@Funky

What it all boils down to is credibility.

If you state on your visa application form that you are going to the
UK for a two week holiday and you end up spending four months or
the whole six months, next time the ECO will wonder why this was.
You might have shown on your form that you had sufficient funds for
a two week stay. Since you stayed for 6 months the ECO wil suspect
in the absence of any other evidence that you might have been working.
Having said that the fact you have complied with the conditions of the visa
and have not actually overstayed would be in your favour. But no do am to
often.

If you are found out to have backdated your entry stamp then you can forget
about any further visas for the forseeable future. I'm not sure whether the BHC
check with the airlines about passenger departures as a matter of course, but
I would suspect that if you give the BHC cause to suspect you then this information
can be obtained from the airline by the BHC. However, they would need to know
which airline you travelled by before they can start any investigation and this would
have to be provided by the passenger. This makes me believe it would be in exceptional
circumstances that they would do this. They would be unlikely to go on a fishing exercise
unless they are sure they could get the info.

funkybaby:



ARE YOU SURE ABOUT WHAT YOU ARE SAYING REGARDING BHC CONTACTING THE AIRLINE TO CONFIRM IF AN INDIVIDUAL ACTUALLY STAYED LONGER THAN NECCESSARY when did they start that one again personally, i have not stayed longer than 2months at a time in uk and i have had no cause to backdate my passport neither have my application for renewal been refused.

but if what you are saying is true, then 'ko ma funny o' ! my younger sis who won the appeal is currently in uk and she intends staying for 4 months and then backdating it to read say 6weeks. are u saying that she can be caught and her chances for another refusal very high? she flew with virgin o !

but i thought in accordance with the immigration rules, it is okay to stay in the uk as long as you do not exceed 6months at a strech and you do not work or seek recourse to public funds. ki ni problem awon BHC sef?

in my sister's case, she intends having fun in uk for the whole 4months because she is not doing anything in naija at the moment. she intends touring most parts of uk including scotland. is there any crime in that? no be her papa money she dey spend? its not like she is depending on money from british govt or anything like that. besides, na summer we dey. this is the peak holiday season.

besides, i have a lot of friends that do this backdating thing. never heard of any of them being refused when renewing their visas.

bhc should take it easy on nigerians. wetin sef?

It is funny though.

" If it is true" is not in my own dictionary, when its a matter of advice, i say nothing but truth

My brother has the same problem 2 years ago. They ask him to bring boarding pass or even bag tags
They eventually approve his 2 years multiple visas.

They hardly believe in these our immigration stamps again. For more than 18 months they've started that checking(though randomly). BA and virgin coperate with them fully in given their manifest daily.

Tell your friends to be careful, UK is now different from those days.

I will try to upload few cases here on that by next week.

4 months visit

Visit remains visit
The lenght of time you wrote on your application form is so important. At times they ignore it but anytime they want to cause trouble, they will.
Look at this scenario:

I told BHC that i am in full time employment, granted 1 month leave by my employer,will spend 3 weeks holiday in UK. I now go ahead to spend 4 months, that means my visa application is fraudulent by all standard.

@ VOR and akolawole

o ga o! u can't blame nigerians for putting 2weeks or 10 days in the visa form. which ECO will give you visa when you tell them the truth that you are holidaying for 2months or 10weeks??

my sister will not want to come back until the four months is complete o! london dey sweet am. the fact remains that she is not overstaying which is still within the immigration rules. the funny thing is that the immigration peeps here in uk didnt say anything about the long duration of the ticket.

so what do u guys advise she does when she is ready to go back?
backdate or just take her chances with the 4months duration. she intends renewing in say about a month after her return to nigeria.

@ VOR and Akolawole,
I got here and was totally lost! Good work here and good advice too.


@ Funkybaby,
Seriously I will advice you tell your sister that it will be better for her to come back at least spend a week or two here and go back. after the four months she can easily renew the visa.
For sake of privacy, I would not want to divulge certain materials here about some of the latest trend of the BHC. As Akolawole has said, it is getting more difficult these days. In fact, they read any lie detected which includes staying beyond the date you specified in your application as a good ground for a possibe refusal!

@mrpataki

ha! that one go hard small. she has only spent a month and 2weeks, out of the four months. cancelling the ticket and reserving another will make her lose money. what about the cost of her coming down again c'mon it can't be that bad o! please just advice on which is safer,  backdating or stating the truth (which is what BHC hates to hear somethings) regarding how long she has stayed. please feel free to email any info to

@VOR and akolawole

you guys are yet to reply to my last post.

@VOR

regarding the issue of credibility, i might intend to stay for 2weeks but assumming something comes up and i stay longer in the uk? is there any crime in that? as long as i do not EXCEED 6MONTHS at a time, nor seek recourse to public funds, blah blah.

me thinks its very unfair of BHC not to stick to the immigration laws and then twist and misinterprete it as they like. to get visiting visa na wahala, student visa na wahala, work permit na wahala, red pali na fantasy, ordinary renewal na wahala again.

@VOR, akolawole, mrpataki

just came across this news. please read this link.

http://www.workingintheuk.gov.uk/working_in_the_uk/en/homepage/schemes_and_programmes/internationalgraduatesscheme.html?

guess, it means it means the graduate scheme that previously operated only in scotland, now applies to students who have graduated from other universities in uk. what are you gentlemen's views/opinions about this new scheme.

@ akolawole, VOR, mrpataki

i have this funny feeling that www.ukvisas.com and its affilates will soon cancel the 'uk visa appeal' thing.

with the way their eyes just dey 'strong' these days and with the different rules and strategies they are coming up with to regulate immigration (legal or illegal), i have this feeling that we will all wake up one morning and read on the internet that the procedure has been cancelled. from what i read on the internet and from the recent experiences of my friends, sooooo many people are appealing, and there is a terrible backlog of cases and the ECOs and whoever are having a tedious task keeping up with the volume of appeal bundles that are needed to be filed in with the AIT.

although, i feel it might only apply to visiting visas, (i doubt if they will extend it to student visas), british universities are making BIG money from international students. i was going through a postgraduate prospectus some few days ago,  MBA, close to £25,000 for international students.

like i said, its just a funny feeling

funkybaby:

although, i feel it might only apply to visiting visas, (i doubt if they will extend it to student visas), british universities are making BIG money from international students. i was going through a postgraduate prospectus some few days ago,  MBA, close to £25,000 for international students.

like i said, its just a funny feeling

Come to the US, life here is so much better. And if you are lucky u can go to school free like me. 
The US govt has plenty of money, they might as well use some of it to train me rather than spend it all in Iraq.

@david

hmmm,  interesting. i go think about am. seriously, britain is really demanding too much from international students. infact, it is really annoying. my boyfriend and i have decided that come what may, i must give birth to all my kids for europe, make them dey enjoy 'UK/EU status' especially when it come to education

funkybaby:

@ akolawole, VOR, mrpataki

i have this funny feeling that www.ukvisas.com and its affilates will soon cancel the 'uk visa appeal' thing.

This is already cancelled in theory few months ago only remains the execution.

Student appeals and Work permit appeals is theoretically cancelled but Visiting visas appeal is not cancelled.

I think i have commented on this months ago.

na wa o, all these just to visit a country that is not paradise?

@AKOLAWOLE

Sorry abt that post, i was distracted then

I meant to say 'i wont accept another refusal again, the last two left me scarred'

i'll type the decision tmoro

funkybaby:

@david

hmmm, interesting. i go think about am. seriously, britain is really demanding too much from international students. infact, it is really annoying. my boyfriend and i have decided that come what may, i must give birth to all my kids for europe, make them dey enjoy 'UK/EU status' especially when it come to education

My dear, i have always maintained that the greatest legacy you can give your children is no longer education but a foreign passport, preferably the US or EU. With that passport, education will automatically follow stress free.
Try the US. I wonder why everyone is dying to visit the UK, its so tiny. What is there to see? There are 50 states here, if you manage to visit 25 all your life you try.

davidylan:

My dear, i have always maintained that the greatest legacy you can give your children is no longer education but a foreign passport, preferably the US or EU. With that passport, education will automatically follow stress free.

I beg!

On what basis?

@akolawole

david has a point. of course EU and UK students have stress free education. They are eligible to apply for study loan, scholarships as well as claim all sorts of benefits. an EU/UK student pays about £3000 for a MSc eduaction, international student is asked to pay close to £8000. c'mon, calculate the difference. as for me, my mind is made up - all my kids must have either EU, UK, or US citizenship.

so no more option to appeal for people denied students' visas?? is it official yet?? please, give me the link on where you had it duscussed. thank you.

@Funky

Dont let us go into that .

I have once be labelled as Anti-west on Nairaland.

So your Kids must have either of those passports abi?Good luck sha. I knew MKO Abiola was not born in UK neither is OBJ or Ojukwu. I also knew Kola Abiola is a British citizen but he lives and enjoy himself in Naija.

Do i want All those passport

OR

Naija passport + Fulfilled life. I choose the later anyday.

Lets leave the discussion for another thread jare.

funkybaby:

an EU/UK student pays about £3000 for a MSc eduaction, international student is asked to pay close to £8000. c'mon, calculate the difference. as for me, my mind is made up - all my kids must have either EU, UK, or US citizenship.

so no more option to appeal for people denied students' visas?? is it official yet?? please, give me the link on where you had it duscussed. thank you.

If you are a UK citizen who has not been ordinarily resident for 3 years in the UK.You still have to pay the full amount.I agree sha,foreign passports help a lot.

@Funkybaby

I'm highly impressed by your posts here. I doff my hat 4 You.

@ Akowale and mrpataki and VOR

You guys re just good 2 go. Highly motivated and wonderful consultants!
Thanks all 4 keeping the thread alive.

I applied 4 a study visa last yr but was refused on grounds of my ability to follow the proposed course, and the ability to fund my stay, then  forgery of my BSc degree award certificate.In fact, the said certificate was withheld by the ECO. After my receipt of the refusal form, I wrote them expressing my feelings about the withheld original document, and in the letter, I stressed that as an employee of one of the biggest financial institutions in the country, the documents I presented to them has been verified by my employers before they offered the job 2 me.
And that I considered their judgement a serious slight on my integrity.

To my utmost suprise, I got a call from the ECO apologising 4 withholding the said document and explaining the grounds of the refusal, and requesting that I pick it up immediately from their office in VI. So I did just that.

This time around, I intended reapplying again 4 study visa, but later resolved 2 visit the schools I have in mind first, then apply for a study visa next yr. I wish to state in my application that I intend to visit some schools in UK (which I mentioned) so as to compare their available postgraduate courses with my intended course of study, and that  I also intend to attend a University's open day.

What do You guys think? Shld I still tackle the other reasons for the last refusal? How do I link this application to the former one I made?

Thanks for your contributions !!!!!!

well i have come to realise that when we say the truth most times we are denied visas

i have had 2 categories of friends applying for visa,

the folks that go to the embassy with legal documents with no forgeries end up bein denied visas

while the other group that go with fake documents from forged bank statements to birth certificate, infact i got a friend that was denied visa he went to another state did another passport and reapplied as fresh applicant, hmmm i have not seen him to ask about the outcome of that

although i have decided to avoid anything west, i got my visa to other part of europe with ease, sometimes UK, US and candian embassies can be funny

@ kaecy5

U re right my brother. But I guess dats the reason 4 all these new immigration policies being set up by Tony Blair and his fellow diplomats. I beleive its a means of separating the wheat from the chaff. Though they still rub off on some innocent pple.
Prayers! dats the solution 4 such things dat involve a mix of luck.
Great day!

Whatsup?

presjany:



1) I got a call from the ECO apologising 4 withholding the said document and explaining the grounds of the refusal, and requesting that I pick it up immediately from their office in VI. So I did just that.


2) Shld I still tackle the other reasons for the last refusal? How do I link this application to the former one I made?

1a) Is it a forged Certificate?

1b) WHY DID'NT YOU APPEAL THE DECISION ?

1c) What explanation were they given you on the phone?

2) I dont know what you want to tackle here. Please tell us what we dont know.

3) If you intend to visit the school first, Did you want to apply for Visitors visa or Prospective student visa?

4) Why are you changing the University in the first instance?

@ Kaecy5 and Pesjany

I did not agree with you completely.

UK is "somehow" easier than Canada and US.

Their appeal system shows their rich democratic values.

FORGED DOCUMENTS
It is not every documents they checked but they do it by sampling. I knew 2 pals that were WRONGLY or [b]RIGHTLY [/b]refused on fake documentation.

1) A man who own a reputable account firm in Naija. He supported his Son's visa application. The man's account is in millions. BHC detected that the tax calculated on the account was wrong hence it was adjudge a fake bank statement. Even though they dont bother to make enquiries from the bank. Who is to be blamed? The bank or the man?

2) One girl who is genuinely a UNILAG student was refused on using a fake University letter. BHC compare her letter to their own sample. The logos are different. Who's fault?

@Funkybabe

Please read Londoncool's ealier post.

Cheers

@ immigration experts
interesting discuss, i however want to know if i can know the details of an appeal via phone i.e by calling the ait? i have until know contacted them via email, i will like to confirm things with them, will a phone call be reasonable, can i get details via phone from the ait?

LondonCool:

@all,

The BHC have employee's called Airline's Liaison Officer's (ALO's) that check passengers and manifests of all inbound and outbound flights to/from UK. UK have them in other countries incase you transit through them too. The flight manifest does not only contain names but miniature pictures of every passenger on the plane, they are used by intelligence incase they need to check Inadequately Documented passengers who normally land and tear up their passport trying to conceal their journey details. Also, most flight from UK to Nigeria are being checked by Immigration on the embarkation control and most Nigerians who have overstayed or travel on Emergency Travel documents do get reported to the BHC Risk Assessment Unit for further action.

@ akolawole

i have just one phrase to say about londoncool's claim [b]''ALL NA STORY''.[/b]I have a friend that used someone's else travelling documents to travel down to naija some few months ago. the person is back in uk although he travelled  back to uk with his own passport. besides, i do not see what londoncool's claim has got to do with me. my sister is not travelling with emergency travel documents and neither has she over-stayed. she is still within the immigration limits.

@presjany

you should have appealed their decison then. infact, it would have been sweet victory. how dare they withold your certificate did they take the pains to call or write the institution where you graduated from to confirm the authenticity of your certificate?
from your post, i think you presently have a visitor's visa. it is against immigration rules to come into the  uk as a visitor and then looking for any university to study. if BHC should get to know, no student visa for you o ! besides, it can even ruin your chances of getting your visitor visa renewed. you can get all the info you need about any course you want to study via email. just ask the university peeps any question, and they will gladdening reply you. all that scope of attending the university's open day wont work for BHC o!

akolawole mentioned something about prospective student visa. i really don't know much about that. maybe you should ask him to explain more

@akolawole

you know say london is a 'leveller'. no one cares if you are abiola's son. that is why some rich folks would rather stay in naija where they can 'oppress' and people will 'notice' them. in uk, who cares?

but seriously, i still stand by my decison. all my kids must be 'tokunbo'. . foreign citizenship has its good sides especially in the area of education.

please, i am still waiting for the link where youn discussed the uk appeal issue.
thanks.

Funky

I think Londoncool was just talking generally about UK immigration procedures
and wasn't specifically applying them to your sister in this instance. Pretty much
all he said is true. Just understand UK immigration can't be expected to catch
every one trying to subvert the immigration rules, definitely some people will
get away with things. What I do know however is that sometimes a person
can be getting away with illegality for many years and think they have cheated
the system but one dayy is all it takes for them to be caught.

I hope you know that the fact your child is born in the UK or Ireland and
many other countries in Europe does not automatically confer nationality
on that child? It still does in the USA so perhaps that is your best bet.

Finally it is NOT against the rules to come to the UK on a visit and look for a school.
It would however be against the rules to enrol and attend classes on a visit visa.
Although having said that there is a grey area where your course is a short term
course that is less than six months. For instance you might come as a visitor and wish
to attend a language school for a couple of weeks. Strictly speaking that is not against
the immigration rules and an Immigration Officer could in those circumstances excercise
his discretion in your favour. But like I said it is not clear cut so don't try it.

@ VOR

am aware of that it is no more automatic in most european courntries.

but my game plan is to give birth 'around'.   my first child in US, and the others in UK/EU.

the only problem now is to get past US immigration at the airport with a protuding tummy cos i have heard stories of them deporting pregnant women straight from the airport back to wherever they are cominh from.

anyway, not too worry, time still dey. when i don get the belle, i will think of a way to get past them

funkybaby:

i have just one phrase to say about londoncool's claim ''ALL NA STORY''.[/b]I have a friend that used someone's else travelling documents to travel down to naija some few months ago. the person is back in uk although he travelled back to

Whether na story or not time will tell. There's always a "first time"
You may not believe in such thing exist but let others learn from it

VOR:


1) [b]I hope you know that the fact your child is born in the UK or Ireland and
many other countries in Europe does not automatically confer nationality
on that child? It still does in the USA so perhaps that is your best bet.


2) Finally it is NOT against the rules to come to the UK on a visit and look for a school.

Thanks VOR, i wonder for Funke o.

funkybaby:

1) you know say london is a 'leveller'. no one cares if you are abiola's son. that is why some rich folks would rather stay in naija where they can 'oppress' and people will 'notice' them. in uk, who cares?

2) but seriously, i still stand by my decison. all my kids must be 'tokunbo'. . foreign citizenship has its good sides especially in the area of education.

Leveller for where?

Can i afford to buy a shirt at Harrods for £600? NO
Can Rich people do that? Yes

DO YOU KNOW WHAT HARRIET HARMAN says of the difference between the Rich and Poor in UK?

Thanks Akolawale and Funke,


.

2) Finally it is NOT against the rules to come to the UK on a visit and look for a school

presjany:

@Funkybaby

I'm highly impressed by your posts here. I doff my hat 4 You.

@ Akowale and mrpataki and VOR

You guys re just good 2 go. Highly motivated and wonderful consultants!
Thanks all 4 keeping the thread alive.

I applied 4 a study visa last yr but was refused on grounds of my ability to follow the proposed course, and the ability to fund my stay, then  forgery of my BSc degree award certificate.In fact, the said certificate was withheld by the ECO. After my receipt of the refusal form, I wrote them expressing my feelings about the withheld original document, and in the letter, I stressed that as an employee of one of the biggest financial institutions in the country, the documents I presented to them has been verified by my employers before they offered the job 2 me.
And that I considered their judgement a serious slight on my integrity.

To my utmost suprise, I got a call from the ECO apologising 4 withholding the said document and explaining the grounds of the refusal, and requesting that I pick it up immediately from their office in VI. So I did just that.

This time around, I intended reapplying again 4 study visa, but later resolved 2 visit the schools I have in mind first, then apply for a study visa next yr. I wish to state in my application that I intend to visit some schools in UK (which I mentioned) so as to compare their available postgraduate courses with my intended course of study, and that  I also intend to attend a University's open day.

What do You guys think? Shld I still tackle the other reasons for the last refusal? How do I link this application to the former one I made?

Thanks for your contributions !!!!!!

@Presjany

I don't think there is anything you can do now about the previous refusal.
The time for you to appeal has almost certainly expired and though in theory
you can request for an extension of time within which to file the appeal you
must have very good reasons for not filing it on time in the first place.

Turning to your proposed visit. There is nothing to stop you applying to visit for the
reason you stated. Contrary to what Funky said the immigration rules do not outlaw
visits for this purpose. The obstacle you will face is satisfying the ECO that you are
a genuine visitor. This would depend to a large degree on your personal circumstances
and whether or not you meet the criteria as a visitor eg adequate accommodation and funds
and possibly a sponsor etc. Bear in mind also that although each application for a visa is decided
on its merits, the fact that you were refused previously will certainly have a bearing on the current
application.

Personally my advice would be to conduct your research about the school you wish to attend in the UK from Nigeria.
In this day and age of the internet it is not so important to attend open days etc. A lot of the info is on line.
By doing it this way you can then channel all your energy and resources into submitting a solid student visa
application. I mean the money you spend on fares to visit would be better utilised as a deposit to a university.

Good luck anyway.