1 John 3:14
14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.

The first proof that a man has come to know Jesus is by loving the church.  

1 Peter 1:22
22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:

Some people tske delight in criticising the church and brethren .We must consider the church in all we do. We are one flesh with one another . We take communion of the blood together. We can't say we love the church and at the same time tear the body apart in open shame. A brother does something wrong in a church. We bring it to an open forum to celebrate and criticise.

Even whe Saul died David said don't let the philistines hear that Saul has died.

2 Samuel 1:19-20
19 The beauty of Israel is slain upon thy high places: how are the mighty fallen! 20 Tell it not in Gath, publish it not in the streets of Askelon; lest the daughters of the Philistines rejoice, lest the daughters of the uncircumcised triumph.

But today when a christian falls , it is fellow christian that will make a story out of it. Instead of praying and thinking of how to restore.

Many people died in the Corinthian church because of lack of love for the brethren.

1 Corinthians 11:30
30 That is why many of you are weak and sick, and some have even died.


Sometimes when one talks like this ,critics will say, we are trying to hide sin , we should expose sin. That's not what the bible teaches. We deal with church problem in the church and not before the world. We must have respect for the body of christ. It us disgusting to God and the holupy spirit to see Christians tear each other apart openly when they ought to be winning sinners. We rather wash our dirty openly . Unbelievers ought not to laugh at the church through our deeds.God wants us to contain church matters in the church.

1 Corinthians 6:1
1 Dare any of you, having a matter against another, go to law before the unjust, and not before the saints? . .
6 But brother goeth to law with brother, and that before the unbelievers.

The fact that we have different convictions and doctrines doesn't make us enemies of one another. We are still one flesh. The blood of Jesus we take in communion binds us together . Hitting each other from the back is a betrayal of the communion.

It is so bad these days that even a sin that someone has repented of  many years ago are still bring published here on the Internet and not by umbelievers but by his brothers in the lord . Who takes communion with the blood of Jesus.

We have 2 assignments. To preach the gospel to the world and to edify the body. These two elements have been lacking in what many Christians do here. You must seek to edify the church.

Ephesians 4:2-6
2 With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love; 3 Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. 4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6 One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.


We forbear one another. There is no perfect congregation . If a christian does so something wrong, there is a structure in the body of christ on how to restore such a one. ,it is not for us to spread such gossip but to restore such a one in meekness if not , we ourselves will fall one day.

Galatians 6:1-3
1 Brethren, if a man be overtaken in a fault, ye which are spiritual, restore such an one in the spirit of meekness; considering thyself, lest thou also be tempted. 2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ. 3 For if a man think himself to be something, when he is nothing, he deceiveth himself.

Any man who spend time to intercede for the body of christ will find it hard to criticise the samebody . We may have doctrinal difference . God is working on that.The early church had some doctrinal difference. But Doctrinal Walls are being broken down till we reach the unity of the faith. There may be faults and offences. These should not get us out of the arena of love into carnal and fleshly action . Insulting and cursing one another all in Jesus name.

James 4:1
11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.

James 3:-11
8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. 9 Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God. 10 Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be. 11 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?

Food for thought

Really lenghty but l'll read through

Thanks Jo. We always need to remind ourselves of these things.

@joagbaje

If you and your sect genuinely love the body of christ, you would not be defrauding them with false doctrines which your cult is notorious for.

. . and there they go again.

John 15:22
22 If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloke for their sin.

Joagbaje:

The first proof that a man has come to know Jesus is by loving the church.

Joagbaje:

Some people tske delight in criticising the church and brethren .

So who do we love, the building or the people

Joagbaje:

We must consider the church in all we do. We are one flesh with one another . We take communion of the blood together. We can't say we love the church and at the same time tear the body apart in open shame.

True.

Joagbaje:

It is so bad these days that even a sin that someone has repented of many years ago are still bring published here on the Internet

Maybe they dont believe he truly repented probably from the manner he conducts his business.

Joagbaje:

We may have doctrinal difference . God is working on that.The early church had some doctrinal difference. But Doctrinal Walls are being broken down till we reach the unity of the faith. There may be faults and offences. These should not get us out of the arena of love into carnal and fleshly action . Insulting and cursing one another all in Jesus name.

i like this bit

Joagbaje:

. . and there they go again.

Jo, maybe it's due to the issue of trust or confidence in the church leadership. It's the leadership that get hit most times. Since they believe only Jesus can rebuke them (afterall members are suppose to submit), members have no choice but to use public forums like this.

Zikkyy:

Jo, maybe it's due to the issue of trust or confidence in the church leadership. It's the leadership that get hit most times. Since they believe only Jesus can rebuke them (afterall members are suppose to submit), members have no choice but to use public forums like this.

Matthew 18:15-17
15 If your brother wrongs you, go and show him his fault, between you and him privately. If he listens to you, you have won back your brother. 16 But if he does not listen, take along with you one or two others, so that every word may be confirmed and upheld by the testimony of two or three witnesses. 17 If he pays no attention to them [refusing to listen and obey], tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a pagan and a tax collector.


Before you can go public , it should be on record ,the effort you have made privately .Churches have emails, phone lines,some still have suggestion boxes. Strucres by which issues can be address in the body. How does public forum agree with the bible teachings . A good christian can make honest mistake. We are ordained to correct in love,

But even if we feel the individual is not of God. Public forum will have effect on innocent people. It is christ that build and purge his church. He didn't give anyone if us such police assignment, Jesus explains it here.

Matthew 13:24-30
24 Another parable He set forth before them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field. 25 But while he was sleeping, his enemy came and sowed also darnel (weeds resembling wheat) among the wheat, and went on his way. 26 So when the plants sprouted and formed grain, the darnel (weeds) appeared also. 27 And the servants of the owner came to him and said, Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? Then how does it have darnel shoots in it? 28 He replied to them, An enemy has done this. The servants said to him, Then do you want us to go and weed them out? 29 But he said, No, lest in gathering the wild wheat (weeds resembling wheat), you root up the [true] wheat along with it. 30 Let them grow together until the harvest; and at harvest time I will say to the reapers, Gather the darnel first and bind it in bundles to be burned, but gather the wheat into my garner.

Maybe they dont believe he truly repented probably from the manner he conducts his business.

that will be carnal of us. Forgiveness is by faith, when a man declares his repentance , we must believe in him. Even if he falls we must believe in him still to hold him up and be strengthened. We often hear about Robert liardon Problem on this forum . But the man has confessed, went through counselling , his wife forgave him, his church forgave him. He came out of the counselling as a changed man, there hadn't been any such report since. But religious men here will keep raising his issue up as though it happened this afternoon. But years have passed, God has forgiven and forgotten . The man of God has moved ahead to fulfil his calling. why should we dwell in a place where God has left. on the past of other people.

1 Timothy 5:13
13 Moreover, as they go about from house to house, they learn to be idlers, and not only idlers, but gossips and busybodies, saying what they should not say and talking of things they should not mention.

@ zikkyy
"So who do we love , the building or the people"
Which would you rather prefer

Jo, maybe it's due to the issue of trust or confidence in the church leadership. It's the leadership that get hit most times. Since they believe only Jesus can rebuke them (afterall members are suppose to submit), members have no choice but to use public forums like this

As a Christian if you have issues with the leadership of your local assembly,it's better you go to the pastor and talk with him, not tell him what to do, but if you can't submit there it's best you move on to some other place.
Using forums like this to castigate men of god is wrong and should not be encouraged, it's destructive

As I've said before. Be careful of slander and libel.

using a public forum like this to propagate lies is not only wrong but very disgraceful. And it will be most disgraceful for one not to admit he is wrong even when the obvious is stated in humility.
For instance; chris and jo said it is wrong to pray through Jesus and to make Jesus a medium to the Father is equally wrong. This, chris taught his congregation worldwide and jo and newmi had to support this even to the extent of bringing it here.
They were corrected in humility, instead of admitting their wrong they decided to jump from one useless point to another

free123:

using a public forum like this to propagate lies is not only wrong but very disgraceful.

But it is not wrong or disgraceful to use it to lawlessly and without any form of restrain criticize and ignorantly make rubbish of Men of God? Perhaps you are suggesting to us that this was the purpose nairaland was designed

free123:

For instance; chris and jo said it is wrong to pray through Jesus and to make Jesus a medium to the Father is equally wrong. This, chris taught his congregation worldwide and jo and newmi had to support this even to the extent of bringing it here.
They were corrected in humility, instead of admitting their wrong they decided to jump from one useless point to another

Corrected by who? Anyway do you have anything meaningful to contribute this wonderful topic. thank you

@newmi

newmi:

Anyway do you have anything meaningful to contribute this wonderful topic. thank you

What would you want him to contribute ? He ought rather to read and go and meditate on it for a change of heart.

when did it become lawless to expose ur so called Men of God? I wonder whose man u are newmi - devil?

My contribution to this supposed wonderful thread is to advise u to stop supporting lies from chris and jo

[color=#990000]Jude 1:8
. . Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.[/Color]. .

Joagbaje:

[color=#990000]Jude 1:8
. .  Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.[/Color]. .

Tanx Jo no better time to bring that scripture

@ Free123
Hi Free123 or may be l should address you more appropriately "Bondage321" hope you have a bible to look out that reference for yourself, you might need it you never could tell perhaps it might just be the magical inspirational tonic for that needed change you desire lollllllllll
Free123, Bondage321, Captive213, Victim312 etc

free123:

My contribution to this supposed wonderful thread is to advise u to stop supporting lies from chris and jo

Testimony! Testimony!! Testimony!!!
Praise Master Jesus! The much needed change has begone sooner than l expected Free123 is truely free now can you believe it he at least recognizes (even though he called it "supposed" that this thread is a wonderful thread
Praise master Jesus, Amen! Amen

newmi!
You are now oldmi as u have lost the respect i have for u.
I thought jo was the most deluded member of chris embasi, u are now the worst victim of oyaks and a big fool for that matter. U follow man sheepishly because of money; leaving ur God given potentials for filthy lucres. Shame on u deceived deceiver roaming about fleecing and devouring people.
U know what is left for a fool at 40? - u remain a fool forever

@Topic
I agree completely with you, however, there are certain grey areas you did not address.
In as much as we have doctrinal differences and sometimes clash here on NL, I acknowledge the fact that largely, we are still brethren. But let us not also forget that we are all humans and we have the right as humans to enjoy our everyday life.
having said that, I would want to draw your attention to situations were deliberate fraudulent and premeditated wicked actions by a so called 'Christian' leads to a bitter disadvantage of another believer. I will give a few examples in as much as I will avoid calling some names.

Some people on this forum have either been victims or have had loved ones or friends who have fallen victims to such situations; and there a several other thousands and even millions the world over that are falling prey everyday.
We have seen ministers who were exposed as frauds over the years, these are men who for several years have deliberately hoodwinked thousands and sent scores to an early grave. (please note the use of the word 'deliberate') will you also call these ones brethren?

I am 101% on your side when you say we should intercede and not criticize, yes but this is for brethren who are unknowingly going astray. When you have a s called brother who devices schemes to take advantage of people he calls brethren, then I dare say that such a person cannot be called a Christian; he should be exposed for what he is so that the true brethren may be safe.

Let me use a friend of mine as an example: He is presently a pastor of about 2000 members; we grew up together as christians back in the days and of all of us, he was the only one that got into full time active ministry. somewhere along the line he began to lose it, he started having several illicit affairs and would always confide in me. After several years, his ministry began to grow and so did his influence. even though he was close to me, I was having doubts as to what he was turning into. At a point, he started having huge favour with wealthy men, they would allow him into their family and then he would defile their daughters. he continued doing this for all the families he got into; infact, he turned into a sexual predator.
He had his way with words so his ministry kept growing, one day I paid him a visit and he showed me a passport, it was a south African passport with his picture on it and a different name he told me he wanted to travel to SA to preach in a friends church, he was all about the honorarium he would get if he was able to raise enough funds in the church.
Today, I see him on facebook, he is hardly in the country spreading his poison all over africa and asia, he inboxed my facebook last week that he was in malaysia. I know him and I know he has no goodwill to offer anyone, I know if he gets into any family, he begins to look for young ladies there. If I can warn a couple of people to steer clear of him have I done wrong? if call him a fraud, am I touching Gods anointed?

Yet we have more and more of his type around the world masquerading as brethren but they are not; they have affluence and influence and as such pose a threat to the true brethren.
in my view, I think they should be stopped as they are not part of the fold!

@newmi
Biko  you guys should not mess up my thread

@Sirjohn
How many people will you warn? Did he rape or by consent . That's one point. If it's by consent , warning ladies will not suffice. But the man surely has a weakness to deal with. That doesn't mean he was never a christian . He needs help. It is not because he is a minister. The problem had been there all along undealt with. But what have you done to help him personally? What reason does he give? Is he happy about it? Is he struggling to stop or he enjoys that lifestyle. No child of God love to live in sin.

If he make boast of his lifestyle . It's either he is not a christian or he is under demonic influence but if he is sad about this thing , he need s help . But the help is not to publish his weakness to everyone. Just like robert liardon got help. But I would have loved to know his attitude towards things lifestyle. Did he admit or deny. Did he justify it. Is he sorry?

Joagbaje:

@Sirjohn
How many people will you warn? Did he violation or by consent . That's one point. If it's by consent , warning ladies will not suffice. But the man surely has a weakness to deal with. That doesn't mean he was never a christian . He needs help. It is not because he is a minister. The problem had been there all along undealt with. But what have you done to help him personally?  What reason does he give? Is he happy about it? Is he struggling to stop or he enjoys that lifestyle. No child of God love to live in sin.

If he make boast of his lifestyle . It's either he is not a christian or he is under demonic influence but if he is sad about this thing , he need s help . But the help is not to publish his weakness to everyone. Just like robert liardon got help. But I would have loved to know his attitude towards things lifestyle. Did he admit or deny.  Did he justify it. Is he sorry?

He has every reason on planet earth to justify his deeds, at one point, a group of brethren were sent to talk to him  when he was cohabiting with a girl he stopped talking to almost all of them. I think he has gotten to the point where his conscience is solid steel.
Thats why I asked for your comment on the derren brown video, there was Rev W V Grant who some years ago was exposed for false miracles and lies. he was imprisoned for tax fraud after many years, hes out and is doing the same things again. derrens video clearly shows him exposed once again deceiving brothers and sisters in christ.

1 John 4:7
Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

@ Jo;

All I can say is thank you for this wonderful info. My heart's been pounding fast after I read your first message. I trully repent of all the wrongs I've done.

To whoever I've ever purposely slghted on NL, please accept my sincere appologies. God bless you.

Joagbaje:

@newmi
Biko  you guys should not mess up my thread

No cause for alarm l apologize

@ Free123
My dearest free123 please accept my sincere apologies but you must understand that l frawn at any attempt by anybody to deray a potencially interesting and educative thread which l thought (perhaps wrongly) you were on course to do.
No hatred brodo l still respect you as a wonderful but controversial contributor. Muchas graias

i gat no problem with u as a person but i gat one with ur interpretation of the Bible. Anyways, my apology for the outburst to ur person but no apology for what and whom u support

Micuilles:

@ Jo;
All I can say is thank you for this wonderful info. My heart's been pounding fast after I read your first message. I trully repent of all the wrongs I've done.
To whoever I've ever purposely slghted on NL, please accept my sincere appologies. God bless you.

We give God thanks

free123:

i gat no problem with u as a person but i gat one with your interpretation of the Bible. Anyways, my apology for the outburst to your person but no apology for what and whom u support

Well thats what this forum is all about most times we are forced to disagree to establish an understanding. Toast to healthy discussion. Muchas graias