koyyes: You should have said that a long time ago so I would have in turn told you to step aside or better still scram!!! What solutions have you given so far?What makes you think you are in the position to tell us what to do? You don't know half of Nigeria's history nor do you feel the 'heat'. What gives you that right! You of all people should know better that nigeria's problems are best solved by nigerians- that is what you should be telling us and not the nonsense you've been spewing!! I really hope for your sake that you are not a black forming canadian citizen-that will just make you the worst hypocrite ever! Keep your links to yourself. I am a nigerian and I don't need a FOREIGNER to lecture me on my history!!

Tell that to cam4pres and other foreigners here.And tell Kidstranglehold, the maker of the kongo thread, to get off too since he is a foreigner too.

Africans/Caribbeans/AAs, we are all suffering under the same conditions and we are all making the same stupid mistakes. Since Africa has a long, independent history, a large population, and is the only African society aside from Haiti to have thrived before the whiteman, I thought I should start here. Didn't Kwame Nkrumah learn from the likes of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X before taking his country to the next level? Wasn't African studies(and afrocentrism) born in the west? And without it's contributions to the history books you would not be reciting any of your history like you are doing now.
And what about this guy?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adefunmi
And there are many more too.

Your people stepped onto Haitian soil to help liberate them from the french, then proceeded annexed them into the African union while blabbering about black unity across the Caribbean, and now you are upset about "foreigners" telling you what to do? Bro, please. I've never seen a person so vexed about his people helping each other.

kingston277:
Tell that to cam4pres and other foreigners here.And tell Kidstranglehold, the maker of the kongo thread, to get off too since he is a foreigner too.

Africans/Caribbeans/AAs, we are all suffering under the same conditions and we are all making the same stupid mistakes. Since Africa has a long, independent history, a large population, and is the only African society aside from Haiti to have thrived before the whiteman, I thought I should start here. Didn't Kwame Nkrumah learn from the likes of Marcus Garvey and Malcolm X before taking his country to the next level? Wasn't African studies(and afrocentrism) born in the west? And without it's contributions to the history books you would not be reciting any of your history like you are doing now.
And what about this guy?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adefunmi
And there are many more too.

Your people stepped onto Haitian soil to help liberate them from the french, then proceeded annexed them into the African union while blabbering about black unity across the Caribbean, and now you are upset about "foreigners" telling you what to do? Bro, please. I've never seen a person so vexed about his people helping each other.

You keep contradicting yourself. First of all, you implied that Africans were doing well before we allowed westerners to interfere in our affairs. Now you are promoting external influences to solve africa's problems. What are you saying? I don't want to keep going back and forth. Let me just say this- Nigeria's issues regarding it's culture/ tradition will continue to remain a subject of discussion due to many factors which are unavoidable as long as a country called Nigeria still exists. I have given one of the factors in my earlier post and if really, you are enlightened about Nigeria, you will understand but if not, just leave matters the way they are. This is the least of Nigeria's problem right now.

Lovless: I don't even know any more. I'm pretty much on the fence.

It's sad that our culture is gradually fading away and it hurts me a lot, However, there are some customs and traditions that are just way to primitive and barbaric that they should be done away with completely. No one should dictate how some else should live his or her life. Stuff like marrying off young under aged girls to some middle aged man is just inhumane and disgusting. This is the 21st century you either evolve or die.

But other things like language, attire, (humane)festivals, e.t.c should all be preserved and built upon. Personally I believe we should stop blaming westernisation for all our problems. The white people enlightened us after all. If not for them, we would still probably be killings twins and doing all matter of other inhumane acts. Though sometimes, I wish they hadn't even set foot here since civilizations tend to evolve with time, its not like they didn't engage in barbaric and inhumane practices in the past; They came way to early. If they had just left us alone we would have eventually evolved at our own pace. However, If that had happen, I probably wouldn't even be here typing this.

Personally, I think it is very sad that Nigerian History isn't taught in schools. The little Nigerian history I know is from reading articles on-line and from the stories my grand parents told me. Bringing it back would definitely have an incredible Impact.

I see you mean well, but you err.

Marrying off under age girl is not an African culture or tradition in today's Africa. It's Arab. Most child marriages in Nigeria are linked to Islam or poverty.

Killings of twins was limited to Calabar Efiks. Mary Slessor stopped the killings of twins in Calabar Efiks not the whole of Nigeria. Twins are seen as a gift from other tribes.

Therfore, white man did not enlighten your ancestors.

koyyes: You keep contradicting yourself. First of all, you implied that Africans were doing well before we allowed westerners to interfere in our affairs. Now you are promoting external influences to solve africa's problems. What are you saying?

Does this look like external influence to you?
Oyotunji village, USA
[img]http://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/BAhbCVsHOgZmSSJGdXBsb2Fkcy9wbGFjZV9pbWFnZXMvMjU2NzU3M2M3NTk0ZTdlYWQxY2MwM2ZkYWIwNTYwNzBmMzY2OWVkNi5qcGcGOgZFVFsIOgZwOgp0aHVtYkkiCng0MDA+BjsGVFsHOwc6CnN0cmlwWwk7BzoMY29udmVydEkiEC1xdWFsaXR5IDkxBjsGVDA/2567573c7594e7ead1cc03fdab056070f3669ed6.jpg[/img]

I don't want to keep going back and forth. Let me just say this- Nigeria's issues regarding it's culture/ tradition will continue to remain a subject of discussion due to many factors which are unavoidable as long as a country called Nigeria still exists. I have given one of the factors in my earlier post and if really, you are enlightened about Nigeria, you will understand but if not, just leave matters the way they are. This is the least of Nigeria's problem right now.

Since the "factors" you gave were at least partially inaccurate, it is important to remain objective and look for solutions then back then up with sources. This includes anyone who has something to contribute, no matter where they come from. I have contributed to this thread and placed sources to back up my reasonings. This, hopefully will strike a cord with people looking for change by enlightening them so they can properly tell their position in history.

kingston277:
Does this look like external influence to you?
Oyotunji village, USA
[img]http://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/BAhbCVsHOgZmSSJGdXBsb2Fkcy9wbGFjZV9pbWFnZXMvMjU2NzU3M2M3NTk0ZTdlYWQxY2MwM2ZkYWIwNTYwNzBmMzY2OWVkNi5qcGcGOgZFVFsIOgZwOgp0aHVtYkkiCng0MDA+BjsGVFsHOwc6CnN0cmlwWwk7BzoMY29udmVydEkiEC1xdWFsaXR5IDkxBjsGVDA/2567573c7594e7ead1cc03fdab056070f3669ed6.jpg[/img]

Since the "factors" you gave were at least partially inaccurate, it is important to remain objective and look for solutions then back then up with sources. This includes anyone who has something to contribute, no matter where they come from. I have contributed to this thread and placed sources to back up my reasonings. This, hopefully will strike a cord with people looking for change by enlightening them so they can properly tell their position in history.

Are you Ghanian or Caribbean?

Fulaman198:

Absolutely, the Bini (Edo) people influenced the Yoruba and vice versa. However, that is due to the fact that they live in close contact with one another. The Edos and Yorubas are neighbours. At one point, there were even many people from present day Edo state that spoke Yoruba language. As aforementioned, I can understand neighbouring cultures influencing one another. Like the Wolof and Serer influencing the Fulani in Senegal that many Senegalese Fulani have adopted the word "Ndeysaan" which means forgiveness in their Fulani dialect. In Nigeria, many Fulani Fulani have adopted Hausa words like "Sai or Sey" which means "until" into our own language.

I am not worried about other Africans influencing other Africans. I am more worried about Africans kicking their respective cultures to the curb (which is becoming a worldwide phenomenon). The most widely spoken language (not talking about things from a population perspective) is English.........why? English is not an African language, but it seems to have gained the highest amount of usage around the world. Pretty soon people will say, hmmm what is the point of speaking my language when I can just communicate in English. To me that is epic fail and I'm glad I won't see that this lifetime I hope (I'm 30 years old I still have many years to live God willing ). So as a young man, I know I'm supposed to think it's cool that Africans are no longer behaving 'African', but I don't think it's cool. I think it's quite sad and appalling.

How many African tales do you know? Recently, I acquired an app from the Google Play Store that is most likely Yoruba, but tells tales children folktales that made me feel very happy inside. Will those tales and stories still be around even 30 years from now?

As a person who has a lot of experience in the sciences, maths and engineering, I do agree with one person who stated that with the advent of technology, people are beginning to be less and less like themselves. With the advent of things like Youtube, People can watch videos and movies on how Westerners behave and try to act and behave in a similar manner. Is there no shame in that itself? Whatever happened to being ones self?

Therefore, to answer your second question, there are many things that influence culture these days, it is not only interaction with other groups of people, it's also the fact that human beings are more than willing to give up their own culture for a culture they feel or deem is superior to their own. There are many a Nigerian who have never come across Americans, but since they have Youtube or other video streaming sites, they think they are imitating the way Americans behave.

Look at how many Nigerians who try to talk and imitate American accents in Naija sef. That should tell you something my brother.

OK...seems the issue was the mind set
People looking down on their culture..?


Then you should look beyond the symptoms and deal with the issue

Its a power game
The conquering culture sets the pace

Globalisation, common language, IMF..

The Chinese had to bring their own money to the table to be heard...
Without that they were seen as primitive

Until you understand this...

koyyes: Good point, but don't forget that the country you are using as an example has a unified religion-ISLAM which has its own culture and Tradition. Correct me if I'm wrong but I understand that the lingua franca there is strictly ARABIC. That basically makes it easier for them to have one VOICE just like the AMERICANS who speak only ENGLISH. But do we have just one religion- NO. Do we have one language- NO. Do we have one voice- NO. So if I say we are united, I would be lying to myself when I can clearly see religious and tribal wars around me and how 1,2 or 3 major tribes are claiming superiority over the rest. THIS IS JUST ONE FACTOR- A HOUSE THAT IS DIVIDED CANNOT STAND AGAINST EXTERNAL INFLUENCES. The consequence of using a foreign language as our unifying lingua franca is what we are facing today. Why? Because we are not united, we do not believe in ourselves and worst of all, we are pretentious and hate each other. Read your history books, you'll understand why.

true but Singapore, Belgium, Switzerland, Indonesia, are multi ethnic and they seem to be doing fine more or less

pickabeau1:

OK...seems the issue was the mind set
People looking down on their culture..?


Then you should look beyond the symptoms and deal with the issue

Its a power game
The conquering culture sets the pace

Globalisation, common language, IMF..

The Chinese had to bring their own money to the table to be heard...
Without that they were seen as primitive

Until you understand this...

which is bad if you're a poor nation or like to keep your culture alive

kingston277:
Does this look like external influence to you?
Oyotunji village, USA
[img]http://assets.atlasobscura.com/media/BAhbCVsHOgZmSSJGdXBsb2Fkcy9wbGFjZV9pbWFnZXMvMjU2NzU3M2M3NTk0ZTdlYWQxY2MwM2ZkYWIwNTYwNzBmMzY2OWVkNi5qcGcGOgZFVFsIOgZwOgp0aHVtYkkiCng0MDA+BjsGVFsHOwc6CnN0cmlwWwk7BzoMY29udmVydEkiEC1xdWFsaXR5IDkxBjsGVDA/2567573c7594e7ead1cc03fdab056070f3669ed6.jpg[/img]

Since the "factors" you gave were at least partially inaccurate, it is important to remain objective and look for solutions then back then up with sources. This includes anyone who has something to contribute, no matter where they come from. I have contributed to this thread and placed sources to back up my reasonings. This, hopefully will strike a cord with people looking for change by enlightening them so they can properly tell their position in history.

What in the world is this?, advice Africans to move with time and not play nollywood films like people that want to be stuck in the past. This should be the last recommendation from someone claiming canadian citizen. Why gathering like that in a foreign land( don't they change their clothing after the meeting and put on western clothes when they go to work) if they want to prove a point, let them go back to their country to continue their meetings and contribute directly to the development of their country!! And by the way, don't you think their presence there has an influence on the american citizen like they have on us? Or are you not aware that some whites enjoy listening to afro juju music? Haven't you seen african prints and ankara materials being used in the fashion industry? We like it when we spread our culture to the western land but we don't like it when they spread their's to our land. Is that not selfishness!!!

TerryCarr:
true but Singapore, Belgium, Switzerland, Indonesia, are multi ethnic and they seem to be doing fine more or less

Those countries are not as diverse as Nigeria.

koyyes: Those countries are not as diverse as Nigeria.

"There are around 300 distinct native ethnic groups in Indonesia, and 742 different languages and dialects"
[img]http://austroindo.files./2014/02/1191px-indonesia_ethnic_groups_map_english-svg.png[/img]

Fulaman198:

Thank you for this, so you understand what I'm saying.

I understand the need for knowing our history. But like I asked someone above , could you maybe enumerate some of the
customs, laws and beliefs that we have lost and should go back to?

TerryCarr:
"There are around 300 distinct native ethnic groups in Indonesia, and 742 different languages and dialects"
[img]http://austroindo.files./2014/02/1191px-indonesia_ethnic_groups_map_english-svg.png[/img]

http://nigeriavillagesquare.com/forum/images/magnetic/icons/icon1.png http://nigeriavillagesquare.com/forum/main-square/69232-nigeria-has-over-500-languages.html I used to think that Nigeria has over 500 languages instead of 200 languages. But right now, I'm not even sure anymore. This is a country where we are not technologically advanced to know our exact population because it is impossible for census officials to get to the remote areas of each state. Some just get to the urban areas and that's it! It's impossible to know the exact number of ethnic group in Nigeria that is why the common man just categorizes someone from calabar as ibo! This is just for language alone, how about religion,believes and values? That's another issue.

Exactly

TerryCarr:
which is bad if you're a poor nation or like to keep your culture alive
[img]ttp://onlinegeography.wikispaces.com/file/view/Burger_lady.jpg/221176758/418x418/Burger_lady.jpg[/img]

Fulaman198: My entire topic could not fit in the subject.

My question to the Nairaland populace is whether as individuals you even care about your very own culture, tradition, language and heritage anymore? If not, where does your inferiority complex stem from? What has transformed you into a person with no identity? Thanks!

Your very question is already prejudiced. Like you, the vast majority are conscious of those things and defer to it. That is the very reason why we continue to remain a backward continent. Everything you defend as your "culture" today was also practiced by your superiors in other continents until they knew better and changed. They stopped killing "witches" in England in the 1600s; this is 2014. The latest one they're giving up now which is dumped on your society and worrying you all is Christianity and Islam.

Go and read and stop regurgitating the prejudice you were born in. I love many African music, clothing and art, but by God I hate the vast majority of your traditions, values and belief system

pickabeau1:

OK...seems the issue was the mind set
People looking down on their culture..?


Then you should look beyond the symptoms and deal with the issue

Its a power game
The conquering culture sets the pace

Globalisation, common language, IMF..

The Chinese had to bring their own money to the table to be heard...
Without that they were seen as primitive

Until you understand this...

I understand it wholeheartedly, the problem is that I'm not happy about it.

Fulaman198:

I understand it wholeheartedly, the problem is that I'm not happy about it.

Im also not happy
But a house divided against itself cant stand
Naija has to first be.. before you can fly
Same with Africa

blackprowler:

Your very question is already prejudiced. Like you, the vast majority are conscious of those things and defer to it. That is the very reason why we continue to remain a backward continent. Everything you defend as your "culture" today was also practiced by your superiors in other continents until they knew better and changed. They stopped killing "witches" in England in the 1600s; this is 2014. The latest one they're giving up now which is dumped on your society and worrying you all is Christianity and Islam.

Go and read and stop regurgitating the prejudice you were born in. I love many African music, clothing and art, but by God I hate the vast majority of your traditions, values and belief system

Rubbish, all of those things you are calling barbaric is you being brainwashed by your Western masters. How do you know these things happened? Because Oyibo man said so?

What could be more barbaric than the advent of nuclear weapons that can easily wipe out the entire world. It's not cultures that are barbaric, it's human beings that are. Have you not seen the impact of nuclear weapons? What about all those chemical weapons that are developed in all these so-called advanced civilisations? Do you not see fault with them?

pickabeau1:

Im also not happy
But a house divided against itself cant stand
Naija has to first be.. before you can fly
Same with Africa

100% agree

Lmaoo tpia5 na wa ooo

Please Kingston, don't mind the brainwashed slaves, knock their heads and move on, you can't save everyone, we should only make sure that the 1diots roaming our continent don't become the majority, imagine that girl saying she became wiser lmfaooo and the other fellow to say that his culture evolves lol tho , I believe culture is dynamic to some extent but those changes have to b made from within and voluntary:..furthermore there's a difference between dropping your culture and changing it, to bad most did the former...
I had a gf, who was always complaining that I'm too traditionalist, wth does that mean

Tho fulaman didn't mention or single out women, denying that they are the weakest link and the most brainwashed is like denying the existence of the sun @fulanigirl

CAMNEWTON4PRES: Lmaoo tpia5 na wa ooo

Please Kingston, don't mind the brainwashed slaves, knock their heads and move on, you can't save everyone, we should only make sure that the 1diots roaming our continent don't become the majority, imagine that girl saying she became wiser lmfaooo and the other fellow to say that his culture evolves lol tho , I believe culture is dynamic to some extent but those changes have to b made from within and voluntary:..furthermore there's a difference between dropping your culture and changing it, to bad most did the former...
I had a gf, who was always complaining that I'm too traditionalist, wth does that mean

Tho fulaman didn't mention or single out women, denying that they are the weakest link and the most brainwashed is like denying the existence of the sun @fulanigirl

If you believe culture is dynamic why does it seem you don't like change

blackprowler:

Your very question is already prejudiced. Like you, the vast majority are conscious of those things and defer to it. That is the very reason why we continue to remain a backward continent. Everything you defend as your "culture" today was also practiced by your superiors in other continents until they knew better and changed. They stopped killing "witches" in England in the 1600s; this is 2014. The latest one they're giving up now which is dumped on your society and worrying you all is Christianity and Islam.

Go and read and stop regurgitating the prejudice you were born in. I love many African music, clothing and art, but by God I hate the vast majority of your traditions, values and belief system

Really our superiors , our traditions ? Dayum don't know whether to laugh or cry
So you basically hate your identity that's if you are even African

Btw who determines what's civilized or being civilized is ? Can you all stop judging us through Western paradigms and your westernized brains?
No need to add you can't miss what you never had

pickabeau1:

If you believe culture is dynamic why does it seem you don't like change

Like I said it Must come from within + there are things that shouldn't change or shouldn't be thrown away , things which are not negotiable

tpia5:

African culture means never crossing the sea.

So, if you have, you've already chainged and westernized your culture.

I hope this is a joke? Like really then what?
Swimming is also being westernized?
Using a phone too right?

CAMNEWTON4PRES:

Like I said it Must come from within + there are things that shouldn't change or shouldn't be thrown away , things which are not negotiable

I had asked Fulaman earlier but got no response
- What are these non-negotiable aspects of culture

- How many instances of culture dynamics do you know that were organic and not forced. give examples please

BTW, pickabeau I forgot to add that I'm still pondering on the possibility of such dynamism , since African history ain't well recorded it is difficult to know if indeed our cultures changed and how many times ...I have to admit that my brain can not accept the fact that we always practiced the Same culture (pre slavery nd invasion) esp because most African ethnic groups migrated a lot and were even in migration during the invasions/genocides (wrongly called colonization)

CAMNEWTON4PRES: BTW, pickabeau I forgot to add that I'm still pondering on the possibility of such dynamism , since African history ain't well recorded it is difficult to know if indeed our cultures changed and how many times ...I have to admit that my brain can not accept the fact that we always practiced the Same culture (pre slavery nd invasion) esp because most African ethnic groups migrated a lot and were even in migration during the invasions/genocides (wrongly called colonization)

Ok,..while its not well recorded, griots recorded history orally
Oral history is available

Nice points

pickabeau1:


I had asked Fulaman earlier but got no response
- What are these non-negotiable aspects of culture

- How many instances of culture dynamics do you know that were organic and not forced. give examples please

I knew this was coming, I believe my last post will answer your questions.

pickabeau1:

Ok,..while its not well recorded, griots recorded history orally
Oral history is available

Nice points

Most of those stuffs are about genealogy and to some extent the origin of the tribe/ethnic group ..at least where I'm from, we have what is called the Mvett although very interesting, it doesn't tell much about the culture per se

CAMNEWTON4PRES:


I hope this is a joke? Like really then what?
Swimming is also being westernized?
Using a phone too right?

so you dont know traditionally, african culture forbids crossing the sea?

tpia6:


so you dont know traditionally, african culture forbids crossing the sea?

Are you implying that traveling , curiosity, discovering are Western things?

Africans psychological hate or blockage for the sea has a lot to do with slavery, pre slavery we used to travel through the sea, just look at the islands surrounding us, how did we get there if not through the sea ?

Anyway I don't know all African cultures and I from the forest but I really doubt any African culture has anything against the sea est with a continent a surrounded by water bodies, I mean common ...who exactly? Ijaw ? Sawa ?

koyyes: What in the world is this?, advice Africans to move with time and not play nollywood films like people that want to be stuck in the past. This should be the last recommendation from someone claiming canadian citizen.

What's wrong with sticking with culture, seems like you need tutoring on what tradition is
https://www.nairaland.com/1796388/tradition-progress

Why gathering like that in a foreign land( don't they change their clothing after the meeting and put on western clothes when they go to work) if they want to prove a point, let them go back to their country to continue their meetings and contribute directly to the development of their country!!

It seems you didn't do the research. All of those people are AAs who converted to yoruba religion and are trying to spread African culture and prove a point as you said. I used him as an example of a foreigner trying to influence and promote Africa.

And by the way, don't you think their presence there has an influence on the american citizen like they have on us? Or are you not aware that some whites enjoy listening to afro juju music? Haven't you seen african prints and ankara materials being used in the fashion industry? We like it when we spread our culture to the western land but we don't like it when they spread their's to our land. Is that not selfishness!!!

We simply don't like non-progressive aspects of culture which is much of western culture taught to Africa in a nutshell, read the link I posted.