anochuko01:
yeah, i'm born of God...and i'v commited a sin since then. Bt dat doesnt mean i cnt live without sin, its because i'm nt fufiling my spiritual obligatns. Its something i'v practised and it works perfectly.
However, no humble person would come out to call himself perfect even if he knws he is.

Bidam has called himself perfect.

My point is that a "born-again" can sin...and you agree.

Shikena!

italo:

Bidam has called himself perfect.

My point is that a "born-again" can sin...and you agree.

Shikena!

why cant he be perfect? Dat i'm nt yet perfect doesnt mean other pple cnt be.
If anybody has d chance to be perfect, it ONLY has to be a born-again.

A born-again can sin. Yes or no?

italo: A born-again can sin. Yes or no?

No A born again CANNOT sin. God does not see us.He sees Christ in us.Short and simple.

Bidam: No A born again CANNOT sin. God does not see us.He sees Christ in us.Short and simple.

Oh...you choose to re-answer this question.

Why then can you not tell me if Jesus was not referring to you when he said "say...forgive us our sins" "without ceasing?"

italo:

Oh...you choose to re-answer this question.

Why then can you not tell me if Jesus was not referring to you when he said "say...forgive us our sins" "without ceasing?"

Did Jesus go to the cross before OR after that statement? Once his blood was shed no more sacrifice for sins. Our sins are automatically forgiven once we are born again by the incorruptible seed of God which lives and abide in us FOREVER.

On this thread, some pple have said that born again CANNOT sin, but they av in one way or the other commited sin.

One has said, they can sin but needed 2 seek for forgiveness ceaselessly(seems dis youngman is a catholic)

Others av competely sidestepped d question, reason being that they call themselves born again but they couldnt resist d occasional bottles of Alch, bleepin of girls, d clubs, cheating, backbiting etc................... This group, to me, are being realistic

The final group are working relentlessly to defend wot dey believe in. Agreeing d@ born again can sin will be a slap on christianity and make dem unlike 'christ'. .......................These are potential theologians.

Even Anaochuku1 started with long epistle abot infallability, but Alhamdulillah, @ some point, he agreed d@ he got blood running thru his veins .

All in all, i expected a consensus of answer from u gentlemen because d idea of salvation is d most fundamental teaching in ur religion. If by now, u are still aving a difference of opinion, dont u think dere is something wrong somewhere??

Pls, ponder on dis points and reply with wisdom.

Thanks.

Bidam: Did Jesus go to the cross before OR after that statement? Once his blood was shed no more sacrifice for sins. Our sins are automatically forgiven once we are born again by the incorruptible seed of God which lives and abide in us FOREVER.

So you are saying Jesus wasn't referring to you?

anochuko01:
yeah, it is by grace that we are born again. But what happens to a born again who doesnt pray and study the bible? There are levels of grace o.....thats why everybody isnt like oyedepo, adeboye and co. U cnt spnd 10hrs everyday to pray and be on the same level of grace with others!

That is another discussion all together. You are talking of the gift of the spirit, people possess different gift of the spirit as God wishes not because of the level of your long prayer, but God gives it depending on how he wants to use you. Paul was an unrighteous person before Jesus gave him assignment greater than some who came before him. this was the Lord's decision, not by the level of his bible reading or long prayer/righteousness. that one receives more assignment than the other, does not make him more perfect than other saints. However, we are talking about being perfect or sinless, which I say it's impossible 'cos we are born sinners from birth. Perfection is only by undeserved kindness/grace.

Talent/gift is different from perfection. In the eyes of God whether you are prominent in his work or not, you are as important as the one who is prominent as far as you remain faithful. Pls dont quote examples of people who disgrace the work of God.

dyfatai: On this thread, some pple have said that born again CANNOT sin, but they av in one way or the other commited sin.

One has said, they can sin but needed 2 seek for forgiveness ceaselessly(seems dis youngman is a catholic)

Others av competely sidestepped d question, reason being that they call themselves born again but they couldnt resist d occasional bottles of Alch, bleepin of girls, d clubs, cheating, backbiting etc................... This group, to me, are being realistic

The final group are working relentlessly to defend wot dey believe in. Agreeing d@ born again can sin will be a slap on christianity and make dem unlike 'christ'. .......................These are potential theologians.

Even Anaochuku1 started with long epistle abot infallability, but Alhamdulillah, @ some point, he agreed d@ he got blood running thru his veins .

All in all, i expected a consensus of answer from u gentlemen because d idea of salvation is d most fundamental teaching in ur religion. If by now, u are still aving a difference of opinion, dont u think dere is something wrong somewhere??

Pls, ponder on dis points and reply with wisdom.

Thanks.

christians do not believe in the doctrine of universal brotherhood, thats a muslim thing.


it would be foolhardy for me, for example, to say just because someone claims they are christian, that automatically means i must not still examine their words and actions. It doesnt work that way and neither is such an attitude supported in the bible.

dyfatai: On this thread, some pple have said that born again CANNOT sin, but they av in one way or the other commited sin.

One has said, they can sin but needed 2 seek for forgiveness ceaselessly(seems dis youngman is a catholic)

Others av competely sidestepped d question, reason being that they call themselves born again but they couldnt resist d occasional bottles of Alch, bleepin of girls, d clubs, cheating, backbiting etc................... This group, to me, are being realistic

The final group are working relentlessly to defend wot dey believe in. Agreeing d@ born again can sin will be a slap on christianity and make dem unlike 'christ'. .......................These are potential theologians.

Even Anaochuku1 started with long epistle abot infallability, but Alhamdulillah, @ some point, he agreed d@ he got blood running thru his veins .

All in all, i expected a consensus of answer from u gentlemen because d idea of salvation is d most fundamental teaching in ur religion. If by now, u are still aving a difference of opinion, dont u think dere is something wrong somewhere??

Pls, ponder on dis points and reply with wisdom.

Thanks.

if the 'sins' u're talking abt includes sex, alcohol, cheating, clubing, stealing nd bck-stabbing, I DONT AND WILL NOT DO THESE. i even find it hard to tell d slightest lies......I'v GONE BEYOND these levels, bt i wnt to reach a higher level.

italo:

So you are saying Jesus wasn't referring to you?

The statement applied to me as well as every who comes to the cross for salvation.I have to confess my sins to get SAVED.Salvation is immediate and at the same time progressive.

Lemme post what John said for the benefit of others.

There are three main verses in 1 John that say that Christians who are truly born of the Spirit of God do not sin, and in fact cannot sin. They are:

No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. (1 John 3:9)

We know that no one who is born of God sins; but He who was born of God keeps him and the evil one does not touch him. (1 John 5:18)

No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him. (1 John 3:6)

I am born of God so i cannot sin because that's the nature of God.

Even if i sin( acts) THE BLOOD OF JESUS automatically cleanses me if i confess them.

Here what John says also which most people think it's contradictory.

If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (1 John 1:

If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. (1 John 1:10)

But John is simply referring to your soulish fleshy realm which PAUL ENCOURAGED US TO MORTIFY. This is different from the born again spirit which is the residence of the Holy Spirit. Spirit do not and cannot sin. The Holy Spirit is a seal,downpayment in me given by God till the day i would be redeemed from this earthly realm.

Unlike you i do not go to a priest to confess my soulish sins. I confess it to Jesus the High priest and to my fellow brothers and sisters in the Faith.As far as i am concerned i do not and cannot sin because i am Christ-like.

Knowing this, our old self was crucified with Him, that our body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin; for he who has died is freed from sin. (Rom 6:6-7)

Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin,.... (Rom 6:11)

Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, that we might bear fruit for God. (Rom 7:4)

Bidam: The statement applied to me as well as every who comes to the cross for salvation.I have to confess my sins to get SAVED.Salvation is immediate and at the same time progressive.

Lemme post what John said for the benefit of others.

There are three main verses in 1 John that say that Christians who are truly born of the Spirit of God do not sin, and in fact cannot sin. They are:

No one who is born of God practices sin, because His seed abides in him; and he cannot sin, because he is born of God. (1 John 3:9)

We know that no one who is born of God sins; but He who was born of God keeps him and the evil one does not touch him. (1 John 5:18)

No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him. (1 John 3:6)

I am born of God so i cannot sin because that's the nature of God.

Even if i sin( acts) THE BLOOD OF JESUS automatically cleanses me if i confess them.

Here what John says also which most people think it's contradictory.

If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves, and the truth is not in us. (1 John 1:

If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us. (1 John 1:10)

But John is simply referring to your soulish fleshy realm which PAUL ENCOURAGED US TO MORTIFY. This is different from the born again spirit which is the residence of the Holy Spirit. Spirit do not and cannot sin. The Holy Spirit is a seal,downpayment in me given by God till the day i would be redeemed from this earthly realm.

Unlike you i do not go to a priest to confess my soulish sins. I confess it to Jesus the High priest and to my fellow brothers and sisters in the Faith.As far as i am concerned i do not and cannot sin because i am Christ-like.

Knowing this, our old self was crucified with Him, that our body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin; for he who has died is freed from sin. (Rom 6:6-7)

Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin,.... (Rom 6:11)

Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, that we might bear fruit for God. (Rom 7:4)

Bro Bidam,God bless you,this is as clear as anything,i hope he sees the truth in the above.

dyfatai: On this thread, some pple have said that born again CANNOT sin, but they av in one way or the other commited sin.

One has said, they can sin but needed 2 seek for forgiveness ceaselessly(seems dis youngman is a catholic)

Others av competely sidestepped d question, reason being that they call themselves born again but they couldnt resist d occasional bottles of Alch, bleepin of girls, d clubs, cheating, backbiting etc................... This group, to me, are being realistic

The final group are working relentlessly to defend wot dey believe in. Agreeing d@ born again can sin will be a slap on christianity and make dem unlike 'christ'. .......................These are potential theologians.

Even Anaochuku1 started with long epistle abot infallability, but Alhamdulillah, @ some point, he agreed d@ he got blood running thru his veins .

All in all, i expected a consensus of answer from u gentlemen because d idea of salvation is d most fundamental teaching in ur religion. If by now, u are still aving a difference of opinion, dont u think dere is something wrong somewhere??

Pls, ponder on dis points and reply with wisdom.

Thanks.

You are only trying,try harder.
There is nothing to ponder on to me,Jesus said you shall know the truth and the truth will set you free,nothing more.
A man who is born-again,born of God,born of the Spirit of God do COMMIT sin,the incorruptible seed of God lies in Him., he does not find Joy in commiting sin and all the ones you put above.

Mintayo:
Bro Bidam,God bless you,this is as clear as anything,i hope he sees the truth in the above.

I hope so too.Stay blessed bro.