diordaves:


Hajji there is no market for fakes. Nobody will deliberately seek out to buy fake products. There is a market for top end product, middle range and bargain range. A product can still be bargain range and still be safe and serve the purpose. There are also branded products and generic products. The fact that it is a generic product and cheap doesn't mean its not safe to use.

The problem is passing off unsafe dangerous products for branded products and charging top end price in some cases. So the consumer is not to be blamed as the consumer is willing to pay accordingly thinking they are getting the real deal. Where the consumer pays lower or go bargain hunting, this doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake product but buying with trust that the product is a generic product which is expected to be cheaper. There is branded paracetamol and generic paracetamol. Generic paracetamol is cheaper, safe and serve the same purpose as the branded; so if the consumer goes in search for generic paracetamol doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake market.

Those importing unsafe products can as well import cheaper safe generic products and charge appropriately. It is the greed of importers that encourage fake market, not consumers. If the importers don't import fake products, I don't think the consumer will clamour for fake products, they will buy happily what's available in the market: genuine top range, middle range or safe generic as your power reach. This is the case in developed world.

EgunMogaji:

You've eloquently spoken my mind.
I'm glad that others see what I'm saying.

diordaves:


Hajji there is no market for fakes. Nobody will deliberately seek out to buy fake products. There is a market for top end product, middle range and bargain range. A product can still be bargain range and still be safe and serve the purpose. There are also branded products and generic products. The fact that it is a generic product and cheap doesn't mean its not safe to use.

The problem is passing off unsafe dangerous products for branded products and charging top end price in some cases. So the consumer is not to be blamed as the consumer is willing to pay accordingly thinking they are getting the real deal. Where the consumer pays lower or go bargain hunting, this doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake product but buying with trust that the product is a generic product which is expected to be cheaper. There is branded paracetamol and generic paracetamol. Generic paracetamol is cheaper, safe and serve the same purpose as the branded; so if the consumer goes in search for generic paracetamol doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake market.

Those importing unsafe products can as well import cheaper safe generic products and charge appropriately. It is the greed of importers that encourage fake market, not consumers. If the importers don't import fake products, I don't think the consumer will clamour for fake products, they will buy happily what's available in the market: genuine top range, middle range or safe generic as your power reach. This is the case in developed world.

allCopacetic:
Speaking on the proliferation of fake goods, the killing of brands and the absence of standards.

Because of our penchant for cheap things, the greed of sellers and the ignorance of consumers (and surprisingly some so-called professionals); Nigeria is a flourishing hub for counterfeiters.
We are arguably the largest market for counterfeited products in the world. The complicity of our supposed regulatory apparatus only adds salt to injury. Many big brands with a strong presence (even in smaller African countries) shy away from establishing a presence here for some of these reasons, and those who mange to do so are having a hell of a time doing it.

An example of a reputable electrical brand with a counterfeit problem in Nigeria is Havells; as expected their products are currently widely counterfeited. From changeovers, to distribution boards to switch fuse units etc.
They continue to fight this by changing moulds, designs, repackaging, adding stickers etc.


For Example;
The Below are pictures of the MCBs for Havells distribution Boards.

On the LEFT you have the Authentic (made in India) while on the RIGHT is a Counterfeit (imported from China)

If you purchased a Havells board somewhere around mid 2016 till date and your MCB looks like the one to the right, you were sold a fake.

Do sufficient due diligence Always, exercise care Always, shop wisely.

Daboomb:


I am just wondering whether this is correct or it is a mistake:
I checked the website of one of the major distributors of this HAVELLS product in Nigeria (Somotex) and the picture of the same product they have on their website, is OPPOSITE to that which you called the original.

The picture they have is the "Havells" Logo in Red color, on a white background (which is exactly what you called the fake).
(See attached picture below).

In Nigeria, we all know that it is the norm to sell the Fake as the original, even sold at higher prices just to fool the buyer who has no idea fo what to expect (we all cant be a guru on every little item!).

Can you please clear the air on this observation.

diordaves:


Hajji there is no market for fakes. Nobody will deliberately seek out to buy fake products. There is a market for top end product, middle range and bargain range. A product can still be bargain range and still be safe and serve the purpose. There are also branded products and generic products. The fact that it is a generic product and cheap doesn't mean its not safe to use.

The problem is passing off unsafe dangerous products for branded products and charging top end price in some cases. So the consumer is not to be blamed as the consumer is willing to pay accordingly thinking they are getting the real deal. Where the consumer pays lower or go bargain hunting, this doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake product but buying with trust that the product is a generic product which is expected to be cheaper. There is branded paracetamol and generic paracetamol. Generic paracetamol is cheaper, safe and serve the same purpose as the branded; so if the consumer goes in search for generic paracetamol doesn't mean the consumer is encouraging fake market.

Those importing unsafe products can as well import cheaper safe generic products and charge appropriately. It is the greed of importers that encourage fake market, not consumers. If the importers don't import fake products, I don't think the consumer will clamour for fake products, they will buy happily what's available in the market: genuine top range, middle range or safe generic as your power reach. This is the case in developed world.

Daboomb:


I must thank you for this post!
I have been pondering whether to react to what some are saying here but being that l dont sugar-coat words and l am not given to hypocrisy, l restrained myself with the hope that someone else will take up the gauntlet!

I dont know how to describe it but for someone to say that "Consumers intentionally buy sub-standard/fake products, simply because it is cheaper", is a reflection of our criminally-minded orientation.
Such mentality as we have seen, can only be supported by people who are UNPRINCIPLED and SYCOPHANTIC by their very sheer nature.

Basically, what that person or seller is saying is that: You came to me with x-amount of money, to purchase a "product Y" but because your money is not enough to purchase the GENUINE "product Y", instead of telling you the truth and asking you to go back and add to your money, he thinks "in his mind",: I will still collect the amount-X from this buyer but will give him something that l will claim "will still do the job" when in all honesty, l know it is counterfeit, will not do the job and might even turn out to be dangerous to the buyer and others within his sphere of influence!
In short, the product the consumer is finally given is NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE!
Only GREED makes anyone to have such mentality!

Let me say it here: No consumer intentionally buys a fake product.
if you want to "prove" me wrong, just offer the Fake and the original to the consumer, identify them clearly and let him know that "both" go for the same price. LET US NOW SEE WHICH ONE THE CONSUMER WILL PICK.

Obviously, the consumer will pick the original.
This therefore means that "if a consumer buys a fake product, knowing that it is fake", the determining factor, is the PRICE-DIFFERENCE.
So, what we have is scenario where the dubious seller, price-low the fake product, to serve as an incentive for the consumer to pick that, while inflating the price of the original, to serve as a dis-incentive for the "poor" consumer, not to buy such.

The underlying psychology of such 'sellers' is to play on the level of poverty within Nigeria and the lack of enforcement of criminal laws, as it relates to "counterfeiting" of goods and services.

No consumer will intentionally and knowing so, buy a fake product but some are forced to buy it, because they have no option as they are constrained financially, by the dubious seller who has inflated the price fo the original beyond their reach.

In countries where they operate fairly towards each other, their is a 'base-price' for all products, the price is not determined by whether it is "fake or genuine". It is always genuine!.
It could only be cheaper as you have mentioned, when it is GENERIC, but it is still and GENUINE as the proprietary one (those who price based on brand-name).

Why cant these sellers and their apologists, insist that they would not import or manufacture Counterfeit products and will not sell same?
It is now left for the buyer to stump up the price for what is available?

Until the govt starts treating manufacturers, importers and sellers of these Counterfeit products as economic saboteurs and slamming them in jail, for upwards of twenty years, we will kepp killing our people on this alter of GREED.
Its nothing but GREED.

allCopacetic:

Well first off, somotex is local , by local i mean operates here. And like most local companies, not many bother with updating small details on thier site.

Secondly there is a reason why I specifically mentioned​ a time range... Mid 2016 till date... The image you have as the fake used to be the series that came with havells distribution boards, but with the proliferation of counterfeits they switched to the Euro II Series , and in addition to that had to specifically start to put the "Havells Nigeria" sticker on the side of the MCBs ( as seen in the first picture) as an extra measure.

You should Visit the manufacturer's site (Havells India) not somotex.

http://www.havells.com/en/consumer/switchgear/circuit-breaker/miniature-circuit-breaker.html

That is why everything is not by looking or picture. .

EgunMogaji:


Another damn well written post. You guys are good.

It took a lot for me to respond yesterday and I didn't quote OP just because I did not want to irk certain folks of respect. em go say Egun don come with him wahala again.

We should stop and never blame consumers.

Daboomb:


I must thank you for this post!
I have been pondering whether to react to what some are saying here but being that l dont sugar-coat words and l am not given to hypocrisy, l restrained myself with the hope that someone else will take up the gauntlet!

I dont know how to describe it but for someone to say that "Consumers intentionally buy sub-standard/fake products, simply because it is cheaper", is a reflection of our criminally-minded orientation.
Such mentality as we have seen, can only be supported by people who are UNPRINCIPLED and SYCOPHANTIC by their very sheer nature.

Basically, what that person or seller is saying is that: You came to me with x-amount of money, to purchase a "product Y" but because your money is not enough to purchase the GENUINE "product Y", instead of telling you the truth and asking you to go back and add to your money, he thinks "in his mind",: I will still collect the amount-X from this buyer but will give him something that l will claim "will still do the job" when in all honesty, l know it is counterfeit, will not do the job and might even turn out to be dangerous to the buyer and others within his sphere of influence!
In short, the product the consumer is finally given is NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE!
Only GREED makes anyone to have such mentality!

Let me say it here: No consumer intentionally buys a fake product.
if you want to "prove" me wrong, just offer the Fake and the original to the consumer, identify them clearly and let him know that "both" go for the same price. LET US NOW SEE WHICH ONE THE CONSUMER WILL PICK.

Obviously, the consumer will pick the original.
This therefore means that "if a consumer buys a fake product, knowing that it is fake", the determining factor, is the PRICE-DIFFERENCE.
So, what we have is scenario where the dubious seller, price-low the fake product, to serve as an incentive for the consumer to pick that, while inflating the price of the original, to serve as a dis-incentive for the "poor" consumer, not to buy such.

The underlying psychology of such 'sellers' is to play on the level of poverty within Nigeria and the lack of enforcement of criminal laws, as it relates to "counterfeiting" of goods and services.

No consumer will intentionally and knowing so, buy a fake product but some are forced to buy it, because they have no option as they are constrained financially, by the dubious seller who has inflated the price fo the original beyond their reach.

In countries where they operate fairly towards each other, their is a 'base-price' for all products, the price is not determined by whether it is "fake or genuine". It is always genuine!.
It could only be cheaper as you have mentioned, when it is GENERIC, but it is still and GENUINE as the proprietary one (those who price based on brand-name).

Why cant these sellers and their apologists, insist that they would not import or manufacture Counterfeit products and will not sell same?
It is now left for the buyer to stump up the price for what is available?

Until the govt starts treating manufacturers, importers and sellers of these Counterfeit products as economic saboteurs and slamming them in jail, for upwards of twenty years, we will kepp killing our people on this alter of GREED.
Its nothing but GREED.

Slim101:
Morning Elders, anyone knows any Aluminium factory in Ibadan? And probably current prices for:
1) Long span local
2)Long Span imported
3) Step tile local & imported
4) 8ft Alu-zinc.

I just finished carcass and I need to hit market for Aluminium covering this week.
Prompt responses will be appreciated.

Slim101:
Morning Elders, anyone knows any Aluminium factory in Ibadan? And probably current prices for:
1) Long span local
2)Long Span imported
3) Step tile local & imported
4) 8ft Alu-zinc.

I just finished carcass and I need to hit market for Aluminium covering this week.
Prompt responses will be appreciated.

EgunMogaji:
An analogy that I would like to use in our ongoing discussion.

"Generic Drugs, Are They as Good as Brand Names?

Generic drugs are copies of brand-name drugs that have exactly the same dosage, intended use, effects, side effects, route of administration, risks, safety, and strength as the original drug. In other words, their pharmacological effects are exactly the same as those of their brand-name counterparts.

.......

Many people become concerned because generic drugs are often substantially cheaper than the brand-name versions. They wonder if the quality and effectiveness have been compromised to make the less expensive products. The FDA (U.S. Food and Drug Administration) requires that generic drugs be as safe and effective as brand-name drugs."

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=46204&page=1

So, just because a consumer is looking for lower prices doesn't mean that he deserves to be saddled with unsafe products.

I'm just happy that i wasn't left hanging alone in the breeze

allCopacetic:

EgunMogaji:

Oh no the well is a poor mans septic/soakaway for the padlock garage. Kobokobo build you know
I'm doing a bore hole later but I have to save up since my survey indicates 100 meters

phlakkeys:


I've tried all I could to get information on using ring concrete for soakaway and only your post came out useful.
Due to small space left, we've decided to go for ring concrete soakaway.
Pls sir, 1) how many rings did you use(depth)?
2) Did you dig in 2places i.e. one for septic tank and the other for soakaway? If not
3) Does it mean you make street gutter to drain kitchen and bath water?

jossy26:
@Oga EgunMogaji, is this ty of suckaway suitable for water logged area too? Please can you shed more light or share the link I can get the resources so I share with my engineer. Thanks

EgunMogaji:

I collect all my kitchen and bath water as I'm told that village people might collect it and use it for voodoo

mufutau55:


You no go kill persin with laugh o. Vooodooo

Hajji M.

EgunMogaji:

Baba, na you elders talk say "igboran o san ju ebo riru lo"

jossy26:
@Oga EgunMogaji, is this ty of suckaway suitable for water logged area too? Please can you shed more light or share the link I can get the resources so I share with my engineer. Thanks

EgunMogaji:

Glad that you found my post useful.
Trust me, many on here do in fact use that method but they don't have the confidence to post it.
My builder wanted to use one hole but I opted to mimic the 2 hole system and that is what I did.
I think that the BQ has 7 and 5 rings and the gateman house has 3 and 2 rings. I added one ring more than recommended.
No water, except rain water (a lot of which will be collected by rain gutters into storage tanks) goes to the street. I collect all my kitchen and bath water as I'm told that village people might collect it and use it for voodoo

phlakkeys:


Am really grateful for your quick response.
Sir, should I conclude that 2 hole system (7rings & 5rings) will be enough for a family of 5?
If yes, is it the 7 rings that will be for septic and 5 rings for soakaway?
Also, should I dig a rectangle and put the 2 rings side by side or I should dig the 2 holes differently with about 1m space?
I won't mind if pictures can be attached sir.

Am sorry I don't have anyone to ask for details and we plan to start digging this weekend.

Marpol:
Pls where can I get a good door lock to buy in Lagos?

EgunMogaji:


What does your bricklayer/builder recommend?

The 7 is for the septic and the 5 for soakaway and we're a family of three not counting very occasional guests.

I would truly recommend that you engage locals with experiecne in your area.