Emusan:

This is Daniel 4:30 and show me where Nebuchadnezzar said HE BUILT THE CITY ALL BY HIMSELF
"The king spoke and said, “Is not this great Babylon that I have built for the house of the kingdom, by the might of my power and for the honor of my majesty?” Compare this with Isaiah 44:24 where God lied (according to you) "Thus saith the Lord, thy Redeemer, and He that formed thee from the womb: I am the Lord that maketh all things, that stretcheth forth the heavens alone, that spreadeth abroad the earth by Myself; Even the Prov 8:22-30 didn't support your lie. The speaker TALKED ABOUT WHO IS CARRYING OUT THE CREATION ACTIVITIES.
Read it slowly and see that the speaker says "When HE spread... I use to ask you people who is that 'HE' the speaker was referencing? But you people will turn a blind eyes to it

Jesus was talking about how his father did so many things through him.

Sand2022:


The bible does not provide any direct answer to that question. If we are to assume that it is so because He has no beginning, well, neither is the Son. (John 1:3; Micah 5, Prov . That is why Fatherhood and Sonship of God the Father and Son are functions. We can't go beyond the scriptures.

Let's get to your interest, cos I don't understand.

Are you of the opinion that why God is called the Father is because he has no beginning? Is that your proof of His uncreated state?

If so, which scripture or lexicon are you relying on?

Eph 4:6 is my proof. " Father of ALL"

Uncreated, Nobody's Son.

But Jesus is a Son like everyone else, he is called our Brother. We are all created

There is of course another option that can be explored even if we exclude the issue of creation about Jesus. As to the fact that he is not created, that is not negotiable. The scripture can't be understood underwise.

The Son is not said to be created, but Begotten. Man begets man. So God beget Jesus, who is of His nature. Now God doesn't give birth nor get pregnant. And the Sons begetal is from eternity. Prov 8.

Many have got different theories about this.

However, some early church fathers have theorized that Jesus was generated from the father through an eternal generation. You will have to notice that they will always add the word "eternal" to the generation. Why? Because there is no other way to say it without seeing some aspect of scriptures fight against you.

Some say the Father divided himself through His Word (Logos). I don't even understand that concept.

My own assumption is that the Father divided himself and called the other Facsimile Son. Perhaps since He initiated the splitting, it explains why He often receives praise most of the times for something done, while the Son shares in it. It may also explain why He took the function of Father and gave the Son to His facsimile. (I will explain the scriptural proof of this Facsimile word choice in my next article)

Perhaps that is why He occupies the role of Head and His Son that of submission.

Others like Prof Wayne Grudem, and Wares have stated that God has always existed that way with these functions in place from eternity.

All these are suppositions, the bible didn't go into such details. What we can be sure is that the Son has been there from eternity past. He was not created.

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus was talking about how his father did so many things through him.

First of all, you couldn't provided Nebuchadnezzar equivalent of Yahweh God.

Secondly, Prov 8:22-30 shows that the SPEAKER was not the one ACTIVELY CARRYING OUT THE CREATION WORKS

Lastly, God can never lie that He CREATED ALL THINGS BY HIMSELF and ALONE and and at the same time Jesus if He was CREATED CAN'T BE USED ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE.

So, Jesus must be THE CREATOR which is what the scripture actually says.

Emusan:


At Jesus' mission on Earth

Now you where your argument fall flat.

[quotr]But nobody called God the Father a son at any point in history, Because he is uncreated. Everyone else called " Son " had a beginning. The exact same word was applied to every creature.

The term TERM FATHER is found used for HUMAN which means HEAD and A created BEING

That God takes the TITLE FATHER is for a purpose the same is for SON not that He was created.

Talk another thing, you list this one.

😂😂😂 Every Human called Father, was once a Son, true or false ?

But the heavenly Father, show me where he was ever called " Son" !!!

Sand2022:

There is of course another option that can be explored even if we exclude the issue of creation about Jesus. As to the fact that he is not created, that is not negotiable. The scripture can't be understood underwise.

The Son is not said to be created, but Begotten. Man begets man. So God beget Jesus, who is of His nature. Now God doesn't give birth nor get pregnant. And the Sons begetal is from eternity. Prov 8.

Many have got different theories about this.

However, some early church fathers have theorized that Jesus was generated from the father through an eternal generation. You will have to notice that they will always add the word "eternal" to the generation. Why? Because there is no other way to say it without seeing some aspect of scriptures fight against you.

Some say the Father divided himself through His Word (Logos). I don't even understand that concept.

My own assumption is that the Father divided himself and called the other Facsimile Son. Perhaps since He initiated the splitting, it explains why He often receives praise most of the times for something done, while the Son shares in it. It may also explain why He took the function of Father and gave the Son to His facsimile. (I will explain the scriptural proof of this Facsimile word choice in my next article)

Perhaps that is why He occupies the role of Head and His Son that of submission.

Others like Prof Wayne Grudem, and Wares have stated that God has always existed that way with these functions in place from eternity.

All these are suppositions, the bible didn't go into such details. What we can be sure is that the Son has been there from eternity past. He was not created.

Everybody called " Son " has a beginning. Son proceed from a Father. Jesus is created.

Jozzy4:
😂😂😂 Every Human called Father, was once a Son, true or false?

But the heavenly Father, show me where he was ever called " Son" !!!

But HE BECAME FATHER which shows human TERMINOLOGY as CREATED.

so, your argument holds no water.

The fact is, the TERM SON was USED FOR JESUS ON EARTH which was the same TIME THE TERM FATHER came on board.

Jozzy4:


Eph 4:6 is my proof. " Father of ALL"

Uncreated, Nobody's Son.

But Jesus is a Son like everyone else, he is called our Brother. We are all created

That is poor exegesis.

Jesus can be called Father. Now why he is called eternal Father is debatable. But he is also mighty God, he didn't become mighty God when he came in earth. He has always been such.

The scripture you quoted didn't say that God is a Father because he is uncreated. You assumed that Father of all means that. Someone might also say the same of Isaiah 9:6.

Jesus once called his disciples little children.

Jesus Christ is uncreated and in fact is worshipped. My next article will talk about worship, and subsequent one will go further to prove he is worshipped but at least we can agree that Jesus being praised as a creator at Heb 1:10 is of itself a worship. I wonder how one will worship a creature.

I will rather say that God as the one who beget the Son and not the other way around, can take the title Father to Jesus. Is that the case? The scripture didn't say.

But it is clear you cant prove it anywhere from the scriptures that the title Father means uncreated. So let's not wait our time on this.

Emusan:


But HE BECAME FATHER which shows human TERMINOLOGY as CREATED.

so, your argument holds no water.

The fact is, the TERM SON was USED FOR JESUS ON EARTH which was the same TIME THE TERM FATHER came on board.

He became Father when he Created us ALL, including our Brother , Christ. We are all sons with a beginning

Jozzy4:


Everybody called " Son " has a beginning. Son proceed from a Father. Jesus is created.

I am not saying that you can't have your own opinion. At least you're convinced of that that is why you keep pressing it, but from my view, Fatherhood doesn't connote uncreated. It may to you, but we do have differing views at times. Its all fine and ok.

I think I am ok with this fatherhood point for now. But I appreciate your bringing up your view. Don't be offended that I don't see it the same way.

Sand2022:


That is poor exegesis.

Jesus can be called Father. Now why he is called eternal Father is debatable. But he is also mighty God, he didn't become mighty God when he came in earth. He has always been such.

The scripture you quoted didn't say that God is a Father because he is uncreated. You assumed that Father of all means that. Someone might also say the same of Isaiah 9:6.

Jesus once called his disciples little children.

Jesus Christ is uncreated and in fact is worshipped. My next article will talk about worship, and subsequent one will go further to prove he is worshipped but at least we can agree that Jesus being praised as a creator at Heb 1:10 is of itself a worship. I wonder how one will worship a creature.

I will rather say that God as the one who beget the Son and not the other way around, can take the title Father to Jesus. Is that the case? The scripture didn't say.

But it is clear you cant prove it anywhere from the scriptures that the title Father means uncreated. So let's not wait our time on this.

This is poor exegesis

Jesus called Eternal Father doesn't mean he isn't created in fact let me shock you, Jesus have no SON.

Father of all was never a Son.

I repeat this again, Jesus is our Brother being a Created being like us.

Jozzy4:

He became Father when he Created us ALL, including our Brother , Christ. We are all sons with a beginning

No! He is Father of the believers.

Gosh.... You don't even know the Fatherhood of God is for believers.

Christ became your BROTHER because He came to provide Salvation to your dying soul and it's also for BELIEVERS.

just give up, you already out of the track.

Jozzy4:
This is poor exegesis

Jesus called Eternal Father doesn't mean he isn't created in fact let me shock you, Jesus have no SON.

Father of all was never a Son.

I repeat this again, Jesus is our Brother being a Created being like us.

Just look at the lying liar mouth.

But the same has been trying to spin it that Father means uncreated.

Do you even know the meaning of ETERNAL?

MaxInDHouse:
Jesus was talking about how his father did so many things through him.

I'm glad you agreed that it was the Father who was actually DOING THE DO

Emusan:

I'm glad you agreed that it was the Father who was actually DOING THE DO

According to Jesus just as all servants of Jehovah always say, whatever we do according to His will we always say Jehovah did it.

Emusan:


Just look at the lying liar mouth.

But the same has been trying to spin it that Father means uncreated.

Do you even know the meaning of ETERNAL?

Provide a single place where the Father of Jesus was ever addressed as " Son of someone" . That's why Jesus said you have ONE FATHER , the heavenly one

Every other Father that might exist are creatures that were once sons of someone .

Sons of Jesus ? Doesn't exist.

We are Jesus Brothers. Cos we are all created

Emusan:


No! He is Father of the believers.

Gosh.... You don't even know the Fatherhood of God is for believers.

Christ became your BROTHER because He came to provide Salvation to your dying soul and it's also for BELIEVERS.

just give up, you already out of the track.

Son ,brother are all creatures from the ONE Father we all have.

Nobody is ever addressed as Son of Jesus, because he is our brother right from the beginning of time.

Jozzy4:

Son ,brother are all creatures from the ONE Father we all have.
Nobody is ever addressed as Son of Jesus, because he is our brother right from the beginning of time.

Hmmmmmmmmmm no wonder Jehovah has never addressed any human as His brother but Jesus said:

“Stop clinging to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. But go to my BROTHERS and say to them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father and to my God and your God.’” John 20:17

Surely Jesus is one of Jehovah's Witnesses {Revelations 1:5} so he is one of our fellow wordhipers of the same FATHER who is Jehovah our GOD!

Jozzy4:
Son ,brother are all creatures from the ONE Father we all have.

The fact is, the term FATHER was adopted at a POINT.

So, your point using Jesus BEING Son is useless here.

Nobody is ever addressed as Son of Jesus, because he is our brother right from the beginning of time.

But Jesus is ETERNAL FATHER, when do you see a father who doesn't have son or daughter?

Jozzy4:
Provide a single place where the Father of Jesus was ever addressed as " Son of someone" . That's why Jesus said you have ONE FATHER , the heavenly one

So Jesus being an ETERNAL Father is useless to you

Every other Father that might exist are creatures that were once sons of someone .

Sons of Jesus ? Doesn't exist.

We are Jesus Brothers. Cos we are all created

So why did Jesus was called ETERNAL FATHER?

Can a person who doesn't have son or daughter be called FATHER not to add ETERNAL?

MaxInDHouse:
According to Jesus just as all servants of Jehovah always say, whatever we do according to His will we always say Jehovah did it.

Lying liar.

Yahweh confirmed He alone and ALL BY HIMSELF Created everything.

Prov 8:22-30 also attested to this as the ETERNAL wisdom of Yahweh was speaking.

Only a twister of God's word will say otherwise.

Emusan:


FIRSTBORN is different from FIRSTCREATED

Firstborn is used among human to mean human can give birth NOT CREATE, you can never say your father CREATED YOU.

Firstborn is used among RULERS to mean HIGH RANK, FIRST POSITION, PREEMINENCE E.T.C

The writers of the New Testament know the two words exist yet NEVER USED the word 'FIRSTCREATED' for Jesus Christ.

And Col 1:15-18 expressly shows that The firstborn used for Jesus IS ABOUT PREEMINENCE not as being BORN AS HUMAN.

Simple English!

Don't mind the Governing Body followers and and their hypocrisy. Why should they add to the scriptures to give it a meaning, Is there not dishonesty?

Elsewhere, God said Israel is my firstborn: does this mean Israel is the first nation to be created on earth?

This is why Yorubas call them alakatakiti, the unreasonable, deluded ones.

Emusan:




First of all, you couldn't provided Nebuchadnezzar equivalent of Yahweh God.

Secondly, Prov 8:22-30 shows that the SPEAKER was not the one ACTIVELY CARRYING OUT THE CREATION WORKS

Lastly, God can never lie that He CREATED ALL THINGS BY HIMSELF and ALONE and and at the same time Jesus if He was CREATED CAN'T BE USED ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE.

So, Jesus must be THE CREATOR which is what the scripture actually says.

Oga, you no understand anything in Proverbs 8:22-30 , John 1:3 & 1 Corinthians 8:6.

Abeg just allow your MUMU to rest.

MightySparrow:


Don't mind the Governing Body followers and and their hypocrisy. Why should they add to the scriptures to give it a meaning, Is there not dishonesty?

Elsewhere, God said Israel is my firstborn: does this mean Israel is the first nation to be created on earth?

This is why Yorubas call them alakatakiti, the unreasonable, deluded ones.

Is Israel, Jehovah's creature?

God said Israel is my firstborn meaning that Israel is God's creature
alakatakiti Sparrow

Emusan:


FIRSTBORN is different from FIRSTCREATED

Firstborn is used among human to mean human can give birth NOT CREATE, you can never say your father CREATED YOU.

Firstborn is used among RULERS to mean HIGH RANK, FIRST POSITION, PREEMINENCE E.T.C

The writers of the New Testament know the two words exist yet NEVER USED the word 'FIRSTCREATED' for Jesus Christ.

And Col 1:15-18 expressly shows that The firstborn used for Jesus IS ABOUT PREEMINENCE not as being BORN AS HUMAN.

Simple English!

Emusan LYING miscreant posted this AI screenshot evidence.

Emusan posted A.I screenshot evidence
"Jesus is the first born in the sense of being the first to be born or created. He is the beginning of all creation "
Genesis 49:3
Reuben, you are my first-born; My might and the beginning of my strength,
Preeminent in dignity and preeminent in power".

Janosky:


Emusan LYING miscreant posted this AI screenshot evidence.

Emusan posted A.I screenshot evidence
"Jesus is the first born in the sense of being the first to be born or created. He is the beginning of all creation "
Genesis 49:3
Reuben, you are my first-born; My might and the beginning of my strength,
Preeminent in dignity and preeminent in power".

When I posted that screenshot, I still take my time to educate you because I know you find it hard to comprehend and still you still couldn't comprehend till now.

You're not JaNosense for a reason

Janosky:
Oga, you no understand anything in Proverbs 8:22-30 , John 1:3 & 1 Corinthians 8:6.

Abeg just allow your MUMU to rest.

So explain to me, since you understand.

While you allow your empty skull to continue to be empty.

Emusan:
You actually paint it as it should be.

Even Paul himself explained why Jesus is called FIRSTBORN.

In verse 18 "Christ is also the head of the church, which is his body. He is the beginning, supreme over all who rise from the dead. So he is first in everything."

Key note from this verse is that:
1. Jesus is called THE BEGINNING Just as God called Himself the Beginning
2. preeminence is @underlined

@ Colossians 1 :18 "he ( Jesus) became" ,
underline that word ,Greek lexicon 1096 BECAME.....

Jesus BECAME preeminent because he was granted that privilege, John 17:7.

No be him get am. Jesus received it.

God his Father owns EVERYTHING, 1 Corinthians 3:23 ..

Janosky:


@ Colossians 1 :18 "he ( Jesus) became" ,
underline that word ,Greek lexicon 1096 BECAME.....

Jesus BECAME preeminent because he was granted that privilege, John 17:7.

No be him get am. Jesus received it.

God his Father owns EVERYTHING, 1 Corinthians 3:23 ..

Still can't comprehend simple sentence

O ma se oooo

Emusan:


When I posted that screenshot, I still take my time to educate you because I know you find it hard to comprehend and still you still couldn't comprehend till now.

You're not JaNosense for a reason

Emusan posted A.I screenshot evidence :
"Jesus is the first born in the sense of being the first to be born or created. He is the beginning of all creation "


Trinity in the mud. Wotowoto.

Oga ,come over here, be WAILING

Sand2022:
Last time I posted about the meaning of Trinity which many obviously don't know. Today, I will be writing about Jesus origin.

My previous belief was that Jesus was a creature. This is because of what I was taught as a JW. The view is that Col 1:15 says that Jesus is the FIRSTBORN of all creation. The organization understand that to mean that Jesus was the first person created by God. They also understand the same about Only Begotten. They understand that begotten mean created. That Jesus is the only person directly created by Jehovah.

Hebrew 11:17
King James Bible
By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,


Oga Sand2022, Is Isaac the only begotten son of Abraham his Father?

Jesus is a promised seed, likewise Isaac is a promised seed.
Like wise, Jesus is a creature,the son of God his Father.
Hebrew 11:17 = John 3:16.
No be rocket science.

Janosky:
Emusan posted A.I screenshot evidence :
"Jesus is the first born in the sense of being the first to be born or created. He is the beginning of all creation "


Trinity in the mud. Wotowoto.

Oga ,come over here, be WAILING

Still struggling with what AI explain, how then will he understand what human explain?

So empty up there