Spy360:

May be you needed to rephrase your question to who are guaranteed first eleven shirt with little competition. That is players whose backups cannot usurp their positions.

Ramsdale, Saliba, Gabriel, Odegaard, Saka.

Settled.

Nothing else to rephrase bro... They knew and understand what I'm talking about. It is just that some are too deep into the fanboyism that they don't see the bigger picture.

ObaIgwe1:




Truth is that, it is a dicey situation.

Do we want to win whatever is available at all cost or we want to develop potential stars for future gain?

If we are pursuing medals, we cannot rely on our academy players that lack experience... once in a while one or 2 might break into the 1st team, but the only way they will make it will be to make instant impact like Saka when an opportunity called or go on loan to get the experience and make a case for themselves that they deserve a permanent shirt in the 1st eleven.

It is not peculiar to Arsenal.... You hardly find academy players easily breaking through into 1st 11 of all ambitious team in Europe. Like how many Academy players are in City or Madrid or Barca's squad?

That said, I am still looking out for the likes of Nwaneri, Patino and others breaking through eventually but they will not get it on a plater.

Baba, I don't think folks like me expect Hale End players to start or see minutes in the EPL. However, there is no reason why they shouldn't be seeing minutes in cup competitions and in Europe when we have already qualified. Last season, many of our starters played many unnecessary minutes especially in Europe and Cup competitions and it cost us at the end.

BlueRayDick:


He's living in self denial ni jare...... From the onset he never rated Saliba as shown in the attached screenshot.

At least if he doesn't rate him back then when Saliba was work-in-progress he should at least appreciate how far he has come. We have people who didn't really fancy Gabriel here from the onset but today they appreciate the player he has become

So that means you don't rate White too based on the screenshots you went to dig up earlier.


That you went up to dig a year-old post shows you have nothing else to counter my post.

Moreso, that post was in reaction to the news that Saliba wanted a guaranteed starting shirt before coming back to arsenal. An intelligent observant would have brilliantly interpreted that post as me telling Saliba to come and fight for his shirt.

What else?

This calmness wey una dey attribute to Saliba anyhow, Partey plays a great role sef.

Roland17:


I want them to tell me which Arsenal CB White will bench right now purely based on quality. I can make a legitimate case that Saliba and Gabu to an extent will make the first 11 of nearly all the top teams in the EPL including the new entrants like Newcastle. Can we make the same case for White? There is a reason I don't want to drag this debate because E go come be like say pesin dey hate on him own player.

He is a decent CB but he has never been our best player/ defender for a long stretch and that speaks a lot to his consistency/ impact. Remember when we paired Mari with White and the disaster that it panned out to be? No be pesin tell Arteta he returned Gabu to the first team to pair White because White was bad.

The funny thing is they are the ones belittling Saliba’s contribution to our success story last seaon, but they turn back to accuse us of denigrating White . They want to hype white more than what we all saw him do less than 2 years ago; it’s not like we are talking of 10 years ago o. It’s something still fresh in our memories .

Saliba; a player that is being applauded by fans and opponents is the one they sha want us to place side by side with white whom he displaced . I just weak

ObaIgwe1:


I am surprised to read many of these posts underrating White...Honestly.

Apart from the 1st 2 matches during his 1st season when the team was yet to stabilize, I cannot remember anyone blaming White for underperforming in any of the matches he played for us till date. C'mon guys, Tomi, White , Gabriel and Tierney brought stability to our defense that season till injuries came calling on many of them.

I mean almost everyone in England blamed Southgate for not using White while parading Harry Maguire, because he is that good.

At the time we got White, only few will even think Saliba can bench him. Saliba improved the season Arteta sent him back on loan, thanks to Henry's advice to him; to use the season to make a case for himself.

If the options is to bench one and use one between Saliba and White, though I will pick Saliba in his current form ahead of White, I am not sure Arteta will and if Arteta pick White ahead of Saliba, I will not worry too much or feel bad...cos White is also very good!

PS: Who were the better defenders at Brighton when we bought White for 50M? Cucurella that was bought for 63M or who?

Oil dey your head bro...
Now tell me how you would feel with Turner and Kiwior in the squad replacing Ramsdale and Gabriel respectively.

BlueRayDick:


U are just forming narratives in ur head and running with it. Nobody has said white is not good! White at CB for Arsenal was decent , by decent we mean he’s not bad.

Roland17 already settled the matter , u go and bring the number of man of the matches White has won as an arsenal player and he position he won them from. Let’s start from there , Since u insist he is very good .

You are the one forming narratives here... in one word you said I overhyped him, in another word word you said he was "decent", then you went on to he's "not bad"...Take a definite stand bro. My point remains that White is very good, he knows what to do as a defender and he does he job well QED.

While it is good to win man of the match, that is not the only way or the best way to determine if a player is very good or not. If it is, then please tell me how many of such did Partey or Odegaard won last season or are they not that very good?

BTW, Nketiah won it last season, but Jesus didn't at any time; are we going to say Nketiah is good but Jesus is just "not bad"?

BlueRayDick:


The bold is cap . Maguire was always in good form when in England shirt up until this last season.

Saying White is very good at CB for arsenal is just ur way of overhyping him.

Tell us you don turn this argument into sarcasm bro. The same Maguire?

Roland17:
I am already worried about the future of our academy players and their ability to transition into the first team. This fear kept be checking on E. Nwaneri's contract situation and today, he signed his pro deal and committed to Arsenal. Nwaneri was courted heavily by Chelsea and City but I am glad he chose to continue with Arsenal. Nwaneri is pure talent with good prospects.
#COYG

Norton-cuffy and Patino are young players I'm also worried would get underutilized. Even if na Carling cup, make we try them.

Jodera:
Hmmm... same White?

I'm surprised to see say White was average in his first season as Rcb sha

Roland17, iamoyindamola, Spy360, Lush100, daveP, Kodded, germaphobe, ObaIgwe, Shegzdave.(and other active arsenal fans here)

I go like see Una thoughts on this biko!

Lol. I dey come. Make i chop fes.


I've been on white matter from start of last season. I highlighted a lot of things i consider not encouraging despite the way we defended well. Funny enough he did well during the drop weeks. But i dey come😂


Ben White!!!

ObaIgwe1:


You are the one forming narratives here... in one word you said I overhyped him, in another word word you said he was "decent", then you went on to he's "not bad"...Take a definite stand bro. My point remains that White is very good, he knows what to do as a defender and he does he job well QED.

While it is good to win man of the match, that is not the only way or the best way to determine if a player is very good or not. If it is, then please tell me how many of such did Partey or Odegaard won last season or are they not that very good?

BTW, Nketiah won it last season, but Jesus didn't at any time; are we going to say Nketiah is good but Jesus is just "not bad"?

🤣🤣🤣🤣

English no hard na . Something that is not bad is decent na , Haba! What’s contradictory in that ?

U used “very good “ in ur original post I quoted and I disagreed with that . I believe very good is what Saliba showed on the pitch last season.

Not bad/decent/average is what sums up Ben white’s first season as a CB for Arsenal . I hope u understand me now ?

BlueRayDick:


The funny thing is they are the ones belittling Saliba’s contribution to our success story last seaon, but they turn back to accuse us of denigrating White . They want to hype white more than what we all saw him do less than 2 years ago; it’s not like we are talking of 10 years ago o. It’s something still fresh in our memories .

Saliba; a player that is being applauded by fans and opponents is the one they sha want us to place side by side with white whom he displaced . I just weak

Pesin make EPL team of the season, this is despite missing the end of the season due to injury oh. Arsenal dropped 15 points after his injury.

The other one couldn't boast of a single player of the month for Arsenal as a CB.

If this is what it will degenerate to then I go comot hand. E get some kain debates wen I no dey involve myself again.

germaphobe:
Going back to mostob.. question that brought up this argument, I think I will follow the path of mostob.., truly in the current arsenal team, among the players he mentioned, na saliba I fit rest with hope that his deputy in the person of white would deliver.

Thank you. I even thought my statement was ambiguous. Looking at it clearly, those who oppose that point are looking it from ball-playing point of view whereas I'm talking about sauad depth.

mostob:
[b] Norton-cuffy [/b]and Patino are young players I'm also worried would get underutilized. Even if na Carling cup, make we try them.

Exactly! Even if na small cup competition, make these kids see playing time. I talked about the emboldened player last year.

mostob:

Tell us you don turn this argument into sarcasm bro. The same Maguire?

U should read the post u quoted very well and try to understand what it says .

Here is what Gary Neville says about his form for England vs Man Utd

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/neville-maguire-manchester-united-england-25640166.amp

iamoyindamola:

No offense to arteta but if he remains our manager for a long time our academy will die

Bro...when you want to win, you gotta sacrifice some things.

Aside Foden and maybe Rico, which other academy player has Pep promoted so far?


Yearly, Chelsea academy player wey dey go on loan may reach 30 sef

If buying players is what Arteta thinks will work, make Dem dey buy them abeg.

Roland17:


I want them to tell me which Arsenal CB White will bench right now purely based on quality. I can make a legitimate case that Saliba and Gabu to an extent will make the first 11 of nearly all the top teams in the EPL including the new entrants like Newcastle. Can we make the same case for White? There is a reason I don't want to drag this debate because E go come be like say pesin dey hate on him own player.

He is a decent CB but he has never been our best player/ defender for a long stretch and that speaks a lot to his consistency/ impact. Remember when we paired Mari with White and the disaster that it panned out to be? No be pesin tell Arteta he returned Gabu to the first team to pair White because White was bad.

So you blame White for Mari's underperformance? If the problem was with White, why didn't he replace White with Gabu na so we can try Mari and Gabu? Or you think Mari with Saliba would have delivered?

I am not saying White is the best defender out there, but he knows his job and does it well. I don't see any team out there that will regret having him as a defender.

Roland17:


Baba, I don't think folks like me expect Hale End players to start or see minutes in the EPL. However, there is no reason why they shouldn't be seeing minutes in cup competitions and in Europe when we have already qualified. Last season, many of our starters played many unnecessary minutes especially in Europe and Cup competitions and it cost us at the end.

I agree with you on this.

mostob:
Bro...when you want to win, you gotta sacrifice some things.

Aside Foden and maybe Rico, which other academy player has Pep promoted so far?


Yearly, Chelsea academy player wey dey go on loan may reach 30 sef

If buying players is what Arteta thinks will work, make Dem dey buy them abeg.

Don't misconstrue this debate baba. No one expects Arteta to start or play these kids in the EPL but there is no reason why they shouldn't see minutes in cup competitions or in Europa when group stage qualification was guaranteed. We played many of our starters unnecessary minutes in competitions outside of the EPL and knockout stages of the Europa last season.

BlueRayDick:


The funny thing is they are the ones belittling Saliba’s contribution to our success story last seaon, but they turn back to accuse us of denigrating White . They want to hype white more than what we all saw him do less than 2 years ago; it’s not like we are talking of 10 years ago o. It’s something still fresh in our memories .

Saliba; a player that is being applauded by fans and opponents is the one they sha want us to place side by side with white whom he displaced . I just weak

Show me one post since this debate started that belittled Saliba's contribution to our success story last season here and I will resign from this debate immediately. Nobody belittled Saliba so far, no one even rated White better than Saliba.... All some of us are just saying is that give White his due credit and not belittle or underate him too.

ObaIgwe1:


So you blame White for Mari's underperformance? If the problem was with White, why didn't he replace White with Gabu na so we can try Mari and Gabu? Or you think Mari with Saliba would have delivered?

I am not saying White is the best defender out there, but he knows his job and does it well. I don't see any team out there that will regret having him as a defender.

I am not blaming White for Mari's performance. However, his drop in form when partnered with Mari buttresses the case that he was stable playing alongside Gabu and struggled when Gabu was benched. Also, Gabu winning player of the month 3 times when he partnered White and White not winning any as a CB supports my argument that Gabu provided some predictability and stability for White. Is he decent defender? Yes but he isn't what you guys want us to accept.

BlueRayDick:


U should read the post u quoted very well and try to understand what it says .

Here is what Gary Neville says about his form for England vs Man Utd

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/neville-maguire-manchester-united-england-25640166.amp

Lol.... bring me words from a better pundit abeg. Gary Neville?


Maguire is decent in England colours but never as good as White. I remember vividly how there was an uproar when Southgate omitted White from his squad last year.


And in your word, Saying White is very good at CB for arsenal is just ur way of overhyping him. So who is underrating who?

Roland17:


Don't misconstrue this debate baba. No one expects Arteta to start or play these kids in the EPL but there is no reason why they shouldn't see minutes in cup competitions or in Europa when group stage qualification was guaranteed. We played many of our starters unnecessary minutes in competitions outside of the EPL and knockout stages of the Europa last season.

I understand bro. Make we dey look am.

ObaIgwe1:


Show me one post since this debate started that belittled Saliba's contribution to our success story last season here and I will resign from this debate immediately. Nobody belittled Saliba so far, no one even rated White better than Saliba.... All some of us are just saying is that give White his due credit and not belittle or underate him too.

I should show u what exactly ? Somebody told u how crucial Saliba was to whatever we achieved last season by the number of games he was voted man of the match based on his performance but u turned back and say that’s not the only way of judging a player’s contribution .

The thing is u probably believe in subjectivity more than obejevtivity as far as this point of discussion is concerned . U want to rely on “trust me bro” with no data to back ur assertions up .

It will be an exercise in futility trying to make u see things other than the way u are seeing them as far as this matter is concerned . I rest my case

Roland17:


Look at it this way..

Saliba has made the team of the season.

Gabu won player of the month 3 times during the period under review

Show us where White won player of the month as a CB during the period.

His only player of the month has come as a RB for Arsenal.

This proves that he did not have consistency in performance to win one as a CB partnering Gabu.

Really? Team of the season? Player of the month?

Partey hardly makes team of the season or player of the month, In fact he's hardly top3 contender most times if I'm not mistaken but you and I know that "a fit Partey would walk into any EPL starting 11"

mostob:
Lol.... bring me words from a better pundit abeg. Gary Neville?


Maguire is decent in England colours but never as good as White. I remember vividly how there was an uproar when Southgate omitted White from his squad last year.


And in your word, Saying White is very good at CB for arsenal is just ur way of overhyping him. So who is underrating who?

So now it’s now about whether Gary Neville is a good pundit or not ? Omo! I bow for u o.

Go to United thread and ask if Maguire doesn’t play better in England colors than when in United’s . This is even when almost everybody who watches football knows . Maguire started playing badly for England recently .

mostob:
Something worse would happen without Gabriel too even while playing Saliba. We slumped because we don't have a capable replacement. I don't think we would have been worse had it been Tomi was available. simple!

Saka was our X-factor at the final third. Who do you think would have replaced him?


Don't even get me started with Turner and Rammy.


Gabriel is as important as Saliba.

All this no necessary boss.

The important thing is Saliba is among those you listed as important and not having a backup that performs like they do.

BlueRayDick:


Lolz

U made a wrong analogy with this Odegaard issue and I will tell u why I said so.

Before Odegaard arrived Arsenal once had Ozil whom everyone knows his quality and that explains why most people didn't get excited when he was pre-cooking prior to last season. The people expected close to what Ozil is known for. It was only last season when he brought that A-game everyone had to give him his flowers.

Now to White issue, most people expected him to bring that Van Djik level of stability to our defence line and that was the reason the pro-attack debators kept on dragging us in his first season when he was partnering with Gabriel.

NOT: At no point did I ever consider white poor, just that he's not that Knight in shining armour Ur argument seems to suggest he was.

Saliba was and is!

Lol...now I see your issue.

You've already set a bar for "so so" player and how you want them to perform?

No wonder you think people aren't excited for Odegaard because they expected him to do close of what Ozil is known for

No wonder you're expecting White to be like Van dijk even when almost all the fan base never knew who White was before coming to arsenal in contrast to Van dijk who almost everyone knows as one of EPL best defenders before his switch to Liverpool.


No wonder you say White is average in his first season. Expecting Absolute Van dijk performance from him

Roland17:


I am not blaming White for Mari's performance. However, his drop in form when partnered with Mari buttresses the case that he was stable playing alongside Gabu and struggled when Gabu was benched. Also, Gabu winning player of the month 3 times when he partnered White and White not winning any as a CB supports my argument that Gabu provided some predictability and stability for White. Is he decent defender? Yes but he isn't what you guys want us to accept.

lol... You think any of the best you think of will not drop in form if partnered with Mari? Even Great Gabu, the 3 times player of the month winner dropped form when partnered with Holding.... And IMO Mari is worse than Holding.

Let's sort it out this way maybe it will let you appreciate my point: Among the top 6 plus Chelsea (Making 7 teams), we should have about 21 constant players playing at the RB or CB positions. If you can list 10 of these defenders that are better than White then I will give up... Else give White his due credit.

I repeat, my point is not that he is the best, my point is that he is also very good defender with few errors.

iamoyindamola:

Bro that mean he’s average
If you can’t play to coach instructions you are no better

Thank God Spy done answer you.

Jodera:
Lol...now I see your issue.

You've already set a bar for "so so" player and how you want them to perform?

No wonder you think people aren't excited for Odegaard because they expected him to do close of what Ozil is known for

No wonder you're expecting White to be like Van dijk even when almost all the fan base never knew who White was before coming to arsenal in contrast to Van dijk who almost everyone knows as one of EPL best defenders before his switch to Liverpool.


No wonder you say White is average in his first season. Expecting Absolute Van dijk performance from him

I can see spy has join hands with u to form Nokia logo .

He don train u well well….. see where u carry matter go. Wo I don tire already, I no get straight to follow u drag the matter again.

Spy360:

I don't think anyone is arguing that Saliba is better than White. The question Mostob is asking is if you were to risk a player among the four considering the quality of their backups who would it be?

Saka -Nelson
Gabriel -Kiwior
Ramsdale - Turner
Saliba - White

I think it would be Saliba all things being equal. Hence he is least untouchable. The most untouchable is Saka. It's like going from Porcshe to Camry.

Gbamsolutely!!

Na me and Mostob point be this.

Nobody is also saying White is better than Saliba.