A mother and her child were walking along a dark street,suddenly two harmed men came out and confronted them,one of the armed men took the child apart and the other one began to hit the woman,punching her really hard,pushed her on the floor and began to hit her, while her son watches in horror.
Meanwhile GOD is sitted on his throne watching this happen.
Me: GOD why don't you do something to stop this man from hurting the poor mother?
GOD: I am not supposed to stop him from harming the mother because that would be interfering with his freewill.
Me: So you want him to be able to exercise his freewill to decide by himself not to hurt the mother again,right?
GOD: Yes exactly.
Me: OK you have preserved the freewill of the man now.
GOD: Yes I have.
Me: What about the mother,is it her freewill to be beaten up by the man?
GOD: Hmmmm,no it's not her freewill.
Me: So that means you are in favour of the armed man's freewill and against the freewill of the mother.
GOD: it seems that way,but that's not how it is.
Me: since you care about everyone's freewill why don't you save the mother since She hasn't done anything wrong to deserve the beating?
GOD: I am not supposed to do that,I am supposed to remain hidden.
Me: So by splitting the red sea into two,turning water into wine,turning a stick into snake,making a tree catch fire without getting burnt,bring a whole human (Jesus) to be the saviour of the world is being hidden? So you would rather be hidden than save the poor woman.
GOD: shutup!!!!!! I am GOD how dare you question me? Don't you know my ways are mysterious! Human comprehension cannot understand me. Just shutup!!
Me: So why do we have the Bible then? Since we cant understand your ways.
GOD: am out!

Tag: theunusualmoon, Honourhim

Omo esu

Lol. You are quite funny and I must say that I do enjoy your write ups.They strengthen my christian belief instead of corroding it.
You have continuously questioned the "concept of free will" at times people choose to do evil but have you considered other times; I mean times when people choose to do good....
E.g Times when you decided to help people with no strings attached.

Have you ever sat down to think about the effect or impact one good gesture can do to an entire generation.........I bet you already know the effects of a single bad gesture.

theunusualmoon:
Lol. You are quite funny and I must say that I do enjoy your write ups.They strengthen my christian belief instead of corroding it.
You have continuously questioned the "concept of free will" at times people choose to do evil but have you considered other times; I mean times when people choose to do good....
E.g Times when you decided to help people with no strings attached.

Have you ever sat down to think about the effect or impact one good gesture can do to an entire generation.........I bet you already know the effects of a single bad gesture.

That doesn't address the Op in anyway.

So you think the good that some people do,would cancel out the numerous evil men do? How does freewill explain it? Does GOD truly care about freewill? How? Used the above illustration to explain

Dapo777:


That doesn't address the Op in anyway.

So you think the good that some people do,would cancel out the numerous evil men do? How does freewill explain it? Does GOD truly care about freewill? How? Used the above illustration to explain

..............
If only you would read with less assumption and more openess.
What I am saying is.........Freewill is freewill.....
Some people choose to do good and some people choose to bad......somewhere someone is abandoning a child on a dirt hill, elsewhere someone is picking up a child from a dirt hill.
Freewill swings both ways.

theunusualmoon:

..............
If only you would read with less assumption and more openess.
What I am saying is.........Freewill is freewill.....
Some people choose to do good and some people choose to bad......somewhere someone is abandoning a child on a dirt hill, elsewhere someone is picking up a child from a dirt hill.
Freewill swings both ways.

So in this case where the poor mother is being beaten against her freewill,why don't GOD care about the mother's freewill? But GOD cares about the armed man freewill.

Dapo777:


So in this case where the poor mother is being beaten against her freewill,why don't GOD care about the mother's freewill? But GOD cares about the armed man freewill.

..
...................
Just because there was no intervention does not mean GOD cared about the free will of the bandits.Dapo believe me, all over the word bad things happen to good people.I know it sounds painful but it has been like that from inception and no one has answers to it.Truth is if we all choose to use our free will to do good then the world will be a better place.Please stop blaming GOD for giving us freewill.

theunusualmoon:
..
...................
Just because there was no intervention does not mean GOD cared about the free will of the bandits.Dapo believe me, all over the word bad things happen to good people.I know it sounds painful but it has been like that from inception and no one has answers to it.

I know the answer. GOD doesn't exist. If he does he would intervene because there is no reason not to intervene. If GOD exist and he is omnibenevolent the world would be better than the way it is now. Being an atheist makes everything clearer and meaningful, now I know it's because there is no GOD that's why the world is full of wickedness, but if I am too accept that there is a GOD then it won't make any sense. It makes more sense being an atheist and there is a reason it makes sense. Because it's true GOD doesn't exist

Dapo777:
A mother and her child were walking along a dark street,suddenly two harmed men came out and confronted them,one of the armed men took the child apart and the other one began to hit the woman,punching her really hard,pushed her on the floor and began to hit her, while her son watches in horror.
Meanwhile GOD is sitted on his throne watching this happen.
Me: GOD why don't you do something to stop this man from hurting the poor mother?
GOD: I am not supposed to stop him from harming the mother because that would be interfering with his freewill.
Me: So you want him to be able to exercise his freewill to decide by himself not to hurt the mother again,right?
GOD: Yes exactly.
Me: OK you have preserved the freewill of the man now.
GOD: Yes I have.
Me: What about the mother,is it her freewill to be beaten up by the man?
GOD: Hmmmm,no it's not her freewill.
Me: So that means you are in favour of the armed man's freewill and against the freewill of the mother.
GOD: it seems that way,but that's not how it is.
Me: since you care about everyone's freewill why don't you save the mother since She hasn't done anything wrong to deserve the beating?
GOD: I am not supposed to do that,I am supposed to remain hidden.
Me: So by splitting the red sea into two,turning water into wine,turning a stick into snake,making a tree catch fire without getting burnt,bring a whole human (Jesus) to be the saviour of the world is being hidden? So you would rather be hidden than save the poor woman.
GOD: shutup!!!!!! I am GOD how dare you question me? Don't you know my ways are mysterious! Human comprehension cannot understand me. Just shutup!!
Me: So why do we have the Bible then? Since we cant understand your ways.
GOD: am out!

Tag: theunusualmoon, Honourhim

What is freewill? Is freewill the same as wish/desire?

The man exercised his freewill by beating up the woman. How did the woman exercise her freewill in connection to the beating?

Another obvious flaw of the freewill argument is that a bulk of the evil that exists in the world is NOT a direct result of any malicious human actions whatsoever.

Diseases and natural disasters affect the lives of humans independent of our respective 'free wills'.

theunusualmoon:
..
...................
Just because there was no intervention does not mean GOD cared about the free will of the bandits.Dapo believe me, all over the word bad things happen to good people.I know it sounds painful but it has been like that from inception and no one has answers to it.Truth is if we all choose to use our free will to do good then the world will be a better place.Please stop blaming GOD for giving us freewill.

The foreknowledge of God should have made him see what havoc this "free will" would cause in his supposedly "good" creation. It is sad that he allows the free will of some to override others. And like someone has already noted, some disastrous occurrences in life (e.g. natural disasters) are totally independent of anybody's free will, yet they happen frequently. Doesn't seem like something a most beneficent good would allow.

Dapo777:


I know the answer. GOD doesn't exist. If he does he would intervene because there is no reason not to intervene. If GOD exist and he is omnibenevolent the world would be better than the way it is now. Being an atheist makes everything clearer and meaningful, now I know it's because there is no GOD that's why the world is full of wickedness, but if I am too accept that there is a GOD then it won't make any sense. It makes more sense being an atheist and there is a reason it makes sense.
Because it's true GOD doesn't exist

..................
I used to work at a place and someone capitalised on the fact that I was a new guy and started stealing stuff.No one.has ever stolen before so obviously this "new movements" was a result of the new guy,but in my absence one person rose on me behalf and defended me and the case she made was since nobody has seen me take anything then it is wrong to accuse me.Do you know what the real thief did? She decided to steal the phone of my defender leaving this woman aggrieved and bitter.Now that something of hers too has been taken let's see if she would not be too bitter enough to point accusing fingers.And you know what Dapo? It worked.Till I left the place no one said a word to my face but they gave me the "silent treatment" which of course is worse than you can ever Imagine.
This is a tip of the ice-berg on what I have been through in life.
I don't know what got you so bitter to the point where you find the "freewill" untenable but truth is: the dark side is willing to do anything to win you over and that's why a lot of good people get bamboozled just so hate or disbelief in GOD can be driven into thier hearts one way or another.I would like you to think about this "freewill" thing from another peespective........
Infact,I remember I once told you to consider the life of Job at a time we had some discussion in the past..........
Do me a favour and read the book of Job again(i.e ,of ourse, considering the fact that you may have read it before).

theunusualmoon:


..................
I used to work at a place and someone capitalised on the fact that I was a new guy and started stealing stuff.No one.has ever stolen before so obviously this "new movements" was a result of the new guy,but in my absence one person rose on me behalf and defended me and the case she made was since nobody has seen me take anything then it is wrong to accuse me.Do you know what the real thief did? She decided to steal the phone of my defender leaving this woman aggrieved and bitter.Now that something of hers too has been taken let's see if she would not be too bitter enough to point accusing fingers.And you know what Dapo? It worked.Till I left the place no one said a word to my face but they gave me the "silent treatment" which of course is worse than you can ever Imagine.
This is a tip of the ice-berg on what I have been through in life.
I don't know what got you so bitter to the point where you find the "freewill" untenable but truth is: the dark side is willing to do anything to win you over and that's why a lot of good people get bamboozled just so hate or disbelief in GOD can be driven into thier hearts one way or another.I would like you to think about this "freewill" thing from another peespective........
Infact,I remember I once told you to consider the life of Job at a time we had some discussion in the past..........
Do me a favour and read the book of Job again(i.e ,of ourse, considering the fact that you may have read it before).

Man it's not about being bitter,I haven't gone through a really bad experience to make me want to hate any GOD,So that's not the case,this is logical and I am convinced, I don't believe the story of job to me it's fabricated to encourage frustrated people to keep their faith,who was there when Satan was asking GOD and GOD was replying Satan in heaven,who was there to record or listen to what there were saying. That's when you would realise the story of job isn't real. It's a myth to make people like you feel better by whatever situation you find yourself and it's working on you.

Freksy:


What is freewill? Is freewill the same as wish/desire?

The man exercised his freewill by beating up the woman. How did the woman exercise her freewill in connection to the beating?

The woman didnt exercise her freewill because its not her will to be beaten. GOD didn't do anything to preserve the woman's freewill,but he was concerned about the freewill of only the armed man. What do you call such a GOD?

Dapo777:
A mother and her child were walking along a dark street,suddenly two harmed men came out and confronted them,one of the armed men took the child apart and the other one began to hit the woman,punching her really hard,pushed her on the floor and began to hit her, while her son watches in horror.
Meanwhile GOD is sitted on his throne watching this happen.
Me: GOD why don't you do something to stop this man from hurting the poor mother?
GOD: I am not supposed to stop him from harming the mother because that would be interfering with his freewill.
Me: So you want him to be able to exercise his freewill to decide by himself not to hurt the mother again,right?
GOD: Yes exactly.
Me: OK you have preserved the freewill of the man now.
GOD: Yes I have.
Me: What about the mother,is it her freewill to be beaten up by the man?
GOD: Hmmmm,no it's not her freewill.
Me: So that means you are in favour of the armed man's freewill and against the freewill of the mother.
GOD: it seems that way,but that's not how it is.
Me: since you care about everyone's freewill why don't you save the mother since She hasn't done anything wrong to deserve the beating?
GOD: I am not supposed to do that,I am supposed to remain hidden.
Me: So by splitting the red sea into two,turning water into wine,turning a stick into snake,making a tree catch fire without getting burnt,bring a whole human (Jesus) to be the saviour of the world is being hidden? So you would rather be hidden than save the poor woman.
GOD: shutup!!!!!! I am GOD how dare you question me? Don't you know my ways are mysterious! Human comprehension cannot understand me. Just shutup!!
Me: So why do we have the Bible then? Since we cant understand your ways.
GOD: am out!

Tag: theunusualmoon, Honourhim

What you talking about? there is nothing like freewill in Christianity.
The sovereignty of God demolishes any thought of freewill.

Dapo777:
A mother and her child were walking along a dark street,suddenly two harmed men came out and confronted them,one of the armed men took the child apart and the other one began to hit the woman,punching her really hard,pushed her on the floor and began to hit her, while her son watches in horror.
Meanwhile GOD is sitted on his throne watching this happen.
Me: GOD why don't you do something to stop this man from hurting the poor mother?
GOD: I am not supposed to stop him from harming the mother because that would be interfering with his freewill.
Me: So you want him to be able to exercise his freewill to decide by himself not to hurt the mother again,right?
GOD: Yes exactly.
Me: OK you have preserved the freewill of the man now.
GOD: Yes I have.
Me: What about the mother,is it her freewill to be beaten up by the man?
GOD: Hmmmm,no it's not her freewill.
Me: So that means you are in favour of the armed man's freewill and against the freewill of the mother.
GOD: it seems that way,but that's not how it is.
Me: since you care about everyone's freewill why don't you save the mother since She hasn't done anything wrong to deserve the beating?
GOD: I am not supposed to do that,I am supposed to remain hidden.
Me: So by splitting the red sea into two,turning water into wine,turning a stick into snake,making a tree catch fire without getting burnt,bring a whole human (Jesus) to be the saviour of the world is being hidden? So you would rather be hidden than save the poor woman.
GOD: shutup!!!!!! I am GOD how dare you question me? Don't you know my ways are mysterious! Human comprehension cannot understand me. Just shutup!!
Me: So why do we have the Bible then? Since we cant understand your ways.
GOD: am out!

Tag: theunusualmoon, Honourhim

I reply this post to educate you on the issue you know nothing about but thinking you know it all because this your analogy is poor and below logical reasoning.

Firstly, God wants to create and He did create all things.
Secondly, God also wants to create BEINGS much like Himself and He did create them.
Thirdly, the BEINGS who God wants to create MUST NOT BE/ACT AS A ROBOT.
Fourthly, so these BEINGS were created WITH POWER OF REASONING that is ability to perceive & receive instruction, and make a decision on those instruction.
Fifthly, God knows that this ability (POWER OF REASONING) can be misused so God placed a set of code i.e COMMANDMENT in between to guide any BEING how to make use of this ability.

The first BEING to misuse his POWER OF REASONING is LUCIFER.

I think as a rational being the argument you can bring to make you look logical should be, why would God create BEING with ABILITY TO REASON and couldn't give every detail about it?

So whosoever misuse his/her POWER OF REASONING decided to act contrary to the commandment of God.

In fact the second greatest commandment is love your neighbour as yourself, so if those thugs love the woman BY OBEYING THE COMMANDMENT of God would they beat her up as you described? Obviously NOT.

Finally, God knows BEINGS He endorsed with POWER OF REASONING can misuse it BUT He also place a commandment that guide them whether they're using it in a RIGHT way or in a WRONG way.

To ask why God then create them when He knows that they will misuse it, is to go against the decision of God which is "God wants to create".

I will now put this question to you, is it possible for MAN to prove the existence of evil wrong? that is it possible for MAN to start doing what we know as good?

Dapo77, dat question "is it d woman's freewill to be beaten by d man?" is a silly question. and u answer as God saying "no" . Sorry mr. u can't answer right ... use ur head, common sense will tell u that d mother could've fought for survival buh she choose to roll on d floor crying. so, address things like d intelligent guy u are, instead of bringing out shiit and trying to make it look good

Emusan:


I reply this post to educate you on the issue you know nothing about but thinking you know it all because this your analogy is poor and below logical reasoning.

Firstly, God wants to create and He did create all things.
Secondly, God also wants to create BEINGS much like Himself and He did create them.
Thirdly, the BEINGS who God wants to create MUST NOT BE/ACT AS A ROBOT.
Fourthly, so these BEINGS were created WITH POWER OF REASONING that is ability to perceive & receive instruction, and make a decision on those instruction.
Fifthly, God knows that this ability (POWER OF REASONING) can be misused so God placed a set of code i.e COMMANDMENT in between to guide any BEING how to make use of this ability.

The first BEING to misuse his POWER OF REASONING is LUCIFER.

I think as a rational being the argument you can bring to make you look logical should be, why would God create BEING with ABILITY TO REASON and couldn't give every detail about it?

So whosoever misuse his/her POWER OF REASONING decided to act contrary to the commandment of God.

In fact the second greatest commandment is love your neighbour as yourself, so if those thugs love the woman BY OBEYING THE COMMANDMENT of God would they beat her up as you described? Obviously NOT.

Finally, God knows BEINGS He endorsed with POWER OF REASONING can misuse it BUT He also place a commandment that guide them whether they're using it in a RIGHT way or in a WRONG way.

To ask why God then create them when He knows that they will misuse it, is to go against the decision of God which is "God wants to create".

I will now put this question to you, is it possible for MAN to prove the existence of evil wrong? that is it possible for MAN to start doing what we know as good?

Am a Christian but the ability to reason,perceive and receive instruction is not all that it is to possess the so called freewill.
Have you thought of the behind the scenes causes of this ability to reason,etc.
If there are circumstances that influence our thoughts and consequently our decisions, how can we say we have free will? I see no scripture that supports this phantom illusion called freewill.

Emusan:


I reply this post to educate you on the issue you know nothing about but thinking you know it all because this your analogy is poor and below logical reasoning.

OK teacher I am listening

Firstly, God wants to create and He did create all things.

Why does GOD want to create? He is GOD he shouldn't need anything, it's only when someone needs something that he creates to supplement his needs. What does GOD needs that he decided to create us?

Secondly, God also wants to create BEINGS much like Himself and He did create them.

What about disabled babies that are born without legs nor arms ? Is GOD also without legs and arms?

Thirdly, the BEINGS who God wants to create MUST NOT BE/ACT AS A ROBOT.

Since he doesn't want us to be like robots,then why did he decided to punish us for not acting like robot? GOD gave man freewill and yet he punishes those that decided to choose evil out of freewill,it doesn't make sense,if GOD didn't want us to do evil and at the same time didn't want us to behave like robots then GOD must be really confused, because it's not possible,either we only get to do good only and be like robots or we be like him and get to do evil,GOD wants to eat his cake and have it,funny GOD.

Fourthly, so these BEINGS were created WITH POWER OF REASONING that is ability to perceive & receive instruction, and make a decision on those instruction.

Man, power of reasoning is different from freewill why are you joining those two different things together? Man can still be logical without having freewill,man can have freewill and be illogical. They are two different things man don't let religion confuse you.

Fifthly, God knows that this ability (POWER OF REASONING) can be misused so God placed a set of code i.e COMMANDMENT in between to guide any BEING how to make use of this ability.

Complete rubbish. If GOD knows that freewill (you are still equating reasoning with freewill wrongly) would be misused and he still decided to give man freewill then it means he wants us to misuse it. If GOD truly doesn't want is to misuse it,then he would have done something about it to prevent it from happening, he is GOD he should be able to prevent future accident, since he decided not to prevent it then it only means he wants it to happen. SIMPLE.

The first BEING to misuse his POWER OF REASONING is LUCIFER.

I think I now know why you are equating reasoning to freewill,So that you can argue that Lucifer was the first to misuse it,because we all know angels don't have freewill and that would make your argument meaningless if you say Lucifer misused his freewill. Lol you tried but failed.

I think as a rational being the argument you can bring to make you look logical should be, why would God create BEING with ABILITY TO REASON and couldn't give every detail about it?

Guy don't be confused, reasoning is different from freewill,we have artificial intelligence, they can be said to have intelligence to a certain extent but they have no freewill to go against their programming So your argument is already flawed from the start to equate freewill with intelligence. Give every details about intelligence? What the crap are you talking about?

So whosoever misuse his/her POWER OF REASONING decided to act contrary to the commandment of God.

Still flawed, no one is misusing power of reasoning,it's freewill we are talking about here but you have to change it to power of reasoning So that you can argue that Lucifer was the first to misuse his reasoning. Doesn't make sense because intelligence cannot be misused.

In fact the second greatest commandment is love your neighbour as yourself, so if those thugs love the woman BY OBEYING THE COMMANDMENT of God would they beat her up as you described? Obviously NOT.

Lol man what are you saying,who is talking about love here. See the way you changed freewill to power of reasoning now you want to change it to love? Guy you are funny.

Finally, God knows BEINGS He endorsed with POWER OF REASONING can misuse it BUT He also place a commandment that guide them whether they're using it in a RIGHT way or in a WRONG way.

Freewill that's the word, not reasoning. We misused freewill not power of reasoning, you are confusing yourself not me.

To ask why God then create them when He knows that they will misuse it, is to go against the decision of God which is "God wants to create".

necessity is the mother of invention, what does GOD needs that he decided to create us? If GOD needed something from us then we can't call him GOD again.

I will now put this question to you, is it possible for MAN to prove the existence of evil wrong? that is it possible for MAN to start doing what we know as good?

Irrelevant question. So you like the way the world is presently? If you were GOD you wouldn't have done any better. The existence of evil only shows that either GOD doesn't exist or he doesn't give a damn about mankind

An2elect2:


Am a Christian but the ability to reason,perceive and receive instruction is not all that it is to possess the so called freewill.
Have you thought of the behind the scenes causes of this ability to reason,etc.
If there are circumstances that influence our thoughts and consequently our decisions, how can we say we have free will? I see no scripture that supports this phantom illusion called freewill.

I thought I was the only one oo. The guys is trying to equate freewill with power of reasoning.

edogho:
Dapo77, dat question "is it d woman's freewill to be beaten by d man?" is a silly question. and u answer as God saying "no" . Sorry mr. u can't answer right ... use ur head, common sense will tell u that [size=17]d mother could've fought for survival buh she choose to roll on d floor crying.[/size] so, address things like d intelligent guy u are, instead of bringing out shiit and trying to make it look good

See the silly excuses Christians give for their sky dad. The woman chose to roll on the floor crying? You are such a senseless individual. So if your mum gets beaten by thugs I am sure a nonsensical person like you would blame your mum for not fighting back. So you would blame your mum for getting beaten? Are you this dumb in real life? Or you are just acting dumb on nairaland? You are indeed a senseless person.

Dapo777:


See the silly excuses Christians give for their sky dad. The woman chose to roll on the floor crying? You are such a senseless individual. So if your mum gets beaten by thugs I am sure a nonsensical person like you would blame your mum for not fighting back. So you would blame your mum for getting beaten? Are you this dumb in real life? Or you are just acting dumb on nairaland? You are indeed a senseless person.

Yes his post is senseless but your stance against Christianity is pitiable.

Don't be too quick to label random people as Christians.

An2elect2:


Yes his post is senseless but your stance against Christianity is pitiable.

Don't be too quick to label random people as Christians.

Give your points against mine.

Dapo777:


See the silly excuses Christians give for their sky dad. The woman chose to roll on the floor crying? You are such a senseless individual. So if your mum gets beaten by thugs I am sure a nonsensical person like you would blame your mum for not fighting back. So you would blame your mum for getting beaten? Are you this dumb in real life? Or you are just acting dumb on nairaland? You are indeed a senseless person.

u are not serious o, see as u wash me dry. buh seriously, in most situations esp like d scenerio u gave, ppl have no choice. u can't link that to freewill.. except u are as dumb as misef ... i'm just pointing out to u dat dat ur question is silly, simple... or u think ursef smarter than everyone else? i have a fair knowledge of how d spiritual works unlike u who's an atheist. u don't just ask a deity to interfere in our affairs... u atheists like judging what u know nothing abt and d worst part is that u act as if u're always right

Dapo777:


Give your points against mine.

Do you believe there is freewill?

and Dapo777, u saying i'll blame anyone for being beaten shows how petty ur mind is. its d normal thing for petty minded individuals to always look for who to blame in any situation. its just like blaming d antelope for being killed by a leopard.. makes sense, i doubt that. i misef being a bonafide young man have been harrassed by thugs on a night i was returning home from work. i tell u, i have options. fight back and die, comply and live. i complied and lived. hoodlums don't just attack for no reason, they want something, give them and move on with ur life. will u blame me for sitting on d floor and giving them mi lappy, phone and wallet? i blamed misef for coming home late tho... so bro, wake up from d dream that being an atheist makes u smarter than everyone who's not. we too can think objectively. if u've experienced what i've experienced first hand, i bet u won't be an atheist.. mind u, i once have considered ditchin theism. u can insult me again if it makes u feel better abt ursef..CheerS

An2elect2:

Am a Christian but [size=14pt]the ability to reason,perceive and receive instruction is not all that it is to possess the so called freewill.[/size]

In fact the bolded part fall out of logic. How can man MAKE A DECISION WITHOUT FIRST THINK?

What is FREEWILL? FREEWILL is the power of acting without the constraint of necessity or fate; the ability to act at one's own discretion or Free will is the ability to make choices without external coercion.

@bold-Now what is discretion? Discretion is the freedom to decide what should be done in a particular situation.
Again how can one make decision without first THINK?

In light of this can a man carried out any action without first REASON IT WITHIN HIM/HERSELF?

Have you thought of the behind the scenes causes of this ability to reason,etc.

It's nothing more than power to make decision.

If there are circumstances that influence our thoughts and consequently our decisions, how can we say we have free will? I see no scripture that supports this phantom illusion called freewill.

The only circumstances that influence our thought is what is going on around us and circumstances that consequently affect our decision is the result of our THOUGHT when we applied the POWER OF REASONING.

Truly, no scripture talks about freewill but we have many references within the scripture on how people used it.

edogho:
u are not serious o, see as u wash me dry. buh seriously, in most situations esp like d scenerio u gave, ppl have no choice. u can't link that to freewill.. except u are as dumb as misef ... i'm just pointing out to u dat dat ur question is silly, simple... or u think ursef smarter than everyone else? i have a fair knowledge of how d spiritual works unlike u who's an atheist. u don't just ask a deity to interfere in our affairs... u atheists like judging what u know nothing abt and d worst part is that u act as if u're always right

You still don't get it. The bandit is exercising his freewill against the freewill of the mother. And GOD is doing nothing about it yet he claims to care about everyone's freewill, or you still dont get it?

An2elect2:


Do you believe there is freewill?

Yes there is freewill but I don't believe GOD cares about the freewill of those that are tortured on earth unfairly, Which Ofcourse is not their will to be tortured

Emusan:


In fact the bolded part fall out of logic. How can man MAKE A DECISION WITHOUT FIRST THINK?

What is FREEWILL? [size=17]FREEWILL is the power of acting without the constraint of necessity or fate; the ability to act at one's own discretion or Free will is the ability to make choices without external coercion. [/size]

@bold-Now what is discretion? Discretion is the freedom to decide what should be done in a particular situation.
Again how can one make decision without first THINK?

In light of this can a man carried out any action without first REASON IT WITHIN HIM/HERSELF?



It's nothing more than power to make decision.



The only circumstances that influence our thought is what is going on around us and circumstances that consequently affect our decision is the result of our THOUGHT when we applied the POWER OF REASONING.

Truly, no scripture talks about freewill but we have many references within the scripture on how people used it.

Let me borrow your definition of freewill. If you say freewill is the ability to act without the constraints of fate nor external coercion . That means we don't have freewill because GOD has introduced FATE and EXTERNAL COERCION by creating hell fire from those who refused to his will,how can you then say we have freewill when we have been coerced to do God's will because we know hell is waiting for us if we don't. Freewill is an illusion if GOD exist and you just confirmed it with your definition of freewill.

Dapo777:


Yes there is freewill but I don't believe GOD cares about the freewill of those that are tortured on earth unfairly, Which Ofcourse is not their will to be tortured

How did you come to the conclusion that there is freewill cos science does not back this claim?

Notice am addressing you as someone who does not believe in God or the authority of scripture.

edogho:
and Dapo777, u saying i'll blame anyone for being beaten shows how petty ur mind is. its d normal thing for petty minded individuals to always look for who to blame in any situation. its just like blaming d antelope for being killed by a leopard.. makes sense, i doubt that. i misef being a bonafide young man have been harrassed by thugs on a night i was returning home from work. i tell u, i have options. fight back and die, comply and live. i complied and lived. hoodlums don't just attack for no reason, they want something, give them and move on with ur life. will u blame me for sitting on d floor and giving them mi lappy, phone and wallet? i blamed misef for coming home late tho... so bro, wake up from d dream that being an atheist makes u smarter than everyone who's not. we too can think objectively. if u've experienced what i've experienced first hand, i bet u won't be an atheist.. mind u, i once have considered ditchin theism. u can insult me again if it makes u feel better abt ursef..CheerS

You still aren't making any sense. If boko harm approaches you,do you think they want something from you? Is there anything you could do at that point to prevent yourself from being killed? You are the one who would blame the antelope for being killed because you blamed the woman for falling on the floor and crying So I won't be surprised if you blamed the antelope for being killed by the leopard,the woman would have fought back if She was strong enough to overcome the bandit but in the case where She isn't strong enough that's when GOD should save her because it is not her will to be beaten. But no GOD won't interfere he would rather preserve the freewill of the bandit rather than preserve the freewill of the poor mother