HanksAnuku:


Liverpool have played Chelsea, City, Arsenal, and Spurs who are a lot more dangerous in possession than the average teams. The games against relegation candidates like Cardiff, Huddersfield, Fulham etc have helped them to pad up their possession numbers to look reasonable.

For example, this season Pool had 38% possession vs Arsenal, 39% against spurs

Man City had 58% against that same Arsenal, and 52% against Spurs.

It's not just the small teams that are struggling to see ball against City. Even when playing against Top 6 rivals, City defenders still have less to do than Pool boys because their opponents simply don't have the ball.

Liverpool and City have played similar opponents this season and by your deductions City opponents have the ball 22mins while Liverools have it for 27mins

So its just 5mins more on the average. City also pad possesion stats vs bottom teams Liverpool played City and possesion was pretty even between them

Will this logic hold for when comparing say Sol Bamba to VVD?

eph12:

TAA, Robertson and Gomez

How? No be the same stat we dey look?

www.nairaland.com/attachments/8171476_trent_jpegcda2e42ce31d8bb78dfaa4fe73ae887d

raumdeuter:


Will this logic hold for when comparing say Sol Bamba to VVD?

No.

Statiscally, only Burnley and Fulham have been more defensively porous than Cardiff this season in the league.

raumdeuter:


Liverpool and City have played similar opponents this season and by your deductions City opponents have the ball 22mins while Liverools have it for 27mins

So its just 5mins more on the average. City also pad possesion stats vs bottom teams Liverpool played City and possesion was pretty even between them

Will this logic hold for when comparing say Sol Bamba to VVD?

That's why I took my time to show you instances of possesion stats when City played Arsenal for example vs when Pool played them.

Pool are happy to give up almost 60% of possession to their top 4 rivals. City will never do that.

So by default, Pool defenders have more to do, against more potent opponents, than Laporte and co ever will.

HanksAnuku:


No.

Statiscally, only Burnley and Fulham have been more defensively porous than Cardiff this season in the league.

If we use a Watford or a Wolves defender who havent conceded as much as Cardiff will it work since they see more of the ball than Liverpool and get more defensive action

HanksAnuku:


That's why I took my time to show you instances of possesion stats when City played Arsenal for example vs when Pool played them.

Pool are happy to give up almost 60% of possession to their top 4 rivals. City will never do that.

So by default, Pool defenders have more to do, against more potent opponents, than Laporte and co ever will.

When City faced Liverpool in the head to head game possesion was pretty even, shots played pass accuracy was even

raumdeuter:


If we use a Watford or a Wolves defender who havent conceded as much as Cardiff will it work since they see more of the ball than Liverpool and get more defensive action

No

eph12:

According to the EPL official website, VVD has the highest interception

Raumdeuter this is from EPL official website
Also check these ones below.

raumdeuter:


How? No be the same stat we dey look?

www.nairaland.com/attachments/8171476_trent_jpegcda2e42ce31d8bb78dfaa4fe73ae887d

Wait first! What's the difference between 1.2 and 1.3? 0.1? lol

raumdeuter:



So its just 5mins more on the average. City also pad possesion stats vs bottom teams Liverpool played City and possesion was pretty even between them

football is a game of tiny margins and 5 minutes is plenty of time in football.

That 5 minutes more can be deadly in the hands of a team like city.

Already this season, City have scored 2 goals in just 2 minutes on 2 occasions - vs Burnley and Cardiff.

in their last match, they scored 3 in the space of just 9 minutes.

So that extra 5 minutes can be deadly given the kind of personnel City have.

raumdeuter:


When City faced Liverpool in the head to head game possesion was pretty even, shots played pass accuracy was even

Pretty even is 50 50.

Can you show me a league game this season where City had less than 40% possession like Liverpool?:

HanksAnuku:


Pretty even is 50 50.

Can you show me a league game this season where City had less than 40% possession like Liverpool?:

Liverpool vs City was 49 -51 that looks pretty even to me

HanksAnuku:


football is a game of tiny margins and 5 minutes is plenty of time in football.

That 5 minutes more can be deadly in the hands of a team like city.

Already this season, City have scored 2 goals in just 2 minutes on 2 occasions - vs Burnley and Cardiff.

in their last match, they scored 3 in the space of just 9 minutes.

So that extra 5 minutes can be deadly given the kind of personnel City have.

Liverpool scored 2 goal in 3 mins vs Cardiff

What is the point of your argument? What brought Laporte into this was when someone claimed that Liverpool has conceded the least goals in Europe since January

Are you of the same opinion?

eph12:

Wait first! What's the difference between 1.2 and 1.3? 0.1? lol

Over 12 games from players that were even less experienced

raumdeuter:


Liverpool vs City was 49 -51 that looks pretty even to me

I'm not disputing the above

I'm asking you to show me a time where City had less than 40% possession in the league

HanksAnuku:
I'm not disputing the above
I'm asking you to show me a time where City had less than 40% possession in the league

Guardiola dominates play and will hardly have below 40% in possesion since he started coaching I doubt he will have 5 games below 40% possession

So what is this ask trying to prove?

eph12:

Raumdeuter this is from EPL official website
Also check these ones below.

Is this per game or total of all games

raumdeuter:


Liverpool scored 2 goal in 3 mins vs Cardiff

What is the point of your argument? What brought Laporte into this was when someone claimed that Liverpool has conceded the least goals in Europe since January

Are you of the same opinion?

That tells you that 5 minutes extra possession is not an advantage to be sniffed at, cos a lot can transpire in just 5 minutes.

Regarding your question, I don't know the numbers and the context fully so I cannot back that statement.

What I know is that VVD has been busier than Laporte this season, and any comparison between the two should take that busy work into account.

I also think VVD is significantly responsible for Liverpool's new found resilience.

I'm sure if we compare shots on target conceded by pool pre-vvd to those conceded post-vvd in the same season, the difference will be clear.

raumdeuter:


Guardiola dominates play and will hardly have below 40% in possesion since he started coaching I doubt he will have 5 games below 40% possession

So what is this ask trying to prove?

Guardiola teams dominate play so his defenders have less to do.

Shebi that's how Pique made his 'name'. Busquets too. Even baskets like vitor valdes

HanksAnuku:


That tells you that 5 minutes extra possession is not an advantage to be sniffed at, cos a lot can transpire in just 5 minutes.

Regarding your question, I don't know the numbers and the context fully so I cannot back that statement.

What I know is that VVD has been busier than Laporte this season, and any comparison between the two should take that busy work into account.

I also think VVD is significantly responsible for Liverpool's new found resilience.

I'm sure if we compare shots on target conceded by pool pre-vvd to those conceded post-vvd in the same season, the difference will be clear.

This is the context that brought Laporte into it

BlackManta:


Since Van Dijk's arrival in January, Liverpool has conceded the least number of goals and kept the most clean sheets than anyone across all 5 European top leagues in 2018 #Facts

This is not a joke.

It is truth.

I won't argue with you, plz check out the statistics for yourself.

But according to some people VVD is overrated and has not improved Liverpools defence.

The statistics say otherwise.

VVD is arguably the best defender in PL.

I wonder where Liverpool would be without him.

You can cherry pick Van Dijk 's performance looking for something to use against him but you take away his stats and records away from him.

He is one the best.

raumdeuter:


Over 12 games from players that were even less experienced

Headers won, blocks, dribble past etc don't count when defending? I wonder why your gifs of Boateng beasting the world cup final were full of sliding tackles and clearances

HanksAnuku:


That tells you that 5 minutes extra possession is not an advantage to be sniffed at, cos a lot can transpire in just 5 minutes.

Regarding your question, I don't know the numbers and the context fully so I cannot back that statement.

What I know is that VVD has been busier than Laporte this season, and any comparison between the two should take that busy work into account.

I also think VVD is significantly responsible for Liverpool's new found resilience.

I'm sure if we compare shots on target conceded by pool pre-vvd to those conceded post-vvd in the same season, the difference will be clear.

I will like to see any stats on shots on target for Liverpool pre and post VVD last season

I think Liverpool has improved defensively and I think a lot of it stems from
1. Maturity of their talented youngsters from last season TAA and Gomez were literally playing their first full pro season
2. Playing a stable Back 4 regularly and reducing time given to Matip Moreno Clyne and Klavan
3. Inclusion of VVD who is a good defender
4. Inclusion of the most expensive keeper in Europe.
5. Klopp being a little more conservative in his approach

All these factors rank equally with me. I dont think VVD plays a bigger factor than the other factors

eph12:

Headers won, blocks, dribble past etc don't count when defending? I wonder why your gifs of Boateng beasting the world cup final were full of sliding tackles and clearances

Go back 2 pages and see my response to patrick

You can intercept with headers or by foot

VVD is significantly more experienced than the other guys in defence and its expected that his stats should even be much better than than compared to Gomez and TAA

Liverpool started the first game of last season with a back 4 of
Trent Moreno Matip Lovren

3 of these dont regularly start anymore. Thats the difference between Liverpool last season and this

raumdeuter:


Go back 2 pages and see my response to patrick

You can intercept with headers or by foot

VVD is significantly more experienced than the other guys in defence and its expected that his stats should even be much better than than compared to Gomez and TAA

That he's more experienced does not mean that he's going to play two or more positions. How many interceptions has VVD lost? I even think he does judging from the number of headers he has attempted and won for his team especially when you compare it to his teammates. You'll appreciate it more when you realize how many teams tend to go through the air route in the EPL.

eph12:

That he's more experienced does not mean that he's going to play two or more positions. How many interceptions has VVD lost? I even think he does judging from the number of headers he has attempted and won for his team especially when you compare it to his teammates. You'll appreciate it more when you realize how many teams tend to go through the air route in the EPL.

He is more experienced means at the minimum he should be better than a couple of guys who ere still playing academy football 2yrs ago

raumdeuter:


He is more experienced means at the minimum he should be better than a couple of guys who ere still playing academy football 2yrs ago

That 1.2 and 1.3, do they include aerial interceptions like the ones you claim Boateng was doing?

How can a dude with over a decade EPL experience pus earnings from foreign leagues leave his family still paying rent and in debt at the end of his career?

Lord, please help us that we leave our children on sound footing in this life

raumdeuter:


He is more experienced means at the minimum he should be better than a couple of guys who ere still playing academy football 2yrs ago

He's not? You already agreed that he's better so let's not go back there

raumdeuter:


Which proves what? That he is better than the 20 and 21yr olds in Liverpool defence? He deserves an accolade for being better than players who started playing pro football few seasons ago

eph12:

Raumdeuter this is from EPL official website
Also check these ones below.

No bother yourself with stats boss

Go and code what you have to code, commit the changes and leave them to keep arguing.

eph12:

That 1.2 and 1.3, do they include aerial interceptions like the ones you claim Boateng was doing?

Do you see a separate category for headers here

www.nairaland.com/attachments/8171476_trent_jpegcda2e42ce31d8bb78dfaa4fe73ae887d

Ibime:
How can a dude with over a decade EPL experience pus earnings from foreign leagues leave his family still paying rent and in debt at the end of his career?

Lord, please help us that we leave our children on sound footing in this life

Na real wahala o kai