Jehovah's witnesses believe Yeshua did not rise bodily from the dead, that He rose a Spirit but this is false.

tlfacts:

Jehovah's witnesses believe Yeshua did not rise bodily from the dead, that He rose a Spirit but this is false.

Adherents of the Grail Message share similar New Age beliefs.

But Bible says it in plain language,
1 Peter 3:18 "Why, even Christ died once for all time concerning sins, a righteous [person] for unrighteous ones, that he might lead YOU to God, he being put to death in the flesh, but being made alive in the spirit".

Well done for that short proof!

Sooo, what next?

OLAADEGBU:

Adherents of the Grail Message share similar New Age beliefs.

The Grail Message does not teach that Jesus rose from the dead as a spirit. What the Grail Message says is that Jesus did not rise from the dead with a physical body. The Grail Message teaches that Jesus rose from the dead with another body that is not physical. That body is refered to as ethereal body and is much finer than the physical body. Material bodies have three basic species and many subspecies. The coarsest is the physical body, then the astral body and the finest is the ethereal body. All human beings living on earth in physical bodies have both astral and ethereal bodies telescoped into the physical body. The ethereal body is the first material cloak that covers the spirit. Death is simply the separation of the physical/astral body from the ethereal body which cloaks the spirit. Best Wishes.

m_nwankwo:

The Grail Message does not teach that Jesus rose from the dead as a spirit. What the Grail Message says is that Jesus did not rise from the dead with a physical body. The Grail Message teaches that Jesus rose from the dead with another body that is not physical. That body is refered to as ethereal body and is much finer than the physical body. Material bodies have three basic species and many subspecies. The coarsest is the physical body, then the astral body and the finest is the ethereal body. All human beings living on earth in physical bodies have both astral and ethereal bodies telescoped into the physical body. The ethereal body is the first material cloak that covers the spirit. Death is simply the separation of the physical/astral body from the ethereal body which cloaks the spirit. Best Wishes.

That is New Age doctrine par excellence.

Preaching The Resurrection

"And with great power gave the apostles witness of the resurrection of the Lord Jesus: and great grace was upon them all" (Acts 4:33).

There are multitudes today who believe that Christ’s resurrection was a "spiritual" resurrection, insisting that the idea of a dead body returning to life after three days in the grave is completely unscientific and impossible.

This was not what the apostles preached with great grace and great power, however.  They would hardly have been excited about any kind of spiritual resurrection, since everyone—both Jews and the pagan Gentiles—believed in life after death.  If that was their message, no one would have doubted, and no one would have cared.  Even when the disciples saw the resurrected Christ, they first "supposed that they had seen a spirit" (Luke 24:37).  Christ even had to urge them to "handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have" (Luke 24:39).

When the disciples finally became convinced of His bodily resurrection, they were quickly transformed into courageous evangelists, willing even to die in support of their glorious message of salvation.  The resurrection was, indeed, contrary to scientific law and all human experience, and this very fact proved to them that their Lord was Himself the divine lawgiver and Author of all human experience.  All other founders and leaders of human religions, ancient or modern, are themselves subject to death, but He alone has triumphed over death.  Only the Creator of life can conquer death, and the resurrection proves that Jesus Christ is Creator, as well as Saviour.

Therefore, when we today, like the apostles of old, proclaim the resurrection of Christ, we know that His name is above every name, and this enables us also to witness with great power, in great grace. HMM

OLAADEGBU:

That is New Age doctrine par excellence.

You can label what I said in anyway that you want. What is important is that I have stated what the Grail Message teaches. Best Wishes.

Resurrect in spiritual body is different from spiritual resurrection, take note.

Spiritual body is heavenly body like that of angels.
You can consider Apostle Paul powerful argument here:

"So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption, it is raised up in incorruption. It is sown in dishonor, it is raised up in glory. It is sown in weakness, it is raised up in power. It is sown a physical body, it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one.

Evidently Jesus was raised in spiritual body.

You wrote "evidently . . . " - couldn't miss that: that's a typical JW argument; they're getting to you, even if you don't know and admit it.

Here: Paul's argument may indicate that there're spiritual bodies, but that isn't evident from what he wrote. You need a measure of 'faith' to accept it. And that ought to be enough.

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Nimshi:

You wrote "evidently . . . " - couldn't miss that: that's a typical JW argument; they're getting to you, even if you don't know and admit it.

Here: Paul's argument may indicate that there're spiritual bodies, but that isn't evident from what he wrote. You need a measure of 'faith' to accept it. And that ought to be enough.

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I don't see why it matters whether or not it is a typical JW argument. What I'm concerned with is whether it is a valid argument. Is it?

TrueSeeker:

But Bible says it in plain language,
1 Peter 3:18 "Why, even Christ died once for all time concerning sins, a righteous [person] for unrighteous ones, that he might lead YOU to God, he being put to death in the flesh, but being made alive in the spirit".

But it is also wriiten in d same bible that he appeared to his followers and showed them his feet and hands dat was nailed


or is dis confussion?

Pastor AIO:

I don't see why it matters whether or not it is a typical JW argument. What I'm concerned with is whether it is a valid argument. Is it?

It matters all when you state "evidently" when nothing is evident.

Paul's 'argument' isn't relevant to the JW position: there were many resurrections in the bible.

In fact, resurrections were pretty much commonplace events then, like meeting your friends on the street.

Lazarus? The son of the widow? And several sevral other nameless people who were resurrected in the bible. What makes one more resurrection special?

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Nimshi:

It matters all when you state "evidently" when nothing is evident.

Paul's 'argument' isn't relevant to the JW position: there were many resurrections in the bible.

In fact, resurrections were pretty much commonplace events then, like meeting your friends on the street.

Lazarus? The son of the widow? And several sevral other nameless people who were resurrected in the bible. What makes one more resurrection special?

.

How isn't Paul's 'argument' relevant to the JW position?

I am not questioning the specialness of Jesus' resurrection. Neither I am questioning whether or not there were others that were resurrected before or after Jesus. Apparently a whole host of saints came out of their graves after Jesus' death. That is not the issue here.

The issue is whether or not there is such a thing as a spiritual body and whether it is in this form that Jesus is supposed to have risen. Rather than in a physical body. That is what I am concerned with.

How does this statement

it is raised up a spiritual body. If there is a physical body, there is also a spiritual one.

fail to suggest that Christ was raised in a spiritual body. And how does accepting this as evident make one a JW?

I lack the depth to analyze this with any sense of conviction so i will say like so,

It is claimed that Enoch did not die but was taken up to heaven, so was Elijah in their bodily form. Now Jesus died (from numerous eye-witness accounts i gather ) and rose on the 3rd day and ascended into heaven. What i have wondered is why we are promised heavenly (ethereal) spiritual bodies (since God is not in physical bodily form), why have some people carried this slowly rotting corpse to Heaven. to what end and based on what level of Wisdom.

I would like to believe that everyone dies (passes over) to enter a new world (dimension) in a different consciousness that is befitting for that world. same confusion when i hear that heaven is tiled with marble and has roads paved with Gold and gates of pearl, i mean of what use is this to a spirit form that can better appreciate non-worldly things, na wa for these writers sef

Pastor AIO:
How isn't Paul's 'argument' relevant to the JW position?

Paul's "argument" is no argument.

It doesn't necessarily follow that because there's a physical body, then there must be a spiritual one. Of course, this does not imply there're no spirutual bodies, only that Paul's "IF" --> "THEN" statement doesn't cut it as logical.

I am not questioning the specialness of Jesus' resurrection. Neither I am questioning whether or not there were others that were resurrected before or after Jesus. Apparently a whole host of saints came out of their graves after Jesus' death. That is not the issue here.

An attempt at escape. Why? Because of resurections will be the vehicle to show that there're spiritual bodies because physical ones do exist, then all resurrections are relevant. That would mean knowing whether Lazarus was raised with a spiritual body, say. He clearly wasn't. That would also imply something special about Jesus' resurrection, which is perhaps the only instance releveant to Paul's "argument".

The issue is whether or not there is such a thing as a spiritual body and whether it is in this form that Jesus is supposed to have risen. Rather than in a physical body. That is what I am concerned with.

This "issue" assumes that there's something special about Jesus' resurrection; there's no point having a discussion with you if you don't see what's an elementary/pedestrian corollary of the proposition.

How does this statement fail to suggest that Christ was raised in a spiritual body. And how does accepting this as evident make one a JW?

You've misunderstood the JW allusion; no time to explain it; the poster to whom the original post is directed probably understands.

Nimshi:

It matters all when you state "evidently" when nothing is evident.

Paul's 'argument' isn't relevant to the JW position: there were many resurrections in the bible.

In fact, resurrections were pretty much commonplace events then, like meeting your friends on the street.

Lazarus? The son of the widow? And several sevral other nameless people who were resurrected in the bible. What makes one more resurrection special?
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The resurrection of Jesus Christ is special, because unlike the other ones that took place in the Holy Bible, He never did die again. Rather, He resurrected to Heaven. Lazarus, the son of the widow and the rest who were resurrected eventually died.

Ndipe

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is special, because unlike the other ones that took place in the Holy Bible, He never did die again. Rather, He resurrected to Heaven. Lazarus, the son of the widow and the rest who were resurrected eventually died.

That is the point!

alimat 2:

But it is also wriiten in d same bible that he appeared to his followers and showed them his feet and hands dat was nailed


or is dis confussion?

It is not a confusion, people do see angels and touch them though they have spiritual body, so Christ, being 'made alive' in spirit does not contradict the account that he was touch by his disciples.

Hope you got that.

Ndipe:

The resurrection of Jesus Christ is special, because unlike the other ones that took place in the Holy Bible, He never did die again. Rather, He resurrected to Heaven. Lazarus, the son of the widow and the rest who were resurrected eventually died.

So there're at least 2 kinds of resurrections, eh?

Was Paul referring to both, or either? In any case, how do you know?

How do you know that all of the other resurrected people died? There were hundreds, of not thousands of them.

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