2. On Benin, there's no need to mislead anybody. Nobody has really claimed that every single Benin king and soldier was righteous and valiant and pure and all that fairytale crap you see written about kings and soldiers of any kingdom in some books or shown in movies. Didn't I already bring up Oba Ohen who committed  a grave crime in ordering the murder of an Iyase and was stoned to death (rather than asking a loyal retine to carry him somewhere and found a town, he accepted his fate like a man) for his crime? Please, nobody is under the impression that [b]every single Oba of Benin was all righteous and nobody has said anything like that. When the first history book published on Benin lists at least three kings who are remembered as erring greatly, and subsequent books uphold these traditions, I think it's clear that nobody is making such claims. In Benin, as in every other kingdom, there were good and bad rulers.

3. I'm not interested in later claims about why the Omu title was created, all I know is that since it has foreign inspiration, there is no sensible claim anyone can make about it being inspired by a woman who was supposedly loathed by the Obi of Obior's ancestor. Your elders can construct stories about the Iyoba having servants who farmed outside of her territory and other claims but it's not going to convince anybody that any particular title was adopted in imitation of someone who was loathed, overstepped their bounds, or who was responsible for their ancestor fleeing in the night from punishment for his crimes.

The role of an Omu is to take care of the king spiritually( and taake care of the markets)  along with the Ezedibie and Sekute( or Ohenukwu) who is his chaplain.We donot give or have  any political role to  any member of the kings family    neither   his wife nor his mother and in the past an Omu never marries, That of course cant be the case in Benin and the  Iyoba. Let me ask one simple question, in Benin before Idia what was the fate of all Queen mothers in Benin ? I will like you to use your expert knowledge (like  you do of Benin moats) to educate us .

1,  The fate of queen mothers? There were no queen mothers, but only queens. But if you are referring to some claim that the mothers of kings had to die before the king could ascend the throne, I think you should go back and see if that claim holds up to scrutiny. Did Erinmwinde have to die? Try and think these things through first. When the second Benin dynasty was created, the Uzama did not make any rule about Princess Erinmwinde needing to die. I am familiar with the sources for these claims, and as with Egharevba, I don't believe everything written when it doesn't make sense. In the coronation rituals of an Oba, which were developed by Oba Ewedo long before Oba Esigie and Queen Idia lived, I have not read anything about the alleged killing of any queen mother.

The decision of a few people to claim, only when recounting stories about Queen Idia, that the other queen mothers were killed before her is obviously a detail added for dramatic effect and contrast between her importance and the insignificance of previous mothers of kings.

In fact, the specific claim doesn't even make any sense. Apart from the fact that Princess Erinmwinde was not killed, and that there is no mention of any other king's mother being killed in any other coronation ritual, there is the glaring question of how Queen Idia was even alive at the time of the Idah war if she was supposed to have been killed before her son could ascend the throne. Try and apply a little common sense to these kind of claims next time.

Supposedly, the queen mothers had to be killed before the son could ascend the throne, yet there is no mention of this alleged tradition in any story or tradition that is not about Queen Idia, and Queen Idia herself was not killed before Esigie could become Oba.

4)Why do you lie so much ? Go through your posts again and see your conclusion after all the "deliberation" on "Chi" and "Ehi", It is your conclusion that matter and not what you have deliberated earlier.

1. I've never said anything definite in this thread about Chima himself being Igbo. I actually thought it was implausible at first (but not impossible) for him to be Edo, but then I saw a possibility when bokohalal brought up Ehima a while back in another thread, but even then I did not make any definite pronouncement on what he was. I don't recall ever discussing Chime/Chima's exact ethnicity with you earlier than my last response to you. My only discussion of that subject prior to my previous response to you was in other threads with other posters. The only thing I claimed was that the other people who migrated with Chima were probably Igbo to begin with since they went to the very Igbo heartland (Onitsha). This is what I believed even prior to this thread simply because it explains the story of the migration well enough to me.

I don't really care what he was or wasn't in terms of ethnicity and I have already told you the implications of any claim about his migrating to somewhere after assaulting an old woman over some yams.

Your problem is pride , to accept that most of your points have been countered by me. You claim that I am an "expert" I will say yes on Anioma history and culture(I thank Abagworo for reminding me ) and exposing your lies. It was after you failed to prove that Ala and Ali mean the same thing

1. I did not say "Ala and Ali" mean the same thing, rather I thought they were different. Then Andre Uweh explained that they were really the same thing but only different because they were used among different groups.


2. You telling me that my problem is pride is just unbelievable. It's really just ridiculous.

that you came up again with a new invention "Ailelehan" for Alilehan , I dey laugh oooohhhh.Then let me name the second one for you, Alisor becoming "Ailelisor "  I suppose and even the completely assimilated village of Alibudo originally could have sounded as "Ailebudo", You no try abeg. So if it was Ailelehan all the while , why did not point at it from the beginning ?

1. Wait, wait, wait a minute. I think there is some real confusion here. Not only did I not make up that name (Aileleihan), it's a bonafide, 100% genuine Edo name that has existed before I was born. I don't know how you concluded  that I made it up or that I was making claims on any other Ika speaking towns that use the prefix "Ali". My point was that you could not explain the name, although you had already attempted to explain the first part of it, despite the fact that you are an Ika speaking person yourself and even an expert.

I would not be surprised if you cooked up some Nollywood story now about a certain "Lehan" in an attempt to give a meaning for the rest of it or if you went on to talk about the "land of Lehan" or something next, although you had no idea about the meaning of the rest of the name initially and when Lehan is not a name among Igbos or Edos.

And I'm not talking about any of those other communities. I'm only talking about the actual Edo speaking communities (Oza nogogo, Alilehan, Alisor)

Aileleihan is a real Bini name with a very clear meaning and you can confirm that with other people. You don't have to take my word for it at all.

As for Alisor, I have already read where an actual Oza nogogo man has said that it's real name is Evboesor (Esor community/people) and that it is "popularly called" Alisor, i.e., the Ika speaking people call it Alisor. In other words they both call it community/land of Esor, but the Ika speaking peoples' designation is popular rather than the name used by the Edo (Oza) speaking peoples (the actual people themselves). How true is this?

2. For you to accuse me of making up a name that has existed before I even existed is just absurd.

As for the "i" that you think I'm adding, that is just another assumption. Some Edo remember to keep the i in some names, while others drop it. For example the name Ayobahan is a mispelling of Aiyobahan. The name is Aiyobahan rather than Ayobahan, yet one will encounter Binis bearing the name Ayobahan. The habit of some Edo people (when using the Latin alphabet to express the language) to drop some vowels here and there does not mean that the same name is not being referred to. And if a native born Bini man in the heart of Benin city can start calling his name Ayobahan instead of Aiyobahan, then certainly a relatively small and relatively isolated group of Bini speakers in Aniomaland can start dropping vowels in their spelling as well.

In truth, the fact that Binis in Benin city itself already drop some vowels in their names that may seem superfluous only makes the case even stronger for Alilehan to be a Bini word.

(And in case you are wondering (and you should be) how I was so easily able to identify it as probably being an actual Bini name, here's a hint: the end part of the name (han) was a something of a giveaway. Of course there are other ethnic groups that will have names with similar endings, but I have come across it too many times among Binis to not suspect that it was Bini, especially given that the town itself speaks a variant of Bini.)

Ogbuefi 1: Clearly a belated case of fabrication. It reminded of what I heard one day abt Asaba town, The Edo historian said it comes from "Aisaba" because the Edo warriors could not cross the river. Whereas the original name of Asaba is AHABA (Asaba being the Aboh pronounciation since the colonialists penetrated via Aboh) and the foundation of the town has nothing to do with Edo warriors.

3. I don't care about all these claims by people I've never spoken to or interacted with. And their claim must have been about Aisabor (we can't go beyond this) not Aisaba (Aisaba - we can't do this- is also valid as a name, but would not make literal sense as easily), but this has nothing to do with my statement about Alilehan.

I really doubt that it's a coincidence that

a) Alilehan is Edo speaking (not merely Edoid, but specifically, they speak a variant of the Bini (Edo) language)
b) there is a perfect correspondence between their name and an old Bini name
c) you can't explain the meaning of their name, despite being an "expert" and despite attempting to explain the first part of their name

That's all I'm saying.

4. I recall you claiming that the Esan claiming of Inyelen was particularly faulty because there was nothing like "ny" in the Esan language. Now, I don't care whether the claim is faulty or not because that's not what I'm debating, but I think you should apply the same reasoning that you used for Inyelen to the town of Alilehan.

Is there actually anything in the entire Igbo language that actually sounds like Alilehan? Unless you can provide any evidence, I think you should just admit that it is not an Igbo name. The people themselves are not Igbo anyways.

5. In terms of unbelievable stories about names, I don't think you can possibly complain here, considering  how strongly you advocate that story about Chime (a very standard Igbo name that has nothing to do with Benin influence) needing to be an Igbo version/interpretation of Ikhime (an Esan name), the name of a man from Udo. You already explained how a few Esan turn "kh" into "ch" but that has little bearing on Udo as there is no evidence of this linguistic trait among people there nor is there evidence that they ever used the name Ikhime (unless you start constructing theories of arbitrary ancient migrations from Edo central (Esan) into Ovia southwest (Udo), which makes the story even more shaky.)

Anyways, I find Ehima --> Chima to be more plausible than Ikhime ---> Chime.

But I don't see how you can complain about the false Aisabor ---> Asaba story yet advocate so strongly for the Ikhime ----> Chime story when the same criticisms apply.

This is little different from how some people were insisting that Eweka comes from Owomika, but if you told them Oduduwa came from Izoduwa or Imadoduwa they responded as if you were crazy. There are other pure Edo names like Aduwa or Oduwa or Okhoduwa or Odowa that could actually fit the bill much better than Izoduwa, but people shouldn't object so strongly to one story (the Izoduwa story) but then advocate another story (the Owomika story) that can be objected to on the same grounds. That's what I think you're doing here with this Ikhime and Aisabor thing. I don't believe for a minute that Asaba comes from "Aisabor" but don't insist on your Ikhime story (which even Abagworo doesn't believe) and act as if others are ignorant because they don't accept that specific name.

Ogbuefi 1: 5)Why do you keep comparing Edo to Delta in those reports ? I said you should make comparisons between Edo and the Anioma part of Delta State simple.Are you shy to do that ? Considering your love for lenghty posts which have often been held by the spam box I will expect you eduacte me via your analysis of the report itself. I am not the author of the report and the authors some of whom were Edo people were commissioned by the United Nations.I therefore have every justification to use it as evidence.I am yet to get any response , Just name 10 projects of note, I have been waiting.Even the rating of Edo is cosmetic because like I noted earlier there is large urbanized population which is very cosmopolitan and that ill brought up boy Exothief have always pointed to that fact.
I have challenged you severally to post whatever you want in bits so that we can expose ourselves but you keep complaining of spam box.Or could that be an excuse ? After all I posted some which did not reflect yet never complained.

1. Do you have such enormous problems with reading comprehension that somehow, you still don't understand that the data for Anioma LGAs was also based on state (Delta) HDI (it was used as a benchmark to make estimates) and that the GDP index data for the LGAs was similarly based entirely on state GDP and not local GDP? Did you actually read the report or did you miss the part where it said oil revenue was factored into calculating this same state GDP which affects several of the other relevant statistics (such as HDI)?

There is nothing like any independent study of the individual LGAs of the states in that UN report and you should stop trying to mislead people into thinking that there are.

2. And so what if an Edo person was one of the authors? I don't think my own people are infallible. I also insist that you have some reading comprehension problems, or are a deliberate propagandist because the report insists in multiple statements that its indices are not really reflective of what's on the ground.


3. Where did I say "mega-infrastructural projects" were completed in Edo state? I already said Delta state was one of the major oil states in Nigeria, so I'm not surprised at their being able to carry out any large projects in any area of Delta state. As for Edo state and oil money, as I said before, Edo state is barely using its oil, but this is not necessarily an issue just now.

6)I base my own research on what I see and from all the years I have been in Yorubaland I have never seen the breadfruit as a food item.Yours however is based on stories written by others without authenticating these so-called claims.I judge with what I see and not what people have written.I will only accept that a tiny population of the Yoruba having been exposed to Igbos living in their villages got to appreciate the nutritional value of the food.I have got several instances.I have a friend from Ugep and he sincerely told me that though they have the tree in their community, it was when he got to Imo state that he got exposed to the food.There is also another case of a lady from Apoi/Ikale( incidentally in the same state where FUT Akure is located ) told me that breadfruit whose occurence in greater in riverine environments was not originally a food item in their place she she grew up in the village(Gbekebo) but it was Igbo people in their midst that introduced it and it has now been accepted as a food item in their community.We are not talking abt the nutritional contents of economic trees , we are talking history here and there are evidence that in Yorubaland they did not consider the breadfruit as a source of food until recently.
My guy your laughter dey expose your ignorance oooohhhh, Abeg try reduce your google small, Come over and get your facts from your own research Ok.It is just an advice.

1. This is starting to get ridiculous. So they merely named the fruit, but didn't ever use it for food, until they met Igbos or other groups?

2. Do my own research? I already said I'm not going to bother asking around because it's irrelevant.

For one thing I don't believe that Yorubas named the fruit but never ate it.

Next, I don't believe that each one of those four researchers, are so ignorant of their own culture and cuisine that they erred in writing what they did.

Finally, the theoretical error in your whole reasoning which you can't get around is that there cannot even be a date attached to the first eating of breadfruit among certain groups so it's irrelevant to the issue of ancient contact, ancient expansion, or ancient moats. For all you know any supposed "breadfruit eating" interaction in which the habit of eating breadfruit was spread from any one group to another only took place in 1200 or 1500 AD or any other date and not necessarily in some really ancient time like you keep trying to assume.

Now how hard is that to comprehend? Go somewhere else with that weak fruit theory of yours.

And by the way, I doubt very much that you base all of your claims on what you see, given some of your previous statements and claims on this thread.

7)ON GARRICK, Is this the only point you could get ? I think it came up after a thorough search on the net.

A thorough search on the net? I have relatives that went to the school named after him. I've known who he is a for a while, More unfounded assumptions. And how can one even search on the net for something as general as a non-Bini who was given a title and somehow come up with his specific name (Garrick) or a link about him through a search anyways?! Do you even know how searches work? That's not even probable.

I was not suprised that Garrick was granted "baronnic lands" in a frontier province as a bulwark against Ijaw expansion and it sounded nice since the entre area itself was not densely populated.

It's good that you finally have the guts to admit to Ijaw expansionism in lands they are not indigenous to. Siluko was not in any way founded by Ijaws and all the Ijaws there migrated there not in ancient times, but much later. Of course, now it is being used for claims for new Ijaw LGAs by some groups.

I also find it curious on the lists of Garrick's descendants included the famous Alagoa family of Nembe Bayelsa State and Gwam family of Asaba (in Aniomaland) and yet despite being the "Egaibu" or whatever of Siluko none of his supposed descendants is from Edo state where a school is named after him. Aniomalands also have examples of people in the mould of Garrick.A good example is Zappa of Asaba who is an Italian (priest) settler in the community and whose name is now used as the name of one of the primary schools in the town.

Why is it curious that his descendants are Ijaw, Igbo or Yoruba? I don't even understand this claim. Who was claiming that he really "integrated" or "assimilated" even the least bit into Edo society? Weren't you the one trying to claim that someone had to be integrated into Edo society to receive a title? One particular Dutch trader (Abrams Raems) was given an honorary title in Benin in the 1700s! (you should have known this already, Mr. Expert) Your claim was rubbish.

Yeah, I'm quite familiar with Father Carlo Zappa who went there and chastised the people for human sacrifice and other things, but I don't recall reading that he was granted a title by anybody.

I asked a simple question, which was if you could prove that Chief Igbe is of Urhobo origin.Because we have often heard of some "notable" Benins being claimed to have different ethnic background.At one time we heard that the Igbinedions were of Esan origin because of the Esama title, in another occassion Lawrence Anini was claimed to be of Igbo origin hence the nick name "Ovbi Igbo" not long ago , it was Odigie Oyegun that was claimed to be of Urhobo origin.Oyegun himself in one occasiondismissed those claims saying he actually comes from Ikoha and his mother is an Urhobo woman from Agbassa(Warri urban).

Igho Natufe (Urhobo) did not deny that Chief Igbe is of Urhobo origin, so what other proof are you requesting? I don't know the Chief personally to be going around asking people of his origins, but if some Binis and some Urhobos agree that he is of Urhobo origin, then there's no issue there for me.

On Chief Edebiri, Hahaha, Na wa, This world is a small place but I can tell you that my father knew Chief Edebiri personally and they hve been friends for a very long time.Let e just leave it at that.You see in Nigeria because of our strucutral lapses, anyone can claim whatever.I really dont care if he says he was even the person the who led the fight for independence.

1. I also know Chief Edebiri. He is very friendly and affable. The new additions to his palace (the art on the walls about Asoro, the hydra, etc.) are beautiful.

2. He didn't say anywhere that he led the fight for independence. I don't see how describing yourself as a footsoldier equates to saying that you led something. He was given a national honor a while back, though.

Ogbuefi 1: 9)You implied it yourself.The relationship between the Oba and the NCNC was based on mutual interest.I will advice you take a deeper look on your post.

Look deeper? In 1949, there is no evidence that Oba Akenzua II, who even initially wanted to steer clear of any outside (of the Midwest) political influence on the Midwest creation movement would have been motivated to go out of his way to help the Zikists by a need for gain from the NCNC. In fact, what could they have done for him? In fact, in 1949, what humiliations had he suffered to make him think he couldn't work with a (not yet extant) Western region government if things went well? In fact, did the Action Group even exist in 1949 for the Oba of Benin to be preemptively aligning with its possible future rivals? This is just nonsense.

10)On the Osagie vs Nwanze issue , I did try to get into Google scholar to make comparisons and behold , there were more citations on Prof Nwanze than Prof Osagie.Rather than jump into conclusion I will advice you take a more thorough look at your post.But I will not take this Google whatever as conclusive because neither you nor me have access to their academic achievements.That is fact ! But was is important is that both men were tested for the job and Nwanze came tops.He got that position on merit.I will advice that you shouldnt be sentimental here.

1. Can you even use Google correctly? It's not that hard. You probably included all sorts of Nwanzes in there without checking the actual names (like whether the publications were by somebody whose first name actually started with a K, instead of an E). Or you even included papers that cited Nwanze but were not authored by Nwanze. The same mistakes could be made for the many people with the last name Osagie, yet you just so happened to make it for Nwanze. Anthony Osagie has over 500 citations and you have to go through many pages of a search just to see all the publications. It's not just the publications on the first page or the first few pages. And Nwanze has nowhere near 500 citations. Please redo your search. Search "A Osagie" and "E Nwanze" and see what comes up.

Those articles with EA Nwanze, EAC Nwanze, and E Nwanze as the author are publications by Emmanuel Andrew Chukwuedo Nwanze  (as long as they are in the right field of science).

Publications with A Osagie and AU Osagie as an author are publications by Anthony U. Osagie (as long as they are in the correct field of science)

2. It's okay to say that he was not unfit for the position.

What's not okay is to insinuate that he got the position ahead of a Bini because of some inadequacy on the part of the Binis - which is exactly what you did.

Nwanze was never

a) Dean of Science at any university
b) president of Nigeria's biochemistry society

and he was

c) academically junior
d) someone with less administrative experience in terms of leading departments or institutions
e) someone with far fewer publications and citations

So let's leave it at that.

11)If you claim that Prof Emovon is the first Phd holder in Physical Chemistry that is your own problem. Because I have seen where it has been claimed rightly or wrongly like the case with Prof Ndili. On the list of Edo achievers I saw a long one you posted in one of this discussions/debates on Nairaland and I dont think the list you can manufacture would be longer than the one you had paraded as Edo "notables" and guess wht I saw the name of Prof Ekhaguere as expected.But I can tell you he ranks less in achievements to Prof Maduemezia (of Anioma) who incidentally was specialized in the same Mathematical Physics like Prof Ekhaguere but have had a more glorious career as an academician.He was at one time VC of the Bendel State University and was nominated at a time for the Nobel Prize for Physics so dont give that crap.

1. I have not seen where Binis or anyone else claimed decisively that Dr. Emovon had the first Ph.D in physical chemistry or first Ph.D in chemistry in Africa. Maybe they did, or maybe you're trying to mislead people. Either way, it's not really relevant. All I was pointing out is that modesty and cautiousness in these kind of claims is better. I could make all sorts of claims - Emovon was the first physical chemist, Iyahen was the first topologist in Africa etc. but I won't. My point is that Binis could equally parade all sorts of claims that can't really be checked without checking out all of black Africa thoroughly.

2. The only list I have ever posted on nairaland was of people from Edo state, not Binis. I deliberately tried to "spread around" the number of people from each linguistic group in Edo state, rather than focusing on Binis because I don't know enough northern Edo names, so I left out some Bini names in order to even it out. If I was going to list people from the state, I didn't want it to seem like a mostly Bini affair.

For northern Edo I listed Dokpesi, Igietseme, Momoh, Udochi, Oshiomhole, Franca Afegbua, and one or two others and I had a comparable amount listed (though slightly more) for Edo south and Edo central. If I had loaded the list with almost all academics (which I didn't do intentionally) like some other people did for their own state's lists, then it would have had too many Bini and Esan in comparison just because I don't know many northern Edo names.

3. A more glorious career? Based on the VC position? Okay, but Nwanze, Anao, Oherkhoraye, etc. had the VC position and none of them had as "glorious" a career as Anthony Osagie.

Anyway Ekhaguere is no slacker: http://www.math.buffalo.edu/mad/PEEPS/ekhaguere_gos.html

I will not say too much here because it may come off as trying to put someone down and also because Maduemezia, Iyahen, and Ekhaguere (among other people) all worked together at the exact same time to found Nigeria's mathematical physics society and are obviously colleagues, but I would put Ekhaguere's actual research work ahead of Maduemezia's although Maduemezia certainly has seniority.

4. Once again, you go and put me in a position where it would seem like I was putting someone down, when that's not actually my goal, just as you did with Nwanze and your refusal to acknowledge reality about his academic profile vis a vis Osagie. Sorry, but Maduemezia was nowhere near being nominated for a Nobel prize in physics and there is nothing he did that would enter into in the realm of even being considered for such a prize. You obviously have no idea what a Nobel prize in physics is, or the kind of academic/intellectual achievement necessary to attain it if you are actually making this claim. Also, you have not even bothered to read up on the nomination process. For the record, it is a strict rule of the Swedish Academy that the different nominees for any Nobel prize for any one year are not released until 50 years after that year. Since it has not been 50 years since Professor Maduemezia even started publishing any research, I would be very interested in knowing how it was leaked that he was nominated for a Nobel prize in a year in which he had yet to even publish any research. Maybe you should not delve into areas in which you have not bothered to actually do any investigation.

12)You used the word "intellectual base" I wonder if an intellectual base should just be restricted in description to a "political think tank", Of course you were biased. An intellectual base of such description has a status of an educatiional institute(ecept you dont know the meaning of the word "Institute" ; administrative officers including career diplomats are expected to have gone through the competitive intellectual house the institute has got to offer.

1. I did not use the word "intellectual base", their website did. Go to their website and see how they describe themselves. This is just one of many reading errors from you but I didn't include it above because it's trivial.

2. Political think tanks are in no way real educational institutions and I would not accept the claim that they are for any country in the world. I don't care the least bit for this evasion and it's not worth my time to debate this. You can hold whatever view you want to about political think tanks; it's not going to bother me.

3. Using your bizarre reasoning about vice chancellors and other positions, Dr. Eghosa Osaghae, who has also been a director at a political think tank, has had a more "glorious career" than Dr. Chike Onwuachi that you mentioned, since Dr. Osaghae has been vice chancellor at two universities.

Why you pretend that you dont like mentioning names I have come to know better that it is actually your trade mark.

1. You tried to start a name dropping competition several pages ago in one of your banned posts. I declined, although you didn't see my banned response. I can produce the specific quote you made right here:

No group and I would not want to be contracdicted have not produced eminent personalities, The point is many and in what capacity ? List them I will give you at least 10 Anioma names in return

So when I say I wasn't into dropping names for bragging competitions, I was quite serious. I only entered that "famous people from your state" thread because some people on this forum (nairaland) had already stated very authoritatively that this state (Edo) produces only ashawos (it does export prost itutes, but I doubt that these even outnumber the scammers/fraudsters and drug couriers from some other states, anyways) and because some people who had already put down lists for Edo state weren't really representing seriously for Edo state but were instead giving the impression that there were only 4 or 5 people to mention for Edo state when other people seemed to be mentioning any and every person that they could for their state.

Also, that thread was more or less cordial, unlike your superiority based comparisons and unlike most of the Igbo vs. Yoruba comparisons on this site.

2. When I brought up how Emovon had already been VC before many other groups had produced a VC, after you insinuated that a Bini academic had never merited a VC position at Uniben, you responded by dropping names like Eni Njoku, it became clear that you were dropping names along ethnic lines rather than answering my question about what entire field the Anioma were first in Nigeria to produce a Ph.D in.

You started this with that Nwanze claim implying academic superiority and I merely responded by saying that an Anioma man was a VC only after Emovon and that you have yet to show me which entire field they produced the first Ph.D in Nigeria from. I'm sure the Anioma were the first in some field but like I said, it's ironic and surprising that you would have to look so hard for that field given your explicitly stated perception of superiority. Keep your perceptions, but at least be consistent or reasonable about them.

Your concern here is that because the Benins are no match to the Aniomas in such big names, It is no use bringing up such an issue. But you have brought up names and as usual it included the Benin born Prof Ekhaguere, Im finish the name you sabi ? This little list is far from being exhaustive and it includes the likes of Prof Charles Uwadia (President Nigerian Computer Society) , Prof Linus Ajabor(President Nigerian Gynaecologists and Obstericians- he is frommy home town Igbodo), Prof Zulu Sofola (the first female professor of theatre arts in Africa), Prof Chukwuedo Nwokolo ( renowned medical practioner and National merit recipient 1980), the intellectual couple Prof H.U and Prof (Mrs) Elizabeth Isichei both of UNIJOS( incidentally on the list of notable academicians from UNIJOS I could not find Prof Emovon's name), Prof P.A.I Obanya( Asst Director General UNESCO and Chairman of the Presidential Committee on Education- I consider him next to Prof Babs Fafunwa), Prof Augustine Esogbue( renowned Professor of System Engineering) and many others.I will advice you dont bring up issue again.

1. It's funny that you think I'm claiming superiority. I'm not. You're the one who is so desperate for a name dropping "match" and it was evident in one of your earliest responses on this thread.

2. Your mention of Uwadia is really very funny to me. Is he supposed to be a "big name"? This must be a joke.

Also, is the Nigerian Computer Society an "educational institution"? No, it is not. The same thing could also be said about the Nigerian Gynaecologists and Obstetricians society that you mentioned. Yet you were criticizing my mention of Nigeria' engineering society.

And although Charles Uwadia is a Ph.D holder, from available information, past presidents (like the more important Olatunji Odegbami) of that society have not needed to be or were not Ph.D holders, just like the engineering society's early presidents.

This is yet another double standard and an example of glaring hypocrisy.

When Aiwerioba was the first president of Nigeria's engineering society almost half a century ago it was dismissable because of his ethnicity, but when Uwadia is now president of Nigeria's computer society or somebody from your hometown is president of a gynaecology society, it suddenly makes that person a big name!

3. As for your comment "( incidentally on the list of notable academicians from UNIJOS I could not find Prof Emovon's name), " that's laughable. Tanko Ishaya, an obscure lecturer in internet computing, is also on that list. He probably added himself there. I could add somebody else to that list right now if I felt like it. This is just a very silly comment. There are all sorts of "Whos Who" sites that I can find Emovon on but can't find all but one of the people you mentioned in your own list on. Is there any significance to that? Of course not. Those sites choose who they want to accept.

4.

a) For Dr. Uwadia (computer scientist) I could mention Nosakhare (Nosa) Omoigui , a computer scientist with more research accomplishments (in terms of publications, patents, and citations) than Charles Uwadia (incidentally, both of them specialized in the same research area: software).

Or Daniel Irowa Okunbor (if you must have someone with a Ph.D) a computer science professor, and one time visiting research scientist at the Oak Ridge National Laboratory, whose diverse research is similarly far ahead of Dr. Uwadia's in importance.

b)  For Linus Ajabor (gynaecologist) I could mention Dr. Osato Giwa-Osagie (gynaecologist) a former president of the West African College of Surgeons and a pioneer of the implementation of IVF in West Africa.

c) For Zulu Sofola, I could mention Sophie Oluwole (ethnically Bini), the first female Ph.D in philosophy in Nigeria.

(I'll decline to claim that she's the first female Ph.D in philosophy from black Africa, though.)

Or I could mention Professor Dan Izevbaye, one of the pioneering African literature scholars from Nigeria and one of Nigeria's foremost literary scholars for decades. He was recently described as "Unarguably one of Africa's best literary scholars of all time" and as a "legendary critic" by an interviewer (Ezechi Onyerionwu). He has been described similarly in many other sources and is considered an icon and pioneer among African literature scholars.

d) For Chukwuedo Nwokolo, renowned medical practitioner and National merit award recipient in 1983

I could mention Tiamiyu Bello-Osagie, also a renowned medical practitioner and recipient of the Commander of the Order of the Niger (CON) in 1982. There is a street named after him in Lagos; there are scholarships named after him, and more.

e) For professor H.U. Isichei (psychiatrist; don't know why or how he's a "big name" though; what did he actually do?), I could mention professor Ayo O. Binitie, one of the early pioneering psychiatrists in Nigeria after whom a prize and memorial lecture are named by Nigeria's psychiatry association.

f) With regard to Elizabeth Isichei, I honestly can't blame you for not knowing this, because I was shocked when I found out myself, but she is actually a Caucasian woman married to a (Delta) Igbo man. I can even provide her picture if you need it. She's 100% oyibo.

I would have mentioned Phillip Igbafe here, though. Since she is not even an actual Anioma woman, there's no point really going further, however.

g) For P.A.I. Obanya, I could list Ephraim Idusogie (a former FAO secretary and lead nutritionist of the United Nations FAO/WHO Food and Nutrition Commission for Africa in the 70s), or Dr. Egbe Osifo-Dawodu, who managed the Human Development Group at the World Bank (she was also one of the founders of the African University of Science and Technology, Abuja (ASUT).). And yet another eminent personality at the UN that I could mention is Ambassador Shola J. Omoregie (look him up), who served the UN in various important positions for over three decades. I could also mention Hayford Alile, who headed the Centre for Management Development in Lagos, headed the Lagos Stock Exchange (LSE) and was the pioneer Director-General of the Nigerian Stock Exchange (from 1979-1999).  Or I could mention Professor Osagie Imasogie, a member of the Wilson Council of the Woodrow Wilson International Center for Scholars in Washington DC (a famous think tank, like the institution that  was headed by Dr. Onwuachi that you mentioned), and a Senior Consultant to the President’s Emergency Plan For Aids Relief (PEPFAR) in the U.S, among other achievements.

h) For Dr. Augustine Esogbue

I could mention Dr. Christopher Oriakhi, a highly cited materials scientist working in industry, and a Fellow of the Royal Society of Chemistry (for "outstanding contributions" to the "advancement or application of chemical science", with many publications and over 60 patents.

You can see Christopher Osagie Oriakhi's work on that same google scholar or scopus and other sites.

If you don't know some of the people I mentioned above, do look them up, for your own edification about the capabilities of the Binis. I didn't recognize a single name that you mentioned in your list except for Elizabeth Isichei (who is actually a white woman) but I looked the others up and I was pleasantly surprised by a few of them (such as Augustine Esogbue; many kudos to him for his research!).

I understand why you're proud of your people, but that isn't a good reason to engage in baseless speculation about the capabilities of other groups that you obviously don't know much about. You keep insisting that you know so much about the Binis, but you're just clueless. I can hardly type in a Bini name in a search engine without stumbling across some professor, engineer, doctor, businessman, etc.  Last week I tried looking up one of my (distant) relatives (to see if he had a facebook), and I stumbled across a professor in the U.S with the same first name and a similar last name. 

The Binis are not compiling "exhaustive" lists, probably because we're too sure of ourselves to need to, but that shouldn't lead you to think we'll sit back and accept claims from ignorant people about being less capable than people of other groups.

(The Edo aren't compiling "exhaustive" lists yet - although I'm sure that with enough insults, derogatory statements or putdowns from their "countrymen" claiming that the Binis are a thing of the past or are "ordinary", some Binis will compile that list and engage individuals like yourself in a full scale name dropping competition.)

5. It was naive of you to assume that I couldn't list many more people than I did in that other thread, but I didn't because I wanted the list in that thread to have a certain character with respect to the different groups in the state.

For example, instead of listing more businesspeople like Hayford Alile, Claire Ighodaro, Osagie Imasogie, Eghosa Omoigui, John Obayuwana, etc., I included Modupe Ozolua (a cosmetics mogul and philanthropist) because she is Owan (parents from Sabongida Ora) instead of Bini. I did not want to make such a slanted Bini list at all and that's why I limited the list and made sure it had a certain composition.

I would have preferred to list some other people but I felt that the list had to be diversified not only between academia, business, entertainment, government and politics,  culture, and art/music but also between the different groups in the state.

If you look through the final form of that list carefully you'll see that while there are slightly more Binis listed there than for any other one group (16 out of 38) there are slightly more non-Binis listed than Binis. It would not be fair to fill the list with 80% Binis when it's supposed to be a list representing Edo state. Not only did I make a list to counter the impression that only a few people could be listed for Edo state which some other people's earlier lists had given, I spread it out as evenly as I could among the different zones.

I think the impression you have has more to do with Binis (and other groups in Edo state, for that matter) not "promoting" themselves significantly than it has to do with your perceptions being reasonable. If the Binis keep quiet and don't make claims about having this achiever or that achiever in some field then of course it's going to seem like the only thing they have is their ancient past (although, even that past is being attacked by some people (both Western and African)). I remember actually arguing with an Igbo member on this forum (Onlytruth)  who was trying to tell me that only Igbos could perform well in Nigeria when appointed to positions by governments. Part of me thought of mentioning Abraham Ordia, Hayford Alile, Stephen Oronsaye, Ifueko Omoigui, etc. but I had long realized that such posters on this forum were beyond help and I decided to let him believe what he wanted and revel in his own ignorance.

I think the nonchalance of most (but definitely not all) Binis to drawing up lists to show that they produce highly competent or accomplished people has to do with their past and an emphasis on the Edo culture and ancient history, which is in all honesty still a more visible and inspiring glory than any modern achievements in Nigeria could be.

Thus, drawing up long lists of achievers because they are Bini would merely be tedious and dull work. There is already enough inspiration in the culture, so why would they start searching for every achiever of Edo descent? Something I noticed about the minorities is that they don't put much effort into listing/mentioning "achievers" from their groups.

For example, I didn't even know  Dr. Osagie was a past president of Nigeria's biochemistry society, and I didn't find out that he had hundreds of citations on his research until his name came up in that VC tussle and I decided to find out more about him. To be honest, he is accomplished, yet the Binis would have never even mentioned him as a "big name" the way you were mentioning the much less academically accomplished Dr. Uwadia.

It was only when someone was sure that my home state can only produce ashawos, or when someone could make the state seem less productive (in terms of human capital) than some other states by producing an abridged list, that I would even bother to engage in such a dull activity as drawing up lists of achievers.


When it comes down to it, this is what I think.

If, a Bini (Aiwerioba) can be the first president of Nigeria's engineering society half a century ago, a Bini (Anthony Osagie) can be a president of Nigeria's biochemistry society in recent decades, a Bini (Emmanuel Emovon) can be the first Nigerian Ph.D in a whole academic field (chemistry) and possibly (but it's not proven) the first black African Ph.D in that field or his sub-field in Africa, a Bini (Osagie Imasogie) can advise the U.S.government on AIDS, a Bini (Giwa-Osagie) was president of the West African College of Surgeons, a Bini (Ephraim Idusogie) is selected as regional secretary of the World Health Organizations' food program in Africa, a Bini can be the first female Ph.D in philosophy in Nigeria, a Bini (Iyahen) can be the first Nigerian in a mathematical science to get a D.Sc as a higher doctorate, if a Bini woman (Claire Ighodaro) can be made a CBE for services to business in Britain, a Bini woman (Ifueko Omoigui) can reform Nigeria's tax system in a short time and be appointed a member of the UN Committee of Experts on International Cooperation in Tax Matters by the UN Secretary General and be recognized by the World Economic Forum and many other accolades, and if a Bini (Dan Izebaye) can be one of the foremost scholars of African literature from Nigeria, and many other things that I am ignorant of (this was by no means an exhaustive list  ) despite the fact that the Binis are outnumbered 50 to 1 by other groups and were initially academically behind several groups during the earlier colonial era, then no sensible person would accept claims that there is some sort of intellectual/academic inadequacy on the part of the Binis compared to those around them. Any claims suggesting such a thing would have to be viewed as propaganda from someone with an agenda.

Considering that I didn't even know about Osagie's past professional history until the VC debate came up, there are undoubtedly several other Binis that I don't know of that refute this bizarre claim about some sort of Bini academic/intellectual inadequacy.

And like most Binis, I honestly cannot be bothered to search for all of those Benin people when the issue of Bini competence and ability is - in my mind and probably that of most other Benin people - a question already resolved by history.

I won't keep going with this though. I will let you have the last laugh, and post whatever full ("exhaustive') list you've been so desperate to post and let you beat your chest like you were so desperate to do at the beginning of this thread (and like you did when you first brought up that nonsense about Nwanze).  It's not important to me to keep going. To honest, intelligent, and impartial observers it will be clear that the Binis are no slackers academically.

13)ON THOMAS IBUSA
Yes it was founded by white missionaries so what is the big deal ? These missionaries were responsible for giving us the first batch of Western educated people and the fact remains that we had one of this calibre before Benin not matter how "humiliating" it is to the Edo pride.Even prior to 1928 when this famous school was founded. a notable Anioma son Rev SW Martin the first graduate from an American University (1917) had returned back to his roots(in 1922) to established the Pilgrims Baptist Mission which included many primary, secondary and technical scools as well as hospitals.He is not a white man.His Mission was responsible for the establishment of the Pilgrims Baptist Mission Secondary School Ewohimi 1964 which is the third oldest secondary school in Esan ; also is the Pilgrims Technical College Ofagbe in Isoko , you will see that this man's work benefitted even people beyond Aniomaland.So to claim that the whites were only responsible for opening up Aniomaland, is to me a display of blatant ignorance.
Mind you Anioma people are proud of their connections with the Catholic, Anglican and Baptist Churches and I dont think these churches did not open such stations of enlightenment in Benin except that it came relatively late.
But what is suprising was when in their usual display of tribal sentiments over qualification, the small Benin Catholic Community attempted to impose an Edo via all sorts of blackmail and intimidation on the same grounds (they usually make on the VC slot in UNIBEN) that a Benin must be made Arch Bishop.As a Catholic I saw that development as a sad on especially as they took the matter to court.

1. Lol! You think it's "humiliating" it's actually slightly amusing. I did read about how Binis were behind because of the colonial system before I started debating anything in this thread with you so it was strange to me to find out that those who had such a clear advantage over the Binis in education could not start an earlier secondary school without white missionaries.

2. As for all that other stuff, the majority of Bini Christians are not Catholic, Whenever a visible but miniscule fraction of a population does something, in your mind, it equals the wishes and actions of the entire group. Regarding Uniben, you could just admit that you had no idea what you were talking about. The Uniben case was the clearest case of tribal sentiments (anti-Bini) over qualification that I can recall in Nigeria in recent times. Neither Nwanze, nor anybody else who had occupied that position had a career as accomplished as Osagie, period.

Ogbuefi 1: 14)ON SLAVES BEING THE FIRST CONVERTS IN IGBOLAND
This was the case everywhere but there are a few exceptions.My great great grandmother brought Christainity to my home town and to all of my knowledge she had nothing to do with slavery. She was a wealthy trader involved  in long distance trade mainly in hand woven cloth and it was in the course of her travels that she got to become a Christain and this was in the late nineteenth century.Because of he wealth and respect she commanded in the community she was able to convince some natives of my town to become Christains. And since  members of the new faith were scattered all over the community in small numbers , they asked for and were granted lands which became known as Ani Ogige Ndi Ukah(the lands of the Christain Era) in 1898. As the community grew through levies and grants fom the established church in the Asaba area they created their own central school in 1901 which is now the present Olie Primary School , Igbodo.We did not wait for government to give us schools.Ours was based on communal self help a trend which is still the case in most Igbo communities.

The school in Igbodo was also created using church money? Wow. No comment. I didn't know the whole Catholic thing ran this deep.

15)Yes, Universities are categorised. And the response you gave clearly reveals to me that you are just an uncompromising tribalist.As an Anioma Igbo as much as we are clearly of Igbo stock, we were never part of the Eastern Region whose regional university was UNN and I am aware many non Igbos were VCs of the institution.Being an Igbo especially from the Mdwest was not a criteria as such.I will advice that you google (since that is your expertise) on what led to Prof Ndili "leaving" the insttitution.

1. Eastern region in 1980? Nope. So whether you were or weren't part of it in earlier decades is irrelevant. Also, I don't care what led to him leaving the institution. Funny how you start bringing up Njoku and Dike instead of Anioma academics to talk about academic achievement, but when you need to claim that Dr. Ndili's Igbo ethnicity would not be a factor in him being a VC at UNN, you try to imply that he would be seen as a "non-Easterner" and that this would cancel out the advantage that his Igbo ethnicity would give him in his selection.

2. "Many" non-Igbo vice chancellors? Is your use of the word "many" here actually correct? List and compare the number of Igbo vice chancellors to non-Igbo and come back with a different comment.

3. I have ignored all your other insults about Edo people in your responses to exotik or other posters in these recent discussions because it's not really interesting to me what your perceptions are. However I think it is really out of place for you to call me a tribalist.You know that you are a tribalist and you don't really care, although you don't seem to have the guts to admit to what you are. You know what you are and you know why I will continue to call you what you are and you only have to come out and admit it and it'll clear up your conscience. Just say what you are and you'll get a burden off your chest.

Oh and by the way, nobody and certainly not any Bini man cares even the least whether someone like you respects Dr. Emovon, when, out of the other side of your mouth, you spend all that time insulting his people. I also happen to recall that  Dr. Emovon's wife is a daughter of Oba Akenzua II, and therefore she and her family are descendants of Oba Eweka II - who you very much wanted people to believe had used one of his wives for human sacrifice because of some affair. Keep your "respect" (if that's what you call it) to yourself.

16)"Rebel Chiefs in Benin", lol.Tht could not have been the reason.I think what must have frustrated the missionaries was the notorious image of Benin as a city of blood and human sacrifice.In Yorubaland , they were even in Civil wars while the Church kept expanding.I dont think the rebel Benin chiefs were such a threat considering the fact that the defences of "Great Benin" collapsed just after two weeks of bombardment wih the Oba and some of his chiefs fleeing to the bush. From what I read from Prof Igbafe's book on Administration of Benin(1897-1938) there was nothing to suggests that the Benins were so rebellious. I will suggest you read on the Ekumeku Movement(1898-1911) and see what rebellion is all about.My great grand father from what I was told was a veteran of those wars and even had a war title.

The rebels I'm referring to are those Benin chiefs (I'm pretty sure you know them, Mr. Expert) that harassed people who went to Benin and pledged their loyalty to the new British administration. This was going on until 1899 and you should know about that already since you claim to be an expert. It makes no sense for them to establish anything when people who go to Benin are still being "harassed" for disloyalty to the defeated Benin kingdom.

17)Sure nothing everything written by these historians Anioma or Benin should be taken seriously. I once had a long arguement with Omojie or Agbontaen from Owa.But what is significant is that there are moats as well in Ominije(Agbor Nta) which have not been comprehensively studied.My understanding is that it could a reaction to the moats that was dugged in Benin.Judging from the antiquity of Ominije it would match more or less with those early moats in Benin.

So now you're guessing about the ages of moats? People take all the time to employ radiometric dating, archaeomagnetic dating, etc. and here you just start assigning dates like you're some self appointed "ogbuefi" of archaeology. This is just too ridiculous. Keep this stuff to yourself. I would be insulting myself by even condescending to discussing this.

18)More on Egharevba, The stories you gave abt Obanosa and Ohen are as far as I am concerned issues concerned within the Benin political definition.It has little or nothing to do with external relationship with other groups be it Anioma , Igala or Akure. As for the war with Igala which actually inspired our OMU title, the Igalas had made significant advance towards Benin capturing as booty the royal mask of the Oba (it now forms a regalia of the Attah of Igala).It was the assistance rendered by Idia who had acquired foreign firearms that saved the Benin from a decisive defeat.

1. So now war with Igala inspired your Omu title! I think you mean Queen Idia of Benin inspired your Omu title!

2. Actually, it is the Igalas that have it on record that their city was invaded, while the Benins merely remember that they (the Igala) got to the gates of the city of Benin, not that they entered it. There's nothing that proves they would have gotten even further and actually won, even if there were no guns there.

I wonder how

a) they got the hip mask when they didn't get anywhere near the Oba
b) got the hip mask when the Oba only wears it on ceremonial occasions
c) got the mask but were too incompetent to capture the Oba and those around him; what's the importance of a hip ornament (the mask) to a war?
d) kept the mask after they were invaded by a force which you have admitted had guns and which marched on their city and which would probably not have let them keep the mask if they had actually stolen it.


3. That mask could possibly be something suggesting an old, non-military connection between Benin and Igala monarchies that some Igala oral traditions attest to. You should already be familiar with those claims of a Benin Igala connection that are attested to by both some Igala and by Egharevba, completely independently of each other. Egharevba claimed the first Attah of Igala was from Benin and there is evidence (as J.S Boston showed) that one Igala monarchy was replaced by a new dynasty so this could have something to do with the alleged connection. As an expert, you should already be aware of the work of J.S. Boston and A.J. Shelton where they were both were informed of claims by Igalas that their monarchy came from Benin. I don't at all believe that their monarchy did come from Benin, by the way, because of other things about it that I have read that I won't get into in this thread, but it is strange that they (Igala people themselves) had those old traditions of some pre-war/non-military connection with Benin.

4. The notion that Benin was severely tested in the Benin-Igala war derives ENTIRELY from Egharevba's publication of stories that he collected. It does NOT derive from some earlier published Igala historian or some Westerner's writings. Therefore it is extremely ignorant and misleading to accuse Jacob Egharevba of an inability to portray Benin's external relations in a less powerful and glorious light.


I also read where you argued with Negro_Ntns about Oba Ewuare and Akure. You kept arguing with him about it but everything you were arguing for really comes from the stories that were collected by Egharevba. I find it very hypocritical to accuse others of selective uses of sources, but fail to mention that any talk of conquest of Akure under Oba Ewuare is either directly from, or is an extension of the work of Jacob Uwadiae Egharevba, who you have repeatedly insisted is completely unreliable when discussing the external relationships of Benin with other groups just so you could push your Ubulu Uku claim.

5. First, if Egharevba remembered the king of this or that kingdom being defeated, then it corresponds perfectly with independent European accounts from Portuguese, English, French, Dutch, and German sources which reveal the extent of Benin war and conquest on some of those around them.


Second, it is a fact that very independently of Egharevba, multiple Benin people from the older generation attested to the fact that the heads of defeated/rebellious kings were cut off and sent to the brass casters guild to be cast in brass. They were then kept as war trophies by the palace or sent to the son/descendant or successor of the defeated rebel king as a warning for him not to toe the rebellious line that his father or predecessor did. This is something that you should have known as an "expert". This particular practice (of cutting off heads and casting them in brass) makes no particular reference to the Anioma but was a very very general tradition. That some of the defeated kings mentioned by Egharevba are from Anioma areas does not mean that he had any particular agenda intended to slight them.

But the fact of the matter is, defeated kings' heads were definitely cut off. This is in contrast to false stories about the Iyoba's servants engaging in farming or about grown men assaulting an old woman over a few yams and then running off to hide somewhere.

6. With regard to defeated kings, it is not always easy to tell which heads are those of defeated kings, and which heads are just those of prominent people or chiefs, but one very glaring and obvious clue is the facial expression on the head itself:

1:



Sometimes heads like these are mistakenly labeled as heads of Obas of Benin or chiefs by Western museums or books, and it is a bit of work to distinguish all of the defeated people from the people who are just being depicted normally or favorably, but I think everybody can tell that this kind of depiction is not a depiction of a glorious figure. He almost looks like the expression when his head was cut off was frozen as on his face as his death mask. This particular head has certain facial scarifications around its mouth that would not be seen in Anioma, but I have seen other trophy heads that do not have these marks:

2:


(In case you're wondering what the marks on the forehead and between the eyebrows are:

"Also, the double vertical forehead slits on ivory belt masks (Fig. 5), commemorative trophy heads, and Ododua masks are not scars at all but an artistic representation of character. Known as "can of eye," the slits signify determination, seriousness of purpose, and, as a friend informed Joseph Nevadomsky, "men [or women; e.g., the Idia queen mother heads] of substance" (Nevadomsky 1986:43)." - from the 1995 article "The clothing of political identity: Costume and scarification in the Benin Kingdom" by Joseph Nevadomsky and Ekhaguosa Aisien. The 1986 article they cite is "The Benin Bronze Horseman as the Ata of Idah." African Arts 19, 4;40-47, 85. by Joseph Nevadomsky.)


The first and second images above are from the Bakarat Gallery, which has museums in California, London, and Dubai.

3:



4:





The third and fourth images are from the book The Art of Benin by Paula Ben-Amos.

In the third picture, the individual on the horse could very easily have his head cut off by the central figure and cast into a brass head like the one in the first picture above.

In the fourth picture, it is interesting that they note in the caption on the picture that there is a trophy head in the British museum from the time of Oba Akengbuda.

7.

Now with regard to the Ubulu thing.

a) The date of the Benin-Ubulu conflict is remembered as around 1750, which falls exactly into the time that the Ubulu rebellion was put down by Agboghidi (by the way, the meaning of his "title" (ingrate) actually confirms the Benin story, but I guess you didn't know the meaning).

Oba Akengbuda is remembered as the Oba of Benin that was reigning at that time, and his father, Oba Eresoyen, was so rich that he built a house covered in cowrie shells, so this was not a time that Benin was lacking finances from trade.

Now, Oba Akengbuda is the Oba that initiated the indigenous production of firearms.

So the question remains: if Oba Akengbuda not only had guns from trade during his long reign, but also initiated the indigenous production of firearms, what particular weapon could have been used to stop him by less militarily equipped groups, if he had waged war with them? Guns did not factor heavily into Benin's military except in a few instances, but if they had felt that there was a real challenge, Benin would certainly have had the tools (guns) to accomplish their objective of suppressing a rebellion.

I doubt very much that an Oba who reigned for a very long time (several decades), and whose reign is remembered very favorably, and who had access to guns from both external trade and internal manufacture, had his soldiers defeated by eight men or was forced to sign some peace treaty with a poorer (i.e., less resources available) kingdom.