Tassembly: I really want to know if this tbills worth it, if i invest 250,000 in that fcmb for 91days at a stop rate of let say 10percent,does it mean i will get 25000naira or just quarter pay of 8,100naira plus.

The interest rate is Per annum. So you must divide the overall interest by 4 to get the quarterly interest rate for a 91-day T-bills, and divide by 2 for 182 days T-bills.

Elai147:

First bank only offers 91 days T-bills. I have 75% of my T-bill investment with First bank even though they refused to offer me more than 91 days T-bill. I don't think First bank can cheat you. They only bid for you at their best prevailing bid rate. So far, their rates have been very okay. Your best bet may be to use another bank for the 182 days T-bill. The interest rate is not fixed for every auction date.

@ Elai147
Tanx so much elai. I went to first bank to roll it frm 91 to 182days last month june while I was told to write before next rollover which was july 18th in which I did. Up till today, I called d person incharge why said they will send my interest.

festher:
@ Elai147
Tanx so much elai. I went to first bank to roll it frm 91 to 182days last month june while I was told to write before next rollover which was july 18th in which I did. Up till today, I called d person incharge why said they will send my interest.

are u saying dt u hv nt received any interest since dec 2012

festher:
@ Elai147
Tanx so much elai. I went to first bank to roll it frm 91 to 182days last month june while I was told to write before next rollover which was july 18th in which I did. Up till today, I called d person incharge why said they will send my interest.

Some banks are usually very slow in crediting investors account. My last roll over was effected last month June 26, and I only received my interest on July 15 after so much complaints to Firstcontact. You have to keep disturbing them to credit your interest in your account.

Elai147:

Some banks are usually very slow in crediting investors account. My last roll over was effected last month June 26, and I only received my interest on July 15 after so much complaints to Firstcontact. You have to keep disturbing them to credit your interest in your account.

my bank debits my account the net amount only , effectively leaving over the applicable interest figure. ie assuming the bid amt is N10 and the applicable int is N2, they'll debit my account N8 and on maturity credit my account N10. i tot that was general practice; didn't know one needs to stress for the interest like this.

ayztech:

my bank debits my account the net amount only , effectively leaving over the applicable interest figure. ie assuming the bid amt is N10 and the applicable int is N2, they'll debit my account N8 and on maturity credit my account N10. i tot that was general practice; didn't know one needs to stress for the interest like this.

madam which bank are you using?

^^^
Ecobank

ayztech:

my bank debits my account the net amount only , effectively leaving over the applicable interest figure. ie assuming the bid amt is N10 and the applicable int is N2, they'll debit my account N8 and on maturity credit my account N10. i tot that was general practice; didn't know one needs to stress for the interest like this.

I think that's exactly what other banks are doing, the only difference is how they are reporting it. Deducting ₦10 and paying back ₦2 immediately is the same as deducting ₦8.

i know that Seun...was only pointing out why an investor should NOT wait for the upfront interest as if it were a totally different transaction.

ayztech:

my bank debits my account the net amount only , effectively leaving over the applicable interest figure. ie assuming the bid amt is N10 and the applicable int is N2, they'll debit my account N8 and on maturity credit my account N10.

Ditto for Diamond Bank. God bless Nigeria.

ayztech: i know that Seun...was only pointing out why an investor should NOT wait for the upfront interest as if it were a totally different transaction.

If your bank deducts the full face value of the tbill upfront, as it seems to be the case with the people complaining, then the upfront interest is very important. If the interest is delayed for one month, as they reported, that represents one month of lost interest. The fact that your bank conducts transactions with integrity does not in any way eliminate the possibility that some other banks cheat their customers by deducting the full face value of tbills purchased and delaying the payment of the interest/discount for a month or two while they earn interest on it.

Seun: If your bank deducts the full face value of the tbill upfront, as it seems to be the case with the people complaining, then the upfront interest is very important. If the interest is delayed for one month, as they reported, that represents one month of lost interest that they would have gained if they reinvested the amount elsewhere. The fact that your bank conducts transactions with integrity does not in any way eliminate the possibility that some other banks cheat their customers by deducting the full face value of tbills purchased and delaying the payment of the interest/discount for a month or two while they earn interest on it.

Gbam...... Any bank that is involved in this should be reported to appropriate quarters or even be sued!!!

ayztech:

my bank debits my account the net amount only , effectively leaving over the applicable interest figure. ie assuming the bid amt is N10 and the applicable int is N2, they'll debit my account N8 and on maturity credit my account N10. i tot that was general practice; didn't know one needs to stress for the interest like this.

Seun: If your bank deducts the full face value of the tbill upfront, as it seems to be the case with the people complaining, then the upfront interest is very important. If the interest is delayed for one month, as they reported, that represents one month of lost interest that they would have gained if they reinvested the amount elsewhere. The fact that your bank conducts transactions with integrity does not in any way eliminate the possibility that some other banks cheat their customers by deducting the full face value of tbills purchased and delaying the payment of the interest/discount for a month or two while they earn interest on it.

@ayztech, Seun is right. First bank usually debit the face value from my account and some times I have to worry them before I get my interest but this is not always the case. Meanwhile, Keystone bank only deduct the value of the bill and leave the discount rate in my account for my immediate use, which is very good. So it actually varies with banks.

Seun: If your bank deducts the full face value of the tbill upfront, as it seems to be the case with the people complaining, then the upfront interest is very important. If the interest is delayed for one month, as they reported, that represents one month of lost interest that they would have gained if they reinvested the amount elsewhere. The fact that your bank conducts transactions with integrity does not in any way eliminate the possibility that some other banks cheat their customers by deducting the full face value of tbills purchased and delaying the payment of the interest/discount for a month or two while they earn interest on it.

Firstbank is used to delaying interest. At one time it took about 7 weeks for them to credit my account after i had made over 4 visits to their office.

Elai147:



@ayztech, Seun is right. First bank usually debit the face value from my account and some times I have to worry them before I get my interest but this is not always the case. Meanwhile, Keystone bank only deduct the value of the bill and leave the discount rate in my account for my immediate use, which is very good. So it actually varies with banks.

Does keystone bank allow 182 days bid and do they bid for you?

And Seun, if plain faced truthed posts will be modified so to suit your self styled standards, your courtesy and reasoning models need a sublime reappraisal cos this level doesnt churn it.
No reasonable body is here to walk on eggshells or pamper tantrums.

Desanta:

Does keystone bank allow 182 days bid and do they bid for you?

Yes they have 182 days but I always do 91 days and so that's what they bid for me.

Hey house..this is my ist time of biddin tru UBA and i am biddin for 364 days..pls one wit UBA experience..then any info on today stop rate

Done a little research the past couple of days. Going to a couple of banks and calling some others.


GTBank requires N500,000 for Nigerian FGN T-Bill investments.

Diamond Bank, N100,000.

Stanbic , their bid form clearly states: N100,000 minimum but the guy at the CS counter told me it is N500,000. I disagree with him.


Ghana T-Bills, 90 - 180 day tenor are purchasable only by Ghanians (Citizens).
Non-Ghanians are only allowed to purchase the longer term bond products, ( 3 or 5 yr)


Hopefully this will help someone.


Peace.

Forgot to add Ecobank to my list above.


No definite minimum, I told him N200,000 and he said that would be OK but they preferred N500,000 upwards.

This thread is really commendable. Pls I will like to know the best and most efficient bank in Treasury bill investment. That is, a bank that pays interest as at when due and will terminate the investment when you request. I once tried first bank, and it took them 2wks to make a successful bid, it also took about some days to terminate. Infact they once paid an incomplete interest(19k instead of 21k) I had to complain befor they returned my money. So which bank is the best?

This thread is really commendable. Pls I will like to know the best and most efficient bank in Treasury bill investment. That is, a bank that pays interest as at when due and will terminate the investment when you request. I once tried first bank, and it took them 2wks to make a successful bid, it also took about some days to terminate. Infact they once paid an incomplete interest(19k instead of 21k) I had to complain before they paid the difference. So which bank is the best?

coderXO: Done a little research the past couple of days. Going to a couple of banks and calling some others.


GTBank requires N500,000 for Nigerian FGN T-Bill investments.

Diamond Bank, N100,000.

Stanbic , their bid form clearly states: N100,000 minimum but the guy at the CS counter told me it is N500,000. I disagree with him.


Ghana T-Bills, 90 - 180 day tenor are purchasable only by Ghanians (Citizens).
Non-Ghanians are only allowed to purchase the longer term bond products, ( 3 or 5 yr)


Hopefully this will help someone.


Peace.

Oga CoderXO, I thank you SMNly for this post. Abeg, regarding the Ghanian TBs, what are the interest rates?
How can one tap into the Ghanian or/and Southern African Market in terms of TBs? Can IBTC be of any help here?

TBILLS CBN STOP RATES FOR 25/07/2013

91 days ---------11.60%

182 days --------12.75%

364 days ---------13.33%


I would definitely be throwing my bid come August 6th ....The new CBN CRR rates would only make the banks to sell down on their Tbills and as such attract higher rates for us in the Auction!

Happy Investing!

Mpeace :
This thread is really commendable. Pls I will like to know the best and most efficient bank in Treasury bill investment. That is, a bank that pays interest as at when due and will terminate the investment when you request. I once tried first bank, and it took them 2wks to make a successful bid, it also took about some days to terminate. Infact they once paid an incomplete interest(19k instead of 21k) I had to complain before they paid the difference. So which bank is the best?

I have never used a bank for my Tbills Transaction.. Rather use The Discount Houses, or boutique investment banks..

feelamong: TBILLS CBN STOP RATES FOR 25/07/2013

91 days ---------11.60%

182 days --------12.75%

364 days ---------13.33%


I would definitely be throwing my bid come August 6th ....The new CBN CRR rates would only make the banks to sell down on their Tbills and as such attract higher rates for us in the Auction!

Happy Investing!

12.75% is not bad at all

I went to my banks today to check their minimum TB opening package. Zenith bank said 1 million. Gtbank 500k , keystone as low as 100k. At keystone, the guy said they have currently 126 day duration to offer me at 11%. This must be their internal holding they want to sublet to me.. I think rather nse now.

Generally, I've found that you need to at least domicile wherever you want to purchase these bills (via banks).
They want you to have an account with them from which they will debit the funds when they have successfully bid on your behalf.

When I inquired from one bank in Ghana about opening an account, they said I needed a residency permit (like really, for even a savings account?).


The Ghana rate (20-22%) is very attractive but the citizen requirement on the short term T-Bills would eliminate most of us on here (whom I expect are Nigerians). I am contemplating a roundabout investment through a Ghanaian Discount House product (something similar to Kakawa KGIF) which returns 20-24% per annum. I am only willing to risk N100,000 on that one however.


Unless you are investing large sums, I don't think it would be worth your while, logistics and all, to invest across borders. By the time you have travelled there to open account etc etc etc, you've eaten up your expected return.


A quick google search on South African Bonds tells me the rate is 5-6%. Not bad if you are coming from Europe or America (where the interest rates are near 0% right now), but certainly not the highest in Africa. In turn, you are buying securities of a more stable government. The risk is is far less.

Generally, T-Bill rates will hover around the country's central bank interest rate but will often be slightly higher.


Peace.

coderXO: Generally, I've found that you need to at least domicile wherever you want to purchase these bills (via banks).
They want you to have an account with them from which they will debit the funds when they have successfully bid on your behalf.

When I inquired from one bank in Ghana about opening an account, they said I needed a residency permit (like really, for even a savings account?).


The Ghana rate (20-22%) is very attractive but the citizen requirement on the short term T-Bills would eliminate most of us on here (whom I expect are Nigerians). I am contemplating a roundabout investment through a Ghanaian Discount House product (something similar to Kakawa KGIF) which returns 20-24% per annum. I am only willing to risk N100,000 on that one however.


Unless you are investing large sums, I don't think it would be worth your while, logistics and all, to invest across borders. By the time you have travelled there to open account etc etc etc, you've eaten up your expected return.


A quick google search on South African Bonds tells me the rate is 5-6%. Not bad if you are coming from Europe or America (where the interest rates are near 0% right now), but certainly not the highest in Africa. In turn, you are buying securities of a more stable government. The risk is is far less.

Generally, T-Bill rates will hover around the country's central bank interest rate but will often be slightly higher.


Peace.

Bless you.

coderXO: Generally, I've found that you need to at least domicile wherever you want to purchase these bills (via banks).
They want you to have an account with them from which they will debit the funds when they have successfully bid on your behalf.

When I inquired from one bank in Ghana about opening an account, they said I needed a residency permit (like really, for even a savings account?).


The Ghana rate (20-22%) is very attractive but the citizen requirement on the short term T-Bills would eliminate most of us on here (whom I expect are Nigerians). I am contemplating a roundabout investment through a Ghanaian Discount House product (something similar to Kakawa KGIF) which returns 20-24% per annum. I am only willing to risk N100,000 on that one however.

I also researched Ghana Tbills and was almost going to bite the bullet but I decided with my head and pulled out last minute.The value of the Ghanaian Cedi has been eroded drastically since the new Cedi was introduced in 2007 and if this devaluation trend continues (most likely will) it will be a complete waste of time investing in their Tbills.

In 2007 $1 = 0.92GHc and in 2012 it was $1 = 1.82 GHc (now it's $1 = 2GHc). If you invested 1000GHc in 2007 and rolled over and compounded it over 5 years at 20%PA, you will have had 2490GHc in 2012. Your original 1000GHc could get you $1085 in 2007. In 2012 your 2496GHc would have bought you $1368. In real terms, only a profit of $283 over 5 years i.e. true yield of 5% annually

Not worth the stress in my opinion.

pappilo:

I also researched Ghana Tbills and was almost going to bite the bullet but I decided with my head and pulled out last minute.The value of the Ghanaian Cedi has been eroded drastically since the new Cedi was introduced in 2007 and if this devaluation trend continues (most likely will) it will be a complete waste of time investing in their Tbills.

In 2007 $1 = 0.92GHc and in 2012 it was $1 = 1.82 GHc (now it's $1 = 2GHc). If you invested 1000GHc in 2007 and rolled over and compounded it over 5 years you will have had 2490GHc in 2012. Your original 1000GHc could get you $1085 in 2007. In 2012 your 2496GHc would have bought you $1368. In real terms, only a profit of $283 over 5 years i.e. true yield of 5% annually

Not worth the stress in my opinion.

Very True...the Ghanian Cedi should be the worst performing currency in the world now! then add that to the wastful govt you have in place now and the fact that there is still some level of political instability over the last election results... for me its a no no no!

pappilo:
I also researched Ghana Tbills and was almost going to bite the bullet but I decided with my head and pulled out last minute.The value of the Ghanaian Cedi has been eroded drastically since the new Cedi was introduced in 2007 and if this devaluation trend continues (most likely will) it will be a complete waste of time investing in their Tbills.

In 2007 $1 = 0.92GHc and in 2012 it was $1 = 1.82 GHc (now it's $1 = 2GHc). If you invested 1000GHc in 2007 and rolled over and compounded it over 5 years at 20%PA, you will have had 2490GHc in 2012. Your original 1000GHc could get you $1085 in 2007. In 2012 your 2496GHc would have bought you $1368. In real terms, only a profit of $283 over 5 years i.e. true yield of 5% annually

Not worth the stress in my opinion.

Excellent analysis and post by pappilo. Fully agree.