so, today I was having a conversation with some of my friends and one of us who is a theist made a statement “well I believe in god because at the end of the day if there is a god I would be save but if there is none, then I have nothing to lose.”
Then immediately I remembered about the Pascal's Wager. Now I think many theists just believe in god just in case there is a god at the end of the day so they would have nothing to lose. But I am sorry the actual truth is if you use the pascal wager you have a lot to lose
(1) The most prominent argument is that you tend to believe only ONE god exists. Now let’s look at it, there are many more religions and there would be many more gods! To rule Over these other religions. And there have also been more gods that do no longer exists. Now if you believe "your god" is the "right god" that will be very funny of you, what if there is a god at the end of the day and you chose the wrong one, you’re no better than an atheist who does not even believe in any and at the end of the day you end up in the same destination which the “right god” has set for people who don’t believe in him.
(2) countless number of people believe that there is an afterlife, a life where when you have left the earth you dine with your god. And most of these gods tend to make you believe that once you suffer here on earth you will enjoy in the afterlife. So, most people choose to suffer on earth so they can enjoy in the afterlife *tragic*
(3) thirdly, if you think there is a god, you will lose a lot of things. You lose the only ONE chance you had to live under the sun on this planet to enjoy yourself and think for yourself. Meaning You lived the one and only life you had, based upon a lie. If a Muslim, for instance, is wrong, he has lost all for instance their entire belief system, and most especially their morals.

hakeem4:
so, today I was having a conversation with some of my friends and one of us who is a theist made a statement “well I believe in god because at the end of the day if there is a god I would be save but if there is none, then I have nothing to lose.”
.

Betting against the Pascal's Wager is the most stupid thing a rational man could do.

It is like:
A strange pot is found in the middle of the road and an inscription/ label beside it saying; "Keep hands off...Deadly Snake Within! ..."Obedience is rewarded with 100kg of gold!"

Now a crowd begins to garther. And some say, "poisonous snake in inside" while others say "it could be a prank!"

1. What happens if you believe a snake is inside and you obey? Reward 100kg of Gold become yours!
2. What happens if you are NOT convinced a snake is inside BUT you obey? Reward 100kg of Gold become yours!

NOW WHAT IF

1. What happens if you are NOT convinced a snake is inside AND you Put your hand in the Pot?
a. If you are correct! Reward Applause from Strangers
b. If you are wrong! Painful Death become yours

Now, the truth of the matter is that
I. No one saw any snake
ii. No one saw the writer of the note
iii. No Evidence what so ever that it isn't a prank

Why would any intelligent person wage his most precious possession (his life) for something of ZERO value?

I believe you understand why some people would rather want everyone to join them in putting their hands in the pot. Then, it would seem like a collective error rather than a proof of shallow and immature reasoning of one person.

shadeyinka:

Betting against the Pascal's Wager is the most stupid thing a rational man could do.

It is like:
A strange pot is found in the middle of the road and an inscription/ label beside it saying; "Keep hands off...Deadly Snake Within! ..."Obedience is rewarded with 100kg of gold!"

Now a crowd begins to garther. And some say, "poisonous snake in inside" while others say "it could be a prank!"

1. What happens if you believe a snake is inside and you obey? Reward 100kg of Gold become yours!
2. What happens if you are NOT convinced a snake is inside BUT you obey? Reward 100kg of Gold become yours!

NOW WHAT IF

1. What happens if you are NOT convinced a snake is inside AND you Put your hand in the Pot?
a. If you are correct! Reward Applause from Strangers
b. If you are wrong! Painful Death become yours

Now, the truth of the matter is that
I. No one saw any snake
ii. No one saw the writer of the note
iii. No Evidence what so ever that it isn't a prank

Why would any intelligent person wage his most precious possession (his life) for something of ZERO value?

I believe you understand why some people would rather want everyone to join them in putting their hands in the pot. Then, it would seem like a collective error rather than a proof of shallow and immature reasoning of one person.

Wrong and dishonest analogy.

In the appropriate analogy, it's not just one pot in the middle of the road. In the real sense, it is more like 500 pots are on the road. And each of them says "100kg of gold in here. Stick your hand in here and be rewarded. All other pots contain poisonous snakes". Then there are people who have never actually stuck their hands in any pot telling u to pick their favorite pot or risk being bitten by a snake. And some of those people actually have the same favorite pot but can't agree of the best way to stick a hand in it.

So it is understandable that some people just ignore the pots and their mad advocates and continue on their way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GScdUIYXglA

NPComplete:


Wrong and dishonest analogy.

In the appropriate analogy, it's not just one pot in the middle of the road. In the real sense, it is more like 500 pots are on the road. And each of them says "100kg of gold in here. Stick your hand in here and be rewarded. All other pots contain poisonous snakes". Then there are people who have never actually stuck their hands in any pot telling u to pick their favorite pot or risk being bitten by a snake. And some of those people actually have the same favorite pot but can't agree of the best way to stick a hand in it.

So it is understandable that some people just ignore the pots and their mad advocates and continue on their way.

If I am not mistaking, I do not know any other God/gods who promise eternal damnation to humans for failing to obey and reverence Him other than the God of the Jews, Christians and Muslims.

Although an argument for another day, these three groups believe in ONE God (and sometimes they claim they are one and the same)

If you know any other God's who promise Hell fire for violating exclusive obeisance, let me know please!

Atheists do not ignore the pot. They actually dare to put their hands in it.

shadeyinka:

If I am not mistaking, I do not know any other God/gods who promise eternal damnation to humans for failing to obey and reverence Him other than the God of the Jews, Christians and Muslims.

Although an argument for another day, these three groups believe in ONE God (and sometimes they claim they are one and the same)

If you know any other God's who promise Hell fire for violating exclusive obeisance, let me know please!

Atheists do not ignore the pot. They actually dare to put their hands in it.

First, those 3 are not one and the same because they will burn u for different reasons.

Secondly, some other religions also advocate some form of punitive measure like reincarnation to something less than human and all.

Thirdly, u forget that even the Abrahamic religions u talked about have different sects under them who all claim to have revelation from the one true god and claim that the other sects are as good as roasted in eternal furnace.

So you were saying......?

NPComplete:


First, those 3 are not one and the same because they will burn u for different reasons.

Secondly, some other religions also advocate some form of punitive measure like reincarnation to something less than human and all.

Thirdly, u forget that even the Abrahamic religions u talked about have different sects under them who all claim to have revelation from the one true god and claim that the other sects are as good as roasted in eternal furnace.

So you were saying......?

I was expecting you to give me names such as Ordin, Vishnu, Ogun, Amadioha etc.
All you have re-echoed that your problem is with the God of Abraham and no one else.

BTW reincarnation isn't a purnishment of not serving a particular God!

shadeyinka:

I was expecting you to give me names such as Ordin, Vishnu, Ogun, Amadioha etc.
All you have re-echoed that your problem is with the God of Abraham and no one else.

BTW reincarnation isn't a purnishment of not serving a particular God!

It is a punishment for not following a particular precept. You are just hairsplitting. My analogy is far more accurate than yours however you choose to look at it.

NPComplete:


It is a punishment for not following a particular precept. You are just hairsplitting. My analogy is far more accurate than yours however you choose to look at it.

NPComplete:


Wrong and dishonest analogy.

In the appropriate analogy, it's not just one pot in the middle of the road. In the real sense, it is more like 500 pots are on the road. And each of them says "100kg of gold in here. Stick your hand in here and be rewarded. All other pots contain poisonous snakes". Then there are people who have never actually stuck their hands in any pot telling u to pick their favorite pot or risk being bitten by a snake. And some of those people actually have the same favorite pot but can't agree of the best way to stick a hand in it[/b].

So it is understandable that some people just ignore the pots and their mad advocates and continue on their way.

I just gave a rebutal of the bolded.

Just 5 other names of these gods would do!

shadeyinka:


I just gave a rebutal of the bolded.

Just 5 other names of these gods would do!

Nah. If we count the number of christian sects that do not agree with each other alone. That is probably up to that number. Before we even start adding the Muslim and Jewish ones. Before we start adding the non-christian karma-based religions.

You know u have lost the narrative when your argument is now based on the number of useless religions there is. Lol

NPComplete:


Nah. If we count the number of christian sects that do not agree with each other alone. That is probably up to that number. Before we even start adding the Muslim and Jewish ones. Before we start adding the non-christian karma-based religions.

You know u have lost the narrative when your argument is now based on the number of useless religions there is. Lol

You don't have the forgiest idea.
There is no sect or denomination in heaven or hell.

It would have been sufficient for you to establish the 500 pots of death.

So you see, ONE POT on the road!
May be the difference is how the viewers (theists) are treating the pot. Some bow down 5 times a day to the pot while some says "the pot is actually three concentric pots while others even vow that "the snake in the pot spoke to them in their dream"...LOL

But at least, they were ultimately wise in their decision of not putting their hands in the pot.

It's you I am sorry for. If at the end of the day You die only to discover that you exist in a non physical reality. Your wisdom and bravery would indeed be apparent!

shadeyinka:

If I am not mistaking, I do not know any other God/gods who promise eternal damnation to humans for failing to obey and reverence Him other than the God of the Jews, Christians and Muslims.

Although an argument for another day, these three groups believe in ONE God (and sometimes they claim they are one and the same)

If you know any other God's who promise Hell fire for violating exclusive obeisance, let me know please!

Atheists do not ignore the pot. They actually dare to put their hands in it.

Totally speechless,u just took dishonesty to another level just to prove u are right,ur fellow Christians would view this as blasphemy

Hermes019:

Totally speechless,u just took dishonesty to another level just to prove u are right,ur fellow Christians would view this as blasphemy

Hear yourself speak falsehood!
Do the three religions not claim " the God of Abraham?"
Are the three religions not Monotheistic?

Think before you write

shadeyinka:

You don't have the forgiest idea.
There is no sect or denomination in heaven or hell.

It would have been sufficient for you to establish the 500 pots of death.

So you see, ONE POT on the road!
May be the difference is how the viewers (theists) are treating the pot. Some bow down 5 times a day to the pot while some says "the pot is actually three concentric pots while others even vow that "the snake in the pot spoke to them in their dream"...LOL

But at least, they were ultimately wise in their decision of not putting their hands in the pot.

It's you I am sorry for. If at the end of the day You die only to discover that you exist in a non physical reality. Your wisdom and bravery would indeed be apparent!

Your analogy does not rightly paint the picture of what the Op said,apparently here are some religions that have a concept of hell,or at least some kind of suffering in the after life
1)Ancient Egypt religion
2)Ancient Greek religion
3)African religions like Haida mythology and Swahili mythology
4)Aztec religion
5)Christianity
6)Buddhism
7)Hinduism
Inuit religion
9)Islam
10)Jainism
11)Judaism
12)Mayan religion
13)Sikhism
14)Zoroastrianism

Now these are the few I know of,I believe there are others,they have different paths to a blissful after life so you can not be saved if you follow the wrong path/religion
So your analogy should Look like this as NP suggested

There are at least 14 pots on the road and each of them says "100kg of gold stick your hand and be rewarded,all others contain poisonous snakes",and you have a group of people besides EACH pot who have never stuck their hads in any pot but claim that theirs is the right pot,worse still some of them disagree on how to stick your hand in the pot to get the reward

This is a better representation,sorry your probability of getting saved is 1/14

To add to that,what if
The universe has a creator who his himself from humanity as a test and would give only atheists eternal bliss since they passed the test,but would send religionists to eternal damnation for serving false gods

So let's add that,ur probability is 1/15


P.S. In reality we know that in Christianity (your pot) and some others religions, believing in God is not the ticket to eternal life,a lot of things besides believing in God are involved ,your bible specifically says that it is not all who cry father father that would inherit the kingdom of God,which reiterates my point,in your analogy we should add that too
getting the 100kg gold doesn't end at picking the right pot,it is in fact the first,in the pot you would find a map that would guide u as u go in search of the gold(a journey which u may fail)

shadeyinka:

Hear yourself speak falsehood!
Do the three religions not claim " the God of Abraham?"
Are the three religions not Monotheistic?

Think before you write

You should open a thread on this if you can and do well to tag me alongside some outspoken christians in this forum
To answer you questions
Yes the three religions claim "the God of Abraham"
Yes the three claim to be monotheistic
Now let me ask you mine,since you claim that the God represented in all thee religions are the same,give a yes or no answer if you can
1) Does God have a son?
2)Which book is inspired by God,the bible,koran or tanakh ?
3)Does God allow polygamous marriages?
4)Is Mohammed God's prophet?
5)Does God give people the inspiration to speak in tongues?
6)Does God request for Baptism ?

Hermes019:

Your analogy analody does not rightly paint the picture of what the Op said,apparently here are some religions that have a concept of hell,or at least some kind of suffering in the after life
1)Ancient Egypt religion
2)Ancient Greek religion
3)African religions like Haida mythology and Swahili mythology
4)Aztec religion
5)Christianity
6)Buddhism
7)Hinduism
Inuit religion
9)Islam
10)Jainism
11)Judaism
12)Mayan religion
13)Sikhism
14)Zoroastrianism

Now these are the few I know of,I believe there are others,they have different paths to a blissful after life so you can not be saved if you follow the wrong path/religion
So your analogy should Luke this as NP suggested

There are at least 14 pots on the roads and each of them says "100kg of gold stick your hand and be rewarded,all others contain poisonous snakes",and you have a group of people besides EACH pot who have never stuck their hads in any pot but claim that theirs is the right pot,worse still some of them disagree on how to stick your hand in the pot to get the reward

This is a better representation,sorry your probability of getting saved is 1/14

To add to that,what if
The universe has a creator who his himself from humanity as a test and would give only atheists eternal bliss since they passed the test,but would send religionists to eternal damnation for serving false gods

So let's add that,ur probability is 1/15


P.S. In reality we know that in Christianity (your pot) and some others religions, believing in God is not the ticket to eternal life,a lot of things besides believing in God are involved ,your bible specifically says that it is not all who cry father father that would inherit the kingdom of God,which reiterates my point,in your analogy we should add that too
getting the 100kg gold doesn't end at picking the right pot,it is in fact the first,in the pot you would find a map that would guide u as u go in search of the gold(a journey which u may fail)

So happy I am that someone is speaking intelligently about this.

Unfortunately, even though some religion prescribe torment for some humans after their death, it is always for the SIN of WICKEDNESS
And not the SIN of not following a Particular God or Religion . I wish you can prove me wrong on this.

Only the God of Abraham demands an exclusive Obeisance as far as I know!

If you have a contrary opinion, I wish to learn.
Thanks

Hermes019:

Your analogy analody does not rightly paint the picture of what the Op said,apparently here are some religions that have a concept of hell,or at least some kind of suffering in the after life
1)Ancient Egypt religion
2)Ancient Greek religion
3)African religions like Haida mythology and Swahili mythology
4)Aztec religion
5)Christianity
6)Buddhism
7)Hinduism
Inuit religion
9)Islam
10)Jainism
11)Judaism
12)Mayan religion
13)Sikhism
14)Zoroastrianism

Now these are the few I know of,I believe there are others,they have different paths to a blissful after life so you can not be saved if you follow the wrong path/religion
So your analogy should Luke this as NP suggested

There are at least 14 pots on the roads and each of them says "100kg of gold stick your hand and be rewarded,all others contain poisonous snakes",and you have a group of people besides EACH pot who have never stuck their hads in any pot but claim that theirs is the right pot,worse still some of them disagree on how to stick your hand in the pot to get the reward

This is a better representation,sorry your probability of getting saved is 1/14

To add to that,what if
The universe has a creator who his himself from humanity as a test and would give only atheists eternal bliss since they passed the test,but would send religionists to eternal damnation for serving false gods

So let's add that,ur probability is 1/15


P.S. In reality we know that in Christianity (your pot) and some others religions, believing in God is not the ticket to eternal life,a lot of things besides believing in God are involved ,your bible specifically says that it is not all who cry father father that would inherit the kingdom of God,which reiterates my point,in your analogy we should add that too
getting the 100kg gold doesn't end at picking the right pot,it is in fact the first,in the pot you would find a map that would guide u as u go in search of the gold(a journey which u may fail)

So happy I am that someone is speaking intelligently about this.

Unfortunately, even though some religion prescribe torment for some humans after their death, it is always for the SIN of WICKEDNESS
And not the SIN of not following a Particular God or Religion . I wish you can prove me wrong on this.

Only the God of Abraham demands an exclusive Obeisance as far as I know!

If you have a contrary opinion, I wish to learn.
Thanks
Like you said,

"Not all who say to me Lord, Lord
BUT
Those who do the WILL of My Father"

My Friend,
It still bore down to acknowledgement of God as God and Obedience to His will.

Very similar to taking the Author of the Script Seriously and taking heed to his instructions about the Pot

shadeyinka:

So happy I am that someone is speaking intelligently about this.

Unfortunately, even though some religion prescribe torment for some humans after their death, it is always for the SIN of WICKEDNESS
And not the SIN of not following a Particular God or Religion . I wish you can prove me wrong on this.

Only the God of Abraham demands an exclusive Obeisance as far as I know!

If you have a contrary opinion, I wish to learn.
Thanks

I don't want to dwell much on that,but u should note that "the sin of wickedness" is not a consensus, for instance it is a sin in Hinduism to kill a cow much less eating it,I don't think christians agree on that,I have more important issues to point out so let's move on

As I pointed out in the end of my post,giving that certain religions require more than just believing in their God to get eternal bliss,I think it is not well portrayed in ur analogy,rather it than just getting the gold by simply opening the pot(I.e believing in God),it should be the first step to getting the gold,maybe inside the pot is a map that would lead you to getting the gold if you overcome many other obstacles you would find on your way

Is Pascal's Wager still reasonable

Hermes019:

You should open a thread on this if you can and do well to tag me alongside some outspoken christians in this forum
To answer you questions
Yes the three religions claim "the God of Abraham"
Yes the three claim to be monotheistic
Now let me ask you mine,since you claim that the God represented in all thee religions are the same,give a yes or no answer if you can
1) Does God have a son?
2)Which book is inspired by God,the bible,koran or tanakh ?
3)Does God allow polygamous marriages?
4)Is Mohammed God's prophet?
5)Does God give people the inspiration to speak in tongues?
6)Does God request for Baptism ?

Did I tell you they are the same?
1. What I told you is that "the three religions worship ONE God" as in Monotheistic
2. The three religions point to the God of Abraham as their God

Please refer back to my earlier post.

shadeyinka:

If I am not mistaking, I do not know any other God/gods who promise eternal damnation to humans for failing to obey and reverence Him other than the God of the Jews, Christians and Muslims.

Although an argument for another day, these three groups believe in ONE God (and sometimes they claim they are one and the same)

If you know any other God's who promise Hell fire for violating exclusive obeisance, let me know please!

Atheists do not ignore the pot. They actually dare to put their hands in it.

Mark the words in italics!

shadeyinka:

So happy I am that someone is speaking intelligently about this.

Unfortunately, even though some religion prescribe torment for some humans after their death, it is always for the SIN of WICKEDNESS
And not the SIN of not following a Particular God or Religion . I wish you can prove me wrong on this.

Only the God of Abraham demands an exclusive Obeisance as far as I know!

If you have a contrary opinion, I wish to learn.
Thanks
Like you said,

"Not all who say to me Lord, Lord
BUT
Those who do the WILL of My Father"

My Friend,
It still bore down to acknowledgement of God as God and Obedience to His will.

Very similar to taking the Author of the Script Seriously and taking heed to his instructions about the Pot

I think at this point I have to ask this,which God are you referring to ?

Yahweh,Allah,Krishna, Ahura Mazda,Zeus,A deistic God ,a Pantheistic God,or one not mentioned ?

shadeyinka:

Did I tell you they are the same?
1. What I told you is that "the three religions worship ONE God" as in Monotheistic
2. The three religions point to the God of Abraham as their God

Please refer back to my earlier post.
Mark the words in italics!

One question to settle this

Do you believe that a Muslim can go to the heaven portrayed in Christianity ?

Hermes019:

I don't want to dwell much on that,but u should note that "the sin of wickedness" is not a consensus, for instance it is a sin in Hinduism to kill a cow much less eating it,I don't think christians agree on that,I have more important issues to point out so let's move on

As I pointed out in the end of my post,giving that certain religions require more than just believing in their God to get eternal bliss,I think it is not well portrayed in ur analogy,rather it than just getting the gold by simply opening the pot(I.e believing in God),it should be the first step to getting the gold,maybe inside the pot is a map that would lead you to getting the gold if you overcome many other obstacles you would find on your way

Is Pascal's Wager still reasonable

I think I know a little of Hinduism to disagree with you.
No one goes to hell because of the "sin" of Killing "mother cow"! The worst that can happen is that you reincarnate back to the Earth as a lower animal.

On your second paragraph, I need you to know that the two essential ingredients is
1. Aknowedgement of the Personality behind the warning of the "pot" even though there is no evidence for him other than the writing
2. Taking the words seriously because of the attendant consequence if violated.

HOWEVER,
Personally, the Pascal's Wager is Just a purely Rational way of looking at the Abrahamic religions AND is NOT a means of Justification for Faith in God.The Pascal's Wager is FEAR oriented, this is not the way of the Spirit.

Faith itself is a Produce of Relationship fueled by a desire to Know God!

Hermes019:

I think at this point I have to ask this,which God are you referring to ?

Yahweh,Allah,Krishna, Ahura Mazda,Zeus,A deistic God ,a Pantheistic God,or one not mentioned ?

I refer to the God of Abraham.

For this discussion, it is sufficient!

Hermes019:

One question to settle this

Do you believe that a Muslim can go to the heaven portrayed in Christianity ?

What I personally believe has no bases for the analysis of the Pascal's Wager as it affects athiesm or theism.
At least a Muslim still takes the words of warning seriously and he wouldn't deliberately dare putting his hands in the pot
Unlike YOU!

You have concluded that
1. No personality penned the warning
2. You are willing to DARE putting your hands in the POT
3. For you believe there is NO consequence

Now, the Pascal's Wager is about the Consequence of You being Wrong versus the Reward you get if you were eventually right

I think I know a little of Hinduism to disagree with you.
No one goes to hell because of the "sin" of Killing "mother cow"! The worst that can happen is that you reincarnate back to the Earth as a lower animal.

whether one goes to hell or returns back as a lower animal,the most important thing is that there is punishment given to those who disobey,and the rules are not he same,what is acceptable in one religion is unacceptable in another

On your second paragraph, I need you to know that the two essential ingredients is
1. Aknowedgement of the Personality behind the warning of the "pot" even though there is no evidence for him other than the writing
2. Taking the words seriously because of the attendant consequence if violated.

The one I provided is a lot better than this,urs would be accurate if simply believing in God would fetch one eternal life,but sadly it is not good enough,the road to eternal life does not end in simply believing in God,so ur analogy didn't solve that problem

HOWEVER,
Personally, the Pascal's Wager is Just a purely Rational way of looking at the Abrahamic religions AND is NOT a means of Justification for Faith in God.The Pascal's Wager is FEAR oriented, this is not the way of the Spirit.

Faith itself is a Produce of Relationship fueled by a desire to Know God!

You should have said this the first time,instead you took the stance that the Paschals Wager was reasonable and u even derided people who don't uphold it,now u see there are a lot of problems with it and u are retreating
Everyone knows that a christian who only believes in God simply because of the Paschals Wager wouldn't be going to heaven,but that is not the issue,we are trying to expose the weakness of that philosophy,only those who align with it should argue against
So take ur stance !

shadeyinka:

I refer to the God of Abraham.

For this discussion, it is sufficient!

Does the God of Abraham have a holy book?,if yes please could you tell me the name

shadeyinka:


What I personally believe has no bases for the analysis of the Pascal's Wager as it affects athiesm or theism.
At least a Muslim still takes the words of warning seriously and he wouldn't deliberately dare putting his hands in the pot
Unlike YOU!

You have concluded that
1. No personality penned the warning
2. You are willing to DARE putting your hands in the POT
3. For you believe there is NO consequence

Now, the Pascal's Wager is about the Consequence of You being Wrong versus the Reward you get if you were eventually right

alright,it seems you are scared to give me your answer,don't worry I understand your plight,your are damned if you do,you are damned if you don't

Hermes019:

Does the God of Abraham have a holy book?,if yes please could you tell me the name

The God of Abraham DOES not have a Book!

The Bible if you want to know is Simply a "Chronicle" of Man's experience of God put down for posterity to Learn and Grow in Knowledge, Love, Character and Faith. The Bible is just a Chronicle of God's interventions in the affairs of men and Man's experiences and response to God's principles and will.

As per does God have a Book? No!

The Muslims however will dissagree with me in the sense that they claim that the Quran is a book that had existed in Heaven even before Prophet Mohammed was born

Hermes019:
alright,it seems you are scared to give me your answer,don't worry I understand your plight,your are damned if you do,you are damned if you don't

Your tactics don't move me one bit.
Don't digress from the main issue "the Pascal's Wager".

On another thread if you want me to answer that I will joyfully. If you have the time to go through my earlier posts on other threads you can also know my stand.

Hermes019:

whether one goes to hell or returns back as a lower animal,the most important thing is that there is punishment given to those who disobey,and the rules are not he same,what is acceptable in one religion is unacceptable in another

The one I provided is a lot better than this,urs would be accurate if simply believing in God would fetch one eternal life,but sadly it is not good enough,the road to eternal life does not end in simply believing in God,so ur analogy didn't solve that problem

You should have said this the first time,instead you took the stance that the Paschals Wager was reasonable and u even derided people who don't uphold it,now u see there are a lot of problems with it and u are retreating
Everyone knows that a christian who only believes in God simply because of the Paschals Wager wouldn't be going to heaven,but that is not the issue,we are trying to expose the weakness of that philosophy,only those who align with it should argue against
So take ur stance !

The Pascals Wager isn't just about punishment for dissobedience it is about RISK to REWARD ratio. It is JUST Mathematics. The Pascal's Wager if you understand is gives you a scenario of fighting a Battle you cannot Win. There is a similar saying in the Casino "You can't beat the House"!
The Pascal's Wager is perfectly Reasonable!


Pascal's Wager isn't a spiritual view of the Christian Religion and Heaven.
If I had started quoting scriptures wouldn't you have laughed me to scorn?

However for you Atheists, the Pascal's Wager is a Purely Rational and Logical means of looking at your choices with respect to spiritual things.And for me it's a good place to start with you atheists.

From this end you must start before you even try to comprehend spiritual things.

shadeyinka:

The God of Abraham DOES not have a Book!

The Bible if you want to know is Simply a "Chronicle" of Man's experience of God put down for posterity to Learn and Grow in Knowledge, Love, Character and Faith. The Bible is just a Chronicle of God's interventions in the affairs of men and Man's experiences and response to God's principles and will.

As per does God have a Book? No!

The Muslims however will dissagree with me in the sense that they claim that the Quran is a book that had existed in Heaven even before Prophet Mohammed was born

I should rephrase my question and be more direct,since u choose to be tactful

Does "the abrahamic God" have a book which he inspired ?

shadeyinka:

The Pascals Wager isn't just about punishment for dissobedience it is about RISK to REWARD ratio. It is JUST Mathematics. The Pascal's Wager if you understand is gives you a scenario of fighting a Battle you cannot Win. There is a similar saying in the Casino "You can't beat the House"!
The Pascal's Wager is perfectly Reasonable!


Pascal's Wager isn't a spiritual view of the Christian Religion and Heaven.
If I had started quoting scriptures wouldn't you have laughed me to scorn?

However for you Atheists, the Pascal's Wager is a Purely Rational and Logical means of looking at your choices with respect to spiritual things.And for me it's a good place to start with you atheists.

From this end you must start before you even try to comprehend spiritual things.

The Paschals Wager would have been reasonable if
1)Only One God is worshipped by humans
2) God would reward people who simply believe in him,and doesn't mind if their purpose is insincere(as in the case of the Wager,believing not because of faith or trust,but because you feel u have nothing to lose)

Apparently none of this holds true,there are many religions which have punishments in the afterlife for people who didn't follow their path as dictated by their belief system(so acknowledging God is not enough),some like Buddhism don't even need you to involve God,so it is not just about believing in God, which do you believe in ?,and I do not want to concur that an omniscient God would grant someone eternal bliss knowing that the individual believed in him for insincere reasons.

Sorry bro,Paschals Wager is not working for me