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Making Love & Raising A Family - Family (27) - Nairaland

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Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 10:52am On Dec 20, 2013
jennykadry: Can y'all stop trying to ruin my reputation...yes I am talking to chillisauce, Efe, salsera and aluta who are hell bent on accusing my innocent self of saying things, I know nothing about cheesy

@aluta
Lol, Which method be that? I no fit remember again.


I dey come


Never marry a male virgin, I have said it a million times. A female Virgin is alright, you can teach her and most times they are willing to learn. Teach a male virgin? Hell no, they gat too much pride to succumb to s3x lesson 101.

Even if you don't want to taste before marriage, please do some serious screening....

1. Check if he is circumcised.

2. Touch him down there and count how many secs it took the iroko inbetween his legs to stand at attention waiting to sing Nigerian national anthem.

3. Run your right hand along the length of his shaft and look for veins that will pop out, the more veins with smug looks on their faces you find, the more sexually active that guy is, if you see an angry vein ready to pop out, please run. That thing must have been deprived of some tender loving care for so long.

I rest my case
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 11:07am On Dec 20, 2013
alutacontinua:

I dey come




Jenny wrote this cheesy

I give up .
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 11:32am On Dec 20, 2013
Chillisauce:

Jenny wrote this cheesy

I give up .

She did oo cheesy cheesy grin grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by EfemenaXY: 11:48am On Dec 20, 2013
Jenny don finish the Naija male virgin! grin grin

But Jenny, you still need to convince me that the hooded yekini get short battery life. cool cool

How you take know?? What are the advantages of a hoodless yekini over a hooded one? undecided
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by bluuu: 12:08pm On Dec 20, 2013
chaircover:

Ileoba is a lady . . . .she is coogers wifey cool grin

I didnt quite understand your other question though. Are you asking on how to deal with other men who want to go out with you even though you are already in a relationship?
how do i deal with the crush and make sure it doesn't escalate to sth else(im single)


i thought BABE is coogar's gf,also one lady that said her bf has double personality offline and online and people decoded it to be coogar.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 12:50pm On Dec 20, 2013
Dyekatana: @ baby mama will do my lips are sealed.
@ nash, where do i start? my husband and i are as different as apples and oranges. our world views are different, when i try to discuss this gently, he gets mad starts a confrontation. if i express views different from his on anything, sex, politics religion it becomes this long drawn out drama. that being said, he is a good provider takes care of his family works hard, loves God. i have become tired of arguments though and have become withdrawn emotionally from him so that my views on life don't upset the apple cart and i think that's what drew me to my ex. the freedom to express myself, be heard, and still valued even if our views differed. the ability to joke and laugh about the things we disagreed about.

as for dates, ....please don't let me get started his idea of a date is him sitting in the living room while i sweat it out in the kitchen, and crawl on my knees bringing savory dishes to my lord and master. grin he is very, very conservative and i am lonely though i am married. don't get me wrong i'm no saint(as if y'all didn't know that already cheesy) all i am doing is presenting the problem that made me go out looking for an emotional connection.
you know when i talk to him his response like most men is to tell me how much money he spends to take care of his family and like most guys, is clueless and does not know that it's not about money.

@chaircover thanks for lending me these guys will use them wella cheesy but whether i'll return 007 ....we'll negotiate that one. wink


thanks again guys, you know the fever went down a notch yesterday after all the cold water therapy i received here. (c'mon cut me some slack have you never had the fever grin) but i have been scared to talk to him cos i think my resolve would turn to mush when i do. however, i prayed today yaaay! something i have not been able to do for a while repenting of course and asking for strength to do the right thing.

i love all you guys already group hug and kisses. kiss


No be small mata! shocked

However, as I believe others have pointed out (I haven't read all the comments yet), if you keep any escape hatches and hidden exits in your marriage, you will work nothing out. People change as they experience life. Your husband can change. But perhaps the more important change needed is yours. You may need to learn to 'see' him first, to get into his world, to learn what language he speaks, who he is and how he reacts to stimuli and what stimuli he reacts to. As you do that, you might end up triggering the changes you want.

Give your marriage a real shot as though it were all you've got, as though you had nothing else in the world. That's the only way I know that people stay together into old age. These days, divorce is the song so everyone holds back just enough to get out if things get uncomfortable (the degree of discomfort varies from individual to individual), but if you can't stick it out, work it out and fight it out with him or her, why promise to stick together 'for better, for worse, in sickness and in health, till death do you part'? If you can't keep a promise, don't make it.

1 Like

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 12:52pm On Dec 20, 2013
salsera: @ihedinobi
to think it took JK to change all your 'dissertation like grammar' to pidgin by changing topic to yekini matters
smh

JK .....hmm no be today she be legend grin grin
grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:12pm On Dec 20, 2013
Dyekatana: why i married him in the first place? as soon as i know, i'll let you know. i have wondered that more and more in the last few months. i lost my job some time ago. downsizing and all that and am into cakes and all. I love him i guess.... but was looking for..... earthshaking.romeo/juliet. jack/rose a la titanic love (probably not the best examples as none had a happy ending but you get what i am saying).
i was naive and had little knowledge of the world when i got married and now.... i am a different person. but i get you about not giving up on my marriage. i don't want to resign myself to a romanceless existence and at times i talk to myself and say maybe when i'm fifty i will have outgrown the need for romance and if only i can hold on till then... undecided
you're right, my marriage is not the worst in the world and you are right that the more i stay away from him, the more i dislike him and he dislikes me and the vicious cycle goes on and on.
i have tried to be affectionate but i have been met with rebuff after rebuff that i have humorously tagged him cactus man cos he's so prickly when you try to get close to him; but he's my cactus. cheesy i am still trying to get him to flower though.
i have not deactivated my facebook account, i am ashamed to admit... embarassed but i admit it. don't really want to go that far, cos i have a lot there family and biznezz wise and don't want to give that up just for this. but not chatted with you know who either.
shocked shocked shocked shocked shocked shocked shocked This bros de wahala o! You don't know why you married him?!!! Yawa de o!

Anyway, there is a reason that I did that 'dissertation' that I made some pages back on the three 'levels' of love. You aren't the only woman who gets in a marriage without passing through the whirlwind of emotions that we call "falling in love". But, emotions are the most fickle part of the human makeup. You don't need to look further than the usual question some people ask, "is it possible to be in love with more than one person at once?" That question exists because people have experienced romantic feelings for more than one person at the same time. Also, people 'fall in love' with people they least expect to fall in love with.

The fact is that what you did not feel for this dude before and upon getting married is not impossible even now. Over time, if you open up to learning him and bonding with him, amazing things can and, in fact, will happen to you. I'm telling you that without a single doubt. Ordinarily, imprinting himself emotionally upon you is his job, but this dude does not sound like he is free, he sounds like he's under some real serious pressure that's draining him psychologically and emotionally, so it may be up to you to start the fire. It may be a bit unusual but it is neither abnormal nor unique. Other women have done it, yet others will still do it because they want the fire of love in their marital homes.

And you don't get to any point in your life where romance does not matter. My mom is in her late sixties and you need to see her around my dad and what kind of complaints she can make. lipsrsealed (I used to think there was something wrong with my family, thank God I grew up grin) You'll find that emotional desire and bonding does not respect age.

Don't try to get him to feel and act in any certain ways. Just get into his world. Learn his world and alter it for him. Leave your signature on him and he'll come to you. I really hope you try. You'll have a different song soon enough.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:14pm On Dec 20, 2013
bluuu:
how do i deal with the crush and make sure it doesn't escalate to sth else(im single)


i thought BABE is coogar's gf,also one lady that said her bf has double personality offline and online and people decoded it to be coogar.

Crush when you are single
Shoot!
You are allowed to have crushes when you are single
If it escalates to something else and is genuine, that means your heart belongs there ,you simply leave the other person ( in a nice way grin) and migrate
My dear,until you walk that aisle,you are a single woman and can change your mind at anytime
This is the time to do it


I left a fiancé to marry my husband and I have no regrets whatsoever
Go with your heart
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:18pm On Dec 20, 2013
Baby mama:

He sounds to me like a man under tremendous stress and pressure
I am more worried about his health now that you have revealed more
Is he catering for a lot of people in his family?
First son?
Successful son.
Everyone dependent on him?
Are finances tight at this time?
That is how this comes across to me
If he has those pressures maybe he is actually looking for a wife to encourage or help him bear that burden
You may have to look deep
Something is seriously bothering that man and his closing off emotionally is a reaction to what he is going through
If your husband is like most men,he probably doesn't talk much about things like that
You may have to be more observant to find out what the main issue is

Take a few steps back from your emotional needs and look deeper


You lost your job you say ,that makes him the sole provider in the home
That may be part of the issue,the time he is not at work ,he is doing mental calculations as to how to provide for everyone and affection is not in that picture
It is hard to be affectionate when you are under pressure
Honey,I have been with a husband that lost his job after the company he was doing research for went bankrupt and closed down suddenly
With a stay at home wife,two kids that need food and shelter
Men are not romantic when money is tight.

Preach it, sista! grin

1 Like

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:19pm On Dec 20, 2013
jennykadry: Can y'all stop trying to ruin my reputation...yes I am talking to chillisauce, Efe, salsera and aluta who are hell bent on accusing my innocent self of saying things, I know nothing about cheesy

@aluta
Lol, Which method be that? I no fit remember again.

@bolded, grin grin grin grin grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:23pm On Dec 20, 2013
Sidebar

Whenever I eee the name ihedinobi,i remember Flavour's song Ife di n'ukwu grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:26pm On Dec 20, 2013
Chillisauce: @D, you have gotten great tips here already, but I would like to chip in on the ex.

Pls don't de-activate your face book cos of him and never block him without him knowing why, trust me he will find a way to contact you again maybe this one through a channel your husband is aware of. Those ex them never give up cheesy.

Just write him a message about how you guys should quit the little Chit a chat and concentrate on your marriages. That being said, pls, stop contacting me. Thanks, something like that.

What if your husband has been reading your messages but decided to ignore or play along. Be careful babe and delete all previous chats too. Change password too. Ad never forget to sign off nairaland.

As per your husband, concentrate on that which makes you happy with him, work on the others.
Buy some se x toys and start the machine when he is about to change for shower, make I see whether him no go rush u.
As YPP said, watch his mood too and know when to play and crack joke with him.


If all fails, continue your chat with ex jare.
Disclaimer cheesy. Man dies once !
You do know what 'we can't keep doing this' does to a man when a woman says it to him about something forbidden, don't you? It makes him press a little harder for it. I advocate a shutting off without explaining anything until the ardour has cooled. Try explaining and you'll understand what it means for a man to claim territory. Only when a man is himself looking for a way to cut off does he accept 'we can't keep doing this' in any form without really fighting back.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:31pm On Dec 20, 2013
chaircover:

My dear. Please let me tell you the truth, there will be hot times and and there will be cool times in marriages. You are just going through a cool period at the moment with your hubby, and which you would have gotten through it but for the distraction of the ex.

There was another lady on this thread who said that her hubby wasnt romantic; the truth is that romance does not come naturally to many men. When I mean romance I mean romance and not sexx. If you want romance you are just going to have to invest in "teaching" him by example. Do to him the things that you want so he learns. If for example you want him to treat vals day in a big way, then you do the same for him first. When he sees that the house did not fall down, and he sees how much he enjoyed it, he will want to make you happy and do the same for you.

Some men due to their life experiences and upbringing are very uptight and always very serious. A lot of these things are from childhood, so be prepared that he may not totally become the opposite but with time they will gradually become more relaxed and flexible if you continue to work on them. Dont condemn him and make him feel like a failure in that aspect, and choose your words very carefully when you are complaining about his attitude so you dont put his back up.

Dont give up. I know it can be frustrating and it seems that you have to do everything, but it will pay off in the end.
Na excess energy cause me I go de type. This is exactly what I went typing an epistle to say, @bolded. The only difference is that you will need to teach him in a language that he can understand. If you do a candle-lit dinner and he doesn't get it, you may need to learn first what he calls "caring enough to do something special" and start from there to work him slowly up to candle-lit dinners.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:32pm On Dec 20, 2013
chaircover:

He has only one, while I have 3

I have black, white and when I am fed up of both, I can move to my in-between colour i.e van snickers LOL

. . .besides I am still winning; cos my booobs are larger than omotolas tongue cool grin so she will remain on the wall while I am in the bed cheesy
Gaaaddem!
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:35pm On Dec 20, 2013
Baby mama: Sidebar

Whenever I eee the name ihedinobi,i remember Flavour's song Ife di n'ukwu grin
shocked shocked shocked shocked shocked shocked grin grin grin grin grin grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 1:38pm On Dec 20, 2013
Baby mama:

Crush when you are single
Shoot!
You are allowed to have crushes when you are single
If it escalates to something else and is genuine, that means your heart belongs there ,you simply leave the other person ( in a nice way grin) and migrate
My dear,until you walk that aisle,you are a single woman and can change your mind at anytime
This is the time to do it


I left a fiancé to marry my husband and I have no regrets whatsoever
Go with your heart
Na women like you de teach us make we de fear to date una! Shuu!! shocked shocked sad
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by debosky(m): 1:42pm On Dec 20, 2013
Ihedinobi:
Na women like you de teach us make we de fear to date una! Shuu!! shocked shocked sad

Bros - that's the same thing I tell my single male friends. Till you sign that dotted line, it's still up in the air and anything can happen.

When it comes to marriage, there are only two states - single or married.

1 Like

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by wonlasewonimi: 1:44pm On Dec 20, 2013
I'll say kudos to all the agony aunts here for helping the masses engrossed in real life, HD version marital woes.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by debosky(m): 1:45pm On Dec 20, 2013
Ihedinobi:
You do know what 'we can't keep doing this' does to a man when a woman says it to him about something forbidden, don't you? It makes him press a little harder for it. I advocate a shutting off without explaining anything until the ardour has cooled. Try explaining and you'll understand what it means for a man to claim territory. Only when a man is himself looking for a way to cut off does he accept 'we can't keep doing this' in any form without really fighting back.

Not sure I agree. She needs to firmly articulate - to herself first, and then to him - why she wants to end this. Without a firm conviction well established, shutting off for a while means little.

I know many who've had experiences of cutting off suddenly with the hope that ends things, and then a chance meeting occurs and they fall right back to where they were in the first place. If he insists on chasing forbidden fruit after being expressly told, then she can delete him/block him with good reason.

1 Like

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by UjSizzle(f): 1:47pm On Dec 20, 2013
Ihedinobi:
Na women like you de teach us make we de fear to date una! Shuu!! shocked shocked sad
I dunno why guys don't keep that in mind always undecided
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by bluuu: 2:17pm On Dec 20, 2013
thanks baby momma

1 Like

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 2:20pm On Dec 20, 2013
debosky:

Not sure I agree. She needs to firmly articulate - to herself first, and then to him - why she wants to end this. Without a firm conviction well established, shutting off for a while means little.

I know many who've had experiences of cutting off suddenly with the hope that ends things, and then a chance meeting occurs and they fall right back to where they were in the first place. If he insists on chasing forbidden fruit after being expressly told, then she can delete him/block him with good reason.
That makes sense to me. My reason for advocating that she shut off until ardour cools is so that she can gain the firm conviction that you mentioned here. I don't advocate cutting off suddenly without a word because it leaves things open-ended. But you need to be clear within yourself that you want it over for the best reasons before you say it or else the guy's passion will sway you. Emotional involvements no be beans for women. That's why players are so successful.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 2:21pm On Dec 20, 2013
debosky:

Bros - that's the same thing I tell my single male friends. Till you sign that dotted line, it's still up in the air and anything can happen.

When it comes to marriage, there are only two states - single or married.

Yeah I agree. It's still upsetting though. An engagement is a promise. A person who easily breaks that promise will easily break marriage's promise as well.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 2:23pm On Dec 20, 2013
uj_sizzle:
I dunno why guys don't keep that in mind always undecided
Maybe I'll just forget about engagement until the minute before marriage to be sure that there'll be someone at the altar when I get there.

Damn, I better completely forget about it sef. How do I know she won't bale just before saying the vows? I'll know I've got someone when the vows are done.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by debosky(m): 2:31pm On Dec 20, 2013
Ihedinobi:
Yeah I agree. It's still upsetting though. An engagement is a promise. A person who easily breaks that promise will easily break marriage's promise as well.

I understand what you mean, but the realisation of one's 'mistake' and its correction can be effected with much less damage at that stage than if one just goes ahead regardless. It's for a good reason that there is a 'formal' commitment that marks the beginning of the marriage.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 3:01pm On Dec 20, 2013
debosky:

I understand what you mean, but the realisation of one's 'mistake' and its correction can be effected with much less damage at that stage than if one just goes ahead regardless. It's for a good reason that there is a 'formal' commitment that marks the beginning of the marriage.
I dunno, bro. I do agree that engagement is not marriage. But it is a promise no less. I think that engagement has been grossly abused. I think that in the ancient past (whenever that was), it was used when marriage itself was not possible for some very cogent reason. That means that engagement meant that these two people were effectively married but had to wait for some requirement to be finished in order for the marriage to be finalized.

It may mean something not just different but quite nonsensical these days, but if I ever engage a girl, it'll be the same as marrying her for me. Breaking up would be the same as divorce for me. So I will be quite careful who I give that ring to. At worst, I won't give it at all. I'll just wait till I've heard the vows and know that she's not going anywhere before I commit.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by damiso(f): 3:42pm On Dec 20, 2013
Dyekatana you have gotten some very great advise but I just want to buttress on the fact that you can make or rather 'show' your husband how ou want him to meet your needs romantically.As I joked about earlier my husband too is not Mr Romantic or emotional(ok let me say was cos he has really been surprising me in 2013 kiss kiss).As baby mama has alluded to look for why he is the way he is and take it from there.

Dont like giving specifics about my life but I will share this to encourage you and help you not give up on your man.My husband lost his mother quite young.His dad (sorry to say) really sucked at giving the right emotional support to his kids at that critical time and then married again less than 2 yrs after his wife's death . Their stepmother was really horrible to them and thet ended up having to live with relatives . These were relatively sheltered kids who were born in England, driver used to take to school the works then turning into bonafide houseboy in other people's homes . The day my husband shared some of the details with me I saw tears in his eyes. cry.Birthdays, Christmas etc were no longer celebrated and so he kinda grew up thinking all those things are inconsequential.

When we were courting, he did the whole valentine, birthday thing more like a show grin even though he always used to tell me then he did not want a fuss about his birthday and was just ok with it being like any other day.I must say here that he is a great impulsive giver, he could go out and say 'I saw this and thought you would look nice in this'.But birthday, Christmas, Valentines, Anniversary useless angry angry.Intially I used to get upset and nag, 'ehn just a card on our anniversary angry angry.But with time through deep heart to heart talks about his childhood I realised it was just not a big deal to him.He realised though that it upset me and sometimes tried to make an effort.
I decided I would take the Christian look on it and just make a fuss on his birthdays (cook, take him out get him gifts etc) without necessarily expecting the same on mine.Even Christmas I was the chief planner.
This year I got made redundant in February at work so I don't earn as much money as I used to and believe me my husband has really suprised me.As I said at valentines he took me out, bought a gift.On our anniversary he suprised me again with a day away without the kids.This Christmas I am in shock. shocked.He has gone all out, bought all the stuff that are normally my consistuency grin and last night he slept at 12 midnight helping me wrap gifts. :oThat has never happened.On my way out but before I left home just got a delivery for so much drinks that I am wondering who will drink all of it.When I asked him na wa what changed this Christmas grin, he just laughed and said am not serious.His friend told me he does not even want me to remember that I am a lowly student at the mo grin.But I guess my not nagging and doing all these stuff over the years eventually got to him

So my darling dont give up.It is well with your marriage. kiss

4 Likes

Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 3:51pm On Dec 20, 2013
damiso: Dyekatana you have gotten some very great advise but I just want to buttress on the fact that you can make or rather 'show' your husband how ou want him to meet your needs romantically.As I joked about earlier my husband too is not Mr Romantic or emotional(ok let me say was cos he has really been surprising me in 2013 kiss kiss).As baby mama has alluded to look for why he is the way he is and take it from there.

Dont like giving specifics about my life but I will share this to encourage you and help you not give up on your man.My husband lost his mother quite young.His dad (sorry to say) really sucked at giving the right emotional support to his kids at that critical time and then married again less than 2 yrs after his wife's death . Their stepmother was really horrible to them and thet ended up having to live with relatives . These were relatively sheltered kids who were born in England, driver used to take to school the works then turning into bonafide houseboy in other people's homes . The day my husband shared some of the details with me I saw tears in his eyes. cry.Birthdays, Christmas etc were no longer celebrated and so he kinda grew up thinking all those things are inconsequential.

When we were courting, he did the whole valentine, birthday thing more like a show grin even though he always used to tell me then he did not want a fuss about his birthday and was just ok with it being like any other day.I must say here that he is a great impulsive giver, he could go out and say 'I saw this and thought you would look nice in this'.But birthday, Christmas, Valentines, Anniversary useless angry angry.Intially I used to get upset and nag, 'ehn just a card on our anniversary angry angry.But with time through deep heart to heart talks about his childhood I realised it was just not a big deal to him.He realised though that it upset me and sometimes tried to make an effort.
I decided I would take the Christian look on it and just make a fuss on his birthdays (cook, take him out get him gifts etc) without necessarily expecting the same on mine.Even Christmas I was the chief planner.
This year I got made redundant in February at work so I don't earn as much money as I used to and believe me my husband has really suprised me.As I said at valentines he took me out, bought a gift.On our anniversary he suprised me again with a day away without the kids.This Christmas I am in shock. shocked.He has gone all out, bought all the stuff that are normally my consistuency grin and last night he slept at 12 midnight helping me wrap gifts. :oThat has never happened.On my way out but before I left home just got a delivery for so much drinks that I am wondering who will drink all of it.When I asked him na wa what changed this Christmas grin, he just laughed and said am not serious.His friend told me he does not even want me to remember that I am a lowly student at the mo grin.But I guess my not nagging and doing all these stuff over the years eventually got to him

So my darling dont give up.It is well with your marriage. kiss
Lovely o!!!!!!!!!! I was so excited with this story that I almost started whooping. Now this here is what we're talkin about! Good one, sis, good one. grin grin grin grin
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by EfemenaXY: 3:59pm On Dec 20, 2013
Nice one Dami.

Your story is truly inspirational and just goes to show that unwavering persistence can and does pay off in the end. Well done smiley

@Ihe, slight digression - are you still into literature / books? I recall you were once an avid reader...
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by Nobody: 4:08pm On Dec 20, 2013
Efemena_xy: @Ihe, slight digression - are you still into literature / books? I recall you were once an avid reader...
Yeah I am. I slowed down a bit because of some stuff that I'm faced with but I'm very much a reader still.
Re: Making Love & Raising A Family by TV01(m): 4:13pm On Dec 20, 2013
Baby mama:
My dear,until you walk that aisle,you are a single woman and can change your mind at anytime
This is the time to do it
Go with your heart

Ihedinobi: Na women like you de teach us make we de fear to date una! Shuu!! shocked shocked sad


No need to fear. But it is essential that you understand - mainly two things;

1. It's the logical follow-on sequence from "testing". Which is essentially a self-seeking, tick-box exercise

2. Many women are hypergamous - essentially traders, upward traders. Some on a limited basis and some in an open-ended sense.

The ones with a limit will typically trade to maximum utility before marriage. Then societal, family pressure etc. prevails and they sit tight. Can often turn toxic if they don't get their wants (or way), which is usually, as they are never really satisfied. For the open-ended ones, marriage is simply a trick and they'll move on without batting an eyelid when the right opportunity arises. At the extreme end here, you have your black-widows.

Hope you're a bit clearer now - even if no less fearful grin.

Happy hunting dude!

Teefee

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