FarmTech:
Get me clear. Our good works as sinners cannot justify us b4 God

Re-read my post above to see that your comment here, is not just only corroborating it but is also re-echoing it

FarmTech:
But after accepting Christ, good works must follow

This is a given, beloved. It's a sure thing that, after accepting Christ, good works must follow.

FarmTech:
That is why I have always emphasized here that u cannot preach Christ without preaching holiness, righteousness, and other godly qualities. These are the qualities that make us Christians. This also applies when preaching Christ to sinners. U tell them to repent from their sins and turn to Christ. U mention the sins u see them commiting, u explain to them why it is sinful and how God hate sin. How God will punish sinners on the last days. Preaching Christ includes a lot.

Of course you mention the sins you see others commiting, and pointing at the speck in their eyes, after you have removed the plank of wood in your eyes

FarmTech:
The reason why I make this emphasis is bc preaching against sin is fast becoming unpopular in churches today. Many pastors have successfully psyched sinners into believing that they are children of God. Bible passages that are meant for doers of the word are being quoted for sinners to claim. Mothers and ladies now dress like prostitutes to church and pastors will see it and keep silent.

It is weak males, who will crumble at the sight of mothers and ladies dressing like prostitutes to church. Have you a problem(s) with prostitutes? Do you look at prostitutes in disdain and with your nose in the air? Have you researched the interesting genealogy of Jesus?

livingchrist:
It is true, when I get the link to the post you will see it.

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Waiting.

BassReeves:
Re-read my post above to see that your comment here, is not just only corroborating it but is also re-echoing it

This is a given, beloved. It's a sure thing that, after accepting Christ, good works must follow.

Of course you mention the sins you see others commiting, and pointing at the speck in their eyes, after you have removed the plank of wood in your eyes

It is weak males, who will crumble at the sight of mothers and ladies dressing like prostitutes to church. Have you a problem(s) with prostitutes? Do you look at prostitutes in disdain and with your nose in the air? Have you researched the interesting genealogy of Jesus?

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Can u explain your thoughts in a thread about gay marriage below?
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BassReeves:
I am so happy that you figured this truth, out all by yourself

You are absolutely right, because it is a fact that, in terms of human being procreation, Adam and Eve are the mould, the prototype through whom all human being emerge. When it comes to the matter of human procreation or multiplication, the increase or exponential growth and even, to have multiples evolve, this is the means, for all these to happen and be possible.

The address, God gave, in Genesis 2:18-24 is about Adam and not, as you want to claim, is it about all human beings. Every single verse in Genesis 2:18-24 is about A&E directly.

In Genesis 2:18, it is Adam, who because of loneliness, was given a companion. In Genesis 2:19-20, it is Adam, who gave names to animal groups. In Genesis 2:21, it is Adam, who was put to sleep and under anaesthetic. In Genesis 2:22, it is from Adam, that the woman was made from. In Genesis 2:23, it is Adam, making a validation speech. Now lastly, Genesis 2:24, is not about A&E, but is about the future and one that, is not restricted to the straight up and customary binary of male and female necessarily only.

Relationship of the sort, is common among lesbians, homosexuals and bisexuals too, and is natural and normal to them, just as heterosexuality is normal and natural to you.

John 4:1-24
'1When Jesus realized that the Pharisees were aware Hea was gaining and baptizing more disciples than John
2(although it was not Jesus who baptized, but His disciples),
3He left Judea and returned to Galilee.
4Now He had to pass through Samaria.
5So He came to a town of Samaria called Sychar, near the plot of ground that Jacob had given to his son Joseph.
6Since Jacob’s well was there, Jesus, weary from His journey, sat down by the well. It was about the sixth hour.
7When a Samaritan woman came to draw water, Jesus said to her, “Give Me a drink.”
8(His disciples had gone into the town to buy food.)
9“You are a Jew,” said the woman. “How can You ask for a drink from me, a Samaritan woman?” (For Jews do not associate with Samaritans.)c
10Jesus answered, “If you knew the gift of God and who is asking you for a drink, you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water.”
11“Sir,” the woman replied, “You have nothing to draw with and the well is deep. Where then will You get this living water?
12Are You greater than our father Jacob, who gave us this well and drank from it himself, as did his sons and his livestock?”
13Jesus said to her, “Everyone who drinks this water will be thirsty again.
14But whoever drinks the water I give him will never thirst. Indeed, the water I give him will become in him a fount of water springing up to eternal life.”
15The woman said to Him, “Sir, give me this water so that I will not get thirsty and have to keep coming here to draw water.”
16Jesus told her, “Go, call your husband and come back.”
17“I have no husband,” the woman replied.
Jesus said to her, “You are correct to say that you have no husband.
18In fact, you have had five husbands, and the man you now have is not your husband. You have spoken truthfully.”
19“Sir,” the woman said, “I see that You are a prophet.
20Our fathers worshiped on this mountain, but you Jews say that the place where one must worship is in Jerusalem.”
21“Believe Me, woman,” Jesus replied, “a time is coming when you will worship the Father neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem.
22You worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews.
23But a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and in truth, for the Father is seeking such as these to worship Him.
24God is Spirit, and His worshipers must worship Him in spirit and in truth.”

Bronze, is a marriage of tin and copper. Living together and civil partnership, are all shades of marriage. Should I say more?

If that referenced John 4:1-24, is read in-depth and with full understanding, it becomes a no brainer to know that, it takes more than sex, to build a great marriage, and ironically nearly impossible to build a great marriage without sex and so, not only did the Designer of human anatomy, God, configured a woman to complement and complete a man, but that homosexuals too, were divinely given thought of, and this evident in the anatomical and physiological design of human beings, as we see it.

Without you giving weak reasons, why, according to you, is same sex conjugal relationship, not normal? You can speak for yourself, that it isn't normal for you to find yourself attracted to your own sex

What human destructive adventure are two strictly monogamous same sex couple participating or taken part in?

You can tell me, after you've quoted out here what they both say

FarmTech:

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Waiting.

Ok, here is the link where jesusjnr (former monika) said Allah is his God.

https://www.nairaland.com/5442276/nairalanders-please-need-opinion#82670903

livingchrist:

Good works cannot save before or after salvation, good works after salvation is not done to attain righteousness, the preaching against sin has just one purpose which is to lead people to Jesus, it is not to make them do good or adjust their character or dressing so that they will make heaven,that is an heresy.

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Preaching against sin does not have only one purpose. It helps sinners to repent or see the need to repent. It helps Christians to grow from infants to maturity. Fact is, if anyone live in sin, he is not a christian. He have not been saved. If u dress like a prostitute or cultist, u are not a Christian and u have not been saved. Such a person is only deceiving him/herself.
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If gud works cannot save u after salvation, is it bad works that will save after salvation? Remember what James said: Faith without work is dead. Show me ur faith, and I will show u my faith by my works. U will have a better understanding of faith and works if you read Paul's and James' writings. See a gud explanation here: https://rsc.byu.edu/vol-13-no-3-2012/paul-james-faith-works.
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Even demons have faith that there is one God and they tremble. But they are not loyal to him. That kind of faith is dead. Likewise, any person who claim to have faith in Christ without obeying his commandment, that person's faith is dead. Jesus said: If u love me, obey my commandment. U are not saved if u don't produce good fruits.
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1 John 3:9
Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.

FarmTech:

I don't understand this question. Jesus was sinless. So are u saying that Christians too are sinless?

Righteousness and sinlessness are not thesame. Righteousness is a gift received through new birth. It is the new nature christ gave to us.

Romans 5:17
. . . they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousnes shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ

Question is if the gift of righteousness is less than what Christ had or did christ give the church lesser Righteousness

FarmTech:

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Preaching against sin does not have only one purpose. It helps sinners to repent or see the need to repent. It helps Christians to grow from infants to maturity. Fact is, if anyone live in sin, he is not a christian. He have not been saved. If u dress like a prostitute or cultist, u are not a Christian and u have not been saved. Such a person is only deceiving him/herself.
.

What of the one that insult people on nairaland. Is he a Christian also

livingchrist:

Ok, here is the link where jesusjnr (former monika) said Allah is his God.

https://www.nairaland.com/5442276/nairalanders-please-need-opinion#82670903

Wonderful now we know how he got he doctrine of righteousness wrong. Where do we start from. This na work oh

First of all the criminal will not go to heaven, what Jesus promised him is Paradise not heaven!
Secondly the works of faith has a lot to do with trusting (believing) in Jesus' sense of judgment, no matter what good works we humans believe if it's not according to what Jesus taught then it will end up a failure.
For your information there is no church founder in the early twentieth century that doesn't have good intentions before establishing a church because as at then it wasn't a money making ventures. But due to the fact that their Churches we're not build on the doctrine of Christ it grew up (like a seed) to become a failure in the end. Jesus said "BY THEIR FRUIT" {Matthew 7:16} so you can't distinguish between the church of Christ and the congregation of devil from the start no matter how smart you are.
For Jesus to have confirmed that even angels (perfect intelligent beings) in heaven can't identify false Church from inception then know that imperfect humans like you and i can't know them. But after several years of their establishment there they will never produce the FRUIT of God's Holy Spirit which qualities are LOVE, JOY, PEACE, PATIENCE, GOODNESS, GENTLENESS, FAITH, MILDNESS, and SELF-CONTROL! Galatians 5:22-23

FarmTech:

.This one is a dying criminal. But assuming he was to live, would he have made heaven if he continued in crime? Thru faith, we are saved. But we cannot say we are saved if we don't bear good fruits or if we continue in sin. Pls, when ever u talk about faith in Christ, don't talk as if bearing good fruits is not important. Many so-called Christians are perishing bc of that. U cannot preach Christ without preaching about the need for holiness and righteousness.

FarmTech:
Can u explain your thoughts in a thread about gay marriage below?

[img]https://media./images/83144cef453b6cb74f63274129d7c290/tenor.gif[/img]
FarmTech is digging up old threads, to instead of from countless many other things to choose from, decidedly zeroed on, this strong desire wanting to know specifically about thoughts on gay marriage?
I just knew you are bothered with imaginable specks in others' eyes, than the glaring plank of wood in your eye.

We can do trade by barter. You go first, satisfactorily answer all the questions asked on the thread you dug up and dragged in here. Give your responses in the same order and/or sequence the questions were asked, then I'll oblige and reciprocate you

FarmTech:

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Preaching against sin does not have only one purpose. It helps sinners to repent or see the need to repent. It helps Christians to grow from infants to maturity. Fact is, if anyone live in sin, he is not a christian. He have not been saved. If u dress like a prostitute or cultist, u are not a Christian and u have not been saved. Such a person is only deceiving him/herself.
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If gud works cannot save u after salvation, is it bad works that will save after salvation? Remember what James said: Faith without work is dead. Show me ur faith, and I will show u my faith by my works. U will have a better understanding of faith and works if you read Paul's and James' writings. See a gud explanation here: https://rsc.byu.edu/vol-13-no-3-2012/paul-james-faith-works.
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Even demons have faith that there is one God and they tremble. But they are not loyal to him. That kind of faith is dead. Likewise, any person who claim to have faith in Christ without obeying his commandment, that person's faith is dead. Jesus said: If u love me, obey my commandment. U are not saved if u don't produce good fruits.
.
1 John 3:9)
Anyone having been born of God does not practice sin, because His seed abides in him, and he is not able to continue sinning, because he has been born of God.

Bro, there is only one way to be saved and that is Jesus.
Everything in the bible points to Jesus, the essence of repentance is so that people can have faith in Jesus

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus is the only way not goodworks, penance or any religious activity or morality.

Only faith in Jesus can sanctify a man.

Acts 26:18
To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

You see that it is the faith in Christ that sanctifies a man not to merely believe there is God.


The faith of demons is to believe that there is God, that is not a saving faith.
Muslims, traditionalists, witches, occultist or other religion believe that there is God but that is not a saving faith.

petra1:

Stop divergence. Is Jesus righteousness different from a Christian righteousness?

If the answer is NO. Then your teaching is faulty. (That's being polite )

Christ's Righteousness , even as discussed by Paul, IS NOT God's Righteousness.

You are expected to seek the Kingdom of God and then God's righteousness. This is not done after with even if you are of those who were imparted Jesus Christ's Righteousness, which is doubt since you are not of the blood of Jacob - were not previously bound to the Old Covenant Law of Moses.

petra1:
Stop divergence. Is Jesus righteousness different from a Christian righteousness?

If the answer is NO. Then your teaching is faulty. (That's being polite )

If only I could like more than once this post

Kobojunkiee:
Christ's Righteousness, even as discussed by Paul, IS NOT God's Righteousness.

You are expected to seek the Kingdom of God and then God's righteousness. This is not done after with even if you are of those who were imparted Jesus Christ's Righteousness, which is doubt since you are not of the blood of Jacob - were not previously bound to the Old Covenant Law of Moses.

Christ's Righteousness, even as discussed by Paul, IS NOT God's Righteousness. Really?
Who to your best understanding does Apostle Paul know Jesus Christ is?

Kobojunkiee:
Christ's Righteousness , even as discussed by Paul, IS NOT God's Righteousness.

Just leave matter bros

You are expected to seek the Kingdom of God and then God's righteousness. This is not done after with even if you are of those who were imparted Jesus Christ's Righteousness, which is doubt since you are not of the blood of Jacob - were not previously bound to the Old Covenant Law of Moses.

That was before his death. Now the righteousness made Available as gift wirhout the law

Rom 3:21 — Rom 3:22
But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

petra1:

Just leave matter bros

That was before his death. Now the righteousness made Available as gift wirhout the law

Rom 3:21 — Rom 3:22
But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Christ's Righteousness even as spoken of by Paul IS NOT God's Righteousness. You may not know it now but the next time you read through even Paul's epistles, pay attention to that.

I am afraid you are also wrong about His death.His death was the completion of what He told you He came to do, which is to fulfill the Old Covenant on the behalf of those of the Old Covenant(the Lost sheep of Israel) who would switch to the New Covenant.

petra1:
Just leave matter bros

That was before his death. Now the righteousness made Available as gift wirhout the law

Rom 3:21 — Rom 3:22
But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

Another one, another nice post

Kobojunkiee:
Christ's Righteousness even as spoken of by Paul IS NOT God's Righteousness. You may not know it now but the next time you read through even Paul's epistles, pay attention to that.

I am afraid you are also wrong about His death.His death was the completion of what He told you He came to do, which is to fulfill the Old Covenant on the behalf of those of the Old Covenant(the Lost sheep of Israel) who would switch to the New Covenant.

1/ Who specifically is this 'the Lost sheep of Israel'?
2/ At what exact point did the ordeal and/or plight of 'the Lost sheep of Israel' come into begin?

jesusjnr2020:
I'm sorry bro but I have to disagree with you on the bolded.

Let me give you an instance from the Bible to prove your assertion is wrong.

Matthew 16:15-17 (KJV)

He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Matthew 16:21-23 (KJV)

From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.
Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.
But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

So as you can see your idea that none of the apostles ever contradicted Christ has been proven wrong by this instance of Peter.

First, Peter spoke and Jesus said it wasn't flesh and blood but the Father in heaven that revealed it to him.

Secondly Peter spoke and Jesus implied that what He said was of men not of God, which meant that Peter the apostle contradicted Christ!

So let's leave sentiments out of the things of God otherwise it would lead to some repercussions. The apostles were not angels but also humans who could make mistakes, so not everything they said or did was inspired of God and here's your proof.

That's the difference between the apostles and Jesus. Every thing Jesus said was inspired of the Spirit of God!

Thanks and God bless.

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I meant the books they wrote, like Cor., Eph, James, Peter etc. The whole bible is the word of God. One of the rule of Bible interpretation is that u don't interpret one part in such a way that it will contradict another part. You also have to interpret in context.

livingchrist:

Ok, here is the link where jesusjnr (former monika) said Allah is his God.

https://www.nairaland.com/5442276/nairalanders-please-need-opinion#82670903

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Thanks. But he didn't went on to specify the Allah he meant - Arabic Allah or Koran Allah. I hope he says sth about it here.
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Pls, also share the link were he says Mohammed is a true prophet.

Kobojunkiee:
Christ's Righteousness even as spoken of by Paul IS NOT God's Righteousness. You may not know it now but the next time you read through even Paul's epistles, pay attention to that.

I am afraid you are also wrong about His death.His death was the completion of what He told you He came to do, which is to fulfill the Old Covenant on the behalf of those of the Old Covenant(the Lost sheep of Israel) who would switch to the New Covenant.

The new testament was only effected after his death.

Heb 9:16 — Heb 9:17
For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

livingchrist:

Bro, there is only one way to be saved and that is Jesus.
Everything in the bible points to Jesus, the essence of repentance is so that people can have faith in Jesus

John 5:39
Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

John 14:6
Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

Jesus is the only way not goodworks, penance or any religious activity or morality.

Only faith in Jesus can sanctify a man.

Acts 26:18
To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

You see that it is the faith in Christ that sanctifies a man not to merely believe there is God.


The faith of demons is to believe that there is God, that is not a saving faith.
Muslims, traditionalists, witches, occultist or other religion believe that there is God but that is not a saving faith.

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I don't know when u people will understand me. How many times shud I repeat myself? Or u are deliberately trying to frustrate the truth?
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I said that faith in Christ must come first. After that, good works must follow. Do u disagree with that? Ur believe in Christ means nothing if u don't bear good fruits. Christ came to call sinners out of sin!

BassReeves:
[img]https://media./images/83144cef453b6cb74f63274129d7c290/tenor.gif[/img]
FarmTech is digging up old threads, to instead of from countless many other things to choose from, decidedly zeroed on, this strong desire wanting to know specifically about thoughts on gay marriage?
I just knew you are bothered with imaginable specks in others' eyes, than the glaring plank of wood in your eye.

We can do trade by barter. You go first, satisfactorily answer all the questions asked on the thread you dug up and dragged in here. Give your responses in the same order and/or sequence the questions were asked, then I'll oblige and reciprocate you

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I just don't feel comfortable arguing christian spirituality with a gay-lesbian supporter. Repent so that u may see the speck in other peoples' eyes. Now I understand why some people will viciously attack holiness and righteousness preachers.

petra1:


What of the one that insult people on nairaland. Is he a Christian also

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Insulting people is bad. Do u agree with what I wrote there?

petra1:


The new testament was only effected after his death.

Heb 9:16 — Heb 9:17
For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth.

The goal was to fulfill the Old Covenant Law of Moses, obtaining the promise included of a forever in the land of Canaan, and the only way was to live and die in one's righteousness, as death is the only way to be free from the hold of the Law .i.e dead to the Law and alive in Jesus Christ(the New Law)

Jesus Christ lived and died a righteous man by Old Covenant standards , on behalf of each and everyone of the lost sheep of Israel(the sinners), who bound by the Old Covenant, would choose Him, the New Covenant instead, His righteousness "imparted" to each one who would - that is Christ's righteousness in even Paul's writings.

Gentiles were never bound to the old law and so had and still have no part in Christ's righteousness since according to the Old Law,only those who of the blood of Jacob were bound to the Old Law in any way or form.

As for life in the New Covenant, all are rendered equal since all are expected to seek God's Kingdom and God's Righteousness, through submission to and obedience of the commandments of Jesus Christ and the Will of God, in order to achieve the promised kingdom to Heaven and the treasures therein. And the

FarmTech:

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I just don't feel comfortable arguing christian spirituality with a gay-lesbian supporter. Repent so that u may see the speck in other peoples' eyes. Now I understand why some people will viciously attack holiness and righteousness preachers.

Hi! I understand you feel grace is against preaching about right doing or about holiness. It's actually the opposite. Men can preach the commandments and laws and people will not change from the inside out. Sin is bad we all know that. Grace on the other hand, transforms believers from the inside out. Grace Himself teaches believers on what to do. Grace is Jesus. He alone can transform people from the inside out.

If you preach to gays that they're sinning and they'll go to hell, few may stop due to this, but that urge will still be there. They aren't transformed from the inside out. What's the best way then? Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. Let them have a relationship with Him and He'll be the one to transform them from the inside out, where those urges will disappear.

Grace will enable believers to produce the fruits of the Spirit and they'll end up obeying the commandments effortlessly...Grace has been highly misconstrued. But it's okay if you still feel otherwise. Just wanted to enlighten you more.

petra1:


Righteousness and sinlessness are not thesame. Righteousness is a gift received through new birth. It is the new nature christ gave to us.

Romans 5:17
. . . they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousnes shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ

Question is if the gift of righteousness is less than what Christ had or did christ give the church lesser Righteousness

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No, Christ didn't gave us a lesser righteousness. But what we must know is that if sb actually received that righteousness, he won't continue in sin. Otherwise he is just fooling himself. Faith in Christ without good work is dead. Shall we continue in sin for grace to abound?

petra1:

Righteousness and sinlessness are not thesame. Righteousness is a gift received through new birth. It is the new nature christ gave to us.

Romans 5:17
. . . they which receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousnes shall reign in life by one, Jesus Christ

Question is if the gift of righteousness is less than what Christ had or did christ give the church lesser Righteousness

Holiness/Perfection(sinlesssness) comes before Righteousness and this is true in both the Old and New Covenants. You cannot obtain God's Rigteousness without first becoming Holy and Holy through submission and obedience to the commandments of God in either case.

Jesus Christ died so that through His death, those formerly sinners(lost sheep of israel) are made holy(His Holiness), and then righteous(His Righteousness) and then dead(His death) to the Old Covenant Law, but reborn in the New Covenant Law.

Christ's righteousness(and death) guarantees them the promise of Abraham which only belongs to those of the blood of Jacob.

Once made alive in the New Covenant, they being alive to the New Law are expected to seek the Kingdom of God and God's righteousness through obedience of the commandments of the New Covenant Law as contained in the teachings of Jesus Christ.

LisaAnneMia:
Hi! I understand you feel grace is against preaching about right doing or about holiness. It's actually the opposite. Men can preach the commandments and laws and people will not change from the inside out. Sin is bad we all know that. Grace on the other hand, transforms believers from the inside out. Grace Himself teaches believers on what to do. Grace is Jesus. He alone can transform people from the inside out.

If you preach to gays that they're sinning and they'll go to hell, few may stop due to this, but that urge will still be there. They aren't transformed from the inside out. What's the best way then? Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. Let them have a relationship with Him and He'll be the one to transform them from the inside out, where those urges will disappear.

Grace will enable believers to produce the fruits of the Spirit and they'll end up obeying the commandments effortlessly...Grace has been highly misconstrued. But it's okay if you still feel otherwise. Just wanted to enlighten you more.

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No, u don't understand me at all. How many times will I repeat myself?
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"I said that faith in Christ must come first. After that, good works must follow. Do u disagree with that? Ur believe in Christ means nothing if u don't bear good fruits. Christ came to call sinners out of sin!"
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Of u have faith in Christ, he will give u the holy spirit, who will guide u and transform u from the inside out.
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So if u preach to gay, u will preach only the love of Christ and shy away from telling them the truth that gay is evil? Is that not why we have gay people that think they are born again? U don't see what is happening in countries like USA? U want that to happen in Nigeria? If u are truely a christian, u will preach against sin.
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U said: "Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. " And I ask u: do u think it is all sinners that acknowledge that they are sinning? They would even use the bible to defend their sins. So how would they repent then, if no one tell them that their sin is sin? Did Jesus and his apostles not spoke against sin?

FarmTech:
I just don't feel comfortable arguing christian spirituality with a gay-lesbian supporter.

The ocean is comfortable with itself, and so, does not fear. Its only the scared person who wants to enter the ocean, who feels not comfortable and so gets afraid.

This would have turn out to be a comfortable life changing discussion and not any arguing matter, had it been, you stepped out of your ethnocentrism and dug in

FarmTech:
Repent so that u may see the speck in other peoples' eyes

Homophobics, like you are, hardly repent. FarmTech, do you as a fyi, know that homophobia, too, is a sin actually?
Do you know what Jesus, in Matthew 7:3, said about someone like you, pointing at seeing an imaginary speck in other peoples' eyes?
FarmTech, Jesus said: Why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not consider the plank of wood in your own eye?

FarmTech, coming from Apostle Paul, is the leading by example, of admitting to being 'the worst of sinners'

Karma, oh so sweet karma, comes for all the stupidly devout quasi-holiness and quasi-righteousness, slyly evil, falsifying, ignorant, sanctimonious hypocrites

FarmTech:
Now I understand why some people will viciously attack holiness and righteousness preachers.

It is evident that you have no inkling, no idea what the two words 'viciously' and 'attack' means before using the two words to construct your sentence and comment with them

LisaAnneMia:
Hi! I understand you feel grace is against preaching about right doing or about holiness. It's actually the opposite. Men can preach the commandments and laws and people will not change from the inside out. Sin is bad we all know that. Grace on the other hand, transforms believers from the inside out. Grace Himself teaches believers on what to do. Grace is Jesus. He alone can transform people from the inside out.

If you preach to gays that they're sinning and they'll go to hell, few may stop due to this, but that urge will still be there. They aren't transformed from the inside out. What's the best way then? Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. Let them have a relationship with Him and He'll be the one to transform them from the inside out, where those urges will disappear.

Gays are the least of anyone's and/or any place's problem.

LisaAnneMia, tell me how many gays are in the presidency? How many gays are in position of power, influence, legislation making and governing Naija? Is it gays causing the wanton and senseless killings upandan the length and breath of the country? Is it gays perpetuating the economy decay and corrupt practices year in, year out in the country?

LisaAnneMia:
Grace will enable believers to produce the fruits of the Spirit and they'll end up obeying the commandments effortlessly...Grace has been highly misconstrued. But it's okay if you still feel otherwise. Just wanted to enlighten you more.

LisaAnneMia, you have grace highly misconstrued, beloved. Watch a bird soar spread its wings, soar into air and begin to fly to understand what grace is. Watch fishes, like dolphins, in a manner requiring no spiritual, physical or mental exertion swim, turn, rise and lower themselves in the water, to understand what grace is about. On top that and on another note, fyi, the fruit of the Spirit, is singular, not plural. Lets get the fact right on that last observation.

FarmTech:
No, u don't understand me at all. How many times will I repeat myself?

You don't understand yourself at all, hence the many times you keep repeating your ignorances, shallow theology and poor grasp of scriptures

FarmTech:
"I said that faith in Christ must come first. After that, good works must follow. Do u disagree with that? Ur believe in Christ means nothing if u don't bear good fruits. Christ came to call sinners out of sin!"

Why not have the decency and boldness to list all the bad works of gays you believe to be, and I will reciprocate each on your list with good works to follow. Are you up for this or you want to play the chicken out and easier way out card?

FarmTech:
Of u have faith in Christ, he will give u the holy spirit, who will guide u and transform u from the inside out.

So if u preach to gay, u will preach only the love of Christ and shy away from telling them the truth that gay is evil? Is that not why we have gay people that think they are born again? U don't see what is happening in countries like USA? U want that to happen in Nigeria? If u are truely a christian, u will preach against sin

FarmTech, let me give you an opportunity to publicly say, what exactly is the evil in being gay?

What is it specifically that is happening in countries like USA then?
What exactly is it that you dont want that to happen in Nigeria?

FarmTech:
U said: "Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. " And I ask u: do u think it is all sinners that acknowledge that they are sinning? They would even use the bible to defend their sins. So how would they repent then, if no one tell them that their sin is sin? Did Jesus and his apostles not spoke against sin?

Beloved, listen blood. If there is any sin, that is demonstrably killing people, locally and at home, it certainly isn't your imaginable sin(s) of gays. If there is any sin, that is demonstrably making people not able to sleep at night with both eyes shut or closed, locally and at home, it certainly isn't your imaginable sin(s) of gays. If there is any sin, that is demonstrably making congo or kongo of garri, locally and at home, not being affordable to the common man, it certainly isn't your imaginable sin(s) of gays. I have a list of ills, longer than my arm, of suffocating and demonstrably snuff life out of all right across board in the country but them three should suffice, as you aren't dense not to get the picture that gays aren't the cause of peoples' misery, wretched conditions etc here. Yet people like you have the gall to go after God fearing, innocent, harmless, affectionate, faithful, not promiscuous, minding their own business gays. Why? its because you are locked inside the echo chamber of a polarised mind and its because gays are easy target to take pot shot at, so with your over bloated too self-righteous to see your own, unjustly condemn them

The only solution is to PRESENT a congregation of people in whose gathering the works of the flesh can't grow. Galatians 5:19-20
Then everyone can see what true Christianity is {Matthew 5:14-16} not just arguing fruitlessly when you already have gays claiming born again Christians. The truth is all these daddy GOs and Bishops in Africa are playing cards with you guys, they switch to whatever doctrines the majority feels is virtuous.
For instance 70% of Nigerian believe in the churches but ask them to mention Bible believing churches, many will not even talk about their own Church there are some churches registered in their brains as Bible believing churches due to the traditional beliefs handed over to them like:
©Alcoholic beverages is evil.
©Secular music is not good for born again.
©Jewelries, makeups and attractive clothes not OK for born again sisters.
But the trend is changing today, go to RCCG now you'll notice that their females that were not allowed to do all these things few decades ago are no more under such restraint.
The few churches maintaining this old tradition are gradually loosing followers to the new generation churches.
As long as their God is the same, as they pray together and practice some customs like Birthdays, Christmas, Easter, New Year and likes together as denominations belonging to the same FAITH, they will sooner or later embrace born again gays!

FarmTech:

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No, u don't understand me at all. How many times will I repeat myself?
.
"I said that faith in Christ must come first. After that, good works must follow. Do u disagree with that? Ur believe in Christ means nothing if u don't bear good fruits. Christ came to call sinners out of sin!"
.
Of u have faith in Christ, he will give u the holy spirit, who will guide u and transform u from the inside out.
.
So if u preach to gay, u will preach only the love of Christ and shy away from telling them the truth that gay is evil? Is that not why we have gay people that think they are born again? U don't see what is happening in countries like USA? U want that to happen in Nigeria? If u are truely a christian, u will preach against sin.
.
U said: "Tell them the love Jesus has for them and how he's forgiven them of all their sins and want them to stay saved. " And I ask u: do u think it is all sinners that acknowledge that they are sinning? They would even use the bible to defend their sins. So how would they repent then, if no one tell them that their sin is sin? Did Jesus and his apostles not spoke against sin?

Look up there to see proof of how the idea that God's righteousness could be inherited justifies iniquity like homosexuality and their workers.

That's what is bound to happen when people say that one doesn't have to obey God's Word to become the righteousness of God but just by inheritance.

Workers of iniquity, ritual killers, homosexuals, pedophiles, adulterers, rapists etc., who have not repented would be justified, as they could just inherit the righteousness of God without turning away from their wicked and abominable ways and obeying God's Word.

The devil is indeed a liar!

That's why we must ensure we keep speaking the Truth regardless of the opposition we face especially from the so-called Christians many of whom are workers of iniquity.

And the gates of hell cannot prevail.

God bless.