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Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by twosquare(m): 10:14am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid:Angels can't worship anyone or anything lesser than God... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 10:15am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid:if I say you they ask dumb question you go vex small abi? the Lamb is jesus... jesus is the word... the word is GOD... wetin be ya palaba... I go call police for you before you go understand? the Micah 5:2 quote clearly states that the Messiah has existed from all eternity - Meaning: "His activities date back to all eternity, without beginning" - Contrasting the Messiah's future incarnation with His "eternal origins/activities", the only logical conclusion is that Jesus was at the very least of supernatural origin, like Jehovah, for only Jehovah has an eternal origins! The Messiah therefore traced his lineage, not from David, but from all past eternity, being like God himself, has always existed and timeless! No Jew would every apply this language to a created angel! you said proverbs proves Jesus was created when it does. The simple Question is who is prudence? However, the "me" who is speaking throughout Proverbs 8:1 through 9:12 is identified as "wisdom," and many other translations reflect the fact that feminine pronouns are used. Wisdom raises her voice in 8:1; she takes her stand in 8:2; she cries out in 8:3; wisdom has built her house in 9:1; she has prepared her table in 9:2--hardly the language one would expect if Jesus Christ were meant. answer this question. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 10:18am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: SMH... now worship don mean another thing... it not obvious david receive worship stop dragging david into it... what ever you say worship means the commandment is that we should not worship anyone except GOD. period |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:23am On Jun 08, 2013 |
twosquare: Angels can't worship anyone or anything lesser than God... And what has that got to do with anything here...... The point here is that Yahweh and his appointed king is worshipped...... Your excuse is lame....... Is david God for sharing worship with God?? |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:24am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Lol........ David shared worship with Yahweh.......its down in scriptures....you just read it boldly..........stop running around....and face the ish....... Define worship.....oya....... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 10:25am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: what verse? |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:32am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Let me face this micah you have been clinging to like a wife.......... 2. The Context of Micah 5:2 But as for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, too little to be among the thousands of Judah, from you One will go forth to Me to be ruler in Israel. His goings forth are from old, from the days of eternity. Therefore he will give them up until the time when she who is in labor has borne a child. Then the remainder of his brethren will return to the sons of Israel. And he will arise and Shepherd his flock in the strength of ""YHWH"", in the majesty of the name of YAHWEH his God. (Micah 5:4). Just two verses later we find that the person in view has a God; Yahweh is his God. It should be clear that the One who will go forth to be ruler in Israel is not Yahweh God or a co equal to Yahweh but someone who has Yahweh God as his God. ....... 3. His "goings forth" The Hebrew word here "motsa'ah" indicates the concept of "origin." The English term "goings forth" is a decent translation of the Hebrew intent. ..... Whose ""origin"" is from of old, from ancient times. (NAB). whose"" origins"" are from of old, from ancient times. (NIV). ..... whose origin is from of old, from ancient days. (RSV). ........####### 4. Of "old" The Hebrew "qedem" is the word we usually translate as "east." Since the sun dawns in the east and the day begins in the east it is a front place where the day begins. This Hebrew word does not really mean "old" but conveys the idea of a "beginning" or a "front" and so with respect to time it implies the idea of old beginnings. .......##### ..... ##The Definition of ""olam"" The word ""olam"" simply does not mean "everlasting," or "eternity" defined as an infinite time continuum, or as a reality of timelessness, or whatever reality God exists in. This word simply means a very long period of time or an indefinite period of time. It does not mean infinity. It comes from a root word which means hidden or concealed. This is similar to the idea expressed by the English term "unforseeable future." It refers to an indefinite period of time. That ""olam"" does not refer to infinite time, or a state of timelessness, or some other kind of reality in which only God exists, can be seen from its use in the Scriptures. The Nephilim were on the earth in those days... they were the mighty ones of old, men of renown. (Gen 6:4). Remember the"" days of old"", consider the years of all generations. Ask your father, and he will inform you, your elders, and they will tell you. (Deuteronomy 32:7). Joshua said to all the people, "Thus says YAHWEH, the God of Israel, ""`From ancient times"" your fathers lived beyond the River, namely, Terah, the father of Abraham and the father of Nahor, and they served other gods. (Joshua 24:2). Now David and his men went up and raided the Geshurites and the Girzites and the Amalekites; for they were the inhabitants of the land from"" ancient times"". (1 Samuel 27:. .. Remove not the ""ancient landmark"" which your fathers have set. (Proverbs 22:8; cf. 23:10). And your ancient ruins shall be rebuilt; you shall raise up the foundations of many generations. (Isaiah 58:12; cf, 61:4). In all their affliction he was afflicted, and the angel of his presence saved them; in his love and in his pity he redeemed them; he lifted them up and carried them all the ""days of old"". But they rebelled and grieved his holy Spirit; therefore he turned to be their enemy, and himself fought against them. Then he remembered the"" days of old"", of Moses his servant. (Isaiah 63:9,11). . Then the offering of Judah and Jerusalem will be pleasing to the LORD as in"" the days of old"" and as in former years. (Malachi 3:4). ...... It is quite clear in the above passages that"" olam"" cannot possibly mean "eternity." The actual Hebrew at Micah 5:2 literally reads "days of olam." This phrase is also used in another place right here in this very same book of Micah just two chapters later. ::: Shepherd Your people with Your scepter, the flock of Your possession which dwells by itself in the woodland, in the midst of a fruitful field. Let them feed in Bashan and Gilead as in the ""days of old"" (Micah 7:14) . Obviously, the term "days of olam" in does not mean "eternity" as "everlasting time," or "never ending time," or anything of the like, or we have the ridiculous problem of explaining just how the Jews were to feed the flock just as they had done in the "days of eternity."........ It is clear what Micah 5:2 is about the fact that Bethlehem is the home of the Messiah's ancestral origins. It is the ancient home of his ancestors. Genealogical lineages tell us about our ancestral origins. Bethlehem is the home of Jesus' ancient ancestors; it is ancient origins. We must remember that David was born 1000 years before Jesus and Judah was born about 1800 years before Jesus. From Jesus' perspective in time this is ancient. ###### The Trinitarian claim is based on unwarranted translation of words and imagining Trinitarian doctrine into the Hebrew text. The grammatical and contextual evidence indicate the verse is a reference to the Messiah’s ancient ancestral origins in Bethlehem of Ephratah. Micah has the ruling Davidic dynasty in mind. The passage should be understood as follows: But as for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, insignificant among the thousands of Judah, out of you One will go forth for Me to be ruler in Israel (i.e. Messiah will be born in Bethlehem). His [ancestral] origins [in Bethlehem] are from ancient times, from the days of old. There is nothing here about a Messiah originating in eternity. The force of the entire passage is about the Davidic King Messiah being born in Bethlehem, the home of Jesus' ancient ancestors where his genealogical lineage began in ancient times. ..... Lest I forget let's take a look @ how the goodnews bible translation renders that verse.... ..... GNT-online Micah 5:2 2 The Lord says, "Bethlehem Ephrathah, you are one of the smallest towns in Judah, but out of you I will bring a ruler for Israel, whose family line goes back to ancient times." Perfect!!!!!!!...... 1 Like |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:34am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: What!!!!.... 1 Chronicles 29:20 King James Version (KJV) 20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless the LORD your God. And all the congregation blessed the LORD God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped the LORD, and the king. No tell me say ya eye no dey see am...... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 10:45am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: I don't know where you Go gather all this bible verse from... but non refute the fact that Jesus is eternal... everlasting... the fact that Jesus called his father his God is not new. try stick to 2 bible... kjv and NIV no they jump about. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 10:47am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: hahahahaha... really david on earth? we are talking about heaven man. Just so you know David was a king to his people while God receive the worship what he Got was civil homage... lmao |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:50am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Lol...I'm not jumping about....I just went straight to the root words which have been misconstrued to mean Jesus exited for everlasting to everlasting.... Innocent micah was just plainly describing Jesus' lineage from bethlehem....trinitarians grabbed it and said this Jesus never had a beginning...... The same words used were used numerous times still in that micah and meant the same thing..never you quote micah 5:2 to prove Jesus never had a beginning...... Jesus had a beginning... Please go back to explaining what Jesus being the beginning of Gods creation means...... Oya...... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 10:55am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Cheiii........ Please from that verse tell me the LORD and david wasn't worshipped??... You say civil homage??.....oh..clap your hands...... E be like you no dey read that verse well... It says the people bowed and worshipped Yahweh and the king..... Oboy no escape route.... Rememeber my point here is to prove people worshipping GOD and his annointed one in no way proves that that annointed one is an equal with God........ No somersault can get you out of it.... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 11:06am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: lol people worship david on earth... understand context. he is not even Divine... even angels stop people from worshipping them. when you go to revelation you see people honoring the son and the father equally... no time david was called... you are only seeing civil homage if you like do like say u no know just because it helps your argument. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 11:13am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: Revelation 3:14, "And to the angel of Laodicea write: 'The Amen, the faithful and true witness, the Beginning of the creation of God....'" Here the faithful witness is Jesus and He is called, "The Beginning of the creation." The Greek word for beginning is arche, which is used in many ways. It is used to mean "origin or source of, or ruler," but not first creation. turn to Revelation 21:6. In these two verses, Jehovah calls Himself the beginning. Does that mean Jehovah was created? No. Therefore you are using the term beginning, incorrectly. Jesus was never created. John 1:1 states, "In the beginning was the Word" Jesus was with God from eternity past; Jesus has no beginning because He is the eternal God. I wonder which verse you go go carry come again. I they pack my things to my new house I no too get time. but I they manage reply you. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 11:13am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: You don't get it do you??....... And what you have read are you not seeing people worshipping and honouring the appointed king of God (David) and Yahweh??...... Please point out where u see civil homage in that verse......please point it out...... wether david is divine or not my point stands......both david and Jesus are and were appointed by Yahweh to be king..... Na lie??..... Was Jesus not appointed and annointed??...... And both david and Jesus sit/sat on Gods throne...... So tell me how that verse does not show that the honour and worship of the isrealites was shared between Yahweh and david......that verse is as clear as day light...... If I remove david and put Jesus in that verse its still the same thing.... Because Yahweh is greater than all of them and he appointed them... Stop this dance around..... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 11:17am On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Did Jehovah call himself the beginning of someone elses hand work??,...... There you fail bro....you fail big time.... Is Jehovah the beginning of the creation of God??....... Please read revelation 3:14 well...... Yes arche means beginning...what about the expression arche of?? I thought previous posts I had fully explained what that expression means....all you did was dodge it to the core..... do you want to see from the bible what it means to be the beginning of someone elses work??...... And john 1:1 got clearer when it was clearly shown that that word is the firstborn of all creation and the beginning of it..... Stick to scriptural truth....Jesus had a beginning........ |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 11:55am On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: ijawkid the crucial Greek word here is “arche.” It has more than one meaning. First of all, it can mean “ruler.” The NIV translates part of this verse as “the ruler of God’s creation.” Second, “arche” can mean “source” or “origin.” This merely confirms again Jesus is the Creator. For example, the Moffatt translation reads: "the origin of God's creation." The TEV (GNB) has "the faithful and true witness, who is the origin of all that God has created." True, this text theoretically could mean Jesus was created. It is ambiguous standing just by itself. Suppose the rest of the Bible is ignored when interpreting it. Then it could mean God created the Word as His first creative act when making the universe. let me look at it in another way... Let’s now think about the problem of “cafeteria exegesis” when interpreting the Bible. In a cafeteria, we can choose what food want you want when we’re in line. But now, should we interpret the Bible this way? Suppose we open up a heavy-duty Greek-English lexicon. Much like a Spanish-English dictionary, it allows us to look up the words in another language that correspond with the English words. Suppose for a given Greek word there are 5 meanings in English. However, suppose only one of those five meanings supports the particular interpretation of a Scripture that we prefer. Do we then dogmatically insist that that one meaning is correct, and the others wrong, in order to prove the doctrine we want to prove? Could one of those other meanings be what God intended for us to understand? If so, shouldn’t we admit that we can’t prove our case then? John 1:1-14 It’s very difficult for Unitarians and Arians to explain away this section of Scripture, although they do try really hard. V. 1: Instead of saying God was in the beginning, it says the Word was in the beginning, compare to Genesis 1:1. Poetic language indicates unusual significance. V. 3: If the Word created all things, He couldn’t have been created. If someone says “all” doesn’t mean “all,” that this universal term isn’t universal, one needs a clear text from elsewhere in the Bible to limit it. V. 14: The Word became flesh. The incarnation of God is a true Biblical teaching. [Hebrews 7:3] as you can see... if you Choose origin or source it Goes with what other verses have been teaching. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 12:15pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: All you have done is dance around...my bro...please can you open an example in the scriptures where the expression beginning of when used for a living being means source??.... Please use scriptures when making examples and stop bringing in greek myths..... I know what arche means......... What we are on is Jesus being the beginning of Gods creation.......... Ok let me for mumus sake follow your exegesis and say Jesus is the source of Gods creation.... How can you be the source of another persons work??.....it didn't occur to you that Jesus isn't the God of which he is beginning of his(God) creation...... All I need is a scripture from the bible that supports your stance.... Please just one... Open a scripture where it says one who is the beginning of someone elses work becomes the source of that persons work there by exempting the person under consideration as part of the handi work of the one he is the beginning of........??... Please I have my scriptures steaming..open your own and stop this dance around........ And john 1:1 and john 1:14 isn't a problem at all to a unitarian like me..... Just open scriptures and refute Jesus being the beginning of Gods creation exempts him from being created by God....... And what are you quoting hebrews 7:3 for??...... You want me to expose that scripture too??.... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 12:16pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
And please benalvino can we call the Father and the holy spirit the firstborn of all creation and the beginning of the creation by God too??....... let's use scriptures strictly to iron these issues out.... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by Mranony: 12:27pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid:interesting. We both know that David was not worshiped. Bowing to pay homage and worshiping are not the same thing it is funny how you managed to scout for the only translation that translated that as worship and then pitched your tent there. If I show you 1john 5:7 from KJV now, you will immediately deny that translation and start scouting other translations to make your claim. Let us see what some of the translations you dodged had to say. Then David said to the whole assembly, "Praise the LORD your God." So they all praised the LORD, the God of their fathers; they bowed down, prostrating themselves before the LORD and the king. NIV Then David said to the whole assembly, "Give praise to the LORD your God!" And the entire assembly praised the LORD, the God of their ancestors, and they bowed low and knelt before the LORD and the king. NLT and my favorite: And David said to all the congregation, Now bless Jehovah your God! And all the congregation blessed Jehovah, the God of their fathers, and bowed and worshiped Jehovah, and bowed to the king. MKJV You have no case. If you like I can also show you throughout the bible people paying homage, bowing and kneeling and falling flat on their faces before their fathers, uncles, brothers, friends, kings, angels e.t.c. Not all bowing is worship. But how does your example compare with this: Rev_5:13 And I heard every creature which is in the Heaven and on the earth, and under the earth, and those that are in the sea, and all who are in them, saying, Blessing and honor and glory and power be to Him sitting on the throne, and to the Lamb forever and ever. or this: Rev_7:10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God sitting on the throne, and to the Lamb. Or even better, This: Rev 17:14 These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them. For He is Lord of lords and King of kings. And those with Him are the called and elect and faithful ones. My dear, your argument is seriously taking a beating here 1 Like |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by Nobody: 12:31pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
Jesus gave all worship to the father, if indeed the word worship regarding Jesus means actually , I will not go into semantics, I will simply say that this is at the command of GOD his father - Hebrew 1:6 |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 12:32pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: lol you took all the example I gave you and flush it down the drain... that beginning some translate as source... I gave you a clear example but I know you... Hebrews 7:3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually. it shows you he is from the ancient of time... the everlasting eternal... link it with Genesis 1:1 and link in with john 1:1 then link it with Colossians then link it with revelation 3:14 then you will see the meaning of what I explained earlier |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 12:39pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Please I want us to do an indepth analysis of what it means to be the beginning of somebodys works........ I didn't flush your definition of arche down the drain.....I agree...what you have failed to do is just provide an example from the scriptures to show what it means the beginning of somebodys works..be it creative works,pro-creative works etc..... Please open one scripture...... You are being disingenuous..... Can we have parallels of that expression from the scriptures and get the meaning of it??...... And as regards hebrews 7:3....do you agree that melchizedek also has no beginning and end just like Jesus and so we have a 4th person who had no beginning??...... You don't just quote scriptures to prove Jesus had no beginning...it would land you in wahala...... Did melchizedek have a beginiing or not??...... I would be up with scritpure to scripture meaning of what it means to be the beginning of someone elses business or works......... Na inside this bible we go die today....... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by BERNIMOORE: 12:44pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
@belnavino No need to take us back may i say that you evade the question you posed which im interested in answering, if you are sure of yourself what stops you from supplying the answer in brief. God Almighty as the superior to innitiates the move to exault the son to receive worship on his behalf but for his(God's) own glory. phillipians 2:9-10 Why God also has highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: 10That[b] at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth[/b] verse 11; 11And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. 2 Likes |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 12:48pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
Mr anony: Oh anony says not all bowing down is worship...now you have come...... So it means the word worship is coined from could mean many things....and that infact people can be worshipped and as shown Yahweh and his king was worshipped... Now you say the case is different from that of Jesus...... Jesus is the greater david and in no way shows the God which annointed them both has changed and that when people worship them then it makes the annointed one Gods equal..... I just used davids example to expose you that you have no point whatso ever to equate Jesus with his Father... Now may I ask you... Was Jesus exalted and annointed or not??.... David was annointed by Yahweh.....was Jesus not annointed??.... Now this is where the problem comes....... Who do you think made Jesus the king of kings ??...... If Jesus was not exalted would he be even close to being a king more or else sit on Yahwehs throne??..... Answer me....... The Yahweh who does the appointing and commands people to adore and bow down before his annointed kings has not changed...get that into your brain...... The whole world bowing before the lamb and his God does not in anyway show the lamb has become equal with God... And the funny thing is that this God the Father is the GOD of the lamb... So try again mr anony........ |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 12:49pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
frosbel: Jesus gave all worship to the father, if indeed the word worship regarding Jesus means actually , I will not go into semantics, I will simply say that this is at the command of GOD his father - Hebrew 1:6 Anony eye don clear...so him wan begin define worship because right in front of his eyes the isrealites worshipped david and Yahweh...... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 12:52pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: the key word is arche can you see... arche translate to many things... some bible say source some say ruler some say beginning... arche means all those things so why should we look at the meaning of beginning instead of arche? when you use source it Goes with other verses... you just they pretend like say you no understand wetin I they talk abi? ok... I take Hebrew back... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 12:55pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
ijawkid: how him eye take care... na you try to say worship mean another thing just because they worship Jesus... and you try to accept worshipping of man as normal in God's eye just to prove your point... david was not worshipped... you always deny Jesus accept worship but now you are backing david up that he accept worship talk about double standard |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by BERNIMOORE: 1:05pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
how him eye take care... na you try to say worship mean another thing just because they worship Jesus... and you try to accept worshipping of man as normal in God's eye just to prove your point... david was not worshipped... you always deny Jesus accept worship but now you are backing david up that he accept worship talk about double standard a parrallel has been striked between 'the worship David receives' and 'that of jesus' all to the glory of God the father! remember too that Davids house is 'like God' note the letter uppercase 'G' i dont mean god, with letter 'g' see that below even in your own bible; New International Version (©2011) On that day the LORD will shield those who live in Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD going before them. New Living Translation (©2007) On that day the LORD will defend the people of Jerusalem; the weakest among them will be as mighty as King David! And the royal descendants will be like God, like the angel of the LORD who goes before them! English Standard Version (©2001) On that day the LORD will protect the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them on that day shall be like David, and the house of David shall be like God, like the angel of the LORD, going before them. New American Standard Bible (©1995) "In that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, and the one who is feeble among them in that day will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD before them. King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.) In that day shall the LORD defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the LORD before them. Holman Christian Standard Bible (©2009) On that day the LORD will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that on that day the one who is weakest among them will be like David on that day, and the house of David will be like God, like the Angel of the LORD, before them. International Standard Version (©2012) At that time, the LORD will defend those who live in Jerusalem, and the one who is feeble among them at that time will be like David. The entire house of David will be like God—indeed, like the angel of the LORD in their midst! NET Bible (©2006) On that day the LORD himself will defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the weakest among them will be like mighty David, and the dynasty of David will be like God, like the angel of the LORD before them. GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995) On that day the LORD will defend those who live in Jerusalem so that even those who stumble will be like David, and David's family will be like God, like the Messenger of the LORD ahead of them. King James In that day shall the LORD defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of the LORD before them. |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 1:05pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino:Hehehehehe.........which other verses na... Oya make we look this straight forward from bible...... Genesis 49:3 King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.) Reuben, thou art my firstborn, my might, and the beginning of my strength, the excellency of dignity, and the excellency of power: Holman Christian Standard Bible (©2009) Reuben, you are my firstborn, my strength and the firstfruits of my virility, excelling in prominence, excelling in power. International Standard Version (©2012) "Reuben, you're my firstborn, my strength, and the first fruit of my vitality. You excel in rank and excel in power. Please let's consider this case.... Remember the arche is used in this verse....firstborn was used..but let's even leave firsborn alone for now...you escaped when it was explained the last time we discussed on it..... Can you please tell me what it means when Jacob says reuben is the arche of his virility?? Or the arche of his strenght??.... Is reuben the source of Jacobs other kids or reuben himself is part of Jacobs kids but the first or start of Jacobs pro-creation spree?? This is scripture...let's analyze... More is on the way.... |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by benalvino(m): 1:07pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
BERNIMOORE: @belnavino we've gone pass here... we talked about Jesus being exalted at the right hand of God... which mean he has all the power and authority... if you read Colossians you will learn that Jesus created all thrones power and authority both in heaven and earth for himself "The Son is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. 16 For in him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things have been created through him and for him. 17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together." you remember when the father says he is the beginning? so is Jesus verse 18 he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy. he dead so that he can conquer death... we have gone pass here... it is coming to a point where any question one ask is already discussed |
Re: Trinity: Why Is It Easier To Call Jesus God And Not The Holy Spirit by ijawkid(m): 1:16pm On Jun 08, 2013 |
benalvino: Still confused...... I hope you don see say the whole earth bowing down to the Lamb and God does not mean Jesus is an equal with God..... You don see am shey??....... If God no exalt Jesus we would not be having this discussion....God no commit crime to exalt him son all for trinitarians to demean the Father and making his son equal to him..... Its madness bro........ |
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