jared007:
Evwreni and olomu clans are partly igbo. Do some research my goodboiy

No Urhobo clan is partly Igbo. If you say some people migrated from Igbo land, I may turn my face away but to assert that they are totally Igbo is something else entirely. Even Aragba-Orogun people that speak Igbo do not claim to be Igbo. However, some Isoko clans migrated from Igbo lands. I can attest to that and some Ijaw clans, such as Mein and Tarakiri, were the progenitors of some Urhobo clans as well. But Urhobos are Edoid and not Igboid! Some Isoko clans maybe partly Igboid.

Ihuomadinihu:
Interesting. I was informed that some Urhobos have Igbo ancestry.

Urhobos and Igbo ancestry? Oh Please! Isokos may have some Igboid elements but not Urhobo! Urhobos are full blooded Edos in culture, language and cosmology! Please take note! Dont incite arguments that cannot be won.

Its not that I have something against Igbos! I know that some Urhobo clans such as Orogun and Olomu, or so, had maternal Igbo relationship in their early history. For instance, Orogun, the eponymous name of the clan's progenitor is an Ukwuani term. However, apart from Orogun itself, NO URHOBO CLAN HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH IGBO whether culturally, linguistically, philosophically or otherwise. Urhobos are Edos in most of these and even its degree of "Edoness" has diminished over time with the fashioning of a new identity for ourselves.

fratermathy:


No Urhobo clan is partly Igbo. If you say some people migrated from Igbo land, I may turn my face away but to assert that they are totally Igbo is something else entirely. Even Aragba-Orogun people that speak Igbo do not claim to be Igbo. However, some Isoko clans migrated from Igbo lands. I can attest to that and some Ijaw clans, such as Mein and Tarakiri, were the progenitors of some Urhobo clans as well. But Urhobos are Edoid and not Igboid! Isokos are partly Igboid.

Only few clan in Isoko speak the Igboid language.. maybe 6%. Isoko is pure Edoid.. they only speak the Igboid language due to communication.. All clan in Urhobo and Isoko Remain Edoid.. nobody can twist The history of my People.. As for the Aragba orogun people they were only Influenced with Anioma language.. but they still remain Urhobo and nobody can change that.

Ihuomadinihu:

Ok,thanks. I was only trying to explain that Language is a pointer to certain origins. For Igbo words to exist in Urhobo,then some Igbos most have settled in Urhobo at some point in history.

Igbo words in Urhobo is not unique. Urhobos have a bad habit of borrowing other language's words. Urhobo is not as linguistically wholesome as Igbo or Yoruba is and so words that have no direct translation in Urhobo are borrowed from other languages, ergo, the use of some Igbo words. To yield credence to this, Igbos have been neighbours to Urhobos via the Abraka/Orogun axis for quite a long time. Igbo is a language of commerce and affluence and so most Urhobos employed words that they learnt from their travels to Onitsha, Aba, etc in the Urhobo language!

Goodboiy:


Only few clan in Isoko speak the Igboid language.. maybe 6%. Isoko is pure Edoid.. they only speak the Igboid language due to communication.. All clan in Urhobo and Isoko Remain Edoid.. nobody can twist The history of my People.. As for the Aragba orogun people they were only Influenced with Anioma language.. but they still remain Urhobo and nobody can change that.

Exactly! Isokos are not even Igboid apart from a scanty few! Very scanty few! Igbo influence ends in Ukwuani.

Oshare! Mavor? You don see my new edit?


Lalasticlala and co, una don start again o!

fratermathy:


Urhobos and Igbo ancestry? Oh Please! Isokos may have some Igboid elements but not Urhobo! Urhobos are full blooded Edos in culture, language and cosmology! Please take note! Dont incite arguments that cannot be won.

Its not that I have nothing against Igbos! I know that some Urhobo clans such as Orogun and Olomu, or so, had maternal Igbo relationship in their early history. For instance, Orogun, the eponymous name of the clan's progenitor is an Ukwuani term. However, apart from Orogun itself, NO URHOBO CLAN HAS ANYTHING TO DO WITH IGBO whether culturally, linguistically, philosophically or otherwise. Urhobos are Edos in most of these and even its degree of "Edoness" has diminished over time with the fashioning of a new identity for ourselves.

Pls it will be wrong if You don't acknowledge the Edoness of The Itsekiri People.. In shot Itsekiri re more Edo than Urhobo .. Na joke I they oo ..

Cc : Onuwaje how your NYSC marra they go ?.. I heard 4 girls re already pregnant for You.. Is that true ?

Radoillo:
But I thought it was well known in historical circles that some Urhobo-Isoko clans have traditions of Igbo origins.

jared007:
Evwreni and olomu clans are partly igbo. Do some research my goodboiy

It is not acknowledged in any historical work, circle, square or triangle that Urhobos migrated from Igbo. Urhobos left Udo in Edo and migrated through Ukwuani land to their current location. In the process of migration, influences here and there may have filtered in and I doubt that even Ukwuani had become Igboid as at the time of the said migration because Ukwuani is a relatively new Igboid language. Ukwuani's acculturation took a more period of time than Ika.
Secondly, Urhobos have always seen Igbos as their kith and kin and NEVER as their progenitors! Kith and Kin in the sense that some Igboid groups, such as Ika and Ukwuani, are as influenced by Edo as the Urhobo-Isokos are. Please correct your impression! Urhobo is EDOID and even its degree of such has waned.

fratermathy:


Exactly! Isokos are not even Igboid apart from a scanty few! Very scanty few! Igbo influence ends in Ukwuani.

Oshare! Mavor? You don see my new edit?


Lalasticlala and co, una don start again o!

He he he .. I nor want another wahala oo.. After that B*n na once I receive Sense. If I they call Seun and Lalasticlala I they Add title put now oo.. Olorugu Chief Seun abeg help us out

Goodboiy:


Pls it will be wrong if You don't acknowledge the Edoness of The Itsekiri People.. In shot Itsekiri re more Edo than Urhobo .. Na joke I they oo ..

Cc : Onuwaje how your NYSC marra they go ?.. I heard 4 girls re already pregnant for You.. Is that true ?

Confirm matters! Itsekiris have more direct and continual Edo influence due to the influence of Ginuwa, the Edo prince, who taught the then Ilaje-Yorubas about Edo aristocracy, culture, monarchy and language. Urhobos have been divorced from Edo for so long that we have established our distinct identity. However in the case of Itsekiri, Ginuwa and his offsprings have continued to remind Itsekiris that they are Edo royalties! In fact, Edos are so recognised in Itsekiri that when kola is being broken and an Edo man is present, no matter his age, he will be the one to break it. Even if the Itsekiris there are 200 years old and the Edo man is 20 years old, the Edo man will perform the breaking of the Kola. However, this tradition has waned over time due to modernisation. Itsekiri borrows words more than Urhobos and that is why the language sounds distinctly different from EVERY other neighbouring group. However, in all these borrowings, Edo has a special place because it comprises the bulk of cultural and monarchical terms in Itsekiri.

It is WELL!!! Wadoo!

Radoillo:


I would suggest getting acquainted with the works of Professor Obaro Ikime, the most prominent historian of Isoko extraction. You could read his Niger Delta Rivalry based on his doctoral thesis. You could also read The Edo-Speaking Peoples by Bradbury, the anthropologist. It contains a section on the Urhobo and Isoko peoples.

To mention the Urhobo/Isoko groups that claim Igbo (or at least part-Igbo) origins, let me quote from Professor Ikime's chapter in the book The Groundwork of Nigerian History, chapter 5.

1. Olomu: "The Olomu traditions also indicate that as some point Igbo elements moved into the area and were assimilated into the population." [page 93].
Now, the Olomu clan had already been established by one Igboze from Benin. He was later joined by an Igbo whose name is given as Olomu and who came with a sizable group of followers. This Olomu succeeded Igboze as the Ovie. Olomu's ascension as the Ovie led to a split in the community, and those who would not accept his leadership seceded and established the Okpe clans. So Olomu clan is believed to be a mixture of Bini and Igbo elements. (This additional detail can be found in Ikime's Niger-Delta Rivalry.)

2. Evwreni: "The Urhobo clan of Evwreni is said to have been founded by Igbo elephant hunters hired in the first instance by the Isoko clan of Iyede." [page 93]

3., 4., and 5. Enwhe, Igbide, and Ume: "The Isoko clans of Enwhe, Igbide and Ume are said to be of Igbo origin, the founders having come from the Igbo country. Details of the migrations are rather scanty. Eru, the founder of Igbide is said to have stayed in Awka for some time before he moved off to the present Igbide clan." [page 93]

As much as your citation may be factually correct, Professor Obaro Ikime's work is disputed by a host of others viz, Professors Peter Ekeh, Godini Darah, Onigu Otite, Sam Erivwo and Michael Nabofa. These aforementioned Professors have all done their seminal works on this same history and some, notably Ekeh, has debunked most of it. It is generally agreed that Isokos have some Igbo influences which is even obviated by the vast deviation of the language from Central Urhobo. Some Isoko clans were directly or indirectly formed by Igbo offsprings. However, this has, in no way, affected the culture, language and worldview of its people. Perhaps the influence was too weak to hold waters unlike the mass acculturation successfully carried out in Ukwuani and Ika.
In the case of Urhobo land, it has been proven by all the scholars I earlier mentioned that Urhobo has no Igbo influence(s). Granted, some Urhobo clans were "maternally" and "itinerarily" influenced by Igbos but it is neither paternal, wholesome nor accultural, ergo, this negates Ikime's theory except that of his own Isoko people.

Freemanan:

I know bros....
Tho I know the basics.... Even Fratermathy sef nor know deep and konk urhobo

The Lost Generation!!! So which language, other than English, do you speak fluently and above the "basics"?

As for me, I am remedying the semi-loss state I was previously in gradually. It is something to be ashamed of that one cant speak his/her native language and yet we are so eloquent in another man's language. It leaves much to be worried of! This is why I have started a culturall renaissance.

fratermathy:


Igbo words in Urhobo is not unique. Urhobos have a bad habit of borrowing other language's words. Urhobo is not as linguistically wholesome as Igbo or Yoruba is and so words that have no direct translation in Urhobo are borrowed from other languages, ergo, the use of some Igbo words. To yield credence to this, Igbos have been neighbours to Urhobos via the Abraka/Orogun axis for quite a long time. Igbo is a language of commerce and affluence and so most Urhobos employed words that they learnt from their travails to Onitsha, Aba, etc in the Urhobo language!

Lol, why are you all mentioning me up and down. I only wanted to get basic information concerning the presence of Igbo words in Urhobo/Isoko language. This fear of Igbo people is getting out of hand and you all should deal with it! Nobody is claming Urhobo and Isoko to be Igbo or Igboid but the word out there is that some Isoko clans have Igbo ancestry or influence,which ever way you want to put it. What you have here is not a unique case. Even in Igbo,we share certain words with our neighbours and that is a pointer to shared ancestry or influence if further investigations are conducted.
It will be nice if we have an open discussion about the origin of those Yoruba and Igbo words in your language instead of coming off as angry whenever Igbo is mentioned along side Isoko/Urhobo.

fratermathy:



As much as your citation may be factually correct, Professor Obaro Ikime's work is disputed by a host of others viz, Professors Peter Ekeh, Godini Darah, Onigu Otite, Sam Erivwo and Michael Nabofa. These aforementioned Professors have all done their seminal works on this same history and some, notably Ekeh, has debunked most of it. It is generally agreed that Isokos have some Igbo influences which is even obviated by the vast deviation of the language from Central Urhobo. Some Isoko clans were directly or indirectly formed by Igbo offsprings. However, this has, in no way, affected the culture, language and worldview of its people. Perhaps the influence was too weak to hold waters unlike the mass acculturation successfully carried out in Ukwuani and Ika.
In the case of Urhobo land, it has been proven by all the scholars I earlier mentioned that Urhobo has no Igbo influence(s). Granted, some Urhobo clans were "maternally" and "itenarily" influenced by Igbos but it is neither paternal, wholesome nor accultural, ergo, this negates Ikime's theory except that of his own Isoko people.

Why will you say Urhobo has no Igbo influence, and then turn around and say some Urhobo clans were maternally and itinerarily influenced by Igbos? Aren't both statements directly contradictory?

Anyway, let me not press on with this, as I have no intention of derailing this thread. The traditions that I mentioned have been around in written form since the early 1930s when anthropologists collected them from elders within the communities involved and documented them in intelligence reports which are still available today. If, however, modern Urhobo scholars today (eg., Peter Palmer Ekeh) say that the elders back in the 1930s had no idea what they were saying, then so be it. I wont press further. Though, I must say that I find it interesting that in a book I read recently, written by a member of the Okpe royal family, he reiterated the traditions that Olomu clan has an Igbo admixture:

https://books.google.com.ng/books?id=8oKjNjheHoAC&pg=PA7&lpg=PA7&dq=Olomu+Igbo+Urhobo&source=bl&ots=8Mhcu2X7SS&sig=P8IGohYEUybA3DSUzOZshLmrhcs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CB8Q6AEwATgUahUKEwi2uo_3yv7IAhXGuhQKHTA1DfU#v=onepage&q=Olomu%20Igbo%20Urhobo&f=false


Forget I was here. Carry on.

fratermathy:



The Lost Generation!!! So which language, other than English, do you speak fluently and above the "basics"?

As for me, I am remedying the semi-loss state I was previously in gradually. It is something to be ashamed of that one cant speak his/her native language and yet we are so eloquent in another man's language. It leaves much to be worried of! This is why I have started a culturall renaissance.

A shame definitely.... I am really learning from elderly ones around me... Tho I understand Ibo and Yoruba a bit ..

Radoillo:


Why will you say Urhobo has no Igbo influence, and then turn around and say some Urhobo clans were maternally and itinerarily influenced by Igbos? Aren't both statements directly contradictory?

Anyway, let me not press on with this, as I have no intention of derailing this thread. The traditions that I mentioned have been around in written form since the early 1930s when anthropologists collected them from elders within the communities involved and documented them in intelligence reports which are still available today. If, however, modern Urhobo scholars today (eg., Peter Palmer Ekeh) say that the elders back in the 1930s had no idea what they were saying, then so be it. I wont press further. Though, I must say that I find it interesting that in a book I read recently, written by a member of the Okpe royal family, he reiterated the traditions that Olomu clan has an Igbo admixture:

https://books.google.com.ng/books?id=8oKjNjheHoAC&pg=PA7&lpg=PA7&dq=Olomu+Igbo+Urhobo&source=bl&ots=8Mhcu2X7SS&sig=P8IGohYEUybA3DSUzOZshLmrhcs&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CB8Q6AEwATgUahUKEwi2uo_3yv7IAhXGuhQKHTA1DfU#v=onepage&q=Olomu%20Igbo%20Urhobo&f=false


Forget I was here. Carry on.

I also dont want to derail this thread as well. My statements are not contradictory. Maternal and itinerary influences are not enough to say Igbos are progenitors of certain Urhobo clans.

As for various scholars opposing each other on the matter, you should know that they work with available data at their disposal! If one says something and another says otherwise, who are we to debunk either except with facts? I do believe that Okpe and Isoko were influenced by Igbo but NEVER Urhobo. This is not an issue of sentiment. This is an objective fact that I'd say even if I were Igbo. I do acknowledge the influence of Edo.

Ihuomadinihu:

Lol, why are you all mentioning me up and down. I only wanted to get basic information concerning the presence of Igbo words in Urhobo/Isoko language. This fear of Igbo people is getting out of hand and you all should deal with it! Nobody is claming Urhobo and Isoko to be Igbo or Igboid but the word out there is that some Isoko clans have Igbo ancestry or influence,which ever way you want to put it. What you have here is not a unique case. Even in Igbo,we share certain words with our neighbours and that is a pointer to shared ancestry or influence if further investigations are conducted.
It will be nice if we have an open discussion about the origin of those Yoruba and Igbo words in your language instead of coming off as angry whenever Igbo is mentioned along side Isoko/Urhobo.

I am DEFINITELY not angry. I always sound like this. I am a serious minded individual. Follow my threads and help yourself with proof.

As for Igbo words in Urhobo, there are also Yoruba, Igara and Ibibio words in Igbo. Do we now say that these languages are the progenitors of Igbo?

I have told you before that Igbo then was seen as a language of commerce and advantage and many Urhobo traders and travellers acquired the language and loaned Igbo words into English as much as Yoruba, Portuguese and English words were loaned. In fact, I believe Urhobo language is one of the few languages that borrow words without control. Everything can be translated into Urhobo by adding "i" before and after the said word. So it is not unique that Igbo words are in Urhobo. I even believe it is vice versa if a research on this is conducted.


Again, I am not angry. You should know by now that I love Igbos. I just like facts being sacronsanct.

Goodboiy:
Hi peeps.. I haven't create any new thread recently due to some reasons best known To me, Although I still Remain your loyal boy "Goodboiyy" . Below are some Igbo and Yoruba word used in Urhobo language.

1. Biko : Biko is an Igbo word for "Please" And it means same in Urhobo, in Urhobo you usually hear word like "Oghene' biko keme' Igho" Meaning "God please Give me money".

2. Olori : Olori is a Yoruba Word for Head .. in Urhobo it means the same thing..

3. Orgor' : Orgor' is an Igbo word for 'Inlaw'. It means the same thing in Urhobo.. for example I might say "Oniovo Orgor we' nkor " meaning 'brother how is Your Inlaw ".

4. Omo' : Omo'r is a Yoruba word for Child, It has same meaning in Urhobo.. I can make statement like " e' Freemanan Omo'r meh' … meaning "Freemanan is my Son"

5. Obara' : Obara is an Igbo word for blood.. It means Same In Urhobo.. Why The Igbo woman will shout "Obara Jesus" and Urhobo Woman will say "Oba'rah' Re' Jesu"

6. Jesu' : Jesu' is an Yoruba word for Jesus . its still the same in Urhobo

7. Ew'a : Ew'a is another Yoruba word for Beans and its thesame with Urhobo. Ew'a is pronounced in Urhobo exactly thesame with That of Yoruba

8. OBA : OBA is a Yoruba word for king , We still use it in Urhobo.. If we Want to Call God.. we say Oba' risi' meaning " King Of The Word"

9. Akpere : Is a Yoruba word for basket, it means the same Thing in Urhobo



Pls don't derail the thread. THANKS

In the isoko language

1) please ~ iviole/ore

2) head. ~ uzo

3) inlaw. ~ orgor

5) blood ~ aze

6) jesus ~ jesus is jesu on almost all "AFRICAN LANGUAgES”

7) beans ~ Eza

king ~ ovie

9) basket ~ ?

"Perhaps the influence was too weak to hold waters unlike the mass acculturation successfully carried out in Ukwuani and Ika"

Fratermarthy, what's the meaning of the bolded part of your post? Are you by any means suggesting that both Ukwuani and Ika were not originally Igbo speaking but became Igbo speaking via acculturation done by Ndiigbo?

Explain what you mean, cos I won't let this slip. Rewriting Igbo history and creating an Igbo boogeyman seem to be the favorite past time activity of Edoids and Ijoids.

Goodboiy:
Hi peeps.. I haven't create any new thread recently due to some reasons best known To me, Although I still Remain your loyal boy "Goodboiyy" . Below are some Igbo and Yoruba word used in Urhobo language.

1. Biko : Biko is an Igbo word for "Please" And it means same in Urhobo, in Urhobo you usually hear word like "Oghene' biko keme' Igho" Meaning "God please Give me money".

2. Olori : Olori is a Yoruba Word for Head .. in Urhobo it means the same thing..

3. Orgor' : Orgor' is an Igbo word for 'Inlaw'. It means the same thing in Urhobo.. for example I might say "Oniovo Orgor we' nkor " meaning 'brother how is Your Inlaw ".

4. Omo' : Omo'r is a Yoruba word for Child, It has same meaning in Urhobo.. I can make statement like " e' Freemanan Omo'r meh' … meaning "Freemanan is my Son"

5. Obara' : Obara is an Igbo word for blood.. It means Same In Urhobo.. Why The Igbo woman will shout "Obara Jesus" and Urhobo Woman will say "Oba'rah' Re' Jesu"

6. Jesu' : Jesu' is an Yoruba word for Jesus . its still the same in Urhobo

7. Ew'a : Ew'a is another Yoruba word for Beans and its thesame with Urhobo. Ew'a is pronounced in Urhobo exactly thesame with That of Yoruba

8. OBA : OBA is a Yoruba word for king , We still use it in Urhobo.. If we Want to Call God.. we say Oba' risi' meaning " King Of The Word"

9. Akpere : Is a Yoruba word for basket, it means the same Thing in Urhobo



Pls don't derail the thread. THANKS

@OP...Jesu, Omo and Oba are not Yoruba words. Jesu is derived from Jesus and cannot be considered Yoruba in anyway. Jesu is only a localized adaptation of the Jesus name in Christianity amongst Igbos and Yorubas. Jesus Christ is Jesu Kristi in Igbo as well.

Omo is common to Edo languages, Urhobo, Isoko, and Yoruba and cannot be said to be derived from Yoruba specifically.

As for Oba, I think you are looking for the origin far beyond where you should. Oba is a Bini/Edo word and NOT a Yoruba word. Ancient Yoruba kings were never addressed as Oba but were known by their various territorial titles such as alaafin of xyz, ajuwale of abc. We begin to see the appearance of Oba in Yoruba land after the Binis conquered Lagos and installed an Oba of Lagos (mind you this Oba was a Bini Oba, not a Yoruba Oba, ruling over Lagos) after which the usage of 'Oba' began to spread over Yoruba land.

You also forgot to include that 'igho' is similar to 'ego' in Igbo for money.

cheruv:
That means Sobo is an amalgam of Old Bini and medieval Igbo with the Bini been more in proportion.
Even though those words you claim are Yoruba, I believe they're Bini.
Moreover, Bini and Yoruba lingos based on my observation show an almost 75-85% correspondence.
Igbo is the only lingo of the YEAI family thats totally different from the others.

Bini is totally different from Yoruba in all respects and only shares a few similar words just as Igbo and Yoruba languages share similar words and meanings but are totally different languages from each other. A Yoruba speaker will not understand a Bini speaker and vice versa.

fratermathy:


I am DEFINITELY not angry. I always sound like this. I am a serious minded individual. Follow my threads and help yourself with proof.

As for Igbo words in Urhobo, there are also Yoruba, Igara and Ibibio words in Igbo. Do we now say that these languages are the progenitors of Igbo?

I have told you before that Igbo then was seen as a language of commerce and advantage and many Urhobo traders and travellers acquired the language and loaned Igbo words into English as much as Yoruba, Portuguese and English words were loaned. In fact, I believe Urhobo language is one of the few languages that borrow words without control. Everything can be translated into Urhobo by adding "i" before and after the said word. So it is not unique that Igbo words are in Urhobo. I even believe it is vice versa if a research on this is conducted.


Again, I am not angry. You should know by now that I love Igbos. I just like facts being sacronsanct.

Olomu and Evwereni are Urhobo clans with some Igbo ancestry. It does not hurt to admit the truth where it is necessary.

bigfrancis21:


@OP...Jesu, Omo and Oba are not Yoruba words. Jesu is derived from Jesus and cannot be considered Yoruba in anyway. Jesu is only a localized adaptation of the Jesus name in Christianity amongst Igbos and Yorubas. Jesus Christ is Jesu Kristi in Igbo as well.

Omo is common to Edo languages, Urhobo, Isoko, and Yoruba and cannot be said to be derived from Yoruba specifically.

As for Oba, I think you are looking for the origin far beyond where you should. Oba is a Bini/Edo word and NOT a Yoruba word. Ancient Yoruba kings were never addressed as Oba but were known by their various territorial titles such as alaafin of xyz, ajuwale of abc. We begin to see the appearance of Oba in Yoruba land after the Binis conquered Lagos and installed an Oba of Lagos (mind you this Oba was a Bini Oba, not a Yoruba Oba, ruling over Lagos) after which the usage of 'Oba' began to spread over Yoruba land.

You also forgot to include that 'igho' is similar to 'ego' in Igbo for money.

OBA is a Yoruba word I stand to be corrected.. The words I used above re pure Yoruba/Igbo.. Don't tell me another Thing because of the hatred you have for Yoruba.

Oba , Olu are both Yoruba.. even the bini's knows that.. just accept the truth for once.. as for as for the Igho/ego they sound different both in Spelling and pronunciation try comparing it with "Orgor" "biko" e.t.c

bigfrancis21:


Olomu and Evwereni are Urhobo clans with some Igbo ancestry. It does not hurt to admit the truth where it is necessary.

NO URHOBO CLAN HAS IGBO ANCESTRY … We re 100% Edo.. You better edit your post before other Urhobo sees it.. We re not connected to Igbo in any way

Goodboiy:


NO URHOBO CLAN HAS IGBO ANCESTRY … We re 100% Edo.. You better edit your post before other Urhobo sees it.. We re not connected to Igbo in any way

Documented evidence exists to prove this. If you are not going to agree to this, you come up with evidence to prove the clans do not. It is not enough to just make negative blanket statements without proof of evidence.

pazienza:
"Perhaps the influence was too weak to hold waters unlike the mass acculturation successfully carried out in Ukwuani and Ika"

Fratermarthy, what's the meaning of the bolded part of your post? Are you by any means suggesting that both Ukwuani and Ika were not originally Igbo speaking but became Igbo speaking via acculturation done by Ndiigbo?

Explain what you mean, cos I won't let this slip. Rewriting Igbo history and creating an Igbo boogeyman seem to be the favorite past time activity of Edoids and Ijoids.

Oga calm down. you like to wail every single Time.. Why re you Dragging Ijaw into this comment ?

Cc : Scholes0 your contributions needed pls.. Some people re trying to tell me something I already knew

Goodboiy:




OBA is a Yoruba word I stand to be corrected.. The words I used above re pure Yoruba/Igbo.. Don't tell me another Thing because of the hatred you have for Yoruba.

Oba , Olu are both Yoruba.. even the bini's knows that.. just accept the truth for once.. as for as for the Igho/ego they sound different both in Spelling and pronunciation try comparing it with "Orgor" "biko" e.t.c

You are clearly ignorant of Edo-Yoruba history. Just because Yorubas popularly use 'oba' does not mean it is of Yoruba origin. 'oba' is a bini word and not a Yoruba word. I know this sounds surprising to you to learn this but the word originates from the binis, not Yorubas. True bini people know this. I'm going to invite NigerMan1, a proud Eshan man, to school you on this.

I don't know what you mean by 'olu' being a Yoruba word. You have to give the meaning of that word you're referencing. 'olu' as a word exists in several african languages and means different things. In Igbo, 'olu' could mean 'neck', 'voice' or 'riverine people living close to the river/sea'.

Do not think you know it all. You have to keep an open mind to learning things that you don't know or correcting impressions that you thought were probably right before.

bigfrancis21:


Documented evidence exists to prove this. If you are not going to agree to this, you come up with evidence to prove the clans do not. It is not enough to just make negative blanket statements without proof of evidence.

Can I see the said Documented Proof ?..

Do you need proof to tell someone you re Igbo ?.. likewise us.. we don't need proof to tell you Our Origin.. I asked my mom regarding this olomu stuff and she said that There is nothing like that..

Goodboiy:


Oga calm down. you like to wail every single Time.. Why re you Dragging Ijaw into this comment ?

I believe he simply asked you for clarification, and I expect you to explain better the meaning of that phrase you gave because you seemed to be implying that the Ukwuanis and Ikas were not Igbo-speaking originally but Igbonized 'due to closeness to the Igbos'. The impression you're giving off on this thread is one of learning and knowledge, now further explain what you meant when you wrote that comment in bold.

Goodboiy:


Can I see the said Documented Proof ?..

Do you need proof to tell someone you re Igbo ?.. likewise us.. we don't need proof to tell you Our Origin.. I asked my mom regarding this olomu stuff and she said that There is nothing like that..

Your mom probably does not know, especially if she is not a historian.

I guess you wouldn't have an issue had the story been some Urhobos have Yoruba ancestry right?

Goodboiy:


Can I see the said Documented Proof ?..

Do you need proof to tell someone you re Igbo ?.. likewise us.. we don't need proof to tell you Our Origin.. I asked my mom regarding this olomu stuff and she said that There is nothing like that..

I believe Radoillo already provided you with evidence already. In case you missed it:

Radoillo:


I would suggest getting acquainted with the works of Professor Obaro Ikime, the most prominent historian of Isoko extraction. You could read his Niger Delta Rivalry based on his doctoral thesis. You could also read The Edo-Speaking Peoples by Bradbury, the anthropologist. It contains a section on the Urhobo and Isoko peoples.

To mention the Urhobo/Isoko groups that claim Igbo (or at least part-Igbo) origins, let me quote from Professor Ikime's chapter in the book The Groundwork of Nigerian History, chapter 5.

1. Olomu: "The Olomu traditions also indicate that as some point Igbo elements moved into the area and were assimilated into the population." [page 93].
Now, the Olomu clan had already been established by one Igboze from Benin. He was later joined by an Igbo whose name is given as Olomu and who came with a sizable group of followers. This Olomu succeeded Igboze as the Ovie. Olomu's ascension as the Ovie led to a split in the community, and those who would not accept his leadership seceded and established the Okpe clans. So Olomu clan is believed to be a mixture of Bini and Igbo elements. (This additional detail can be found in Ikime's Niger-Delta Rivalry.)

2. Evwreni: "The Urhobo clan of Evwreni is said to have been founded by Igbo elephant hunters hired in the first instance by the Isoko clan of Iyede." [page 93]

3., 4., and 5. Enwhe, Igbide, and Ume: "The Isoko clans of Enwhe, Igbide and Ume are said to be of Igbo origin, the founders having come from the Igbo country. Details of the migrations are rather scanty. Eru, the founder of Igbide is said to have stayed in Awka for some time before he moved off to the present Igbide clan." [page 93]

bigfrancis21:


You are clearly ignorant of Edo-Yoruba history. Just because Yorubas popularly use 'oba' does not mean it is of Yoruba origin. 'oba' is a bini word and not a Yoruba word. I know this sounds surprising to you to learn this but the word originates from the binis, not Yorubas. True bini people know this. I'm going to invite NigerMan, a proud Eshan man, to school you on this.

I don't know what you mean by 'olu' being a Yoruba word. You have to give the meaning of that word you're referencing. 'olu' as a word exists in several african languages and means different things. In Igbo, 'olu' could mean 'neck', 'voice' or 'riverine people living close to the river/sea'.
Do not think you know it all. You have to keep an open mind to learning things that you don't know or correcting impressions that you thought were probably right before.

What Binis originally called their titled kings was Ogiso, not Oba.
It was Oranmiyan that changed the title from Ogiso to the Yoruba words, Oba, & Omo n'Oba n'Edo, Crowned King of the Edos.
All kings in Yorubaland are known as Oba.

Also, Olu might exist in several African languages, but the Olu of Yoruba means "Lord", the only other Languages with similar connnotations of the word are Itsekiri (Olu), and Igala (Onu)


cc: Goodboiy