sonmvayina:


The person who really sent me on this discovery was ken Humphreys..'jesus never existed'..

He really opened my eyes to the fraud..

Mind blowing I must admit.

For me, my research started with The Paga Christ by Tom Hapur.

I am currently studying - Who Is This King Of Glory? by Alvin Boyd Khun.

If you're interested, we can agree on a historical book to study and then discuss our findings on a thread.

What do you think?

And it syncs. What's your problem with that?

oteneaaron:


Mind blowing I must admit.

For me, my research started with The Paga Christ by Tom Hapur.

I am currently studying - Who Is This King Of Glory? by Alvin Boyd Khun.

If you're interested, we can agree on a historical book to study and then discuss our findings on a thread.

What do you think?

I would really appreciate that..

What do you have in mind ?

sonmvayina:


I would really appreciate that..

What do you have in mind ?

Well, we can agree on a book to study, then share our findings as we go on a thread, chapter by chapter.

As study buddies, we need to ensure that complete the book before moving on to another one.

We can start with any of these books -

1. Ceasar's Messiah - as mentioned by the OP

2. Who is This King of Glory? - by Alvin Boyd Khun

3. The Pagan Christ - by Tom Hapur

4. Who Was Jesus? Fingerprints of the Christ - by DM Murdock

5. The Jesus Mysteries; Was the Original Jesus a Pagan God? - by Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy

Does this work for you?

guysbewise:


If you're not the one insane then you would know that the virgin birth and the FAKE messiah of the Jews was a psychological warfare to control the minds of people at the time as they were all expecting a messiah like David to deliver them from Roman occupation.

Let us assume that the Romans invented Jesus Christ as you claim to control the minds of gullible Jews, let me then ask you the following questions.

1. Why then did the Romans later believe in Jesus and started the first Universal Church that told the world about Jesus.
Does it mean that the Romans later deceived themselves with their own invention?

2. Why did other religions like Islam confirmed the existence of Jesus. If Jesus was a fiction, won't Islam and the Quran exposed it in a bid to get converts from Christianity.
If a man's history is confirmed by his rival, is that not an evidence that such history is authentic.

3. How can we confirm that the man who claims that Jesus was a fiction was not a fiction himself.
At least historians books talked about Jesus Christ but there is no historian book that confirmed such a person existed in this world.

MikeofAfrica:


Let us assume that the Romans invented Jesus Christ as you claim to control the minds of gullible Jews, let me then ask you the following questions.

1. Why then did the Romans later believe in Jesus and started the first Universal Church that told the world about Jesus.
Does it mean that the Romans later deceived themselves with their own invention?

2. Why did other religions like Islam confirmed the existence of Jesus. If Jesus was a fiction, won't Islam and the Quran exposed it in a bid to get converts from Christianity.
If a man's history is confirmed by his rival, is that not an evidence that such history is authentic.

3. How can we confirm that the man who claims that Jesus was a fiction was not a fiction himself.
At least historians books talked about Jesus Christ but there is no historian book that confirmed such a person existed in this world.

What you need to find out is why did no historian during the time of Jesus Christ write anything about Jesus Christ and what did the Romans do to all the Jewish Holy Books they found in Israel?

oteneaaron:


Well, we can agree on a book to study, then share our findings as we go on a thread, chapter by chapter.

As study buddies, we need to ensure that complete the book before moving on to another one.

We can start with any of these books -

1. Ceasar's Messiah - as mentioned by the OP

2. Who is This King of Glory? - by Alvin Boyd Khun

3. The Pagan Christ - by Tom Hapur

4. Who Was Jesus? Fingerprints of the Christ - by DM Murdock

5. The Jesus Mysteries; Was the Original Jesus a Pagan God? - by Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy

Does this work for you?

I have not read most of the books that you mentioned and might not have the time to read them.

However, the best way to verify if a man existed and is still existing is not by reading books claiming such man does not exist but having an encounter with Him.

For instance, if I visit White House and have a dinner with Joe Biden, then I do not need any book to verify if Joe Biden exist or not. Physical evidence is more concrete than literary evidence.

Even though Jesus Christ is a Spirit, there are physical evidence that He exist just as there are physical evidence that the Air we breathe exist.

Millions of people in our generation have had encounters with Jesus Christ. We have seen Cripples walk after having encounters with Jesus, we have seen deaf and dumb people talk after having encounter with Jesus.

We have seen Criminals become Missionaries after having encounters with Jesus.

These evidences are more concrete than any
envidence written by someone who might even be a fictional creature.

oteneaaron:


Well, we can agree on a book to study, then share our findings as we go on a thread, chapter by chapter.

As study buddies, we need to ensure that complete the book before moving on to another one.

We can start with any of these books -

1. Ceasar's Messiah - as mentioned by the OP

2. Who is This King of Glory? - by Alvin Boyd Khun

3. The Pagan Christ - by Tom Hapur

4. Who Was Jesus? Fingerprints of the Christ - by DM Murdock

5. The Jesus Mysteries; Was the Original Jesus a Pagan God? - by Timothy Freke and Peter Gandy

Does this work for you?

Yes.. definitely..

MikeofAfrica:


I have not read most of the books that you mentioned and might not have the time to read them.

However, the best way to verify if a man existed and is still existing is not by reading books claiming such man does not exist but having an encounter with Him.

For instance, if I visit White House and have a dinner with Joe Biden, then I do not need any book to verify if Joe Biden exist or not. Physical evidence is more concrete than literary evidence.

Even though Jesus Christ is a Spirit, there are physical evidence that He exist just as there are physical evidence that the Air we breathe exist.

Millions of people in our generation have had encounters with Jesus Christ. We have seen Cripples walk after having encounters with Jesus, we have seen deaf and dumb people talk after having encounter with Jesus.

We have seen Criminals become Missionaries after having encounters with Jesus.

These evidences are more concrete than any
envidence written by someone who might even be a fictional creature.

How old are you?

Just give me a range....

MikeofAfrica:


I have not read most of the books that you mentioned and might not have the time to read them.

However, the best way to verify if a man existed and is still existing is not by reading books claiming such man does not exist but having an encounter with Him.

For instance, if I visit White House and have a dinner with Joe Biden, then I do not need any book to verify if Joe Biden exist or not. Physical evidence is more concrete than literary evidence.

Even though Jesus Christ is a Spirit, there are physical evidence that He exist just as there are physical evidence that the Air we breathe exist.

Millions of people in our generation have had encounters with Jesus Christ. We have seen Cripples walk after having encounters with Jesus, we have seen deaf and dumb people talk after having encounter with Jesus.

We have seen Criminals become Missionaries after having encounters with Jesus.

These evidences are more concrete than any
envidence written by someone who might even be a fictional creature.

This arguement you referred to above, was covered extensively in this book - Who is this king of glory by Alvin Boyd Khun.

I am not arguing with the fact that people have seen "visions" or apparitions of "Jesus" - because in the inner depths of the human mind, there is a "divine mind" many of us are yet to realize.

But let me ask you, can these people who have had these visions decribe who they saw?

Did the person they saw in this "vision" look like the drawing of the white guy people popularly known as Jesus?

If yes, how can we trust such visions when there is no single archeological record that shows us how Jesus actually looked like?

sonmvayina:


Yes.. definitely..

Awesome!!

Let's pick a book to start with.

For a start, I vote for either -

1. The Pagan Christ by Tom Hapur or

2. Who is this King of Glory by Alvin Boyd Khun.

What about you?

Maynman:

exactly, if you live in lagos state between 2000 and 2010, and a forged and edited book tells you that abacha was military governor of lagos state will you believe?

To debunk the lie, we’ll first look at who, how, when and why the book was written.
The book was meant for which audience?
No wonder the jews reject it

https://www.nairaland.com/7393471/isis-chrest-chrest#117738753

Allayed shut up

guysbewise:


What you need to find out is why did no historian during the time of Jesus Christ write anything about Jesus Christ and what did the Romans do to all the Jewish Holy Books they found in Israel?

You fail to answer any of my questions.

If Jesus Christ was created by the Romans to deceive the gullible Jews while then did the Romans later believe in Jesus Christ and founded the the first Universal Chruch to convince the world that Jesus Christ is Lord?

The fact that the Roman Government later became the pacesetter of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is enough evidence that Jesus existed and was not created by the Roman Government.

The reason why no historian wrote about Jesus during his time is because he was not a King or VIP. Historians only write about important personalities in their society.

Nevertheless, those who believe in Jesus Christ like his disciples and Apostle Paul wrote about Him.

The Roman Government later authenticated what His disciples wrote about Him and included it in the Holy Scripture.

Are you now saying that the Roman Government will authenticate a story that is not real and make her citizens believe such story?

Jesus himself knew this will happen that's why he said:

"When the Son of man arrives, will he really find this faith on the earth?" Luke 18:8

Well there's just one evidence today that Jesus once walked this planet but it's a pity Satan has blinded the minds of billions so they're against the one and only evidence.

Jesus said to JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES:

"But you will receive power when the holy spirit comes upon you, and you will be witnesses of me in Jerusalem, in all Ju·deʹa and Sa·marʹi·a, and to the most distant part of the earth.” Act 1:8

So the undeniable evidence that Jesus once walked this planet is here already {Matthew 5:14-16} case closed!

oteneaaron:


This arguement you referred to above, was covered extensively in this book - Who is this king of glory by Alvin Boyd Khun.

I am not arguing with the fact that people have seen "visions" or apparitions of "Jesus" - because in the inner depths of the human mind, there is a "divine mind" many of us are yet to realize.

But let me ask you, can these people who have had these visions decribe who they saw?

Did the person they saw in this "vision" look like the drawing of the white guy people popularly known as Jesus?

If yes, how can we trust such visions when there is no single archeological record that shows us how Jesus actually looked like?

I was not reffering to " Visions" of Jesus Christ, I am talking about " Physical manifestation of the power of Jesus Christ".

Let me give you an instance. In 2000, I attended Reinhard Bonnke' s crusade in Lagos. In my presence, a 15 years old blind boy from my community began to see. This boy is today working in UK.

If the name of Jesus Christ can make someone born blind to see at the age of 15 , then it means that there is a Spiritual being known as Jesus Christ.

Both lslam and Buhaddism confirmed the existence of this Spiritual being hence I do not need to read the book of a philosopher to verify His existence.

Remember that some Philosopher also believe that Man particularly Africans come from ape and have also wriiten great books to back up their claims.

MikeofAfrica:


You fail to answer any of my questions.

If Jesus Christ was created by the Romans to deceive the gullible Jews while then did the Romans later believe in Jesus Christ and founded the the first Universal Chruch to convince the world that Jesus Christ is Lord?

The fact that the Roman Government later became the pacesetter of the Gospel of Jesus Christ is enough evidence that Jesus existed and was not created by the Roman Government.

The reason why no historian wrote about Jesus during his time is because he was not a King or VIP. Historians only write about important personalities in their society.

Nevertheless, those who believe in Jesus Christ like his disciples and Apostle Paul wrote about Him.

The Roman Government later authenticated what His disciples wrote about Him and included it in the Holy Scripture.

Are you now saying that the Roman Government will authenticate a story that is not real and make her citizens believe such story?

Flavius Josephus born after the ministry of Jesus Christ was the first historian that wrote about Jesus Christ, so why did Flavius Josephus write about Jesus Christ he never saw if Jesus Christ was not a VIP.

During the time of Jesus Christ, the Roman emperors were regarded as gods so them creating a new religion was accepted as divine.

guysbewise:


Flavius Josephus born after the ministry of Jesus Christ was the first historian that write about Jesus Christ, so why did Flavius Josephus write about Jesus Christ he never saw if Jesus Christ was not a VIP.

During the time of Jesus, the Roman emperors were regarded as gods so them creating a new religion was accepted as divine.

Why are you avoiding the main issue that you raised.

Assuming the Roman Emperors are regarded as gods as you claim , will they form a new religion to deceive the Romans to worship a certain invention meant to decieve gullible jews.?

The truth is scared hence no matter how you twist the truth, it will surely expose your falsehood.

I do not know about Josephus . If he wrote Jesus, then he must have read the scrolls written by Apostle Paul and other Apostles.

The truth remains that the Romans themselves confirmed that Jesus Christ existed by accepting Him as the Messiah after His death and ressurrection.

sonmvayina:


How old are you?

Just give me a range....

It is only a kid that will believe the words of philosophers on Spiritual issues.

Since you believe that Jesus Christ does not exist due to what you read on a philosopher' s book , I hope you also believe that your ancestors are apes .

The philosophers have also written so many great books to prove that Africans are from apes. The same philosophers wants you to accept LGBTQ .

Those philosophers are actually fools in the sight of God.

Psalm 14 vs 1 says - " The fool says in his heart that there is no God. They are corrupt, they do abominable deeds and there is none among them that does good ".

MikeofAfrica:


Why are you avoiding the main issue that you raised.

Assuming the Roman Emperors are regarded as gods as you claim , will they form a new religion to deceive the Romans to worship a certain invention meant to decieve gullible jews.?

The truth is scared hence no matter how you twist the truth, it will surely expose your falsehood.

I do not know about Josephus . If he wrote Jesus, then he must have read the scrolls written by Apostle Paul and other Apostles.

The truth remains that the Romans themselves confirmed that Jesus Christ existed by accepting Him as the Messiah after His death and ressurrection.

You need to study Roman history to know what led to the Roman emperor Constantine making Christainity the official Roman religion about 300 years after the ministry of Jesus Christ.

There are no historical records of Apostle Paul and other Apostles.

You really need to study Roman history to know what really took place at that time and then you will become enlighthened to know that the questions you are asking are of no use on the topic

guysbewise:


I personally know someone who is always saying Jesus is Lord and is the only through way but the Sixth and Seventh Books of Moses was found in his room where he has been practicing it. Now I have come to realise that Jesus is just a coverup to control the gullible ones.

GOD of the Old Testament is the only LORD

Like the books were just found accidentally during a visit or errand or he did something bad and his room was investigated and the books were found. Which one?

sharpwriter:

Like the books were just found accidentally during a visit or errand or he did something bad and his room was investigated and the books were found. Which one?

Someone made his way into his room when he was out and found the Sixth and Seventh Books of Moses there.

And this is a man that always say those reading such books are worshiping Satan and are not following Jesus Christ

oteneaaron:


Awesome!!

Let's pick a book to start with.

For a start, I vote for either -

1. The Pagan Christ by Tom Hapur or

2. Who is this King of Glory by Alvin Boyd Khun.

What about you?

Just saw the preview of the pagan christ..sound interesting. Let's start with that first..

guysbewise:


You need to study Roman history to know what led to the Roman emperor Constantine making Christainity the official Roman religion about 300 years after the ministry of Jesus Christ.

There are no historical records of Apostle Paul and other Apostles.

You really need to study Roman history to know what really took place at that time and then you will become enlighthened to know that the questions you are asking are of no use on the topic

Let me ask you a simple question.

The historical record that you keep refering to was authenticated by who?

How am I not sure that the historical record you are referring to is not a fiction?

As long as religion and Spiritual issues are concern, there are two historical record accepted worldwide. They are the Holy Bible and Holy Quran. These two books superside every other book on Spiritual issues .

That is the reason Societies such as Freemason and Amork base their teaching on these two books. Those societies were founded by philosophers with Spiritual knowledge not those that believe that man came from ape.

Hence any philosopher whose teaching contradicts these two books is writing beautiful nonsense.

Legally, the history of Jesus Christ and the early apostles are authentic. They were confirmed by the ancient Roman Governments and the Goverments of ancient nations like Egypt, England, Greece and Arab nations.

MikeofAfrica:


It is only a kid that will believe the words of philosophers on Spiritual issues.

Since you believe that Jesus Christ does not exist due to what you read on a philosopher' s book , I hope you also believe that your ancestors are apes .

The philosophers have also written so many great books to prove that Africans are from apes. The same philosophers wants you to accept LGBTQ .

Those philosophers are actually fools in the sight of God.

Psalm 14 vs 1 says - " The fool says in his heart that there is no God. They are corrupt, they do abominable deeds and there is none among them that does good ".

I am not disputing the existence of Chukwu (Creator God) ..

But the idea that the creator of heaven and earth impregnated another man's wife to sire a son...meeen, you have to agree that is just bollocks except you are a dummy.

MikeofAfrica:


I was not reffering to " Visions" of Jesus Christ, I am talking about " Physical manifestation of the power of Jesus Christ".

Let me give you an instance. In 2000, I attended Reinhard Bonnke' s crusade in Lagos. In my presence, a 15 years old blind boy from my community began to see. This boy is today working in UK.

If the name of Jesus Christ can make someone born blind to see at the age of 15 , then it means that there is a Spiritual being known as Jesus Christ.

Both lslam and Buhaddism confirmed the existence of this Spiritual being hence I do not need to read the book of a philosopher to verify His existence.

Remember that some Philosopher also believe that Man particularly Africans come from ape and have also wriiten great books to back up their claims.

Interesting

Now we are getting somewhere.

Now about this "physical manifestation of the power of Jesus Christ".

What would you say about the "physical manifestation of power by the God's of our ancestors"?

What would you say about the "physical manifestation of power by the Asian Zen Masters"?

I'm sorry, but this doesn't cut as proof of the historicity of Jesus.

Maynman:

exactly, if you live in lagos state between 2000 and 2010, and a forged and edited book tells you that abacha was military governor of lagos state will you believe?

To debunk the lie, we’ll first look at who, how, when and why the book was written.
The book was meant for which audience?
No wonder the jews reject it

https://www.nairaland.com/7393471/isis-chrest-chrest#117738753

Let's discuss Maynman, was Jesus a real person historically? what's your reason for your answer present evidence to back up your answers that should be easy for you.

sonmvayina:


Just saw the preview of the pagan christ..sound interesting. Let's start with that first..

Awesome!

Should I create the thread where we share our thoughts or will you create it?

I will study chapter 1 and 2 today, and share my findings.

It's nice to have a study buddy on Nairaland.

MikeofAfrica:


Let me ask you a simple question.

The historical record that you keep refering to was authenticated by who?

How am I not sure that the historical record you are referring to is not a fiction?

As long as religion and Spiritual issues are concern, there are two historical record accepted worldwide. They are the Holy Bible and Holy Quran. These two books superside every other book on Spiritual issues .

That is the reason Societies such as Freemason and Amork base their teaching on these two books. Those societies were founded by philosophers with Spiritual knowledge not those that believe that man came from ape.

Hence any philosopher whose teaching contradicts these two books is writing beautiful nonsense.

Legally, the history of Jesus Christ and the early apostles are authentic. They were confirmed by the ancient Roman Governments and the Goverments of ancient nations like Egypt, England, Greece and Arab nations.

The New Testament is not a historical book. This topic is based on historical records.

GOD in the Old Testament never promised to mate with another man's wife to send his son so that he be crucified. If you study Greek and Roman history you will know that such is a Roman pagan belief.

Proving that Jesus Christ was a Roman invention does not disprove the GOD of Creation in the Old Testament.

Even we don't have the complete and original Old Testament today as the Romans tooks them away and hid them and the rest in Israel they destroyed

guysbewise:


Someone made his way into his room when he was out and found the Sixth and Seventh Books of Moses there.

And this is a man that always say those reading such books are worshiping Satan and are not following Jesus Christ

Lol... Well, I'm not interested in your topic, but what I have learnt about people of the world is hypocrisy or rather deception. They rarely show you the path that is blessing them or what they indulge in and enjoying from, but they know how to clamor on something watery so that your eyes won't find what they are doing in the original.

There is a thread on this nairaland where a guy said he has a very prayerful father (maybe MFM or so, can't remember the church). So he went to check something in his Dad's wardrobe and there he found a bat hanged down in there.

Questioning his father, his father only smiled, laughed and told him not to worry himself, no tangible explanation. The guy said since then, he hated him coz his Dad was someone who hammered on prayers, holiness heaven, hell bla bla.

Just like broda or papa wey dey preach abstinence but dey fvk olosho pass area Boys. Walahi people are crazy,

sonmvayina:


I am not disputing the existence of Chukwu (Creator God) ..

But the idea that the creator of heaven and earth impregnated another man's wife to sire a son...meeen, you have to agree that is just bollocks except you are a dummy.

I now get your position. However you are not on same page with the philosophers that you are mentioning their books. They do not believe there is a God in Heaven.

Regarding the issue that you raised, it is a mystery that only Spiritually enlightened people can understand.

God is a Spirit, Satan is a Spirit. Angels and Demons are also Spirits. It is possible for a Spirit to live in the body of a human being. That is why we have Obanje and Abiku in Nigeria . They are people possess by evil spirits.

In the case of birth of Jesus Christ, God did not carnally impregnate Mary . The Spirit of God moved into the womb of Mary and became flesh in her womb . Hence She became pregnant and gave birth to God . There was no Sexual intercourse involve because God does not need the assistance of a mortal to manifest in human form.

This mysterious birth of Jesus has been confirmed by other religions such as Islam. It has also been confirmed by Spirtitual societies such as Freemason, Amork and Enkankar.

Hence it is not a fiction. If we can believe that this Earth is Spherical in shape then we can also believe that God came into this Earth through a Virgin called Mary.

Lawag3:


Let's discuss Maynman, was Jesus a real person historically? what's your reason for your answer present evidence to back up your answers that should be easy for you.

Jesus is a common latin name, of course alot of jesus existed, have you read the talmud?

Now my question Lawag3, was Jesus a real person historically? what's your reason for your answer present evidence to back up your answers that should be easy for you.

MikeofAfrica:


I now get your position. However you are not on same page with the philosophers that you are mentioning their books. They do not believe there is a God in Heaven.

Regarding the issue that you raised, it is a mystery that only Spiritually enlightened people can understand.

God is a Spirit, Satan is a Spirit. Angels and Demons are also Spirits. It is possible for a Spirit to live in the body of a human being. That is why we have Obanje and Abiku in Nigeria . They are people possess by evil spirits.

In the case of birth of Jesus Christ, God did not carnally impregnate Mary . The Spirit of God moved into the womb of Mary and became flesh in her womb . Hence She became pregnant and gave birth to God . There was no Sexual intercourse involve because God does not need the assistance of a mortal to manifest in human form.

This mysterious birth of Jesus has been confirmed by other religions such as Islam. It has also been confirmed by Spirtitual societies such as Freemason, Amork and Enkankar.

Hence it is not a fiction. If we can believe that this Earth is Spherical in shape then we can also believe that God came into this Earth through a Virgin called Mary.

Hahahahha,

So you are a dummy then?