1. just to answer you there is nothing you can say or do that will make me change my opinion , that we are ika people ,we are neither igbo or benin.
2. you seems to be ignorant about the ika people ,because if you are not ,you will not be asking if ika people can say any words in benin language, these are some words that have the same meaning in ika and benin language;
1. ofingbon- palm oil
2. igbon- slave
3. egan- chain or prison
4. ukpe - light
5. iyare- save journey/protection
6. ogua/eguare- palace
7. okpoho- woman
8. odede- mother / elderly woman
9. edionma- oldman/senior
10. ohaimen- chief
11. ezuzu- fan
12. ekete- stool
13. ada- staff of office
14. ogiso- king
15. oselobue- GOD
16. EHI- guardian spirit.
17- onyimiseme- thanks giving
18. ozuor- fool
19. ibiegwa- royal servants
20. egho- money
21. efe- wealth
22. ighogho- happiness
23. ubi rie- evil spirits depart.
24. ojuwu- devil
25. uje- royal dance
26. eben- simitar
27.utormi- long life
28. idayi- long life and protection
30. tor- to live long
31. ikeke- bicycle
32.uwaya- road
33.sakpamagori-great grand child
34.uniform iizagin
35. ulakpa- police
36.okpan- plate
37.okhue-parrot
38.suffering uya
39. obu-native doctor
40. ohen/ohenren -priest.


3. so also ika has many igbo words too in our language, and why do you igbo propagandist hate to hear the word benin in ika history? or is there any thing you people are afraid of, but any time we mention igbo you become happy.
4. ika people quite appreciate the many groups of immigrants from different places that helped to shape ika like the igbo, ukwani, ora, ishan, benin and others ,but the fact is that we have evolved over a thousand years and we are our own people, we do not need any majority tribe to help us stand, we have stood on our own and we intend to remain like that as ika people.
5. the kingship that we hold there in ika ,evolved from benin, in terms of system of crowning the kings,chiefs and the way the town is run,having said this i have not in any of my write up assumed that ika people are bini people ,i just acknowledge their contributions to ika history and culture, just like i also acknowledge the igbo too in ika culture,but ika people are distinct from these two groulps , if you like you can call us the land where the west meets with the east as some authors both local and international have described ika by this name.

I asked you if you can make a full sentence in bini language.

I never said you dont have bini words in Ika. Onitsha Igbo also has bini words in their dialect. So nothing special about having a couple of bini words here and there.

i met some ika young guys fewdays ago(2-3 days back) and i ask them,during discusion on nigeria politics.

"what do you think about ika people" igbo,bini or just ika ?

i dont want to mispresent the issue. cus i want a sincere answer.

All of them,i say all of them said "they are igbo infact ika is igbo" none said anything different.
i told them am an efik,so they are not impresing me.

all of them are university graduates. now one of them said "that is what hapen after the war in fear of federal punishment"
i concluded to inform us once again about that,its only agbontean/solomon omogie and few bini/ika family are doing the
denial.

pls my igbo brothers whenever u see any ika denying his/her igboness first ask him his direct ancestoral
lineage b4 argue with him. majority of ika people has testifies of their igbo identities over time. so no arguements anymore on this.

you are just an ignorant igbo man , and your write up is a testimony of your ignorance, what do you mean by lineage ?
did i ever tell you that i am a bini man , i am ika and that is all ,
2. my lineage started from bini ,as we were told ,but that does not make me bini , and there are some ika that can also trace their lineage to igbo, and other places.
3. my lineage or ancestors were igbedigi, omigie,osunhon, agbontaen, ovwiagbon,ugbebor, ehiabor,imade, owodo,ewuare and others ,and i think you know where they came from , our family records says they migrated from benin,and founded a village called idumu -ezomor in owa-oyibu,headquarters of owa kingdom.
4. i can bet you that even if many owa people are called okonkwo now , if you go back to their great grand fathers name you will end up with a bini name.
5. my friend please wake up ,as majority of ika people will never support being igbo , if you go to interrior of our areas you will know what they call igbo ? i dont want to say it on this forum.
6. let ika people determine their destiny. the majority has said we are ika and that is all. if you like be day dreaming ,but i know if ika will dissappoint you when the chips are down.
7. i was very young when my late father told me the difference between ika and igbo,and i know it.

1 let me tell you that what you said about ika denying being igbo is a lie the igbo people have recycled over time ,and let me tell you.
2. ika people never supported biafra ,and we were not part of the areas that fought for biafra.
3. infact we have it on record that muritala lived in owa kingdom ,during the civil war and owa and her environs did not witness the war as such
4. that umunede was one of the key areas the federal troops stayed and rooted biafra out ogf the midwest.
5. that the majority of ika people did not support biafra.
6. that the obi of owa was amongst the midwest leaders of thoughts during the civil war and muritala was made a chief in owa as at then.
7. that the only part of ika land that witnessed the war was around igbodo ,because they supported biafra.
so please get your facts right and finally in 1930 , the agbor patrotic union comprising of all ika groups told the british people that ika was a seperated ethnic group different from all other groups .so get it right , and stop propagating your stupid igbo believe of this ahaic civil war story.

this guy omojie solomon you are still here with this your lies.
infact you can never change.

all ika i have met comfirms ika as igbo ,its just only you.
though ogbuefi has said that your likes in ika are in the minority.

Igbo man from the Ika clan of Delta state (Owa "kingdom"

[flash=350,350]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxQYsHzGvpQ[/flash]

@abgotean,  According to all the nonsense words and fake sentences you wrote, I shouldn't be able to understand this guy(^^^). I wonder why I can? Do keep in mind, i dont speak bini and this guy seems to not be speaking it either.

Ogbuefi should go and read the Guardian of Monday 12th December,2011 .The article is titled:Rot.neglect,anguish at the nation's airports.
When sometime ago I had written that the Benin City Airport was the fourth busiest in the country,Ogbuefi had found it comical. And we now know that while it is the fourth busiest it is also the only other viable airport in Nigeria aside Lagos and Abuja.
Ogbuefi's hatred for the Binis is what is comical. Since he has been found out on this ,I have decided all that he ever said about the Binis and the civil war are lies, too.
ISELOGBE!

bokohalal:

Ogbuefi should go and read the Guardian of Monday 12th December,2011 .The article is titled:Rot.neglect,anguish at the nation's airports.
When sometime ago I had written that the Benin City Airport was the fourth busiest in the country,Ogbuefi had found it comical. And we now know that while it is the fourth busiest it is also the only other viable airport in Nigeria aside Lagos and Abuja.
Ogbuefi's hatred for the Binis is what is comical. Since he has been found out on this ,I have decided all that he ever said about the Binis and the civil war are lies, too.
ISELOGBE!

There is nothing in Ogbuefi's posts to suggest he hates Benin or Bini people. He was narrating a first hand information of a city he resided for ages.

IGUE FESTIVAL IN OWA KINGDOM

1. OBI ISELOGBE( that is the greeting to the obi of owa ,on igue festival day,as well as the dein of agbor, obi of abavo and obi of umunede)
it another igue festival in owa kingdom ,thisdecember, its celebrated towards the end of december ,and we welcome every one to come down to owa-oyibu ,where the obi will be performing the ceremony.
2. this is about 500 years of igue festival in owa kingdom, as we were told according to our oral history ,it was first performed by the obi of owa called aigbogidi orhogbuwa, son of ewodo , it was celebrated to mark the end of the year and the start of a new year.
3. it is a time that owa kingdom prays to our ancestors and deities like ajan, uhunmweden, olokun, idigun ,ehi and idinwina, and ikenga.
4. we also use the time to purify our land of evil spirits characterised by the ubi masquerade and the shout of ubi rie- evil spirits go away.
5. the ibiewere festival to bring good luck ,using ewere leaves and singing of ewere ewere gbe oyoyo .
6. it is also a time for the chiefs- ohaimes to dress in traditional hairdos and beaded necklaces called ikpehe as the dance to the ogua - palace of the obi to pay hommage with their eben ,as soon as they see the obi,they will point the tip to the ground as an act of respect to his royal majesty the obi of owa , as they shout agbogidi iyare, ojenebo iyare and agwo ekirika iyare.
igue festival festival is a link to our ancestors ,and as tradition had it , it was started in benin by oba ewuare the great when he ruled the benin empire.
it is a celebration where the obi, chiefs and indegenes of owa pray to their guardian spirit called ehi to bless them and protect them.

why all this problem, ika language as spoken by agbor, owa, abavo and most ika people is a mix of igbo, bini and other languages showing traces of migration, and we have about 5 variations of ika language as it is spoken today , and the ika spoken by communities near aniocha area is quite different in sound and use of sentences.we as ika people are living in a border area between benin and igbo area , so we know what constitute igbo words and we also know what constitutes bini words . so why are you so alarmed about our language,so also is our cultural traits different
2. .let me ask you a question , assuming an ika community lets say owa or abavo has a dispute in chiefthancy matter as per people trying to take the title of obaseki or the obi of owa selects an ihama from a non-royal village,and the community is in confussion ,where will they turn to for advice as to how to resolve this issue? is it igbo land or bini ?
3. if agbor, owa and abavo has dispute about succession to their throne in their uselu , and they want to turn to an outsider , is it to the east or bini they will turn to ?
4. while no one is saying the igbo did not contribute to the development of ika as an ethnic group ,no one can also undermine the contribution of the bini to the founding of ika kingdoms, infact if you remove it then it will crumble , infact most ika kingdoms have and believe in their brotherhood because of the bini connection.
5. without kingship and chiefthancy tradition there is no ika, ikas are held together because of our royal traditions,that is why when they are crowning any ika king ,they place a curse that whosoever will destroy this kingship will destroy his generation.

Go to the present Eze Nri, the monarch of your ancestral home if you have any problems, he'll help you out.

as an owa man , i know our system of kingship is strictly taken from benin with its three system of chieftancy ,which are palace ,town and hereditory titles and i know by their names that they are benin titles with some that are igbo in nature, but most of them started recently.
so the crown prince of owa is called edaiken, and we have chiefs like obaseki, olgboshere, iyase, ihama, ezomor and others , and i am sure you know that these are not nri titles, and our obi is crowned in the uselu, and he dressess in a style that is different than an nri king.
i bet you also know that owa monachs rule from father to son.
this is enough ,but i know that those that are deluded can say any thing .

We've heard enough of your delusions. We get the point. You can want to be called an Igbo man. But please leave other to decide what they prefere to be refered as. If a Yoruba man calls himself aboki who i'm i to discount his assertion.

lol. Ike ghuru

agbotaen:

as an owa man , i know our system of kingship is strictly taken from benin with its three system of chieftancy ,which are palace ,town and hereditory titles and i know by their names that they are benin titles with some that are igbo in nature, but most of them started recently.
so the crown prince of owa is called edaiken, and we have chiefs like obaseki, olgboshere, iyase, ihama, ezomor and others , and i am sure you know that these are not nri titles, and our obi is crowned in the uselu, and he dressess in a style that is different than an nri king.
i bet you also know that owa monachs rule from father to son.
this is enough ,but i know that those that are deluded can say any thing .

But your origins are from Nri land according to historians/anthropologists, and that the benin style of kingship was borrowed during your sojourn in Benin territory.

Which will you chose? The original or the 'fake' borrowed style?

Lol, like I saying I once heard " when you dont know who you are, people will tell you lies about yourself".
I think the Igbo people in this thread should leave the Ika people alone, they are not Igbos like agbontan said.

I have been following this thread and people seem to want to impose on the Ika/Owa people something they are not, they are not Benins, not Igbos nor are they anything except what they are.

I know some Ika people believe themselves to be Igbos, this is simply because they don't know who they are, they have no idea about their history and their heritage and this is the main problem ( A few years ago, many people were able to deceive me that Benins were yorubas, this was because I didn't know ho I was then, but for the last 5 years I have gathered enough evidence to prove who I am and who my ancestors were and I now know we are not youruba, we simply share an history), I think any Ika person who claims Igbo heritage, should go and study their history in-depth before digging an hole for themselves and insulting their ancestors from whom they have inherited their lands.

As agbontaen previously stated, they Ikas are not Igbos and if they are anything besides Ika, they would be Binis, for the amount of culture and traditions they share together, but I know they are not Benins. And mind you, before 1897, Benin was known by all, as not a clan, but simpy an administrative centre for all who claim the single ancestry of igodomigo, and the city was a combination of all the tribes that made up the Edo nation( Urhobos, Ika, exam isoko, arbor), in order words a man in Benin ho claims to be Benin could have had ancestors who were once in the Urhobos or arbor parts but then granted a title in the boas palace in oredo, may have remigrated back to Benin. Therefore, Benin was not a tribe but a capital, just like Abuja is, hence the generalized name for the Old Benin kingdom was Edo and the capital was Edo( as every Edo man came from Edo(igodomigodo) the territories were named according).

The present people in Ika may be letting the Igbo influence make them forget who they are and losing their language, but the Ogua Ika is pure Edo and that proves everything Igbo imposers in this plac wrong. Therefore, if Ika are anything besides Ika, they are Edos ( not Benin, but Edo by ancestry and establishment).

Language isn't always an accurate way of categorising a group or tribe. My moms family speak Edo n'ekhue, which is a cross between Edo language and akure yoruba, they have a lot in common with the Yoruba akures, but still this does not make them yoruba but Edos who happen to speak a bit of yoruba. This tells a lot about them, makes them unique, as a group of their own within a nation.

A black man can spend his entire life in Europe, his fathers may have been born there and even died there, but this does not really make them Europeans, does it?, because they still know and Europeans still know they are not europeans, they are simply Africans who happen to speak good european and hold an EU passport. This example is laid bare by the UAE immigration, who till this day, do not grant people with ancestors from outside the UAE with the UAE passport, even if your fathers and grandfathers were born there, you speak Emirati-Arabic, you are still not an Emirati.

So I think the igbo Imposers in this thread should stop, because, they can't transform Ikas to Igbos, the monarch is an evidence of that, a strong tie is still being held between the Ika monarch, agbor monarch, Owa monarch and the Oba of Benin , because they are brothers. And I urge every Ika person to research their history to know who they are and chase the Igbo virus, trying to steal their lands and influence their language.

They are Ikas a unique group of their own, they only have language similarities with Igbos, but their true core and foundation and as a matter of fact the Ika people are simply Ika people.

FYI: The conquest of the Benin empire only aimed to unite all clans and settlements of Edo(igodomigodo) origin, it had no interest In imposing it's way of life or it's language on any people who weren't from igodomigodo. Thank you.

ISELOGBE.

All this talk, yet the Obi of Owa authoritatively links Ika people mostly to Nri

N_Oviedo, this your epistle is too long and boring. You are a very partial observer. It seems you are too blind not to read what Ogbuefi1- an Ika son has been writing. You only read Agbontaen's because it pleases your bigoted mindset.
You mentioned Owa, yet you were too blind to read the part where the Obi of Owa claimed that they came from Nri.
I can't believe it took you so long to know that Edos are not Yorubas, yet you are Edo. You are a disgrace to the Edo community you come from. There is nothing at all that will suggest to any Edoman that he is Yoruba. I feel ashamed of you. Even the Edos born in far away land as in the U.K know whom they are.
Why do you have to come here to tell Ndigbo to leave Ikas alone without you warning Agbontaen to leave Ikas who are proud Igbo alone.
I think this is the last rubbish i will read this year in Nairaland. I don't know why people can be so biased and pathetic. It's a pity.

ChinenyeN:

All this talk, yet the Obi of Owa authoritatively links Ika people mostly to Nri

Could you please provide a reference to a resource where the obi of Owa claimed the Owa people to have originated from Nri.

Andre Uweh:

N_Oviedo, this your epistle is too long and boring. You are a very partial observer. It seems you are too blind not to read what Ogbuefi1- an Ika son has been writing. You only read Agbontaen's because it pleases your bigoted mindset.
You mentioned Owa, yet you were too blind to read the part where the Obi of Owa claimed that they came from Nri.
I can't believe it took you so long to know that Edos are not Yorubas, yet you are Edo. You are a disgrace to the Edo community you come from. There is nothing at all that will suggest to any Edoman that he is Yoruba. I feel ashamed of you. Even the Edos born in far away land as in the U.K know whom they are.
Why do you have to come here to tell Ndigbo to leave Ikas alone without you warning Agbontaen to leave Ikas who are proud Igbo alone.
I think this is the last rubbish i will read this year in Nairaland. I don't know why people can be so biased and pathetic. It's a pity.

Nobody was born with information and it is not a crime not to know something, rather awareness of your lack of knowledge and being unwilling to learn is the crime, we all learnt whatever it is we know and Unlike you my friend, I do not make assumptions, I make statements based on personal research, and if I said I was made to believe a wrong history of the Edos in the past, it is simply a result of my lack of knowledge of the history at that time and not a reflection of my intellect at present.

As for my post being to long and boring, I am not here to entertain you, I simply posted to express an opinion about a topic and if you were someone who wanted to learn you would have simply read it and made reasonable comments and not spilling words of abuse.

I would also like you to explain why the Ika people and the Benin people share the same culture and many traditions if they weren't of a single origin?

As for me being biased and pathetic, I think you should take another read through your posts, you seem not to have taken in anything agbontaen, I and other People posted about the Ika and Benin links, you appear to be hellbent on forcing the Ikas into the Igbo group, I don't know what could be so biased.
My post was made to provide information for us all in this forum to come to a better understanding of the Ika people and their origin, but you seem to have turned everything into a slew of abusive words and verbally derogative statement.

Speak of pathetic, it is you who is pathetic for not knowing a better and a more mature way of responding to someone you haven't even spoken with before,  as a matter of fact you seem to have established yourself on this post as a retard. Do you even know what pathetic or biased mean?

Please Andre if you can't respond as an adult, you shouldnt reply to my post or even be on this forum.


Thank you.

N_ovbiedo:

Could you please provide a reference to a resource where the obi of Owa claimed the Owa people to have originated from Nri.

Community Development in Owa Kingdom
by Efeizomor II (Obi of Owa)

[img]http://books.google.com/books?id=WXouAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA67&img=1&pgis=1&dq=nri&sig=ACfU3U37hhqn_xIzt_p-wP1kuPcxlMKryA&edge=0[/img]
[img]http://books.google.com/books?id=WXouAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA67&img=1&pgis=1&dq=%22Owa+society%22&sig=ACfU3U3TdFyZbzbvd4S0232m8eV8WJ9Rjw&edge=0[/img]

more. . .

[img]http://books.google.com/books?id=WXouAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA1&img=1&pgis=1&dq=%22owa+kingship%22&sig=ACfU3U3kHTWBDk5VXB1-epUHZo-Gb4o-fQ&edge=0[/img]
[img]http://books.google.com/books?id=WXouAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA1&img=1&pgis=1&dq=%22had+its+genesis+in+Nri%22&sig=ACfU3U3aNOk83VVaUjwL8myYq2raoi_Z0A&edge=0[/img]

more. . .

[img]http://books.google.com/books?id=WXouAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA48&img=1&pgis=1&dq=%22Though+we+know+our+root+is+firmly+Nri,+(Nshi)%22&sig=ACfU3U3X_cnS3VZsWnf4ZNd4aWsukPCesQ&edge=0[/img]

I'm not sure where this bini is yoruba claim is coming from.

First time i ever heard of it was here on nairaland.

My dad expressly explained the difference between yoruba and benin to me as a young child - he pointed out the similarity in names but they are still different people. In addition, none of my bini friends from benin (not the southwest) has ever claimed they were yoruba.

So, its on nl that i hear bini is allegedly yoruba. As i pointed out to someone before, the benin monarchy are the ones with definite yoruba links.

True, some yorubas were absorbed into benin but so were other tribes. And most of the yoruboid edos today hve been fully assimilated into edo.

N_ovbiedo:



Could you please provide a reference to a resource where the obi of Owa claimed the Owa people to have originated from Nri.
Nobody was born with information and it is not a crime not to know something, rather awareness of your lack of knowledge and being unwilling to learn is the crime, we all learnt whatever it is we know and Unlike you my friend, I do not make assumptions, I make statements based on personal research, and if I said I was made to believe a wrong history of the Edos in the past, it is simply a result of my lack of knowledge of the history at that time and not a reflection of my intellect at present.

As for my post being to long and boring, I am not here to entertain you, I simply posted to express an opinion about a topic and if you were someone who wanted to learn you would have simply read it and made reasonable comments and not spilling words of abuse.

I would also like you to explain why the Ika people and the Benin people share the same culture and many traditions if they weren't of a single origin?

As for me being biased and pathetic, I think you should take another read through your posts, you seem not to have taken in anything agbontaen, I and other People posted about the Ika and Benin links, you appear to be hellbent on forcing the Ikas into the Igbo group, I don't know what could be so biased.
My post was made to provide information for us all in this forum to come to a better understanding of the Ika people and their origin, but you seem to have turned everything into a slew of abusive words and verbally derogative statement.

Speak of pathetic, it is you who is pathetic for not knowing a better and a more mature way of responding to someone you haven't even spoken with before, as a matter of fact you seem to have established yourself on this post as a slowpoke. Do you even know what pathetic or biased mean?

Please Andre if you can't respond as an adult, you shouldnt reply to my post or even be on this forum.


Thank you.

Dude, you made a mockery of yourself in your first post. How on earth can a Bini man not know that he is not Yoruba until recently?.Where you born by a bini family and given away for adoption to a Yoruba family when you were less than one year. Then after the age of probably 25, your parents now informed you that you are Bini and not Yoruba. If not for a case like this, then your logic is turned upside down.
Also, you lied through your anus that you have gone through this thread from the beginning yet you did not see the post about Obi of Owa where he claimed that there roots are from Nri, now that another poster has exhumed that particular post, yet you ignored it.
A proud Igbo from Ika called Ogbuefi1 here wrote extensively about their Igboness yet you ignored it but only saw logic in what Agbontaen wrote.
Dude, quit this thread and stop displaying additional stupidity here.

tpia@:

I'm not sure where this bini is yoruba claim is coming from.

First time i ever heard of it was here on nairaland.

Same here. Posters like Alj harem (step 1), Bababuff, Negro_Ntns have even repeated this. I've never heard of this bizarre claim outside of the internet.

My dad expressly explained the difference between yoruba and benin to me as a young child - he pointed out the similarity in names

There's not even much similarity in names, really.

True, some yorubas were absorbed into benin but so were other tribes.

Which other tribes?

@chenenye Thanks for providing those screen shots, this isn't the first time I have come across that version of the Owa origin, but I have just gotten to know about the book by the Obi of Owa. I'll get a copy and maybe we can revisit that later. But we can both agree that the Owa origin story isn't shared by all the Ika clans.

@tpia @physicsQED - trust me, there are a select few and I have Edo friends who have little knowledge about the Edo-Yoruba link and seem to believe it when their Yoruba friends bring up the Oduduwa story. Some even know a bit about Edo history from their family, but may have never been told enough about the ogisos and Ekhaladeran.

The issue of Owa has long since been settled by the Obi himself but Agbotaen whose real name is Solomon Omojie has been going about trying to create an Owah of his own where his family produces the Obi and do not speak Igbo. The Delta Igbos are mostly of Nri, Awka and Isu descent while the rise of Benin attracted people of different ethnic groups to go and work in Benin or even join the Benin army. Most of the Benin people that migrated Eastwards were trying to get back home after falling out with their hosts or the Oba. They settled among Igbo speakers and influenced them with the culture of Benin.


In a nutshell most Anioma people are Benin cultured Igbos.

Abagworo:

The issue of Owa has long since been settled by the Obi himself but Agbotaen whose real name is Solomon Omojie has been going about trying to create an Owah of his own where his family produces the Obi and do not speak Igbo. The Delta Igbos are mostly of Nri, Awka and Isu descent while the rise of Benin attracted people of different ethnic groups to go and work in Benin or even join the Benin army. Most of the Benin people that migrated Eastwards were trying to get back home after falling out with their hosts or the Oba. They settled among Igbo speakers and influenced them with the culture of Benin.


In a nutshell most Anioma people are Benin cultured Igbos.

Happy new year Nwa Imo, Aku Nwata na Oguta.

Abagworo:

The issue of Owa has long since been settled by the Obi himself but Agbotaen whose real name is Solomon Omojie has been going about trying to create an Owah of his own where his family produces the Obi and do not speak Igbo. The Delta Igbos are mostly of Nri, Awka and Isu descent while the rise of Benin attracted people of different ethnic groups to go and work in Benin or even join the Benin army. Most of the Benin people that migrated Eastwards were trying to get back home after falling out with their hosts or the Oba. They settled among Igbo speakers and influenced them with the culture of Benin.


In a nutshell most Anioma people are Benin cultured Igbos.

Dont you think that your first statement in bold contradicts your second?

Personally, I still find it illogical that these peoples(the so-called Benin emigrants ie the Ezechima, Akalala, Esumai groups, etc) that settled in present day Anioma were ethnic Binis in the first place, except I see more convincing evidence to believe otherwise.

What still makes sense to me at the moment is in line with your first statement in bold that majority of Anioma is composed of persons of Nri, Oka and Isuama descent that who were attracted by the rising Benin Empire, and ending up working there or joining the army.

mbatuku2:

Dont you think that your first statement in bold contradicts your second?

Personally, I still find it illogical that these peoples(the so-called Benin emigrants ie the Ezechima, Akalala, Esumai groups, etc) that settled in present day Anioma were ethnic Binis in the first place, except I see more convincing evidence to believe otherwise.

What still makes sense to me at the moment is in line with your first statement in bold that majority of Anioma is composed of persons of Nri, Oka and Isuama descent that who were attracted by the rising Benin Empire, and ending up working there or joining the army.

Happy new year bro. What I meant was that Igbos were already established on the Western Niger before the expansion of Benin. There were definitely some ethnic Benins, Yorubas, Igalas and more that came to settle in Anioma long after the Igbos have established the towns. These people influenced the culture of Igbo people. Eze Chima, Odogwu, Akalaka etc were obviously Igbos that went to live in Benin and fell out with their hosts but there were other people with them who were not Igbos.


We cannot really say for sure but those names and the stories around them suggest reverse migration. Ie Migrating from Igbo to Benin and back to Igbo.

Abagworo:


Happy new year bro. What I meant was that Igbos were already established on the Western Niger before the expansion of Benin. There were definitely some ethnic Benins, Yorubas, Igalas and more that came to settle in Anioma long after the Igbos have established the towns. These people influenced the culture of Igbo people.  Eze Chima, Odogwu, Akalaka etc were obviously Igbos that went to live in Benin and fell out with their hosts but there were other people with them who were not Igbos.


We cannot really say for sure but those names and the stories around them suggest reverse migration. Ie Migrating from Igbo to Benin and back to Igbo.

Happy new year to you too, bro.

Back to our discuss. I really dont think a few migrant Binis can so influence a whole region as big as Anioma. Most of the Benin influence were most likely brought to Igbo land by the returnee Igbo groups themselves, having lived for some time in Benin.

This thought just came to my mind out of curiosity. Does anyone know if the Benin culture has any Igbo influence?

mbatuku2:

Does anyone know if the Benin culture has any Igbo influence?

The Ikegobo cult or "cult of the hand" in Benin is very likely to be from Ikenga. This may have been introduced to Benin during Benin's wars of expansion when contact was made with other outside groups or some Western Igbo immigrants may have brought that with them.





As for the rest of your discussion with Abagworo, I agree with the general sentiment, but maybe not the specifics. You are possibly underestimating the spread of Edo culture. There are pure Edo settlements like Oza nogogo and Alilehan that are only a stone's throw away from Agbor. Yes there was probably Igbo migration both ways, but its really unlikely that there were no actual ethnic Bini migrations whatsoever.


As for the Owa issue, one possible reason a person (such as Agbontaen) might have difficulty accepting the story is because owa is a basic Edo (Bini) word which means house and there is a pure Edo community called Owa (now named Evbuobanosa) in Orhionmwon LGA in Edo state. It should therefore be pretty easy to see why Agbontaen could claim that although they received later elements from other cultures, their basic foundation was from Benin. I read a more complex derivation of Owa from Ute Okpu in one of the earlier debates here, and it's entirely possible, but perhaps not as convincing. But I think "Owa" is a word in multiple Nigerian languages, not just Edo, anyway.

You aren't the only ones making such arguments, though. Nowadays Ogho is called Owo, although as Chief Ashara (the Owo historian) and even the current Olowo of Owo attested to, the original name was Ogho (which is actually a non-Yoruba word (the "gh" sound, called the "voiced velar fricative" by linguists, is completely alien to Yoruba and is only found in areas of Edo influence such as Ogho/Owo and Ilaje) and just so happens to be a pure Bini word which means respect). Of course today, Owo is considered wholly Yoruba in origin and any Edo influence is chalked up to Oba Ewuare or Oba Ozolua's conquests and expansion, not to an early Edo element in the founding population. Chief Egharevba, and of course, the Binis in general, believed the exact opposite however.

^^^Owa in my own part of Igboland means east (Owa anyanwu). Owa could have meant east from Benin. But this is just my personal assumption.
Like Abagworo stated earlier, The Igbo groups East of Benin acquired from the Edos the aristocracy pattern of Bini. But before this, what you had in those areas were Nri culture and that exist till date.
Lets go back to the 1997 centenary of the Bini occupation. In 1997 the year of this anniversary, N.T.A did interview the sole survivor of the sack of Oba's palace. Am not sure if he is still alive now, the man spoke in Igbo. He was 8 years when the sack happened.
This goes a long way to show that Ndigbo were in Benin even till the sack of Bini in 1897.
Those who left Bini and moved eastwards are Igbo people.