debosky:

Quite wrong - I will point out a few of YOUR false dichotomies.

Good. Let us reason together says the bible.

Let's go..

This is a false dichotomy - there is no rigid 'distinction' of 'old testament' and 'new testament' beyond being before Jesus and the other being after Jesus was born. Anything beyond that simple distinction is a false dichotomy. It is simply a way to arrange the books of the bible and not a strict division enforced by God.

did you read where Goshen says those 4 books must be seen as under the old testament.

Some christians will disagree and say those books must be seen as under the new testament.

Now, dont tell me that old and new testament means the same.


This, my friend is NOT a false dichotomy. This is conflicting intepretation and both sides will claim they have the best interpretation from the same bible.

Another false dichotomy - the bible itself says Mary is blessed among women - no one disputes this. It is how much emphasis is placed on it that differs. All Christians regard Mary with honour.

but when catholics praise, honour and hail Mary, pentecostals and protestants say they are in error. Catholics also believe you are in error because you dont give due honour to Mary. Do you see what i mean?
And both sides claim the bible as their authority.


How about other points I listed. Let's see your take on them.

cyrexx:

Good. Let us reason together says the bible.

Let's go..




di[b]d you read where Goshen says those 4 books must be seen as under the old testament.

Some christians will disagree and say those books must be seen as under the old testament.

This, my friend is NOT a false dichotomy. This is conflicting intepretation and both sides will claim they have the best interporetation from the same bible.[/b]



but when catholics praise, honour and hail Mary, pentecostals and protestants say they are in error. Catholics also believe you are in error because you dont give due honour to Mary. Do you see what i mean?
And both sides claim the bible as their authority.


How about other points I listed. Let's see your take on them.

There is nothing conflicting therein. If me or anyone said it, it's the duty of every Christian to search the truth of every matter. The fact that Matthew to John were placed under the new does not make the content new. How can New Testament be established under the new, that is if Matthew to John is new There is a thread we trashed this out already. Go there and learn the truth.

cyrexx:
did you read where Goshen says those 4 books must be seen as under the old testament.

Some christians will disagree and say those books must be seen as under the old testament.

This, my friend is NOT a false dichotomy. This is conflicting intepretation and both sides will claim they have the best interporetation from the same bible.

It is a false dichotomy - when those four books were written, the authors did not 'place' them into an 'old' or 'new' testament, neither did they divide them into chapters and verses. They are accounts of Jesus' time on earth and some time afterwards - pure and simple.

Any 'old' and 'new' testament claim for 'placement' of those books is a false dichotomy - the 'placement' of the books is simply a preference and nothing more in reality. The important issue is the content of the books.

but when catholics praise, honour and hail Mary, pentecostals and protestants say they are in error. Catholics also believe you are in error because you dont give due honour to Mary. Do you see what i mean?
And both sides claim the bible as their authority.

When you talk about 'due' honour versus honour you've created a false dichotomy. The difference here is the 'emphasis' - the core fact is that Mary is blessed among women - that is not in dispute. The emphasis/how this is carried out is of lesser importance and is an opinion - it cannot detract from the substance of the matter.

This is what atheists are fond of doing - leaving the substance and focusing on peripheral differences of opinion.

*juggling around. I'm warming up*

Mr_Anony:
Why? Is the verse I quoted not in the same bible? Why not read the bible in context instead of sprouting what you don't know.

Nope, thats twisting. Or it meant Jesus words are not certain

@ Debosky,

You see say them don run, leaving only cyrexx to this argument. I told you. I have tracked that Logicboy03 of a person, he is the same person using another I.d for FOLYKAZE......I will expose him one day....

Reyginus: *juggling around. I'm warming up*

Mr_Anony:
And so what? Where is it written as law that the "completeness" of the bible depends upon whether all the quoted parts are accounted for in the same book?

Yap! Like my granddad says wind don blow, chicken yanch is exposed. You said your 66 books is all. And the Catholic have additional books in their bible. Dont also forget the Apocrypha and others. You twisted your 66 books bible to be the inspired book and the Catholic members twisted theirs claiming it is inspire. Now it fact that Christians twist.

Goshen360: @ Debosky,

You see say them don run, leaving only cyrexx to this argument. I told you. I have tracked that Logicboy03 of a person, he is the same person using another I.d for FOLYKAZE......I will expose him one day....

Shut up! Crowned Jewish Slave. I think thats what you want. Track me not mumu but answer questions i laid

FOLYKAZE:
Shut up! Crowned Jewish Slave. I think thats what you want. Track me not mumu but answer questions i laid

Aha! So Goshen is telling the truth. Paving the way for Abuja I guess.

FOLYKAZE:

Nope, thats twisting. Or it meant Jesus words are not certain

Please go and read the bible so that you can follow the story. Stop cherry-picking verses to hurl.

Mr_Anony:
In red - you can always show yourself does not mean that if you choose not to, you lose the ability.
In green - how are you so sure?

When people keep sending mixed messages using my name, it is my DUTY to come and and stop the confusion and make things clear to them especially when it comes to something as important as their relationship with me. . .For the part in green, when was the last time your god appeared to any group of conflicting christians and solved their issues?. . .

FOLYKAZE:

Yap! Like my granddad says wind don blow, chicken yanch is exposed. You said your 66 books is all. And the Catholic have additional books in their bible. Dont also forget the Apocrypha and others. You twisted your 66 books bible to be the inspired book and the Catholic members twisted theirs claiming it is inspire. Now it fact that Christians twist.

What exactly is your point?

Reyginus: Aha! So Goshen is telling the truth. Paving the way for Abuja I guess.

'leaf' am, I will report his IP address to the Moderators when the time comes. He is already tracked!

@ Goshen and
@ Debosky,

thank you for your clarifications and rationalisations.

But know that many "bible-believing christians" will disagree with you and they will prove you wrong from the scriptures.

This corroborates my earlier statement that anybody can prove any "truth" from the scriptures if you can harvest enough scriptures to support what you already see as the "truth" and rationalise away any contrary views to your "truth"



and if you think those two issues you addrtessed are non-essential, how about the deity of jesus, its even first on my list. That shd be essential since you accused us thus:

"This is what atheists are fond of doing - leaving the substance and focusing on peripheral differences of opinion."



Now,
Some christians believe Jesus is the same as Yahweh and has been with Yahweh since the beginning and others believe he was begotten later and did not start with Yahweh from the beginning.

What saith ye?

The world can see clearly now that debosky and Goshen360 are the ones that twisted the bible. Debosky, I have provide you your trinity verse in the bible. Now lets see you twisting in action.


Goshen360, your bible is 66 books while the catholic bible have additional books. The Apocrypha is there which i think Obadiah quote from in some thread. Now you dont have the Apocrypha, it is clear you dont have the knowledge of the bible as a whole.

Anony! Pls get the RSV and lets close this case
Twist the bible not

mazaje:

When people keep sending mixed messages using my name, it is my DUTY to come and and stop the confusion and make things clear to them especially when it comes to something as important as their relationship with me. . .For the part in green, when was the last time your god appeared to any group of conflicting christians and solved their issues?. . .

You would have to establish that the conflicting people were christians first. God has made Himself manifest as Jesus Christ. As I said, if you follow Him, you can't go wrong.

debosky: Atheists like to create false dichotomies in order to appear intelligent. Unfortunately, they just show that even the 'logic' they claim to hold on to is something far beyond their understanding.

The statements these atheists love to make is tantamount to saying the following:

1. Are human beings asleep or awake? If one says awake and the other says asleep, you are twisting things!

2. Are human beings 1ft tall or 6ft tall? If you answer that the same human being can be 1ft tall and 6ft tall, then you are twisting things!

(forgetting that both can be true at different times)

3. Which is larger - six or half a dozen? If you say they are the same, atheists believe this is 'twisting'.

In each of these cases, there is a false dichotomy - that is the specialty of duplicitous NL atheists.

this really is a classic answer a summary for those that aint ready to learn. 1000+

Mr_Anony:
What exactly is your point?

Anony! You got my hand here today. From your point, you claim your 66 books bible is the inspired word of God. And logicboy lets you understand that the Catholic bible contain some additional books. My point here is that the apocrypha are also inspired which some christians use in there worship. This is the fact that twisting style is not only on bible verses but also on bible it self. You accept 66 books and other doesn't. You got now

debosky: Interesting - I particularly was intrigued mazaje's post on this matter.

Yes - there is an element of 'preferential' reading amongst Christians, but that is simply a reflection a difference in emphasis, not a difference in the constitution/character of God as revealed in the bible.

Back to your example - while Ola may lay emphasis the justice/punishment characteristic of God, he does not deny that God is loving, and vice versa for Jesoul.

Now back to the general theme of 'twisting' - I posit that these are largely the grains of sand (areas of differing opinion/interpretation) amid the pebbles (main elements/central tenets of the Christian faith).

Yes, human beings (including Christians) can spend an unbelievable amount of time splitting hairs or discussing/disputing minor details, but that doesn't necessarily mean the central tenets are not agreed upon or clearly stated.

All Christians believe God created the earth and the universe, they believe Jesus came to die for our sins and was resurrected, they believe God spoke through the prophets, through the priests, through Israel till the time of Jesus. They believe there will be a final reckoning, a judgement.

These central tenets (and a few others I haven't mentioned) are what establish the Christian faith.

These tenets are the core issues, not whether Mark is in the 'old' or 'new' testament, not whether Jesus 'taught'/'supported' tithing or not, not whether God is a 'trinity' or a 'unity', not whether 'priests' should have wives or not, not whether Christians should drink alcohol or not, not whether only unleavened bread should be used for the Lord's supper or not, not whether you should 'celebrate' Christmas, not whether you should cross your legs in church, pray with your head covered/uncovered or any other 'controversy' or 'twisting' you can come up with.

Human beings like to focus on 'differences', but this doesn't change the core beliefs of Christians. Atheists love to ask close ended questions to 'prove' the 'twists' and 'contradictions' in the word, but the central tenets cannot be 'twisted' - they hold true - as long as the focus remains on these, we will remain on track.

Most of what you have written is NOT true. . .Many christians do NOT agree on the basic nature of who Jesus is. Some agree that Jesus is god and god's son at the same time, others agree that is he is only the son of god. The road to salvation itself is not agreed up on by all, while some agree that all christians are saved others agree that you still have to do some work to get saved. Even the bible it self is in dispute, catholics have their own bible that contains more books than the 66 books of the pentecostal bible. . .

You talked about god creating the universe, but even christians do not agree on how and when he created it, while some take a literal reading of the bible(Young earth creationist) others claim it is an allegory(old earth creationist), some believe that adam was the first man while others believe that there was a pre adamite world. . .Some believe that hell is a permanent place of torture, while others do not agree that it is a place of eternal torture. . .

To claim that there is a central tenet is false. . .There is no acceptable universal christian doctrine. . . .

Goshen360:

'leaf' am, I will report his IP address to the Moderators when the time comes. He is already tracked!

Prevent your evidence the Crowned Jewish Slave. I think your bible says you must not lie huh?

My IP is what and what? Keep lying and burn in Hell when the trumpet sound.

FOLYKAZE:

Anony! You got my hand here today. From your point, you claim your 66 books bible is the inspired word of God. And logicboy lets you understand that the Catholic bible contain some additional books. My point here is that the apocrypha are also inspired which some christians use in there worship. This is the fact that twisting style is not only on bible verses but also on bible it self. You accept 66 books and other doesn't. You got now

.....I get it but I am still lost as to why it is such a big deal for you

mazaje:

Most of what you have written is NOT true. . .Many christians do NOT agree on the basic nature of who Jesus is. Some agree that Jesus is god and god's son at the same time, others agree that is only god. The road to salvation itself is not agreed, while some agree that all christians are saved others agree that you still have to do some work to get saved. Even the bible it self is in dispute, catholics have their own bible that contains more books than the 66 books of the pentecostal bible. . .

You talked about god creating the universe, but even christians do not agree on how and when he created it, while some take a literal reading of the bible(Young earth creationist) others claim it is an allegory(old earth creationist), some believe that adam was the first man while others believe that there was a pre adamite world. . .Some believe that hell is a permanent place of torture, while others do not agree that it is a place of eternal torture. . .

To claim that there is a central tenet is false. . .There is no acceptable universal christian doctrine. . . .

They knew these are facts but they will ignore your claim cuz they have not taste the doctrine of other denomination

Mr_Anony:
.....I get it but I am still lost as to why it is such a big deal for you

Anony! You know very well i told you i dont like participating on this forum but read, read and read. Which voodoo you use for me today?

The Big deal is that Christianity form and twist only to suit there doctrine.
Case close

Atheist: What can you perceive or see?

FOLYKAZE: Anony! Twist bible the way you like. It remains in Matthew 10:5-6 says : These twelve Jesus sent out, charging them, "Go nowhere among the Gentiles, and enter no town of the Samaritans, but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. I wonder cause you are not Israelite those disciples are send to.
And matthew 15:24 says He answered, "I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Now tell me what your problem is. Atheist and Israelites should twist the bible not you.

ignorance on the rampage, the old testament including Mathew, Mark, Luke and John is about the Jews, while the new testament is about Christians. Now read Galatians 3:13. Christ had redeemed us from the curse of the law,being made a curse for us, for it is written, cussed is everyone that hangeth on a tree. 14. That the blessings of Abraham might come on the GENTILES through Jesus Christ, that we might recieve the promise of the Spirit through faith. You see why the death of Jesus Christ mean so much for us. Accept Jesus so that you can understand, otherwise it will be diff 4 you.

hisblud: Atheist: What can you perceive or see?

Both is 'twisting'........

christemmbassey: ignorance on the rampage, the old testament including Mathew, Mark, Luke and John is about the Jews, while the new testament is about Christians. Now read Galatians 3:13. Christ had redeemed us from the curse of the law,being made a curse for us, for it is written, cussed is everyone that hangeth on a tree. 14. That the blessings of Abraham might come on the GENTILES through Jesus Christ, that we might recieve the promise of the Spirit through faith. You see why the death of Jesus Christ mean so much for us. Accept Jesus so that you can understand, otherwise it will be diff 4 you.

ha! TWISTING IN ACTION

christemmbassey: ignorance on the rampage, the old testament including Mathew, Mark, Luke and John is about the Jews, while the new testament is about Christians. Now read Galatians 3:13. Christ had redeemed us from the curse of the law,being made a curse for us, for it is written, cussed is everyone that hangeth on a tree. 14. That the blessings of Abraham might come on the GENTILES through Jesus Christ, that we might recieve the promise of the Spirit through faith. You see why the death of Jesus Christ mean so much for us. Accept Jesus so that you can understand, otherwise it will be diff 4 you.

ha! TWISTING IN ACTION

FOLYKAZE:
ha! TWISTING IN ACTION

What do you even consider or call 'twisting'

Logicboy03:


Yes, only a protestant would believe that a catholic for 22 years did not know Christ from the scriptures.

is logicaoy a catholic?

Logicboy03:


Yes, only a protestant would believe that a catholic for 22 years did not know Christ from the scriptures.

is logicboy a catholic?