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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Business / How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) (51497 Views)
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Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by ChristianNorth: 8:56pm On Mar 02, 2020 |
Go and meet the legal department. You have to transfer the right to the designs to them before you will be paid. It is a simple matter now. It is dangerous to pay for IP without a contract transferring the right to the appropriate party. In fact, we advise clients not to make those kind mistakes and a lot of people have been fired because of those silly mistakes. 6 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by AngryIgboMan: 8:58pm On Mar 02, 2020 |
Nairaland these days have turned to a playground for people without thinking or reasoning faculty. Sorry to say these but the average Nigerian still thinks like a stone age beast. Even though the complainant made very clear his reasons for not using the legal route, some airheads still think they are smart and can force there opinions on others. All same, I will assist the OP by giving an illustration I gave on another thread. Pyrrhic victory is a victory or success that comes at the expense of great losses or costs. In business, examples of such a victory could include winning a lengthy and expensive lawsuit that at the end of the day, it wouldn't have made sense to head to the courts. The expression alludes to King Pyrrhus of Epicurus, who, after defeating the Romans in battle, reportedly said: "If we win another such battle against the Romans, we will be completely lost." He reportedly lost 16,000 of his 17,000 best officers and warlords. In life, there are things you just allow to slide no matter how painful it is. It doesn't make sense to win a battle and loose a war. I believe that the complainant is trying to make first bank see reasons on why this should not get dirty. Infact if this gets sorted out in a "clean" manner, he may still get another contract from them which will be a win win for everybody. Please lets be guided. My personal opinion though. 7 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by pesty100(m): 9:37pm On Mar 02, 2020 |
AngryIgboMan:nobody here is advising the op to embark on a legal tussle, most of us on the other side; we are simply saying the op should at least meet with the legal department and hear what they have to say. The logo was designed for the whole of First Bank and not the rude lady in question. The way I see it the legal department can enter, break and approve contract on behalf of the bank as a whole, OP GO AND SEE WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY IN THE LEGAL DEPARTMENT. Now if they now say that we are not paying you for bla bla reasons then we will all know that the people at first bank are terrible people till then this is not the best way to sort out this issue. 6 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by selfemployed(m): 7:57am On Mar 03, 2020 |
Why is this advert still running? Op should go and see legal department with his lawyer |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by xtremecr8: 8:20am On Mar 03, 2020 |
AngryIgboMan:God bless you sir. The attempt to reduce it to "go see the legal " says much about how long injustice committed against small brands has been permitted and taken as normal. The legal angle was an afterthought and clearly ought to be before the logo was used if it wasn't an attempt to intimidate us. We are small but not unreasonable. This is a pattern to intimidate and we will not be intimidated. They won't do this to international brands they spend billions to get same services available locally. Did they refer CNN to their legal unit to pay CNN when they used our designed logo on their ads that ran on international media? We don't have business with their legal unit after they used our design. Once they had used our design and schemed that paying for about 100 ipad covers they ordered us to print would fool us as the compensation, referring to legal was just to dig in more delays and technicality so we won't be paid. We have equally refused to sign any confidentiality form they are imposing on their vendors in the wake of our demand that we get paid. Small brands are seriously been humiliated and killed by these Nigerian big brands and we need the support of everyone including government to put a stop to it before they kill our creative industry completely. If Mrs Folake Ani-Mumuney had requested us to see legal before our design for their 125th Anniversary logo was used, we would gladly do so. Referring us to legal unit while they are using our design and not paying us is how they want to kill us. We deserve our pay and won't stop begging well meaning Nigerians to prevail on big brand First bank not to kill us. 2 Likes
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Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by pesty100(m): 8:39am On Mar 03, 2020 |
xtremecr8:even though this might look like reducing this issue to: "go and see legal", the fact here is that the only option you have now that might probably led to you receiving your money is to go and see the legal Dept first. 3 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by gboyetade: 9:03am On Mar 03, 2020 |
I actually don't know why they are afraid of seeing the legal team. Are they ghost or what? See them, listen to them, don't commit yourself but just tell them you will get back to them so you can consult and plan. pesty100: 8 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by gboyetade: 9:05am On Mar 03, 2020 |
Too much talk. See the legal team. Do you know if that is how they work. If you are not sure, then get your lawyer to meet the legal team on your behalf. xtremecr8: 2 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by IceColdVeins(m): 9:12am On Mar 03, 2020 |
See let me explain how bank-vendor payment relationship works |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by xtremecr8: 9:51am On Mar 03, 2020 |
IceColdVeins:I sincerely don't think we have a challenge in that area and that is not the issue sir. The issue is that we are not paid for a logo we designed for their 125th Anniversary logo and it has been used and is being used. Many small brands have suffered this same experience from these big brands and has to stop. We have received so many messages from more people with this similar problem but too scared to speak up and we just chose to speak up. We have been at this for months on this issue. How are we expected to pay our own bills? Why use our logo for months and not pay us? Is that done anywhere in this world? What manner of country watch and allow the talents from its citizens be brazenly stolen and the thief goes away? We have seen their paid hands attempt to shift the issue away from main issue sir. We know it won't be easy like we have been forewarned. We will maintain our ground that the moment they started using our logo, they become liable.We won't stop until we are paid and the system punish people like the FBN officials who infringed on our IP and stood against us getting paid for our Labour. The national assembly will eventually wade into this issue in order to probe this issue of how big brands treat small indigenous brands. 2 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by losprince(m): 11:31am On Mar 03, 2020 |
xtremecr8: You're being really obtuse about this. You may think you are in the right (maybe morally) but legally FBN has the upper hand here. If they directed you to their legal department then the wise thing to do as a businessman is to see their legal department. It's that simple. This your nairaland activism isn't going to help you or your brand and frankly, people will soon start to see you as a nuisance. 8 Likes 2 Shares |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by xtremecr8: 11:49am On Mar 03, 2020 |
losprince:Thank you sir. We are morally and legally right to demand payment for our hardwork. It's morally wrong and illegal to use people's intellectual property and still grandstand. Our campaign will go on to ensure other small brands learn from our experience and ensure First Bank pays. We will meet with their accounts and top management if they eventually realise how bad they have behaved by using our work and not paying us. They have used it and still using it yet has not paid us a dime. It is where we are as a nation of people who don't encourage others to do the RIGHT thing. We are not scared of speaking up. You used our IP First Bank,pay us. Others who have had similar experience, please speak up and join our campaign to stop the ill treatment of small brands by big brands.
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Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by tee10: 5:55pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
xtremecr8: Allow me to give you free legal advice. Nairaland will not help you get a kobo from first bank at best it will only get you publicity and sympathy If you are thinking someone high up in first bank will see this thread and “order” that you be paid immediately, then I most say with due respect that you are naive and ignorant, corporations don’t work that way there are operational procedures and controls that must be compiled with. My advice: The best lawyers anywhere in the world will tell you go seat down with the legal team and discuss. Go seat down with the legal team and hear them out, do not sign any documents just yet! Even if First bank is to pay you today, it will start with a phone call and a meeting , nobody will just credit your account! 12 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by Ikjosh04: 8:43pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
Xtremecr8 you came here to seek advice and opinions on the best way to get paid for the service you rendered to FBN and I've gone through the thread and lots of advice has been given out. If by now you don't know you need to meet with FBN legal team to know why you are yet to be paid then I'm forced to conclude you're here on nairaland constituting nuisance. I'm in no way supporting FBN ( I dislike that bank) but you need to leave emotions out of it and follow instructions. 13 Likes 1 Share |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by xtremecr8: 9:18pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
Ikjosh04:At the bolded,Really? We actually came here to let people know about our horrible experience, encourage them to speak up so we can exchange notes, solicit the help of well meaning men and women of conscience in this land to help us beg first bank to pay us for designing their 125th Year anniversary. Thank you for your advice sir. We actually don't hate first bank. Our objective is already yielding results and there will soon be more small brands speaking up. We won't rest until men and women of conscience in this land wade in. We won't meet with their legal unit because we no longer trust the judgement of Mrs Folake Ani-Mumuney who referred our request for payment to the legal unit after the ploy to fool us with a job to print about 100 ipad covers failed.We have course to reasonably suspect that the legal unit works hand in glove with her since they didn't see qualms in the corporate infringement and advice her against such decision she led the bank into. They seem to all be profiting actively from such a system that robs small brands of their sweat and labour by going ahead to use the logo without paying us and still want to breathe down our necks. We should actually be demanding an apology From them as well as our due payment. We will meet with a higher authority that may include the top management but not that unit. Our goals for this campaign is clearly not against the bank but these powerful clique of decision making people behind this that made a big brand like FBN to a point it wants to kill a small brand like us. Our campaign is a noble one in the face of God and man. We laboured and invested a lot to design their 125th Anniversary logo, we have not been paid a dime for it. We are grateful to God and those helping us so far to make reason prevail as we are already making some little progress. We are grateful to you all. 2 Likes
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Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SmartyPants(m): 9:37pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
kokomaster3d: A verbal contract is still valid, and there is an abundance of evidence as to the existence of business relations. Of course, the matter is admissible before the Courts. 1 Like |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SmartyPants(m): 9:39pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
xtremecr8: Meet the legal unit and hear from them. Whatever they say can be used against them. 1 Like |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by tee10: 9:59pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
SmartyPants: I don’t think he wants our advice, his motives are different. I’m certain of one thing this thrend will a achieve next too nothing other than noice 7 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by tee10: 10:07pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
xtremecr8: This is the wrong way to handle commercial dispute. But I’m certain you wouldn’t listen Your motivation here is “ disgrace and ruin First banks reputation” I have news for you, you can’t Succeed. Learn from the failed World largest outdoor billboard project in Abuja, like you the man ran campaigns and paid blogs and journalists to force the hand of government, guess what his campaign hasn’t achieved anything! https://www.premiumtimesng.com/news/headlines/323900-how-fct-minister-agencies-frustrated-installation-of-worlds-biggest-billboard-in-abuja.html I suspect you a student, because I don’t expect a serious businessman to resort to activism as a means to resolve commercial disputes You and your company will lose respect and sympathy if you continue on this wrong path and no serious brand will do business with you As regards First bank I hope you haven’t burnt the bridge for future collaboration Like I said earlier, you aren’t here for advice so I don’t expect to you listen 8 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SmartyPants(m): 10:07pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
tee10: Quote the right person please. |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by commodore007: 10:10pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
All these legal team meeting is story..once you meet them they would re-schedule another meeting till the matter dies down...it's a slow down tactics....most big brands use this system to push small brands into a tight corner....there by making them to loose steam....#xtreme cr8 remember your story must be heard# 3 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by overboard(m): 10:26pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
FAM, FAM, ever the amazon. I reserve my comment. |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by kokomaster3d: 10:36pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
SmartyPants: Unless they admit. But for big company like FBN anything verbal doesn't hold water. |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SmartyPants(m): 10:57pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
kokomaster3d: They cannot deny it. There is abundant correspondence. I don't know why you hold this conviction that the size of the company is relevant but let me advise you that actually, a Court will be more inclined to uphold the terms of an unwritten contract in favor of the party with lesser bargaining power. If you don't know law, dont give legal opinions. 2 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by kokomaster3d: 11:26pm On Mar 03, 2020 |
SmartyPants: How do you know there is abundant correspondence? The OP only showed 1 email from the woman and you believed that as a lawyer. The court will only uphold unwritten contract if the party is an unstructured business like akara seller, shoe shinner, etc. But for a legal entity no - irrespective of financial power. The OP is just ranting here in order to attract public sympathy and hoping someone somewhere will plead with FBN to pay him, without following procedure. 1 Like |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SmartyPants(m): 12:00am On Mar 04, 2020 |
kokomaster3d: Please I don't like to argue. Help yourself: "Many who negotiate commercial contracts often assume that they are not bound unless and until the agreement is reduced to writing and signed by the parties. However, the courts in England are not at all reluctant to find that binding contracts have been made despite the lack of a final writing and signature. Indeed, as we have previously noted, even in the narrow area where written and signed contracts are required (for example pursuant to the Statute of Frauds requirement that contracts for the sale of land must be in writing), the courts can find the requisite writing and signature in an exchange of emails As for oral contracts, a recent informative example is presented by the case of Rowena Williams (as executor of William Batters) v Gregory Jones (25 February 2014) reported on Lawtel reference LTL 7/3/2014 document number AC0140753. There the executor of the estate of a deceased minority shareholder brought suit to enforce an agreement by the decedent to sell his shareholding to the majority shareholder. The Judge held that an oral agreement for such a transaction was complete and binding despite the intent of the parties that their agreement should be recorded in a formal written document that they were to sign. Since the parties had not evidenced the clear intention that their oral agreement should be ‘subject to contract,’ a formal signature on a written contract was not required." https://www.pillsburylaw.com/images/content/7/1/v2/716/Alert20140313LitigationEnglishContractLaw.pdf |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by yomalex(m): 12:08am On Mar 04, 2020 |
If you have money pay for billboard around their corporate HQ Abi 1 Like |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by maik99(m): 12:36am On Mar 04, 2020 |
SocialJustice: 10-15k for a SAN? The legal profession is suffering so much disdain These days |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by xtremecr8: 1:09am On Mar 04, 2020 |
commodore007:God bless you Sir! You really understand their game and we wish we knew better than we now know. Even to pay the benefits of one of their departed employee has been reminders upon reminder that gathers dust like the bureaucracy of an inefficient public service and the poor widow is in so much financial difficulty. This is their unit charged with the responsibility to attend to the family of those workers who served First bank diligently and had passed on let alone we that they see as if they are even doing a favour by riding roughshod on us. To reclaim her husband's benefits,the poor old widow has been on it for years yet they will keep posting her, is it now us they already dealt with they won't fly us a kite to go visit legal as if the legal was not there when the bank infringed on our IP. Is it not the legal unit that should give it's approval to use of an IP to ensure that there is clear evidence that there is a legitimate right to use the logo? It's so sad how First Bank got to this unenviable state. We will not rest until justice is served. They treated us badly but we will keep our protest within the breadth of decency to protect the legacy of those founders of the bank who toiled to build the brand some of their current people now want to destroy.
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Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SocialJustice: 8:14am On Mar 04, 2020 |
xtremecr8, what's really going on here? You don't have money to do the legally right thing but you have money to be on front page back to back. It is contradictory. You're talking about intellectual property, is that not an issue for the legal department. I think you made a mistake in trying to get this job and omitted signing a non disclosure. Simply get a lawyer to send a Cease and Desist/Demand Notice as you're not interested in visiting their legal department. For how long can you continue running this expensive campaign? When you eventually run out of money to run it, won't you relax even without receiving payment. It is also sad that at this point you don't even sound like you've actually met a lawyer to discuss this legal issue. I really pray you don't learn the hard way. 3 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by Chikebrain: 8:27am On Mar 04, 2020 |
I'd advise you go see and hear out what the legal team has to say to "fulfil all righteousness". If it's not as regards your payment, then you can leave the meeting. Seek out a lawyer who handles cases like this. Using media as a tool to paint yourselves as not having money for legal battle yet paying for this advert on NL which isnt cheap doesn't help matter. Do the right thing, see their legal team. Every day is a lesson. Subsequently, draft our a contract before you commence work and spell out all your terms and condition 2 Likes |
Re: How First Bank Did not pay us for designing 125th Year Logo(read FBN's reply) by SocialJustice: 8:30am On Mar 04, 2020 |
maik99:Cost of an ordinary letter? How much should they charge? Lawyers make their money through consulting and court appearance and the lowest a SAN charges per appearance is about N4m. |
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