In my own opinion, believing in afterlife is irrational. There is no evidence of such thing as heaven or hell, humans have always desire to live forever and enjoy the good things of life, one of the reasons the afterlife delusion was created.

mcemmy0z:
If there is afterlife that means we've lived in other life before this, why can't we remember, why do we forget about this. Is not even an issue, we are in a state of Forgetiveness
As a Yoruba guy, I was brought up in believing in things list this, heaven, hell, after life, demon, etc.
We believed that people do come back to this world, maybe that's the after life, why do we have to forget this memory.
Many do have dreams about thier past life, If this is not real why the dreams?
I was told some people came back to life, I knew some of them, and I study them and compare them to what I heard about their behaviours In that formal life, same thing with what they are doing now.. Why is it so.
Our after life is here, here on earth, we are made up of energy, and we all know energy can never be destroyed but change from one form to another.
There are lot of secrets in this world of ours, if you pay attention you will see some.

lives
Exactly what I was about to talk about: reincarnation! I've read of children dat cld remember their former lives. D most recent is a Syrian boy; he rememberS his former name, d name of his killer etc when confronted she cldnt'

johnydon22:


why?

Because there is no substantial and cogent evidence to corroborate such claims. Religious adherents who believe strongly in an afterlife do so on the basis of blind faith. Faith does not PROVE anything..

If there be an afterlife, is there also a pre-life?

Frenchkisss:


Because there is no substantial and cogent evidence to corroborate such claims. Religious adherents who believe strongly in an afterlife do so on the basis of blind faith. Faith does not PROVE anything..

If there be an afterlife, is there also a pre-life?

Everyone - atheists and theists - exercises faith .

https://www.nairaland.com/3202814/why-faith-good

Is it rational to claim that what millions of people of various religious backgrounds (including some atheists), scientists and others of sound academic background across the globe have confessed to have experienced as real over the years is hallucination?

CHARLOE:
Exactly what I was about to talk about: reincarnation! I've read of children dat cld remember their former lives.

Under which condition(s) do you think reincarnation can be possibly achievable. . .

- E.G: If the exact same genes are arranged in the exact same order [ same former consciousness is born]

- or exact same atoms are rearranged intricately in the exact same form and order..


I want to know your thoughts on how reincarnation is achievable.

D most recent is a Syrian boy; he rememberS his former name,

There are very many weird psychological misfires - example is a man who hit his head on a hard surface and immediately became a master pianist.

He never knew or learnt how to play a piano before...

Acquired savants . . . Can it also be possible that someone remembering what he wasn't is still another psychological misfire ?

d name of his killer etc when confronted she cldnt'

why couldn't she?

KingEbukasBlog:


Everyone - atheists and theists - exercises faith .

https://www.nairaland.com/3202814/why-faith-good

This doesn't necessary matter - what ever someone holds on to by Faith Atheist/theist or what ever tag there is still means same thing.

that held on to by faith is only because it is uncertain and require exercision of conviction none the less

Frenchkisss:


Because there is no substantial and cogent evidence to corroborate such claims. Religious adherents who believe strongly in an afterlife do so on the basis of blind faith. Faith does not PROVE anything..

If there be an afterlife, is there also a pre-life?

I agree on the basis of faith not being proof for anything - it only means you believe such a thing whether it is true or not.

So in essence to you - anything held on to by faith is irrational?

kingkaspa:
In my own opinion, believing in afterlife is irrational. There is no evidence of such thing as heaven or hell, humans have always desire to live forever and enjoy the good things of life, one of the reasons the afterlife delusion was created.

If man had the desire to live forever to enjoy there wouldn't be a place of torment . There are other concepts of afterlife where there is total destruction of the soul - annihilationism .

honourhim:
Is it rational to claim that what millions of people of various religious backgrounds (including some atheists), scientists and others of sound academic background across the globe have confessed to have experienced as real over the years is hallucination?

True . I even forgot that some atheists believe in afterlife .

cc: ifenes , immortal

Oya appear !

johnydon22:


Just blare your mind - the ground is open to all

I could say, if it is not irrational to try to know how far we've come and actually traced something, I don't see how it's irrational to belief we changed forms? That will surely create another argument.

The big bang, space time, blue green algae, the Spi worms, the Archaean era, the Proterozoic, Paleozoic, Meso and Cenozoic Eras. That's if this orders I think I know is even true in the first place.

If we didn't appear instantly in this form and consider trancing our transmutation to this form rational how then can a belief in another transmutation be irrational? That's how I see it.

Reyginus:
I could say, if it is not irrational to try to know how far we've come and actually traced something, I don't see how it's irrational to belief we changed forms? That will surely create another argument.

The big bang, space time, blue green algae, the Spi worms, the Archaean era, the Proterozoic, Paleozoic, Meso and Cenozoic Eras. That's if this orders I think I know is even true in the first place.

If we didn't appear instantly in this form and consider trancing our transmutation to this form rational how then can another tracing to our transmutation to another form irrational?

Oh very good direction your argument is based - so in this 'afterlife' is just another phase of our evolution?

@ johnydon22. It would be wrong for me to make presumptuous claims. I must say that I do not know. Even neurosurgeons are working on a way to preserve human memory in a chip. In that way, they could resurrect the dead according to them.

I am really yet to see a good point here supporting the rationality afterlife except for Regynius brilliant approach - anyway let me raise one myself from the fundamental premise held on to by the proposing side during our live debate.

For morality to make sense then there must be afterlife..

How so?

Lets hear more ideas

Seun:
Inasmuch as there is no evidence whatsoever for the existence of an afterlife, it's certainly irrational to believe in it. Near death experiences are just hallucinations. The belief in an afterlife is driven by our reluctance to accept our mortality. Instead of worrying about what happens after death, focus on prolonging your life as much as possible and doing the things you love most. A bird in your hand is worth plenty in the bush.

When it comes to things like this our own intelligence will fail us, there is life after death never wait till death closes ur eyes before u know the reality.

lordnicklaus:
@ johnydon22. It would be wrong for me to make presumptuous claims. I must say that I do not know. Even neurosurgeons are working on a way to preserve human memory in a chip. In that way, they could resurrect the dead according to them.

That would be replicating the biological wiring of a neurological network in a mechanical system.

That if it happens will i think put to rest once and for all and confirm that "thought [consciousness]" is a product of matter...

johnydon22:


This doesn't necessary matter - what ever someone holds on to by Faith Atheist/theist or what ever tag there is still means same thing.

that held on to by faith is only because it is uncertain and require exercision of conviction none the less

Your atheistic views about the existence of the universe and its purpose are convictions since its based on your perception of reality . See ? Its the same with the theist and deist . Our convictions are drawn from our perceptions . That's why I'm strongly against imposing one views on another or pejoratively criticizing another's views .

Gluthatione:

When it comes to things like this our own intelligence will fail us, there is life after death never wait till death closes ur eyes before u know the reality.

since our intelligence fails us when it comes to things like this, how then did you manage to ascertain that there is such a thing?

It doesn't require intelligence but you as an intelligent being somehow happen to know - is this rather a case of subtituting 'gut feelings' 'personal convictions' 'hope' 'emotions' and 'what we feel or want to be' with what actually might be?

KingEbukasBlog:


True . I even forgot that some atheists believe in afterlife .

cc: ifenes , immortal

Oya appear !

What is your question?

ifenes:


What is your question?

Explain your view of the afterlife and let's see if it is rational or not .

KingEbukasBlog:


Your atheistic views about the existence of the universe and its purpose are convictions since its based on your perception of reality . See ? Its the same with the theist and deist . Our convictions are drawn from our perceptions . That's why I'm strongly against imposing one views on another or pejoratively criticizing another's views .

I think it takes less faith to say "lets find out and know" it doesn't actually require faith because certainty derived through empirical probe has left the confines of speculations or belief and are within the horizones of FACT.

I hold a scientific view of the universe and that is 'lets not believe, lets find out'… … so every iota of scientific speculations are treated as such even thesis with evidences pointing towards are also touched with shivering hands of possible errors.

johnydon22:


Oh very good direction your argument is based - so in this 'afterlife' is just another phase of our evolution?

Afterlife? Does evolution really exist? What about this:

If our law of thermodynamics is correct then I don't think it would even be fair to say we ever began to exist. We are all molecules and vitamins simply taking different shape at different intervals.

We(energy) have always been. Can it be called Evolution or Energy Cycle? Are humans their bodies? And our bodies are what? If not then what? I don't know if I can help you.

When we say humans what do we mean? Surely this afterlife, this transformation of energy, will not produce a human form. If so, are we not still existing but in different form?

johnydon22:


I think it takes less faith to say "lets find out and know" it doesn't actually require faith because certainty derived through empirical probe has left the confines of speculations or belief and are within the horizones of FACT.

I hold a scientific view of the universe and that is 'lets not believe, lets find out'… … so every iota of scientific speculations are treated as such even thesis with evidences pointing towards are also touched with shivering hands of possible errors.

"Let's not believe , lets find out " and you became an atheist What's now the rationale behind that ? You should be an agnostic if you cleave unto such principle .

Reyginus:
Afterlife? Does evolution really exist? What about this:

If our law of thermodynamics is correct then I don't think it would even be fair to say we ever began to exist. We are all molecules and vitamins simply taking different shape at different intervals.

We(energy) have always been. Can it be called Evolution or Energy Cycle? Are humans their bodies? And our bodies are what? If not then what? I don't know if I can help you.

Probably the word "evolution" is one of the most misunderstood word in human language.

'Evolution' in a basic definition is 'Change, modification, developmeny' . . It is evident that nature is ever changing in order words ever evolving.

You are basically creating more problems than help - i think the bolded we can also go deeper on. In another thread maybe?

When we say humans what do we mean? Surely this afterlife, this transformation of energy, will not produce a human form. If so, are we not still existing but in different form?

If you severe thought from human form, then if you take away this human form in what way will this 'thought' be?

Reyginus:
Afterlife? Does evolution really exist? What about this:

If our law of thermodynamics is correct then I don't think it would even be fair to say we ever began to exist. We are all molecules and vitamins simply taking different shape at different intervals.

We(energy) have always been. Can it be called Evolution or Energy Cycle? Are humans their bodies? And our bodies are what? If not then what? I don't know if I can help you.

When we say humans what do we mean? Surely this afterlife, this transformation of energy, will not produce a human form. If so, are we not still existing but in different form?

Looks like you support reincarnation

KingEbukasBlog:


"Let's not believe , lets find out " and you became an atheist What's now the rationale behind that ? You should be an agnostic if you cleave unto such principle .

I have repeated it times without number: I am an agnostic atheist.

I do not believe any claim of God(s) abound due to lack of substantial empirical evidence - this makes me an atheist.
[Lack of belief ] as my quote states lets not believe… therefore i do not believe hence the label atheist.

Atheist it's not something you become asin in the case of religious affiliation - as long as you lack belief in the eventuality of Gods (what ever your reason may be) you are an atheist.

I also recognize the inconclusiveness and uncertainty [unknown] in holding an absolute approach towards such subject [unrestricted possibilities] - that makes me agnostic...

Agnosticism is still diluted atheism - because for someone to agree to agnosticism it is already obvious such a person does not buy the ideas of deities already in place [which is basically the position of atheism]…

I think Agnosticism is a tag used by mild atheists who are unable to agree or find the tag 'atheist' too strong or straight to bear..

More like a subtle or soft presentation of atheism

KingEbukasBlog:


Explain your view of the afterlife and let's see if it is rational or not .

I think I may have discussed this with you before. The Afterlife is not really a correct experience since everything is happening in the Now. To explain the term Afterlife( which is in a lane man's language),you will have to look at it in relationship to space and time, which are both illusions. Because we cannot experience a different point of view of our real self in a timeless state ,the illusion of space and Time was created, which is what you and I are experiencing now.

The past and future are illusions. Afterlife falls in the category of the illusion of the future, so in reality it doesn't exist. But if you say it does exist you are right because you are looking at it from the surface. But dive in deeper, it is a mere illusion of time.

Reyginus:
Does evolution really exist?

Nice question. I'm still wondering why evolution [as it is taught] suddenly decided to pause the moment cameras were invented for us to keep pictorial records of organisms evolving. But I digress

johnydon22 I posted on the first page of this topic sha, you probably didn't see it cos I booked space then replied late. I've posted my answer on the belief being rational and the reason for my answer

Strawman:


Nice question. I'm still wondering why evolution [as it is taught] suddenly decided to pause the moment cameras were invented for us to keep pictorial records of organisms evolving. But I digress

johnydon22 I posted on the first page of this topic sha, you probably didn't see it cos I booked space then replied late. I've posted my answer on the belief being rational and the reason for my answer

Oooh alright i just hope it's not too long [lol] , i will go check it out

johnydon22:
Probably the word "evolution" is one of the most misunderstood word in human language.

'Evolution' in a basic definition is 'Change, modification, developmeny' . . It is evident that nature is ever changing in order words ever evolving.

You are basically creating more problems than help - i think the bolded we can also go deeper on. In another thread maybe?



If you severe thought from human form, then if you take away this human form in what way will this 'thought' be?

Can we then say a Foetus is not a Human life or a human? I mean a zygote

KingEbukasBlog:


Looks like you support reincarnation

Not at all. I don't know what is really real anymore. I know the person called me thinks. That's all. Maybe he thinks he thinks.

ifenes:


I think I may have discussed this with you before. The Afterlife is not really a correct experience since everything is happening in the Now. To explain the term Afterlife( which is in a lane man's language),you will have to look at it in relationship to space and time, which are both illusions. Because we cannot experience a different point of view of our real self in a timeless state ,the illusion of space and Time was created, which is what you and I are experiencing now.

The past and future are illusions. Afterlife falls in the category of the illusion of the future, so in reality it doesn't exist. But if you say it does exist you are right because you are looking at it from the surface. But dive in deeper, it's is a mere illusion of time.

Could you break it down a bit?