Going by seun kuti's pronouncement

What was it about African traditional religion that made it so easy to be abandoned.

I don't think religion or spirituality generally is as powerful as people especially Africans make it to be.

The Asians especially East Asians also generally abandoned religion for pure reason.

While southern Asians generally abandoned their religion for the Arab mysticism (islam)

Only India mainly retains is original religion and it hasn't made them any better than anyone else.

Have you ever wondered why African traditional religion was easily abandoned by many fore-parents of Africans during their encounter with the whites?

From my little research the main reason was that it was found to be powerless against the whites.

First it cudnt save them from whites weapon technology such as heavy guns.

Second, it cudnt save from some diseases which ravaged Africans like small pox and monkey pox but the whites especially the missionaries had remedy to this disease and saved many from dying.

Third,many sacred groves that where thought to be powerful such as sacred trees,waters,bushes etc were easily cleared,cut down or burnt by these white missionaries and their followers without repercussions.

Fourth,the western education which came along with Christianity produced better competent workers in several fields than traditional African workers such as better farming techniques and building technology.


In all of these I think there are pros and cons of both ATR and Foreign religions.

I think it would have been better if ATR was not generally whole scale abandoned.

I think generally religion is not as powerful as Africans make it to be.

I also think the religions from the middleeast for some unknown reason are ahead of others

One thing I think Africans should note is that the middle Eastern mysticism ( Christianity and Islam) may be more powerful than they think as the middleeast had some of the early ancient civilisations and powers,it's not a coincidence.

Only the most high knows the mystery.

This same reason is why the Europeans are abandoning anything religion

Religions are just stories designed by advanced AI beings to control Human Beings.

Now that Europeans are abandoning there religion nko what do you have to say

Perhaps you’re confusing the European renaissance when Europe modernized itself with the rise and spread of Christianity/Islam. Perhaps not.

But in any case , Christianity already existed for thousands of years before the renaissance . But the remarkable transformation of Europe did not happen right away and infact is not tied directly to any religion.

If anything , the renaissance was linked to the desire by European intellectuals to bring back the glory of classical antiquity .
Classical antiquity was a phase in European history several thousands of years ago before Christianity came . The was the period of the Greek philosophers and early roman period . A lot of progress of was achieved in this era and guess what , they were all PAGANS at the time believing in many gods: Zeus , Cupid, Poseidon etc


My point is that if the British had not come with their way of doing things , we here in Africa would have had our own renaissance at some point . They came and disrupted our way of life . Yes I agree , the Bible is an extremely deep philosophical book of thought. One of the deepest , if not the deepest ever written. But the British and indeed the rest of Europe never at any point attributed their technological advancements to the adoption of religion . If anything , the renaissance opened their eyes and they questioned the dogma of religion ; causing them to focused more on advancing this life here on earth instead focusing on the afterlife .

Therefore it was wrong of them to come and slam their religion down our throats and sell it to us as the solution and key to a better life here on earth when they knew very well that it was not what transformed their societies. In other words, their own religion did not save them

We could’ve accepted the technology and the advancements while remaining true to our culture and our traditional way of life devoid of the disruptively catastrophic interference of foreign religions

BitterTruth0001:

Perhaps you’re confusing the European renaissance when Europe modernized itself with the rise and spread of Christianity/Islam. Perhaps not.

But in any case , Christianity already existed for thousands of years before the renaissance . But the remarkable transformation of Europe did not happen right away and infact is not tied directly to any religion.

If anything , the renaissance was linked to the desire by European intellectuals to bring back the glory of classical antiquity .
Classical antiquity was a phase in European history several thousands of years ago before Christianity came . The was the period of the Greek philosophers and early roman period . A lot of progress of was achieved in this era and guess what , they were all PAGANS at the time believing in many gods: Zeus , Cupid, Poseidon etc


My point is that if the British had not come with their way of doing things , we here in Africa would have had our own renaissance at some point . They came and disrupted our way of life . Yes I agree , the Bible is an extremely deep philosophical book of thought. One of the deepest , if not the deepest ever written. But the British and indeed the rest of Europe never at any point attributed their technological advancements to the adoption of religion . If anything , the renaissance opened their eyes and they questioned the dogma of religion ; causing them to focused more on advancing this life here on earth instead focusing on the afterlife .

Therefore it was wrong of them to come and slam their religion down our throats and sell it to us as the solution and key to a better life here on earth when they knew very well that it was not what transformed their societies. In other words, their one religion did not save them

We could’ve accepted the technology and the advancements while remaining true to our culture and our traditional way of life devoid of the disruptively catastrophic interference of foreign religions

I never attributed European success to Christianity,I simply implied that the African forefathers during the colonial era can't really be blamed for abandoning the African traditional religion, they had justified reasons to, people tend to deride them as foolish for abandoning their religion, when it was actually practical and wise to do at the time.

babasolution:


I never attributed European success to Christianity,I simply implied that the African forefathers during the colonial era can't really be blamed for abandoning the African traditional religion, they had justified reasons to, people tend to deride them as foolish for abandoning their religion, when it was actually practical and wise to do at the time.

But what did the foreign religions do for them ?

British also conquered China and ruled Hongkong for 156 years .

They ruled the whole of India for almost 100 years

Yet these two nations stayed with their Buddhism , Hinduism, Taoism, Sikhism etc

The whites also had pagan religions remember. There is no where religion has saved anyone tho. It didn’t save the Egyptians, romans , ottomans , persians etc

Why do you think the purpose of religion is to 'save' someone?
If you like to celebrate your birthday and somebody robs your house, do you stop celebrating your birthday because it didn't save you? Where does that expectation come from?

Hmm

BitterTruth0001:


But what did the foreign religions do for them ?

British also conquered China and ruled Hongkong for 156 years .

They ruled the whole of India for almost 100 years

Yet these two nations stayed with their Buddhism , Hinduism, Taoism, Sikhism etc

Don't confuse colonialists with missionaries.
And you can't really be asking what the Christian missionaries did in Nigeria.

The hospital I was born was built by the missionaries and is still standing till today.

Like OP said, it was because of their great works in Nigeria that made our forefathers abandon their religion.

Forget about what the Nigerian Christians are doing today, that was not how the missionaries started it.

Interesting Thoughts! Perhaps its due to inferiority complex or classism? Certainly the efficacy of ATR is at question when the new alternative have weapons and solutions to hitherto impossible problems.

It has nothing to do with being saved or whatever.
They were abandoned because the priests were unlettered and lack
any sustainable means to combat foreign missionary propaganda.

It didn't also help that education was tied to religion then.
The educated, that is, the converted were more prosperous than the uneducated.

So, the religion and god of the educated was considered to be superior.

BitterTruth0001:


But what did the foreign religions do for them ?

British also conquered China and ruled Hongkong for 156 years .

They ruled the whole of India for almost 100 years

Yet these two nations stayed with their Buddhism , Hinduism, Taoism, Sikhism etc

Remember, the British also changed their religion, they were not originally Christians

ivolt:
They were abandoned because the priests were unlettered and lack
any sustainable means to combat foreign missionary propaganda.

It didn't also help that education was tied to religion then.
The educated, that is, the converted were more prosperous than the uneducated.

So, the religion and god of the educated was considered to be superior.

But it was initially difficult for the missionaries to communicate with the locals,how then were they able to spread propaganda to the locals if not by their superior works .The African Trad priest were powerless

I agree with the OP, the Africans abandoned their gods/religion having seen what the white men did with their advanced technology by the time our forefathers came in contact with them(Which at that time they attributed to the superiority of the white man's god)

Below is an excerpt of historical account of Ijebu war in 1892:

In West Africa in1892 the British authorities were encountering problems in their dealings with the Ijebu tribe. The tribe, proud, isolated and determined, lived between 50 and 60 miles north-east of Lagos on the Magbon River, and Jebu Ode was the tribal capital.

In May 1891 the British Acting Governor, Captain C.M. Denton C.M.G., left Lagos with an escort of Hausa constables (Hausas are from the Islamic north of Nigeria) to visit Jebu Ode to make agreements allowing the free passage of trade goods through Ijebu territory. However the Awujale refused to agree to the British requests and he also rejected the British presents given to him by Denton, doubtless fearing that to accept them would obligate him in some way.

London then instructed Lagos to obtain an apology from the Awujale for the perceived "insult" to Denton, and to insist on free right of way through the Awujale's territory. In January 1892 a representative of the Awujale went to Lagos to agree to the British demands, and in return the British granted the Ijebu 500 pounds annually to compensate for the loss of customs revenue. However the tribe was unhappy with this outcome as it did not wish to change its traditional methods and practices, particularly when threatened by foreigners.

On 19th May the Jebu made a determined stand on the north bank of a ford over the Yemoyi River, five miles south of Jebu Ode. The river here was 40 yards wide and sometimes over 4 feet deep (the Jebu had dug it deeper for this battle to create a difficult obstacle), and above and below the ford the river narrowed and ran through impenetrable bush. The southern approach to the ford ran through a gorge that prevented the British from manoeuvring off the track. The enemy warriors were located on both sides of the river, and the narrowness of the track being used made it extremely difficult for the British to bring up and concentrate their heavy weapons. The Ijebu were determined to prevent the British from crossing the ford and as warriors were shot down or ran out of bullets fresh relays of men from the rear replaced them.

Scott ordered his Hausa advance guard across the river but they did not want to move. It was believed that the Jebu had made a human sacrifice to the goddess of the river in order to obtain the goddess' support in repelling the invaders. Finally a machine gun was brought up to the river bank and Scott ordered the West Indian Regiment company under Major George Colquhoun Madden to storm the ford. The crossing was successful, and once the Hausa had observed that the river goddess was inactive then they too crossed and engaged the Jebu. By now the guns and rockets had struggled up the congested track and these fired into likely Jebu positions until resistance ceased.

The remainder of the force now crossed the ford and advanced half a mile to Imagbodon village where Scott took stock of the situation. Since they had left Epe the British had lost 56 men killed and 30 more wounded including three white officers, one of them being Roddy Owen at the river crossing. Although the Jebu had lost around 700 warriors at the ford, mainly to machine-gun fire, thousands more remained at large ready to fight.

Therefore next morning as the march resumed Scott's Advance Guard was surprised to meet envoys from the Awujale offering submission. The Ijebu admitted to losing a thousand warriors and seven chiefs and were anxious to stop the burning of any more villages. The tribe accepted defeat and, in the words of the Awujale, they were "no fit for fight with white man".

A few hours later Jebu Ode had a Union Flag flying over it, the Awujale's palace was being used as the British officers' mess and the surrounding buildings housed the soldiers. Scott banned looting but this order antagonised the Ibadan irregulars who had to be disarmed. Flying columns marched along the trade routes declaring them open, Roddy Owen commanding the one that went north to Oru to destroy the Ijebu toll gates there. The West Indians marched back to Lagos declaring that south-westerly route open also.

Before marching away and leaving a garrison in Jebu Ode the British burned part of the city including the Fetish House. The Ijebu were great believers in dark practices and had slaughtered thousands of sacrificial victims in order to placate evil spirits (good spirits could be ignored as they did no harm). After ritual torture the victims were beheaded, buried alive or nailed to trees by their heads. After the latter the bodies were thrown into a special pond but the skulls were left adorning the trees in the fetish groves.


Everybody except the casualties was pleased with the outcome of this little war. The Colonial Office was particularly gratified that the total cost of the expeditionary force was less than 5,000 pounds sterling.

Source: http://www.kaiserscross.com/188001/204201.html

Lol no religion is any powerful… all are bullocks

babasolution:


Remember, the British also changed their religion, they were not originally Christians

They were already Christians for hundreds of years by the time they invaded those countries

Starcrest1:


Don't confuse colonialists with missionaries.
And you can't really be asking what the Christian missionaries did in Nigeria.

The hospital I was born was built by the missionaries and is still standing till today.

Like OP said, it was because of their great works in Nigeria that made our forefathers abandon their religion.

Forget about what the Nigerian Christians are doing today, that was not how the missionaries started it.

You’re missing my point
That hospital and all the other good things could’ve been done through the colonial government , not the church.
Read my first post on this thread. Why were the good benefits like hospitals , schools etc packaged through the church instead of the government if not that it was intended to separate us from our traditional religion and culture

They knew very well that it was not religion that transformed their own societies so why did they sell that idea to us ?

BitterTruth0001:


You’re missing my point
That hospital and all the other good things could’ve been done through the colonial government , not the church.
Read my first post on this thread. Why were the good benefits like hospitals , schools etc packaged through the church instead of the government if not that it was intended to separate us from our traditional religion and culture

They knew very well that it was not religion that transformed their own societies so why did they sell that idea to us ?

They didn't intend to build hospitals ,schools etc,remember the colonialist initially came as business men( traders) buying slaves and later goods,they were interested only in exploitation, the missionaries came along with them cos it has always been their practice since the days of the early popes to travel to "spread" the gospel,the colonialist did their jobs while the church did theirs

BitterTruth0001:


You’re missing my point
That hospital and all the other good things could’ve been done through the colonial government , not the church.
Read my first post on this thread. Why were the good benefits like hospitals , schools etc packaged through the church instead of the government if not that it was intended to separate us from our traditional religion and culture

They knew very well that it was not religion that transformed their own societies so why did they sell that idea to us ?

You are still mixing things up. Why wait for government when the missionaries were here way before the colonial government.?

What is wrong with converting to christianity for them to wait for colonial government to build those vital infrastructures. Or do you think the colonial government had better intentions than the missionaries. No they didn't, they did us bad compared to the missionaries.

Who stopped the traditionalists from killing twins, using human sacrifice to bury kings, attributing strange illnesses to curse(they actually cured people of some of them, while some of the missionaries contracted some of the diseases and died from them but it didn't deter them).

Who taught people how to read and write,? Who actually sent Our fore fathers to Europe to train and come back to help. Who went on to adopt the outcasts in the society and made their lives better. I don't know where you are from but if you are from southern Nigeria, you should've come across schools, hospitals, churches and other institutions established by the missionaries.

So if you are still slow to understand things, it was because of these good works that made our forefathers embrace christianity. This was because christianity then was devoid of violence, killings, extortion and fear which was what the traditional religion offered them most of the time. If it were you won't you port.

And yes Christianity transformed our society because most of those barbaric practices were stopped by the missionaries. If you say christianity was bad, traditional religion was worse.

You can actually attack the colonial government because all they did was loot and create problems for us......

babasolution:


They didn't intend to build hospitals ,schools etc,remember the colonialist initially came as business men( traders) buying slaves and later goods,they were interested only in exploitation, the missionaries came along with them cos it has always been their practice since the days of the early popes to travel to "spread" the gospel,the colonialist did their jobs while the church did theirs

The church gives the colonists the authority to colonize, the compromise is the colonist have to allow them to build churches to generate revenue and followers of the church. The Pope was the original UN, so it's equivalent of today's UN recognizing or not recognizing a state of a claim. I don't know if you're aware of the Catholic Church signing a doctrine that deemed blacks and non-christians were sub human, and therefore any crime committed against them is not technically a crime. This is what legitimized and truly launched the slave trade. This is why, no matter what country is colonizing, the Catholic church can have access to all colonies. England is not Catholic

Great post anyways. You're correct

If you guys truly want to learn why African Traditional Religions faded from a historian, the fact is they are not religions. They are cultures. There is no difference between Yoruba culture and Yoruba traditional religion. There is no difference between Igbo culture and Igbo traditional religion. In fact, they are not religions.

Christianity and Islam are religions. Judaism is not a religion, only Christianity and Islam. This is why a person can be a Jewish atheist. It is a culture. Not all of our ancestors acknowledged all of the traditional rites and 'beliefs', but they doesn't stop them from being Igbo or Igala or Yoruba. Till today I don't have to believe in Ogene, but that doesn't stop me from being Urhobo. If I stop believing in Allah I'm no longer Muslim. If I stop beliving in Yaweh I can still be Jewish.

Christians first taught slaves and poor people about their doctrine. Because they were in control, they made the first generation of these slaves and poor people the heads of major colonial posts. When our ancestors realized their children could not be successful in the new order by not going to school, they sent the children to school. When the children went to school, they had to be baptized and christianized.

Over time there became a ruling class of christians, and an underclass of Igbo/Yoruba etc people. Christians were taught that they are superior to their parents and kinsmen. This is why, till this day, if a Nigeria or Indian wants to insult you they will say you're an illiterate. This is why Nigerians associate all crime and social ills with 'illiteracy', this is why Christianity in Nigeria is a status symbol and being cultural is a sign of poverty (though this is changing). Even today, pick up a research paper by a Nigerian about his or her own culture. It will start with 'The Yoruba are a tribe in what is today south western nigeria'. Even though this person has never met a white person in their life and never will, they are writing a research paper from the perspective of a white, non-yoruba person who is communicating to other white non-yoruba people. You will never see paper of American movie culture start with 'The Americans are a tribe of people in North America' because they are writing to themselves and don't need to say these things.

Because the Christians were left in charge and indoctrinated with elitism and hate, they are the ones that started tearing down their respective cultures to assert their superiority over their 'uneducated' kinsmen. They created new versions of their own cultures so that they didn't participate in anything that looked 'religious'.


The actual thing that took away our traditional beliefs is our personal desire to feel and look superior to the people around us and our hatred for people we deem poor. Today culture is being seen as a status symbol for the rich, and now everyone is 'proudly' Igbo, Yoruba etc etc. When it was seen as a poor thing, we almost rid ourselves of our identity completely because of hatred.

Ofodirinwa:
If you guys truly want to learn why African Traditional Religions faded from a historian, the fact is they are not religions. They are cultures. There is no difference between Yoruba culture and Yoruba traditional religion. There is no difference between Igbo culture and Igbo traditional religion. In fact, they are not religions.

Christianity and Islam are religions. Judaism is not a religion, only Christianity and Islam. This is why a person can be a Jewish atheist. It is a culture. Not all of our ancestors acknowledged all of the traditional rites and 'beliefs', but they doesn't stop them from being Igbo or Igala or Yoruba. Till today I don't have to believe in Ogene, but that doesn't stop me from being Urhobo. If I stop believing in Allah I'm no longer Muslim. If I stop beliving in Yaweh I can still be Jewish.

Christians first taught slaves and poor people about their doctrine. Because they were in control, they made the first generation of these slaves and poor people the heads of major colonial posts. When our ancestors realized their children could not be successful in the new order by not going to school, they sent the children to school. When the children went to school, they had to be baptized and christianized.

Over time there became a ruling class of christians, and an underclass of Igbo/Yoruba etc people. Christians were taught that they are superior to their parents and kinsmen. This is why, till this day, if a Nigeria or Indian wants to insult you they will say you're an illiterate. This is why Nigerians associate all crime and social ills with 'illiteracy', this is why Christianity in Nigeria is a status symbol and being cultural is a sign of poverty (though this is changing). Even today, pick up a research paper by a Nigerian about his or her own culture. It will start with 'The Yoruba are a tribe in what is today south western nigeria'. Even though this person has never met a white person in their life and never will, they are writing a research paper from the perspective of a white, non-yoruba person who is communicating to other white non-yoruba people. You will never see paper of American movie culture start with 'The Americans are a tribe of people in North America' because they are writing to themselves and don't need to say these things.

Because the Christians were left in charge and indoctrinated with elitism and hate, they are the ones that started tearing down their respective cultures to assert their superiority over their 'uneducated' kinsmen. They created new versions of their own cultures so that they didn't participate in anything that looked 'religious'.


The actual thing that took away our traditional beliefs is our personal desire to feel and look superior to the people around us and our hatred for people we deem poor. Today culture is being seen as a status symbol for the rich, and now everyone is 'proudly' Igbo, Yoruba etc etc. When it was seen as a poor thing, we almost rid ourselves of our identity completely because of hatred.

You have really valid points, but I strongly disagree for the following reasons:

I don't think your assertions are true that Christians looked down,tore down and hated the traditionalist or culture.The fact is people took it upon themselves to sustain this Christianity n Islam.

For example, Islam particularly was introduced mainly to the rich or ruling class in those days not to the poor.The rich or ruling class then tried to force it on the poor,so your claim of it being seen as a status symbol doesn't hold water especially for Islam, if not it would not have been forced on the poor examples include the Fulani jihad,the islamization of areas like northern Edo and kogi,it was their traditional rulers that forced Islam on the population.

As for Christianity ,it was a battle,the early converts were strongly persecuted in colonial nigeria just like in early Rome,if not for the cover of the British forces it was have died down, but the good works and education that Christianity brought made it gain more and more converts.It would interest you to know that christainity was always mainly preached to the chiefs and some of them were the ones that started sending their children to school not even the poor,the slaves that were initial converts were used as intepreters etc mainly,example include the itserikiri kings who were early christains,even in benin which the oba sent up a church
( the holy arousa church)

Though later in colonial times the missionaries always pressured the kings n chiefs with the backing of the colonial forces to stop many cultural practices ,many people bought into Christianity gradually,many elites and ruling classes bought into it after seeing it's benefits for example there is a particular festival that is done in my place,according to history the celebration puts people into serious debts every year but the Christian missionaries lured people into Christianity by paying off peoples debts,this brought many people from my area into Christianity, people just saw it as a better option, the message in Christianity then made people to shed away their cultural practices which to Christianity is idol worship.

I agree with you in the point that truly the so called traditional religion was more of culture than religion,so people had to give away their culture if they would remain Christians or Muslims,but it wasn't so hard of a choice for many fore parents who saw the Christianity especially and islam as a better or easier way of life(culture),there was really nothing special in the traditional culture ( religion) which is my point,that the reasons many of the African forefathers gain up their culture (religion) generally is cos there really wasn't anything special or better in it like the way people keep advocating for it

Infact only a minority stuck to the traditional culture.

babasolution:


You have really valid points, but I strongly disagree for the following reasons:

I don't think your assertions are true that Christians looked down,tore down and hated the traditionalist or culture.The fact is people took it upon themselves to sustain this Christianity n Islam.

I think your religious biases are clouding your response. Islam came by the elite and you don't think it's spread is linked to elitism? Christians (and Muslims) didn't tear down traditional structures, but it's happening right now everyday all over Nigeria.

Ofodirinwa:


I think your religious biases are clouding your response. Islam came by the elite and you don't think it's spread is linked to elitism? Christians (and Muslims) didn't tear down traditional structures, but it's happening right now everyday all over Nigeria.

Yeah, I mean why were the elites too so quick to shed their traditional practice for Christianity or islam if it wasn't somewhat superior, it certainly had better privileges than the traditional culture, therefore Islam n Christianity were seen as superior religions from the get go

babasolution:


Yeah, I mean why were the elites too so quick to shed their traditional practice for Christianity or islam if it wasn't somewhat superior, it certainly had better privileges than the traditional culture, therefore Islam n Christianity were seen as superior religions from the get go

Because in Islam, you can sell non-muslims, and this was the standard in the Ummayid era. You also did business preferrentially with muslims. So many of the leaders in the sahel became muslim and would sell their non-muslim subjects. If you wanted access to the Ummayids you became muslim. This would allow you to become a rich gold, slaves and salt to the arabs. Same in the Christian south where the only way to get an education was to convert. The muslims would therefore feel superior to blacks (which they no longer saw themselves as).

I saw a very disgusting documentary about it not too long ago. They would kidnap africans by hundreds and send them to torture camps in the sahel. Then a muslim arab will come and pick the tortured people that begged them the most and shown the a more broken spirit than their counterparts. They would then cut off the joysticks of the men and walk them through the desert. Most died.

Superior is subjective, but I can see you classifying this structure as superior being that you're obviously muslim. Truth is, it's corruption. People gain power and start selling their own people. It's like you classify Tinubu as superior because he robbed Lagos and others followed in his footsteps in robbing Lagos. After all, stealing has more advantages than not stealing, but I don't call it superior, though you probably classify it differently.

In both cases (Christianity Islam), converting allowed you to sell other africans. For the white and arab, it made you weak and submissive to them because Islam is ultimately the worship of Arabs and christianity they worship of Whites.

Ofodirinwa:


Because in Islam, you can sell non-muslims, and this was the standard in the Ummayid era. You also did business preferrentially with muslims. So many of the leaders in the sahel became muslim and would sell their non-muslim subjects. If you wanted access to the Ummayids you became muslim. This would allow you to become a rich gold, slaves and salt to the arabs. Same in the Christian south where the only way to get an education was to convert. The muslims would therefore feel superior to blacks (which they no longer saw themselves as).

I saw a very disgusting documentary about it not too long ago. They would kidnap africans by hundreds and send them to torture camps in the sahel. Then a muslim arab will come and pick the tortured people that begged them the most and shown the a more broken spirit than their counterparts. They would then cut off the joysticks of the men and walk them through the desert. Most died.

Superior is subjective, but I can see you classifying this structure as superior being that you're obviously muslim. Truth is, it's corruption. People gain power and start selling their own people. It's like you classify Tinubu as superior because he robbed Lagos and others followed in his footsteps in robbing Lagos. After all, stealing has more advantages than not stealing, but I don't call it superior, though you probably classify it differently.

In both cases (Christianity Islam), converting allowed you to sell other africans. For the white and arab, it made you weak and submissive to them because Islam is ultimately the worship of Arabs and christianity they worship of Whites.

No,firstly am non religious but tilt towards Christianity having come from a Christian family,
Also by the time Christianity started becoming entrenched in our society slave trade had officially stopped,so people did not actually convert to feel superior and sell non Christians,slave trade was already common prior to Christianity.

Even with Islam, the jukun who were non Muslims captured alot of Hausa Muslims as slaves,slave trade had little to do with Islam ,people were captured and sold regardless of religion.It was simply about who was powerful militarily.

The kogi zone eg the ebira and igala and some northern edo who are largely Muslims today,became Muslims due to their leaders encouraging islam among them and tramping their traditional practice, this occurred during the colonial era after slave trade had been largely ended. So your argument is flawed.

The traditional rulers in those areas simply bought into the message of islam and were enticed by the prospects of trade links with the hausa-fulani north.Remember the ebira largely quelled the islamic Nupe assault on their lands before they became Muslims, they accepted Islam on peaceful terms.

Yes,Christianity came with education and the prospects of getting western educated encouraged people to be Christians.our fore parents rightly saw the benefit in being western educated and many were willing to drop their traditions for the benefits of western education.

Eg,in my village traditional history says that when Christianity came with education, the older gen were worried that it was making the younger men lazy,instead of them tending to the farms,they were sitting and reading a paper.

The older gen were livid and tried to quench education and Christianity but they later saw reason of the benefits and thereafter encouraged people into education and therefore Christianity.

My point is Christianity came with benefits that triumphed the traditional, if not it would not have succeeded the way it did.

Therefore Christianity and Islam somewhat came with greater benefits and prospects than traditional culture,therefore our fore-parents were justified to switch to them.

You are wrong when you say people took into Christianity or islam simply because it made them feel superior to traditional culture. That is the stereotypes that are used to label Africans of old as foolish simple people.

They weren't foolish

They took into Christianity and Islam cos it offered more,they were indeed wise.

Unfortunately this generation as bastardized the prospects of these religions, therefore making it look like our fore parents made a foolish mistake.

babasolution:


No,firstly am non religious but tilt towards Christianity having come from a Christian family,
Also by the time Christianity started becoming entrenched in our society slave trade had officially stopped,so people did not actually convert to feel superior and sell non Christians,slave trade was already common prior to Christianity.

Even with Islam, the jukun who were non Muslims captured alot of Hausa Muslims as slaves,slave trade had little to do with Islam ,people were captured and sold regardless of religion.It was simply about who was powerful militarily.

The kogi zone eg the ebira and igala and some northern edo who are largely Muslims today,became Muslims due to their leaders encouraging islam among them and tramping their traditional practice, this occurred during the colonial era after slave trade had been largely ended. So your argument is flawed.

The traditional rulers in those areas simply bought into the message of islam and were enticed by the prospects of trade links with the hausa-fulani north.Remember the ebira largely quelled the islamic Nupe assault on their lands before they became Muslims, they accepted Islam on peaceful terms.

Yes,Christianity came with education and the prospects of getting western educated encouraged people to be Christians.our fore parents rightly saw the benefit in being western educated and many were willing to drop their traditions for the benefits of western education.

Eg,in my village traditional history says that when Christianity came with education, the older gen were worried that it was making the younger men lazy,instead of them tending to the farms,they were sitting and reading a paper.

The older gen were livid and tried to quench education and Christianity but they later saw reason of the benefits and thereafter encouraged people into education and therefore Christianity.

My point is Christianity came with benefits that triumphed the traditional, if not it would not have succeeded the way it did.

Therefore Christianity and Islam somewhat came with greater benefits and prospects than traditional culture,therefore our fore-parents were justified to switch to them.

You are wrong when you say people took into Christianity or islam simply because it made them feel superior to traditional culture. That is the stereotypes that are used to label Africans of old as foolish simple people.

They weren't foolish

They took into Christianity and Islam cos it offered more,they were indeed wise.

Unfortunately this generation as bastardized the prospects of these religions, therefore making it look like our fore parents made a foolish mistake.

Have you seen this video? Lol
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2PjKLRgR1z/?igsh=MWR3dGYxb3hneXNmNg==

Ofodirinwa:


Have you seen this video? Lol
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2PjKLRgR1z/?igsh=MWR3dGYxb3hneXNmNg==

It doesn't mean a thing, if people wan mumu may dey MUMU, that's what am saying about this current GENERATION, it's this generation that is MUMU, making the fore parents, not fathers or grandfather's, but for most I mean great-grandfathers GENERATION that were wise and made their children be Christians. But this generation like in the video has bastardized the whole thing

Starcrest1:


Don't confuse colonialists with missionaries.
And you can't really be asking what the Christian missionaries did in Nigeria.

The hospital I was born was built by the missionaries and is still standing till today.

Like OP said, it was because of their great works in Nigeria that made our forefathers abandon their religion.

Forget about what the Nigerian Christians are doing today, that was not how the missionaries started it.

Shut up joor! And they told you that the missionaries were not part of the colonizers abi? Dey play

babasolution:
Going by seun kuti's pronouncement

What was it about African traditional religion that made it so easy to be abandoned.

I don't think religion or spirituality generally is as powerful as people especially Africans make it to be.

The Asians especially East Asians also generally abandoned religion for pure reason.

While southern Asians generally abandoned their religion for the Arab mysticism (islam)

Only India mainly retains is original religion and it hasn't made them any better than anyone else.

Have you ever wondered why African traditional religion was easily abandoned by many fore-parents of Africans during their encounter with the whites?

From my little research the main reason was that it was found to be powerless against the whites.

First it cudnt save them from whites weapon technology such as heavy guns.

Second, it cudnt save from some diseases which ravaged Africans like small pox and monkey pox but the whites especially the missionaries had remedy to this disease and saved many from dying.

Third,many sacred groves that where thought to be powerful such as sacred trees,waters,bushes etc were easily cleared,cut down or burnt by these white missionaries and their followers without repercussions.

Fourth,the western education which came along with Christianity produced better competent workers in several fields than traditional African workers such as better farming techniques and building technology.


In all of these I think there are pros and cons of both ATR and Foreign religions.

I think it would have been better if ATR was not generally whole scale abandoned.

I think generally religion is not as powerful as Africans make it to be.

I also think the religions from the middleeast for some unknown reason are ahead of others

One thing I think Africans should note is that the middle Eastern mysticism ( Christianity and Islam) may be more powerful than they think as the middleeast had some of the early ancient civilisations and powers,it's not a coincidence.

Only the most high knows the mystery.

Religion never saved any race.
Islam could not stop Europeans from colonizing Arab countries.
Neither has it stopped Israel from displacing Palestanians from their homes.