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Nairaland Forum / Nairaland / General / Politics / EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes (8736 Views)
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Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by pemimi(f): 11:11am On Aug 17, 2011 |
Am one to read and pass on but today, I just have to say something Maybe her intentions are pure but i do know it wasn't based on wisdom or understanding of her true job, 1st of all she said Pastors and their worshipers, A true christian doesn't worship his/her pastor, My tithe is a covenant between i and my God and my pastor aint a 3rd party in that covenant so sorry he can't question it, God knows who is doing that which is right ® wrong and pays each according τ̅☺ his deed, So if she insist on this then she should ask all religious groups including the traditional grps and the muslims, afterall they are all worshipers Of something e all worshipers Of something |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Claus(m): 11:13am On Aug 17, 2011 |
While I commend the motive behind what EFCC are trying to do, it's clearly not going to work. Firstly, the expectation in these churches is that people can be miraculously blessed. This is the message from the main men in the churches. For these same men to start questioning the sources when such "miraculous blessings" occur is very unlikely. Secondly, if it's money laundering that they want to prevent, then appealing to the churches is no good. For money laundering to happen, the church (or certain people within it) have to connive with the money launderers to pull it off. Also, money laundering through the church actually means that a person tries to place dirty money into the church and then retrieve a large % of it as clean money. I'm not aware that church members are able to extract funds from churches. EFCC should use the methods used by tax agencies in the developed world. This involves matching a person's lifestlye and assets to their known sources of income. E.g. a person known to be in a modest pay grade but who has bought like 10 houses should attract further attention. The difficulty is always in being able to match a person to their assets since a lot of looters use proxies. I don't envy EFCC. Their job is not easy. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by 3direct: 11:15am On Aug 17, 2011 |
EFCC should query the money, A man Last month pays his tithe with blood money, and confesses he has been doing that for long, should the money be return or report to EFCC?, |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Nobody: 11:18am On Aug 17, 2011 |
Tee_Jay: Crime is vast but a known criminal shouldn't be shielded.Imo,i think the church and mosque should raise concerns about people that tender millions in tithes especially those with unknown source of income.Morality is the basic foundation of every religion and therefore,must be treasured by the custodian of both religions.It makes no sense preaching against corruption but gaining from the proceeds of corruption.It's called aiding and abetting ! |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by brainpulse: 11:19am On Aug 17, 2011 |
Tee_Jay: But a pastor can question and reject it when in doubt. Samuel rejected the offering of saul when he disobeyed God- He questioned him to know maybe he actually obeyed God. Paul wrote to the churches on the same topic in his epistles. If He actually have the spirit of God, He has every right to question the tithes and offering because they have bad implication on the alter. Waziri is not out of point. If my tithe increased from 10,000 to 100,000- My pastor will call me and politely question me. But if he suspect that i am not clean. he advices me to repent and retrace my step. The war on corruption cannot be won overnight. though we know alot of them still roaming the streets and we feel that she is not taking action- we may not know about investigations going on underground to have a solid case against them in the court of law. What is wrong is wrong. Men of God are God care-takers and if they close their eyes on crimes them we are going to be sharing from there sufferings |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by islamrules(m): 11:20am On Aug 17, 2011 |
I dislike double standard to the core and you are only getting emotional because the church was mentioned.I'm talking from a political and moral aspect not a religion win or lose one.Just one question for you. Is stolen money justified to pay tithe either in mosque or church ? What moral values do religion bodies hold when it comes to corruption ? should they support or oppose it ? Gain from the proceeds or turn it down ? ! According to tithe, Pastors should not even know who pays what. It is not his business! Is pastor God. Can you steal and pay tithe from it ? Are deceiving God ? Is it possible to deceive God ? This matter is being address at a business angle, but, it should be spiritual. But, what churches can be doing is if your tithe is more than that of Goodluck Jonathan, then how much is your salary ? Cuz as far as I am concerned, nobody should be earning salary more than the president among those politicians. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by sley4life(m): 11:28am On Aug 17, 2011 |
wow. i cant LMAO. So EFCC think the church will bite the fingers that feeds it. When most of the church in Nigeria is for profit making. How will Adeboye buy his Jet if he reveals such info to EFCC |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by brainpulse: 11:29am On Aug 17, 2011 |
In my church every tithe envelop have numbers on them known only to the man of God. Once you don't pay your tithe consecutively, he calls you to know what went wrong wheather you lost your Job or problems that the church can help you with. if you lose you job, a vacancy is sort out for on your behave and within some weeks you get something doing. if the tithe was not able to paid because of sickness, the church helps in prayer, mental, material support. A lot of men form religious gathering without the main reason of setting them up, just to take, receive and receive then close eye, without care for the sheep and dirty the alter of God. Since the followers don't take time to read the bible they accept everything even when not pure. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Nobody: 11:34am On Aug 17, 2011 |
brainpulse:But sincerely how many pastors in Naija actually do this ? Did they call cecelia ibru or Akingbola ? |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Claus(m): 11:35am On Aug 17, 2011 |
Perhaps when laws like the U.K.'s Proceeds of Crime Act come into play in Nigeria, then people and organisations in general will be a bit more curious about the dubious sources of the money they receive. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 11:36am On Aug 17, 2011 |
@comments some peeps here are as dumb as farida. . . @op By the way is she a christian? So d pastor will begin to follow all his members every where to make sure that their money is clean? ![]() |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Kalman(m): 11:38am On Aug 17, 2011 |
I pity Nigerians. We don't seem to know the difference between Moral obligation and Legal Obligations. Government has the right to regulate the operation of the church under laws. This is document is from Internal revenue Service, UK. Read it and enlighten yourselves on how thing are done in civilized countries. Not to open mouth bla-bla-bla. We don't think before we talk. http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p1828.pdf (UNITED STATES INTERNAL REVENUE SERVICE) and http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/charities/gift_aid/rules/church-coll.htm (UNITED KINGDOM HM REVENUE AND CUSTOM) Only in Nigeria do we try to regulate churches then people open their mouths to say rubbish. Be there let people use your head. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by MMM2(m): 11:41am On Aug 17, 2011 |
what of mosque? ![]() |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Nobody: 11:48am On Aug 17, 2011 |
Claus: Naija will never support such law because of our short-sightedness and corrupt ways even mosque and church are not spared ! Wtf |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 11:51am On Aug 17, 2011 |
how much percentage of a persons wealth(stolen or worked 4) is spent in a church?The bulk of the money is spent in restaurants,boutiques,estate agencies,airlines e.t.c.It logically means that every business should report to the efcc transactions that run into million or thousands ![]() Efcc should please go and do their work |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by bisiaet: 11:54am On Aug 17, 2011 |
I dislike double standard to the core and you are only getting emotional because the church was mentioned.I'm talking from a political and moral aspect not a religion win or lose one.Just one question for you. Is stolen money justified to pay tithe either in mosque or church ? What moral values do religion bodies hold when it comes to corruption ? should they support or oppose it ? Gain from the proceeds or turn it down ? ! Ok Mr Bluetooth I get your point clear now but as well you need to get my point clear. I'm not getting emotional for any reason because church was mentioned if you read my earliest post you will see what I said as per tithe of a things to be frank either from right source or stolen source I personally dislike the way men of God go pink or blue in their face yelling for tithe to satisfy their gluttonous desire for wealth. Coming to your question as per if it is right or wrong collecting tithe from these well known corrupt men in a real sense it is WRONG ABSOLUTELY no question about that. But in other way there is no way EFCC can not tell church to investigate them because the man on the pulpit is cash drunk, the man as Imam is cash conscious. All I expect from EFCC is to encouage the Church and Mosque to shun such tithe because they are loot cash that is if that is possible because it is a big question of moral conscienceness. God bless |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by chines4(m): 11:56am On Aug 17, 2011 |
I just don't understand why government agencies can't just do their job. Not only churches what about the herbalists, town unions, the spouse of the individuals involved, BF,GF etc |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 11:58am On Aug 17, 2011 |
chines4:no mind d murrafuckas. . .like i said earlier on,It logically means that every business or non profit organisations should report to the efcc transactions that run into million or thousands ![]() |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by brainpulse: 12:00pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
M M M:All religious gathering |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by CHEUARIN: 12:06pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
WHERE ARE THE STOLEN BILLIONS , EFCC? THE BILLIONS STOLEN BY MR. OLE FROM THE BANK WAS NEVER TITHED? MAY BE IT WAS RETURNED TO EFCC! EFCC NEEDS TO BE FOCUSED IN THEIR BIZ. THE REAL MILKERS UP THERE IN ABJ DO NOT PAY ANY DAMN TITHE. DO THEY ATTEND CHURCH SERVICES AT ALL? RESEARCH WELL EFCC. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Nobody: 12:09pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
bisiaet:The church and mosque can also help in the fight against corruption if it's established that any of their members is into criminal activites.The law of the land remains the only official law to deal with crimes;granting forgiveness by pastors or imams to thievies in order to justify their collection of crime proceeds is wrong and should be discouraged. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by islamrules(m): 12:10pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
I pity Nigerians. We don't seem to know the difference between Moral obligation and Legal Obligations. Why cant you balance the equation by showing us how Saudi and Iraq audit there mosque revenues. US and UK are not the only country in the world. We are not using the same account, federal revenue and treasury. Or have we joined our federal reserve with that of US, may be we are operating the same account like husband and wife lol ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Biggie9: 12:17pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
Waziri is a fool and very stupid.she should concentrate on her muslim faith and not to make reckless statements about xtianity.dont politicians n others donate to islamic affairs?when Nasfat was launching fountain university oshogbo didnt all sort of people donate for d islamic university.did she ask them where they got their money from. I blame GEJ for allowing all these illitrate muslim bigots n fanatics like boko haram,sanusi and waziri hold the country hostage. Ex Governors who have stolen billions havent even been invited for questioning talkless of being charged,yet d stupid Waziri has d gut to try to divert peoples attention to churches by labelling them as receivers of stolen wealth. May God punish her generation.If she is not fit for her position let her resign rather than throw blanket accusations. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Kobojunkie: 12:22pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
luluosas (m) I am going to go out on a limb here and declare you are probably one of those who allows his sentiments cloud his judgement. How in the world do you, pray tell, espect a pastor to, I don't know, POLICE the money that is dropped off in the tithe box in churches? You expect a pastor to add the question "Did you earn this money legitimately?" to the collection Envelope? Will that be one of your WISE suggestions here? Look? We already have government agencies that we ENTRUST with the duty of ensuring that money earned by individual nigerians, are done so legitimately. What do we have the, yes, EFCC, Internal Revenue Service, police, etc for. Unless you are willing to have this lady open up all her resources on individuals who attend particular churches to the Pastors, I suggest . . . . Pastors are not there to do the job of the IRS or the EFCC. It is not the pastor's job to POLICE the congregation. If the EFCC or the POLICE establishes that there are members of a particular church involved in one crime or another, the EFCC and POLICE(not the Pastor) should SWOOP in and ensure those persons, whether members of the Rotary Club, Pirates Cult, or any church, be dealth with as required by law. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 12:24pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
islamrules:no mind them. . .very soon they will tell us to copy britain and establish child care services to stop parents 4rm beating their children(only 4 our kids 2 turn looters) ![]() ![]() Biggie9:we have confused leaders in this country who go about killing chicken by using razor blade.D most disgusting thing is dat d ediot is a freaking muslim ![]() |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Claus(m): 12:26pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
EFCC is working with very blunt tools as the legislative framework is not strong enough. philip0906: For example, U.K. legislation actually places the burden on certain businesses including high value dealers (e.g. cars, expensive jewellery etc) to report suspicious transactions, including any cash transactions above a certain thershold. It gives directives on how to treat politically exposed persons. There are a host of other things, but the legislation is long. It doesn't appear to deal with not for profit organisations, but presumably this is because these are well covered by the Charities Commission and HMRC tax rules. The point I'm trying to make is that proper legislation places certain reporting obligations on organisations that are susceptible to receiving large proceeds of crime. It would not hurt if our legislators bear this in mind when enacting laws. EFCC don't seem to have the appropriate legislative backing, which is why they are left with making toothless appeals like the one in this post. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Kalman(m): 12:26pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
islamrules: Who be first, na First Who be Last, na last. If u wan be First, you go follow First If u wan be Last, u will do same. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Kalman(m): 12:28pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
philip0906: Oya tell us who to follow na? Who introduce the church in the first place? Is it iraq or Iran? |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by goggle4rea: 12:31pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
Waziri! Waziri!! Waziri!!! how many do I call you? Can she bold enough and say that she never influence the office running cost by increasing the amount. If she can swear it let her continue and if not. |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by Kalman(m): 12:31pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
Kobojunkie: In a nice and polite sermon. Please if you have earned you money legitimately, then you can pay your tithe. If not the wrought og the lord will befall a dubious man. How does that sound for a pastor? |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 12:32pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
Kobojunkie:sometimes I wonder how these leaders think?if their brains have been leased out? |
Re: EFCC Wants Churches To Investigate The Sources Of Huge Tithes by philip0906(m): 12:35pm On Aug 17, 2011 |
Kalman:what d heck did u just type? ![]() Kalman:your post smirks of lack of understanding and comprehension. . .how does that solve mrs farida's ambitions?. ![]() |
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