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Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 8:35pm On Aug 23, 2017 |
PastorAIO: Pls explain what you mean by consiouness so that I can understand what you are talking about. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by CatfishBilly: 10:52pm On Aug 23, 2017 |
dalaman:The vast majority of science is of the agreement that consciousness resides squarely in the Central nervous system. There's no out of body consciousness that's separated from the brain. It has never been proven last I researched. 2 Likes |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 11:12pm On Aug 23, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: I was surprised when butterflylion came up with his empty and baseless claim that has no evidence at all. I asked him to provide evidence and he ran away. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 6:11am On Aug 24, 2017 |
CatfishBilly: The VAT majority of science assume that consciousness resides within the brain and that is simply because science is based on what we can see, touch, hear and feel so anything outside that boundary is discarded as they have no equipment or parameters to study them and that is another reason why they still question NDE. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 6:21am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: Where is your own evidence to show that consciousness is generated outside the brain and how can that be clearly demonstrated? You have to provide evidence for your own assumptions as well. What generates consciousness? It's very easy to make wild and empty claims. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 6:47am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: The problem with you is that you think too highly of yourself and always try to convince yourself that what you say is actually true. Here you are claiming I ran away when I told you on another thread that I would respond to you on my own time and not based on your demand. The below post is for you.
! We can see that science is also taking the posture of consciousness not being brain based because thought isn't confines to the brain yet the brain processes thought whenever it pops up which is similar to what Rupert Sheldrake said that the brain is like a radio set that receives and interpreted signals but does not generate them. I know that even you, a lot of times you have woken up happy and full of good thoughts but out of nowhere a negative thought just pops into your head and you cannot understand why you are having such a thought despite being positively happy. Or when you are driving down the road and fully concentrated on your driving and then suddenly a thought pops into your head that you need to call someone (without you even thinking about it) the thought just pops up from nowhere. I am sure if you sit down and think about it, you will discover I am right. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 6:47am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: I do not think you read where I said science is evidential while not everything is tangible. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 6:52am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: Which science? You just threw quotes at me without links. What am I to do with them? Where are the links to your post? I asked you to show me what generates consciousness and how it can be clearly demonstrated. You haven't done that but throw more wild assumptions from who knows where claiming it's science. Where did you get those quotes from? Next time make sure you post the source where you lift your materials. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by felixomor: 6:53am On Aug 24, 2017 |
Some people are already telling lies above. Anyway, here is a video that explains several incidents of people recalling and having vivid conscious awareness even without brain activity. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_qBIw7qyHU 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 6:54am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: Where is the scientific evidence that shows that consciousness is generated outside the brain and how has that been clearly demonstrated scientifically? |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 6:57am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: http://www.supernoetics.com/is-this-proof-the-brain-is-not-the-seat-of-consciousness/ |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by felixomor: 7:01am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: They are quite even more numerous studies http://www.express.co.uk/news/science/670781/There-IS-life-after-DEATH-Scientists-reveal-shock-findings-from-groundbreaking-study 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 7:03am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: I think you are beginning to mock yourself. Clearly you read where I said science is beginning to tow the line that consciousness isn't brain based and here you are trying to force me to tell you where consciousness comes from. Don't worry, the ground breaking research was published just in June 2017 so evidence would follow soon for you that consciousness isn't brain based. Do you actually "originate" your thoughts from your brain or your brain simply processes them? Is it everything you want to think about that comes as you want them or a lot of other undesired thoughts also come along but your brain simply chooses what you want from all that mess. You wake up in the morning and the thought "coffee" pops into your head without you thinking about it. Your brain begins to process the information and you suddenly feel a longing for coffee and your brain decides how coffee is prepared and you get up and make yourself one. All this happens in Nano seconds but you can actually freeze the process by asking yourself questions in the moment like, "but I do not need coffee so why am I thinking about it"?. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 7:10am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: What we have up there are just speculations. They claim the brain is 3 dimensional and there are other mathematical dimensional plains. They even concluded with this: Note that extra mathematical dimensions are pure[b] abstractions[/b]; they do not actually exist, except to make formulas balance up when the formula is otherwise WRONG! What am I to do with wild speculations? What generates consciousness is what you are to show not throwing wild mathematical abstract and imaginations at me. 2 Likes 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 7:10am On Aug 24, 2017 |
felixomor: This is a quote from you link felixomor Furthermore, the detailed recollections of visual awareness in this case were consistent with verified events. Cc dalaman. What that quote means is that people who came back after heart failure or no brain activity actually gave detailed recollections of things they saw from outside their body which was going on around them and their visual observations were verified as actual events happening when they lay dead and without brain activity. So how could they still see and recollect without the help of the brain? 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 7:12am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: I do not think you understood that quote. This was what it meant. For the limits of science these abstractions do not exist but they can be mathematically calculated because mathematics isn't limited to tangible things so they aid to bring balance when physical formulas are wrong. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by felixomor: 7:13am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: These things are simple. We know why its hard for those who claim it is hard. 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 7:29am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: By the way, the brain is 3 dimensional and that is a fact and not a claim. However they discovered that this same brain creates 11 dimensions within itself and the questions is WHY? what would make the brain create 11 dimensional walls in its information centre when physically there is no reason to do that since it only receives 3 dimensional stimuli. So why the 11 dimensional wall? Could it be that it is receiving an 11 dimensional stimuli from another source outside its physical 3 dimensional stimuli? There is a huge gap between 3D and 11D and if 3D still blows our mind today then imagine what 10D or 11D would do. It would be like unlocking the full potentials of the brain and being able to see everything from the front, back, side, top, bottom, in between, inside out, outside in, in colours that do not physically exist, and calculating all these information at the same time. Something else is causing an 11 dimensional stimuli on the brain. 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 8:34am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: The dimensions were clearly stated to be be mathematical abstracts from the link you posted. They do not actually exist in reality. They are just mathematical abstracts. You are to provide evidence not speculations of could it would it should it. I don't have any interest in your own opinions and speculations. The evidence of what generates consciousness is what you are to provide not mathematical abstracts, opinions and wild imaginations. You made the claim to provide evidence for your speculations and assumptions. What is is this elusive source? What's it's name and how can it be clearly verified? I don't want your opinions. 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 8:37am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: What am I to do with your opinions? This is what it says: Note that extra mathematical dimensions are pure abstractions; they do not actually exist, except to make formulas balance up when the formula is otherwise WRONG! I can read and understand clearly. I do not need your opinions and interpretations. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 8:50am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: Ogbeni what generates consciousness is what you are to tell me. What is the name of the thing that generates it, how can it be clearly demonstrated. These are what you are to provide answers to not writing epistles about coffee. What generates consciousness? Tell me the name of the thing and how it can be demonstrated. It's simple. 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 8:53am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: Gosh! Let me break it down. The brain is a reaction and processing unit. It reacts to what we see, touch, feel, hear etc and builds structures which can handle such external stimuli. The Brain is a 3 dimensional machine which it has become due to our restriction to 3 dimensional assessment and visualisation. However an 11 dimensional response structure was found to reside in the brain and since the brain only builds structures based on information stimulating it then something beyond our known 3 dimensional exposure is causing this 11 dimensional response. Our world does not have 5D to 11D stimulations so the brain could not have developed those 11 dimensional structural responses in its neurons on its own. It came from a source above our 3 dimensional world. That is as simple as I can put it and if you still do not understand it then good luck 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:00am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: so suddenly mathematics does not provide evidence simply because you do not see it? Are mathematical equations real or are the results real? That's what the quote meant by balancing things. Mathematics are simply calculations which help confirm something intangible and brings it to tangibility. Is this equation tangible? No it is not. But it helps prove something that exists. That is what mathematics does. 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:04am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: You clearly do not understand what they meant by mathematical dimensions are pure abstractions and that they do not actually exist. They simply help balance and prove what exists which sometimes are not seen or felt by our human senses |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 9:08am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: What generates consciousness and how can it be clearly demonstrated is what you are to provide evidence for not telling me something bla bla bla. Something? What is the thing? What's it's name? How can it be clearly verified? What is this source you are speculating? |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:10am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: You cannot force anything out of me. You believe in science and science is already showing that consciousness exists outside the brain as I have shown you. You need to pause and stop being shallow and actually think. If nothing should jump start your thinking process then my post about 11 dimensional structures being found in a 3 dimensional brain when a 3 dimensional stimuli cannot generate an 11 dimensional response from the brain should have forced you to actually do some thinking as a supposed critical thinking atheist but instead of engaging your thought process you would rather sweep such a huge significant find aside simply because you wish to keep arguing. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:12am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: This your comment shows you are not a critical thinker and also not a scientific mind. Despite all I keep saying, and you keep reading, you keep repeating this? 1 Like 1 Share |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 9:15am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: Mathematics has brought the tangiblility of what generates consciousness what? What is the thing? |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by dalaman: 9:20am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: That is because you are NOT saying anything meaningful or relevant to the question am asking. You claimed that consciousness is generated outside the brain by a source. All I've asked you to do is tell me what generates it, and state this elusive source you have been talking about. Simple question. What generates consciousness? 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:23am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: How are 3 dimensional objects calculated? How are visual aids which assist in viewing 3D calculated and made us aware that 3D actually exists? MATHEMATICS! now they found 11D structures in the brain and how were they able to calculate it to be 11D? MATHEMATICS! I never said mathematics brought the tangibility of what generates consciousness so I do not know where you read that from. What I said was simply that our world offers a strict 3 dimensional external stimuli and our brain is meant to restrict itself to what stimulates it but clearly the brain isn't doing that because it has 11 dimensional structures in it and this goes against how things should be since we only offer 3D in our world. So where is the 11D emanating from? It's like the brain upgrades itself to receive 11D information and then downgrades to give out 3D feedback. One end is 3D (our end) the other end is 11D. Without mathematics calculating this 11D existence how would we have known that such a thing existed? Now we know that this exists, how come is the brain having it when there is nothing on our planet capable of causing such stimulation which would cause such a reaction from the brain? You really need critical thinking in order to follow my train of thought dalaman. |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by butterflylion: 9:24am On Aug 24, 2017 |
dalaman: Actual critical thinking is not meant to make sense to a non critical thinker so I understand your struggle. 1 Like |
Re: Atheists Who Believe In The Supernatural Please Come In(discussion) by felixomor: 9:42am On Aug 24, 2017 |
butterflylion: By now you should know how he argues. He argues by repeating the same sentence over and over again. Even when u have addressed what he is saying And then before you know, he starts repeating the exact same words you are using. By the way, I thought they were after "scientific evidence" ? Now it is mathematics. SMH 1 Like |
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