If you are truely you are spirit, you should verify your encounter with your elder in you church. The word of God is not for debate. You can not be convinced here, you need time to mature spiritually "except dem send you"

You are here claiming you know God and you are being supported by JW cultist, you don't know that you are bringing shame to your God if ever you are real. Stop creeping like a satanic serpent here and go to your closest.

Jehovah witness organisation (a cult founded by taze rusell a 33' freemason)believes Jesus is Angel micheal (imagine) reducing the creator to the created.

The organisation truly lives to the expectation of satan her father.
Jesus said that a corrupt tree cannot bring forth good fruit.

The organisation is fraught with lies and deception.

They deny that Jesus has come in the flesh saying Jesus didnt have a bodily resurrection.

Janosky:


"Unto us a son is given.... he shall be called Everlasting Father", it pleased his Father to elevate Jesus to that title.
In heaven, Jesus is still accountable to his Father and God (Rev 3:5,12,14,21).

Mumu Pharisee, your "Everlasting Father" is "a son given" by his Father and God, Jehovah "to whom every family in heaven and on earth owes it's name" Ephesians 3:14,15.
The Father of Jesus is only true God" Jehovah. John 17:3. John5:26.

This one here; no direction. All JW believe we know, I don't know if you want to tell something new~~ Neither here nor there, fighting for space and audience. Pls go and prepare for the next door to door dabate their are no gullible converts here. You thinks there is a single trace of sense in you hence you think are here to impress.

If I say your intellectual is very low some people will think I'm abusing you.

Janosky:
Did Thomas say Jesus is our God?

Do you mean Thomas has two God?

If you called Buhari "my President", are you meaning he is the President of every one on earth?

Is there anything like World PRESIDENT?

The words of Jesus in John 20:17 &
Rev 3:5,12,14,21 over ruled your satanic interpretation & twisting of John20:28.

You lying pharisees disdain the words of Jesus , the perfect son of God& master of Thomas but cling to his disciple, Thomas, as if he's your lord and saviour.
Naso your sense reach....

We cling to Thomas's word because he said it in front of Jesus and as a Jew who knew, addressing someone other than God as God is blasphemy.

The problem you're having as well as other anti-trinitarian is that you failed to learn what you're arguing about.

Trinitarian didn't argue against John 20:17 but they know when the scripture talks about pre-human Jesus and when Jesus became part of His own creation.

But it's you lying JWs that is twisting the word of Thomas and make Thomas to have two Gods.

Janosky:


"Unto us a son is given.... he shall be called Everlasting Father", it pleased his Father to elevate Jesus to that title.

If God the Everlasting Father elevated Jesus Christ to the title "everlasting father," are you now saying that in heaven there are 2 everlasting fathers?

Janosky:

In heaven, Jesus is still accountable to his Father and God (Rev 3:5,12,14,21).

Trash

Janosky:

Mumu Pharisee, your "Everlasting Father" is "a son given" by his Father and God, Jehovah "to whom every family in heaven and on earth owes it's name" Ephesians 3:14,15.

KJV:That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth. Philippians 2:10

After bowing to Christ Jesus which is a form of worship are we still going to look for an everlasting father to bow unto?
1. If no, are you telling me Jesus Christ is God?
2. If yes, are you telling me that God himself cannot keep to his commandment in Exodus 20:3-5

KJV:Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4
KJV:Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5
KJV:Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;

Janosky:
The Father of Jesus is only true God" Jehovah. John 17:3. John5:26.

KJV:Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
7
KJV:If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
8
KJV:Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9
KJV:Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?
10
KJV:Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. John 14:6-10

From here you can see that Thomas called Jesus Christ Lord and God not because he was surprised.

herlecks:
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son (not Himself, for they are different. The Father sent His Son), that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. Jesus, the Son of God has redeemed us by His blood, and restored us to fellowship with the Father, by giving us the Holy Spirit. Now we can in the Holy Ghost (through Whom all the promises of God in Christ Jesus are fulfilled), pray and worship the Father in Jesus name. The Holy Spirit is the life of the Father and the Son, He or It is the full representative of God on earth, He carries the personality of God and He is subject to the Father, for He is the Spirit of the Father. IT sometimes appears as the power and glory and presence of God, other times He manifests the Father and the Son. The Father has never for once stepped out of heaven, but the Holy Spirit, that is His Spirit carries out all His tasks in the earth, yet the Father is the Spirit, for God is Spirit. What sort of Spirit is the Father or the Son? A Holy Spirit. If anyone tries to make the Holy Spirit a person apart from the Father or the Son such falls into grave error, for the Spirit is their manifestation. To say the Holy Spirit is not the Father, is to say the Father is not the Father, that's of course a senseless talk, because the Holy Spirit manifests the Father and the Son, and has no other personality to manifest besides these.

That I have laid this out does not imply you will understand them, unless God opens your eyes.

you have just successfully explained the role of God in three offices; as the Father who purposes redemption, The Son who made redemption possible and The Holy Spirit who makes believers experience the joy of redemption, because [b]he God is OMNIPRESENT.
Just as you cannot separate the Body from the Spirit or vice versa else both become worthless also you CAN'T SEPARATE THE FATHER, THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT. All three are one and the same doing same thing same time because he[b] God is OMNISCIENCE [/b]and what he requires from us is to live his kind of life why he was on earth because that is the reason he came to dwell in human flesh because he God is OMNIPOTENT the simple explanation of the doctrine of the Trinity.

We needn't add insult to our comments, let's be simple.

Agrogbeide:
you have just successfully explained the role of God in three offices; as the Father who purposes redemption, The Son who made redemption possible and The Holy Spirit who makes believers experience the joy of redemption, because he God is OMNIPRESENT.
Just as you cannot separate the Body from the Spirit or vice versa else both become worthless also you CAN'T SEPARATE THE FATHER, THE SON AND THE HOLY SPIRIT. All three are one and the same and this is the simple explanation of the doctrine of the Trinity.

Okay.. So then who is the God and the Lamb always together in Revelation? And again, who is the Son of man and the Ancient of Days in Daniel 7?

Who was David referring to when he said, "the Lord said to my Lord?" Who was he talking about when he said, "O God, thy God has anointed thee?" God anointed himself then called himself God? or God fulfilling 2 roles at once then tagging himself with different names? You are in error, bro. If anyone studies the OP with an open and humble mind God will show him these common things.

Agrogbeide:
If God the Everlasting Father elevated Jesus Christ to the title "everlasting father," are you now saying that in heaven there are 2 everlasting fathers?
Trash

KJV:That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth. Philippians 2:10

After bowing to Christ Jesus which is a form of worship are we still going to look for an everlasting father to bow unto?
1. If no, are you telling me Jesus Christ is God?
2. If yes, are you telling me that God himself cannot keep to his commandment in Exodus 20:3-5

KJV:Thou shalt have no other gods before me.
4
KJV:Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.
5
KJV:Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me;
KJV:Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
7
KJV:If ye had known me, ye should have known my Father also: and from henceforth ye know him, and have seen him.
8
KJV:Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.
9
KJV:Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?
10
KJV:Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. John 14:6-10

From here you can see that Thomas called Jesus Christ Lord and God not because he was surprised.

Because you lack understanding of the holy scriptures Rev 3:5,12,14,21 is trash to Trinity worshippers and those verses exposes your Trinity scam .

Where did the holy scriptures referred to the God and Father of Jesus as Everlasting Father?
You made that up yourself .

*** To digress a bit,Jesus sacrificial death for mankind's ransom led to his Father elevating Christ as everlasting Father to mankind.Adam our first father lost everlasting life due to sin ,Jesus the last Adam, restored it back to man,(1 Cor15:21,22,45-47).

** The Father dwells in Jesus, the Father dwells in you too, are you God? If the holy spirit is in you or dwells in you, are you the holy spirit?
You guys keep twisting John 14:9,10.

***Jesus is a messenger for his God and Father ,who sent Jesus (John 7:16). Therefore, if you saw Jesus, you have seen the Father whom gave Jesus his message to present to you.
John 5:37"And the Father who sent me.... you have neither heard his voice nor seen his form"
** John 5:37 annulled your wacky interpretation of John 14:9, take note.

** Matt 10:40 gives you the exact interpretation of John 14;9,10.
"He that receives you receives me also, & he that receives me receives him also that sent me"

Thomas viewed Jesus as his God and lord,Thomas only spoke for himself. (Recall that he initially never agreed Jesus resurrected until he sees Jesus face to face.)
Thomas NEVER said Jesus is our God and lord.
John 20:17 is irrevocable and immutable. Master Jesus is talking. He says he and Thomas worshipped the same God &Father

Janosky:

Because you lack understanding of the holy scriptures Rev 3:5,12,14,21 is trash to Trinity worshippers and those verses exposes your Trinity scam .

Where did the holy scriptures referred to the God and Father of Jesus as Everlasting Father?
You made that up yourself .

*** To digress a bit,Jesus sacrificial death for mankind's ransom led to his Father elevating Christ as everlasting Father to mankind.Adam our first father lost everlasting life due to sin ,Jesus the last Adam, restored it back to man,(1 Cor15:21,22,45-47).

** The Father dwells in Jesus, the Father dwells in you too, are you God? If the holy spirit is in you or dwells in you, are you the holy spirit?
You guys keep twisting John 14:9,10.

***Jesus is a messenger for his God and Father ,who sent Jesus (John 7:16). Therefore, if you saw Jesus, you have seen the Father whom gave Jesus his message to present to you.
John 5:37"And the Father who sent me.... you have neither heard his voice nor seen his form"
** John 5:37 annulled your wacky interpretation of John 14:9, take note.

** Matt 10:40 gives you the exact interpretation of John 14;9,10.
"He that receives you receives me also, & he that receives me receives him also that sent me"

Thomas viewed Jesus as his God and lord,Thomas only spoke for himself. (Recall that he initially never agreed Jesus resurrected until he sees Jesus face to face.)
Thomas NEVER said Jesus is our God and lord.
John 20:17 is irrevocable and immutable. Master Jesus is talking. He says he and Thomas worshipped the same God &Father

When you go out to do God's work, carrying his word to mankind then you are carrying God with you. This is what the shield of faith means, that is when, when we go out to preach Jesus, the one who we go out to defend shields us,

Matthew 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

hence it is not us anymore but Christ now.

Galatians 2:20
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

When Christ say this words, that is what it means, hence Christ is the Word but not God in person of the Trinity

Hence we can imply Christ was moving with God's presence and shield while on earth.

Jesus Christ our Creator

A biblical defence of the Trinity

The doctrine of the Trinity is difficult for some people to understand. But this is what God has revealed in Scripture about His own Being, so we should believe it.
The doctrine of the Trinity states that in the unity of the Godhead there are three eternal and co-equal Persons: Father, Son and Holy Spirit, the same in essence but distinct in role — three Persons (or three centres of consciousness) and one Being (see diagram, below). The different senses of one-ness and three-ness mean that the doctrine is not self-contradictory. This is similar in principle to saying that the navy, army, and airforce are three distinct fighting entities, but are also one armed service. NB: this is not to suggest that the three persons are ‘parts’ of God. Indeed, each Person has the fullness of the Godhead (see Colossians 2:9). A better analogy is that space contains three dimensions, yet the dimensions are not ‘parts’ — the concept of ‘space’ is meaningless without all three dimensions.
Biblical derivation
All things necessary for our faith and life are either expressly set down in Scripture or may be deduced by good and necessary consequence from Scripture. Some cults, such as Jehovah’s Witnesses and Mormons, and groups known as ‘Oneness’, or ‘Jesus-only’ Pentecostals (not to be confused with mainstream Pentecostals who do believe in the Trinity), are fond of pointing out that the word ‘Trinity’ is not found in the Bible. But the doctrine can be logically proven from the following clear teachings of Scripture as follows:

There is only one God (Deuteronomy 6:4, Isaiah 44:8 ). Note that the Hebrew word for ‘ one’ is echad which means composite unity — it is used in Genesis 2:24 where the husband and wife become ‘ one flesh ’. The word for absolute unity is yachid which is never used of God in the Scripture.
The Father is called God (John 6:27, Ephesians 4:6).
The Son is called God (Hebrews 1:8. He is also called ‘ I am ’ in John 8:58 cf. Ex. 3:14 — see below for more biblical proof). He has always existed (John 1:1–3, 8:56–58), but took on full human nature in addition to His divine nature at the Incarnation (John 1:14, Philippians 2:5–11).
The Holy Spirit is called God (Acts 5:3–4), and is personal (Acts 13:2), not some impersonal force as the Jehovah’s Witness cult believes.
They are distinct, e.g. at the baptism of Jesus in Matthew 3:16–17 all three were present and distinct. The Son is baptized, the Father speaks from Heaven, and the Holy Spirit, in the form of a dove, flies down and lands on the Son. See the baptismal formula in Matthew 28:19 ‘ baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost .’ Note that the word ‘ name ’ is singular, showing that all three Persons are one Being.
The distinction in persons within the one God means that it is possible for Jesus to be the ‘ one mediator between God and men ’ (1 Timothy 2:5), and to be our ‘ advocate with the Father ’ (1 John 2:1) when we sin. An advocate is a defence lawyer, who pleads our case before a judge. This demonstrates a distinction between the persons.
The distinction makes the Substitutionary Atonement possible. How else could Jesus be the One on whom the LORD has ‘ laid … the iniquity of us all’ (Isaiah 53:6)? The one laying and the one on whom our sins are laid must be distinct.
Jesus said that His Father sent Him (John 14:24) and that the Spirit was sent by both the Father (John 14:26) and the Son (John 15:7). This also points to distinct centres of consciousness within the one God.
The fact that Jesus prayed to God the Father (John 17:1) shows there was a distinction between Father and Son. Since Jesus was fully human (as well as fully divine), and humans should pray, it follows that it was proper for Jesus to pray in His humanity.
Also, the deity of the Son, Jesus Christ, is further proved by the fact that He has attributes belonging uniquely to God, e.g.:
He is the Creator (Colossians 1:16–17).
He has the ability to forgive sins (Luke 7:47–50) and judge all people (John 5:27).
He sends forth the Holy Spirit (John 15:26).
He accepts worship (Hebrews 1:6, Matthew 14:33).
He is called ‘ Lord ’ (Romans 10:9) where ‘ Lord ’ ( kurios ) is a translation of the Old Testament Yahweh (= God). (Romans 10:13 cites Joel 2:32 which makes this clear.)
And He is identified with the ‘ Alpha and Omega ’ and the equivalent ‘ the first and the last ’ (Revelation 1:8, 17–18, cf. Isaiah 44:6).
In the Old Testament, He is the Child who is called ‘ Mighty God ’ and ‘ Everlasting Father ’ (Hebrew is literally ‘Father of Eternity’, meaning ‘Author of Eternity’) (Isaiah 9:6, cf. 10:21) He would be born in Bethlehem, yet His ‘ goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.’ (Micah 5:2)

Some Objections to the Trinity Answered

Despite the clear Biblical evidence for the Trinity, some cults have objections based on misunderstandings of Scripture.
Jesus said: ‘ My Father is greater ( meizon) than I ’ (John 14:28). But this refers to the Father’s greater position in Heaven, not superior nature. Philippians 2:5–11 states that Jesus had equality by nature with God, but
voluntarily took on the lower position of a servant. The same arguments apply to related passages about Jesus submitting to His Father’s will.
The word ‘better’ ( kreitton ) would have been used to describe superiority in nature if this is what had been meant. Indeed, kreitton is used to describe Jesus’ superiority in His very nature to the angels (Hebrews 1:4). The distinction can be illustrated in the human realm by the role of the Prime Minister — he is greater than us in position , but he is still a human being like us, so is not better in nature .
Jesus is called ‘ the firstborn of every creature ’ (Colossians 1:15). However, in Jewish imagery, ‘ firstborn ’ means ‘having the rights and special privileges belonging to the eldest child’. It refers to pre-eminence in rank more than to priority in time. This can be shown in passages where the term ‘ firstborn ’ is used of the pre-eminent son who was not the eldest, e.g. Psalm 89:27, where David is called ‘ firstborn ’ although he was actually the youngest son.
‘ Firstborn ’ does not mean ‘first created’; the Greek for the latter is protoktisis , while firstborn is prototokos . In fact, the verses after Colossians 1:15 show that Christ Himself is the creator of all things.
Jesus is Son of God. From this, some cults try to show that Jesus is somehow less than God. But in Jewish imagery, ‘ the son of ’ often meant ‘of the order of’ or ‘having the very nature of’. For example, ‘ sons of the prophets ’ meant ‘of the order of prophets’ (1 Kings 20:35); ‘ sons of the singers ’ meant ‘of the order of singers’ (Nehemiah 12:28). Jesus’ Jewish contemporaries understood that He was claiming to be God, which is why they wanted to kill him for blasphemy (John 19:7).
Jesus is the ‘ only-begotten Son ’ (John 3:16). The Greek word translated ‘ only-begotten ’ is
monogenes , which means ‘unique, one of a kind’. Jesus is the unique Son of God, because he is God by His very nature (see above). Believers in Him become ‘ sons of God ’ by adoption (Galatians 3:26–4:7).
This is shown in the human realm by Hebrews 11:17, where Isaac is called Abraham’s ‘ only begotten son ’. Abraham had other sons, but Isaac was the unique son of the Abrahamic Covenant (Genesis chapters 15–18, 20), born when his parents were old.

Janosky:

Because you lack understanding of the holy scriptures Rev 3:5,12,14,21 is trash to Trinity worshippers and those verses exposes your Trinity scam.
[quote author=Janosky post=78200875]
Where did the holy scriptures referred to the God and Father of Jesus as Everlasting Father?
You made that up yourself.

Lol. You just shot yourself, are you telling me Christians have Everlasting God and Everlasting Father? If you say Jesus Christ is the everlasting Father, can you see that Jesus Christ was referring to himself all through his ministry on earth because he always refer to the Father who sent him and there can never be 2 everlasting fathers?

Janosky:
*** To digress a bit,Jesus sacrificial death for mankind's ransom led to his Father elevating Christ as everlasting Father to mankind.Adam our first father lost everlasting life due to sin ,Jesus the last Adam, restored it back to man,(1 Cor15:21,22,45-47).

Do you even understand the term "everlasting" at all? If Adam had everlasting life, why was the tree of Life protected?

Janosky:

** The Father dwells in Jesus, the Father dwells in you too, are you God? If the holy spirit is in you or dwells in you, are you the holy spirit?
You guys keep twisting John 14:9,10.

[b]KJV:Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16
KJV:For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17
KJV:And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18
KJV:And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19
KJV:For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20
KJV:And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
[/b]Colossians 1:15-20

Janosky:
***Jesus is a messenger for his God and Father ,who sent Jesus (John 7:16). Therefore, if you saw Jesus, you have seen the Father whom gave Jesus his message to present to you.
John 5:37"And the Father who sent me.... you have neither heard his voice nor seen his form"
** John 5:37 annulled your wacky interpretation of John 14:9, take note.

I ask you again, when we get to heaven are we going to see an Everlasting God and Everlasting Father siting down separately?

Janosky:
** Matt 10:40 gives you the exact interpretation of John 14;9,10.
"He that receives you receives me also, & he that receives me receives him also that sent me"

Thomas viewed Jesus as his God and lord,Thomas only spoke for himself. (Recall that he initially never agreed Jesus resurrected until he sees Jesus face to face.)
Thomas NEVER said Jesus is our God and lord.
John 20:17 is irrevocable and immutable. Master Jesus is talking. He says he and Thomas worshipped the same God &Father

Who is our Savior Janosky, God or the Lord Jesus Christ?

BTW learn to give straight answers to questions instead of roaming the whole thread like a lost kid.

From what I perceived, I think the topic for this thread should have been "Is Jesus God and worthy of worship"

In my answer to this:
Lets see creator
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

This means Christ created you and I. God almighty didn't do it without Him

Worship
Philippians 2:10
That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

Definition of God ~~~
noun

1. (in Christianity and other monotheistic religions) the creator and ruler of the universe and source of all moral authority; the supreme being.

2. (in certain other religions) a superhuman being or spirit worshipped as having power over nature or human fortunes; a deity.

What is see in many response is that Jesus is a messenger. Please I am also a messenger so from today use my Id to get to God.

What you called Jesus, that is what He is to you, but for me, He is my God.

Emusan:
If I say your intellectual is very low some people will think I'm abusing you.

Do you mean Thomas has two God?


Is there anything like World PRESIDENT?



We cling to Thomas's word because he said it in front of Jesus and as a Jew who knew, addressing someone other than God as God is blasphemy.

The problem you're having as well as other anti-trinitarian is that you failed to learn what you're arguing about.

Trinitarian didn't argue against John 20:17 but they know when the scripture talks about pre-human Jesus and when Jesus became part of His own creation.

But it's you lying JWs that is twisting the word of Thomas and make Thomas to have two Gods.

** Stop being foolish, to call Buhari "my President", you're talking about his authority relative to Nigeria & Nigerians.
Likewise , for Thomas to call Jesus "my God" is relative to Thomas's view of his relationship with Jesus.

Which other disciple called Jesus " my God" ? None !

Lying Pharisees everywhere.
John 20:17 "I am ascending to my Father and your Father, my God and your God" that statement has no twist and turns,except you're bereft of sense and deceive yourself.

In heaven and earth, the Father and God of Jesus is also the Father and God of his disciples .
Rev 3:5,12-14,21. Rom15:5,6.

Isce:


In my answer to this:
Lets see creator
John 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

This means Christ created you and I. God almighty didn't do it without Him


What you called Jesus, that is what He is to you, but for me, He is my God.

Your statement above you just confirmed Jesus your "God" is NOT Almighty God .
Trinity mumu doctrine dey thief your sense.

Your Bible says Jesus worships his God and Father.( John 20:17) to whom Jesus owes his name ( Ephesians 3:14,15. 1:3 .) & granted life to Jesus . John 5:26.
Phil 2:9 His God Jehovah "exalted Jesus and gave Jesus a name.." and authority in Phil2:10.

Receive sense.

Janosky:
** Stop being foolish, to call Buhari "my President", you're talking about his authority relative to Nigeria & Nigerians.

It's no more president of everyone on earth....deluded shameless liar.

Likewise , for Thomas to call Jesus "my God" is relative to Thomas's view of his relationship with Jesus.

Now you finally agreed that Thomas called Jesus "My God" no more it's just an exclamation.

Then if Jesus is Thomas God, is Jesus your God too?

Which other disciple called Jesus " my God" ? None!

The fact that Thomas called Jesus God in Jesus presence without Jesus rebuking him speaks a volume only a JWs deluded person will think such thing can happen.

Lying Pharisees everywhere.
John 20:17 "I am ascending to my Father and your Father, my God and your God" that statement has no twist and turns,except you're bereft of sense and deceive yourself.

In heaven and earth, the Father and God of Jesus is also the Father and God of his disciples .
Rev 3:5,12-14,21. Rom15:5,6.

At least, Thomas now has two God.

Shameless idiotic JWs

Emusan:


It's no more president of everyone on earth....


Now you finally agreed that Thomas called Jesus "My God" no more it's just an exclamation.

Then if Jesus is Thomas God, is Jesus your God too?



The fact that Thomas called Jesus God in Jesus presence without Jesus rebuking him speaks a volume only a JWs deluded person will think such thing can happen.

You getting it wrong.
" My President" is an expression which does not cover everyone.

"My teacher is not the same as "our teacher" likewise "my God" is not " our God".
If you like argue till kingdom come.
Did Jesus ever say he is our God?

** Thomas say Jesus na him Oga,OK. Jesus say him get Oga for heaven and earth wey be him (Jesus) Oga and Thomas Oga.
John 20:17.
The God of Jesus & Thomas na their Oga for heaven.
Rev 3:5,12-14,21.

** Jesus say No human being done see him Oga for eye to eye. John 5:37. 6:46.
Jesus say you Emusan na unbeliever, lying Pharisee who listen & believe the junk from the stable of pastorpreneurs.
John 5:38-42.

* Why should Jesus rebuke Thomas , when it was obvious Thomas still doubted Jesus resurrection?
"Stop doubting and believe" John 20:24-28.

It's true that verse 28 is an expression of surprise, (an exclamation! ) that indeed, Jesus had resurrected.
v29 " Jesus said : because you have seen me you have believed, blessed are those who never saw Jesus resurrected but believe in his resurrection.
v30,31: these events occurred so you may believe Jesus is the Christ the son of God".
Shikena !!

Janosky:


You getting it wrong.
" My President" is an expression which does not cover everyone.

"My teacher is not the same as "our teacher" likewise "my God" is not " our God".
If you like argue till kingdom come.
Did Jesus ever say he is our God?

** Thomas say Jesus na him Oga,OK. Jesus say him get Oga for heaven and earth wey be him (Jesus) Oga and Thomas Oga.
John 20:17.
The God of Jesus & Thomas na their Oga for heaven.
Rev 3:5,12-14,21.

** Jesus say No human being done see him Oga for eye to eye. John 5:37. 6:46.
Jesus say you Emusan na unbeliever, lying Pharisee who listen & believe the junk from the stable of pastorpreneurs.
John 5:38-42.

* Why should Jesus rebuke Thomas , when it was obvious Thomas still doubted Jesus resurrection?
"Stop doubting and believe" John 20:24-28.

It's true that verse 28 is an expression of surprise, an exclamation!

Now the delusion is taking to another level...

If verse 28 is truly an expression of surprise, and exclamation!

Then, did Thomas actually called Jesus my God?

As you're trying to claim since.

In one breath you agreed that Thomas actually called Jesus my God but this only means Jesus is Thomas God alone and not our God in another breath you still want it to be Thomas statement was a surprise or exclamation which in real sense Thomas didn't mean what he said.


Self destruction is very easy when dealing with a confuse JWs.

An open-minded person following this thread can see that confusion is a cloth you put on.

Emusan:


Now the delusion is taking to another level...

If verse 28 is truly an expression of surprise, and exclamation!

Then, did Thomas actually called Jesus my God?

As you're trying to claim since.

In one breath you agreed that Thomas actually called Jesus my God but this only means Jesus is Thomas God alone and not our God in another breath you still want it to be Thomas statement was a surprise or exclamation which in real sense Thomas didn't mean what he said.


Self destruction is very easy when dealing with a confuse JWs.

[quote author=Emusan post=78302799]An open-minded person following this thread can see that confusion is a cloth you put on.

KJV:But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
Hebrews 1:8

Ask Janosky and his cohorts why the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ turned around and called His son God? If the case of Thomas is an exclamation what about the case of the father, is it still an exclamation?

Janosky, herlecks and co.

All these arguments are just not needed if the antiTrinitatian people would only stop trying to comprehend the existence of an infinite God with their carnal and finite minds.

janosky and his cohorts need to come to terms with the fact that the 3 persons - God the Father, God the Son and the Holy Spirit are just the same essential Being. God is more than powerful to be that if some elements He made can exhibit such properties.

Deuteronomy 6:4
Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:

There is only One God, the Father. Jesus is not "God the Son" but "the Son of God" who is subject to the Father.

If Jesus is subject to the Father, that makes the trinity doctrine a falsehood, for they claim Jesus to be equal with God or is God, but Jesus was a God who has a God. This is where everyone is confused, they know Jesus was a God, but they confuse Him with the Supreme King. Jesus was a King who has a King. The Ancient of Days is His Father and His God.

If Jesus called His Father "my God," that means the Father receives worship from His Son. How then are they equal? Jesus is the Word of God, not the Father nor is He equal to the Father. The Word of the Father is subject unto the Father, so is the Spirit subject to His owner (the Father) and the Son. The scripture is clear on this.

No wonder our Lord Jesus continued to stress "my God, my God" on earth and in eternity. He knew falsehood will come, with that He destroyed every hope of placing Him as equal with His God and His Father.

My Father and My God. This statement alone destroys every false hope of Trinity. He is called the Father for a purpose, for He is the origin of all things. He is the Father of our Lord Jesus. Is anyone here equal with his father or his God?

You folks should ask yourselves, what does it mean to be a God to someone? If God is my God and my Father, are we still in anyway equal?

[quote author=Agrogbeide post=78304424][/quote]herlecks don't tell me you didn't notice the above. Please explain.

Cc. Janosky, maximus99

[quote author=Agrogbeide post=78304424][/quote]Yea. Jesus was a God who has a God,

Psalms 45:7
Thou lovest righteousness, and hatest wickedness: therefore God, thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

Hebrews 1:9
Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.

I'll continue to stress this that the term "God" is not anyone's name, it only defines the type of being, especially spiritual beings. Angels were called gods, demons, humans were also called god.

herlecks:


... but Jesus was a God who has a God. This is where everyone is confused, they know Jesus was a God, but they confuse Him with the Supreme King. Jesus was a King who has a King. The Ancient of Days is His Father and His God.

sorry to say this but you keep sounding like an incoherent broken record because we can't have only One God and at the same time have another God(not god) that is subject to Him, except if you're going to utterly deny the deity of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is the Lord, the Everlasting Father that deserves our worship, that makes Him the same with the Ancient of Days as a Being NOT as a Person.

Jesus is subject to His heavenly Father as a Person NOT in essence. Is your soul not subject to your spirit? Yet your soul and spirit are essentially the same - YOU.

Your position is not different from that of Quran and Muslims, for their main purpose is to deny that Jesus Christ is Lord.

Emusan:




If verse 28 is truly an expression of surprise, and exclamation!

Then, did Thomas actually called Jesus my God?

As you're trying to claim since.

In one breath you agreed that Thomas actually called Jesus my God but this only means Jesus is Thomas God alone and not our God in another breath you still want it to be Thomas statement was a surprise or exclamation which in real sense Thomas didn't mean what he said.

Liar, it is NOT my claim, it is a statement of Fact.
In many trinitarian Bible translations ,John 20:28 is an exclamation (!).
This is a solid fact.
https://biblehub.com/john/20-28.htm
Trinity worshippers are never in agreement regarding their satanic doctrine, unlike Jesus disciples, even if they disagree, they will reconcile & stand together on the same side on any issue.
1Cor1:10.




ht

UceeGod:


sorry to say this but you keep sounding like an incoherent broken record because we can't have only One God and at the same time have another God(not god) that is subject to Him, except if you're going to utterly deny the deity of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ is the Lord, the Everlasting Father that deserves our worship, that makes Him the same with the Ancient of Days as a Being NOT as a Person.

Jesus is subject to His heavenly Father as a Person NOT in essence. Is your soul not subject to your spirit? Yet your soul and spirit are essentially the same - YOU.

Your position is not different from that of Quran and Muslims, for their main purpose is to deny that Jesus Christ is Lord.

Oh.. being not as a person.. Is that so?

Bring your words out of scripture, not those jargons your pastor taught you. If your argument is not based on scripture you speak falsehood.

As a person not in essence. Lies. But Jesus says the Father (Person) is His God (Essence). Ah! Jesus says His Father is supreme in every way, whether in person or in essence. He called the LORD GOD His Father to prove superiority of Person and also calls Him His God to prove superiority of Essence! How come you people claim they are equal in any way? You people would even say to the Lord Jesus to shut up, that He doesn't know himself, that you know Him better. The Lord Jesus knew hypocrites would come to twist God's word to their own destruction, so He often emphasizes "my God my God my Father my Father." What can be easier to understand than this? Who taught you people these nonsense you spew on net? Where is this in the scripture? Who is the Source of all things? Jesus says, "I have life because of my Father," meaning Jesus cannot exist without the Father Who is the Source of life, hypocrites say no, you have life because you are equal to the Father in essence. What is Person? What is essence? God is Spirit. That is the essence. Man has spirit, that makes him equal with God, right? of the same essence? Angels and demons are spirits too. Absolutely deluded folk and his pastor.

Folly. So Jesus is soul and Father Spirit? This is in fact demonic. Who taught you all these nonscriptural jargons? Were you never taught at Sundays school that God is Spirit? You want to add your little human soul to complete Him?

If Jesus has not another God, why does He always say "my God and my Father?" I thought essence was the same? The Father shouldn't be His God if they were equal in essence, right? Lest you don't know what essence is.

Was Jesus making jokes when He said He has a God and a Father? Oh! He was referring to? His other essence half in heaven?

Your standpoint is most erroneous here. Folks like you want to eradicate the Person of the Son, the Word of God who became flesh, and make Him in the most stupid way One with His Father, calling Him the Father. You are most confused or deceived in here, very confused. In truth, if anyone believes not the Son of God, he is none of his! If Jesus is equal to the Father, then you deny the Son of God, for He is Son, not Father. Whosoever denies the Son is condemned already because He believed not on the Son of God. So you all had better get it right in your minds, if you truly worship God or something you fabricate on your bed. Go study scripture afresh with all humility and simplicity of heart, maybe God will show you something besides the nonsense your pastor has fed you with.

Agrogbeide:
Like I said earlier, there are many Bible passages that can be use to verify that the Lord Jesus Christ is the same as God or the Lord Jesus Christ is not the same as God the father. A good and proper understanding is required to balance the two claims in order to arrive at the truth.
Another clue;
MAN has a Spirit, Soul and Body, he is not one of them but has each of them which together makes him a Man. Without one there won't be others and as a result all must be present same time whether Man is active or asleep.
If we understand the clue above we can be able to see some lights.

Man does not have a soul
Man is a soul. A living man is a living soul while a dead man is a dead soul.
Genesis 2:7
7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Man was not given a a soul but became a living soul as a result of God's breath of life (spirit) breathed into his nostrils.

So the makeup of man is The body (what God formed out of dust) and the spirit (breathe of life).

Before God gave Adam the breathe of life
He was lifeless, (a dead soul) but he became a living soul when the breath of life entered him.

Bottom line: A soul is not a separate entity from Man himself rather the soul basically refers to the human or animal as a complete person, whether dead (dead soul) or alive (living soul). The soul can also mean the life a person or animal has, as it appears in other bible contexts.

Other references are Ecclesiastes 12:7, Ezekiel 18:4 (the soul that sins will die = the person that sins will die)

P/S: I know someone might want refer to 1Thess 5:23, but when you take a calm look at the verse it still tallies with what we are talking about...
Paul was here referring to the whole being of his christian brothers in Thessalonica. Just like what Jesus said in Matthew 22:37.

Believe that you are a Good Child of your Father and Mother and not a bastard..