@Blackteeth

I used to have nightmares of devil worshippers coming to offer me for sacrifice.

When I was told stories of evil eyes, night-runners or when some Vampire series on starting coming on TV, my nightmares changed too. To include these vile creatures.

But they just kept coming, after I pray, like you, the night got better. but later that night or another day, I would get other nightmares.

To be very honest, when I become an atheist I stopped having nightmares, immediately.

Dreams are purely in the mind. That's why we dream about what we fear, what we like or simply what we know. you need to tame our mind. You do it through prayer. Others do it by realizing they are just dreaming.

Does sacrifice brings about positive change e.g. brings rain, brings good will, fight disease?
If your answer is no,
why do you believe in story of Jesus of Nazareth? It is a story of human sacrifice to save humans from sins.
Sins that we committed.
Did Jesus of Nazareth wash our sins with his blood?
Discuss,

It is very easy to conclude this argument, we just need agree on a few rules.
@Deep Sight
What do you need to be told be convinced that God does not exist. Say 10 things that you think will prove to you that God does not exist examples and illustrations will be appreciated.
If you want, I can easily give you 10 things I would demand of any God before I believe they exist. It will be very easy to do. So you start,

Posted by: frosbel
Insert Quote
^^

Why do you keep repeating the same thing over and over again Huh

In communist Russia, where Atheism reigned, 5% of the elite still controlled the wealth of the state while the other 95% suffered in poverty.

This is inequality at it's peak !!

IF religion is a Ak-47, Facism and dictatorship is a Mi-6
Both are dangerous and bad.

If I tell you beer is bad, and you say spirits are worse. who said spirits are good? and does beer become good because spirits are also bad?

[img]http://freethoughtkampala.files./2011/09/sophisticatedreligion.jpg[/img]

@Deep Sight
of course your experience is really meaningful for you and it did happen. And you felt it and it was true. And only you truly knows. You know why, because you are God. and you are Jesus.

@deep sight
what about your inaccurate dreams, kindly also post those.

[img]http://floroy1942.files./2010/02/behead-those-who-say-islam-is-violent.jpg[/img]

@noetic16 you should like a child trapped and falling with your own shoe lace that you are tying to impress the girls.
Maybe it will help if you actually read what you are writing ( preview) and see if it makes sense to you before hitting the reply (click once, then wait) button.

explain this verse then. quoted above.

this is does not come as a surprise. Christians lie. Pastors lie.

@noetic16
maybe you have not heard of Bertrand Russell, Ayn Rand,
or even more relevant , Carl Sagan
Just google Carl Sagan. That's is a nice start.

1. "when your primary concern should be His ontology." By discussing his ontology you are already assuming his exists. This is a fundamental flaw in your argument.

2 "Plausibility of the material world having a super-intelligent creator"
Onus is on both sides, that I agree, but you also need to talk a walk further into this intellectual path. Let me contextualize it

I say Santa exists and you say no.
What happens next?
A. I will provide evidence he exists e.g. gifts during christmas, my mother says he exists etc
B. you on the other hand, will disprove *my* claims. e.g. gifts are from your parents not Santa, mothers lie sometimes etc

The Onus is on both of us. But We are in point A. at the moment.

3. Forget many Gods. None Exists.


I think we all need to agree on terms of engagement. If we are to use English words like ESOTERIC then we must agree what definition we will use. Otherwise, if you create your own meanings for words you can say anything you like.

Why we atheist do not follow RD as you do Jesus is simple.

1. If RD was caught doing something that is clearly immoral, we will join you in shunning the person. But The God Delusion will still be an important book.
2. If Isaac Newton was a devote Christian, gravity is still, well gravity.
3. In other words, we celebrate and honor the person, but what is important is the work. itself. It less important who discovered something but important that is was discovered and that it works. And whatever is discovered stands to be challenged.
4. The bible, a book is a collection of anecdotes/or memes. unlike bible reader, atheists are not compelled to agree with everything the book says, they can pick what anecdotes make sense and discard others. Because books are not written by Gods but my humans. Humans can get some things wrong. Other humans can explain some things better than others.

you seem to be an intelligent man, in spite of everything you say here,
when you go to the doctor, and he tells you something you question it, for how long? no but last time I was given drug X why are you giving me Y, etc,
you research. and find alternative viewpoints and you think about them.
the difference here is that , we are applying the same analytical effort when it comes to religion. you are not. simple. if you applied it. we would not be having this debate.

@Enigma calling people mumu, simple exposes your own immaturity. And shows how fine living examples of Jesus result to insults when they are met with infallible logic. you simply do not have a anything to disprove what is being said. And you are suffering from a common problem Christians who consider themselves to be highly educated, you turn to throw big names, left right and center without understanding them. You think that by mentioning certain complex ideologies it equates to understanding them.

I think nothing shows this problem better than this debate with Sam Harris and Deepak Chopra. I think one of the best debates of all times.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-8-Yxdphsg

God answers your prayer for your wife to buy you new rims for your mercedes, he answers the prayer for your crocodile leather shoes to be shiny in the morning as you left them yesterday, he answers the prayer that your mum gifts you the while Ipad2 and not the Samsung Galaxy tab.

It is the height of arrogance.

People are dying but I am so so important that God will get me red prada shoes instead of preventing a woman from being raped. What a sweet God! He seems to have his priorities so it place right? my priorities come before anyone else in the world.

"Thanking God and saying prayers for yourself is arrogant and selfish. There are people in much worse situations than you. Why should you be a higher priority? Why are you so special? WHY? I'll tell you why. It's because your god is really nothing more than an extension of your own ego."
Ref:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IKkfBKLApY

You can watch the video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IKkfBKLApY

jesus as a concept or system or meme does exist and is very real. when a mad man goes to a psychiatrist they discuss about his hallucinations. real or perceived.

there are many christian hate groups that specifically target atheists. it is very kind if you all watched the you tube video linked. it is short and to the point. that wikl pretend us from having to repeat things unnecessarily.

if an atheist screams God when he or she is in danger. it does not mean god exists. it actually means nothing.

@noetic16,
understanding it, you claim you know the meaning of "esoteric" yet what you write, clearly shows the opposite is true.

Yes we have all heard of the spirit.
Have we been how mental ill people are bullied by Pastors in the name of impacting this "holy" spirit and chasing a bad one. yes, very regrettable and sad.
very poorly scripted acting by pastors,  they should take some tips from Nollyhood.
Do you have the same spirit as the next Christian? revealing the same things? How comes you all manifest it so differently?

We all know what the holy spirit is,
as @globexl says, it is all the mind. you are your holy spirit. that's why it is so real

@thehomer, is a recurrent trend for christian to become abusive and unnecessarily emotional when present with infallible logic.
@Enigma , if on the other hand to presented evidence of a God that is credible, we will be very happy, who does not want to live forever!

This is a beautiful story of how a "jesus" or "muhammed' is born, A true Jesus created within "our" lifetime. amazing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1skNgYdJXK8&feature=player_embedded

[img]http://www.atheist.ie/phpBB3/download/file.php?id=57[/img]

When God "does" things on earth that we humans clearly see as unfair, Many Christians are quick to say, God works in Mysterious ways, that there is a meaning for everything, that they are lessons learnt etc, and that we cannot comprehend what God does and we should never question it.

That's all very well.

If God sends well deserving Christians to "hell" that, I guess those Christians will say the same thing as they burn away with Satan.

How dare you question God for sending you to hell, he knows best what you deserve. How clever of God, don't you all agree.

It is a surprise why women hold on so strongly to religion and still expect to be treated fairly,

Guess the verse,
"8 For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; 9 neither was man created for woman, but woman for man."

1. The fundamental liberties of God simply implies that as we debate the existence of a super intelligent being who created the universe, might we also put into consideration the fact that He is intelligent enough to make his own choices and decisions.
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@noetic16
including, taking all the atheists to heaven and burning all the Christians.
or ignoring altogether what is the bible, and doing whatever he like right?
you can't claim that you will go to heaven if you believe in God/Jesus/ and do what he wants you to do.
god will do whatever he likes regardless of what you do. he is not bound by any law.
>>

@noetic16 no no, esoteric is an English word, even if you bold it, the meaning remains the same.