What a beautiful pass from Boateng. Lewandowski juay dey miss clear cut chance anyhow. Smh

Lewandowski and sanches out. Ribery and vidal in

A40:

Shut up your phoolish and lying apoche cra cra mouth. You were still chasing okete in some bush in Rijkaard's hey day. You had no access to radio never mind TV. Eediot

When I'm done with you you go delete your account walahi. Reetardo Banks wey no know say Rijkaard was starting CB for Holland in U.S.A 94, Euro 92 and Italia 90

Let me just bookmark this. By evening when i am free, i will descend on you and you should come and tell me you were under the influence of alcohol when you typed this nonsense or you should just delete your account.

airmark:



So Rijkaard was starting as cb in usa 94? This is the reason i dont want to reply you again. It's obvious you were a toddler in 1994 or you were still kept under boxers. no offense. Wetin koeman and de boer come dey play for pitch. Why cant you shvt the fvck up and stay outta disgracing yourself everyday?

Hahahahaha when I said you were still hunting okete in the early 90's I was not joking. This apoche cra in his infinite stewpidity did not know that back then lots of teams played with 3 CB'S. I don't know how much more footie education I have to give you before you have sense

An apoche cra cra that did not know about Rijkaard - Koeman partnership, Rijkaard - Blind partnership and he said he watched football in the 90's.

You claimed Rijkaard didn't go back to CB for club and country after joining Milan you shameless phool

Torrrrrrr Kimmich omo oro


Apoche cra cra words on marble

airmark:


Now lemme chip in this , your bringing rijkaard case to Mascherano's is very ludicrous. After rijkaard cut it as a midfielder for milan, like i said in pages before, he never looked back. no club bought him /used/wanted to use him as a defender again. He played for holland as a midfielder subsequently

Edumare punish you if you are not here this evening. I have gasoline, napalm and lighter ready to cremate you and light your ashes with this high grade Cheeba wey dey my side

airmark:

Let me just bookmark this. By evening when i am free, i will descend on you and you should come and tell me you were under the influence of alcohol when you typed this nonsense or you should just delete your account.

A40:

[s]Hahahahaha when I said you were still hunting okete in the early 90's I was not joking[/s]. This apoche cra in his infinite stewpidity did not know that back then lots of teams played with 3 CB'S. I don't know how much more footie education I have to give you before you have sense

[s]An apoche cra cra that did not know about Rijkaard - Koeman partnership, Rijkaard - Blind partnership and he said he watched football in the 90's.

You claimed Rijkaard didn't go back to CB for club and country after joining Milan you shameless phool[/s]

You are even digging your hole deeper. Now tell me the 3 cbs for holland in usa 94?

airmark:




You are even digging your hole deeper. Now tell me the 3 cbs for holland in usa 94?

Ohh I would gladly do that when you tell me who was Danny Blind's partner in defense at Ajax.

Apoche cra cra still doesn't realize I have already crushed his imbecilic points.

You claimed Rijkaard was no longer a CB after hitting it at DM for Milan. I have proven he played there for club and country

I don rope you with strong okun. Come and explain how Rijkaard went to Euros, World Cup and Ajax and still played at CB

Apoche cra cra words on marble

airmark:


Now lemme chip in this , your bringing rijkaard case to Mascherano's is very ludicrous. After rijkaard cut it as a midfielder for milan, like i said in pages before, he never looked back. no club bought him /used/wanted to use him as a defender again. He played for holland as a midfielder subsequently

afrodoc2:
I wont even continue to engage him in any talk , not that i did in the first placce.
People here have had several debates here without resorting to but in his first response to me he laced it with insults. Tells me he is not someone i want to engage in any debate with.

Thats what the ignorant people do. When they cant match your facts the resort to insults.

afrodoc2:
I have begged them to stop several times before but they have both refused. Stubborn men like that, i don't know even now how or when it started

elrony:
Sorry o.. but lemme ask;

Ramdeuter and AdisaOwala, una get beef for real life before Nairaland?

This is way too much for banter na!

Can both of you point whereever I engaged him first. He thinks he can score some internet brownie points that he is missing in real life by antagonizing or tackling me, Not knowing he is reaching way beyond his intelligence and IQ level

RuuDie:
ramdeuter. i like dis una away jersey (vs Hamburg) - show a broda luv and arrange one for me na

Omo decamp come Bayern we dey wait you

Dayo and A40, I saw your posts. I'll reply after these matches of today.


BTW, these insults are way too corrosive. Is this not football banters anymore? The bile is just too much, IMHO.

sinizia:
Dayo and A40, I saw your posts. I'll reply after these matches of today.

BTW, these insults are way too corrosive. Is this not football banters anymore? The bile is just too much, IMHO.

I would be waiting for your response

Of which this your one sided admonishing get as e be. We are not the only ones dishing the insult. Don't be partial. Its what you are seeing with your eyes

Airmak will run from this thread, go and ask your predecessors Toba, you no sabi anything, he dey use Wikipedia argue

Davidbanky:
Airmak will run from this thread, go and ask your predecessors Toba, you no sabi anything, he dey use Wikipedia argue

He has proven to be a shameless Arrow. He doesn't even know how to use search engines and Wiki

How can anybody who followed football in the 90's not know about Rijkaard and Danny blind connection. Edakun

Abeg make we come up with name for Kimmich. That boy is turning to something else.

Wasn't suprised we barely scraped thru. We drew at Hamburg last year

I do like how Carlo is alternating the squad. Its Jupp-esque

A40:
Abeg make we come up with name for Kimmich. That boy is turning to something else.
Wasn't suprised we barely scraped thru. We drew at Hamburg last year
I do like how Carlo is alternating the squad.

Kimmich is already one of our top scorers? Is there anything he cant do? Neuer should start getting worried of Kimmich o. His gloves are not safe anymore. Kimmich might end up playing our entire 11

A40:
Abeg make we come up with name for Kimmich.That boy is turning to something else.

Wasn't suprised we barely scraped thru. We drew at Hamburg last year

I do like how Carlo is alternating the squad.

Poor man Sergi Roberto.

raumdeuter:


Kimmich is already one of our top scorers? Is there anything he cant do? Neuer should start getting worried of Kimmich o. His gloves are not safe anymore. Kimmich might end up playing our entire 11

If I want to count one of the few things Pep got right that boy is one of them

bykebyke:
Poor man Sergi Roberto.

Shey Sergi Roberto get liver to score two goals for CL match

A40:

Shey Sergi Roberto get liver to score two goals for CL match

Is it goals we are talking about?

Who is the better utility player?..that's the real question.

raumdeuter:


Omo decamp come Bayern we dey wait you

I sey arrange jersey for me make I dey wear go groove for party, u dey talk of decamp... I resemble naija politician for ya eye

bykebyke:
Is it goals we are talking about?
Who is the better utility player?..that's the real question.

Shey your Sergi Roberto fit play Center back?
Kimmich fit play Right winger, Right back, DM and CB

A40:

Shey your Sergi Roberto fit play Center back?

Kimmich fit play Right winger, Right back, DM and CB

Sergi..Right winger,CM,DM,CB,GK,Right back,False 9.
Dude is even benching the dude that was bought to bench Dani Alves.

A40:

He has proven to be a shameless Arrow. He doesn't even know how to use search engines and Wiki

How can anybody who followed football in the 90's not know about Rijkaard and Danny blind connection. Edakun

Abeg make we come up with name for Kimmich. That boy is turning to something else.

Wasn't suprised we barely scraped thru. We drew at Hamburg last year

I do like how Carlo is alternating the squad. Its Jupp-esque

My head just swells whenver I see him on the field, Carlo will give us te champions league, I have a very good feeling about that, Ribery is playing well too, the last time he did we won the UCL, I hope it's time for another, it's the semi and final am worried about, cos semi final is our birth right now..

Davidbanky:

My head is just swells whenver I see him on the field, Carlo will give us te champions league, I have a very good feeling about that, Ribery is playing well too, the last time he did we won the UCL, I hope it's time for another, it's the semi and final am worried about, cos semi final is our birth right now..

I am wondering how phoolish Stuttgart must be feeling for passing up on him.

We just need a bit of injury luck on our side. Carlo is pragmatic and I trust he would set us up to capitalize on the weaknesses of our opponents

His first test is on Wednesday. Fortunately he knows Atleti intoto

Shey Dortmund never scam us with this Hummels buy so?

bykebyke:
Sergi..Right winger,CM,DM,CB,GK,Right back,False 9. Dude is even benching the dude that was bought to bench Dani Alves.

Sergi Roberto has not played CB in a CL k.o game, he never play RB for Euros.

A40:

I would be waiting for your response

Of which this your one sided admonishing get as e be. We are not the only ones dishing the insult. Don't be partial. Its what you are seeing with your eyes

First off, my admonition wasn't one-sided, maybe it came off the wrong way, but it's meant for all parties. No party is innocent. I wasn't blaming anybody in particular?

Now to the discourse. After reading the rebuttal from you and Dayo, I've had a rethink seeing that I'm not entirely right, and also that there's no particular criteria that cuts across all scenarios. My fluctuating benchmark failed to describe Mike's exact position. As a matter of fact, I sought out 5 different websites and 4 of them called Mikel a midfielder without saying for sure if he's an AM, DM or CM. After much thought I've concluded that there no particular criteria thats absolute for judgement but rather a series of varying criteria. E.g:

The fluctuating criteria: while this criteria favors my argument for Mascherano, it fails woefully for Mikel. Calling Mikel a makeshift DM, CM or AM sounds retărded, and anyone can call him an AM or DM and he'd be right.

The "successful or prominent position" criteria: this criteria refers to a place where a player excelled the most or achieved success the most, and hence is always associated with that position. Judging by this criteria, a player like Rijkaard will always be a DM to not just me but the entire football lovers. His position as CB won't erase that fact. But this criteria also fails to address the Mascherano angle. At least 80% of Mascherano's trophies or achievement came while playing as a CB for Barca, but most people and I still see Mascherano as a DM till this minute.

The coach/club position criteria: this is criteria where where a club or coach wants a player to play might be different from the former position the player must've played. E.g: Blind started out as DM before LvG converted him to a RB, then to a DM at United, before moving him to a CB role last season. Currently, he has no chance of playing in a midfield position for United. Very soon, he might end up being recognized as a defender for United irrespective of what he's seen as outside United. This was one of the reason Dayo didn't win the Okazaki debate many months ago coz the evidence brought out showed that Leceister also insisted that Okazaki is a striker for them which destroyed Dayo's case for Okazaki. This means that anyone, especially from a Barca fan angle, can boldly call Mascherano a defender/CB.

And finally,

The "popular opinions" criteria: this is the criteria where majority opinions/views are generally used to describe a players makeshift or main position. E.g: Azpilicueta has played more games at the left-back than RB and achieved prominence there too, successfully ending the Chelshit careers of Cole, Bertrand and Ruiz. But the popular consensus is that he's a makeshift LB, and should a quality LB be gotten, Ivanovic should be thrown out for Azplilicueta to collect back his natural position. It's the same reason why I believe that any/most club looking to buy Mascherano from Barcelona will likely buy him to play the DM position which he started his career with and still plays for the NT. I


The popular opinion criteria is the most used and generally accepted criteria.


In all, I agree that anyone that currently calls Mascherano a DM or CB is correct.

Davidbanky:
Airmak will run from this thread, go and ask your predecessors Toba, you no sabi anything, he dey use Wikipedia argue

Next time spell my moniker well so i will get notification of your comment. I use wikipedia ? The same wikipedia that was first used by ajakaja40 to support his rubbish position on mascherano? Now airmark cant use it. Ok i want to expose your friend again with youtube videos. If wikipedia and other sources are lying, watch the videos below and tell me what rijkaard played in those matches.
A40 claimed rijkaard started italia 90, euro 92 and usa 94 world cup matches as central defender. This he said to show that rijkaard ought to be called makeshift if mascherano is one. Below is his disgraceful post.

A40:

[s]Shut up your phoolish and lying apoche cra cra mouth. You were still chasing okete in some bush in Rijkaard's hey day. You had no access to radio never mind TV. Eediot
[/s]
When I'm done with you you go delete your account walahi. Reetardo Banks wey no know say Rijkaard was starting CB for Holland in U.S.A 94, Euro 92 and Italia 90

It would interest everyone that holland's opening games in all these competitions listed by ajakaja40, rijkaard played in front of the central defenders as a midfielder.

Italian 90

Koeman and Adri van Tiggelen (CBs)

First match vs egypt


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkyxSe2Q6LQ


Euro 92

Koeman and Adri van Tiggelen (CBs)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dge7L9hG1TI

usa 94

Koeman, frank de boer, van gobbel (CBs)

First match Vs Saudi arabia


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58yRqk8BDQA


This is day 2 of his lying streak. We will see what's in the offing from him tomorrow.

Day 1 : PSG bought luiz before signing marquinhos

Day 2 : Rijkaard starting cb in italia 90, euro 92 and usa 94

Day 3 : ((((((((((((((((loading))))))))))))))))))

sinizia:

Now to the discourse. After reading the rebuttal from you and Dayo, I've had a rethink seeing that I'm not entirely right, and also that there's no particular criteria that cuts across all scenarios. My fluctuating benchmark failed to describe Mike's exact position. As a matter of fact, I sought out 5 different websites and 4 of them called Mikel a midfielder without saying for sure if he's an AM, DM or CM. After much thought I've concluded that there no particular criteria thats absolute for judgement but rather a series of varying criteria. E.g:

The fluctuating criteria: while this criteria favors my argument for Mascherano, it fails woefully for Mikel. Calling Mikel a makeshift DM, CM or AM sounds retărded, and anyone can call him an AM or DM and he'd be right.

The "successful or prominent position" criteria: this criteria refers to a place where a player excelled the most or achieved success the most, and hence is always associated with that position. Judging by this criteria, a player like Rijkaard will always be a DM to not just me but the entire football lovers. His position as CB won't erase that fact. But this criteria also fails to address the Mascherano angle. At least 80% of Mascherano's trophies or achievement came while playing as a CB for Barca, but most people and I still see Mascherano as a DM till this minute.

The coach/club position criteria: this is criteria where where a club or coach wants a player to play might be different from the former position the player must've played. E.g: Blind started out as DM before LvG converted him to a RB, then to a DM at United, before moving him to a CB role last season. Currently, he has no chance of playing in a midfield position for United. Very soon, he might end up being recognized as a defender for United irrespective of what he's seen as outside United. This means that anyone, especially from a Barca fan angle, can boldly call Mascherano a defender/CB.

And finally,

The "popular opinions" criteria: this is the criteria where majority opinions/views are generally used to describe a players makeshift or main position. E.g: Azpilicueta has played more games at the left-back than RB and achieved prominence there too, successfully ending the Chelshit careers of Cole, Bertrand and Ruiz. But the popular consensus is that he's a makeshift LB, and should a quality LB be gotten, Ivanovic should be thrown out for Azplilicueta to collect back his natural position. It's the same reason why I believe that any/most club looking to buy Mascherano from Barcelona will likely buy him to play the DM position which he started his career with and still plays for the NT. I

The popular opinion criteria is the most used and generally accepted criteria.

In all, I agree that anyone that currently calls Mascherano a DM or CB is correct.

You make some solid points. However the concept of the role a player can play is vast and multi-layered. I'm going to merge all your criterias together and address them forthrightly.

For starters it is far too simplistic to throw words like makeshift for a player that has or could have evolved either due to the squad on ground or purely borne out of tactical necessity

Certain players are naturally blessed with the gift of versatility and simply adjust easily to certain roles. Sometimes even at roles they hate playing. At that point it is important to detach your mind from their previous position. Football is a dynamic game and what works with club/coach A might not work with club B

If a Pep Guardiola or Marcelo Bielsa bought a Javi Martinez for instance it is very likely they would play him at CB. Now if Juve were to buy Mascherano. They had 4 CB's already. What sense would it make to throw him in that congested setting when he can still play at DM.

You brought up the Rijkaard example which highlights how a coach or a tactical switch can permanently alter how a player is viewed. Perception is still key because Rijkaard was one half of a CB pairing that won the Euros. He still played at CB for the Netherlands while at Milan and in his twilight years he went back to Ajax and formed arguably the best defensive partnership in Europe as well. However it took just 1 coach to show us he could be great in multiple positions.

If you know me you should know by now that I don't hang my hat on general/popular opinion. I watch these games and draw my own conclusions that is why I could say two years ago at the peak of his hype that Hazard is overrated and that is what we saw last season and are seeing this year (without being immodest)
Tactics and actual performance is what I look at not the position the general public assume you play. If coach after coach deems you fit to keep playing a position then the issue of makeshift flies out the window.

Makeshift is David Alaba, Michael Carrick, Xabi Alonso playing at CB.

airmark:


Next time spell my moniker well so i will get notification of your comment. I use wikipedia ? The same wikipedia that was first used by ajakaja40 to support his rubbish position on mascherano? Now airmark cant use it. Ok i want to expose your friend again with youtube videos. If wikipedia and other sources are lying, watch the videos below and tell me what rijkaard played in those matches.
A40 claimed rijkaard started italia 90, euro 92 and usa 94 world cup matches as central defender. This he said to show that rijkaard ought to be called makeshift if mascherano is one. Below is his disgraceful post.



It would interest everyone that holland's opening games in all these competitions listed by ajakaja40, rijkaard played in front of the central defenders as a midfielder.

Italian 90

Koeman and Adri van Tiggelen (CBs)

First match vs egypt


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hkyxSe2Q6LQ


Euro 92

Koeman and Adri van Tiggelen (CBs)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dge7L9hG1TI

usa 94

Koeman, frank de boer, van gobbel (CBs)

First match Vs Saudi arabia


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58yRqk8BDQA


This is day 2 of his lying streak. We will see what's in the offing from him tomorrow.

Day 1 : PSG bought luiz before signing marquinhos

Day 2 : Rijkaard starting cb in italia 90, euro 92 and usa 94

Day 3 : ((((((((((((((((loading))))))))))))))))))

Bwahahahahaha. You have finally ran mad

Van Tiggelen ko Van Lionel ni. I have forgotten that teams only one match at a major tournament then go home afterward

Van Tiggelen was the Left back. You God forsaken sodomite

So if they asked you who was Germany's first choice central defensive partnership at the last World Cup you would tell us it was Hummels and Mertesacker. Eediot