Kimbeast:

Nobody said anything about foundation the term I used I was framework in the sense of the term set up, player roles etc. Kante is still being played in an attacking role, jorginho is still the Anchor of the midfield,Pedro still uses the flank runs, kovacic sub for Barkley . the main reason as to why kante looked better against Liverpool than with sarri in same position is because
sarri was too hell bent on 1 touch passing and wouldnt allow players to run with the ball, kante and kovacic’s best attributes are running with the ball, which was curtailed by sarri because he wanted 1-2 touch passing progression which was his biggest flaw last season and not for his players to hold onto the ball and run with it.

Biggieboy:


Which system did he inherit when he was at Derby?

U guys should calm down with this ur propaganda abeg.
When Chelsea hired Conte and when the results where not going his way witu 4 at the back, how long did it take Chelsea to understand his 3 at the back tactics/philosophy. I remember Chelsea even one the first game Chelsea played with 3 at the back.

These guys have been training and learning lampard's tactics/philosophy for close to two months now, so attributing Lampard's effort to Sarri is totally wrong.

If u followed Chelsea preseason games u will know Chelsea worked with 4-4-2, 4-4-2 diamond, 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1.


If u said Sarri's philosophy made it easier for the team to adapt to Lampard's philosophy then I might be able to agree with u to an extent, but saying Lampard INHERITED Sarri's tactic is 100% wrong .

nihilistjnr:
How anybody can look at what we played last night and see comparison to Sarriball is beyond me.

so if anybody plays 3 midfielders and 3 forwards, Sarri must take credit?

Shey we won't credit Sarri for inventing football too? or at least for building Stamford bridge?

airmark:


Thats a very wrong assumption. He inherited nadda from Sarri system as i explained earlier, Jorginho no more our only link to attack. We now play more forward passes, which make our game more direct. All these he did at Derby, without Sarri being his predecessor there.

Kante was a box to box player, that was also explosive for Leicester that year. So Sarri wasn't the one that taught him that, in fact he underperformed under him.

If Tomori and Mount could do well under Lampard last season, i will rather believe he's the one improving Emerson and co this season and not Sarri.

donjazet:


I'm pointing out to you that Lampard did not carry out a revolution at derby like you would like to postulate, goals scored and conceded were very much alike before and during his tenure, like wise the position.

It took Guardiola one full year for his team to fully implement his philosophy. Don't forget he went trophyless.


It took Conte about 5-6 months with the team before he started using the 3 at the back formation . Don't make it appear like that was his immediate formation. He experimented different systems before that.

And I point out again that various factors aided Conte, the formation took teams unaware, the lack of European football and an experienced team.

Greatihex:
i think you are getting confused.

Sarri's undoing has nothing to do with 1 touch passing, it had Everything to do with not being direct in his play.

Lampard did not copy anything from sarri. He only benefitted from Sarri's work in the sense that he does not need to do much work on bringing the players up to speed on the quick passing, pressing and playing out from the back

donjazet:


Airmark, be honest, Kante has been known primarily for his tough tackling and very hardworking ethics, never has he been famed for his technicalities and creativity which we are beginning to see.
We scorned Sarri for playing Kante further forward because we knew his strength lay basically in front of the defense but that has inadvertently led to his development as a creative midfielder.
Against Liverpool, Kante was clearly the most advanced of the midfielders in terms of position while Kovacic and jorginho lay at the base.

When you say jorginho was the only link to our attack, you sound like that was the only problem we had with Sarri's tactics.
You conveniently leave out where a lot of us were pointing out the fact that hazards ball hugging was incompatible with the one touch passing and sleek off the ball movement we can see now. You also forget that Kante was learning the new role in which Sarri had thrust him into etc.

I continue to say that Sarri's tenure was clearly a learning curve for the team with positives and negatives ant to totally discredit those positives is unfair.

And more so we STILL can't define for certain what "Lampard's football" is.
It's still early to say if it's working or not. Certainly we wouldn't want to be in a situation where there is no good balance between the attack and defense.

airmark:


It's shocking to say the least. All successors must thank their predecessors if they don't overhaul the team.

donjazet:


You contradict yourself and you call another person confused?

Answer this question honestly, before Sarri, was Chelsea known to be a high pressing team or a good passing team?
Did Sarri's method not make us more comfortable on the ball?
We didn't have goal scoring midfielders and that was one of our problems, do you know if that has been rectified yet?

We all hope that Lampard succeeds but there are not enough parameters yet to know exactly what his system is.

donjazet:


It's not shocking as you've claimed, it's logical.

Don't we credit Mourinho for other managers success after his first stint with us?

Avram grant took Chelsea to a Champions League final, who did you credit that success to? Mourinho or grant?
Hiddinks FA cup triumph, who did you credit that success to? him or Mourinho?

You make it sound illogical to give credit where due.
I am not saying that Lampard hasn't done anything yet but facets of the team bears Sarri's hallmarks.

Biggieboy:


If u said Sarri's philosophy made it easier for the team to adapt to Lampard's philosophy then I might be able to agree with u to an extent, but saying Lampard INHERITED Sarri's tactic is 100% wrong.

Greatihex:
[b]you only copy what you cannot produce yourself. [/b]Lampard cannot be copying sarri when he was already doing his thing at Derby.

You can't say you don't know how Lampard likes to train and setup his team if you watched his Derby team

Greatihex:
are you sure you followed our club that season?

BTW, Pep's problem in his first season was more about Personnel. The same thing that happened to conte in his second season. Personnel.

airmark:


Epl isn't Serie A, Sarriball would have put us outside top4, if Arsenal and United took their chances. The smoker would still have run to Juve.

If Lampard played another system at Derby, you might have got a good point. Sorry he is using same system here and i'm optimistic he will succeed despite the constraints.

United sat behind the ball for majority of the first half, we still managed to create multiple chances inside their box. I had nightmares under Sarri, when teams parked their buses. Now i have hope of creating chances if you like park trucks.

Would Sarri had done better, capital NO. Unless you want to say Hazard was the reason his system didn't work last term. We will see how Sarri will use his fat Higuain to achieve in europe.

SkimpleD:
All these arguments, na una sabi

Can’t wait for Sunday to see the boys again.

Those boys dey give me joy.

BlueAngel444:


am telling you, my only issue for now, apart from the unfair losses, is our striking role where even Tammy looks like a black Morata wearing a cursed number 9 shirt.

Giroud is slow for the kind of game Lampard wishes to play. A striker like Gabriel or Firmino would do Chelsea's attack good.

DExponential:

He has to play Bats soon.

BlueAngel444:
but not in our next match though. I feel Lamps will still start Tammy in that game.

SkimpleD:
All these arguments, na una sabi

Can’t wait for Sunday to see the boys again.

Those boys dey give me joy.

Biggieboy:


Sir, what's ur take on the Sarri foundation propaganda?

BlueAngel444:


am telling you, my only issue for now, apart from the unfair losses, is our striking role where even Tammy looks like a black Morata wearing a cursed number 9 shirt.

Giroud is slow for the kind of game Lampard wishes to play. A striker like Gabriel or Firmino would do Chelsea's attack good.

SkimpleD:

The bolded is true. But, for a large part of the game on Wednesday, Giroud held up to his own. We really need a sharp and fast striker to slot in the goals.

airmark:


It's shocking to say the least. All successors must thank their predecessors if they don't overhaul the team.

BlueAngel444:


am telling you, my only issue for now, apart from the unfair losses, is our striking role where even Tammy looks like a black Morata wearing a cursed number 9 shirt.

Giroud is slow for the kind of game Lampard wishes to play. A striker like Gabriel or Firmino would do Chelsea's attack good.

nihilistjnr:


Bruh at the start of Conte era on this very thread Afrodoc2 was calling for Kante to be used as a box 2 box.

I should know - he was telling me.

If Afrodoc2 can see these qualities while peering between legs in the gynaecologist ward, how much more the managers who coach him daily.

The biggest difference between Sarri and Lampard is in that midfield arrangement.

We haven't seen Akpuruka as the last man shielding defnce like with Sarri. So far, Kante and Kovacic are acting like body guards.

We also haven't seen the nonsense where Akpuruka controls all the play. see Kovacic throwing better passes.

We don't even play from the back like that sef. kepa dey kick better long ball to Giroud to nod on Wednesday.

Emerson Kovacic Pulisic tap and go also happened very rarely under sarri.

Instead Alonso will run, collect ball by touchline and then instead of pullout will pass back to Kovacic or Hazard.

Morata will make 10 runs the ball will never come

And we will never press Liverpool under sarri. are you mad? Go and look at the possession stats if those games and compare to wednesday.

Anybody that sees 433 and claims Sarri invented it should come - I get bridge for sale for bariga side

SkimpleD:

You don finally wan trust Lampard now?