There is little to zero difference between Frosbel who believes the Bible is full of error and fables and myths and a Dispensationalism who literally and arbitrarily DIVIDES the Word and apportion some parts to imaginary lumps of time called dispensations,and dismisses the same as irrelevant.

The effect is the same, watering down the Authority of the Word

shdemidemi:


The bible isn't confusing if we learn to understand it as a progressive revelation instead of one flat story book. It is within God's prerogative to keep things hidden from man until He chooses to unveil them. He unveiled the message for the church to Apostle Paul but my friends will rather pitch their tent with those who came before the Apostle.
Deut 29:29
"The LORD our God has secrets known to no one. We are not accountable for them, but we and our children are accountable forever for all that he has revealed to us, so that we may obey all the terms of these instructions.

vooks:

There is little to zero difference between Frosbel who believes the Bible is full of error and fables and myths and a Dispensationalism who literally and arbitrarily DIVIDES the Word and apportion some parts to imaginary lumps of time called dispensations,and dismisses the same as irrelevant.

The effect is the same, watering down the Authority of the Word

Do you understand Deuteronomy 29:29...it says somethings are hid until an appropriate time.

Paul says the mystery that had been hid all the while before him was revealed to him.

Do you understand the above?

shdemidemi:


The bible isn't confusing if we learn to understand it as a progressive revelation instead of one flat story book. It is within God's prerogative to keep things hidden from man until He chooses to unveil them. He unveiled the message for the church to Apostle Paul but my friends will rather pitch their tent with those who came before the Apostle.
Deut 29:29
"The LORD our God has secrets known to no one. We are not accountable for them, but we and our children are accountable forever for all that he has revealed to us, so that we may obey all the terms of these instructions.

Fair enough
Please can you help to present a timeline for different activities and revelations from Matthew to Revelation.
Such a visual presentation could be helpful.
It doesn't need to have dates, just present it in a linear sequence.

From this, we can try determining when Paul received this revelation compared to the other apostles
and whether this was the final revelation of his or if he reverted back to previous revelations

We can even learn loads of other stuff than can help in our discussions

Something like this:

M0ronic brains

Ephesians 3:3-6 New King James Version (NKJV)

3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel,

To Paul was REVEALED exactly what was revealed to APOSTLES

shdemidemi:


Do you understand Deuteronomy 29:29...it says somethings are hid until an appropriate time.

Paul says the mystery that had been hid all the while before him was revealed to him.

Do you understand the above?

esere826:


Fair enough
Please can you help to present a timeline for different activities and revelations from Matthew to Revelation.
Such a visual presentation could be helpful.
It doesn't need to have dates, just present it in a linear sequence.

From this, we can try determining when Paul received this revelation compared to the other apostles
and whether this was the final revelation of his or if he reverted back to previous revelations

We can even learn loads of other stuff than can help in our discussions

Something like this:

Can't do that at the moment but there is quite a lot of time lines that depict the timing of event from Gen. to Rev. on line.

I will probably paste one much later. They certainly help for guided study.

shdemidemi:


If you have, why did you agree to be a sinner when I asked?

Because I still sin, like St. Paul and the Corinthians after their justification.

shdemidemi:
Moreover, James is saying 'works' and 'faith'. My question was if you can make yourself righteous...you said 'yes'.

Do you stand by your 'yes' or do you think it needs 'faith' and your 'work'?

That wasn't your question. Stop lying.

I cannot make myself righteous but I can help myself by cooperating with God's grace by doing good and living right.

shdemidemi:


Can't do that at the moment but there is quite a lot of time lines that depict the timing of event from Gen. to Rev. on line.
I will probably paste one much later. They certainly help for guided study.

That would be great. Thanks
With such timelines, we might even start seeing possibilities that the gap between a revelation and the time it was documented and who documented it could have an influence
Something like I tried to explain to Frosbel about the possible reason why there is no record of the virgin birth in the book of Mark

Esere826,
He is in many words aksin to be given time to Google for a Dispensationalism biased timeline so that he can comment on it. He don't want to be caught like a dear in the headlights...Jehovah's Witnesses can't think without their Watchtower study 'aids'

His will have 7 'dispensations from Genesis to Revelation and the 'message of Grace' starts somewhere in Acts 15

shdemidemi:


Can't do that at the moment but there is quite a lot of time lines that depict the timing of event from Gen. to Rev. on line.

I will probably paste one much later. They certainly help for guided study.

vooks:
M0ronic brains

Ephesians 3:3-6 New King James Version (NKJV)

3 how that by revelation He made known to me the mystery (as I have briefly written already, 4 by which, when you read, you may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ), 5 which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: [size=26pt]6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs[/size], of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel,

To Paul was REVEALED exactly what was revealed to APOSTLES

My brainy critic

Do you need the parts where he personalise his message of the gospel?

It was revealed that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs. What it did not say- we were all taught this gospel that is to be preached to Gentiles.

Is it clear that the mystery was revealed to APOSTLES not just him?

How is revelation of this mystery to apostles personalising? Dump that Scoffield Junk and start using your head.

Who taught Peter that Cornelius a Gentile is a fellow-heir?

shdemidemi:


My brainy critic

Do you need the parts where he personalise his message of the gospel?

It was revealed that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs. What it did not say- we were all taught this gospel that is to be preached to Gentiles.

italo:

Because I still sin, like St. Paul and the Corinthians after their justification.

Does that not mean you can't help yourself?

You can't say you have made yourself righteous and at the same time say you remain a sinner, can you?

shdemidemi:


Thank you, I guess only Frosbel is good on this forum.

Can you help yourself from the sinner status to a 'righteous' status?

italo:


Yes.

That was my exact question.

italo:

That wasn't your question. Stop lying.

I cannot make myself righteous but I can help myself by cooperating with God's grace by doing good and living right.

Good... Now you agree you can't make yourself righteous.

What do you mean by cooperating with God's grace?

vooks:
Esere826,
He is in many words aksin to be given time to Google for a Dispensationalism biased timeline so that he can comment on it. He don't want to be caught like a dear in the headlights...Jehovah's Witnesses can't think without their Watchtower study 'aids'
His will have 7 'dispensations from Genesis to Revelation and the 'message of Grace' starts somewhere in Acts 15

lol naaaa...
I'll give Shdemidemi the benefit of doubt

and besides, I think it as an assignment for all of us to try to do
its kinda crazy that we just received a book without trying to find out more about instead of parroting that "it is the Word of God"
afterall, someone in the bible seems to be way smarter than us of this generation and says this:

Luke 1
Dedication to Theophilus

1 Inasmuch as many have undertaken to compile a narrative of the things which have been accomplished among us, 2 just as they were delivered to us by those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and ministers of the word, 3 it seemed good to me also, having followed all things closely[a] for some time past, to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theoph′ilus,[b] 4 that you may know the truth concerning the things of which you have been informed

vooks:
Is it clear that the mystery was revealed to APOSTLES not just him?

How is revelation of this mystery to apostles personalising? Dump that Scoffield Junk and start using your head

What mystery did Eph 3:6 speak about?

Paul says things like-
Rom 2:16
This will take place on the day when God judges people's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

2 Tim 2:8
Remember Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, descended from David. This is my gospel,

shdemidemi:


NOOOOO.. They were not made in God's image but in the image of the fallen man- Adam.
Gen 5:3
And Adam lived an hundred and thirty years, and begat a son in his own likeness, and after his image; and called his name Seth:

Do you agree Mr vooks the critic?

Negro,
The mystery is DEFINED right there in verse 6

that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel,

You want it translated into Yoruba or pidgin?

Now I can see you recycling the same Dispensationalism arguments of 'my'

Paul said 'My God shall supply all your needs...'. Was that a personal God as well?

shdemidemi:


What mystery did Eph 3:6 speak about?

Paul says things like-
Rom 2:16
This will take place on the day when God judges people's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.

2 Tim 2:8
Remember Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, descended from David. This is my gospel,

@vooks

Do you understand Deuteronomy 29:29...it says some things are hid until an appropriate time.

Paul says the mystery that had been hid all the while before him was revealed to him.

Do you understand the above?

shdemidemi:


Does that not mean you can't help yourself?

You can't say you have made yourself righteous and at the same time say you remain a sinner, can you?

I can. Paul called the Corinthian Church "carnal" and "saints."

shdemidemi:
That was my exact question.



Good... Now you agree you can't make yourself righteous.

What do you mean by cooperating with God's grace?

I meant to say I cant make myself righteous on my own. I can cooperate with God's grace by doing good and living right...to make myself righteous. Like Abraham who cooperated by offering up his son.

Shdemidemi, can a christian who doesn't love his brother go to heaven?

I don't understand how a mystery Paul, by the Spirit, tells us revealed to the apostles was revealed to Paul ALONE...I'd have to lose my brains first before I ignore the glorious truth of Eph 3

I fully understand Deut 29:29 probably better than you can ever dream of in two lifetimes

shdemidemi
post=29817591:
@vooks

Do you understand Deuteronomy 29:29...it says some things are hid until an appropriate time.

Paul says the mystery that had been hid all the while before him was revealed to him.

Do you understand the above?

italo:

I can. Paul called the Corinthian Church "carnal" and "saints."

What made paul call them saints, could it be because they helped themselves or cooperated with God I.e was it by their doing?

italo:

I meant to say I cant make myself righteous on my own.

Better!

italo:

I can cooperate with God's grace by doing good and living right...to make myself righteous. Like Abraham who cooperated by offering up his son.

When you say cooperating with God's grace, does that mean His grace isn't sufficient?

italo:
Shdemidemi, can a christian who doesn't love his brother go to heaven?

Is heaven dependent on who I love or who I do not love?

My answer to your question based on scripture is 'yes'.

vooks:
I don't understand how a mystery Paul, by the Spirit, tells us revealed to the apostles was revealed to Paul ALONE...I'd have to lose my brains first before I ignore the glorious truth of Eph 3

I fully understand Deut 29:29 probably better than you can ever dream of in two lifetimes

he talked about a mystery that reveals that Gentiles are now called to be a part of God.

Isn't that different from the mystery of the message that actually does the work of imputing righteousness?


Did he personalise the gospel he got from Jesus like no other person did, yes or no?

He says that mystery was revealed to the apostles. Digest that negro.

Please recite Ephesians 3:5-6

which in other ages was not made known to the sons of men, as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to His holy apostles and prophets: 6 that the Gentiles should be fellow heirs, of the same body, and partakers of His promise in Christ through the gospel,

shdemidemi:


he talked about a mystery that reveals that Gentiles are now called to be a part of God.

Isn't that different from the mystery of the message that actually does the work of imputing righteousness?


Did he personalise the gospel he got from Jesus like no other person, yes or no?

vooks:

He says that mystery was revealed to the apostles. Digest that negro.

What mystery Mr vooks?

Eph 1:1
For this reason I, Paul, a prisoner for Christ Jesus on behalf of you Gentiles— 2 assuming that you have heard of the stewardship of God's grace that was given to [size=26pt]me[/size] for you,

shdemidemi:


Is heaven dependent on who I love or who I do not love?

My answer to your question based on scripture is 'yes'.

Can a Christian who doesn't love God go to heaven?

italo:


Can a Christian who doesn't love God go to heaven?

You can't be a Christian if you don't love God. You can't hate God and say you are a follower- haters of God are the atheist and all that don't believe in Christ.

Not everybody is Eistein but surely,is this an excuse for m0ronic comprehension?

Ephesians 3:6 English Standard Version (ESV)

6 This mystery is[a] that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

shdemidemi:

What mystery Mr vooks?

vooks:
Not everybody is Eistein but surely,is this an excuse for m0ronic comprehension?

Ephesians 3:6 English Standard Version (ESV)

6 This mystery is[a] that the Gentiles are fellow heirs, members of the same body, and partakers of the promise in Christ Jesus through the gospel.

Eph 1:1
For this reason I, Paul, a prisoner for Christ Jesus on behalf of you Gentiles— 2 assuming that you have heard of the stewardship of God's grace that was given to me for you,

Do you understand that asides the mystery that surrounds the knowledge revealing the adoption of Gentiles, there is a mysterious message of the good news of Christ that was revealed to Aposle Paul?

NOOOOO.. They were not made in God's image but in the image of the fallen man- Adam.

Did you goof.. Mr critic?

Do you agree unbelievers are not made in God's own image and likeness but in Adam's image and likeness?

You are now dancing azonto and palongo hopping from one irrelevant idi0cy to another.

Can we FIRST agree that according to Paul's OWN words in Ephesians 3:3-6,

1. A mystery was REVEALED?
2. It was REVEALED to the apostleS?
3. The mystery is, 'Gentiles are fellow heirs?
4. The mystery was revealed by Holy Spirit

We can quote the entire scriptures but if you are too blinded by doctrines of men to admit such simple and obvious truths,it won't help nothing


Cc BabaGnoni,italo

shdemidemi:

Eph 1:1
For this reason I, Paul, a prisoner for Christ Jesus on behalf of you Gentiles— 2 assuming that you have heard of the stewardship of God's grace that was given to me for you,

Do you understand that asides the mystery that surrounds the knowledge revealing the adoption of Gentiles, there is a mysterious message of the good news of Christ that was revealed to Aposle Paul?

vooks:
You are now dancing azonto and palongo hopping from one irrelevant idi0cy to another.

Can we FIRST agree that according to Paul's OWN words in Ephesians 3:3-6,

1. A mystery was REVEALED?
2. It was REVEALED to the apostleS?
3. The mystery is, 'Gentiles are fellow heirs?
4. The mystery was revealed by Holy Spirit

We can quote the entire scriptures but if you are too blinded by doctrines of men to admit such simple and obvious truths,it won't help nothing

Don't play dumb with me now, you are the pin head smart one, isn't it?

I agree with the four points...

Now move on to the gospel that does the work of salvation and how to be saved...Rom 1:16, Rom 10

shdemidemi:


You can't be a Christian if you don't love God. You can't hate God and say you are a follower- haters of God are the atheist and all that don't believe in Christ.

So it takes more than faith in God to be a Christian, love too is needed?

Can one be a Christian, yet not love his brother?