, life and ultimately complex life by random chance.

XxSabrinaxX:

Am sorry... this is a dumbass question. No offense.

The essence of your response is that I should take the proof of the existence your Great - Great - Grandpa on the basis of you explanation and that you are not a genetically engineered robot.
If You are a robot you will be able to lied to me that you had Great - Great - Grandpa. just because that is the norm which i already knew, but I need evidence, not an explanation - simple.


You second Paragraph is a self-centred write-up and scientific fallacies.
a=> I never said God created himself, it is your assumption, not mine.
b=> Saying Universe came from nothing is even worse than having Faith or Believed that God exists, such claim can't be verified, which make it an exit.

1=> It is unscientific for noting to come out of nothing (even a handful of air contain particles, even the most clean Hydrogen gas contained matters)
2=> From Nothing + Energy = Positron + Electron and replace Nothing with God and see how the Generally accepted Newton's third law comes to play

Bleep=> if the universe can come from noting (noting being self-existing) then there is the equal possibility that God is self-existing as well

GoodMuyis:


The essence of your response is that I should take the proof of the existence your Great - Great - Grandpa on the basis of you explanation and that you are not a genetically engineered robot.
If You are a robot you will be able to lied to me that you had Great - Great - Grandpa. just because that is the norm which i already knew, but I need evidence, not an explanation - simple.

This is a yet another dumbass response to my post.
My DNA is peppered with coding given to me by countless individuals. My own existence -- while not sufficient for you -- refutes any need to prove that my grandfather existed. I exist, ergo he existed.
I know what you're trying to say: "See, no proof exists, yet you still believe in your grandfather." and while that may work for your puerile argument, it doesn't really hold up because:
* You're mixing issues that really don't demonstrate what you're trying to say.
* You're begging, simply BEGGING, for a "gotcha" moment rather than really engaging in helpful dialogue on the matter. That's desperation and a sign of someone who is deeply insecure of his/her own beliefs. I think we're on the verge of having a new atheist join our ranks (it's how I behaved before leaving religion behind).
ONE: Proving my grandfather exists is not in the same league as proving that a deity exists. I know -- precisely because of my existence, numerous documents of service and immigration and not too few pictures -- that my great-great-great grandfather existed. Before him, I still have my DNA and my own existence as proof.

Saying that this also works to prove that "god exists" may work for you and I'm fine with that. I'd never come into your home or life and say otherwise. But it doesn't pass the logic test because for the past 500 years we've steadily removed god and spirits and demons from every causality in life.

* The Sun moving through the sky was once a god (or the hand of god) doing so.
* Diseases were caused by demons.
* Earthquakes were caused by god's anger.
* Droughts and hurricanes were punishment for man's sins.

But in the past hundred years, we've expanded our knowledge and demonstrated that -- unequivocally -- none of those previous statements are true.

Fearful of being pushed aside even further, theists have attempted to play logical games with proof and evidence. Instead of following this path down the logical course (i.e. "all positive assertions require positive facts" ) , we're now being asked to prove a negative.

Well, it doesn't work like that. You cannot simply point to existence and say that proves god exists. All that existence proves (and our current scientific understanding notwithstanding proves) that we exist, our universe has existed for 14 billion years and at some point in time we came into existence out of an infinitely dense singularity. God could've done it. Aliens could've done it. Or NOBODY could've done it. We don't know definitively.
You have proof of MY existence and the history of parents making babies (all over the world), the numerous documented examples of men inserting their joysticks into millions of vaginae and those millions of women giving birth as empirical, visual and experiential evidence that humans procreate and make babies. Based on our understanding of genetics and the very real experience of human copulation followed by a birth 9 months later, we can deduce LOGICALLY that this has gone on for eons. We have, in many cases, 4 or 5 generations of humans living at the same time as proof. We do NOT know with absolute certainty that we are right. Everything before today could have been an elaborate simulation, programmed into our brains in intricate detail, so detailed that we BELIEVE it existed. Even the sensations we experienced before today and all the history of humanity could have been programmed into us to be indistinguishable from reality.

But . . . we do NOT know with absolutely certainty. What we have is REASONABLE evidence and sound speculation. We exist, it's likely we've existed; based on what we know about existing and procreation, this has gone on for many many thousands of years. Our grandparents, therefore, existed as well.

Conversely, we have NO example of any deity sticking his penis in a black hole and squirting a universe into it. We have no observations of a deity ever visiting us and saying, "Yep, I pumped that cosmos into that black hole." We have no experience WHATSOEVER of any deity. No evidence. No testable theories. Nothing. Without witnessing any cosmic creation, no visual or testable evidence of a god, all we're left with is . . . nothing.

All we have is theists saying, "Well, YES! Hallelujah! I know God is real because you cannot prove that he isn't." Sure. You're allowed to believe that. Nobody's going to go into your home and tell you not to. But don't come into a forum where your logic can be questioned and then ask childish, leading questions that are illogical and unbelievably immature.

TWO: You're attempting to attain by rhetoric and entrapment what you'll never get. Your question is so dishonest and full of hubris and then, like a true solipsist, you're spinning it that WE'RE wrong because you lack the integrity to truly grow and learn from the comments given.

If you have an honest quest for information, then ask for it. But these questions are intentionally designed to entrap and to solicit answers that support your world view. They are designed dishonestly.

Re: "If you can't prove it you really don't have any business denying the existence of something like God."

Says who? You? Wow! Talk about hubris. You've completely missed the boat on logic and now want everybody else to join you there.

GoodMuyis:


You second Paragraph is a self-centred write-up and scientific fallacies.
a=> I never said God created himself, it is your assumption, not mine.
b=> Saying Universe came from nothing is even worse than having Faith or Believed that God exists, such claim can't be verified, which make it an exit.

1=> It is unscientific for noting to come out of nothing (even a handful of air contain particles, even the most clean Hydrogen gas contained matters)
2=> From Nothing + Energy = Positron + Electron and replace Nothing with God and see how the Generally accepted Newton's third law comes to play

Bleep=> if the universe can come from noting (noting being self-existing) then there is the equal possibility that God is self-existing as well

First of all, I made it clear that even I don't believe these things 100%. They are just possibilities and alternatives to the origin of the universe that are more logical.
I know it makes you christians butthurt and salty but its the truth - Atheists have NOTHING to prove. It sucks, I know. But that's what you christians get for making grand claims of not only the existence of a god, but his teachings, doctrines and all the other bs christianity is comprised of.
You said there is equal possibility that God is self existing as well. I never denied that. I have one question though:
Which God?
PS Something can come from nothing. "Nothing" as a concept is unstable i.e it can change.

XxSabrinaxX:


You're wrong but I'm not going to argue as am really lazy for dat now. But I have just one question:
Which God?

He is referring to the one described as a river which sources life.

XxSabrinaxX:

First of all, I made it clear that even I don't believe these things 100%. They are just possibilities and alternatives to the origin of the universe that are more logical.
[s]I know it makes you christians butthurt and salty but its the truth - Atheists have NOTHING to prove. It sucks, I know. But that's what you christians get for making grand claims of not only the existence of a god, but his teachings, doctrines and all the other bs christianity is comprised of.
You said there is equal possibility that God is self existing as well. I never denied that. I have one question though:
Which God?[/s]
PS Something can come from nothing. "Nothing" as a concept is unstable i.e it can change.

I don't really like TL;DR stuff when it starts with ad-homen. It's my fault that I push you out off your limit

Simply say you don't have further evidence other than your explanation which can be a theory. You could have shown me the picture of the subject or something to convince me. Mind you Explanation is not evidence.
The Fact now is that you lack evidence to show that your GGP exist, this makes Absence of evidence is evidence of absence invalid statement. Atheist like you holds the same stand as I do on this.

From the part that quote am not asking you to prove God non-existence me. The question still remains the same
Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

The last Paragraph of your comment read (but that is impossible as you have no proof and it is against any scientific rule)

PS Something can come from nothing. "Nothing" as a concept is unstable i.e it can change.

If Noting is variable, I have filler entity which I called God, but your explanation still makes the position void.
Mathematically you are wrong, N+N !=S, rather N+N=N² Or N+N=N

So far I made my question rhetoric for you to think the way you wanted me to think, think out of the box. If you want me to think out of the God Concept, You also think out of the Nothing Concept.

Here is my proposition again
X => if the universe can come from noting (noting being self-existing) then there is the equal possibility that God is self-existing as well
Then Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

GoodMuyis:


I don't really like TL;DR stuff when it starts with ad-homen. It's my fault that I push you out off your limit

Simply say you don't have further evidence other than your explanation which can be a theory. You could have shown me the picture of the subject or something to convince me. Mind you Explanation is not evidence.
The Fact now is that you lack evidence to show that your GGP exist, this makes Absence of evidence is evidence of absence invalid statement. Atheist like you holds the same stand as I do on this.

From the part that quote am not asking you to prove God non-existence me. The question still remains the same
Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

The last Paragraph of your comment read (but that is impossible as you have no proof and it is against any scientific rule)


If Noting is variable, I have filler entity which I called God, but your explanation still makes the position void.
Mathematically you are wrong, N+N !=S, rather N+N=N² Or N+N=N

So far I made my question rhetoric for you to think the way you wanted me to think, think out of the box. If you want me to think out of the God Concept, You also think out of the Nothing Concept.

Here is my proposition again
X => if the universe can come from noting (noting being self-existing) then there is the equal possibility that God is self-existing as well
Then Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

Pushed me out of my limit? Lmao!! You christians sure love to flatter yourselves.

1. Nothing is inherently unstable. Quantum mechanics requires that if we have a pure vacuum with no particles in it, particle pairs poof into existence constantly then VERY rapidly recombine and annihilate one another before the energy required for them to exist can be missed. That way, they never have to pay back that energy deficit.

Now, what if nothing was everything there was? How could that become everything we see today. I mean, we're talking about a lot of particle, anti-particle pairs to get a Big Bang, and somehow we have to end up with that yielding more positive matter than antimatter. Why the disparity is not clear. It's one of the most active pursuits in Astrophysics today and there is a Noble prize or several of them out there for the lucky scientists who figure it out. What we can say with reasonable confidence is that if you total up all the stuff in the Observable Universe today, the matter, dark matter, energy, dark energy, and gravity, the sum is Zero. So nothing and everything are just two sides of the same coin.

We humans are not well equipped to think about nothing. Evolution as hunter gatherers on the African savannas led us to a "common sense" that believes strongly in cause and effect. You could say we are cause and effect machines, living computers designed to find "or invent" the cause of each effect that catches our attention. For early humanity sharing that savanna with some truly awe inspiring predators, assigning a cause to effects was a matter of survival. The humans who heard a rustling sound in the tall savanna grass and thought to themselves, "Lion, I better run." lived on to pass on their genes to a succeeding generation. The kind who thought, "It's probably nothing, or just the wind." were often right. But on the sad occasion when they were wrong and it was a hunting lion, they lost the ability to pass on their genes. So we ended up with brains that assume there is a cause for every effect.
There was no way on the Serengeti that we could have known about processes that are entirely stochastic, such as the decay of a radioactive isotope. We can't even see that happen today unless we are privy to some very sophisticated and expensive technology to assist us in "seeing". But today those who are scientifically literate generally have heard of one or more effects that appear to have no direct cause. There is a probability distribution that tells when the event is most likely to occur, but there is no direct cause. It just happens when it's ready. Nothing triggers it.
But even if we know all that, we still are stuck with brains determined to find a cause for every observed effect that we find interesting. Even the most primitive of humans appear to have believed in animism. They thought there was supernatural, spiritual force flowing through everything, animate or inanimate. So from the dawn of time forward, we've been inventing a supernatural prime mover to explain what causes all those things we cannot sufficiently explain with our own knowledge of how the world works. If the mountain explodes in a volcanic eruption, the supernatural prime mover (AKA god) did it. When asked what caused god, we tend to try to define that problem away.

Long story short, because you probably won't be able to follow up with the long one , We live in a universe where everything that comes into being must have a cause, except god. That is, of course, a special pleading fallacy

2. LMAO!! Didn't I just agree with you that its possible for God to be self existing? I don't think you even read my responses. You just jump to reply to them because of your dogma and intolerance to opposing views.
I asked you before and I'll ask you again: I've agreed that god can be self existing, so the question now is..... which god is it? Is it Allah? Yahweh? Buddha? Zeus perhaps?
Don't dodge this question o! I saw how you subtly cancelled it out of my previous post , dumbass.

GoodMuyis:


I don't really like TL;DR stuff when it starts with ad-homen. It's my fault that I push you out off your limit

Simply say you don't have further evidence other than your explanation which can be a theory. You could have shown me the picture of the subject or something to convince me. Mind you Explanation is not evidence.
The Fact now is that you lack evidence to show that your GGP exist, this makes Absence of evidence is evidence of absence invalid statement. Atheist like you holds the same stand as I do on this.

From the part that quote am not asking you to prove God non-existence me. The question still remains the same
Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

The last Paragraph of your comment read (but that is impossible as you have no proof and it is against any scientific rule)


If Noting is variable, I have filler entity which I called God, but your explanation still makes the position void.
Mathematically you are wrong, N+N !=S, rather N+N=N² Or N+N=N

So far I made my question rhetoric for you to think the way you wanted me to think, think out of the box. If you want me to think out of the God Concept, You also think out of the Nothing Concept.

Here is my proposition again
X => if the universe can come from noting (noting being self-existing) then there is the equal possibility that God is self-existing as well
Then Why is it difficult for you to believe God himself is self-existing and cannot be created

I believe you already know the response you'll get to this, enjoy the show.

sonofthunder:

I believe you already know the response you'll get to this, enjoy the show.

conjecture