Perfectbeing:


If a lot needs to be done by a believer then Jesus shouldn't have died in the first place. We'd have just needed to do the "lot" of things to be saved. It is pride and not humility that will make someone think he needs to do "a lot of things" to get himself saved or to remain saved. The bible tells us in Romans 8 that nothing, "of this age or the age to come" can separate us from the love of God.

This is why some people will cry out on that day "Lord Lord, I did so so and so in your name. I gave to the poor, I kept the commandments, I didn't steal, kill, commit adultery, I always attended church, I even healed the sick in your name, I raised the dead in your name." But Jesus will reply that he doesn't know them. He isn't lying. He actually never knew them cos they never really believed in his redemptive work. They, like Cain thought that they could please God with their toil, with their sweat.. with their good works.. They never believed that only the cross could save them..

James taught about the works of faith. But what we don't realise is that he was talking about the works that man could see. Works of faith is the proof that man needs to see in you to make them believe you're a believer. The only proof God needs is the seal of salvation. Which you get when you believe.

Let's take a look at the thief on the cross. He only needed to believe in Christ and he was saved. He didn't need to do "good works" . He only need BELIEVE.

Why would they need to see the work in you?

alBHAGDADI:
Both verses still don't say your not sinning is what saves you. They encourage us not to sin, but salvation is not of our works.

The first says "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" and Romans 12 says that you should not be conformed with the world

You just want to discard both passages with your fixed saved by grace alone chant? Why do we strive to be different then? Jesus said unless your righteousness exceed the righteousness of the pharisees you will in no wise.......in the book of Hebrew we were told about holiness without which no man shall see the Lord there are too many verses that negetes your theory of once save you're forever saved. Man you need to really review this view of yours


Shalom

rhektor:

Why would they need to see the work in you?

Let your light so shine before men that.... Complete it..

rhektor:


The first says "work out your salvation with fear and trembling" and Romans 12 says that you should not be conformed with the world

You just want to discard both passages with your fixed saved by grace alone chant? Why do we strive to be different then? Jesus said unless your righteousness exceed the righteousness of the pharisees you will in no wise.......in the book of Hebrew we were told about holiness without which no man shall see the Lord there are too many verses that negetes your theory of once save you're forever saved. Man you need to really review this view of yours


Shalom

Yes Jesus said our righteousness must exceed the righteousness of the Pharisees quite all right. But have you wondered how righteous this Pharisees were? These are sets of people that know the laws of God by heart. And they follow it to the uttermost. They tithe, they give to the poor. They fast, they pray, they don't worship idols, they don't use the name of God in vain, they don't steal, they don't fornicate or commit adultery, they don't covet their neighbours properties. In fact they obey the 10 commandments and the 613 mosaic laws (you can see them in Leviticus). If it's about being righteous, the Pharisees where righteous to the core. But Jesus said our righteousness must exceed theirs. Why? Cos even in all their righteousness they were still unrighteous in that they haven't believed in him. When you believe in Jesus, then and only then can your righteous exceed the pharisees'...

Have you wondered the set of people that criticized and killed Jesus? It wasn't the tax collectors or the adulterous, or the prostitutes. It wasn't the sinners. It was the pharisees. The people who deemed themselves righteous. Righteous by the law. They are the ones that ended up killing Jesus.

Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The fruits are of two kinds. The knowledge of good and the knowledge of evil. Both were deadly. The fruit of the knowledge of good was equally as deadly as that of evil. And if you ask me, I'll say the fruit of good was more deadly. Why? Cos it is more deceptive. It is this good part of the fruit that was "pleasing" to the eyes of Eve. It was it that was more deceptive. It is the good part that will make someone think he doesn't need the tree of life (Christ) to be like God. Like Eve the Pharisees think that by keeping the law (the tree of knowledge of good and bad) they don't need Christ (the tree of life) to please God.

The same mistake Adam and Eve and the pharisees made is the same mistake many of us. are making today.

Look up to Jesus the author and finisher of your faith.

Perfectbeing:


Yes Jesus said our righteousness must exceed the righteousness of the Pharisees quite all right. But have you wondered how righteous this Pharisees were? These are sets of people that know the laws of God by heart. And they follow it to the uttermost. They tithe, they give to the poor. They fast, they pray, they don't worship idols, they don't use the name of God in vain, they don't steal, they don't fornicate or commit adultery, they don't covet their neighbours properties. In fact they obey the 10 commandments and the 613 mosaic laws (you can see them in Leviticus). If it's about being righteous, the Pharisees where righteous to the core. But Jesus said our righteousness must exceed theirs. Why? Cos even in all their righteousness they were still unrighteous in that they haven't believed in him. When you believe in Jesus, then and only then can your righteous exceed the pharisees'...

Have you wondered the set of people that criticized and killed Jesus? It wasn't the tax collectors or the adulterous, or the prostitutes. It wasn't the sinners. It was the pharisees. The people who deemed themselves righteous. Righteous by the law. They are the ones that ended up killing Jesus.

Your assertion here appeals to common sense however its not an acceptable explanation for the passages you're trying to wound into your story of once saved forever saved.
For your righteousness to exceed that of the pharisee you must be a doer of the word of God, that is acting, talking and comporting yourself in accordance with the word of God not just that people think that you are doing it but that you really are doing it the right way.
Why would it be the religious leaders that crucified Jesus? Simple, he was always bursting their myths whatever they were hiding from people he made it known he set the record straight people have been holding them in high esteem he came and told the people these pharisees that you have been thinking are doing the right things are only deceiving you they've been doing the wrong things in secrete. I am still waiting for you to talk about those verses I posted earlier even though the question was not directed to you however, since you took it upon yourself to respond to it please do ASAP
Someone even said here that shine your light I put it to the person to tell us how he's going to shone his light?
Would every believer begin to go about with flashlight like Zack Adzee lols ? No
It by how you live your life the see the attributes of God in you

I am waiting for you to tell me how you're not going to conform to the world, how you will show your works of faith, how you work out your salvation with fear and trembling, how you will be perfect as your heavenly father, how you will strive to enter (according to Jesus Luke 13:24) etc the list is just endless

Perfectbeing:
Adam and Eve ate from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The fruits are of two kinds. The knowledge of good and the knowledge of evil. Both were deadly. The fruit of the knowledge of good was equally as deadly as that of evil. And if you ask me, I'll say the fruit of good was more deadly. Why? Cos it is more deceptive. It is this good part of the fruit that was "pleasing" to the eyes of Eve. It was it that was more deceptive. It is the good part that will make someone think he doesn't need the tree of life (Christ) to be like God. Like Eve the Pharisees think that by keeping the law (the tree of knowledge of good and bad) they don't need Christ (the tree of life) to please God.

The same mistake Adam and Eve and the pharisees made is the same mistake many of us. are making today.

Look up to Jesus the author and finisher of your faith.

Looking up to him does not mean that we would do nothing Jesus himself said that we should "strive to enter because the way is narrow" Luke 13:24. Ponder over this, salvation is free but keeping your salvation is at a price and you can loose it. Denmas lost his own, Judas lost his own too so bro I will compel you to strive strive strive to enter. Why do think Paul was begging the Romans congregation to present their bodies as a living sacrifice in Romans 12:1? Bro looking unto Jesus does not mean you should shouldn't work out your salvation by your own actions it simply means that you should act like Jesus, you should follow hiss steps. Always ask yourself this question before every of your actions "what would Jesus do"
May the peace of the Lord be with you

My brother, a lot are happening today than happened in bible days. If you can put together all the supernatural occurrences and miracles and divine visitations all over the world among believers it surpasses what you have in the bible many times.

But the question is what are own personal experiences with the holy spirit and Jesus christ?

rhektor:


Your assertion here appeals to common sense however its not an acceptable explanation for the passages you're trying to wound into your story of once saved forever saved.
For your righteousness to exceed that of the pharisee you must be a doer of the word of God, that is acting, talking and comporting yourself in accordance with the word of God not just that people think that you are doing it but that you really are doing it the right way.
Why would it be the religious leaders that crucified Jesus? Simple, he was always bursting their myths whatever they were hiding from people he made it known he set the record straight people have been holding them in high esteem he came and told the people these pharisees that you have been thinking are doing the right things are only deceiving you they've been doing the wrong things in secrete. I am still waiting for you to talk about those verses I posted earlier even though the question was not directed to you however, since you took it upon yourself to respond to it please do ASAP
Someone even said here that shine your light I put it to the person to tell us how he's going to shone his light?
Would every believer begin to go about with flashlight like Zack Adzee lols ? No
It by how you live your life the see the attributes of God in you

I am waiting for you to tell me how you're not going to conform to the world, how you will show your works of faith, how you work out your salvation with fear and trembling, how you will be perfect as your heavenly father, how you will strive to enter (according to Jesus Luke 13:24) etc the list is just endless

The law (the 10 commandments) was powerless to make us right with God because of our sinful nature (Heb . It isnt to say the law was not perfect. Everything God does is perfect. So is the law. But we just couldn't handle the law because of our flesh was too weak. The law was too fault-finding. We had to keep every commandment to the end. If we break just one, we would be guilty of breaking all of them (James 2:10). Keeping the 10 commandments could look easy to us. Isn't it just to serve God, worship God, not bow to any other gods, not to dishonour your parents, not to murder, commit adultery, or fornication, not to steal, lie, covet our neighbors property etc. It looks easy right? But trust me it isn't. When you think you haven't committed adultery but you look at that pretty girl that just walked past you lustfully, you just committed adultery. When you think you haven't lie but you tell one white lie in the office or you tell a lie to save a friend you just broke the 6th commandment. When you think you honour your parents but you just called Buhari a fool and an idiot, you've dishonored your parents, when you think you've never murdered someone in your entire life but you call your brother a fool, the law will label you guilty of murder. When you think you haven't coveted your neighbor's property but you look at Davido's Lamborghini and you say in your mind "I wish that car is mine", you've just coveted. When you think you've never served any other God but instead of going to church on Sunday you had to be in your workplace, the law finds you guilty of idol worship.
The law deems almost anything you do as a man sin. Obeying the law could never have made us perfect of righteous.

The law was powerless in making the Pharisees righteous hence the statement of Jesus.

The pharisees obeyed the law but Jesus still said our righteousness must exceed theirs to be saved. The righteousness of obeying the law, of good works can never make us holy, righteous or perfect.

So what God did was to make things easy for us was send his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering (the same Heb . So he fulfilled the law for us. So once we believe in him we have kept and fulfilled all the laws of God to the end.


But then you might ask, "perfectbeing, are you now saying that if someone believes in Jesus and he steals or murder someone, are you saying he's still in right standing with God?" You might want to quote Romans 6:1. But let me ask you something first, did you see me write to in anywhere that you should go and steal since you've believed and no longer under the law? Go and steal or kill if you like. You'll know whether the police is your friend or not.
That's not what I'm saying. When you believe your sinful nature is been replaced with the nature of Christ. Romans 6:1 says... Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? What was the reply in vs 2? "God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"
Impossible. Believers can no longer live in sin because the nature of sin is dead and buried. But it is still possible for for us believers to fall into sin (not live in sin) sometimes because even though our nature is changed, we still live in this weak body of ours. Our minds still needs to be regenerated. That can only happen when we keep reading and meditating on God's word daily.

Striving for perfection and Holiness isn't possible with good works. Perfection is attained the moment a believer believes in Christ once and forever. Christ is the righteousness of God. And only when you believe in him will you be made holy or righteous or perfect before God once and forever. God doesn't see the believer anymore. He only sees Christ in the believer. And only in Christ is God pleased with. Not good works or morals... Only Christ..

If you believe that you will go to heaven after dying on a LovePeddler, simply because you are a child of God,

Then you need to go back to the Bible and start reading from the book of Genesis...

Beware of the doctrines of the devils.

Without holiness, no man shall see the Lord.

Jesus said that unless our righteousness exceeds that of the Pharisees.. we shall not enter into the kingdom of God..

The Pharisees professes to know the law, but they acted against it.

They were hypocrites and no righteousness was found in them.

The only thing they always shouted was THE LAW OF MOSES ..

If You always profess Jesus, and you don't see the reason why you should live the kind of life

he lived,

Then you are a Pharisee...and your righteousness is the same with theirs....You will not enter into the kingdom of God.


Not everyone that call me Lord Lord will enter into the kingdom of God...

they called him Lord, but do iniquity.. They will have no part in him.

The first thing the holy spirit does in the life of man is to make him run from sin...

This is what the law cannot achieve... That is why apostle Paul condemned the law...but anchored Christianity on grace...

grace is the holy spirit, that is given to man, which enables man to do the will of God.

Stop preaching heresies.

Jesus is Lord.

rhektor:


Looking up to him does not mean that we would do nothing Jesus himself said that we should "strive to enter because the way is narrow" Luke 13:24. Ponder over this, salvation is free but keeping your salvation is at a price and you can loose it. Denmas lost his own, Judas lost his own too so bro I will compel you to strive strive strive to enter. Why do think Paul was begging the Romans congregation to present their bodies as a living sacrifice in Romans 12:1? Bro looking unto Jesus does not mean you should shouldn't work out your salvation by your own actions it simply means that you should act like Jesus, you should follow hiss steps. Always ask yourself this question before every of your actions "what would Jesus do"
May the peace of the Lord be with you

Salvation being eternal life cannot be lost. If someone could lose eternal life then it wasn't eternal in the first place.

Judas didn't loose his salvation. He wasn't saved in the first placed. The 12 disciples weren't saved prior to Jesus death because Jesus had not yet shed his blood which was the requirement for salvation.

Denmas fell into sin didn't mean he lost his salvation. Not one verse in the Bible ever tells us that salvation could be lost.

Originakalokalo:


If you believe that you will go to heaven after dying on a LovePeddler, simply because you are a child of God,

Then you need to go back to the Bible and start reading from the book of Genesis...

Beware of the doctrines of the devils.

Without holiness, no man shall see the Lord.

Jesus said that unless our righteousness exceeds that of the Pharisees.. we shall not enter into the kingdom of God..

The Pharisees professes to know the law, but they acted against it.

They were hypocrites and no righteousness was found in them.

The only thing they always shouted was THE LAW OF MOSES ..

If You always profess Jesus, and you don't see the reason why you should live the kind of life

he lived,

Then you are a Pharisee...and your righteousness is the same with theirs....You will not enter into the kingdom of God.


Not everyone that call me Lord Lord will enter into the kingdom of God...

they called him Lord, but do iniquity.. They will have no part in him.

The first thing the holy spirit does in the life of man is to make him run from sin...

This is what the law cannot achieve... That is why apostle Paul condemned the law...but anchored Christianity on grace...

grace is the holy spirit, that is given to man, which enables man to do the will of God.

Stop preaching heresies.

Jesus is Lord.

I'm sure you didn't read my post from the beginning to the end.

Can you tell me one instance the pharisee did something that was against the law?

Without holiness no man can see God. What are the requirements for attaining holiness?
Didn't the law condemned fornication and adultery too? Didn't the law condemned immorality? You keep talking about living right, did the law demand wrong living? Didn't the law asked us to give to the poor and needy? Didn't the law asked us to honour our elders? Wasn't the law against idol worship? Why then was the old covenant replaced with the new? Why then was the pharisee still unrighteous even after obeying the law? Why then was Jesus blood still needed to get someone saved?

If you abstain from fornication and immoral acts and you give to the poor and you do not believe in the redemptive power of the blood of Christ, you'd die and make hell.

This is what we preach. We don't preach "believe in Jesus and sin you'll make heaven" as you people claim we do. It is your pride and sin consciousness that make you take our preaching that way.

Without holiness no man can see God. Living right can't and won't make you holy. Believing in Christ remains the only way one can attain holiness. This is what we preach...
Jesus is lord!

Perfectbeing:


I'm sure you didn't read my post from the beginning to the end.

Can you tell me one instance the pharisee did something that was against the law?

Without holiness no man can see God. What are the requirements for attaining holiness?
Didn't the law condemned fornication and adultery too? Didn't the law condemned immorality? You keep talking about living right, did the law demand wrong living? Didn't the law asked us to give to the poor and needy? Didn't the law asked us to honour our elders? Wasn't the law against idol worship? Why then was the old covenant replaced with the new? Why then was the pharisee still unrighteous even after obeying the law? Why then was Jesus blood still needed to get someone saved?

If you abstain from fornication and immoral acts and you give to the poor and you do not believe in the redemptive power of the blood of Christ, you'd die and make hell.

This is what we preach. We don't preach "believe in Jesus and sin you'll make heaven" as you people claim we do. It is your pride and sin consciousness that make you take our preaching that way.

Without holiness no man can see God. Living right can't and won't make you holy. Believing in Christ remains the only way one can attain holiness. This is what we preach...
Jesus is lord!

You asked me to show you one instance where the Pharisee break the law...

I will give you 7.

1. This is a statement from the Pharisee...

(John 11 )
------------
47 Then gathered the chief priests and the Pharisees a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many miracles.

48 If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation.


see verse 53:

" Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death."
(John 11: 53)


The idea to kill Jesus is born out of the fact that he did many miracles and PEOPLE WILL BELIEVE IN HIM....


Don't forget that they knew that NO ONE could do those miracles except God is with him.

That is envy, and hypocrisy.

2. Jesus healed a man born blind..The man told them this:

"If this man were not from God, he could do nothing


This is the reply of the Pharisees:

."9:34To this they replied, "You were steeped in sin at birth; how dare you lecture us!" And they threw him out.


3. Look at Nicodemus's statement to the Pharisees...

(John 7 )
------------
51 Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?

If they know the law, why not practice it?

4. A woman was caught in adultery... and they brought the man to Jesus to tempt him...

If the woman was caught in the ACT of adultery.. WHERE WAS THE MAN?

What does their law say about anyone caught in adultery?

5. " And the scribes and Pharisees watched him, whether he would heal on the sabbath day;

that they might find an accusation against him."
(Luke 6: 7)


This was when Jesus was about to heal a man with withered hand...

Does the law of Moses oppose healing on sabath day? all what they were looking for was ACCUSATIONS.

6 This is Jesus to the Pharisee

" But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God:

these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. "
(Luke 11: 42)

They could pay tithes of anything... but they omit weightier matters of LAW, MERCY, FAITH AND LOVE...

who omits any of these and still claim righteousness?

7. This is another character of the Pharisee from THE CREATOR HIMSELF:

" Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them."
(Luke 11: 44)


I am surprised that you could ask this question.

if you claim that the Pharisee obeyed the law with all these,

Then you call Jesus statement to question

and call the Alpha and Omega a liar.


Beware of what you say. Unknowingly, you may err.

Jesus is Lord.

Originakalokalo:



You asked me to show you one instance where the Pharisee break the law...

I will give you 7.

1. This is a statement from the Pharisee...

(John 11 )
------------
47 Then gathered the chief priests and the Pharisees a council, and said, What do we? for this man doeth many miracles.

48 If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation.


see verse 53:

" Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death."
(John 11: 53)


The idea to kill Jesus is born out of the fact that he did many miracles and PEOPLE WILL BELIEVE IN HIM....


Don't forget that they knew that NO ONE could do those miracles except God is with him.

That is envy, and hypocrisy.

2. Jesus healed a man born blind..The man told them this:

"If this man were not from God, he could do nothing


This is the reply of the Pharisees:

."9:34To this they replied, "You were steeped in sin at birth; how dare you lecture us!" And they threw him out.


3. Look at Nicodemus's statement to the Pharisees...

(John 7 )
------------
51 Doth our law judge any man, before it hear him, and know what he doeth?

If they know the law, why not practice it?

4. A woman was caught in adultery... and they brought the man to Jesus to tempt him...

If the woman was caught in the ACT of adultery.. WHERE WAS THE MAN?

What does their law say about anyone caught in adultery?

5. " And the scribes and Pharisees watched him, whether he would heal on the sabbath day;

that they might find an accusation against him."
(Luke 6: 7)


This was when Jesus was about to heal a man with withered hand...

Does the law of Moses oppose healing on sabath day? all what they were looking for was ACCUSATIONS.

6 This is Jesus to the Pharisee

" But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God:

these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. "
(Luke 11: 42)

They could pay tithes of anything... but they omit weightier matters of LAW, MERCY, FAITH AND LOVE...

who omits any of these and still claim righteousness?

7. This is another character of the Pharisee from THE CREATOR HIMSELF:

" Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them."
(Luke 11: 44)


I am surprised that you could ask this question.

if you claim that the Pharisee obeyed the law with all these,

Then you call Jesus statement to question

and call the Alpha and Omega a liar.


Beware of what you say. Unknowingly, you may err.

Jesus is Lord.

You still don't get it do you?

The pharisees brought a woman to Jesus to tempt him. The law clearly states that anyone caught in adultery was to be put to death. The woman was caught in the very act of adultery and the law demands her death. The fact they didn't bring the
man too was wrong but it still doesn't changes the fact that the woman was to die according to the law.

Now they brought only the woman. Their intent was to put him in a corner. If he had said they should leave her, the Pharisee would have said he was disobeying the law. They'd probably had showed him the exact scripture that says the woman was to be put to death. On the other hand if Jesus had said the woman was to die, they'd have jumped up and clap their hands. They'd have said Jesus didn't practice the forgiveness he preaches.. They'd have won.

But the thing that they didn't know was that Jesus was the author of the law and he couldn't be put in a corner by it. So what Jesus did was to make that infamous statement, "let him that is without sin cast the first stone." And guess what happened?it was the oldest that left first. The ones that are supposed to be without sin that left first. Guess why? Cos even though they kept the law they still didn't see themselves as sinless. The fault finding law still found fault with them.

The law forbade the Jews to do any work on Sabbath day. Even insignificant work like gathering manna on Sabbath day was frowned upon by the law.

In Luke 6, Jesus and his disciples went into the cornfields to pluck corns to eat on the sabbath. The pharisees came to accuse Jesus of breaking the law. Jesus didn't just say what he did was lawful. They'd have held is words against him if he did. instead he reminded them of when David ate food that wasn't lawful for him to eat.

In verse 6, Jesus healed a man with a withered hand on a Sabbath day. The Pharisees again accused him of breaking the law. Jesus didn't argue with them on whether he was doing something lawful or not. They'd have held his statement against him. He simply asked them if it was lawful to do good or bad on the Sabbath day. They couldn't answer him.

The pharisees tried to push Jesus to a corner with his statements. They'd have had some points against Jesus if he had answered them directly...


I'm sure you might not get my points. But I'm sure if read well you'll notice I'm trying to make points the obeying the law cannot and will not save you..

You quoted Nicodemus question to the Pharisees. But I tell you, if Nicodemus didn't believe in Jesus he'd have died and he'd have gone to hell even though he wasn't like the rest of the Pharisees. He too needed Jesus to be made perfect. Obeying the law doesn't make one Holy. Only Christ is capable of making one Holy..

Perfectbeing:


You still don't get it do you?

The pharisees brought a woman to Jesus to tempt him. The law clearly states that anyone caught in adultery was to be put to death. The woman was caught in the very act of adultery and the law demands her death. The fact they didn't bring the
man too was wrong but it still doesn't changes the fact that the woman was to die according to the law.

Now they brought only the woman. Their intent was to put him in a corner. If he had said they should leave her, the Pharisee would have said he was disobeying the law. They'd probably had showed him the exact scripture that says the woman was to be put to death. On the other hand if Jesus had said the woman was to die, they'd have jumped up and clap their hands. They'd have said Jesus didn't practice the forgiveness he preaches.. They'd have won.

But the thing that they didn't know was that Jesus was the author of the law and he couldn't be put in a corner by it. So what Jesus did was to make that infamous statement, "let him that is without sin cast the first stone." And guess what happened?it was the oldest that left first. The ones that are supposed to be without sin that left first. Guess why? Cos even though they kept the law they still didn't see themselves as sinless. The fault finding law still found fault with them.

The law forbade the Jews to do any work on Sabbath day. Even insignificant work like gathering manna on Sabbath day was frowned upon by the law.

In Luke 6, Jesus and his disciples went into the cornfields to pluck corns to eat on the sabbath. The pharisees came to accuse Jesus of breaking the law. Jesus didn't just say what he did was lawful. They'd have held is words against him if he did. instead he reminded them of when David ate food that wasn't lawful for him to eat.

In verse 6, Jesus healed a man with a withered hand on a Sabbath day. The Pharisees again accused him of breaking the law. Jesus didn't argue with them on whether he was doing something lawful or not. They'd have held his statement against him. He simply asked them if it was lawful to do good or bad on the Sabbath day. They couldn't answer him.

The pharisees tried to push Jesus to a corner with his statements. They'd have had some points against Jesus if he had answered them directly...


I'm sure you might not get my points. But I'm sure if read well you'll notice I'm trying to make points the obeying the law cannot and will not save you..

You quoted Nicodemus question to the Pharisees. But I tell you, if Nicodemus didn't believe in Jesus he'd have died and he'd have gone to hell even though he wasn't like the rest of the Pharisees. He too needed Jesus to be made perfect. Obeying the law doesn't make one Holy. Only Christ is capable of making one Holy..

I get your points... You asked me to give you a place where the Pharisee acted against the law...

And from this reply of yours, You are trying to justify the Pharisee.. despite these statements from Jesus:

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them."
(Luke 11: 44)


But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God:
these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. "
(Luke 11: 42)


They could pay tithes of anything... but they omit weightier matters of LAW, MERCY, FAITH AND LOVE...
They were not righteous, they were not justified.

So, when Jesus said that unless our righteousness is more than that of a Pharisee, we will not enter the kingdom of God..

He is talking about professing love for him and not doing his will...

God bless you.

Perfectbeing:


The law (the 10 commandments) was powerless to make us right with God because of our sinful nature (Heb . It isnt to say the law was not perfect. Everything God does is perfect. So is the law. But we just couldn't handle the law because of our flesh was too weak. The law was too fault-finding. We had to keep every commandment to the end. If we break just one, we would be guilty of breaking all of them (James 2:10). Keeping the 10 commandments could look easy to us. Isn't it just to serve God, worship God, not bow to any other gods, not to dishonour your parents, not to murder, commit adultery, or fornication, not to steal, lie, covet our neighbors property etc. It looks easy right? But trust me it isn't. When you think you haven't committed adultery but you look at that pretty girl that just walked past you lustfully, you just committed adultery. When you think you haven't lie but you tell one white lie in the office or you tell a lie to save a friend you just broke the 6th commandment. When you think you honour your parents but you just called Buhari a fool and an idiot, you've dishonored your parents, when you think you've never murdered someone in your entire life but you call your brother a fool, the law will label you guilty of murder. When you think you haven't coveted your neighbor's property but you look at Davido's Lamborghini and you say in your mind "I wish that car is mine", you've just coveted. When you think you've never served any other God but instead of going to church on Sunday you had to be in your workplace, the law finds you guilty of idol worship.
The law deems almost anything you do as a man sin. Obeying the law could never have made us perfect of righteous.

The law was powerless in making the Pharisees righteous hence the statement of Jesus.

The pharisees obeyed the law but Jesus still said our righteousness must exceed theirs to be saved. The righteousness of obeying the law, of good works can never make us holy, righteous or perfect.

So what God did was to make things easy for us was send his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh to be a sin offering (the same Heb . So he fulfilled the law for us. So once we believe in him we have kept and fulfilled all the laws of God to the end.


But then you might ask, "perfectbeing, are you now saying that if someone believes in Jesus and he steals or murder someone, are you saying he's still in right standing with God?" You might want to quote Romans 6:1. But let me ask you something first, did you see me write to in anywhere that you should go and steal since you've believed and no longer under the law? Go and steal or kill if you like. You'll know whether the police is your friend or not.
That's not what I'm saying. When you believe your sinful nature is been replaced with the nature of Christ. Romans 6:1 says... Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? What was the reply in vs 2? "God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?"
Impossible. Believers can no longer live in sin because the nature of sin is dead and buried. But it is still possible for for us believers to fall into sin (not live in sin) sometimes because even though our nature is changed, we still live in this weak body of ours. Our minds still needs to be regenerated. That can only happen when we keep reading and meditating on God's word daily.

Striving for perfection and Holiness isn't possible with good works. Perfection is attained the moment a believer believes in Christ once and forever. Christ is the righteousness of God. And only when you believe in him will you be made holy or righteous or perfect before God once and forever. God doesn't see the believer anymore. He only sees Christ in the believer. And only in Christ is God pleased with. Not good works or morals... Only Christ..

This your long epistle did not address any of this questions that I asked you just running around a circle its called the crazy circle because where you start from is where you end up at. Please read my earlier comment which you quoted and address it sir
Shalom

Perfectbeing:


Salvation being eternal life cannot be lost. If someone could lose eternal life then it wasn't eternal in the first place.

Judas didn't loose his salvation. He wasn't saved in the first placed. The 12 disciples weren't saved prior to Jesus death because Jesus had not yet shed his blood which was the requirement for salvation.

Denmas fell into sin didn't mean he lost his salvation. Not one verse in the Bible ever tells us that salvation could be lost.

Salvation can not be lost? What are trying to put up here man? If this is true Jesus would not have told John in revelation 3 to warn the Severn churches in Asia. Brother, you must strive to enter, STRIVE TO ENTER us not my own coinage it is not my own word but that of Jesus himself. It is not the word of Paul neither is it that of Peter. It is not what I was told by my pastor or a prophet unless you do not believe in Jesus, or probably you do not believe the truth of the Bible then you may provide us with how you come about your salvation message
Peace of the Lord be with you

Originakalokalo:



I get your points... You asked me to give you a place where the Pharisee acted against the law...

And from this reply of yours, You are trying to justify the Pharisee.. despite these statements from Jesus:

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them."
(Luke 11: 44)


But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God:
these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. "
(Luke 11: 42)


They could pay tithes of anything... but they omit weightier matters of LAW, MERCY, FAITH AND LOVE...
They were not righteous, they were not justified.

So, when Jesus said that unless our righteousness is more than that of a Pharisee, we will not enter the kingdom of God..

He is talking about professing love for him and not doing his will...

God bless you.

I wasn't trying to justify them. The law justified them.

Paul kept the law when he persecuted the church. He was so zealous in keeping the law.

Phil 3:6; I was so zealous that I harshly persecuted the church. And as for righteousness, I obeyed the law without fault.
The law justified his acts.


He obeyed the law without fault yet he still counted it as loss to Christ.
Verse 7; But whatever were gains to me I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

Paul was a pharisee before his conversion. He considered the righteousness of the law garbage. The only righteousness God wants from us is that of faith in Jesus.

Originakalokalo:



I get your points... You asked me to give you a place where the Pharisee acted against the law...

And from this reply of yours, You are trying to justify the Pharisee.. despite these statements from Jesus:

Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are as graves which appear not, and the men that walk over them are not aware of them."
(Luke 11: 44)


But woe unto you, Pharisees! for ye tithe mint and rue and all manner of herbs, and pass over judgment and the love of God:
these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. "
(Luke 11: 42)


They could pay tithes of anything... but they omit weightier matters of LAW, MERCY, FAITH AND LOVE...
They were not righteous, they were not justified.

So, when Jesus said that unless our righteousness is more than that of a Pharisee, we will not enter the kingdom of God..

He is talking about professing love for him and not doing his will...

God bless you.

I wasn't trying to justify them. The law justified them.

Paul kept the law when he persecuted the church. He was so zealous in keeping the law.

Phil 3:6; I was so zealous that I harshly persecuted the church. And as for righteousness, I obeyed the law without fault.
The law justified his acts.


He obeyed the law without fault yet he still counted it as loss to Christ.
Verse 7; But whatever were gains to me I now consider loss for the sake of Christ. What is more, I consider everything a loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord, for whose sake I have lost all things. I consider them garbage, that I may gain Christ and be found in him, not having a righteousness of my own that comes from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ—the righteousness that comes from God on the basis of faith.

Paul was a pharisee before his conversion. He considered the righteousness of the law garbage. The only righteousness God wants from us is that of faith in Jesus. Yet we know that a person is made right with God by faith in Jesus Christ, not by obeying the law.

Gal 2:16; And we have believed in Christ Jesus, so that we might be made right with God because of our faith in Christ, not because we have obeyed the law. For no one will ever be made right with God by obeying the law."

Even if the pharisee had obeyed the weightier matters of the law, they still wouldn't have been in right standing with God.

rhektor:


Salvation can not be lost? What are trying to put up here man? If this is true Jesus would not have told John in revelation 3 to warn the Severn churches in Asia. Brother, you must strive to enter, STRIVE TO ENTER us not my own coinage it is not my own word but that of Jesus himself. It is not the word of Paul neither is it that of Peter. It is not what I was told by my pastor or a prophet unless you do not believe in Jesus, or probably you do not believe the truth of the Bible then you may provide us with how you come about your salvation message
Peace of the Lord be with you

“For He Himself has said, ‘I will never leave you nor forsake you.’ Hebrews 13:5.

This is an unconditional statement made by Jesus. It is without any terms and conditions.

“I will never leave you…”— not for any reason; not my sin, selfishness, stubbornness, nor waywardness.

It has never been about me but about Him. Never about my actions but about his Love. His unconditional love for me..

I'd like to share this video. 
So it is with some many pastors
YouTube

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVG1x-rh6FE

Salvation for us is as simple as accepting what God has already accepted -the death of Jesus as payment in full for all our sins. Jesus’ death in our place as our substitute, satisfied the justice of God. Salvation is as simple as swapping your sins for God's righteousness. He takes your sins - you take His righteousness. You become Holy and perfect in his eyes.

Perfectbeing:


“For He Himself has said, ‘I will never leave you nor forsake you.’ Hebrews 13:5.

This is an unconditional statement made by Jesus. It is without any terms and conditions.

“I will never leave you…”— not for any reason; not my sin, selfishness, stubbornness, nor waywardness.

It has never been about me but about Him. Never about my actions but about his Love. His unconditional love for me..

But why did he say STRIVE TO ENTER? This statement alone negates everything you wrote here. Remember in one of your comments you quoted Paul in his letter to the Romans "shall we continue in sin and say grace should abound? Certainly not" so going by this you have your role to play. Jesus also said that "every word that men speak they will account for on the day of judgement Mathew 12:37. I put it to you that if words would be judged then actions would be judged too. Bro stop deceiving yourself and others here we all are responsible for whatever we do here on earth. Jesus offers us salvation freely but we must act in accordance with all his terms which includes holy living. Living a holy life is a painstaking effort it takes a lot of discipline to live rightly because we are still human but it can be achieved. God is a merciful God yes but we must always remember that this same God is the God of justice.
Shalom

rhektor:


But why did he say STRIVE TO ENTER? This statement alone negates everything you wrote here. Remember in one of your comments you quoted Paul in his letter to the Romans "shall we continue in sin and say grace should abound? Certainly not" so going by this you have your role to play. Jesus also said that "every word that men speak they will account for on the day of judgement Mathew 12:37. I put it to you that if words would be judged then actions would be judged too. Bro stop deceiving yourself and others here we all are responsible for whatever we do here on earth. Jesus offers us salvation freely but we must act in accordance with all his terms which includes holy living. Living a holy life is a painstaking effort it takes a lot of discipline to live rightly because we are still human but it can be achieved. God is a merciful God yes but we must always remember that this same God is the God of justice.
Shalom

In my comment about Paul's letter "shall we continue in sin.." did you read it to the end to get what I was saying?

Now let me ask you something. Be honest. Have you been living a holy and perfect life since you got saved?

Perfectbeing:


In my comment about Paul's letter "shall we continue in sin.." did you read it to the end to get what I was saying?

Now let me ask you something. Be honest. Have you been living a holy and perfect life since you got saved?

This is not about me but what Jesus said stop shifting goal post

rhektor:

This is not about me but what Jesus said stop shifting goal post

Answer the question Sir

Perfectbeing:


Answer the question Sir

I will answer your questions this way
1 corinthians 9:27 But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified.
Phillipians 3:12-14
Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

With the above passes you should know that I am working towards perfection that's me now you can continue in your sin and fool yourself that Jesus will safe you because he had died on the cross sorry Bro it doesn't work that way, you have your role to play

rhektor:
I will answer your questions this way
1 corinthians 9:27 But I discipline my body and bring it into subjection, lest, when I have preached to others, I myself should become disqualified.
Phillipians 3:12-14
Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

With the above passes you should know that I am working towards perfection that's me now you can continue in your sin and fool yourself that Jesus will safe you because he had died on the cross sorry Bro it doesn't work that way, you have your role to play

Since you claimed you haven't attained perfection yet it means you aren't holy yet. Remember without holiness no man can see God. So for now you're in danger of hell if rapture should come right now.

So tell me this.. At what point do a believer become perfect?

I stand by this and will continue to stand by it..
A believer do not strive to become righteous or Holy. A believer is made and declared righteous the moment he/she believes.

I stand by this and will continue to stand by it..
A believer do not strive to become righteous or Holy. A believer is made and declared righteous the moment he/she believes.

Perfectbeing:
I stand by this and will continue to stand by it..

A believer do not strive to become righteous or Holy.
A believer is made and declared righteous the moment he/she believes.

What of someone who profess Christ denies Jesus later ?

as an apostate?

Christians who just believed and was swept away by things of this world..

and denied Christ?

Does once saved always saved theory apply here?

if a case like this happens, what makes him fall away?..

God?

or he did not work out his salvation with fear and trembling?

I know someone who couldn't walk but was healed at Synagogue church. Since then till now he's back in Warri and is walking perfectly. I now Emmanueltv daily and I see God performing great and mighty miracles in our time. Jesus lives, he never said goodbye.

Brock1:



All thes are not answers! Show me where it is happening, not heresays or jus by answering dat it is happening. Dats not an answer, dats beclouding answers. Backup ur responses wit reasonable answers