^^^^

Mere Assumption, hehehe, informal sector that can't be ascertained is being grouped under the 70% mark? i pity your likes.

Got no more stuffs to type on this issue.

IF dem like, make dem say na 90% live on less than $0.5 a day, as long as these same people are not dying of starvation, i am good to go!

[/quote][quote author=honeric01 link=topic=507378.msg6702385#msg6702385 date=1283707328]
So in your long sermon, you are trying to say 70% of Nigerians live below $1 a day? hehehehe, you are joking, when last were you in Nigeria? when you came to Nigeria, where did you reside? did you for once go to the markets? do you know how much food stuffs cost? the slowest soup you can cook for a family of 2 is nothing less than -N-500 (excluding what you are to eat the soup with).

Well most rural dwellers would hardly dream of wasting N500 to make a pot of soup when they are perfectly capable of sourcing their own fruit and vegetable requirements. What is more fruits and vegetables are much cheaper in the villages so I don't know what your point is.

Sagamite:

E leyi o de poju o.

Ki lo ma wa so ni pa e leyi:

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-503928.0.html#msg6648868

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-504283.96.html#msg6673980

Mo ni passionate hate for morons. Ki eyan ma ti er le lo opolo er fun isheju kan ko to so'oro.

Awon lo ma ba aiye yi je.

To ba gbo nipe  awon Alakori kan pa'ara won, ni tori awon morons ni.

To ba gbo pe omugor olopa kan naa obirin ni hoho abi gbe omode kan si erwon nitori pe won wa baba e, nitori pe olopa yen je slowpoke ni.

To gba gbo nipe alakori politician kan ti won elect ko gbo gbo owo je, ni to ri pe awon morons lo vote fun.

Awon morons ba aiye je fun wa.

Morons ma nfun mi ni High Blood Pressure. Mo hate slowpoke gaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan!

https://www.nairaland.com/nigeria/topic-496295.64.html#msg6568340

ROTFLMAO!!!!!

tensor777:

Once again you are going into abstract generic issues that are neither here nor there. The question is how do you increase investment in education and training per head whilst  the economy is still dependent on finite natural resources and the population continues to increase.

Already this population increase has caused rampant deforestation, species depletion and consequent erosion in the southern parts of the country. In other words the much-trumpeted natural resources are not presently being used in an environmentally sustainable fashion.

do you really understand the concept you are discussing? are you saying population is the cause?
you need to invest in infrastructure and stop blaming population. is there aforestation in britain? and france? are you here to talk about species depletion? what depletion? how many species are they protecting in europe?
human needs supercede that of any specie. are you an animal right campaigner?
once again, it is not about population. it is about people of nigeria being organised and having maintenance culture. it is about responsible and responsive leadership.
if i may ask you, what is the population of equitorial guinea? are they ok despite their relatively small masses? are they better off than china that has over a billion?

productivity is the key.
reduce nigeria's population by a third and there would still be decay and ineptitude all around you.

you will invest in education when you stop being corupt.

you guys have stopped discussing corruption. it is now population control. abi?
are you kidding?
utilize what you have got and stop blaming population.
nigeria is not densely populated

ola olabiy:

you guys have stopped discussing corruption. it is now population control. abi?
are you kidding?
utilize what you have got and stop blaming population.
nigeria is not densely populated

No one was talking about population density - it is the failure of economic growth to match population increase that is anticipated to cause severe social problems.

tensor777:

Well most rural dwellers would hardly dream of wasting N500 to make a pot of soup when they are perfectly capable of sourcing their own fruit and vegetable requirements. What is more fruits and vegetables are much cheaper in the villages so I don't know what your point is.

Anyways, back to the topic, we can keep beating about the bush, population is not our problem, the problem solely lies with not knowing what to do with population.

honeric01:

Anyways, back to the topic, we can keep beating about the bush, population is not our problem, the problem solely lies with not knowing what to do with population.

Again, you miss the point - unless we solve the economic problems and lack of commensurate growth, the population WILL become a problem.

debosky:

No one was talking about population density - it is the failure of economic growth to match population increase that is anticipated to cause severe social problems.

do you expect any economic growth where people don't pay taxes? where people's resources get by plundered politician? where there is no honesty in any transaction? where you can't call on the law when wronged?
nigerians always expect miracles.
it is a garbage-in-garbage-out thing.
a country prospers where there is a well-articulated plan fronted by public-oriented government.

a society/country is what you make of it. it operates like a robot.
so guys make nigeria WORK.
all the issues you guys raised are purely economic. not population-related.
they can discuss population vis-a-vis land in japan, in china, and in the netherlands. these countries simply have none left.
you only discuss populaton where land, which is fixed in supply becomes inadequate. this is not the issue with nigeria.

simple economics, guys.

debosky:

Again, you miss the point - unless we solve the economic problems and lack of commensurate growth, the population WILL become a problem.

That lies with the government, it's not about how many we are, its about what we do with it i maintain, what we need is an environment where the population'll show off their capacity.

You were the one that mentioned that Nigeria has abundant natural resources. So what is the point of having these resources if as a result of population pressures they are not being used in a sustainable way. In such a scenario rural based activities like farming, fishing,and hunting would be adversely affected.

ola olabiy:


is there deforestation in britain? and france? are you here to talk about species depletion? what depletion? how many species are they protecting in europe?

You are forgetting that countries like England and France have highly industrialized economies with agriculture forming a very negligible proportion of GDP. Consequently most of their population do not have to live off the land so to say. In rural Africa on the other hand environmental issues can have immediate life and death consequences.

ola olabiy:



if i may ask you, what is the population of Equitorial Guinea? are they ok despite their relatively small masses? are they better off than china that has over a billion?

Actually Equatorial Guinea has relatively high per capita income precisely because they have a small population and China had already formulated and implemented their one child policy BEFORE their rapid economic growth.

tensor, tensor, how many times did i call you?
please, go and pick up your economics textbook, ASAP.

so we should control our population in order to help fishing profession? are you joking?
so britain is industrialized? why can't you industrialize nigeria?

also, your understanding of macro economics appears warped.
per capita income is nothing these days. it reflects nothing. al least not standard of living.
you can use may be PPP ( it only corrects it a bit) to understand a bit about standard of living trough per capita income.
the whole wealth of equitorial guinea is concentrated in the hands of few politicians.
do i need to refer you to an edition of the economist magazine?
please, forget par capita income

ola olabiy:

you are right about the uk being well-planned, saga.
the issue with nigeria is not population, it is about productivity.
the percentage that is not productive in nigeria is too high.
and, illeteracy is also very high.

You are right about productivity being the core.

The reality is that Nigeria is not some exceptionally blessed country like we like to bleeth about so frequently.

Yes, we have natural resources and do not lack but we are like most other blessed country not some exception.

Now if we look at our natural resources and look at the population it has to cater for, it is slightly diluted. That is why Kuwait can pay each of its citizen £35K a year as they have the same or more oil than us but a miniscule population unlike us.

The reality is that, even if Nigeria generates full throttle efficiency, we will only be able to match the South American countries' people's lifestyle.

To cater for our already huge population will require some ingenuity and cutting edge environment which takes decades to build or brutal focused leadership. Talk less of increasing the population ridiculously.

Nigeria can not even stop fuel scarcity at the moment, so forget cutting edge environment in the near future.

^^^^^^^^^
now you are talking.
nigeria is a poor country made poorer by its leaders. FACT.
WITHOUT A BIT OF RADICALISM, THINGS WOULD not CHANGE.
the government has to lead.
population is not an/the issue.
very simple!

honeric01:

So in your long sermon, you are trying to say 70% of Nigerians live below $1 a day? hehehehe, you are joking, when last were you in Nigeria? when you came to Nigeria, where did you reside? did you for once go to the markets? do you know how much food stuffs cost? the slowest soup you can cook for a family of 2 is nothing less than -N-500 (excluding what you are to eat the soup with).

I have used 2 independently verifiable data - Nigeria's estimated GDP and population - to arrive at my conclusion. You are using incoherent conjecture to arrive at yours. Please define ''a family of 2''.

I visit Anambra State and now that I think of it, the claim that the average person lives on less than $1 a day makes perfect sense. To use an anecdote, when someone heard that our driver in Awka(counts as urban in Nigeria) is paid 14000 Naira per month, they were astounded as they thought it was far above the norm. If you extrapolate from income figures in rural areas, presuming you actually visit rural areas, such low incomes are not far-fetched. Invariably, living costs are far lower but with that comes low income. I have a friend who works in Lafia(urban by Naija metrics) and his perception is that most of the adult working population survives on 10 to 15k per person.  

The average Nigerian, forget Lagos and all the other cities that warp your perspective of life in Nigeria, living in huge swathes of the South and the North, in rural  areas and small towns, do survive on around 150Naira a day. Nigeria's Govt, not the British, tells us that the average Nigerian does not even have access to electricity. I'm not aware that the Nigerian Govt disagrees with the claim that 70% of Nigerians live on less than $1 a day. You seem more intent on painting a glorified image of Nigeria than the PDP and the rest of our thieving political class.

I see that a lot of people are running away from the primary issue which is population growth. If today the amount invested per head in education and training of the youths is inadequate then how much more so if there is a doubling of the population.

ola olabiy:

the whole wealth of equitorial guinea is concentrated in the hands of few politicians.
do i need to refer you to an edition of the economist magazine?
please, forget par capita income

Can we stick to the topic and realise that what Equatorial Guinea has is an income redistribution issue. It is a political problem which can be solved by their leaders instituting some sort of social security scheme. It is poles apart from the Nigerian situation.

honeric01:

So in your long sermon, you are trying to say 70% of Nigerians live below $1 a day? hehehehe, you are joking, when last were you in Nigeria? when you came to Nigeria, where did you reside? did you for once go to the markets? do you know how much food stuffs cost? the slowest soup you can cook for a family of 2 is nothing less than -N-500 (excluding what you are to eat the soup with).

Honestly honerico, you need to start reading people's posts and consuming and ratiocinating the content before giving a counter.

How many times do we have to tell you that you should stop using your myopic view from city to judge for the whole of Nigeria?

That is like using London to judge cost of life in Haymarket village or Montrose in Scotland.

You think it is the same cost of N500 is the same in the villages around Mubi or Otukpo? They will STARVE to death if cost of food is that high there.

MOST NIGERIANS DO NOT LIIIIIIIIIIIIVE IN CITIES. They are rural. STOP using city life as your judgement tool.

tensor777:

I see that a lot of people are running away from the primary issue which is population growth. If today the amount invested per head in education and training of the youths is inadequate then how much more so if there is a doubling of the population.

Can we stick to the topic and realise that what Equatorial Guinea has is an income redistribution issue. It is a political problem which can be solved by their leaders instituting some sort of social security scheme. It is poles apart from the Nigerian situation.

so you don't want to address the reason why the amount you invested in education and training is inadequate?
so the answer to the inadequacy lies in population control and not a fight against corruption?
o ga oooo

ola olabiy:

^^^^^^^^^
now you are talking.
nigeria is a poor country made poorer by its leaders. FACT.
WITHOUT A BIT OF RADICALISM, THINGS WOULD not CHANGE.
the government has to lead.
population is not an/the issue.
very simple!

Well the rate of  population growth is an issue that should be taken VERY SERIOUSLY by development planners.

Sagamite:

You are right about productivity being the core.

The reality is that Nigeria is not some exceptionally blessed country like we like to bleeth about so frequently.

Honestly a  lot of people keep propagating this myth as if at the end of the day it changes  anything.
The most important requirment for development is having a highly-skilled and disciplined work force. That is how countries like Germany and Japan developed not by having abundant natural resources.

ola olabiy:

^^^^^^^^^
now you are talking.
nigeria is a poor country made poorer by its leaders. FACT.
WITHOUT A BIT OF RADICALISM, THINGS WOULD not CHANGE.
the government has to lead.
population is not an/the issue.
very simple!

I beg to differ. I don't see how you can argue the way you are trying to here and still arrive at that conclusion.

^^^thank you,tensor.
you are now talking.
you said:

''The most important requirment for development is having a highly-skilled and disciplined work force. That is how countries like Germany and Japan developed not by having abundant natural resources''.

which sums it up:
population is NOT an/the issue.
make people productive (highly skilled)

Nigerian population explosion(human resources)+ 75% utilization of her natural resources = A world Economic Power. Britain should start brainstorming over her inevitable decline.

ola olabiy:

^^^thank you,tensor.
you are now talking.
you said:

''The most important requirment for development is having a highly-skilled and disciplined work force. That is how countries like Germany and Japan developed not by having abundant natural resources''.

which sums it up:
population is NOT an/the issue.
make people productive (highly skilled)

Population is an issue when you have finite resources.

The more people you have, the more resources you have to utilise to make them highly skilled.

Even the UK cannot afford to give free Uni education to its population any longer.

A country with a large population has a potential asset but you need to right-size your population.

Even China had a point it said "We are too much".

Nigeria has already reached a population that is an asset, much more over that figure will soon become a liability, more so because of the 3 fundamentals I mentioned ealier that will restrict productivity needed to cater for a huge population.

Sagamite:

Honestly honerico, you need to start reading people's posts and consuming and ratiocinating the content before giving a counter.

How many times do we have to tell you that you should stop using your myopic view from city to judge for the whole of Nigeria?

That is like using London to judge cost of life in Haymarket village or Montrose in Scotland.

You think it is the same cost of N500 is the same in the villages around Mubi or Otukpo? They will STARVE to death if cost of food is that high there.

MOST NIGERIANS DO NOT LIIIIIIIIIIIIVE IN CITIES. They are rural. STOP using city life as your judgement tool.

4 Play:

I have used 2 independently verifiable data - Nigeria's estimated GDP and population - to arrive at my conclusion. You are using incoherent conjecture to arrive at yours. Please define ''a family of 2''.

I visit Anambra State and now that I think of it, the claim that the average person lives on less than $1 a day makes perfect sense. To use an anecdote, when someone heard that our driver in Awka(counts as urban in Nigeria) is paid 14000 Naira per month, they were astounded as they thought it was far above the norm. If you extrapolate from income figures in rural areas, presuming you actually visit rural areas, such low incomes are not far-fetched. Invariably, living costs are far lower but with that comes low income. I have a friend who works in Lafia(urban by Naija metrics) and his perception is that most of the adult working population survives on 10 to 15k per person.  

The average Nigerian, forget Lagos and all the other cities that warp your perspective of life in Nigeria, living in huge swathes of the South and the North, in rural  areas and small towns, do survive on around 150Naira a day. Nigeria's Govt, not the British, tells us that the average Nigerian does not even have access to electricity. I'm not aware that the Nigerian Govt disagrees with the claim that 70% of Nigerians live on less than $1 a day. You seem more intent on painting a glorified image of Nigeria than the PDP and the rest of our thieving political class.

And who told you i was using cities to judge? did these people making up the stats visit the whole urban areas in Nigeria to have arrived at 70% mark? both of you are using the GDP gotten from a source that does not even know the stat of how many Nigerians are into informal business.

Now, lets leave big big English, let do the math ourselves.

70% of 150 million is 105 million our of 150 million, so you are trying to say that 105 million Nigerians feed themselves with just $1 daily (150)?

for real, are you people even making any sense? Lagos is 18million people, and i can tell you that more than 80% of people in Lagos spend more than $1 a day on feeding. (the kids included)

Edo state is within 2-4 million people, 40-50% surely spends than $1 a day.

Jos is another example

Abuja is another

we have 36 states plus Abuja making it 37, are you trying to tell me that an average of 1.5 million people from these states do not spend more than $1 a day (feeding?)

infact, i am wasting my time, because the WB said it's 70% (I HAVE BEEN SEEING THIS STATS SINCE 10 YEARS AGO, YET IT HAS NOT CHANGED), does that sense to you? 10 yrs gone, yet the stats still remain?

Answer me, do you mean in the past 10 years, 70% still spend less than $1 a day? (put inflation and all that in view).

^^^
saga, don't annoy me .
the way you are arguing on this thread annoys me.
what are you talking about?
do you know how much britain invests on education? from primary school to adult education? they are still virtually free.
learndirect will train you free when it comes to IT and other courses.
including acounting courses like SAGE.
be honest with your analysis.
who says university education is not still virtually free in the uk? you and you alone?
they ask you to pay 3,000 a year and this is so while you are on benefit. isn't it?
this is so while you can apply for other funding.
all vocational courses are still free except you don't access them.
primary school is free (including meal for many). secondary school is free.
transportation free or subsidized.
please, get your points right.

honeric01:


And who told you i was using cities to judge? did those people making up the stats visit the whole urban areas in Nigeria to have arrived at 70% mark? bot of you are using the GDP gotten from a source that does not even know the stat of how many Nigerians are into informal business.

Now, lets leave big big english, let do the math ourself.

70% of 150 million is 105 million our of 150 million, so you are trying to say that 105 million Nigerians feed themselves with just $1 daily (150)?

for real, are you people even making any sense? Lagos is 18million people, and i can tell you that more than 80% of people in Lagos spend more than $1 a day on feeding. (the kids included)

Edo state is within 2-4 million people, 40-50% surely spends than $1 a day.

Jos is another example

Abuja IS another

we have 36 states plus Abuja making it 37, are you trying to tell me that an average of 1.5 million people from these states do not spend more than $1 a day (feeding?)

infact, i am wasting my time, because the WB said it's 70% (I HAVE BEEN SEEING THIS STATS SINCE 10 YEARS AGO, YET IT HAS NOT CHANGED), does that make it true?

Answer me, do you mean in the past 10 years, 70% still spend less than $1 a day? (put inflation and all that in view).

Sorry, where do you get your stats from?

You claim you are not using city stats?

Edo state is 2-4m? And all these live in Benin city? You want to tell me those that live in the rural areas of the state on average make up to N20K per month? Do the same analysis for all other states in Nigeria.

You keep on missing the point being given to you about even if someone makes N2000 Naira a day, what is profit and how many mouths does the profit have to feed.

I pretty much sure that your N500 figure is one of your conjectural fallacies that will break under testing because I can cook a pot of Efo Riro soup for 2 for less than £5 in London.

Leaves: 3 for £1.
Plum: 2 for £0.8.
Palm oil: Bottle £2.50, I will use a fraction, maybe £0.50
Meat: £2 worth will last 2 a week.
All other ingredients (salt, maggi, onions, tatashe, ata rodo) will be fractions used. Maybe max £1.

Remember Nigerian ingredients should be more expensive in London than Nigeria. So to tell me that MINIMUM pot of soup in Lagos (I forgive you for saying Nigeria) is £2 or £2.50 is pure fallacy.

so , how many uk students do you know who have paid back those 3,000s?
not just the fees.
it (benefit) also covers accommodation and feeding. all paid for.
now that they are experiencing recession, you think that will last.
by 2014, they are back to virtually -free system.

abeg

ola olabiy:

^^^
saga, don't annoy me .
the way you are arguing on this thread annoys me.
what are you talking about?
do you know how much britain invest on education? from primary school to adult education? they are still virtually free.
learndirect will train you free when it comes to IT and other courses.
including acounting courses like SAGE.
be honest with your analysis.
who says university education is not still virtually free in the uk? you and you alone?
they ask you to pay 3,000 a year and this is so while you are on benefit. isn't it?
this is so while you can apply for other funding.
all vocational courses are still free except you don't access them.
primary school is free (including meal for many). secondary school is free.
transportation free or subsidized.
please, get your points right.

Ki lon so, paddy yi. Wetin you dey say, this guy.

Shey you know say education used to be free before.

When the likes of Blair, Mililband and co went to Uni, the government paid everything gbam. Nothing like student debts. They paid your school fees and give you FREE money for maintenance on needs-be basis.

By our time, it became a grant you have to pay back. That is why people now have student debts and owe on average £18K after they finish.

Now they are debating whether to increase school fees over £3000 called top-up, which the student will have to pay.

tell me one person who has paid back that debt.
plumbing and other courses are still free.
even IT. and many science courses.
well, nigerians are complaing probably because they don't pay for ACCA

ola olabiy:

tell me one person who has paid back that debt.
plumbing and other courses are still free.
even IT. and many science courses.
well, nigerians are complaing probably because they don't pay for ACCA

I no understand?

You mean it is irrelevant?

It is taken from your pay every month and you will pay it up to a certain age, so it is not free.

It used to be TOTALLY free before.

why not first put to judicious use the little you have got in nigeria before complaining about its inadequacy.
spend and not plunder the allocated one.