please forget the hair an' all, and listen the word of God which the man is trying to get across to us. i have also been richly blessed by the man's teaching of the word of God.

people just wont reason,they look at things seen,when there suppose to look at things not seen. . .and they hear not. . .and yet Christ said "Only if they look and see,listen and hear and turn their heart towards me. . .i'll heal them."

But why dont some people just give a hearing first before they judge?

Messengers of Pastor Chris we have heard you all!

I still stand by my word. Stop Glorifying the messeger above the Message!.

Tell me where in the Bible Apostle Paul was ever exalted by any of the churches or any of his members? John said I must decrease so that HE must increase.

I would have gone on further to address you in this error, but I can see your heart is bent on proclaiming Pastor Chris the more!

Jesus said, I will send you a comforter who will guide you into all truth not a Pastor Chris!

God Bless greatly.

i can see that uve bent your back and not trying to straighten it. . .But its like u never read any of my post. . .i asked in one of my previous post that in what sentence did i exalt my pastor more than the message. . .?

Is saying that i love his teaching exalting him?
He teaches me the word,makes me understand better. . .some certain truths are revealed to me thru the holy spirit but i wudnt know it was the spirit who reveals it to me, if not that my pastor brought it to my awareness. . .does that make sence? do you now understand wot i mean when i say that i love his teaching?

He never teaches about himself,the message of God is what he teaches.
Believe me or not,u'r not the first and you wont be the last,so i better save my speech for the last person. . .save.

its when it comes to issues like this that people will be proving spiritual or lack of it. well the bible urges believrs to honour their leaders and respect them, so whats the problem with that.

As for the appearance, that is what God expects of His Men. Infact the bibles says the clothes they wear should be one of a kind, You know Designers. lol/

Dressing well and looking good is no big deal, I guess if he were not a preacher he would still dress well and look great.

For me I dress well,I place orders from top designer in Uk and around the world as I move.if by any chance I am called to the ministry I don't think that will change. lol

Some guys here and simply interesting.
Hero-worship is what I see even if u don't call it by that name.
If the messenger becomes more visible than the message, something is wrong.
A lot of gifts to this generation are being ignored right here on this forum by these same people who have identified one as a gift to this generation. U know why? They don't see yuo spending money on the internet, speaking nicely in front of adoring crowds and tv cameras, showcasing the highest collection of suits and shoes, etc.
There's a guy with THE VERY MESSAGE for the church today. Grace. No one knows him probably. Because he's not been packaged like the prosperity guys all around.
While we are not to judge, what should we do with error?

I have read with amusement the views of many Christ Embassy members on this thread. I have never believed in the man and his razzmatazz. If his followers are honest enough, they would admit they see more of his flamboyance than the Spirit in the word.

The question is : Would Christ have gone about his ministry the way he does? I have had courses to investigate his church and activities and I came away with distressing facts. He is not a man of God as far as I am concerned. He is just a businessman on the pulpit. I am trying to restrain myself but I have to be bold about my convictions.

I don't give a hoot how you guys will judge and condemn me but I will stand by my words even before God.

I will be waiting for your missiles.

My two cents:

Recently, after a friend has repeatedly bothered me to listen to one of pastor Chris' messages (Who Is The Spirit?), I obliged her. What I heard in many respects didn't make sense, and any honest Bible taught believer would have cause to ask questions.

1. What do Christ Embassy members (Nairaland) believe about being born again? Is it the indwelling of the Holy Spirit or the baptism with the Holy Spirit?

2. What is the meaning of this clause in Luke 3:22 - "the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him"?

The whole message simply didn't make sense at all, and I had to return the tape to my friend with my frank submission that it confuses issues far more than it sought to teach anything.

well am not suprise you didnt  understand.But what i'll love to tell you to listen to it again, pray before listening, and use a very good reference bible.

And again let me see if i can help with your first qwestion "Is it the indwelling of the Holy Spirit or the baptism with the Holy Spirit?" How can the spirit take his dwelling in you without u been baptised of the spirit. .You get the baptism of the holy spirit first before he takes his dominion inside you(and its all by faith)

secondly "the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him"?
A dove  has a bodily shape of a bird doesnt it,the holy spirit came in a bodily form of a dove(its by faith,accept it). . its as simple as that. . .theres one thing i know and its that The more you study Gods word with his spirit u'll expand your awareness of the simplicity that is in Christ.


but i just want to say something that has nothing to do with what u asked.

People don't know that to be a preacher you have to be wealthy. Jesus Christ was so wealthy when he walked the face of this earth,that even when he died the roman soldiers had to cast lot to get his designer clothing. . . . . .Mhn am the best of my kind.

@desodgi,

Thanks for offering to answer my questions. Actually I listened to that tape over and over again, as well as checked all the references he quoted before coming to my summations.

1. I think Pastor Chris confuses baptism with the Holy Spirit with indwelling of the Spirit. The moment anyone believes in the Gospel, the Holy Spirit indwells that person at the same time that such a person is baptized by the Spirit into the Body of Christ.

It is not by coincidence that the apostle mentions the indwelling first in I Cor. 3:16 and 6:19, before going on to mention the baptism by the Spirit into the one Body in ch. 12:13.

Now, many people have been led to believe that the Holy Spirit comes upon a person first before a "second experience" of the indwelling. That is simply not what the Bible teaches. Romans 8:9 says: "Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his". How can a person be a Christian if the Spirit of God is not already dwelling in that person in the first place?

Pastor Chris' analogy of a bottle first 'wrap' by the water if put in a basin of water before the water gets inside the bottle was inaccurate. If I may so say, another person may reason that the water is put in the bottle before placed in a basin.

However, leaving the analogy aside, I would say this:

Jesus showed that the Spirit is first given to dwell in a person before the Spirit overflows that person:

John 7:38 -- "He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water."

The Lord Jesus did not say that the 'living water' (which was symbolic of the Holy Spirit - vs. 39) would act from outside to the inside; rather, it was the other way round: "out of his belly shall flow".

That whole message was not balanced; and after I showed my friend what she missed, it surprised me that she frankly reasoned with me to the point I made.

@desodgi:

People don't know that to be a preacher you have to be wealthy. Jesus Christ was so wealthy when he walked the face of this earth,that even when he died the roman soldiers had to cast lot to get his designer clothing. . . . . .Mhn am the best of my kind.

i'm tired of this 'Jesus was wealthy' bandwagon.

2Cor 8;9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sake He became poor, so that you through His poverty might become rich.
Matt 17;27, there was no money to pay the temple tax
Matt 8;20, he could not afford a hotel to make use of in his missionary work

Have you considered the possibility that the soldiers casting lots for his clothing  was a means of bringing about the fulfillment the prophecy in Ps 22;18?
Jesus' parents were not rich. Jesus was not rich. Even many of his disciples weren't. Have you forgotten 'silver or gold we do not have' (Acts 3;6)? I wonder where all his 'wealth' dissappeared to if even his own disciples, who had 'left everything to follow him' (Matt. 19;27), could not get any share of it.
And no, i didn't say it is against God's will for us to be rich, but the over-emphasis on wealth is, to say the least, disheartening. 1 Tim 6:5-11 and Matt. 6; 28-34 are still in the bible.

I just saw the other part of your statement that 'to be a preacher you have to be wealthy'. If that's what you think, then i must say its very sad.
Please do read the scriptures; was Paul wealthy?
1 Cor 4; 11-13 (the whole chapter is a must-read)
11To this very hour we go hungry and thirsty, we are in rags, we are brutally treated, we are homeless. 12We work hard with our own hands. When we are cursed, we bless; when we are persecuted, we endure it; 13when we are slandered, we answer kindly. Up to this moment we have become the scum of the earth, the refuse of the world.
How many preachers of today do you see that even come close to the humility and devotion shown by the men of God in the bible. Where does their pattern come from?
Barnabas used to be wealthy, what did he do, he gave it all away. (Acts. 4;36-37). There is NO statement in scripture that supports what you just said, and i'd really love for you to rethink that. cheers.

@desodgi,

Secondly, thanks for answering the second question. I agree with you that Luke 3:22 was rather pointing to the fact that the Holy Spirit assumed the shape of a dove when He descended upon Jesus. But Pastor Chris said that was not correct at all. Rather, he said that the verse did not teach that the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove, but rather ina  figure.

What that figure was, he did not say throughout the message.

ricadelide:

And no, i didn't say it is against God's will for us to be rich, but the over-emphasis on wealth is, to say the least, disheartening. 1 Tim 6:5-11 and Matt. 6; 28-34 are still in the bible.

I was wondering about that as well.

pilgrim.1:

@desodgi,

Secondly, thanks for answering the second question. I agree with you that Luke 3:22 was rather pointing to the fact that the Holy Spirit assumed the shape of a dove when He descended upon Jesus. But Pastor Chris said that was not correct at all. Rather, he said that the verse did not teach that the Holy Spirit descended in the form of a dove, but rather ina figure.

What that figure was, he did not say throughout the message.

do expect to hear everything from preachers they are only there to lead you on how to know what you already have. . .more reason i said get a reference bible and not a newspaper bible.

Lol, @desodgi,

Well, I'm quite fortunate to be born into a family with a wealth of good reference material. I checked painstakingly checked out everything in that tape - that's how I came to the summation that it was not balanced or Biblically sound.

But thanks again for your love. Cheers.

calf,

Besides listening to Pastor Chris, do you read your Bible?

Where do you spend the most time,

listening to Pastor Chris or reading Scriptures?

Pastor chris has not in any way shown that he interested in preaching the words of God. thou he pretend to preach gosple but he took it as a business venture and not a ministerial job. Dont look at him on tv and believe he's preaching gosple,try and get near to him and his church activities then you'llknow he's a business man.

If miracle is what is deceiving you with,i'll tell you that there are lots of thing that you can use to perform miracles. there are tricks and miracle,mkracle are performed by prophet whom the god has sent to do so but tricks by those who wishes to get people to believe them to achieve their aim.

Pastor chris is a freak

Pastor Chris wears a shower cap to bathe and a hair-net to bed. How much more vain can a man of God get? I say what others overlook so I will tell it clearly here: VANITY IS A SIN.
A man of God spending hours under a dryer is sinning.

PASTOR CHRIS HAS FOLLOWERS! There may be some few people who listen to Pastor Chris' teaching (whatever that is) and go their way to seek understanding. But 99% of them are followers. I have attended one of his nights of bliss. At the end of the service, when he was leaving the venue, people started to rush desperately to touch his car. These are not just followers, they are worshippers.

The man got a perm, 15% of his male followers got their hair permed. That has nothing to do with learning the word of God, it has nothing to do with following a man of God, this is worship.

And just listen to what they preach. "I know who I am", "The Holy Spirit adds beauty and color to your life". Where are these messages going to take us?
I don't want to add beauty and colour to my life, I want to go to heaven when I die. Then he also goes further to quote Bible verses out of context for his members and they in turn do not bother to read the Bible at all. They read their monthly Rhapsody. Which is full of what Pastor Chris wants it to be full of.

Am tired of these people. Wealth, Enjoyment, Good health, Jobs, is this salvation. How can you forget that it was written: what shall it profit a man if he gains the whole world, yet lose his soul? Why is Chris Oyakhilome's message focused more on how to enjoy life than how to make heaven.

@doyenn,

doyenn:

If miracle is what is deceiving you with,i'll tell you that there are lots of thing that you can use to perform miracles.

Why did Muhammad not use any of those "lots of thing" to perform even one miracle?

doyenn:
Pastor chris is a freak

Aside the accusations, what good have your own Muslim preachers done in contrast to what Pastor Chris is doing?

Hmmm! Pastor chris, This is a very delicate subject. I'm being careful because the bible said something about his annoited servants (i've forgotten what it said).

But Pastor chris miracle are quite interesting. Check out this extract from a "total experience" crusade

Usher; Pastor, Pastor we have a lady here who was born blind, but she said when you were praying a scale fell out of her eyes and now she can see.
Pastor Chris; Thank you father, Come here woman. So the Lord has healed you
Woman; Yes
Pastor chris; So you can see
Woman; yes
Pastor Chris; What colour is my tie?
Woman; Fushia
Pastor Chris; (screams) Praise the lord
Woman; Halleluyah
Pastor Chris; (touchs her forehead) You are healed forever in jesus name.

The woman falls to the ground.

Now the question is how come a woman who was born blind could identify colour?

dont really know much am his level of faith , i have listened and watched him preach , the word! thats the most important and not the preacher/vessel, just wonder why u people just dont get it , i dpont care abt the vesssels , allll i care abt the the word that comes forth ,

Esss:

Hmmm! Pastor chris, This is a very delicate subject. I'm being careful because the bible said something about his annoited servants (i've forgotten what it said).

But Pastor chris miracle are quite interesting. Check out this extract from a "total experience" crusade

Usher; Pastor, Pastor we have a lady here who was born blind, but she said when you were praying a scale fell out of her eyes and now she can see.
Pastor Chris; Thank you father, Come here woman. So the Lord has healed you
Woman; Yes
Pastor chris; So you can see
Woman; yes
Pastor Chris; What colour is my tie?
Woman; Fushia
Pastor Chris; (screams) Praise the lord
Woman; Halleluyah
Pastor Chris; (touchs her forehead) You are healed forever in jesus name.

The woman falls to the ground.

Now the question is how come a woman who was born blind could identify colour?

hahahaha ha i go die ooooooo.
me i no trust that man hoha. which kind pastor? i no trust that man. i get many things to say but make i take am easy. let me start with. . . . i no trust am.
and all him followers de vex me. i no see that reflection Godliness in his ardent followers. at all. beware of people who centre so much on prosperity messages.

even the other chris (okotie) that one wey say God de choose am for every election. all those nigerian pastors i fear dem.

MP007:
i don't care about the vessels , all i care about the the word that comes forth

Can you drink iced water out of a dirty vessel contaminated with excreta?

funny! I dont even know what fuscia is,How did the x-blind woman know?_{God told her!}

those people na wayo hoha. even all those miracles should be investigated for clarity .

na so one woman go recieve healing from diabetes for one church and started to eat what she should not eat as a diabetic, now the beautiful woman is resting with the lord. she died from complications of diabetes. i'm sure the pastor of the church that healed her did not attend the funeral.

nonsense

when economy begin good now people go forget them sharp sharp

Pastor Chris and his fellow healing pastors are healing people in their thousands and yet more and more patients are crowding our hospitals.

Which way?!

@TOPIC

I was at one of those Crusades and The Preacher said he saw a vision that the Lord said he should marry me
and I said to him, "tell God you didn't see me".
Can you imagine me marrying a man with shifty eyes and pot belly. He smells like a Goat's ass

denex:

Pastor Chris and his fellow healing pastors are healing people in their thousands and yet more and more patients are crowding our hospitals.

Which way?!

Well, if the few who are healed have received what they longed for, then let's be thankful. There are other issues that may be more critical than the many people in our hospitals.

[size=20pt]Except a man is born again he/she cannot see the kingdom of God. Now i will advise you people that is vilifying the man of God to also become born again and preach the word of God to the people, after all, i only listen to his preaching. If he has any other thing that is not of God, that one is not my business, he will be the one to be convicted and not me. Moreover, that one will not stop me from seeing the kingdom of God.[/size]
[size=30pt]Stop Blabbing[/size]