privately,while the tax payers pays d interest and suffer d consequencies

Wow.
Posted this last night, and it's already on page 8

^^^

Thanks to the Irunmoles on the 4 corners of the world

Without them, it would never have been possible

@Topic,
Of course corruption is a major problem. Excuse my French, but Mr Ruhl is talking out of his backside.
There is no country that can truly move ahead without some level of accountability and integrity. You can't have an open stealing regime like we do in Nigeria, and make reasonable progress. Even the so-called BRICs (except for China) have serious social problems which all their much-vaunted economic growth has been unable to solve. Brazil still has serious crime, poor infrastructure, crappy social services. Ditto for India and Russia.

China has an official zero-tolerance mentality to corruption. The Chinese institutions do offer bribes as a matter of policy, but woe betide any random individual caught stealing from China's Treasury. January last year there was a train accident, and some of the railway officials were executed for negligence. Yes, executed. Even South Africa does not openly celebrate corruption the way we do in Nigeria.

Our problem is corruption n unity. We have to disintegrate dis useless nation

“Don’t think it (corruption) is Nigeria ’s problem. I think corruption is important but I really don’t think it is the only thing or may be not the decisive thing,” he said.
Ruhl was responding to a question at the Forum of the News Agency of Nigeria, NAN, Thursday, in Abuja , on whether Nigeria was being hindered by corruption compared with developing countries such as Brazil, China, Korea and Malaysia .
“The question is: Are we going to keep talking about who gets which job? Or are we going to say how we are going to move this country forward?
“If we do the latter, the country is going to move forward because the potential of Nigeria is more in terms of resources, both human and natural,” he said.

I would like to posit that our main problem is that those of us whose parents spent so much money sending to school to be educated and get a good job become so big that we leave it to our househelps, meiguards, messengers, drivers, stewards, cooks, gardeners etc to register and vote in our political leaders who in turn determine how much tax we pay and what to do with our tax, including paying themselves ridiculous emoluments for doing absolutely nothing except kowtow their godfathers. Ask yourself do you earn your living by doing absolutely nothing? So why should let legislooters and executhiefs do so with your hard earned taxes
We do not matter to our leaders. And if you think because you pay no tax, remember that your state and local government collects money from Abuja on your behalf as part of its population. Moreover the federal government collects taxes from companies on our behalf. If there is absolutely noone in Nigeria the government cannot have any sovereignty to collect corporate tax.
So let's get off our butts and stand in the queue to register so our leaders will start serving our interests.

I dont think corruption is important, what's the reason?

[img]http://2.s01.flagcounter.com/count/fcPpr/bg=Ffffff/txt=ffffff/border=ffffff/columns=1/maxflags=1/viewers=3/labels=1.jpg[/img][img]http://s01.flagcounter.com/count/fcPpr/bg=Ffffff/txt=ffffff/border=ffffff/columns=1/maxflags=1/viewers=3/labels=1.jpg[/img]

Ordinarily, corruption should not be a big problem but the Nigerian version can ground any government in the world.

We have an extreme case in our hands here. without dealing with it, it is practically impossible to move forward.

Nigeria is not the only corrupt country in the world. The guy was right. We should start thinking on how to move on and move the country forward. We should start by voting for credible people and should be ready to oppose all forms of rigging during the forthcoming elections.

It is. That dude is a politician

How can d right peeps get d right jobs in a system where d rule of law does not apply b-cos of endemic corruption?

Great conversation people. From what I have read so far on this thread, most people have different ideas of what is plaguing Nigeria. Keep up this great discussion.

BTW, the "Sugar Daddy Phenomenon" can be found in Ghana as well. So this is common throughout Africa, not just Nigeria. However, it is very easy to pull up to a campus with a nice car in Nigeria and find a nice looking babe very easily. Not to say I have done it, but I have seen it in action time and time again.

Uduagban of delta state regained office as a governor after being thrown out by d court for epic rigging b-cos of corruption.

D present federal govt was rigged into office and b-cos of corrution nobody is questioning that,yet peeps wants to move ahead

D international banks benefit from corruption by lending money to thieves who will end up taking d money back to them

That's a very good point.

Foreign banks and foreign contractors aid and abbet looting of treasury by our leaders.

Peeps must think oyinbo like us that must to tell us d fundamental truth.How is he going to big shot if we wise up?

For me the square root of Nigeria's problems is ignorance. Nigerians literate and illiterate are largely ignorant. What we call corruption is only a side effect for ignorance. Here is something to ponder on:

Why would someone give a job to a person that is not qualified when there are people better qualified for that job and as such will be more productive and make the business more efficient and competitive. The same 'coconut head' giving jobs to his relations will run to government for protection, when better run companies from abroad flood the market with cheaper goods. If only he knew that by employing the best for the job, his business will be better run and hence more competitive even without government protection.

Why would someone vote for someone because he is of the same tribe state or religion when there are better candidates from other tribes and religion who can offer better leadership? The same fool who voted for his kinsman will complain of no electricity or good roads, every night the fool will be disturbing God for a job or admission into university. If only the ‘coconut head’ knew that by just casting his votes for the right person irrespective of tribe, sex, or religion the country would have been better run with jobs and admissions for everyone.

The answer is ignorance. Every of those actions that inhibit our development are deeply rooted in our ignorance as a people from the professor to the street tout from the president to the councilor. If only we all know a little bit more, this country would have been better. That is why if we love this country, we should start a massive investment in education so as to raise a new generation of Nigerians that will have the knowledge, skills, sincerity of heart, and wisdom to move Nigeria towards development.

It is that new generation of Nigerians that are the hope of this country. If we do not equip them now this country will have no hope. Most of our problems will remain until a new generation of Nigerians with thinking faculty emerges. The problem with our generation is that we hardly think, perhaps if we were thought how to use our brains in school, rather than cheating, we would have offered more to Nigeria. The fact remains that most of us complaining about corruption today are only doing so because we are not getting our share. Once we get our share of the loot, we will shut up.

Oyinbo love his dog more than he love a blackman

i'd say every other problem stem from corruption.how better do you explain young men who should engage in meaningful ventures wake up in the morning believing he can be rich one day by chance simply because he'd seen it happened to his neibor.coruption breeds laziness and violence.

@Beaf youu made sense jo,Nigerians are not only naturally lazy but wickedly lazy,how can we still be importing oil at this century,why dnt they train thier jobless graduates that studied petrochemical engineering to do the the drilling process&refine and the conutry to supervise and market it to allover the world,but they prefare to get ready made things from west and render thier youths useless roaming the sreet,may the curse of Allah be upon all all corrupt people in Nigeria

legba1:

i'd say every other problem stem from corruption.how better do you explain young men who should engage in meaningful ventures wake up in the morning believing he can be rich one day by chance simply because he'd seen it happened to his neibor.coruption breeds laziness and violence.

This stems more from ignorance than from corruption. If only they were equipped in school with the right thought processes, they would have thought of something else to do.

passyjango:

For me the square root of Nigeria's problems is ignorance. Nigerians literate and illiterate are largely ignorant. What we call corruption is only a side effect for ignorance. Here is something to ponder on:

Why would someone give a job to a person that is not qualified when there are people better qualified for that job and as such will be more productive and make the business more efficient and competitive. The same 'coconut head' giving jobs to his relations will run to government for protection, when better run companies from abroad flood the market with cheaper goods. If only he knew that by employing the best for the job, his business will be better run and hence more competitive even without government protection.

Why would someone vote for someone because he is of the same tribe state or religion when there are better candidates from other tribes and religion who can offer better leadership? The same fool who voted for his kinsman will complain of no electricity or good roads, every night the fool will be disturbing God for a job or admission into university. If only the ‘coconut head’ knew that by just casting his votes for the right person irrespective of tribe, sex, or religion the country would have been better run with jobs and admissions for everyone.

The answer is ignorance. Every of those actions that inhibit our development are deeply rooted in our ignorance as a people from the professor to the street tout from the president to the councilor. If only we all know a little bit more, this country would have been better. That is why if we love this country, we should start a massive investment in education so as to raise a new generation of Nigerians that will have the knowledge, skills, sincerity of heart, and wisdom to move Nigeria towards development.

It is that new generation of Nigerians that are the hope of this country. If we do not equip them now this country will have no hope. Most of our problems will remain until a new generation of Nigerians with thinking faculty emerges. The problem with our generation is that we hardly think, perhaps if we were thought how to use our brains in school, rather than cheating, we would have offered more to Nigeria. The fact remains that most of us complaining about corruption today are only doing so because we are not getting our share. Once we get our share of the loot, we will shut up.

I agree with you that Nigerians are largely ignorant but the same can be said of people living in developed countries. You only need to look at the protests taking place in the US, Greece, UK, Spain, Portugal, etc where people just expect the government to provide certain welfare packages without a care for how it is done. The differences between Nigeria (other African countries as well) and the rest of the developed world are

1. Our intellectual capital is abroad, mostly in the US. It is the intellectual capital that is responsible for innovations, science, and technology etc. There are Nigerians involved in these industries in the US in large quantities. The industrial revolution which began in the UK in the early 18th century was responsible for changing the socioeconomic and cultural conditions of most developed nations and served to end the barbarism which existed in Europe at that time. European nations no longer needed to wage war on other nations for slaves and resources when industrial output brought economic gains. Africa is still in that era where brawn is what counts and not brains. Our brains are abroad.

2. Good visionary leadership is lacking because endemic corruption gives the advantage to those who are MOST corrupt and evil to seek political office. Afterall, it is a game of who can intimidate and kill the most and get away with it. There have been a serious of political murders, particularly in the SW but how many have been convicted for these murders? Ige, the AG of the federation was gunned down in cold blood; what was the result? This was the system in Europe 300 years ago. How do good leaders emerge in such a climate? Could an Obama emerge from Nigeria in the current climate? I honestly doubt it but can a Mugabe emerge? Yes, there are millions of them in Nigeria. For those arguing that our leaders are smart, can you point to one or two innovative solutions by any political leader in Nigeria?

That being said, the problem is with Nigerians. Our cultural values are flawed. We place too much emphasis on material possessions and too little on living and enjoying life. There are many well to do people in Nigeria but how many are cultured? How come our artists (cultural arts) are poor? How come our writers are poor? How is it that Nigerians mainly visit US, UK, Dubai, Italy and other shopping destinations? Why don't we have many Nigerians back-packing in Asia or Latin America? I understand that these questions can start another debate but they are connected to fundamental problems in Nigeria.

passyjango:

This stems more from ignorance than from corruption. If only they were equipped in school with the right thought processes, they would have thought of something else to do.

But corruption has unsured that Nigeria only spends 3% on education as against the 26% recommended by Unicef. Even that 3% is still looted. How can you have education which changes the thought process when corruption stands in its way?

passyjango:

This stems more from ignorance than from corruption. If only they were equipped in school with the right thought processes, they would have thought of something else to do.

You are quite right. The country needs mass education and reorientation. Sorry for bringing politics into this but that is why I support ACN.
There are many ways to kill a cat but the best way is to advocate for true federalism. It might not stop corruption but it would atleast curb it to its minimum. The unitary style of Government only fits a certain group and it alien to others. Thats why it seems that southern governors are more corrupt that their northern counterpart.

Katsumoto:

2. Good visionary leadership is lacking because endemic corruption gives the advantage to those who are MOST corrupt and evil to seek political office. Afterall, it is a game of who can intimidate and kill the most and get away with it. There have been a serious of political murders, particularly in the SW but how many have been convicted for these murders? Ige, the AG of the federation was gunned down in cold blood; what was the result? This was the system in Europe 300 years ago. How do good leaders emerge in such a climate? Could an Obama emerge from Nigeria in the current climate? I honestly doubt it but can a Mugabe emerge? Yes, there are millions of them in Nigeria. For those arguing that our leaders are smart, can you point to one or two innovative solutions by any political leader in Nigeria?

The advantage is given to the most corrupt because people collect bribes either at the primaries or at the general elections to vote them in. If only the fools collecting the bribes knew the consequences of their actions they would have thought twice before collecting the bribe. But because they are short sighted they take the bribes now and later complain about how the same leaders they collected bribes to elect are not performing. The same also goes for the fool who votes for a person just because he/she is from the same tribe or religion. They are all products of ignorance not corruption. If only that fool knows that because of the bribe he/she collected today, nepotism, or tribalism, his children will not find jobs in a couple of years time or his grandchildren will not get quality education, he/she would not have sold his generation's future for a little bribe today. So, ignorance (our lack of deep thinking) still remains our main problem.

So how do we get majority of the populace educated?

passyjango:

The advantage is given to the most corrupt because people collect bribes either at the primaries or at the general elections to vote them in. If only the fools collecting the bribes knew the consequences of their actions they would have thought twice before collecting the bribe. But because they are short sighted they take the bribes now and later complain about how the same leaders they collected bribes to elect are not performing. The same also goes for the fool who votes for a person just because he/she is from the same tribe or religion. They are all products of ignorance not corruption. If only that fool knows that because of the bribe he/she collected today, nepotism, or tribalism, his children will not find jobs in a couple of years time or his grandchildren will not get quality education, he/she would not have sold his generation's future for a little bribe today. So, ignorance (our lack of deep thinking) still remains our main problem.

I agree but the problem remains that most of the candidates that the poor man must select from are corrupt already. Plus most of the grass roots are already in servitude to the corrupt politician or his godfathers for reasons I mentioned in my previous post. Reason why better candidates such as Utomi don't stand a chance. Even Fashola with all the good he has done in Lagos doesn't stand a chance.

jotopayo:

So how do we get majority of the populace educated?

It is too late for adults to change the thought process of most adults without some kind of upheaval. But for kids, you have to start at the primary school level. This is what most south eastern Asian nations did.

His words are encouraging.

passyjango:

The advantage is given to the most corrupt because people collect bribes either at the primaries or at the general elections to vote them in. If only the fools collecting the bribes knew the consequences of their actions they would have thought twice before collecting the bribe. But because they are short sighted they take the bribes now and later complain about how the same leaders they collected bribes to elect are not performing. The same also goes for the fool who votes for a person just because he/she is from the same tribe or religion. They are all products of ignorance not corruption. If only that fool knows that because of the bribe he/she collected today, nepotism, or tribalism, his children will not find jobs in a couple of years time or his grandchildren will not get quality education, he/she would not have sold his generation's future for a little bribe today. So, ignorance (our lack of deep thinking) still remains our main problem.

I posted something along the same lines a couple of days ago and at the risk of boring you to death I will post it again because I think explains a lot about what is wrong with our country:

[b]In my view, Nigeria is one of the most difficult countries to lead and govern, but one of the easiest to rule and manipulate.  That is why we have always had rulers in Nigeria, but never leaders.  Our rulers have long recognised that Nigeria is not a country as such but a collection of vested interests, and they have ruthlessly exploited  these interests to keep themselves in power.   They know that the people want subsidised petrol, so what do they do?  Of course they provide it even if it means shortages from time to time and less money to build roads, hospitals and schools.  They also subsidise electricity, even if it means regular blackouts.  I have also come to the conclusion that the last parastatal that the Nigerian government will privatise is NNPC because that is the golden goose that gives our rulers golden eggs with which to buy favours and operate their system of patronage.  Government control of parastatals means that you can bribe even your opponents with juicy appointments and freeze out those who don't toe the line.  I have also realised that expecting our government to privatise key industries and utilities is like expecting turkeys to vote for Christmas.  Once they do this they will start losing their levers of patronage.  In the final analysis,  the solution to the Nigerian conundrum, in my opinion is the reduction of the size and influence of government and the public sector in Nigerian daily life  and to allow the natural Nigerian entrepreneurial spirit to flourish.  However I doubt that this will happen simply because the rulers and the ruled appear to be involved in a relationship of convenience and expediency, and mutual backscratching.

Katsumoto:

I agree but the problem remains that most of the candidates that the poor man must select from are corrupt already. Plus most of the grass roots are already in servitude to the corrupt politician or his godfathers for reasons I mentioned in my previous post. Reason why better candidates such as Utomi don't stand a chance. Even Fashola with all the good he has done in Lagos doesn't stand a chance.

I agree with you, I am only trying to point out that if Nigerians will spare some thought for the consequences of their actions there will be less corruption as the ills of corruption are more than its gains.

jason123:

There are many ways to kill a cat but the best way is to advocate for true federalism. It might not stop corruption but it would atleast curb it to its minimum. The unitary style of Government only fits a certain group and it alien to others. Thats why it seems that southern governors are more corrupt that their northern counterpart.

I agree that Federalism is one of the greatest things that can happen in Nigeria. It will reduce laziness, increase internally generated revenue, create massive employment, etc. Like @Beaf pointed out every month governors simply go to Abuja to share money. They are not occupied in any form of productive activities. That is why there are no jobs. Even if all of us are unemployed, as long as the oil industry works the government will still have money to finance its activities. In a federal system, governments will be forced to see its population as a resource. So creation of jobs will be a do or die affair for any government. These days when our leaders are talking about job creation, they see it as a favour to us. That is why they give it to their friends and relations. In a federal system jobs will be about efficiency and wealth creation and the leaders will see that job creation is in their own interest.

Katsumoto - I take some issue on your polarisation of Nigerians based on  a Diaspora / Home based dichotomy. Being a Nigerian is not location dependent  neither do 'Diasporans' (I hate that word) have a monopoly on good ideas or brainpower. This sort of thinking serves to divide us even further.

However, I do agree with you and will go even further to say that the 'Leadership' is an evil, demonic and wicked entity, they are not driven to leave positive and lasting legacies for the people. Apart from Duke and Fashola (when he finishes his term) we really are struggling.

You throw stones at Mugabe but Robert can beat his chest and say he made his country one of the most educated in Africa with a literacy level of 90%.