Magnoliaa:


Why do you assume her home is like the homes of other Naija housewives? I can tell a woman in an abusive relationship to quit it, or even separate and stay away from an abusive husband. If my husband no dey beat me, why I go leave am? Why do you keep assuming the disrespect and uncertainty and the whole hullabaloo that accompanies virtuous Naija women and their horsebands are evident in Coco's home? Abi you're saying Coco's comments ALL THE TIME ON EVERY POSTS is advising divorce and separation and homosexuality?

Coco sleeps? You that see posts of person wey dey sleep, you no be night-watcher yourself?

Now you're just being unrealistically unbelievable at this point.

LMAO Magnoliaa, woooooo I don tire for your matter

cococandy:
Because we already have a million messengers telling women how to be good wives but not enough telling men how to be good husbands

Obviously women are pulling their relationship weight more than men hence the need to focus on men with the messaging. You can’t keep doing something one way and expect different results each time. With everyone harping on how women can even be “perfecter” than they already are, relationship issues still exist.

Maybe we should talk to men? That’s why I focus on that.

Oh and I’ve never said men must cook and clean bla bla. But if they want non-traditional wives who contribute financially too, then they have to cook and clean too. It’s only fair.

Before you ask, yes my husband participates in keeping our home too. He’s not inconsiderate

In your attempts to tell men how to be good husbands, your relationship with the man in your life will be a very good reference point.


By the way, traditional wives contribute financially too.

Magnoliaa:
@Acidosis, I have mentioned Kawulia, Hanny (@Hannysmilez), and Apathetic (@apatheticme). I said a whole lot of things in that post. Yet you just skipped right over it to comment on the ones you want.

These are few of the women I know who share their personal stories and experiences on here.

You mentioned feminists on NL. Stop setting up Coco to be the only one and demanding she tell you things.

Is Coco a feminist? I don't think she's ever called herself one (I may be wrong).

About the other monikers, you don't expect me to engage people randomly, do you? Besides, I'm not too jobless to engage people like Kanwulia on marital or relationship issues. I would rather go out there and play with sand.

Acidosis:


I don't have a narrow idea of what a feminist must be. What I don't have is a true picture of the average [real]life of a feminist on Nairaland because of the issues they invest their time and resources.

Oh well, Magnolia has given you the monickers of those who share their personal lives on here, hasn't she?

Acidosis:
I never mentioned that all women must be housewives. My position is that I am not against the notion of housewife so if my wife decides to be one, I have to uphold my belief.

Point me in the direction of your personal stories, abeg. Please. What are the things you've asked of your wife? Or previous women in your life, how exactly did y'all work it out as a traditional couple? Were they 100% feminine? How were you even able to classify and judge them as feminine? If your wife currently works, do you think that fits into the model of femininity you support and desire?

I am not a woman but I can make a case based on what I expect from the woman in my life.

No. You initially said you can make a case for housewives. Therefore straight people can make cases for lesbians and gays.

Others can make a case for things they believe in so long as they're willing to practice or live with people who practice that thing.

You support housewives, femininity and women sticking to traditional roles, yet you don't form a baby or breastfeed and you can never be a housewife nor become feminine. Why do you support things you can't practice? And has any pro-LGBTQ+ person on here told you they they can't live with people like that? Do you absolutely, in toto, practice and live with the kind of things and people you support realistically? Okay, I know you'll be willing (just like others haven't told you they are not willing), but is it happening in actuality?

You can't, for example, make a case for marijuana/Indian help, when you won't allow your man or son smoke Indian hemp. It is not enough to say that you've discussed Vasectomy with your significant others and sons. Have they agreed to undergo the procedure? If your answer is NO, the next question should be how did you marry someone whose ideas to family planning contradict yours?

Are you referring to Coco again? Is she the one making a case for Indian hemp or you're just giving a general example?

Okay, let's take this one by one. You said they don't talk or preach about it in their homes. They told you they do. Does that in itself not counter your claim that they don't?

Then you want to know the outcome of them talking about such ... since they've not said anything further, what are you dragging them for? Because their partners refuses? What makes you think a conversation should ultimately result in a follow-up of what has been discussed? You don't know if their partners refused, you don't know if they said, and so you definitely can't conclude they married people whose family planning values does not align with theirs.

I wonder why you're fixated on those two, though, when there are literally other people bursting with stories and experiences of their hysterectomies and vasectomies.

Magnoliaa:


Point me in the direction of your personal stories, abeg. Please. What are the things you've asked of your wife? Or previous women in your life, how exactly did y'all work it out as a traditional couple? Were they 100% feminine? How were you even able to classify and judge them as feminine? If your wife currently works, do you think that fits into the model of femininity you support and desire?

No. You initially said you can make a case for housewives. Therefore straight people can make cases for lesbians and gays.

Don't you get it? I can make a case for housewives because I am opened to living with one. Can you marry a lesbian? Can you conduct weddings for your daughters who are engaged to other women? It's very easy to hide under "liberal" opinions to make cases for those we perceived to be "marginalized."

You support housewives, femininity and women sticking to traditional roles, yet you don't form a baby or breastfeed and you can never be a housewife nor become feminine. Why do you support things you can't practice? And has any pro-LGBTQ+ person on here told you they they can't live with people like that? Do you absolutely, in toto, practice and live with the kind of things and people you support realistically? Okay, I know you'll be willing (just like others haven't told you they are not willing), but is it happening in actuality?

LOL, see ehn, let's close the chapter. I've addressed these things over and over again.

Are you referring to Coco again? Is she the one making a case for Indian hemp or you're just giving a general example?

Okay, let's take this one by one. You said they don't talk or preach about it in their homes. They told you they do. Does that in itself not counter your claim that they don't?

Just the same way they're free to "talk" about it on Nairaland. I never said they shouldn't post stuff about vasectomy but to say that men should be encouraged to undergo vasectomy means that the closest men in their lives must have gone through the process. It's even morally wrong to suggest an idea, one that the closest man in your life hasn't already agreed to do willingingly.

Acidosis:
Is Coco a feminist? I don't think she's ever called herself one (I may be wrong).

About the other monikers, you don't expect me to engage people randomly, do you? Besides, I'm not too jobless to engage people like Kanwulia on marital or relationship issues. I would rather go out there and play with sand.

I DID NOT ask you to engage them. Nope, sir. Never did. You said feminist women don't share their personal stories on NL and I gave you the list of those women WHO DO. Go through their posts to satisfy your curiosity. Nairaland is an anonymous forum, but even at that, there are a few who aren't all that mum about their selves.

You mayyyy be wrong?? Wtf?? Wtaf?? So you're doing all of these, everything simply based on assumptions and misconceptions?? Guyyyy. If you never knew Coco was a feminist, so who was the "you people" you were referring to when you quoted Amazon? Was it only her? You clearly talked about women who claimed to be feminists or who you perceived to be feminists. Then you talk about women who don't use the feminist tag. So, please, state for me: who are these NL Feminists that you're referring to? Who are the women on NL that you think they don't practice what they preach online?

Is it Coco you're referring to about changing her mouth on feminism?
Is it Amazon that is standing for something she turns around to deny?
Abi it's Poco (@pocohantas) that doesn't preach online sermons in her house?
Is it Saintmary...?

I think you should be clear at this point. Make e no go be like say you just dey speak at air... this minute, you're talking generally, the next minute, you're specifying it's only NL feminists.

So allllllllll you've been saying since, about loud and vocal women and such - have they all been directed at Coco?

If you don't think Coco is a feminist, whom have you been talking about? Was it Amazon you've been referring to? Abi me? You definitely referred to, have been referring to a group of women na. Haba mana.

If you don't know anyone that is a feminist offline, and you are not certain who is a feminist online ... which women have you been directing your posts to?

Acidosis:



In your attempts to tell men how to be good husbands, your relationship with the man in your life will be a very good reference point.

By the way, traditional wives contribute financially too.

Well I’ve already used it as reference point didn’t I?

So what are “traditional wives” gaining if they do their supposed female duties and also do the man’s duties for him. what’s in it for them?

Acidosis:
Don't you get it? I can make a case for housewives because I am opened to living with one. Can you marry a lesbian? Can you conduct weddings for your daughters who are engaged to other women? It's very easy to hide under "liberal" opinions to make cases for those we perceived to be marginalized.

If you can speak for things that you aren't, Oga, then you can't tell others they have to be things they speak for. It's as simple as that.

LOL, see ehn, let's close the chapter. I've addressed these things over and over again.

Lmaooo. I see it's hard for you to accept that things are true for you or applicable in your life shouldn't be for others. If you know any pro-LGBTQ+ straight person who has said they can't have a gay child or live with one, come and show me.

Just the same way they're free to "talk" about it on Nairaland. I never said they shouldn't post stuff about vasectomy but to say that men should be encouraged to undergo vasectomy means that the closest men in their lives must have gone through the process. It's even morally wrong to suggest an idea, one that the closest man in your life hasn't already agreed to do willingingly.

Okay, and they haven't said the men and people in their lives have refused. So no hypocritical talk there. Non-disclosure has not started becoming an issue of not putting one's money where one's mouth is. They aren't the same.

doggedfighter:


Pocohontas, let me know too.

Make I go write all una name down.

Acidosis:
In your attempts to tell men how to be good husbands, your relationship with the man in your life will be a very good reference point.


By the way, traditional wives contribute financially too.

I'm still waiting for you to use your relationships (past and present) as a good example for traditional ideals. If you've made such posts on NL, I told you I'll like to see it ... are they in your posts' history?

Traditional and financially-contributing wives should be with traditional and domestic-duties performing husbands. Why does a support for the latter seem to be unacceptable to you, given the former?

Acidosis:

That picture is wrong. My vasectomy at Marie Stopes cost 80k

cococandy:


Well I’ve already used it as reference point didn’t I?

So what are “traditional wives” gaining if they do their supposed female duties and also do the man’s duties for him. what’s in it for them?

Do the man's duties, as in provide everything for the household? By traditional wife, I mean someone who understands that her number one role is to take care of her home. The traditional guy understands that his number one role is to provide. Emphasis on the term "number one". That shows that there's room for secondary roles.

By the way, we may have to redefine the idea of a traditional wife because you cannot agree to a traditional wedding where your man paid your bride price, where you probably knelt for him, served him palm wine, and then turn around to say that you're not a "traditional wife". Another character misalignment.

tensazangetsu20:
That picture is wrong. My vasectomy at Marie Stopes cost 80k

Niceeeeeeee.

So wait, I hope you don't mind me asking you some questions? Huh? Not intrusive questions. No, nah. Just to make my case. Like, do you support family-planning, are you pro- vasectomies or men getting vasectomies? Do you recommend it?

Magnoliaa:


Niceeeeeeee.

So wait, I hope you don't mind me asking you some questions? Huh? Not intrusive questions. No, nah. Just to make my case. Like, do you support family-planning, are you pro- vasectomies or men getting vasectomies? Do you recommend it?

I don't believe anybody with a working brain should have a child in Africa but that's just me. I am pro vasectomy.

tensazangetsu20:


That picture is wrong. My vasectomy at Marie Stopes cost 80k

Oh okay.

Acidosis:


Do the man's duties, as in provide everything for the household? By traditional wife, I mean someone who understands that her number one role is to take care of her home. The traditional guy understands that his number one role is to provide. Emphasis on the term "number one". That shows that there's room for secondary roles.

By the way, we may have redefine the idea of a traditional wife because you cannot agree to a traditional wedding where your man paid your bride price, where you probably knelt for him, served him palm wine, and then turn around to say that you're not a "traditional wife". Another character misalignment.

So you mean by your own interpretation of traditional wife. Because obviously many people practice various forms of role overlap because in real life it can never truly be cut and dry.

What do you call a husband who got married in a traditional way but also performs traditional female roles in the marriage to assist his wife? A misaligned character? What if a husband pays the bride price but also accepts financial assistance from his wife what’s his character?

Sometimes you speak in ways that make me SMH.

Acidosis:
Do the man's duties, as in provide everything for the household? By traditional wife, I mean someone who understands that her number one role is to take care of her home. The traditional guy understands that his number one role is to provide. Emphasis on the term "number one". That shows that there's room for secondary roles.

...we may have redefine the idea of a traditional wife because you cannot agree to a traditional wedding where your man paid your bride price, where you probably knelt for him, served him palm wine, and then turn around to say that you're not a "traditional wife". Another character misalignment.

Of whom?

If you believe there's room for secondary roles nd modifications in a traditional set up, then you cannot foist the traditional tag on a woman who does a traditional wedding.

If a traditional woman can contribute financially, as a number two duty, then another woman can have a traditional wedding without performing traditional duties as a traditional wife afterwards.

Assuming you have kids you care for now, if nurturing them doesn't make you less of a traditional man, why should a wedding, an event, simply make me less of a nontraditional wife?

Magnoliaa:


I'm still waiting for you to use your relationships (past and present) as a good example for traditional ideals. If you've made such posts on NL, I told you I'll like to see it ... are they in your posts' history?

Traditional and financially-contributing wives should be with traditional and domestic-duties performing husbands. Why does a support for the latter seem to be unacceptable to you, given the former?

I don't have a problem with cleaning or other domestic duties. I clean and wash in my household (as secondary duties) and it has nothing to do with how much I contribute financially. Meaning that when I fail to clean, my spouse will never hold it against me.

They're merely secondary responsibilities and would remain so, whether I contribute or not.

Also, it doesn't matter how much my spouse contributes financially, that aspect will remain her secondary role. And when she fails to contribute financially, I will never hold it against her or make it a mandatory thing to do.

cococandy:
So you mean by your own interpretation of traditional wife. Because obviously many people practice various forms role overlap because in real life it can never truly be cut and dry.

What do you call a husband who got married in a traditional way but also performs traditional female roles in the marriage to assist his wife? A misaligned character? What if a husband pays the bride price but also accepts financial assistance from his wife what’s his character?

Sometimes you speak in ways that make me SMH.

Asinnnnnnnnn. How I love this response. Absolutely nothing is cut and dry! I'm sure he still considers himself a traditional man, and it's likely his S/O works. He has refused to say or accept or deny anything about that.

Why should only traditional people get to modify and play around and assist in other roles or only live about 60-70% of traditional lives but other people, of other ideological leanings can't do the same?

If your wife financially supports you from time to time as a traditional man and it doesn't make you an hypocrite, then I can do a traditional wedding of my choice and cook for my husband as a feminist and it wouldn't make me an hypocrite.

cococandy:


So you mean by your own interpretation of traditional wife. Because obviously many people practice various forms of role overlap because in real life it can never truly be cut and dry.

What do you call a husband who got married in a traditional way but also performs traditional female roles in the marriage to assist his wife? A misaligned character? What if a husband pays the bride price but also accepts financial assistance from his wife what’s his character?

Sometimes you speak in ways that make me SMH.

Coco, your head won't stop shaking until you understand the difference between primary and secondary roles.

Acidosis:


Coco, your head won't stop shaking until you understand the difference between primary and secondary roles.

Oh primary and secondary role is how you think you can talk yourself out of the inconsistencies in your post?

cococandy:


Oh primary and secondary role is how you think you can talk yourself out of the inconsistencies in your post?

There are no inconsistencies. Like I mentioned, even if I my wife becomes a full-time everlasting housewife, I'll still clean and wash as secondary responsibilities. I don't assign roles in the family based on financial prowess.

He really tries to ask about personal issues so that he can look for a reason to try and discredit a poster but meanwhile he won’t look at the inconsistencies on his own side.

I got married as a young 23 year old. It’s been almost 10 years, so definitely my strength to stick by my convictions has only improved with more maturity. Does it mean if I had a traditional marriage at that young age, almost a decade later I can’t have any opinion that’s non-traditional because my traditional marriage ceremony cancels it? Sir acidosis no make me reason your matter.

Magnoliaa:


Asinnnnnnnnn. How I love this response. Absolutely nothing is cut and dry! I'm sure he still considers himself a traditional man, and it's likely his S/O works. He has refused to say or accept or deny anything about that.

Why should only traditional people get to modify and play around and assist in other roles or only live about 60-70% of traditional lives but other people, of other ideological leanings can't do the same?

If your wife financially supports you from time to time as a traditional man and it doesn't make you an hypocrite, then I can do a traditional wedding of my choice and cook for my husband as a feminist and it wouldn't make me an hypocrite.

Acidosis:
I don't have a problem with cleaning or other domestic duties. I clean and wash in my household (as secondary duties) and it has nothing to do with how much I contribute financially. Meaning that when I fail to clean, my spouse will never hold it against me.

They're merely secondary responsibilities and would remain so, whether I contribute or not.

Also, it doesn't matter how much my spouse contributes financially, that aspect will remain her secondary role. And when she fails to contribute financially, I will never hold it against her or make it a mandatory thing to do.

You don't have a problem with cleaning or domestic duties. Great. So why did you bring up Coco's "advices" and focus on men cooking and washing in their homes (whether as a secondary or primary duty)?

Because you're trying to 'drag' Coco for always talking about men contributing domestically, instead of advising women to be 'good', like you assumed she is. But you're forgetting the context that many women in Nigerian homes today contribute financially, and yet, women still get preachings about how they should run the home and take care of it. She hasn't said all of that isn't good, she hasn't said women shouldn't be cooking and shouldn't care for their families (because she does), she's simply saying now that women also bring money as well, whether consistently or seldomly, let's tell more men to put in more efforts in contributing domestically, to the women's 'primary' duties, as you've believed. There are already tons of messages for women. So why do you have a problem with Coco talking to men? You said you clean in your home, she said her husband helps out too --- so where is the issue?

cococandy:
He really tries to ask about personal issues so that he can look for a reason to try and discredit a poster but meanwhile he won’t look at the inconsistencies on his own side.

I got married as a young 23 year old. It’s been almost 10 years, so definitely my strength to stick by my convictions has only improved with more maturity. Does it mean if I had a traditional marriage at that young age, almost a decade later I can’t have any opinion that’s non/traditional because my traditional marriage ceremony cancels it? Sir acidosis no make me reason your matter.

You want to reason my matter? How?

Magnoliaa:
@Acidosis, I have mentioned Kawulia, Hanny (@Hannysmilez), and Apathetic (@apatheticme). I said a whole lot of things in that post. Yet you just skipped right over it to comment on the ones you want.

These are few of the women I know who share their personal stories and experiences on here.

You mentioned feminists on NL. Stop setting up Coco to be the only one and demanding she tell you things.

Hi!!

Tnks for dragging me down here. Been a while I posted here though, I've been really busy.

I'll go through the thread and comment appropriately.

cococandy:
He really tries to ask about personal issues so that he can look for a reason to try and discredit a poster but meanwhile he won’t look at the inconsistencies on his own side.

I got married as a young 23 year old. It’s been almost 10 years, so definitely my strength to stick by my convictions has only improved with more maturity. Does it mean if I had a traditional marriage at that young age, almost a decade later I can’t have any opinion that’s non-traditional because my traditional marriage ceremony cancels it? Sir acidosis no make me reason your matter.

And I even thought he said you don't talk about yourself. This one, nko, Mr Ascorbic Acid? I'm guessing this is a general info you put out here from time to time. I am just knowing of this... and mostly because I focus on what you have to say, not the messenger and your life decisions.

I would think that's how to be logical and objective and to form opinions without biases. Even if I form personal opinions, like I do with redpillers or try to infer what they'll be like offline, when I am arguing with them, one-on-one, I rarely bring it up to use against them. If I don argue your points finish with you, that's the end niyen, until another time.

I mean this is a really simple issue. I don’t know why he thinks it should be complicated.

At the end of the day, my feminism (and feminism at large) isn’t about what people ought to do in their relationships. I really do not care who plays what role as long the couple are happy and no one feels like they are bearing an unfair burden in the marriage. Stay home mom, stay home dad, 50-50, traditional etc. I will support any choice anyone makes VOLUNTARILY for themselves. If they are forced to do it, then I might have an issue with it. But if they choose it because that’s what’s best for them at that point in their lives, I pray for nothing but blessings to them

This issue is bigger than people’s individual relationships but more about the general social welfare of women. I’ve said this before SO MANY TIMES.

3 months later, you’ll still see him here trying to drag me on this matter

Magnoliaa:


You don't have a problem with cleaning or domestic duties. Great. So why did you bring up Coco's "advices" and focus on men cooking and washing in their homes (whether as a secondary or primary duty)?

Because you're trying to 'drag' Coco for always talking about men contributing domestically, instead of advising women to be 'good', like you assumed she is. But you're forgetting the context that many women in Nigerian homes today contribute financially, and yet, women still get preachings about how they should run the home and take care of it. She hasn't said all of that isn't good, she hasn't said women shouldn't be cooking and shouldn't care for their families (because she does), she's simply saying now that women also bring money as well, whether consistently or seldomly, let's tell more men to put in more efforts in contributing domestically, to the women's 'primary' duties, as you've believed. There are already tons of messages for you. So why do you have a problem with Coco talking to men? You said you clean in your home, she said her husband helps out too --- so where is the issue?

Magnoliaa:


You don't have a problem with cleaning or domestic duties. Great. So why did you bring up Coco's "advices" and focus on men cooking and washing in their homes (whether as a secondary or primary duty)?

Because you're trying to 'drag' Coco for always talking about men contributing domestically, instead of advising women to be 'good', like you assumed she is. But you're forgetting the context that many women in Nigerian homes today contribute financially, and yet, women still get preachings about how they should run the home and take care of it. She hasn't said all of that isn't good, she hasn't said women shouldn't be cooking and shouldn't care for their families (because she does), she's simply saying now that women also bring money as well, whether consistently or seldomly, let's tell more men to put in more efforts in contributing domestically, to the women's 'primary' duties, as you've believed. There are already tons of messages for you. So why do you have a problem with Coco talking to men? You said you clean in your home, she said her husband helps out too --- so where is the issue?

What makes you think that men are not contributing domestically at the same rate? When you say let's talk to men, you're assuming that men do not contribute domestically.

The issue is that, in a traditional setting, people do not assign roles based on financial strength. If you think that you cannot cope with cleaning and cooking (as primary duties) for a man whose income is below yours, please do well to marry a wealthy man.

I do drop personal tidbits once in a while because ppl like acidosis think what I have to say has no merit unless I use personal examples .

But then the trolls get a pen and paper to take notes and then embellish it when they come for me

It’s all good

Magnoliaa:


And I even thought he said you don't talk about yourself. This one, nko, Mr Ascorbic Acid? I'm guessing this is a general info you put out here from time to time. I am just knowing of this... and mostly because I focus on what you have to say, not the messenger and your life decisions.

I would think that's how to be logical and objective and to form opinions without biases. Even if I form personal opinions, like I do with redpillers or try to infer what they'll be like offline, when I am arguing with them, one-on-one, I rarely bring it up to use against them. If I don argue your points finish with you, that's the end niyen, until another time.