Well may be the man who started the thread should tell us if he meant fraud by the true sense of the word or advanced fee fraud??  (419).

I for once will do anything to defend Nigerian interest to a non-Nigerian.

But amongst Nigerians we must face the fact.

The solution to any problem starts from recognition of need, this is not about patrotism it is about knowing what aspects of our lives we must drop if we must get anywhere as a Nation.

While it might be too harsh to say the average Nigerian is fraudulent, there is hardly any Nigerian at the age of at least 30 who will say he has never gained any advantage in life in a dishonest way.

McKren:

Well may be the man who started the thread should tell us if he meant fraud by the true sense of the word or advanced fee fraud?? or 419.

I for once will do anything to defend Nigerian interest to a non-Nigerian.

But amongst Nigerians we must face the fact.

The solution to any problem starts from recognition of need, this is not about patrotism it is about knowing what aspects of our lives we must drop if we must get anywhere as a Nation.

While it might not be too harsh to say the average Nigerian is fraudulent, there is hardly any Nigerian at the age of at least 30 who will say he has never gained any advantage in life in a dishonest way.

Thanks for you clarication! Does it make it right?

MILITIA:



Not necessarily!  It depends on if you are "frauded" by a Nigerian!  Then you are actually greedy and deserve the best of the insult to your intelligence!   How a mugu for Nigeria----when never ever see chalk and slate go fraud person biko nu? I cannot imagine that! It means it was hypnotics or just sheer "karma" that worked.  With all the bad English in those 419 letters and the way most of those yahoo dudes and babes sound on the phone, I cannot imagine how any one will fall for such a "bull"!

On the other hand if you are an "identity" theft victim, you do not have to be greedy.  Your mails can be picked and your computer hacked without your participation.  Those this make you greedy?  Our fraudulent average "Naija" specialize in this format of fraud over here.  300 drivers licences and 500 addresses registered to one person.  Please do not tell me it is common to all other countries.  DOES THAT MAKE IT RIGHT?

I agree with u on this but the question is not wether it is right or wrong o! and i do not agree that most identity theft are carried out by nigerians. u should see what the 'paki' guys get up to.

sorry for my earlier post

I meant to say "while it might be too harsh , "

angel101:

I agree with u on this but the question is not wether it is right or wrong o! and i do not agree that most identity theft are carried out by nigerians. u should see what the 'paki' guys get up to.

True! But no need making excuses for Illegality because others engage in it.  The average Nigerian will justify any state of degeneracy to make himself or herself feel better at what ever he or she is doing.  If you remove the "excuses" then most have no leg to stand on!

McKren:

sorry for my earlier post

I meant to say "while it might be too harsh , "

Kai! Oh boy stand for one place now! Haba!

Fraud is Fraud and is not A Nigerian/African problem period. its a worldwide problem.

let me broaden the scope, if for instance You're pretending to be a guy's girlfriend and knowing fully well
you're using him for financial gains. is that not fraud/identity theft too

If been fraudulent means the same thing as corrupt, then I think more than the average Nigerian is fraudulent.
But I'm pretty sure they have different meanings.

Caradona:

Fraud is Fraud and is not A Nigerian/African problem period. its a worldwide problem.
let me broaden the scope, if for instance You're pretending to be a guy's girlfriend and knowing fully well
you're using him for financial gains. is that not fraud/identity theft too

We know! But we are dealing with "the average Nigerian" in this topic. We are not making a qualitiative analysis across the globe ok? Is the average Nigerian fradulent or not? SIMPLE QUESTION OH! These Nigerian graduates sef?

PapaBrowne:

If been fraudulent means the same thing as corrupt, then I think more than the average Nigerian is fraudulent.
But I'm pretty sure they have different meanings.

Thank you PapaBrown! I beg teach some people here how to answer simple questions without dilly dallying!

CALL ME DEFENSIVE ,BUT N-E-V-E-R D-I-S-S Y-O-U-R K-I-N-D .

This is a hot issue. what is considered to be fraudulent? stealing? or doing what ever you have to to survive in No mans land? if the average Nigerian is fraudulent, what is the mean and the media?

Mamajama:

This is a hot issue. what is considered to be fraudulent? stealing? or doing what ever you have to to survive in No mans land? if the average Nigerian is fraudulent, what is the[b] mean [/b] and the media?

You are welcome.  I am the "impartial" moderator.  Because we are talking of Nigeria we will lower the standards to compensate for inadequacies!

The mean would be + or - 10%
The media or median would be 75%. 

For normal societies I will use a Mean of + or - 1% and a Media or Median of the requiered 50%!

Now answer the question.   Please don't forget to vote in the polls at the beginning of topic!  Nigeria is proud of you!

emirategun:

CALL ME DEFENSIVE ,BUT N-E-V-E-R D-I-S-S Y-O-You-R K-I-N-D .

_{Make una check una wallet oh!} I think I detect not an "Average Nigerian Fraudster", but a "Top Grade Nigerian Fraudster" in the house oh!

I think we are all standing too close to the mirror, so we see our eyeballs but dont see our faces.

The average Nigerian is human. to the extent that the average human is prone to selfishness and subversion in the interest of self preservation, I would say Yes. the average Nigerian is fraudulent.

But allow me to qualify that statement. It is not an admission to being an inferior or baser specie of homo sapien; it is in fact an affirmation and confirmation of the fact that nigerians are human and will behave as the average human is NATURALLY prone to do, given certain conditions.

Fraud is not the exclusive preserve of the nigerian, but a natural disposition of humanity, so let he who says it in an accusatory tone beware of hypocrisy.

Having said that, let us recall that we are talking about the AVERAGE nigerian. Beyond that, there are not a few of our kind, who have by force of self discipline , committed themselves to a DAILY struggle to do the right thing inspite of the natural proclivity to choose the easy way out. They deserve commendation, especially from those in the diaspora, some of whom sadly, have turned themselves into the unwitting allies of the facelesss neo-colonial phenomenon which seeks to keep the African psychologically underdeveloped by constantly attacking his self esteem though the all powerful media apparatus.

Crime is crime, fraud is fraud, irrespective of who commits it. Nevertheless, I am yet to hear of fraud that is exclusive to the Nigerian, and has not been committed in history by someone of lighter skin complexion.

You are what you think my people!, nothing more and nothing less. The challenge here is not really whether we are fraudulent or not, but what are we doing to improve our individual and collective disposition as a nation,inspite of the economic & politicalcircumstances we find ourselves facing. Why?, its just a phase, It will pass!

I am PROUD to have been born Nigerian, I am determined to make the most of my heritage. I am resolved that nothing, human or circumstantial , will prevent me from from being all that this Nigerian blood I have in my veins has equipped me to be. And I will do it the right way, wanna know how?, stay close to the Stream

I rest my case.

hmm i wonder y nigeria is not the most corrupt nation.

We are not fraudulent circumstances make us who we are.

have you ever introduced yourself as a Nigerian and all of a sudden every one that heard you tightly hold on to their wallet and gags ?

I don't think this is funny but the world have a wrong image about average Nigerians !!!  Nigerians living abroad doesnot even account for 5% of total Population, how then can we say Average of Nigerians.  If the topic is "average of Nigerian living in the west", then that's something else !!!

Mamajama:

We are not fraudulent circumstances make us who we are.

Mamajama, I do not quite agree with you. circumstances DO influence who we are, but I do not believe that they MAKE us who we are.

If you are born into a poor home for instance, the particular circumstances you encounter may influence you, but ultimately you have a choice in how you respond to where you find yourself; do you accept it as fate, or do you fight with dogged determination to break out of poverty? You definitely would not remain poor in your thoughts if you choose that path.

In the same vein, we 9ja's may be faced with adverse circumstances, but that does not, should not, define who we are.

If you ask me, it makes life all the more interesting when I reminisce on my little triumphs over the many many challenges of young people like myself trying to not just survive in 9ja, but actually make a difference!

Struggling to get a job, getting one, saving money, leaving home, saving more money, learning more, leaving home, squatting with friends, paying rent, saving more money, losing some, learning to invest, losing faith in the country, learning that its my attitude, not the country, regaining focus, getting own house, dealing with NEPA, saving for a Gen. Set, saving for a TV, coping with relationship stress, saving for virtually everything inspite of rising inflation, coping with adverse economic climate/failed leadership, dealing with the temptation, to cut a deal here, make a quick buck there, join the fast lane, realising that anything was possible, getting a better job, and another, and another, realising that hard work pays, and smart work pays better even ( it takes hard work for you to be able to do smart work),

I must tell you, I know quite a number of people like me, male and female, who are in their own little way, making the space they occupy on this land mass we all call home count.

Qc-1:

have you ever introduced yourself as a Nigerian and all of a sudden every one that heard you tightly hold on to their wallet and gags ?

I don't think this is funny but the world have a wrong image about average Nigerians !!! Nigerians living abroad doesnot even account for 5% of total Population, how then can we say Average of Nigerians. If the topic is "average of Nigerian living in the west", then that's something else !!!

_{Choking on my gizzard suya!} he he he he he! Ohmigosh! It does not matter where the "average" Nigerians live. I think it is the same "pysche" regardless of location!

Bluestream:

Mamajama, I do not quite agree with you. circumstances DO influence who we are, but I do not believe that they MAKE us who we are.

If you are born into a poor home for instance, the particular circumstances you encounter may influence you, but ultimately you have a choice in how you respond to where you find yourself; do you accept it as fate, or do you fight with dogged determination to break out of poverty? You definitely would not remain poor in your thoughts if you choose that path.

In the same vein, we Nigeria's may be faced with adverse circumstances, but that does not, should not, define who we are.

If you ask me, it makes life all the more interesting when I reminisce on my little triumphs over the many many challenges of young people like myself trying to not just survive in Nigeria, but actually make a difference!

Struggling to get a job, getting one, saving money, leaving home, saving more money, learning more, leaving home, squatting with friends, paying rent, saving more money, losing some, learning to invest, losing faith in the country, learning that its my attitude, not the country, regaining focus, getting own house, dealing with NEPA, saving for a Gen. Set, saving for a TV, coping with relationship stress, saving for virtually everything inspite of rising inflation, coping with adverse economic climate/failed leadership, dealing with the temptation, to cut a deal here, make a quick buck there, join the fast lane, realising that anything was possible, getting a better job, and another, and another, realising that hard work pays, and smart work pays better even ( it takes hard work for you to be able to do smart work),

I must tell you, I know quite a number of people like me, male and female, who are in their own little way, making the space they occupy on this land mass we all call home count.

NICE ONE

This is a simplistic question of YES or NO and with greatest of respect an average Nigeraian is not fraudulent.

Opportunist yes and from bad set up.

Even if you try hardly can good thing comes from bad set up. This answer is no

AS a Nation state we lack leadership which was choosen among followership who are confused and need leading.

What do I mean by the above, everybody want their own person to be in political for office for chop chop or some 'family support' or contract.

I WILL SAY IT AGAIN POVERTY AND LACK OF LEADERSHIP makes an average Nigerian more likely to take an 'opportunist' position than some others who had some element of social security.

Nigerian suffer considerably more than other nationals or nations given that nigeria has more resources that are not anywhere near even distribution. Nations even envy us for what we have and would like a slice of the actions. Multi natioanls plunder billions from our national wealth to build their own country because we are stupid not because we are fraudstars. Petty criminals and thieves like any other nations , 419 is IBB invention as  parting gifts to Nigerians

As a consequnce it is 'you steal here they steal there' . Anything criminal or illegal cannot be justified but the root cause is important.

Our leaders have not rewarded hard work and they even 'sell' hardwork does not pay.

Take for instance Senators, Honourables and Governors. Look at the way they allocate and enrich themselves legally and illegally but get the law to back them up.

Imagine people want to die to get elected to political office and what people do in naija to become rich and stay rich, but in cosolation there are crafty ways which is done in the west as well. So it is not a Nigerian thing at all.

As for Fraud, The russians, italians and major part of the south east Asian are the superstar, except that the majority bears similar surnames so you are not sure who is done what. The Pakistanian and the indians are propably more fraudulent than Nigerians but then they have Nuclear weapons so the West treat them with Respect.

Chinesse are worst but they have built Economic powerbase from huge fraud and now going to be overtaking the uSA as the next superpower, even the Americans don't know how powerful the chinesse are military wise.

Wait until Nigeria(if we have the ball) to aqcuire  nuclear know how, then the west we announce us as rogue state and they will be negotiatiing rather than call us name.

Nigerian's especially in diaspora makes more noise than any others when they do something they should bury their heads in the sand for.

This is the Big one, there is a political angle to economic warfare in the major countries of the world. Take Europe and the USA on the issue of A380 and Boeing & 787 aircrafts. It is simply to do with economics and jobs, and wealth creation for their own people. It is easy to fight Nigerians by demonising them and everybody avoid doing business with them. There is a silent propaganda against Nigeria because if Nigeria were to wake up and realise its rightful position and used it at least the west will stop reaping us off and when el start to compete against them rather than being their dumping ground for their consumer goods.

Nigerians help these countries by accepting this negative labelling accepting that we are no good, we are fraudulent, we are bad etc. Complete nonsense.

Even if anybody is, why they are and they should change is a our preoccupation rather than glorifying it as if we are the only bad people on earth

An average westerner are more fraudulent and will seek to hide it under some law.

Look let me tell you the history of Fraud, it is big time rip off by big corporations, they are what I called legalised thieves.

1. Insurance companies - they always find away to avoid paying out once accident happens

2. Banks- bank fees, charges, interest penalties  etc

3. Lotteries

and many more

In conclusion, the receiver is more dangerous than the thief, our leaders in collaboration with the west steal billions of dollars and put in a western account to develop the western economies, what is that , big time fraud.

I will not accept that an average Nigerian is fraudulent, they are no different from any other nationals if not better than others all over the world. Our own LEADERS are always the problem, They are not LEADERS or ones with VISION.

They will have tapped the huge human natural resources in Nigeria for the betterment of the country.

May God in his infinte mercies bless us and make us better people in whatever we may be lacking including discpline and fraud free.

Why are you people using yourselves and your fraudulent cliques or friends as a measuring tool for the  average Nigerian?

The average Nigerian that I know is NOT fraudulent, I have only met one Nigerian out of 100s who was a confrimed fraudster. Every other Nigerian I know personally, works very hard and lawfully for what they have.

Examine yourself critically before you start accusing the average Nigerian of being a fraud.

@tiiaaa

there's only one slot left for the last non-fraudulent Nigerian. Why are you trying to trick us into bringing in your whole clique. That is a fraudulent act. You're hereby disqualified.

It is the orientation ,the goverment is fraudulent so every body copies the goverment,it is a norm,inborn.

lol, you are funny.

Look at me expecting the overwhelming response to be no and actually thinking Nigerians were going to fight for their good names in stead of being unfairly maligned over and over and over again.

I believe there's more than one slot left  for the  honest Nigerians.

Its ridiculous when a bunch of people start getting complacent  about their wrongdoings / crimes and start rationalizing fraud because you think every one is as rotten as yourself.

I know way too many honest Nigerians to accept this rubbish about us.

tiiaaa:

lol, you are funny.

Look at me expecting the overwhelming response to be no and actually thinking Nigerians were going to fight for their good names in stead of being unfairly maligned over and over and over again.

I believe there's more than one slot left for the honest Nigerians.

Its ridiculous when a bunch of people start getting complacent about their wrongdoings / crimes and start rationalizing fraud because you think every one is as rotten as yourself.

I know way too many honest Nigerians to accept this rubbish about us.

Wonderful! Can you please tell me what planet these[b] treasures [/b] reside?

75% of Nigerians in the public sector (PHCN, NITEL, NNPC, NIPOST, etc.) are fraudulent.
99% of Nigerians in any political office (in Nigeria) are criminals beyond redemption.
99.99% of Nigerians in the Nigerian Police Force are _{in short, just forget it!}

Una dey talk fraudulent like say any Nigerian don ever defraud to the level of $30 billion?

Nigerians, stop hyping yourselves.

Where Nigerians dey when them kenneth Lay dey chop the whole Los Angeles more than $30 billion?
Where naija dey when John Rigas (81 years old at the time of the crime) dey defraud more than $2 billion?

Dennis Kozlowski defraud to the extent he could afford a shower curtain for $6,000. A bloody shower curtain! Em, and Persian Rug of $190,000! That's money for 100 yahoo boys.


Abeg Nigeria dey learn fraud. I been think say Nigeria dey try till I saw a recap of the father of all frauds on CNN. Maybe by the next 10 years, Nigeria go reach where US and Australia are.
But for now, we still dey learn.

Oga denex! You still dey for here? Please clap for the one and only denex! Na you win oh!

I just dey watch CNN wey dem dey talk Conrad Black matter. Them just go back memory lane to remind us of other big boys (fraudwise).

The amounts these people defraud is fit for only God to mention.

THERE ARE COUNTLESS NIGERIANS,WHO ARE NOT FRAUDULENT.WE SHOULD STOP 'ADVERTISING' 'NEGATIVES' OF NIGERIANS.U CAN'T TELL WHO IS TAKING NOTES.I LOVE NYJA!