Kay 17:

^^

for the mere reason that he is omnipotent

and almighty, numerous options instantly appear for him.

@Kay 17

Hmmmm. Strong omnipotent backlash there ...

“A great man is always willing to be little.”
― Ralph Waldo Emerson

It is true that God is omnipotent or all powerful

however He is also modest and respectful

God accepted reality and made no attempt to corner or outsmart it.

God has no or had no hang ups with the possibility or likelihood of some future event occurring

Let the chips fall where they may, God regardless of being omnipotent was ready and willing to be little.

Greatness is not found in possessions, power, position, or prestige.

It is discovered in goodness, humility, service, and character

Incidentally earlier, although in vain,

I tried checking to confirm whether you are familiar with templates

and what templates are used for

or what templates are all about.

Do you know what templates are and what templates are used for or what templates are all about?

Just another option.

@obadiah would have loved to chat wif u now but don't think u r online...pls can we talk tomorrow 9t citeris paribus...btw, r u a grail message adherent?

ATMC: @obadiah would have loved to chat wif u now but don't think u r online...pls can we talk tomorrow 9t citeris paribus...btw, r u a grail message adherent?

no doubt Hun, i will be here, God willing, tomorrow to break bread with you. its always a pleasure to break bread with a fellow Israelite sister. dunno what a grail is though

@obadiah 8.50pm or before then is ok by me, how about u?

ATMC: @obadiah 8.50pm or before then is ok by me, how about u?

8.50 IS PERFECTUMUNDO. HOPEFULLY YOU MEAN NIGERIAN TIME

Oui

If Jesus died for man's sins, then why are people still sinning?

seriallink:

The Bible doesn't teach reincarnation, where did you get all these ideas from It's all scary, so you think Africans are in hell now while the developed nations are in Heaven Interesting!! I can't say what you are saying are right or wrong, but where are the biblical backups for these your Heaven & Hell theories & reincarnation

Please read your Bible. Don't let anybody to deceive you.

Obadiah wey u?

ATMC: Obadiah wey u?

I FULL GROUND MA

evening...shall we?

Begining with judgement...u said dt's almost what life on earth entails and i ask can we say dt d very thing dt one is judged of while on earth is his reason for living meaning purpose?

ATMC: evening...shall we?

YES WE SHALL

ATMC: Begining with judgement...u said dt's almost what life on earth entails and i ask can we say dt d very thing dt one is judged of while on earth is his reason for living meaning purpose?

NO YOUR JUDGEMENT WILL NOT BE YOUR MAIN PURPOSE OF LIVING. YOUR MAIN PURPOSE OF LIVING WILL BE TO DO ON EARTH AS IT IS IN HEAVEN. MEANING LIVE AT PEACE WITH ALL MEN AND OBEY THE LORDS COMMANDS.

ECCLESIASTES 12 VS 13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man HOWEVER IF YOU FAIL IN THIS DUTY THEN YOU WILL BE PART OF THE REASON WHY DISHARMONY IS ON EARTH AND YOU WILL HAVE TO BE RECOMPENSED FOR IT IN THIS LIFETIME OR THE NEXT LIFETIME.

So what's d essence of ti t for tag...judgement?

ATMC: So what's d essence of ti t for tag...judgement?

TO REFINE YOU AND PURIFY YOU AND GET YOU READY FOR THE KINGDOM. THIS LIFE WE HAVE NOW IS JUST A DRESS REHEARSAL. THE REAL LIFE ? YOU WILL LIVE TO 1000 YEARS OLD IN THE KINGDOM NOT 80 YEARS. AND NO MORE BILLS OR SUFFERING OR PAIN OR TEARS. NOT FOR US ANYWAY. TWILL BE TIME FOR THE GENTILES TO TASTE HELL. WE WILL HAVE BEEN REFINED IN SUFFERING AND WILL BE PARDONED. WE ( US BLACK PEOPLE ) HAVE BEEN IN HELL FOR OVER 2000 YEARS NOW. OUR HELL ENDS WHEN CHRIST RETURNS.OUR HELL IS TO REFINE US.

^sleep dealt with me yesterday...i had a busy day dt was y i slept off only to wake up now...imagine

obadiah777: TO REFINE YOU AND PURIFY YOU AND GET YOU READY FOR THE KINGDOM. THIS LIFE WE HAVE NOW IS JUST A DRESS REHEARSAL. THE REAL LIFE ? YOU WILL LIVE TO 1000 YEARS OLD IN THE KINGDOM NOT 80 YEARS. AND NO MORE BILLS OR SUFFERING OR PAIN OR TEARS. NOT FOR US ANYWAY. TWILL BE TIME FOR THE GENTILES TO TASTE HELL. WE WILL HAVE BEEN REFINED IN SUFFERING AND WILL BE PARDONED. WE ( US BLACK PEOPLE ) HAVE BEEN IN HELL FOR OVER 2000 YEARS NOW. OUR HELL ENDS WHEN CHRIST RETURNS.OUR HELL IS TO REFINE US.

1000 years in d kingdom is too small if it be all there is, then it aint making any sense! How do u mean black people are in hell presently? Obadiah, i was expecting dt u 'll use d bible to back up ur words just as u 've been doing. D above statement sounds awkward to me, can u back it up wif d scripture

Again, can u explain isaiah 53 to me

I go with d bible, i don't know about u. Tell me, do u? If u do, what do u think paul meant when he said 'if any man be in christ, he's a new creature, OLD THINGS have passed away, behold ALL THINGS HAVE BECOME NEW

ITSOLUTIONS: just wondering why jesus had to really die for us?

First you must understand that Jesus did not die for the sins of all the people!! He died only for His people who loved Him and served Him personally in His mission of divine knowledge propagation when God came as Jesus to this world. This means that He died for only very few deserving devotees of His time.

Now let us analyse why God suffers for a deserving devotee.

God suffers only for a deserving devotee who has a scope of change. The suffering is for the upliftment and change in the mentality of the soul. The suffering is to uplift the soul so that the soul should turn from world to the God. For this God comes in every generation to this world in human form to preach wonderful divine knowledge. If God cancels all the sins of all the people just like that then it is injustice and there will not be any transformation in the souls. God cancels the sins of deserving devotees only who has transformed and do not sin any sin in future.

Realization is the process of effort to change the soul and reformation is the actual change of the soul. If the soul is reformed, the proof for it is that the sin is not practically repeated. If this result is achieved, there is no need of punishment. The punishment is not for the sake of past sin, since past is past. The punishment is only to change the soul so that in future the sin is not repeated.

The day you have stopped repeating the sin, you are excused by God for the past sin. This is the only way to stop the punishment of sin, which is in the form of problems of life. If you have stopped all the sins, your life will be the happiest and for this you need not pray even God. Prayer to God will not cancel even the trace of the sin.

Ravana prayed Lord Shiva in several ways, but, he could not escape the punishment of his sin. If you are committing sin, you are violating the word of God and going against the will of God. God wants you not to commit any sin. His word is the ethical scripture, which says that you should not commit any sin. The sin will disturb the balance of the society since it hurts the co-living beings.
All the punishments are only for reformation of the soul and not for revenge. The hell is created by God not with vengeance against sinners but due to kindness to reform the souls. God is always kind to reform the souls, which are His children since the souls are created by Him.

The father will never have even a trace of vengeance towards his issues. Jesus always addressed God as father and He propagated this concept by saying that all your sins will be excused by God if you are reformed. Practical knowledge, the practical realization, which is the reformation, will cancel all your previous bad deeds or sins as told in Gita (Jnanaagnih….). Except this one way, there is no other way to cancel the sins and escape from all the present problems in the world and future torture in the hell.
www.universal-spirituality.org
Universal Spirituality for World Peace

^what do you refer to as sin?

ATMC: ^sleep dealt with me yesterday...i had a busy day dt was y i slept off only to wake up now...imagine

hey you cant fight the body. if you gotta sleep, you gotta sleep

ATMC: 1000 years in d kingdom is too small if it be all there is, then it aint making any sense! How do u mean black people are in hell presently? Obadiah, i was expecting dt u 'll use d bible to back up ur words just as u 've been doing. D above statement sounds awkward to me, can u back it up wif d scripture

as in you will be in the kingdom forever, but your lifespan will revert to what it was originally intended to be which was around Methusellahs age. ' scripture says in the book of Isaiah, my people will live to be as old as trees when they are in the kingdom'. now if you are familiar with trees you know they live up to thousands of years'. then you die. then you return again and live another thousand years. just as it is now. you live, die, live, die etc etc. your spirit goes up and down forever like a yoyo.

black people are the first people created by God and hence we were the first judged ( scipture says judgement is Jews first and then gentiles.). judgement is twofold. individual judgements ( individual judgements of sin you get everyday. whenever you see people going through terrible things they are getting judged. the lord hands out judgements everyday ). then you have the ultimate judgement of the two factions, jews and gentiles. christ is not coming for individual judgements. individual judgements are handed out everyday. christ is coming for the judgement of the two factions. the first faction called the jews are the first people created by God, so called negros. this faction recieved its judgement over 2000 years ago which is why black people are in hell now. it spiritual. as a people we will never succeed. the lord has blocked our progress by making us spiritually dead and as such preys to eagles. stronger nations will always feed on us because we are dead. we have been spiritually killed. this is one of the components of hell. scripture says fear the one who can kill your soul not the one who can kill your body. well so we been in hell. our faction has been judged. what christ is coming to do is to reverse the judgement onto the other faction, the gentiles. so all the prosperous nations on earth will be put in hell and will become the new 'niggers' while we will be released from our prison and be on top again. thats what christ is coming for. not individual judgements. judgements of individuals happens everyday.

ahhh LOL ok i will back it up with scriptures. i didnt think people bothered reading the scriptures. jude 6, romans 11 vs 7, isaiah 14 vs 1, ezekiel 39 vs 25,

isaiah 65 vs 22 - how we will live as old as trees in the kingdom

romans 2 vs 10 -jews first and then gentiles

ATMC: Again, can u explain isaiah 53 to me

a lot of people make this mistake. when you read the bible, some aspects of it are not ambiguously meshed with time. this means you cant apply every part of the bible to every era on earth. some parts of the bible are time-specific. that part of the bible, Isaiah 53 is time-specific. who was around during these times wiriting these lamentations because they were going through hell in the hands of the gentiles ? the Jews. and most especially the spiritually enlightened ones amongst them called the elect ( 144,000 of them ). these are the elect amongst them talking about how christ will come die for their sins etc etc. this is era-specific and jew-specific. that does not apply to modern day era. however how that chapter applies to the modern era is that because christ died to seal the elect, which made them the first fruits onto the lord, these men were able to be used by God to write the words that united the whole world under the law, which is the new testament, as well as writing the old testament. these men are who put the spirit of the lord in print so that you and I can use the spirit of God ( which is the bible-john 6 vs 63 ) to atone for ourselves and get closer to God. SEE THIS IS THE MISTAKE MOST PASTORS AND PEOPLE MAKE. THEY READ TIME-SPECIFIC EVENTS IN THE BIBLE OR LETTERS DIRECTED TO SPECIFIC PEOPLE SUCH AS THE NEW TESTAMENT LETTERS AND THEY THINK THIS IS TALKING TO THE WHOLE WORLD. THESE ARE ERA-SPECIFIC MESSAGES, WHICH IF THEY HADNT HAPPENED THE WAY THEY HAPPENED, WE WOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PRIVY TO HAVE THE SPIRIT OF GOD IN OUR HOMES WHICH IS THE BIBLE. SO BASICALLY THOSE EVENTS ARE JUST NOTES GIVING YOU THE PROCESS OF HOW THE BIBLE GOT TO YOU. WHAT THESE MEN WENT THROUGH AND HOW THEY HAD TO GET SANCTIFIED AND ATONED FOR SO THAT THE LORD CAN THEN USE THEM ( CUZ THE LORD DONT WORK WITH SINNERS TO PRODUCE HIS WORD ) TO BRING HIS WORD TO THE WHOLE WORLD. SEE SO MANY PEOPLE GOT THE BIBLE MIXED UP. IF SOMEONE GAVE YOU A BIBLE WITHOUT TELLING HOW IT GOT PRODUCED WOULD YOU TAKE IT SERIOUS ? I AM SURE YOU WILL NOT. WELL THE LORD PUT IN THE BIBLE THE WHOLE PROCESS OF HOW IT CAME ABOUT. PEOPLE ARE THEN EGOTISTICAL TO APPLY THAT PROCESS TO THEMSELVES THINKING IT IS TALKING ABOUT THEM. THE PARTS OF THE BIBLE THAT APPLIES TO US ARE THE PROPHESYS AND THE LAWS AND STATUTES AND COMMANDMENTS. NOT THE JESUS DYING FOR US PART. THAT PART IS TIME-SPECIFIC. THERE IS A REASON WHY WE ARE ALLL CATCHING HELL TODAY AND THATS BECAUSE CHRIST DID NOT DIE FOR OUR SINS. WE PAY FOR OUR SINS EVERYDAY.

ATMC: I go with d bible, i don't know about u. Tell me, do u? If u do, what do u think paul meant when he said 'if any man be in christ, he's a new creature, OLD THINGS have passed away, behold ALL THINGS HAVE BECOME NEW

of course i go with the bible. if any man is in christ he is a new creature. but what does christ represent ? you dont believe in a human being thinking you are doing the right thing. that is idolatry to worship a human being. what is christ ? christ = WORD OF GOD. ( revelation 19 vs 13 ). see this is why it says you should not make any graven image of christ to worship because you are not supposed to worship the man. its idolatry. christ = word of God = bible ( revelation 19 vs 13 )

obadiah777: YOU ERR BROTHER AYOMIVIC, YOU ERR GREATLY. JESUS DID NOT DIE FOR OUR SINS ? YES HE DID NOT. DO WE STILL NEED TO CARRY OUT THE LAWS OF ATONEMENT ? NO WE DO NOT BECAUSE THAT IS MOSAIC. DID THE ATONEMENT LAWS DIE BECAUSE WE ARE UNDER CHRIST REGIME ? YES. SO YOU ASK -HOW DOES CHRIST REGIME KILL THE LAWS OF ATONEMENT IF JESUS DID NOT DIE FOR OUR SINS ? JESUS = THE WORD OF GOD ( REVELATION 19 VS 13 ). THATS HOW YOU ATONE FOR YOUR SINS, WITH THE WORD. JESUS DIED SO HE COULD UNITE THE WORLD UNDER THE WORD SO YOU CAN HAVE A CHANCE TO ATONE FOR YOUR SINS WITH THE WORD. HOWEVER ATONING FOR SINS AND FORGIVING IS TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. ATONEMENT JUST MEANS YOU ARE AT PEACE WITH GOD. YOU WILL STILL PAY FOR YOUR SINS. QUICK QUESTION ? IF ALL SINS ARE FORGIVEN THEN WHY IS CHRIST COMING TO THROW PEOPLE IN THE LAKE OF FIRE WHEN HE RETURNS ? I THOUGHT SINS WERE FORGIVEN ?

ACTS 5 VS 31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins. ONLY ISRAEL NOT THE WORLD

MATTHEW 15 VS 24 But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. ONLY ISRAEL

JOHN 4 VS 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews NOT THE WHOLE WORLD

ATONEMENT OF SINS DOES NOT EQUAL FORGIVENESS OF SINS. THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS

It seems i know where your problem lies.You think we mean Jesus had forgiven all our sins by saying "Jesus had die for our sins" and because of that we are free to commit sin without any punishment? Is that what you think we mean ?Don't be bias.
If that is what you think, you are wrong and that was the reason i said you don't know the purpose of atonement in the Old Testament.

In the Old Testament,the sins and punishment were two.
1 The sins that lead to death. Examples of these sins are adultrey,furnication,itimate with animal, idolatry,intentionally killing,witchcraft etc.The punishment for these sins is death.(Exodus 21:12-14) First death, then in the day of judgement,they would face the second death.

2 the sins that required atonement. Example of these sins were. False swear,duping, taking things by force from another person etc. The punishment for these was that, when you realized that you have sinned,you will first of all settle the matter you and the person you offended by returning what you have forcefully taken.Then, you will go and reconcile with God by taken sin offering to priest to make atonement for you. You will lay your hand on the animal you brought for sin offering and the priest will kill that animal,takes its blood and sprinkle it on the thorn of the altar.(Lev 5:1- 14)Remember God said "the blood is given to make atonement on the altar"
After the sacrifice has been done for you,that sin in which you purposely bring the sin offering have been forgiven you because you have made peace with God.Please take notice, iam not saying that all the sins he would commit in his lifetime has been forgiven him but, that sin he atones for has forgiven him.That is how he would continue to do for such sins .
Ok,i want you to examine this,if someone commit this kind of sins and overlook the sacrifice what do you think would happen to that person?That person is storing his punishment for the day of judgement.He would face the second death because he did not make peace with God when he was alive.

Today,nobody is taken animal to priest to make atonement for their sin and the reason we do not is because Jesus had come and died. If i sin, no matter how terrible that sins are, i can make peace with God by going down on my knee, sorry for what i had done wrong, and foresake that sin with mean i would not continue in that sin again. Once i do this, God has forgiven me of that sin.Is that right? But if am still continue in that sin that mean, iam storing my punishment for the day of judgement by facing second death. Is that so ?

I am sure we are saying thesame thing but its you that is complicating the issue.Let me state what we were argueing on.
1 i said Jesus died for our sins with mean there is chance for us to repent and reconcile with God While you said Jesus did not die for our sins but for the sins of elected jews.You gave the name of these elected to be those that had died before him and his disciples but there is no single verse in Bible where Jesus said i died for these people. He said "this is the blood of new convenant that would be shed for many for the remission of sin" How does that refer to isaiah, Jeremiah, etc? All those you made metion in OT leave under Mosaic law.They atoned for their sins when alive. why does Jesus still need to atone for them?

2 i said Jesus died for the world but you said he died for Israelites.You then said he unite the Jews and gentiles.I said how? You said by word and you gave the meaning of that world to mean Jesus. Now let see how we are saying the same thing.You said he unite Jews and gentiles.Jews + gentile= world. Is that not correct? And if he unite us by word and you said 'word=Jesus' then, that mean we unite by Jesus. So, nothing wrong if we say Jesus died for us.

Concerning the verse you quoted that Jesus said "i am not sent but to the lost sheep of israe"
Jesu said this because he had not finish his assignment. He had not unite the Jew and gentile but immediatelly he acomplish mission he sent the disciples to go to the world and preach the gosple.

Horus: If Jesus died for man's sins, then why are people still sinning?

read the book of Leviticus chapter 1,2,3,4,5,6 you will know what it mean by "Jesus had did for our sins"

Ayomivic:
It seems i know where your problem lies.You think we mean Jesus had forgiven all our sins by saying "Jesus had die for our sins" and because of that we are free to commit sin without any punishment? Is that what you think we mean ?Don't be bias.
If that is what you think, you are wrong and that was the reason i said you don't know the purpose of atonement in the Old Testament.

In the Old Testament,the sins and punishment were two.
1 The sins that lead to death. Examples of these sins are adultrey,furnication,itimate with animal, idolatry,intentionally killing,witchcraft etc.The punishment for these sins is death.(Exodus 21:12-14) First death, then in the day of judgement,they would face the second death.

2 the sins that required atonement. Example of these sins were. False swear,duping, taking things by force from another person etc. The punishment for these was that, when you realized that you have sinned,you will first of all settle the matter you and the person you offended by returning what you have forcefully taken.Then, you will go and reconcile with God by taken sin offering to priest to make atonement for you. You will lay your hand on the animal you brought for sin offering and the priest will kill that animal,takes its blood and sprinkle it on the thorn of the altar.(Lev 5:1- 14)Remember God said "the blood is given to make atonement on the altar"
After the sacrifice has been done for you,that sin in which you purposely bring the sin offering have been forgiven you because you have made peace with God.Please take notice, iam not saying that all the sins he would commit in his lifetime has been forgiven him but, that sin he atones for has forgiven him.That is how he would continue to do for such sins .
Ok,i want you to examine this,if someone commit this kind of sins and overlook the sacrifice what do you think would happen to that person?That person is storing his punishment for the day of judgement.He would face the second death because he did not make peace with God when he was alive.

Today,nobody is taken animal to priest to make atonement for their sin and the reason we do not is because Jesus had come and died. If i sin, no matter how terrible that sins are, i can make peace with God by going down on my knee, sorry for what i had done wrong, and foresake that sin with mean i would not continue in that sin again. Once i do this, God has forgiven me of that sin.Is that right? But if am still continue in that sin that mean, iam storing my punishment for the day of judgement by facing second death. Is that so ?

I am sure we are saying thesame thing but its you that is complicating the issue.Let me state what we were argueing on.
1 i said Jesus died for our sins with mean there is chance for us to repent and reconcile with God While you said Jesus did not die for our sins but for the sins of elected jews.You gave the name of these elected to be those that had died before him and his disciples but there is no single verse in Bible where Jesus said i died for these people. He said "this is the blood of new convenant that would be shed for many for the remission of sin" How does that refer to isaiah, Jeremiah, etc? All those you made metion in OT leave under Mosaic law.They atoned for their sins when alive. why does Jesus still need to atone for them?

2 i said Jesus died for the world but you said he died for Israelites.You then said he unite the Jews and gentiles.I said how? You said by word and you gave the meaning of that world to mean Jesus. Now let see how we are saying the same thing.You said he unite Jews and gentiles.Jews + gentile= world. Is that not correct? And if he unite us by word and you said 'word=Jesus' then, that mean we unite by Jesus. So, nothing wrong if we say Jesus died for us.

Concerning the verse you quoted that Jesus said "i am not sent but to the lost sheep of israe"
Jesu said this because he had not finish his assignment. He had not unite the Jew and gentile but immediatelly he acomplish mission he sent the disciples to go to the world and preach the gosple.

YOU MADE A LOT OF STRONG POINTS. ONE OF THE STRONGEST POINTS I HAVE ENCOUNTERED SO FAR. WE ARE PRETTY MUCH SAYING THE SAME THING. I SEE WHERE YOU ARE COMING FROM AND I SEE YOU ARE LEARNED AND KNOWLEDGEABLE. HOWEVER I THINK THIS WOULD BE A MORE APT PICTURE TO PAINT > JESUS DIED FOR THE FORGIVENESS AND ATONEMENT OF SINS OF THE ELECT OUT OF NECESSITY SO THAT THEY CAN PUT HIS SPIRIT IN PRINT WHICH THE REST OF US CAN USE TO ATONE AND GET FORGIVENESS FOR OUR SINS. SO WHILE DYING FOR THE ELECT DIRECTLY HE DIED FOR THE REST OF US INDIRECTLY BUT ONLY IF WE CHOOSE TO ABIDE BY THE WORD. THE ELECT DIDNT HAVE A CHOICE BECAUSE THEY WERE CHOSEN BUT WE HAVE A CHOICE TO ACCEPT OR NOT. AND FINALLY I AGREE WITH YOU WHEN YOU SAY ATONEMENT OF SINS DOES NOT MEAN YOU DONT PAY FOR YOUR SINS. ATONEMENT JUST KEEPS YOU CONNECTED TO THE FATHER IN SIN BUT PAYING FOR IT MAKES YOUR SLATE WIPED CLEAN.

wonders shall never end! *claps 3 times* obadiah, from whence geteth thee all these? Anyways, i'll respond when i'm less busy u hear?

ATMC: wonders shall never end! *claps 3 times* obadiah, from whence geteth thee all these? Anyways, i'll respond when i'm less busy u hear?

I GETTEST FROM THE BIBLE OK HOLLA BACK